Things the Camino needs more of

[GerryDel]

My intent is not to ruin the ambiance or spirit of the Camino, but reflecting back on my trip, I definitely had the feeling that there were things that would improve the Camino experience for all and would not ruin the ambiance. First, I wondered why there weren't more lavanderías or laundromats along the way. I think they would be well supported by pilgrims. I often found myself just wishing I had somewhere to stop and do my clothes. Yes, I know that most pilgrims hand wash their clothes daily, but I felt this was a difficult process, and often my clothes didn't get dry enough. I also was dependent on the albergue or pension a few times to clean my clothes for me, sometimes at an inflated rate. Next, I really wish there had been more historical markers. I often felt I was walking through history without understanding what I was seeing. All these little villages along the way have a story to tell and it would have been nice to stop and read their stories. With the thousands of years of history in Spain, I am sure there are quite a few untold stories If they could have markers in Spanish, and perhaps the other top 2 languages of the Camino, then that would be very helpful. I'm not saying that they should plaster the things everywhere. Maybe just a historical marker at the beginning of the village explaining the history, what landmarks are there, what events occurred, famous people who live there, etc... I know this takes money, but it would be such an improvement to the experience. It might also induce me to stop in a village and spend money there! What other things do you think would improve the experience without ruining the ambiance?

 

[nidarosa]

Benches.

 

[Felipe]

The perennial problem with possible Camino related businesses is its seasonal character. So, the "supply and demand" rule does not work very well.

 

[Metropolly]

Escalators

 

[Icacos]

moving sidewalks

 

[GerryDel]

Benches.

I agree wholeheartedly!

 

[GerryDel]

The perennial problem with possible Camino related businesses is its seasonal character. So, the "supply and demand" rule does not work very well.

You're probably right in regards to a laundry, but perhaps a dual purpose place like a bar with a laundry might make it.

 

[xin loi]

agree with need for historical markers--e.g. just why were those 7 little rock huts built that we called the Homes of the Seven Dwarfs? They over look a place where several small watersheds join a larger one--probably old sentry posts--Roman? We saw many old structures and parts of old roads but had no idea who built them or why they were built. Perhaps a better guide book was needed?

 

[Deleted member 3000]

With little or no chance of historical markers being erected, instead you can take "The Pilgrimage Road to Santiago," by Gitlitz and Davidson. It has hundreds of local anecdotes. Tell me where the Homes of the Seven Dwarfs are, and I will see if they say something about it.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

The camino isn't Home. It what it is, where it is. We can all see the outcomes of dozens of ill-conceived "improvement" schemes, all along the pathways.

I think one thing the camino can do with less of is people who want to "improve" it.

 

[another walker]

agree with need for historical markers--e.g. just why were those 7 little rock huts built that we called the Homes of the Seven Dwarfs? They over look a place where several small watersheds join a larger one--probably old sentry posts--Roman? We saw many old structures and parts of old roads but had no idea who built them or why they were built. Perhaps a better guide book was needed?

If there is water nearby to these,it is highly likely they were mills (flour perhaps)

 

[Arn]

Temporary additions at key periods of pilgrimage, i.e. Holy Year/Week...where the number of pilgrims easily out paces the availability of lodging (tents, public parks opened), lavatories (porta pottiies), trash cans at key junctions, and yes, even benches (for the long wait outside a porta pottie).

 

[another walker]

As far as plaques with historical information is concerned,the name of the place is usually enough.Especially in our information technology revolution.
I lived in a very ancient village in southern England in my formative years and enjoyed finding out the history of my village in the library and talking to old people.
Now we can do it without getting of our bums. Also,had signs been posted in the village they would probably been trashed.
I now live in the Iberian peninsular and nobody has a clue about the history of the villages in these parts,the towns a bit more historical knowledge albeit very sketchy and often inaccurate.
One example of this is the "roman" bridges every where. Personally, i believe them mainly to be Norman(as built in Normandy) and the design use extensively elsewhere because it is a great design. There exists a "Roman" bridge in our nearest town,it is in fact 15th centuryAD and is Norman in design. So you see, you may be better trying to research village or town names on the net prior to a walk and impress fellow walkers with for-knowledge if you can find any. Best wishes to you.GerryDel

 

[another walker]

Temporary additions at key periods of pilgrimage, i.e. Holy Year/Week...where the number of pilgrims easily out paces the availability of lodging (tents, public parks opened), lavatories (porta pottiies), trash cans at key junctions, and yes, even benches (for the long wait outside a porta pottie).

The truth revealed !

 

[bystander]

The camino isn't Home. It what it is, where it is. We can all see the outcomes of dozens of ill-conceived "improvement" schemes, all along the pathways.

I think one thing the camino can do with less of is people who want to "improve" it.

I am totally with you on this.

It is, as you say, what it is.

