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Possibility of new requirements for a Compostela

Devon Mike

Active Member
Time of past OR future Camino
Frances, Finisterre & Muxia (2014, 2015, 2016, 2018 & 2019), Primitivo & Ingles (2017)
Reported in el Correo Gallego on Tuesday 15th December:

"The International Brotherhood of the Camino wants pilgrims to walk for 300 km to get their Compostela, instead of the stipulated 100 km. For those who choose the bicycle or horse, the distance should increase to 500 km from the current 200 km. According to the organization, it said in a statement this request is based on historical reasons. 300 km separates Oviedo from Santiago, the first pilgrimage route used by King Alfonso II and his court, now called the Primitive Route. Also the new length responds to the distance on the French Way, when the kingdom's capital is transferred to Leon."

This is a very interesting proposal. What do we all think about it?

Mike
 
St James' Way - Self-guided 4-7 day Walking Packages, Reading to Southampton, 110 kms
Why the increase? I'm happy with the current rule but if anything, I think it should also be given to people who travel shorter distances or travel by plane, train or road. I don't look at my compostela the same way I do my marathon finisher medal. To me, I t's a recognition that I've done a pilgrimage to Santiago not that I've accomplished something that others didn't or couldn't. For practical purposes though, I'm happy to stick to the current rules.
 
So where are all the starting points on the different routes if you work on a 300 km minimum? That would be almost the entirety of the Sanabres so I can see lots of people starting from Zamora or Granja de Moreruela for the VDLP.
 
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I does not make much difference to me personally, but I think that while it may reduce the trouble around Sarria, it may "kill" shorter routes such as Camino Ingles. Wouldn't that be considered a path for pilgrimage anymore?

Pilgrimage is from the heart and soul, the steps are just carrying them.
 
I think that the funny thing here is that the International Brotherhood arguments have nothing to do with the way that this fight will play itself out in Spain. I think it will be a battle between those with economic interests in Sarria, who realize that their goose that laid the golden egg might be leaving if the 300 km rule is implemented, vs. all of those further back who think their business will be increased if pilgrims have to walk more. All the while, the International Brotherhood talks about Alfonso II and his relationship to Oviedo.
 
I think that the funny thing here is that the International Brotherhood arguments have nothing to do with the way that this fight will play itself out in Spain. I think it will be a battle between those with economic interests in Sarria, who realize that their goose that laid the golden egg might be leaving if the 300 km rule is implemented, vs. all of those further back who think their business will be increased if pilgrims have to walk more. All the while, the International Brotherhood talks about Alfonso II and his relationship to Oviedo.

I skimmed over the bit about Alfonso II as I am waiting for the video to come out.
 
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I skimmed over the bit about Alfonso II as I am waiting for the video to come out.
My concern is that some make the Camino a family oriented venture a form of a vacation. In my eight Camino's I have seen this take place. Some limited funds and time so the increase can hamper their Camino.
 
So where are all the starting points on the different routes if you work on a 300 km minimum? That would be almost the entirety of the Sanabres so I can see lots of people starting from Zamora or Granja de Moreruela for the VDLP.

On the Francès, Leon would become the popular 300+ starting point.
 
Reported in el Correo Gallego on Tuesday 15th December:

"The International Brotherhood of the Camino wants pilgrims to walk for 300 km to get their Compostela, instead of the stipulated 100 km. For those who choose the bicycle or horse, the distance should increase to 500 km from the current 200 km. According to the organization, it said in a statement this request is based on historical reasons. 300 km separates Oviedo from Santiago, the first pilgrimage route used by King Alfonso II and his court, now called the Primitive Route. Also the new length responds to the distance on the French Way, when the kingdom's capital is transferred to Leon."

This is a very interesting proposal. What do we all think about it?

Mike

Found the link to the article here: http://www.elcorreogallego.es/santi...ostela/idEdicion-2015-12-15/idNoticia-969641/

It is a petition, so I wouldn't hold my breath that it will become reality. I don't think it will impact Sarria too much as it will still be inside the 300km radius (reducing the distance would have a far bigger impact!) and about shorter than 300km routes like the Ingles? My wild guess is that most people that walk the Ingles have already at least one Compostela from previous caminos. I think it might be a good thing, if it really happens, to spread the pilgrims load a wee bit better. Buen Camino, SY

PS Forgot to add, at the same time I would love to see clear provision for pilgrims that can't walk/bike the Camino for health reasons but really would like a Compostela for devotional reasons. This group of pilgrims, as small it might be, could be seriously affected by a widening of the "Compostela Radius" as some of them might just manage 100km, with help, but not 300km.
 
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Reported in el Correo Gallego on Tuesday 15th December:

"The International Brotherhood of the Camino wants pilgrims to walk for 300 km to get their Compostela, instead of the stipulated 100 km. For those who choose the bicycle or horse, the distance should increase to 500 km from the current 200 km. According to the organization, it said in a statement this request is based on historical reasons. 300 km separates Oviedo from Santiago, the first pilgrimage route used by King Alfonso II and his court, now called the Primitive Route. Also the new length responds to the distance on the French Way, when the kingdom's capital is transferred to Leon."

This is a very interesting proposal. What do we all think about it?

Mike
FICS raised this issue in a more general way at the end of 2014, and it is consistent with the Manifesto of Villafranca del Bierzo they promulgated at that time. It appears a new tactic to try and justify this now by using a historical link, but their desire to increase the qualifying distance for the award of a compostela is not. At the end of the day, the cathedral is the authority on what qualifies, and I recollect they dismissed the suggestion last time it was raised. Time will tell whether they give this latest attempt similar treatment.
 
What about the indulgence? would that then be back dated? So my 1/2 years sins, which I have got twice to cover all my sins till I die and did with the 100km rule now be only worth about 1/3. Lets hope its the first 1/3 and not the last!..... so I have another 6 x 100km to do! Great excuse for more "caminoing"

being more serious, I think everybody's Camino is so different and personal. The compestella is a physical representation \ reminder of the experience. Everybody gets touched in one way or another some more deeply than others. The recognition of the personal achievement is whats important not the km. Its where the heart is rather than the accounting that matters.
 
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I walked the Inglés as my first Camino, without that I doubt if I would have walked the Primitivo or any other longer route. As I said on the similar thread last year I hope that this does not happen as it will prevent those less able, but who do want to walk, from making their pilgrimage. To me it sounds like money talking and hopefully the Cathedral authorities will ignore it, and they make the rules.
 
Even if money were the motivation, if the change helped spread an economic benefit from the Camino, that's probably not a bad thing. Also, I suspect families who choose to walk will still choose to walk, perhaps in stages, or perhaps forgoing the compostela. To avoid disenfranchising those with a disability, formalization of an exception process ought to accompany extension of the required distance.

On a purely selfish level, if 300km takes off the wave crest of pilgrims flooding into Santiago and creates a bit more seriousness to the minimum walk, that might also be a good thing. I will confess to losing the battle of inner charity more than once to dive-bombing cyclists between Astorga and Sarria, and, worse, the crush of people (including families) from Sarria who lacked a basic level of consideration towards fellow pilgrims (disrupting naps, shouting, parties, constant rustling, early morning packing noise, lights in the eyes, gear strewn about, etc.). Etiquette and consideration of others goes a long way, and that's something you learn as you go.

On the flip side, perhaps keeping the madness contained to a 100km final sprint might just be a good penance for completing a pilgrimage. Or perhaps it's only me who needs it!
 
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Whilst I think I can appreciate the reasoning behind the proposal I suggest it needs further explanation/amplification. Maybe there needs to be a clear distinction between those who due to physical restrictions can only manage the current 100 km. Those with time limitations could be given an opportunity to fulfill the 300 km over two consecutive years, or be required to fulfill additional spiritual/religious obligations to qualify for a "full" compostela.
For me (personally) I doubt it will mean much of a change - I have my compostela (from 2015) and when/if I return to walk from SJPP to Logrono and then Astorga to SDC I will not be doing it just for a second piece of paper.
As SYates indicated this, so far, is a proposal in a petition and yes I think the people of Sarria or other 100 km radius locations will "be up in arms".

BTW can someone enlighten me - how was this 100km minimum first determined?? Thanks
 
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Last June I took a group to Santiago, along the Frances by coach. In the group were a couple for whom it was a real struggle - he was 86 and had had a major stroke, she was 85 with terminal cancer. I asked at the pilgrim office if there was any way their pilgrimage could be recognised and was told no. The trouble is that what is a major achievement for some may be easy for others - but in the end each pilgrim knows whether they have really made a pilgrimage and the piece of paper doesn't really matter very much.
 
Reported in el Correo Gallego on Tuesday 15th December:

"The International Brotherhood of the Camino wants pilgrims to walk for 300 km to get their Compostela, instead of the stipulated 100 km. For those who choose the bicycle or horse, the distance should increase to 500 km from the current 200 km. According to the organization, it said in a statement this request is based on historical reasons. 300 km separates Oviedo from Santiago, the first pilgrimage route used by King Alfonso II and his court, now called the Primitive Route. Also the new length responds to the distance on the French Way, when the kingdom's capital is transferred to Leon."