 

[GerryDel]

As far as plaques with historical information is concerned,the name of the place is usually enough.Especially in our information technology revolution.
I lived in a very ancient village in southern England in my formative years and enjoyed finding out the history of my village in the library and talking to old people.
Now we can do it without getting of our bums. Also,had signs been posted in the village they would probably been trashed.
I now live in the Iberian peninsular and nobody has a clue about the history of the villages in these parts,the towns a bit more historical knowledge albeit very sketchy and often inaccurate.
Best wishes to you.GerryDel

A lot of these towns were not on any map I looked at, so would not have been able to research ahead of time. I like learning as I go. It doesn't carry the same significance if you read about it ahead of time, as it does when you're there and you see it in front of you. Yeah they probably would be trashed over time, but that's just the nature of people. Your point about history is fascinating to me. They might not know what they're sitting on top of. My son and I discussed this very thing as we were sitting on a couple of rocks one day. Imagine all the lost archaeology of the place, all the people who probably camped near where we were sitting over the centuries, and now it's under centuries of accumulated dust and earth, just waiting to be discovered. I would think the Camino would be a historian's dream.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

My son and I discussed this very thing as we were sitting on a couple of rocks one day.

The atoms in those rocks have existed unchanged since the Big Bang! That makes the Roman bridge seem absolutely modern...

 

[MendiWalker]

The Camino needs big spenders.

Ondo Ibili !

 

[another walker]

The Camino needs big spenders.

Ondo Ibili !

Like KFC or Macgonads ?????????????

 

[GerryDel]

With little or no chance of historical markers being erected, instead you can take "The Pilgrimage Road to Santiago," by Gitlitz and Davidson. It has hundreds of local anecdotes. Tell me where the Homes of the Seven Dwarfs are, and I will see if they say something about it.

I'll have to check that out. Thanks

 

[MendiWalker]

Nope

 

[OTH86]

Like KFC or Macgonads ?????????????

Noooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[dougfitz]

I am with Rebecca and falcon on this. If you need more information, carry a better guidebook, and as pilgrims we shouldn't expect our needs to take a priority over spending for the local community.

 

[GerryDel]

The atoms in those rocks have existed unchanged since the Big Bang! That makes the Roman bridge seem absolutely modern...

Well technically no. Only the light elements were made during the big bang, like helium, hydrogen, lithium. Most other atoms were created as part of star formation, which would probably put the atoms at the age of the solar system, and we could get more specific and say that they were also modified from other processes such as volcanic activity, morphological changes due to pressure, accretion, etc.. While interesting to study, those rocks wouldn't be as interesting to me as the old Roman bridge made by human hands.

 

[GerryDel]

I am with Rebecca and falcon on this. If you need more information, carry a better guidebook, and as pilgrims we shouldn't expect our needs to take a priority over spending for the local community.

Thank goodness we're all entitled to our own opinions.

 

[annakappa]

I think that this idea of information markers would cost a lot if money, however how about a bit of fun?
Take a list of all the villages and towns you will walk through and then one by one enter their name into Wikipedia. You will come up with an incredible amount of information. I just tried it. I entered Redecilla, Belorado and Rabanal. It's amazing the amount if information was given, at least for the first two, which are much larger villages than Rabanal. I used the Spanish version of Wikipedia, considering that maybe more information is offered on home ground, so to speak.
So.....while preparing your Camino ( and the preparation is part of the enjoyment) make up your personal historical guide! Anne

 

[GerryDel]

I think that this idea of information markers would cost a lot if money, however how about a bit of fun?
Take a list of all the villages and towns you will walk through and then one by one enter their name into Wikipedia. You will come up with an incredible amount of information. I just tried it. I entered Redecilla, Belorado and Rabanal. It's amazing the amount if information was given, at least for the first two, which are much larger villages than Rabanal. I used the Spanish version of Wikipedia, considering that maybe more information is offered on home ground, so to speak.
So.....while preparing your Camino ( and the preparation is part of the enjoyment) make up your personal historical guide! Anne

Or alternatively, they could put up historical markers. They would probably pay for themselves in increased traffic to other parts of town, spending, etc...

 

[GerryDel]

The camino isn't Home. It what it is, where it is. We can all see the outcomes of dozens of ill-conceived "improvement" schemes, all along the pathways.

You may have seen the results of some ill-conceived improvement schemes. I happen to think that historical markers are not ill conceived, unless spreading knowledge and educating not only the pilgrims but the entire populace is ill conceived. I've never seen a historical marker in my own country that I've objected to. I enjoy them.

I think one thing the camino can do with less of is people who want to "improve" it.

I could do with less people who think they get to dictate to others how to think of the camino or how they behave on the camino (tourist versus real pilgrim, etc...). I guess we all have our cross to bear. Such is life.

 

[Icacos]

Or alternatively, they could put up historical markers.

I don't think so. Historical markers are what they put up for tourists, which pilgrims aren't.

 

[GerryDel]

I don't think so. Historical markers are what they put up for tourists, which pilgrims aren't.

Nonsense. They put them up for everyone. Tourists or otherwise. I was just at a local park and stopped to read a historical marker. Pilgrims are anything they damn well want to be

 

[Icacos]

........Pilgrims are anything they damn well want to be

And I don't want to be a tourist!

 

[Bajaracer]

For pilgrims to pick up after themselves.

 

[GerryDel]

And I don't want to be a tourist!

You won't be a tourist if you read a historical marker. You'll just be perhaps a little bit more informed than you were before reading it. You might even like it.

 

[JoeNYC]

I really don't get all the hatein' on Gerry. He threw out a couple of ideas. Not like he suggested building a EuroDisney in O Cebreiro!