This is a very interesting proposal. What do we all think about it?

Mike
I think it would give all the people who consider themselves to be "real pilgrims" something else to do LOL
 
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I think the 300 kilometers for the Compostela will be a good decision , people that can walk won't have any problems and it can be done in one , two or three times.
The other thing is that people that are not in good shape for walking should get their Compostela when they walked 100 kilometers!
That's my opinion am I could be wrong, but walking from Sarria to Santiago is a fair , is to crowded because everyone wants to get their Compostela after walking the last 100 kilometers.
Buen Camino
 
Makes me wonder....if there was no de Compostela for anyone at the end of the journey, no matter how many miles, how many would then decide not to walk at all? The deepest reward for so many, is in the doing.

Some business-savvy person would invent an equivalent and offer it against $$$ ... SY (who still would walk)
 
St James' Way - Self-guided 4-7 day Walking Packages, Reading to Southampton, 110 kms
Last June I took a group to Santiago, along the Frances by coach. In the group were a couple for whom it was a real struggle - he was 86 and had had a major stroke, she was 85 with terminal cancer. I asked at the pilgrim office if there was any way their pilgrimage could be recognised and was told no. The trouble is that what is a major achievement for some may be easy for others - but in the end each pilgrim knows whether they have really made a pilgrimage and the piece of paper doesn't really matter very much.
Hi Sue M, :)

indeed, I do not walk for Compostela. ;)

Bota
 
Makes me wonder....if there was no de Compostela for anyone at the end of the journey, no matter how many miles, how many would then decide not to walk at all? The deepest reward for so many, is in the doing.

Exactly. We live in a strange age, when people do things for a piece of paper... They study at the University to get the Diploma, and they do the pilgrimage to get the Compostela- to have something to show their friends. Sad but true.
Personally I took the Compostela on my first Camino, but on the second one I even did not walk to the office in Santiago.
As to the business part of the talk - if you look at it mathematically, it won't have any impact on Saria.
 
everyone wants to get their Compostela after walking the last 100 kilometers.

in the end each pilgrim knows whether they have really made a pilgrimage and the piece of paper doesn't really matter very much

I would love to see clear provision for pilgrims that can't walk/bike the Camino for health reasons but really would like a Compostela for devotional reasons. This group of pilgrims, as small it might be, could be seriously affected by a widening of the "Compostela Radius"

A significant number who get a Compostela have come to their antipodes. For them, in so many ways, their pilgrimage starts at home. My pilgrimage started in 2001 when I first read a piece written by someone I had first encountered more than 30 years earlier about his start from Sarria. And continued in 2010 when I came north for some family weddings.

And concluded that year:
Partly in the killing fields of Flanders Fields / the Somme (with home connections) I mourned over;
Partly in arriving in Santiago (from Sarria) and getting a piece of paper;
Partly in the three following days I spent in the cathedral there;
Partly when I did a 10 day pilgrimage (by car, sleeping rough in the back) to some of the churches, abbeys and cathedrals (Portsmouth, Deerhurst and Tintern was the triangle); and
Finally finished when I was able to return home and share with my incapacitated wife.

And started again when my wife got an unhelpful diagnosis. So with nearly four years of preparation of mind body and equipment (including getting the daily office with its two year cycle and our local saints and commemorations onto a tablet) I intend to leave home early March, visit family and friends before jetting away on 1 April and to start in Le Puy a few days later. If I encounter troubles, yes, I will plane / train / bus to Sarria.

The Compostela is nice to show to the doubting Thomas' who prefer rules to guide them.
 
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I am a member of the International Brotherhood (Fraternidad Internacional del Camino de Santiago.) I am working on an English translation of the document cited in the newspapers, but it will be a while in coming -- I start on the Way tomorrow.

The 300-km. document was written by an historian and a sociologist. It quotes Carlos II because those people who think history has no bearing on the present are doomed to repeat it; and those (of us) who appreciate history like to draw these parallels -- the 300 km radius cities (Zamora, Coimbra, Aviles, Oviedo, Leon) have had much to do with the history of Spanish piety and are still active parts of the modern camino.

The 100 km rule dates back to 1999. It was meant as a temporary measure to deal with an overwhelming Holy Year boom, but was set in concrete somehow. The unintended consequence was the commercialization and overcrowding along the final 100 kilometers into Santiago, and a strange mania for a fancy bit of paper. Latest numbers say 60% of pilgrims who get Compostelas walked only the last 100 kilometers of the path. IMHO, this seems to defeat the whole purpose of a long-distance pilgrimage.

The Camino de Santiago has always been seen, at least in Spain and Portugal, as an extraordinary, marathon long-distance journey for the devout and the fit, not a short-term "romeria" walk for everyone. Pilgrims who hike across continents should not be awarded the same as people who've done the four-day, four-star "Camino Quickee Tour." The cathedral seems to have abandoned its initial hope to keep the Compostela a "precious document of holy vows completed," and has simply gone into the souvenir business at worst, and traffic-policing at best.

As for who are the Brotherhood: We all are volunteers. We accept no funding from government programs or corporations or commercial interests. We paint waymarks, write guides, clean up caminos, staff albergues. Other initiatives include riding herd on redevelopment in downtown Sarria (so another Roman bridge is not demolished); overseeing enforcement of UNESCO heritage route disignations and Camino sites; and now lobbying local government agencies to improve pilgrim safety at 14 "black spots" along the paths, where pilgrims and traffic are not mixing well.
We are not doing this because we'll make money. We're doing this because we want to keep the camino spirit alive -- with or without souvenir scallop-shell socks, cool apps, mileage certificates, or even cathedrals.

We don't expect a lot of response from the Cathedral on this, but it's important that we keep this issue out there. Miracles are known to happen around here, you know.
 
Thank you for the background details Rebekah.
 
I am a member of the International Brotherhood (Fraternidad Internacional del Camino de Santiago.) I am working on an English translation of the document cited in the newspapers, but it will be a while in coming -- I start on the Way tomorrow.

The 300-km. document was written by an historian and a sociologist. It quotes Carlos II because those people who think history has no bearing on the present are doomed to repeat it; and those (of us) who appreciate history like to draw these parallels -- the 300 km radius cities (Zamora, Coimbra, Aviles, Oviedo, Leon) have had much to do with the history of Spanish piety and are still active parts of the modern camino.

The 100 km rule dates back to 1999. It was meant as a temporary measure to deal with an overwhelming Holy Year boom, but was set in concrete somehow. The unintended consequence was the commercialization and overcrowding along the final 100 kilometers into Santiago, and a strange mania for a fancy bit of paper. Latest numbers say 60% of pilgrims who get Compostelas walked only the last 100 kilometers of the path. IMHO, this seems to defeat the whole purpose of a long-distance pilgrimage.

The Camino de Santiago has always been seen, at least in Spain and Portugal, as an extraordinary, marathon long-distance journey for the devout and the fit, not a short-term "romeria" walk for everyone. Pilgrims who hike across continents should not be awarded the same as people who've done the four-day, four-star "Camino Quickee Tour." The cathedral seems to have abandoned its initial hope to keep the Compostela a "precious document of holy vows completed," and has simply gone into the souvenir business at worst, and traffic-policing at best.

As for who are the Brotherhood: We all are volunteers. We accept no funding from government programs or corporations or commercial interests. We paint waymarks, write guides, clean up caminos, staff albergues. Other initiatives include riding herd on redevelopment in downtown Sarria (so another Roman bridge is not demolished); overseeing enforcement of UNESCO heritage route disignations and Camino sites; and now lobbying local government agencies to improve pilgrim safety at 14 "black spots" along the paths, where pilgrims and traffic are not mixing well.
We are not doing this because we'll make money. We're doing this because we want to keep the camino spirit alive -- with or without souvenir scallop-shell socks, cool apps, mileage certificates, or even cathedrals.

We don't expect a lot of response from the Cathedral on this, but it's important that we keep this issue out there. Miracles are known to happen around here, you know.
An excellent read; and to know now more of what it is you do. Truly, a wonderful service. Thank you.
 