 

[GerryDel]

I really don't get all the hatein' on Gerry. He threw out a couple of ideas. Not like he suggested building a EuroDisney in O Cebreiro!

Now that is an interesting idea! Have a running of the bulls ride!

 

[xin loi]

If there is water nearby to these,it is highly likely they were mills (flour perhaps)

Not next to water, but on hill tops slightly below the military crest at junction of several waterways. I'm looking for my notes on where they were. They had slabs inside for sleeping and Steve from the U. P. of Michigan slept in one. They were only located in one place along the Camino and were not next to a town.

 

[DLJ]

My intent is not to ruin the ambiance or spirit of the Camino, but reflecting back on my trip, I definitely had the feeling that there were things that would improve the Camino experience for all and would not ruin the ambiance. First, I wondered why there weren't more lavanderías or laundromats along the way. I think they would be well supported by pilgrims. I often found myself just wishing I had somewhere to stop and do my clothes. Yes, I know that most pilgrims hand wash their clothes daily, but I felt this was a difficult process, and often my clothes didn't get dry enough. I also was dependent on the albergue or pension a few times to clean my clothes for me, sometimes at an inflated rate. Next, I really wish there had been more historical markers. I often felt I was walking through history without understanding what I was seeing. All these little villages along the way have a story to tell and it would have been nice to stop and read their stories. With the thousands of years of history in Spain, I am sure there are quite a few untold stories If they could have markers in Spanish, and perhaps the other top 2 languages of the Camino, then that would be very helpful. I'm not saying that they should plaster the things everywhere. Maybe just a historical marker at the beginning of the village explaining the history, what landmarks are there, what events occurred, famous people who live there, etc... I know this takes money, but it would be such an improvement to the experience. It might also induce me to stop in a village and spend money there! What other things do you think would improve the experience without ruining the ambiance?

You won't be a tourist if you read a historical marker. You'll just be perhaps a little bit more informed than you were before reading it. You might even like it.

 

[DLJ]

You may not want to be a tourist, but... People have walked the Caminos for over 1200 yrs. do you think it was a hardship to wash out their few belongings, compared to the facilities today? Today it is a vacation for many, not the rigors of the original Pilgrimage. You lose the Spirit of the Way if you continually think on how can we improve this. The Caminos are an opportunity to travel back in time, and more importantly back into our real selves, the inner man. It is not a walk in the park, walk in the Spirit of the Caminos.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

EuroDisney at O Cebreiro.

 

[Al the optimist]

The Camino needs more of those walking to hesitate, reconsider, and then decide against any inconsiderate act or comment? Or maybe not? After all the Camino reflects life and provides us a chance to gain a new approach to it?

 

[NoQ]

There are loads of purpose built laundry facilities on the Camino Ingles, usually with a roof for drying too.

 

[MendiWalker]

Spain already has places like EuroDisney. Places like - PortAdventura, TerraMitica, Isla Magica, etc............ If you´re looking for something of that kind try visiting the Mediterranean coast. The Camino is something else.

Ondo Ibili !

 

[NoQ]

EuroDisney at O Cebreiro.

Great idea! Genius!

And instead of Mickey, Donald et al, we could have a St James, a Roldan, and a Pope Callixtus the Second along with a host of sparkly plywood mock ups of all the main cathedrals and churches along the way, all with a slightly different theme of course. Plus a boccadillo food court and , best of all for that authentic experience, a morning after photo opportunity after a night in a 'real pilgrim' albergue with a massive bedbug infestation.

 

[nidarosa]

@GerryDel - I agree with you re the wishing to know more about the history and the landscape I was walking through. I particularly remember some ruins I could see on the hill on the other side of the motorway, but not knowing what they were I didn't prioritise spending the time to get over there. Also I had high hopes for the visitors' centre at Atapuerca, which was very disappointing, and when I got to Burgos I just wanted a rest day instead of getting the guided tour back there. I can recommend the Gitlitz book - I have it on my Kindle now and will read up in the evening on the places I will pass the next day. The book itself is too heavy to carry (in my opinion) and reading it before you go won't help much in week four if you have a memory like mine. I was quite jealous of one of my Dutch friends who had a big spiral bound guide book that seemed to have all sorts of info on history, accommodation and recommended things to see and places to eat. I am compiling my own 'next time' list of things to see and do and will keep it on my phone. And I'm serious about the benches - that's why I am taking my roll up mat so I can sit down anywhere.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

@GerryDelAlso I had high hopes for the visitors' centre at Atapuerca, which was very disappointing, and when I got to Burgos I just wanted a rest day instead of getting the guided tour back there.

The visitor center in Atapuerca is just a bus pickup point for the tour of the archeological site. There is a demonstration village next to it that is much more informative (when it is open). The real gem is the museum in Burgos, Museo de la Evolución Humana.

The site tour is interesting and in Spanish. The latest scientific reports assert that some of the remains go back a million years, far further back than anything else in Europe. I met a man (and his family) in Santo Domingo de Silos who had played in the caves as a boy before anything significant had been discovered!

 

[nidarosa]

Sadly I never saw a demo village - it was just that kind of thing I was hoping to find - but I will be getting the tour next time. I do wish they would do the tour in other languages as my Spanish is too basic to really benefit from it - but let's not start that discussion again I suppose I'll have to read up on that too and then put the pieces together when I get there.

 

[GerryDel]

@GerryDel - The book itself is too heavy to carry (in my opinion) and reading it before you go won't help much in week four if you have a memory like mine. I was quite jealous of one of my Dutch friends who had a big spiral bound guide book that seemed to have all sorts of info on history, accommodation and recommended things to see and places to eat. I am compiling my own 'next time' list of things to see and do and will keep it on my phone. And I'm serious about the benches - that's why I am taking my roll up mat so I can sit down anywhere.

That's exactly the problem with books. I had the Brierley along and it was just too much to go fishing in my backpack for it every time I walked through a small village. Plus it didn't have a great deal of historical info. And I'm afraid I had the same problem with memory. I would forget most of the details along the way.

 

[GerryDel]

Great idea! Genius!

And instead of Mickey, Donald et al, we could have a St James, a Roldan, and a Pope Callixtus the Second along with a host of sparkly plywood mock ups of all the main cathedrals and churches along the way, all with a slightly different theme of course. Plus a boccadillo food court and , best of all for that authentic experience, a morning after photo opportunity after a night in a 'real pilgrim' albergue with a massive bedbug infestation.

I think the running of the bulls ride AND a butafumeiro ride would be fantastic.

 

[another walker]

Not next to water, but on hill tops slightly below the military crest at junction of several waterways. I'm looking for my notes on where they were. They had slabs inside for sleeping and Steve from the U. P. of Michigan slept in one. They were only located in one place along the Camino and were not next to a town.

A water slide park perhaps? Weary pilgrims could soak the feet and have BIG fun at the same time!

 

[GerryDel]

You may not want to be a tourist, but... People have walked the Caminos for over 1200 yrs. do you think it was a hardship to wash out their few belongings, compared to the facilities today? Today it is a vacation for many, not the rigors of the original Pilgrimage. You lose the Spirit of the Way if you continually think on how can we improve this. The Caminos are an opportunity to travel back in time, and more importantly back into our real selves, the inner man. It is not a walk in the park, walk in the Spirit of the Caminos.

I understand your point, but I don't feel I have to replicate the old pilgrims' experience. I have my own difficulties and challenges without adding on something that I cannot possibly hope to recreate.

 

[Iamherdingcats]

I'll have to check that out. Thanks

It is available for e readers.

 

[Helen1]

What other things do you think would improve the experience without ruining the ambiance?

More public toilets! Even if you had to pay 1 euro a time to finance cleaning and maintenance. I know that the buildings would probably look ugly and all the rest of it but I feel for the people who have to live next to the piles of human excrement/ toilet paper
lurking in convenient patches of woodland.

 

[Canucks]

How about a restaurant in each town that is open earlier.
Just kidding, but that was the tough part sometimes after a loooong day of walking and having to wait until 8 or 8:30 to enter the restaurant. Sometimes the small cultural changes are the most difficult!

 

[xin loi]

Camino could use some Common Sense routing of the path! Goes out of it's way at times to make things difficult, e.g. climbs some hills for no reason other than to make the walk longer. On the other hand, I do wonder if weather conditions 1200 years ago were the reason for some of the unnecessary hill climbs--after all that was when the Vikings were farming in Greenland and when the Mayan Civilization collapsed--Global warming.

 

[Kanga]

More public toilets! Even if you had to pay 1 euro a time to finance cleaning and maintenance. I know that the buildings would probably look ugly and all the rest of it but I feel for the people who have to live next to the piles of human excrement/ toilet paper
lurking in convenient patches of woodland.

This has been discussed in previous posts. Unless they are in a town (in which case just use the local bar) then toilets will have to be septic or composting long-drop toilets and stupid people foul those with plastic and other non compostable rubbish. Port-a-loos have been tried and quickly became a disgusting mess with excremental oozing out the door after they were blocked with plastic bags and rubbish.

It is not difficult to plan toilet stops to coincide with a cafe or a drink. Surely we are past the age of needing to be reminded to "go" before we set out? We were told to "remember the Queen; she never misses an opportunity".

I can't recall seeing any toilet paper along the route from Le Puy to SJPDP - yet the distances between villages is greater than on the Camino Frances.

 

[Kanga]

I don't know what it needs more of - I do know what it needs less of.

 

[efdoucette]

Too much, too less, too new, too old, too long, too short, too hilly, too flat.
This is all too much!!!!!
Just enjoy, please.

 

[josway2015]

My intent is not to ruin the ambiance or spirit of the Camino, but reflecting back on my trip, I definitely had the feeling that there were things that would improve the Camino experience for all and would not ruin the ambiance. First, I wondered why there weren't more lavanderías or laundromats along the way. I think they would be well supported by pilgrims. I often found myself just wishing I had somewhere to stop and do my clothes. Yes, I know that most pilgrims hand wash their clothes daily, but I felt this was a difficult process, and often my clothes didn't get dry enough. I also was dependent on the albergue or pension a few times to clean my clothes for me, sometimes at an inflated rate. Next, I really wish there had been more historical markers. I often felt I was walking through history without understanding what I was seeing. All these little villages along the way have a story to tell and it would have been nice to stop and read their stories. With the thousands of years of history in Spain, I am sure there are quite a few untold stories If they could have markers in Spanish, and perhaps the other top 2 languages of the Camino, then that would be very helpful. I'm not saying that they should plaster the things everywhere. Maybe just a historical marker at the beginning of the village explaining the history, what landmarks are there, what events occurred, famous people who live there, etc... I know this takes money, but it would be such an improvement to the experience. It might also induce me to stop in a village and spend money there! What other things do you think would improve the experience without ruining the ambiance?