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The indulgence is given to all pilgrims AND visitors to the Cathedral in Holy Years that fulfil the religious requirements (confession, communion etc.) It is not necessary to walk/bike/ride the Camino for it. Buen Camino, SY
SY.... with respect... are you sure the indulgence is for ALL pilgrims and visitors?? I read in one of the many Jubilee Year website the specific mention of "catholics". But, IMHO, its all a matter of FAITH. :)
 
SY.... with respect... are you sure the indulgence is for ALL pilgrims and visitors?? I read in one of the many Jubilee Year website the specific mention of "catholics". But, IMHO, its all a matter of FAITH. :)

The indulgence is given to all pilgrims AND visitors to the Cathedral in Holy Years that fulfil the religious requirements (confession, communion etc.) It is not necessary to walk/bike/ride the Camino for it. Buen Camino, SY

Yes, one of the religious requirements is obviously to be Roman-Catholic as indulgences, in the strict theological sense of the word, are only available to Roman-Catholic Christians, and Christians of Churches that are in full communion with the Roman-Catholic Church. Wiki has an interesting article https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indulgence about this, especially about the use of a similar practise in the Eastern Orthodox Churches. Buen Camino, SY
 
Hola Reb & Paddy - thanks for a very clear (and yes concise) explanation who the Brotherhood are and some of their roles. Considering the way the SDC Cathedral has commercialised the swinging of the Botafumeriro over the past 3 years I certainly won't hold my breath waiting for their agreement or positive response. Cheers
 
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Very interesting perspective. I never thought much about the distance traveled by others, or about the paper, other than the memories & the loving heart from the pilgramage. I very much appreciate what the brotherhood gets accomplished. The Camino exists because they keep the Caminos functioning, yet in thought & faith we go, seems we get out of it what we put into it.
Thanks Rebeka
 
Great info Rebeka. I thank you for your interest in keeping the Camino and its meaning true, many of us benefit from this labor.
With regards to the proposed change to increase the distance I believe that the church is in the business of salvation and to teach us to live a life according to Christian teaching and values. If the 100 kilometres and the botafumairo brings people in by the hundreds to hear and be exposed to these teaching then I'm in. Call it a marketing ploy if you want but in my view is working. For those reasons, I'm in support of keeping things as they are.
My humble opinion

Chris
 
The focus is on reducing the risk of failure through being well prepared. 2nd ed.
For me it´s not kilometers or days or even that piece of paper. Only thing that matters is that I have been there, done my OWN Camino.

I didn´t remember the Compostela before I read these replies but almost every day since my Camino last April-May I think
the few people I met, the places I saw and those quiet long days I walked alone, coming to Santiago.....
Those memories will follow me forever and that´s enough.

We are different, somebody else may think that the Compostela is the thing. I am not the one to judge anybody.
This is one of the things (among many others) I learned in four days after leaving Irun. I should have met this ´teacher´ years ago.

I don´t know if I should say this but I felt myself stupid (more than usual) when I was standing in front of the Pilgrim`s Office.
Only 15-20 people in front me and suddenly I wanted to escape. I did not.

Merry Christmas
 
I think it's a short sighted proposal. The Camino is a major source of economic income for Spain (it must be given the number of pilgrims who walk it) so to reduce the incentive to walk at a time when many nations are struggling economically doesn't make sense. The Camino is an arbitrarily determined route as it is. As if anyone walking to SDC in the olden days actually set off to walk a specific route? They would have traveled by any transport available on any route that was feasible. So I don't see any reason for a change other than to satisfy someone's ego or view about what a pilgrimage should be.
 
I think it's a short sighted proposal. The Camino is a major source of economic income for Spain (it must be given the number of pilgrims who walk it) so to reduce the incentive to walk at a time when many nations are struggling economically doesn't make sense. The Camino is an arbitrarily determined route as it is. As if anyone walking to SDC in the olden days actually set off to walk a specific route? They would have traveled by any transport available on any route that was feasible. So I don't see any reason for a change other than to satisfy someone's ego or view about what a pilgrimage should be.
In the meantime, you are losing many pilgrims 'because' of the crowds, growing commercialism, jacked up rates along the last 100kms...
 
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That's not what the statistics show. Completion rates from the official website are consistently growing:
  • 1984 - 423 (yes, that's all)
  • 2004 - 179,944 (Holy Year)
  • 2005- 93,924
  • 2006 - 100,377
  • 2007 - 114,026
  • 2008 - 125,141
  • 2009 - 145,877
  • 2010 - 272,135 (Holy Year)
  • 2011 - 183,366
  • 2012 - 192,488
  • 2013 - 215,880
  • 2014 - 237,886
So the popularity of the Camino continues to grow. Obviously some of that growth comes from people returning to do it again and again. But still ... if the next Holy Year follows the trend of previous Holy Years perhaps there will be 400,000+ completions in 2016.

It is estimated on the American Pilgrims website that approximately 20% of all pilgrims only walk the final 100km. So the lost tourist revenue for Spain if that option is removed would hit hard.

I found a news article that says that tourism generates about 50,000,000E for Spain. You don't need to be a mathematician to see what kind of hit the economy would take if those 47,000 pilgrims (based on 20% of 237,000) didn't come to Spain and spend a couple hundred euros each (even if they only spent 200E each that would still be about 9,400,000E taken off the income.

Now I'm no economist or mathematician ... I'm just thinking this through
 
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Good point LookingFor42. Is quite impressive how many people participate on this treck, regardless of their reasons. There is nothing better than a common goal to unify people, this pilgrimage to Santiago seems to have that calling card. Particularly important at a time when we have been losing church goers all over the world at a great rate. I respect a place that brings so many people together like the Camino does, it must have major Mojo...
 
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Good point LookingFor42. Is quite impressive how many people participate on this treck, regardless of their reasons. There is nothing better than a common goal to unify people, this pilgrimage to Santiago seems to have that calling card. Particularly important at a time when we have been losing church goers all over the world at a great rate. I respect a place that brings so many people together like the Camino does, it must have major Mojo...

It is impressive isn't it. I'm not a church goer (I'm gay and transgender so I've had some bad experiences with the Catholic Church as an institution but I pray every day in the Blue Sky Cathedral). But the call of all those Cathedrals where I can pray in peace to give thanks for having been given a second chance at life (I had a mini stroke in February 2014 at 34 years old) and having been given the opportunity to spend the past two years since that second chance traveling the world is definitely a draw card.

I also love the idea that an experience can draw so many people to it. It's an incredible demonstration that we are all human before we are labeled. And to think that each of those hundreds of thousands of people will take home stories of world peace through their stories of "oh that Japanese man I walked with" or "that Israeli woman I met on the Camino" or "you wouldn't believe this Italian man was 70 years old walking" or "I spent a day walking with a 20 year old woman from America who dreamed ...". Because each of those stories will be shared with 10-20 people, opening 10-20 pairs of eyes to the beauty of humanity no matter nationality, age, gender or anything else that makes us unique.

Yes ... as you say ... a major Mojo
 
... The Camino is an arbitrarily determined route as it is. As if anyone walking to SDC in the olden days actually set off to walk a specific route? They would have traveled by any transport available on any route that was feasible. ....

Actually that isn't completely true. Pilgrims in the olden days grouped together, mainly for safety (bandits, wolves etc.) reasons and followed established routes, often trade routes. Also the availability of bridges and hospitality determined the route they would take. Santo Domingo de la Calzada is a prime example for this. Obviously they all had to start, more or less, alone at the door of their own home, but would aim to join others at 'traffic knot points'. Examples are for example the monastery in Einsiedeln where pilgrims would group together to tackle the mountain crossing or sanctuaries on the route like Vezelay or Le Puy that were 'must visits' in their own rights. True, there were no yellow arrows at that time, but also far less roads to get lost on ;-) Buen Camino, SY
 
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Who cares about a piece of paper that will probably end up in the bottom of a drawer. 300km is too much for many people. I know a friend who has his knees replaced any he just managed the 100km. Also Porto to SDC is a popular route and its less than 300km.

I remember arriving on my 2nd Camino to SDC and seeing the queues to get the compostala, I didn't bother queuing, I did the camino, I don't need a piece of paper, However I did pass later when there was no queue to get it.

With Facebook today you don't need a piece of paper to say you did the camino, its all online. There are also those who take the odd bus along the way and don't walk the whole thing anyway.

The way they are going the camino will end up like a Marathon event and people will have to wear chips and pass certain points to certify they did walk it.

Mind you most of the routes before the last 100km are nicer than the last 100km. I would encourage anyone to walk them.
 
You know, I made a pretty cynical comment about the International Brotherhood's efforts earlier in this thread and I very much regret it. I know that I owe this group a lot for all of its behind the scene efforts and projects to protect and defend the Camino. They are really the front line fighting the onslaught of economic forces that want to create a Caminolandia where your every whim can be catered to, where the "it's your Camino" folks pander to our weaknesses and where it's all about the amenities and the pieces of paper that attest to our accomplishments.

I'm sure it's a long hard and maybe even a losing battle, but hooray for the dedication and love of the Camino that they embody. Buen camino, Laurie
 
@peregrina2000 - while appreciating their efforts in so many ways I still think it is sad that they are embracing a 'distance requirement' that will work against many who are unable to walk more than the current requirement (for any reason). They are also underestimating the effect on the other, shorter Caminos and seem to be focusing too much on the Francés, which (if they succeed distance wise) will actually become even more overcroweded/commercialised as folk are forced away from the shorter routes to Santiago.
 
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@Rebekah Scott , thank you for explaining the history and work you do as a brotherhood. I joined this forum a year ago when this very topic was being discussed since there had just been talks in Spain about this, and probably other issues, which I cannot recall. Spent most of my winter vaccation on my tablet reading all the comments with great interest. Is this Round II?

I cannot say how delighted I am that the 100km circus situation is being addressed by those in the know, by people who can articulate their rational better than any others, and that the rational is based on historical, religious, and yes, economical/social issues. Thank you also for tying long distance to the notion of this particular pilgrimage and also the one of sacrifice. It's not as if the Catholic Church is not used to asking its faithful for sacrifices after all.

@movinmaggie mentions the loss of pilgrims because of the overcom,ercialisation of the Camino, not that of vaccationers, and she makes an excellent point. Without getting into the debate of what makes a person a true pilgrim I have certainly experieced the difference in the introspection, praying, meditation, etc. that one can do in a quieter environment, in a more respectful environment that in one that is getting more and more chaotic by the day, one that is now about the certificate, not the process or the sanctity of the destination. For those looking for a more spiritual experience the crowds have become an issue. The Camino as a walking retreat, which is has basically been for centuries, is being greatly challenged.

Remember, we camino addicts on the forum are not representative of the tens of thousands who will only walk once. I believe that the proportion of people on the camino that are there for the experience, for the bucket list, is much greater in the general camino walking population than here, and for those with a bucket list, the peice of paper is important.

Sarria will not suffer because the starting point will be elsewhere, it may just suffer if the numbers drop overall, on the other hand it may not have to embark in huge public works to support this tourist infrastructure: water supply, sewer treatment etc. things that can hardly supported by taxes on beds at 10€ a night, no matter how many beds are filled and how many cafe con leches are sold. Afterall, isn't a huge part of what attracts so many on the Camino what an inexpensive holiday it is? o_O

If the 100km rule,was only created for the last Ano Santo I am all in favour for it being revised before the next one.

Thank you again Rebbekah for the info you provided. Now, where do I sign this petition?
 
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@peregrina2000 - while appreciating their efforts in so many ways I still think it is sad that they are embracing a 'distance requirement' that will work against many who are unable to walk more than the current requirement (for any reason). They are also underestimating the effect on the other, shorter Caminos and seem to be focusing too much on the Francés, which (if they succeed distance wise) will actually become even more overcroweded/commercialised as folk are forced away from the shorter routes to Santiago.
By removing many from the CF who may not have a compostela high on their bucket list it will make more space for those for whom the sacrifice to get to Santiago is important. Ad it's not as if there are huge numbers of people on the other routes anyway. 5% walk the Norte, less than 1% the Primitivo, something along those lines?
 
By removing many from the CF who may not have a compostela high on their bucket list it will make more space for those for whom the sacrifice to get to Santiago is important. Ad it's not as if there are huge numbers of people on the other routes anyway. 5% walk the Norte, less than 1% the Primitivo, something along those lines?
But in return you get the 100/200km people who are forced to walk 300Km..... and possibly all of them if the Compostela does matter to them
 
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But in return you get the 100/200km people who are forced to walk 300Km..... and possibly all of them if the Compostela does matter to them
And for them special treatment from the Catheral can surly be programmed. I think the main point being addressed is the heard, not the gems.
 
But in return you get the 100/200km people who are forced to walk 300Km..... and possibly all of them if the Compostela does matter to them
Then I guess we could ask the question "Why does the Compostela matter"? And would it hold perhaps hold more meaning having walked 800 kms rather than 100 kms? We each answer in our own way.
 
Then I guess we could ask the question "Why does the Compostela matter"? And would it hold perhaps hold more meaning having walked 800 kms rather than 100 kms? We each answer in our own way.
I'm willing to be that it does have a lot more meaning for those who walked from home, from Jerusalem, Rome, or even Russia. With every step comes the opportunity to quit or jump in a taxi, on a bus, a train. A constant battle.

But as Rebbekah pointed out, within Spain 300km makes sense due to the roles Leon and Oviedo have played in the history of the Camino. It's a rationale that is not based on current geopolitical borders but the Camino's own history.
 
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I am a member of the International Brotherhood (Fraternidad Internacional del Camino de Santiago.) I am working on an English translation of the document cited in the newspapers, but it will be a while in coming -- I start on the Way tomorrow.

The 300-km. document was written by an historian and a sociologist. It quotes Carlos II because those people who think history has no bearing on the present are doomed to repeat it; and those (of us) who appreciate history like to draw these parallels -- the 300 km radius cities (Zamora, Coimbra, Aviles, Oviedo, Leon) have had much to do with the history of Spanish piety and are still active parts of the modern camino.

The 100 km rule dates back to 1999. It was meant as a temporary measure to deal with an overwhelming Holy Year boom, but was set in concrete somehow. The unintended consequence was the commercialization and overcrowding along the final 100 kilometers into Santiago, and a strange mania for a fancy bit of paper. Latest numbers say 60% of pilgrims who get Compostelas walked only the last 100 kilometers of the path. IMHO, this seems to defeat the whole purpose of a long-distance pilgrimage.

The Camino de Santiago has always been seen, at least in Spain and Portugal, as an extraordinary, marathon long-distance journey for the devout and the fit, not a short-term "romeria" walk for everyone. Pilgrims who hike across continents should not be awarded the same as people who've done the four-day, four-star "Camino Quickee Tour." The cathedral seems to have abandoned its initial hope to keep the Compostela a "precious document of holy vows completed," and has simply gone into the souvenir business at worst, and traffic-policing at best.

It is supposed to be a religious journey with hardship, and a lot of time to reflect on ones own life and experience. If i only walked 100km i would never ask for a certificate, i would consider it to be taking the mick a little. 300km is a nice amount. Not to long, not to short. Someone with average fitness should be able to complete in 2-3 weeks. Fitter people wanting the minimal experience will do it in considerably less. The ones who want to appreciate the journey will still go the whole hog.

I havent walked yet, so some things i cant really pass judgement on, but from what ive read on here, it does seem the camino has become one large business for a lot of people. Not that i find mainstream catholicism to be any different.
 
I never expected to achieve walking the Camino after hurting my knee, and being unable to walk when Terry did in 2009. Managing to walk the Camino Inglés and receiving my Compostela in 2011 meant a great deal. Walking the Primitivo after that, from Tineo in 2012 (having walked sections from Oviedo to Tineo in 2010) was also meaningful. There was plenty of space for reflection in the days ot took to walk both these Caminos - taking twice as long as most people do.
Please do not denigrate what for some is both a meaningful pilgimage and an achievement. And 'no' I would not expect some sort of alternative Compostela if the distance was lengthened, I would just feel excluded. For the registered disabled then 'yes' there is a need for special recognition, even for the present 100kms. :)
 
Found the link to the article here: http://www.elcorreogallego.es/santi...ostela/idEdicion-2015-12-15/idNoticia-969641/

It is a petition, so I wouldn't hold my breath that it will become reality. I don't think it will impact Sarria too much as it will still be inside the 300km radius (reducing the distance would have a far bigger impact!) and about shorter than 300km routes like the Ingles? My wild guess is that most people that walk the Ingles have already at least one Compostela from previous caminos. I think it might be a good thing, if it really happens, to spread the pilgrims load a wee bit better. Buen Camino, SY

PS Forgot to add, at the same time I would love to see clear provision for pilgrims that can't walk/bike the Camino for health reasons but really would like a Compostela for devotional reasons. This group of pilgrims, as small it might be, could be seriously affected by a widening of the "Compostela Radius" as some of them might just manage 100km, with help, but not 300km.

I hope this is not too off topic, but I just wanted some clarity about the Pilgrims Passport. I am walking my first Camino April 2016. I am assuming I can order it from the Shop on this forum. I am meeting some friends in Sarria and they will walk only Sarria to Santiago. Can I order all three passports from the forum shop? And this is the passport we carry with us and get signed as we walk the Camino? Or should I just get my own when I get to SJPP?
 
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With his thread I see a lot of people getting confused about terminology and the original intent of walking the Camino. There is a thread called What is a Compostela? What is it not?, that is a good read to clarify that document. Folks, the Compostela is a religious document, more specifically a "Catholic" document, issued by the Catholic Church, not a completion certificate. The body of the text speaks to religious accomplishment, not athletic accomplishment. The Compostela was presented to pilgrims who arrived in Santiago after sacrificing time and effort to walk there. Having it meant, atonement for sins, or, during Holy years, the earning of plenary indulgence. It is a Catholic document, as such it is their prerogative to determine what a pilgrim is required to achieve to receive it. That is why you are not given a "Compostela" if you don't tell them your reason for walking the Camino is Spiritual/Religious. That said, it does not mean that non-Christians, agnostics, or atheists, cannot walk the Camino, or earn a completion certificate. The article mentions nothing about changing the distance requirement for the completion certificate, they only mentioned the religious document. If you are doing it for religious reasons, and want that Compostela then you have to be willing to sacrifice to earn it. Sacrifice is the whole point of the Compostela. Sacrifice, religion, nor spirituality have anything to do with getting a completion certificate to indicate you walked the last 100K of the Camino.
 