Dear Gerry, there is this book by Gitlitz and Davidson called The Pilgrimage Road to Santiago (ooops! Moderators, is this allowed?) I got mine on Kindle and you would have loved it! Next time!

 

[josway2015]

Please don't change anything, take away or add, I want to see it exactly how it is.

 

[josway2015]

I don't know what it needs more of - I do know what it needs less of.

Can I make a guess Kanga? People that litter?

 

[GerryDel]

Dear Gerry, there is this book by Gitlitz and Davidson called The Pilgrimage Road to Santiago (ooops! Moderators, is this allowed?) I got mine on Kindle and you would have loved it! Next time!

Yep, someone alerted me to that earlier. I will have to get it. Maybe then I won't be so frustrated next time.

 

[bystander]

Plaques, information boards, signboards, interpretation centres?

Dear Lord, what is this generation coming to?

Do we really need to be spoon-fed, instructed and counselled throughout our lives?

Perhaps, (copyright/patent just applied for by bystander©) I should start a "kickstarter" campaign to raise the money for a GPS system for everyones smart gadgets.

This app will, as you walk, at certain waypoints trigger your phone/tablet to, or in a rolling commentary as you walk, instruct and educate you in as to where you are - the geography, the architecture, the history, the politics (oh god, I'm already falling asleep) where the nearest loo/john/dunny with a seat and paper is, what is the best item in the best local restaurant........... /s

I think I'll give walking the camino a miss and just stay at home and watch "My Way" again.

 

[mlhhome]

I love to see more places where pilgrims can donate €/$/£/¥ to help clean up parks, restore town centers and fund safer paths/bridges where needed. This investment could be our legacy to future pilgrims while strengthening the local economies

 

[GerryDel]

Plaques, information boards, signboards, interpretation centres?

Dear Lord, what is this generation coming to?

Do we really need to be spoon-fed, instructed and counselled throughout our lives?

Nothing like a little hyperbole after lunch. I'm not asking to be spoon fed, but if there's a sign that says there's a historical landmark in this village, then I might stop and go check it out as opposed to just walking past. That's to the benefit of both me and the town. I left donations at all the historical sites I stopped at. I can't leave them if I don't know they're there.

Perhaps, (copyright/patent just applied for by bystander©) I should start a "kickstarter" campaign to raise the money for a GPS system for everyones smart gadgets.

This app will, as you walk, at certain waypoints trigger your phone/tablet to, or in a rolling commentary as you walk, instruct and educate you in as to where you are - the geography, the architecture, the history, the politics (oh god, I'm already falling asleep) where the nearest loo/john/dunny with a seat and paper is, what is the best item in the best local restaurant........... /s

You should do it. I personally don't have a smart phone but I'm sure others would enjoy it.

 

[GerryDel]

By the way, there was a plaque on the Hotel Burguete in Burguete mentioning it as the hotel where Hemingway stayed. It was one thing that I was aware of, but I actually walked on the other side of the road and did not see it. Fortunately, we doubled back for breakfast and I walked on the same side of the road, and saw it. If I had not seen the plaque, I probably would have walked right past it again. It was a highlight for me, as I was reading "The Sun Also Rises" at the time and the stay in Burguete was one of my favorite parts of the book. So there are examples of current plaques helping pilgrims locate the history they are looking for.

 

[GerryDel]

One thing the camino needs more of, cash machines and businesses who accept credit/debit cards.

 

[Leaningforward]

I rather liked the difficulty and challenge of accomplishing tasks that would be easy at home -- which forced me to rely on and trust others.

The only thing I missed -- really missed -- on the Frances were more dry places to sit off the ground, or out of the rain and snow, to attend to my feet.

Otherwise, a glorious time.

 

[GerryDel]

I rather liked the difficulty and challenge of accomplishing tasks that would be easy at home -- which forced me to rely on and trust others.

The only thing I missed -- really missed -- on the Frances were more dry places to sit off the ground, or out of the rain and snow, to attend to my feet.

Otherwise, a glorious time.

Yep, more benches would be great, but I wonder if there's a concern about people sleeping on them.