I am a member of the International Brotherhood (Fraternidad Internacional del Camino de Santiago.) I am working on an English translation of the document cited in the newspapers, but it will be a while in coming -- I start on the Way tomorrow.

Rebekah,

Thank you for your contributions. I agree with International Brotherhood's reasoning.

Victoria
 
I hope this is not too off topic, but I just wanted some clarity about the Pilgrims Passport. I am walking my first Camino April 2016. I am assuming I can order it from the Shop on this forum. I am meeting some friends in Sarria and they will walk only Sarria to Santiago. Can I order all three passports from the forum shop? And this is the passport we carry with us and get signed as we walk the Camino? Or should I just get my own when I get to SJPP?

Yes, yes, yes and yes and no worries. Buen Camino, SY
 
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Then I guess we could ask the question "Why does the Compostela matter"? And would it hold perhaps hold more meaning having walked 800 kms rather than 100 kms? We each answer in our own way.
I agree! And, I suspect that most of us answer that question somewhere in between the either/or extremes of "Who cares about a piece of paper" and "I walk to get a piece of paper" camps. I think a "both/and" middle ground applies to most of us.

I walked from SJPdP, and the fruits of the pilgrimage were my greatest reward. I walked for other reasons than the Compostela AND I'm glad I received it. It is framed on display alongside my pilgrim's passport, stretched out to show all the sellos. There's no reason not to be proud (as distinct from egotistical) of such an accomplishment. There, for the grace of God, went I. AND I got some really cool mementos in the process.

Personally, having read @Rebekah Scott's post above, I would wholeheartedly support the extension to a longer minimum distance provided that consideration is made for those with disability. Those who can walk longer should. Those who can't should be able to receive an accommodation. I am reminded of a passage from the Rule of St. Benedict, "arrange everything so that the strong have something to yearn for and the weak nothing to run from."
 
There are a lot of very valuable comments in this dialog. Thank you all.

I am sorry for how long my posting is. But those of you know me will understand that this pushes my buttons...HARD. For those of you who I have not had the pleasure to meet, again, I regret the length. However, there are some gems in what follows...use them as appropriate...

I agree with increasing the distance, in concept. However, I also very well understand the very visceral, political and economic realities of doing so in Spain. My ideas or recommendations, below, add to what Rebekah stated above and approach the end result from a simple maxim: "Instead of raising the bridge, lower the water..."

Increasing the required distance raises the bridge and affects all pilgrims, including those with special needs. "Lowering the water" also affects all pilgrims, but in a manner than affects each person individually, not all pilgrims as a class.

I think the end result of adopting at least some of my ideas would likely be similar. That result is fewer people will hang their entire Camino experience on the paper document - the Compostela. I agree with all of those who desire to increase the sincerity, solemness, and spiritual accomplishment of completing a proper Camino.

However, I also feel this desired result would be reached, without much of the vitriol and anxiety that simply drawing a larger diameter radius for starting a Camino entails. While a simple tactic for reducing pilgrim numbers among some tranches of the current Pilgrim demographic, simply requiring more distance will not work and will likely never happen. So, and accordingly, I cam up with alternative, process solutions, that should achieve a similar outcome.

On the other hand, from what I have seen among the "Camino Quickee" crowd over three years, many people will simply find more and clever ways to cheat the system. I believe the current system needs to change to remove the inducement to cheat, by eliminating the free FREE benefit at the end. All of what I propose is about increasing value, both to the individual pilgrim and the Camino community writ large.

My view, predicated on walking three Caminos and having served a total of six-weeks as a volunteer at the Pilgrim Office, mirrors some of Rebekah's outstanding thoughts, above. To wit:

"Pilgrims who hike across continents should not be awarded the same as people who've done the four-day, four-star "Camino Quickee Tour." The cathedral seems to have abandoned its initial hope to keep the Compostela a "precious document of holy vows completed," and has simply gone into the souvenir business at worst, and traffic-policing at best."

I agree totally with this sentiment. This past August, I implored, no...begged, the Pilgrim Office management, and Fr. Jaime (? surname) who oversees the ACC (Acogida Cristiana en en Camino) on several occasions over a month, to PLEASE find a way at the new Pilgrim Office to separate out those requesting the Compostela as a spiritual document, from "the tourists." I sought to remove issuing the free Compostela from those who wanted a Compostela, but as one FREE item on their shopping list of certificates, souvenirs, baubles and what not, that they were intent on purchasing while in this (supposedly solemn) Cathedral space.

Incidentally, all of this added-on"tripe" for purchase contributes in a straight-line fashion to queues, aggravation and displeasure among the arriving pilgrims. Perhaps ironically, or not, in my observation, the loudest complainers were those in the largest sub-groups (fewer than 4 or 5), or with the longest shopping lists, who had walked the shortest distances...I am just sayin...

My specific comment to Fr. Jaime at the time was that the current atmosphere is akin to Jesus in the courtyard of the Temple in Jerusalem overturning the money changer and vendor carts. We have, perhaps accidentally, turned part of a house of God into a marketplace.

While I understand the need for the Pilgrim Office to be self-sufficient financially (they are NOT supported by the Cathedral budget if I recall correctly), I believe that changes to the current business plan are indicated. The current atmosphere (2015) is not conductive to spirituality and solemness, at least IMHO.

For example, as part of my 2015 pleading, I recommended that there be an onsite tienda at the new Pilgrim Office (Lord knows they have the space) that would sell all the souvenir and devotional items, as well as laser-printed distance / mileage certificates. I strongly maintain that issuance of the formal Compostela should be done in a more serious and devout manner and setting.

Knowing that approximately half of all Pilgrims start in Sarria, and are on the "Camino Quikee Tour" as Rebekah so concisely states it, I make the following recommendation for any and all who can actually DO SOMETHING with it.

First, we start with a suggest, revised policy for the Archbishop to "issue."

"To increase the devotional and sincere aspect of the accomplishment of a proper Camino, Compostelas should cease to be dispensed for free. Instead, and upon proper certification of completing a Camino, as specified by the relevant authorities, a Compostela may be obtained at a nominal fee, and solely at the Pilgrim Office in Santiago de Compostela. In lieu of a free Compostela, on request, any arriving Pilgrim with a properly completed pilgrim credencial, may receive a free stamp of the Cathedral and Archbishop that documents completion of the pilgrimage. Said stamp(s) will be affixed to the validated credencial"

Second, I considered the following ideas when proposing this simple but profound policy and process change:
  1. The "cheap holiday" and "Camino Quickee Tour" folks will be dissuaded from standing in line to get something for free, because nothing will be free. At the Pilgrim Office, there would be a separate place, and queue for persons who only desire a sello / stamp, and "close-out" of their Credencial by Pilgrim Office staff (volunteers included).
  2. Fees from the now, at cost, Compostela should be used to hire one or more qualified calligraphers. The official, staff calligrapher(s) will write the Compostelas upon being told to issue one, by the Pilgrim Office staff person (including volunteers) conducting the arrival interview. The resulting document will be more worth the cost, and will increase the felt value of the entire experience to the Pilgrim.
  3. Yes, it will increase gross Pilgrim Office revenues, but the intention is to pay for the calligrapher, not necessarily to turn a profit. Surely, there are trained calligraphers in or near Sanitago who would leap at the job opportunity. It is an ancient city, a UNESCO site, and a university city. Spanish labor laws aside, I would propose a minimum wage, with a per Compostela, piece rate payment, to keep production proceeding, especially during the peak season.
  4. Yes, the Church has been issuing a free Compostela certificate for more than 800 years. However, consider that this started at a time when it was absolutely needed in an era when only clergy could read and write, and the ONLY way you could PROVE you actually completed the pilgrimage was written proof, complete with wax and ribbon seals. The original Compostelas were handwritten, and given on parchment, then vellum, both of which were more durable than paper certificates.
  5. Currently, many pilgrims take GPS-tagged photos holding their Compostelas on leaving the Pilgrim Office using digital camera or smart phones. I have personally taken hundreds if not thousands of these happy photos. I even adopted a red clown / payaso nose to compel people to laugh.
  6. Adopting the modern view, one could argue that the paper Compostela was an anachronism, a useless link to an ancient time, with little current value. I would argue that taking photos that have the time, date, and GPS location connected forever to the image electronically, is a far better idea. We could use a standard prop, a "stage" Compostela if you will to stand in for a personalized, free document, or not, whatever works...
  7. Affixing the formal stamp of the Cathedral and Archbishop on a completed credencial, to signify the successful completion of the Camino, by authorized Pilgrim Office staff, should be adequate to document the Camino. See the policy statement above...
  8. God, the Angels, Saints and whoever staffs the Pearly Gates will not need to see an earthly piece of paper to document your completion of a Camino and arrival at the Gates of Heaven with your indulgences. Besides, any such paper will long ago have become dust. Consider that...
  • All indulgences and spiritual benefits that confer upon one's SOUL from having completed a Camino are just that...SPIRITUAL. Perhaps that is why we see more and more repeat pilgrims simply requesting "solo sello" to document in their credencial that they finished their Camino, but they do not desire a Compostela, even a free one. There is veritas at work here....
  • These repeat pilgrims KNOW what they have accomplished, as does the BIG GUY above. To paraphrase a comedic movie from the 1970's: "...(Compostelas, COMPOSTELAS!) we don need no "stinkin" (Compostelas)...! I am using humor here to make a point. NO insult to anyone is intended (sic). The point is that, if you did it (a Camino), you and the Big Guy know it. No piece of paper is going to convince St. Peter and the Angels to let you pass...it is stamped on your immortal soul. Of course, this is problematic if you are not a believer...But I do not judge...
  • God knows all, and man goes nuts thinking somehow, that physical, earthly documentation will make a difference in the end...
I am perplexed....

I hope this helps the dialog...actually, I hope the doable bits of this find their way to someone who can act on them...

Feliz Navidad everyone...!
 
On the Francès, Leon would become the popular 300+ starting point.
Personally starting points and such don't concern me any longer. I have opted out to doing the Camino by get my passport stamped and that's the end. The past three years have not bother to get a Compostela I felt that I did the Camino cause I wanted to do it for my enjoyment and pleasure.
 
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Dear Sisters and Brothers of the Camino. I am a woman of a certain age. When I first walked my 100k pilgrimage, I was 50 pounds overweight.. OK maybe more, I had never hiked, never wore a backpacked, never thought I would make it. My goal was to arrive in Santiago, go to the Pilgrom Mass in gratitude and receive my certificate.

I met others on the trail and in subsequent conversations with people at home who dismiss my personal heroics. I didn't start in France types. I am not addressing you.

My comment is to those of you who might have seen me struggle, seen me fall, seen my black eye .. Which earned me my trail name.. Dah. I actually named myself "the Turtle." I am grateful for your kindness and you are in my daily prayers. You did not demand that I keep up with you. You walked with me for a few moments and wished me a buen Camino. You comforted me and encouraged me on the biggest challange of my life. It brings me tears of appreciation to remember you.

So you in this Brotherhood, coming up with an additional Kilometer requirement, see me, and others like me. Feel the joy within the least physical among us. Know that some people walked the Camino from much farther away than any one of you and,,,, and walked back. Keep this 100k marker in place. That's the vote I am sending out to the community.

If you wish, you can make gradations to the Camino. 1) Comino completed requirement - 100k. 2) stellar performer 300K. 3) Star of the Camino - 1,000k. And maybe add Grand Slam for those aspiring to walk, ride, all the routes in Spain, and oh yes, International Grand Slam for those starting in foreign countries. The Brotherhood could sell patches for accomplishments.

Yes, a bit of humor. Say Hi to me, still "The Turtle" in April 2016 for my third Camino. Blessings for a Christmas of joy, peace and light. Elin
 
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I have no first hand knowledge about this and have to rely on what others say, but on a thread within the last few years, my understanding of what the compostela signifies was corrected by someone in the know. I learned that it is a document that carries with it no indulgence, no atonement. As Sil puts it in this recent and interesting thread, it is not a "get out of jail free" card (sorry if that seems disrespectful, not intended to be), it is merely a blessing.

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/com...-significance-of-the-modern-credencial.37486/

That doesn't mean it isn't an important religious activity and that people don't feel strongly about getting the compostela. But since it seems to have devolved into a kind of bragging rights show for so many, maybe those who advocate getting rid of it altogether are on to something. Or giving it to everyone who wants one, that would also solve the problem of hoards doing the minimum or "cheating" to get it.
 
"To increase the devotional and sincere aspect of the accomplishment of a proper Camino, Compostelas should cease to be dispensed for free. Instead, and upon proper certification of completing a Camino, as specified by the relevant authorities, a Compostela may be obtained at a nominal fee, and solely at the Pilgrim Office in Santiago de Compostela. In lieu of a free Compostela, on request, any arriving Pilgrim with a properly completed pilgrim credencial, may receive a free stamp of the Cathedral and Archbishop that documents completion of the pilgrimage. Said stamp(s) will be affixed to the validated credencial"
I hope this doesn't come off as harsh, because it's not intended that way. I just don't get it.

I don't see how anything gets solved with this, nor do I really see a change here other than charging for a nicer version of what a pilgrim already receives. I already can't get a Compostela anywhere but the pilgrim's office. I already get Cathedral stamps on my credencial (I ended up sello collecting, and so had two full credencials, plus an extension, and all were stamped). I would pay for a hand-written version of the credencial on parchment or vellum, assuming the price wasn't outrageous. But, if the funding was only for the service itself, then it's irrelevant to whether or not the free, preprinted version is also available for those who don't want to purchase a nicer version.

The issue of "why" a pilgrim/tourist walks is not verifiable, except on the attestation of the pilgrim/tourist him/herself. The decision to buy a cool memento (or a revered testament) to their journey is motivated by the inner disposition of the pilgrim/tourist, and there's no test for that either.
 
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All I can say is I thank God that we walked when we did and already knew that this year's Camino was to be our last. The increasing comments and attitudes to distance, worthiness and compostelas - so different in so few years.
I shall continue to treasure memories of my 3 Caminos, all walked for different but spiritual reasons, and the arrivals in Santiago together with the Pilgrims' Masses and the English Mass. Next year we will visit Spain and take our car to some places we were unable to walk to along the camino, as the diversions would have exceeded my daily walking limit, but not Santiago again.
 
Reported in el Correo Gallego on Tuesday 15th December:

"The International Brotherhood of the Camino wants pilgrims to walk for 300 km to get their Compostela, instead of the stipulated 100 km. For those who choose the bicycle or horse, the distance should increase to 500 km from the current 200 km. According to the organization, it said in a statement this request is based on historical reasons. 300 km separates Oviedo from Santiago, the first pilgrimage route used by King Alfonso II and his court, now called the Primitive Route. Also the new length responds to the distance on the French Way, when the kingdom's capital is transferred to Leon."

This is a very interesting proposal. What do we all think about it?

Mike
Completely agree. With so many people just having luggage carried and sometimes just walking the last few hundred yards to get a stamp after getting out of a bus or car it devalues the Compostela.
 
I know this will be an unpopular opinion, but perhaps just stop issuing a Compostella. It's supposed to be for religious (Catholic) reasons, but God does not need it to know who was 'a true pilgrim.' Change the wording of the indulgence requirement to milage considered appropriate to one's health/condition after discussion with your Parrish priest. Eliminate the 100 km dash for a 'souvenir'--if people want bragging rights they can show people their credential.
 
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Change the wording of the indulgence requirement to milage considered appropriate to one's health/condition after discussion with your Parrish priest.
The Compostela and 100km requirement to receive it have nothing to do with the indulgence. A Catholic can fly into Santiago in a Holy Year, attend Mass at the Cathedral and receive Communion, make a good confession, and pray for the intentions of the Pope to receive the indulgence. Walking is not a requirement.
 
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And, at risk of potentially violating the rules of the forum and inciting a Catholic/non-Catholic debate on the merits/ills of indulgences, I would add that the Church also grants indulgences for many other acts that can be performed in the process of a pilgrimage (or a visit to the Cathedral without having made a pilgrimage), even when it is not a Holy Year. For instance, devoutly praying the Rosary or spending a half hour reading and meditating on Scripture, provided they are accompanied by reception of Communion at Mass, sacramental Confession, and prayer for the intentions of the pope.
 
I hope this doesn't come off as harsh, because it's not intended that way. I just don't get it.

I don't see how anything gets solved with this, nor do I really see a change here other than charging for a nicer version of what a pilgrim already receives. I already can't get a Compostela anywhere but the pilgrim's office. I already get Cathedral stamps on my credencial (I ended up sello collecting, and so had two full credencials, plus an extension, and all were stamped). I would pay for a hand-written version of the credencial on parchment or vellum, assuming the price wasn't outrageous. But, if the funding was only for the service itself, then it's irrelevant to whether or not the free, preprinted version is also available for those who don't want to purchase a nicer version.

The issue of "why" a pilgrim/tourist walks is not verifiable, except on the attestation of the pilgrim/tourist him/herself. The decision to buy a cool memento (or a revered testament) to their journey is motivated by the inner disposition of the pilgrim/tourist, and there's no test for that either.

The "inner disposition" you mention is exactly my point. By stopping the doling out of free Compostelas to everyone who shows up asking for one, but keeping them available, and arguably in a nicer format, for people willing to pay the cost of producing the finer document, so be it.

One of the major drivers for long lines, wait times, and "customer"dissatisfaction over the past several years is that, as each year goes by, more and more "stuff" is sold in the Pilgrim Office, directly alongside the process for issuing Compostelas. When they added the certificate of distance in 2014, it instantly became wildly popular, especially with the bike crowd. People wanted the form showing the mileage / kilometers they covered. It quickly became known colloquially as the "bragging rights" document.