 

[jpflavin1]

My intent is not to ruin the ambiance or spirit of the Camino, but reflecting back on my trip, I definitely had the feeling that there were things that would improve the Camino experience for all and would not ruin the ambiance. First, I wondered why there weren't more lavanderías or laundromats along the way. I think they would be well supported by pilgrims. I often found myself just wishing I had somewhere to stop and do my clothes. Yes, I know that most pilgrims hand wash their clothes daily, but I felt this was a difficult process, and often my clothes didn't get dry enough. I also was dependent on the albergue or pension a few times to clean my clothes for me, sometimes at an inflated rate. Next, I really wish there had been more historical markers. I often felt I was walking through history without understanding what I was seeing. All these little villages along the way have a story to tell and it would have been nice to stop and read their stories. With the thousands of years of history in Spain, I am sure there are quite a few untold stories If they could have markers in Spanish, and perhaps the other top 2 languages of the Camino, then that would be very helpful. I'm not saying that they should plaster the things everywhere. Maybe just a historical marker at the beginning of the village explaining the history, what landmarks are there, what events occurred, famous people who live there, etc... I know this takes money, but it would be such an improvement to the experience. It might also induce me to stop in a village and spend money there! What other things do you think would improve the experience without ruining the ambiance?

Nothing.

 

[Tincatinker]

Perhaps what the Camino needs most is pilgrims who understand that their expectations will be confounded, and exceeded; no matter what is provided, added, supplied or denied.

The economics of providing facilities have been discussed elsewhere on this forum but a simple rehearsal might be of value. Cost of hire of a Portaloo @ €40/ week; cost of servicing @ €25 / visit. Say €90 a week peak season. Income generated by the Camino in a pueblo that has no bar, cafe, Albergue providing facilities and which therefore "should" provide facilities - €0.

 

[rsvp125]

Soap supplied in toilets!

 

[tyrrek]

For pilgrims to pick up after themselves.

Quite right. And pilgrims who on just a few occasions bit their tongues and fill a spare plastic bag with other people's rubbish. The Camino would be clear in no time. Litter attracts more litter.

 

[josway2015]

More public toilets! Even if you had to pay 1 euro a time to finance cleaning and maintenance. I know that the buildings would probably look ugly and all the rest of it but I feel for the people who have to live next to the piles of human excrement/ toilet paper
lurking in convenient patches of woodland.

Oh man! Is it too hard to dig a hole in the ground and deposit your bodily waste there?Like what some smart animals do? Perhaps all perigrinos should be required to carry a trowel. It is not only disgusting and disrespectful to the locals but leaving excrements exposed spread diseases that will not only affect the local flora and fauna, but also humans, and possibly spoil the Camino.

 

[annakappa]

Oh man! Is it too hard to dig a hole in the ground and deposit your bodily waste there?Like what some smart animals do? Perhaps all perigrinos should be required to carry a trowel. It is not only disgusting and disrespectful to the locals but leaving excrements exposed spread diseases that will not only affect the local flora and fauna, but also humans, and possibly spoil the Camino.

Well, yes! I could be too hard to dig a hole in the ground. We don't usually carry a trowel and with bare hands or maybe a fortunate located digging shape rock, you might sometimes manage! Sometimes the depth of the earth is almost non existent, sometimes it's totally dry. Of course it's disgusting, but in some conditions it's not a good situation! Anne

 

[josway2015]

Well, yes! I could be too hard to dig a hole in the ground. We don't usually carry a trowel and with bare hands or maybe a fortunate located digging shape rock, you might sometimes manage! Sometimes the depth of the earth is almost non existent, sometimes it's totally dry. Of course it's disgusting, but in some conditions it's not a good situation! Anne

Hi Anne! Digging a hole in the ground is what we do here in the bush Down Under, it prevent the spread of diseases and keeps the bush a pleasant place to visit. I don't know what the Galician governments' rule is about this matter. A trowel wouldn't be that heavy

 

[MendiWalker]

In Galizia as in other parts of the country people use toilets.

Ondo Ibili !

 

[William Garza]

The camino isn't Home. It what it is, where it is. We can all see the outcomes of dozens of ill-conceived "improvement" schemes, all along the pathways.

I think one thing the camino can do with less of is people who want to "improve" it.

I agree with keeping a place authentic and true to its nature...
but, and please forgive my idea
in my travels across the States
I would bury the seeds of the fruit i was eating along with a cup of water, in the hopes that someone will benefit from shade and nourishment at some future time.
think that would work on some Camino there?
thanks

 

[MendiWalker]

I agree with keeping a place authentic and true to its nature...
but, and please forgive my idea
in my travels across the States
I would bury the seeds of the fruit i was eating along with a cup of water, in the hopes that someone will benefit from shade and nourishment at some future time.
think that would work on some Camino there?
thanks

Just like Johnny Appleseed.......

Ondo Ibili !

 

[mishlove]

Oh what a wonderful walk, as I found it, as it was, as it is, so I hope it will remain and be the same for my next Camino……..contemplating my life and moving forward, by coming from.

 

[annakappa]

Hi Anne! Digging a hole in the ground is what we do here in the bush Down Under, it prevent the spread of diseases and keeps the bush a pleasant place to visit. I don't know what the Galician governments' rule is about this matter. A trowel wouldn't be that heavy

OK, I've just gone to the garden to check our trowel. It weights approx 400 gr. frankly I have more important things to put in my backpack for that weight!
Josway, I don't think you have walked the Camino yet, so on the moment you try to accommodate all the things that you think you will need for your Camino, keeping roughly to the 10% body weight, you might think again about the trowel. For those Pilgrims that, because of their body weight 80 kgs or over, a trowel won't make much difference to your overall weight, however I weigh under 60 kgs, I am over 70, I always carry my pack, but I have to keep it at the most 6 kgs! Sorry, no place for a trowel there!
Presumably you intend to walk the francés, where there is a village most of the time in less than one hours walking. Of course it can happen that you have to " go". It's unfortunate and of course one should do everything possible to bury your product!
I'm interested to find out just how many of our Forum members actually carry a trowel! Anne

 

[Calgarybiker1965]

You're probably right in regards to a laundry, but perhaps a dual purpose place like a bar with a laundry might make it.