However, and logically, this meant that if 100 people were in the queue, and all now asked for TWO hand-written documents instead of the single Compostela, it took twice as much time to process the requests. Staffing is finite, as is the physical space for interviews. In the end, people would have to wait wait at least twice as long. Lines in 2013 that were one-hour long, were now two-hours or longer.

So, if I am a single walking pilgrim at the end of this line, who only wants the Compostela, I have to wait twice as long to get to the front of the line. The nature of the process, at present compels me to wait behind the larger group who are on the Camino and in front of me, for what amounts to primarily secular reasons.

My thought is to carve out the issuing of Compostelas for the serious, sincere pilgrim, at a separate location. Everything else, mileage certificates, non-religious completion documents, and all retail purchases, including tubes, should be done elsewhere.

The purpose is to try to winnow out and reduce the masses of persons not in a sincere pilgrimage mindset, or who are on the Camino as a lark, holiday, physical fitness test, etc. The focus should, IMHO, be in accommodating the smaller population of pilgrims who are sincerely there for the historical and religious reasons for establishing the pilgrimage over 1200 years ago. We seem to have gotten far off the original track over the decades.

By imposing a nominal fee for the document, I believe we will winnow out the folks seeking the free Compostela primarily for "bragging rights" or a nice piece of paper to take home. This document would continue to be available on request. However, it is my experience and belief that the number of requests for Compostelas will decrease as the price is imposed and the physical location is changed so the marketplace and Compostela issuance are physically separate.

This has no effect on the overall number of pilgrims doing a Camino. All it does is restrict the issuance of this formal document to those who comply strictly with the requirements, and who are willing to pay a few Euros for the new, improved version. Anyone wanting a lesser document can obtain one at the tienda I am suggesting.

Of course, the Camino is open to all, regardless of their motivation. That should not change. In this vein, I think increasing the mileage required will not work, some people will simply cheat.

However, I favor restricting formal documentation to the smaller tranche of persons who actually understand what it is all about. This is also why I favor moving everything but issuance of the Compostela to a separate location on the new grounds. The new facility has plenty of space to do this if they had the will.

And before anyone says that I am being an elitist, let me explain that is not the case. By continuing to issue free Compostelas to all comers, many being obtained under sketchy qualifications, we only discount the higher meaning of pilgrimage, and dilute the Church's preeminent role in documenting the Camino pilgrimages. I seek only to restore the sanctity and solemnity of the Compostela to the place it needs to have.

Of course, the Church will do what is will do. In the end, I believe, accept and follow. But here, I can provide suggestion, recommendations and opinions. Hopefully, this helps the process.
 
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It's rather amusing to read all these posts. First, to understand indulgences, pardons for sins, etc., you either have to do some research on the Catholic faith, or know someone who is Catholic and can explain it. No the Compostela is not in an of itself an indulgence. But you can walk the Camino, fulfill the Catholic Churches requirements, be given the Compostela and use the Compostela as proof of completing the Camino, in an attempt to earn an indulgence. Just as you can earn a plenary or partial indulgence doing good works, paying alms, visiting a church. None of which makes a particle of difference to a person who is not Catholic. Unless your church at home has decided to accept the Compostela as proof of penance for walking off with last months Sunday offering, (just kidding).
My original point was that this is a Catholic document which has to do with their faith and the Catholic Church will make the decision as to what they will require to get a Compostela. If the Church decides to change the mileage it will be for their own spiritual purposes and reasons. The International Brotherhood has their reasons for requesting a change, and the Church will make up it's mind with regard to what followers of their faith will be required to accept. As a non-Catholic, it's none of my business how they want to determine eligibility for receiving that document. My only recourse is to decide whether or not I want it and am I willing to fulfill their requirements for receiving it. Frankly, they could simply decide that you may not have the historical Compostela at all unless you are a practicing Catholic, all others will receive a certificate to indicate that they have walked an historical religious trail, "atta boy".
 
:)
Or what about bronze (Sarria), silver (Leon) and gold (SJPdP/Roncesvalles) compostelas?

The modern credencial and the modern compostela are strange documents (see a recent thread about how they came into existence and got connected to each other): the credencial is a card of the kind you need to stay in a youth hostel or alpine hut on the one hand and on the other hand a piece of paper that needs to be stamped in under specific conditions to get another piece of paper named compostela with a purpose that is not quite clear. All that is certain is that a compostela is not needed for obtaining an indulgence.

The text of the modern compostela confirms only that you have "visited devoutly this Sacred Church in a religious sense (pietatis causa)" - the French translation renders pietatis causa more correctly as "sentiment chrétien" (=Christian sense).

The compostela does not say a word about walking, let alone from where and how long or under which conditions!
Love the idea of Bronze Silver and Gold. I'm smiling. Elin
 
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Last June I took a group to Santiago, along the Frances by coach. In the group were a couple for whom it was a real struggle - he was 86 and had had a major stroke, she was 85 with terminal cancer. I asked at the pilgrim office if there was any way their pilgrimage could be recognised and was told no. The trouble is that what is a major achievement for some may be easy for others - but in the end each pilgrim knows whether they have really made a pilgrimage and the piece of paper doesn't really matter very much.

I agree with this.

I tend to think "give it to everybody or give it to nobody."
 
This has been a fascinating debate.

I am looking forward to walking the Camino in 2016 especially since it is the Jubilee of Mercy. Pilgrimage, for this year, has been cited as a particularly spiritually beneficial undertaking. The cathedral at Santiago de Compostela will have its Holy Door open when I arrive. Walking mindfully and prayerfully through this door has its own Indulgences if the usual requirements are fulfilled; Confession, Eucharist and prayers of Intention for Pope Francis.

Obviously I will be doing this for religious reasons. My Credencial will be a memorare for the whole journey from starting point to the finish. I won't begrudge anyone for doing the minimum requirements (ie the 100km debate) because it is none of my business what people do in regards to what is permitted. When I get to Santiago I won't mind waiting a few hours in line at the pilgrim office to get my Compostela, that will be part of the whole experience. I may not be interested in the souvenirs for sale in the pilgrim's office but I can always give a donation toward the running costs.

I don't see any real need for reform. Isn't the odd hardship, discomfort and annoyance part of the pilgrimage experience?
 
By stopping the doling out of free Compostelas to everyone who shows up asking for one, but keeping them available, and arguably in a nicer format, for people willing to pay the cost of producing the finer document, so be it.

...

And before anyone says that I am being an elitist, let me explain that is not the case. By continuing to issue free Compostelas to all comers, many being obtained under sketchy qualifications, we only discount the higher meaning of pilgrimage, and dilute the Church's preeminent role in documenting the Camino pilgrimages. I seek only to restore the sanctity and solemnity of the Compostela to the place it needs to have.

Of course, the Church will do what is will do. In the end, I believe, accept and follow. But here, I can provide suggestion, recommendations and opinions. Hopefully, this helps the process.

You may not realise that what you're asking for would be for the Church to resume selling indulgences, which (quite apart from being Simony) was a major contributor to the Protestant schism in the 16th Century, and has been since utterly condemned and completely forbidden.

So I wouldn't get your hopes up if I were you ...
 
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Speaking of which, in the context of the current Year of Mercy, which puts an emphasis on inclusiveness, there is mention of a "breve peregrinación". How short is a short pilgrimage?

Well, the traditional short pilgrimage to St Peter's via the other Basilicas is just a few KM long, but it's a recommendation, not a requirement.

Many cathedrals and basilicas etc have established a walking circuit for such purposes, often organised by Stations of the Cross ; the Cathedral in Santiago simply has a very much longer one than most :p
 
Dear Sisters and Brothers of the Camino. I am a woman of a certain age. When I first walked my 100k pilgrimage, I was 50 pounds overweight.. OK maybe more, I had never hiked, never wore a backpacked, never thought I would make it. My goal was to arrive in Santiago, go to the Pilgrom Mass in gratitude and receive my certificate.

I met others on the trail and in subsequent conversations with people at home who dismiss my personal heroics. I didn't start in France types. I am not addressing you.

My comment is to those of you who might have seen me struggle, seen me fall, seen my black eye .. Which earned me my trail name.. Dah. I actually named myself "the Turtle." I am grateful for your kindness and you are in my daily prayers. You did not demand that I keep up with you. You walked with me for a few moments and wished me a buen Camino. You comforted me and encouraged me on the biggest challange of my life. It brings me tears of appreciation to remember you.

So you in this Brotherhood, coming up with an additional Kilometer requirement, see me, and others like me. Feel the joy within the least physical among us. Know that some people walked the Camino from much farther away than any one of you and,,,, and walked back. Keep this 100k marker in place. That's the vote I am sending out to the community.

If you wish, you can make gradations to the Camino. 1) Comino completed requirement - 100k. 2) stellar performer 300K. 3) Star of the Camino - 1,000k. And maybe add Grand Slam for those aspiring to walk, ride, all the routes in Spain, and oh yes, International Grand Slam for those starting in foreign countries. The Brotherhood could sell patches for accomplishments.