We have Cafe/Laundromats here...I know for a fact those laundry machine make a killing and if someone owned one...they could take a long winter off!

 

[Tia Valeria]

Soap supplied in toilets!

Well it might be if pilgrims didn't take it along with the toilet roll.

 

[kmrice]

OK, I've just gone to the garden to check our trowel. It weights approx 400 gr. frankly I have more important things to put in my backpack for that weight!

I'm interested to find out just how many of our Forum members actually carry a trowel! Anne

Mine weighs 75 gr; REI has two that weigh 3 and 3.5 gr. Didn't need it on my Camino but I wouldn't dream of walking without it. You are responsible for your excrement.

 

[whariwharangi]

I'd like more detours around the uglier bits.

Looking at a map it looks perfectly feasible to make a detour (and shortcut) around Leon for example.

 

[annakappa]

Mine weighs 75 gr; REI has two that weigh 3 and 3.5 gr. Didn't need it on my Camino but I wouldn't dream of walking without it. You are responsible for your excrement.

REI is not universal! We don't have REI in Costa Rica ( wishful thinking, I would love to visit REI one day)! A trowel would be bought in a ferretería and it's heavy.
I'm quite aware that we are responsible for my own excrement! Anne

 

[annakappa]

I'd like more detours around the uglier bits.

Looking at a map it looks perfectly feasible to make a detour (and shortcut) around Leon for example.

There is a way around Leon. We have been checking it out and it seems quite feasible.
Anne

 

[Urban Trekker]

I have only walked the English Camino and am walking the Portuguese in September. I research my trips very carefully and take to heart advice from the forum followers. I have a good idea of what to expect. I am prepaired for a lack of cafes, restrooms, water, and long walks between lodgeings. If I have any complaints about the Caminos, it's the sometimes lack of way markers.

Happy Trails

 

[JohnG]

I don't know what it needs more of - I do know what it needs less of.

Billboards for example advertising future albergues / hostels, bars etc.

 

[trevorcc]

The camino isn't Home. It what it is, where it is. We can all see the outcomes of dozens of ill-conceived "improvement" schemes, all along the pathways.

I think one thing the camino can do with less of is people who want to "improve" it.

Agree 100% accept it for what it is no more no less, next we will want the Spanish to speak English????

 

[Tia Valeria]

With all the 'improvements' it soon won't be 'the Camino' but just another long distance hike with all the tourist area 'attractions'. Just what we try to avoid.

With an increasing number of churches being closed I would like to see more open again, even if it is only the outer doors and the grill is in place, or a grill in the door so we can at least see in.

 

[Charrito]

I have only walked the English Camino and am walking the Portuguese in September. I research my trips very carefully and take to heart advice from the forum followers. I have a good idea of what to expect. I am prepaired for a lack of cafes, restrooms, water, and long walks between lodgeings. If I have any complaints about the Caminos, it's the sometimes lack of way markers.

Happy Trails

I'll be doing the Camino Portugués for the third time at the end of this month. If you need any more information (apart from what is available on this excellent forum), just ask.

I also did the Camino Inglés earlier this summer.

 

[Dutch]

The camino isn't Home. It what it is, where it is. We can all see the outcomes of dozens of ill-conceived "improvement" schemes, all along the pathways.

I think one thing the camino can do with less of is people who want to "improve" it.

Agree 100% accept it for what it is no more no less, next we will want the Spanish to speak English????

When something changes, it still is what it is, only differently. Change isn't always a bad thing. The camino has evolved from day one...maybe not at the same rate the rest of the world has, but it is changing and you cant stop it. All your doing is trying to slow the change down, but in the end this is impossible. This doesn't just apply to the Camino. This is universal.

Why are so many people scared of change.

If you go live somewhere on the camino from abroad, you also change the camino. I am even willing to bet when you moved there you decided to do some things differently from others. Maybe even Improve some here and there. Even if its just one or two things.
Is it only good when you say it is?


Oh...yes on the english. Nothig wrong with the spanish learning some english. I try my very best at Spanish. I am sure it won't kille the Spanish to return the favour.
If you work in the hospitality business, there is nothing wrong with being hospitable towards your guests.
It's never a one way street. I try some, you try some. Don't see why not.

 

[Tia Valeria]

There is change and change.
Some of the changes that people want are in fact wanting our culture(s) not theirs. Moving into a society requires change -' we' adapt more than 'they' do. Been there, done that .............etc. Perhaps that is why some of us don't really want to see some types of change on the Camino, because we appreciate the cash economy, less 24/7 electronic communication, the opportunity to try different food etc.
Many Spanish do speak English, but they often feel that some pilgrims need to make more effort. It can be very interesting being a Spanish speaker to see some of the interaction. Then there is rural Galicia where we found an English speaker in a hostal on the Primitivo where only Gallego was spoken by one family member, but we could still communicate and enjoy it.

 

[MendiWalker]

There is change and change.
Some of the changes that people want are in fact wanting our culture(s) not theirs. Moving into a society requires change -' we' adapt more than 'they' do. Been there, done that .............etc. Perhaps that is why some of us don't really want to see some types of change on the Camino, because we appreciate the cash economy, less 24/7 electronic communication, the opportunity to try different food etc.
Many Spanish do speak English, but they often feel that some pilgrims need to make more effort. It can be very interesting being a Spanish speaker to see some of the interaction. Then there is rural Galicia where we found an English speaker in a hostal on the Primitivo where only Gallego was spoken by one family member, but we could still communicate and enjoy it.

Your post reminded me of the follow case -

We arrived to Santiago on Aug 3 . We got our Cotolaya on the way to the peregrinos office. Asked for JW ( he was around but didm´t get to meet him). Got our Compostela. Met up with another forum member and we went to the peregrino mass together. Saw the botafumeiro swing ( once again ) , hugged Santiago , saw his remains, had lunch and later that day met two more fellow forum members and had dinner.......... The following day we were returning home but not without a "see you soon hug" to Santiago again. And passed by hoping to see JW but he was still around but missed him ( perhaps next year).

Now to what your post reminded me of. As we had our backpacks with us this second day. I went in first ...... said see you soon ...... and waited outside as my wife went in. While I was sitting there in the morning sunshine looking after our backpacks a fellow American walked up to me and asked - "Where´s the Pilgrim Office ?" in English. No intention whatsoever to ask in Spanish ( others can make the effort) no intention whatsoever of asking...... just demanding. I found this very very rude on her part ( unfortunately it´s not the first time I´ve seen it done on the Camino) so I smiled at her and replied -" I don´t speak English. " She didn´t give it a second thought , she turned and asked someone else.

The Camino will change itself as time moves on. Don´t try to change it. The Camino has been around for a long long time. It knows what it needs and what it doesn´t. If anyone wants to change it they are wasting their time on the Camino. Better go somewhere else.

Ondo Ibili !

 

[TerryB]

Why are so many people scared of change .

I am wondering if it is those who are asking for "change" on the Camino who are uncomfortable with the "culture shock" that comes from a sudden immersion in a different way of living? It does not seem so long since travellers' cheques had to carried and changed. Now life is so much easier with cash machines (we have always found them to be available even in small towns). No need to push for "change", as Rebeka says "It is what it is"!

Blessings
Tio Tel

 

[MendiWalker]

Well the only change one should hope for on the Camino is to be able to change ones clothes after a nice shower.

Ondo Ibili !

 

[GerryDel]

I am wondering if it is those who are asking for "change" on the Camino who are uncomfortable with the "culture shock" that comes from a sudden immersion in a different way of living? It does not seem so long since travellers' cheques had to carried and changed. Now life is so much easier with cash machines (we have always found them to be available even in small towns). No need to push for "change", as Rebeka says "It is what it is"!

Blessings
Tio Tel

Roncesvalles had no cash machine. Burguete had a cash machine, but it was broken the day we went through. Luckily a hotel was able to give me cash off my card or we would have been screwed. In other places our cards were refused by the cash machines for no explicable reason. I called my bank and they said that everything was fine, that the cash machine should have worked. My bank is a world wide bank with thousands of outlets. It should not have been a problem.

I'm glad you didn't have the difficulties we had with cash machines, but we did face a lot of problems with them. The fundamental nature of the Camino is not changed by adding some convenience, like actual working cash machines, or better yet, businesses could just accept cards like they do in many other modern areas of the world. Instead, they lost business, because I didn't have cash, and by the time I found cash I wasn't going back to them if there was another business nearby.

 

[GerryDel]

If anyone wants to change it they are wasting their time on the Camino. Better go somewhere else.

Ondo Ibili !

So it's up to you to decide who gets to walk the Camino because we don't have the "right" attitude? I enjoyed my Camino, but I also saw definite places where things could be made a bit easier for the pilgrims without taking away from the pilgrimage. I will walk my camino how I want, think what thoughts I want to, and not suffer any from judgments of others who think I should just accept things that I think could be improved. Thanks!

 

[Tia Valeria]

................. In other places our cards were refused by the cash machines for no explicable reason. I called my bank and they said that everything was fine, that the cash machine should have worked. My bank is a world wide bank with thousands of outlets. It should not have been a problem.

It has been said a number of times that most ATMs only accept 4 digit PINS, is yours a 6 digit PIN? If so that would account for the problem. It is something that needs sorting with the bank before leaving home. (For 4 digit PINS in a 6 digit ATM the cards come with instructions for adding 2 more digits. )

 

[MendiWalker]

So it's up to you to decide who gets to walk the Camino because we don't have the "right" attitude? I enjoyed my Camino, but I also saw definite places where things could be made a bit easier for the pilgrims without taking away from the pilgrimage. I will walk my camino how I want, think what thoughts I want to, and not suffer any from judgments of others who think I should just accept things that I think could be improved. Thanks!

Sorry you have misunderstood my words. I´m just another peregrino on the Camino. And on that ..........

Ondo Ibili !