Yes, a bit of humor. Say Hi to me, still "The Turtle" in April 2016 for my third Camino. Blessings for a Christmas of joy, peace and light. Elin
Hi Elin , wish you well for the future and a happy Christmas, Peter.
 
You may not realise that what you're asking for would be for the Church to resume selling indulgences, which (quite apart from being Simony) was a major contributor to the Protestant schism in the 16th Century, and has been since utterly condemned and completely forbidden.

So I wouldn't get your hopes up if I were you ...

You make an excellent point, and one that I completely forgot. Thank you for reminding me. Actually, I think Martin Luther had some good ideas. Unfortunately, he was up against a well established and very powerful organization, the Roman Catholic Church.

I am a "cradle Catholic" born into my faith. However, I am not brain-dead, and have long studied other Christian sects that cleaved off following the initial Protestant Reformation. This issue of selling indulgences was a very bad idea in it's day, and the notion of charging for a Compostela needs to be managed carefully to avoid the unfortunate historical connection, even if there is none in contemporary practice. Still, it is a lesson to be aware of as we move forward on this issue.

I submit that the protection against going down that road, even conceptually, is to write a formal policy that clearly states that the fee for issuing the Compostela shall forever be limited to the actual cost of issuing the document; including administrative costs and calligraphy.

Thanks again for jarring my memory...
 
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someone just posted a photo of a "Compostela" from 1976, earned by a pilgrim from Toledo.
It's a piece of gridded notebook paper with a date-stamp and hand-scrawled by a cathedral canon "This pilgrim arrived at the cathedral of Santiago day/month/year." It's got a cathedral sacristy stamp. And that's it.
No credential, no mileage, no Latin. I think it's great.
 
someone just posted a photo of a "Compostela" from 1976, earned by a pilgrim from Toledo.
It's a piece of gridded notebook paper with a date-stamp and hand-scrawled by a cathedral canon "This pilgrim arrived at the cathedral of Santiago day/month/year." It's got a cathedral sacristy stamp. And that's it.
No credential, no mileage, no Latin. I think it's great.
 
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The comments on this posting to date have all been thoughtful. I can see the merits of so many of the views expressed. BUT, if allowed to put in my two pence worth it would be on a related matter.

While the Compostela provides evidence to take home of having completed the required distance, many of those arriving in Santiago also seek photographic evidence to take back. Would it be possible for all pilgrims - no matter their starting place, no matter whether Catholic, Jew, Muslim or person of no faith - to remember that Santiago Cathedral is a holy place and to behave accordingly. Sightseeing in the Cathedral can be accommodated outside of the religious services, but on my arrival inside the building, I was both shocked and saddened to observe people behaving like frenzied tourists during the Mass, jostling for the best views and using cameras with flash despite notices saying this was forbidden. You don't have to be a Catholic - I am an Anglican by the way - to know that respecting the sanctity of the Cathedral (or any faith's place of worship) is an implicit requirement of any visitor. Whatever the decision made about the minimum distance walked to earn a Compostela, might it be a good idea for staff in the Pilgrim's office to make known to all those collecting their piece of paper, and intending to attend the Pilgrims' Mass, that, as it is a religious service, there are certain codes of conduct and simple courtesies expected, even from non-believers.
 
Compostelas are for long distance pilgrims only, perferably for long distance pilgrims on foot.

Only because the 100/200 KM rule was introduced as a counter-measure against a large number of abuses.

It's still technically a Church legal document, and it could be used by someone under some canonical penalty as documentary evidence that he or she has accomplished a penitence, and received the benefit of any associated indulgence on such and such date.

Still -- this is starting to get a bit more seriously OT, and I've made my counter-point insofar as it's relevant to monetising the document.
 
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By removing many from the CF who may not have a compostela high on their bucket list it will make more space for those for whom the sacrifice to get to Santiago is important. Ad it's not as if there are huge numbers of people on the other routes anyway. 5% walk the Norte, less than 1% the Primitivo, something along those lines?

To me, walking the camino - any of them - is not a sacrifice, quite the opposite; it's a sheer joy, even when my blisters are killing me and I'm soaked to the bone.

Anyway, as for the compostela, I totally agree with those who've said it's just a piece of paper. Rules, rules - the beauty of the caminos is exactly the opposite, it's the freedom of just walking that is so special. The bureaucrats who would try to have it otherwise are kidding themselves if they think they can take that away from us.
 
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Reported in el Correo Gallego on Tuesday 15th December:

"The International Brotherhood of the Camino wants pilgrims to walk for 300 km to get their Compostela, instead of the stipulated 100 km. For those who choose the bicycle or horse, the distance should increase to 500 km from the current 200 km. According to the organization, it said in a statement this request is based on historical reasons. 300 km separates Oviedo from Santiago, the first pilgrimage route used by King Alfonso II and his court, now called the Primitive Route. Also the new length responds to the distance on the French Way, when the kingdom's capital is transferred to Leon."

This is a very interesting proposal. What do we all think about it?

Mike
A very reasonable alteration, there are far to many people rushing the 100k and not only spooling it for others but not giving themselves the time to really settle into the reflection of Pilgrimage. After all this is still a Christian Pilgrimage. I would also add that it should be attempted in one go
 
It's still technically a Church legal document, and it could be used by someone under some canonical penalty as documentary evidence that he or she has accomplished a penitence, and received the benefit of any associated indulgence on such and such date.
My simple understanding is that when it comes to actually 'claiming' an indulgence, not only are you unlikely to be holding the piece of paper, but the entity making any enquiry might already know whether such a claim is sustainable!
 
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My simple understanding is that when it comes to actually 'claiming' an indulgence, not only are you unlikely to be holding the piece of paper, but the entity making any enquiry might already know whether such a claim is sustainable!

Yup, a bit difficult to take a piece of paper with you then ;-) SY
 
A very reasonable alteration, there are far to many people rushing the 100k and not only spooling it for others but not giving themselves the time to really settle into the reflection of Pilgrimage.

Rather than a requirement for a minimum distance what about a minimum time spent on the pilgrimage?

Super fit pilgrims could cover 100km in under 3 days which does not leave time for much contemplation. A minimum time period (say 5 nights) would also remove the distance barrier for those less able to walk such a long way.
 
Rather than a requirement for a minimum distance what about a minimum time spent on the pilgrimage?

Super fit pilgrims could cover 100km in under 3 days which does not leave time for much contemplation. A minimum time period (say 5 nights) would also remove the distance barrier for those less able to walk such a long way.
Good point, my understanding was that if you needed a rest day you stopped for a while until you could continue. My experience of the Frances from Saria was hetic rush. The same on the Portuguse.
 
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On my last arrival in Santiago with my friend Robyn (described by us both as our "Disney tour of the Camino") we did not ask for a Compistela but simply a stamp from the Cathedral in our credentiale. A Compostela would have been absurd. What we have instead is a very satisfying and much more meaningful document. Credentiales are a fabulous record, and each one is unique. I value them far more than a mass produced "paper to order".
 
On my last arrival in Santiago with my friend Robyn (described by us both as our "Disney tour of the Camino") we did not ask for a Compistela but simply a stamp from the Cathedral in our credentiale. A Compostela would have been absurd. What we have instead is a very satisfying and much more meaningful document. Credentiales are a fabulous record, and each one is unique. I value them far more than a mass produced "paper to order".
Spot on ... when people ask me what it was like I get down my Credential and tell stories around the stamps, every stamp is a memory of people and places . My compestlas are shoved Away in drawers somewhere
 
Reported in el Correo Gallego on Tuesday 15th December:

"The International Brotherhood of the Camino wants pilgrims to walk for 300 km to get their Compostela, instead of the stipulated 100 km. For those who choose the bicycle or horse, the distance should increase to 500 km from the current 200 km. According to the organization, it said in a statement this request is based on historical reasons. 300 km separates Oviedo from Santiago, the first pilgrimage route used by King Alfonso II and his court, now called the Primitive Route. Also the new length responds to the distance on the French Way, when the kingdom's capital is transferred to Leon."

This is a very interesting proposal. What do we all think about it?

Mike
I am walking the Ingles in a week in Lent. I would never be able to afford to take enough time from work to walk 300km, but also that distance would have dissuaded me from making the pilgrimage. It's far too daunting for me. Experienced walkers may think this is manageable but for me I would have not even considered the pilgrimage
 
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I am walking the Ingles in a week in Lent. I would never be able to afford to take enough time from work to walk 300km, but also that distance would have dissuaded me from making the pilgrimage. It's far too daunting for me. Experienced walkers may think this is manageable but for me I would have not even considered the pilgrimage
Buen Camino Anna.
 
I think the 300 kilometers for the Compostela will be a good decision , people that can walk won't have any problems and it can be done in one , two or three times.
The other thing is that people that are not in good shape for walking should get their Compostela when they walked 100 kilometers!
That's my opinion am I could be wrong, but walking from Sarria to Santiago is a fair , is to crowded because everyone wants to get their Compostela after walking the last 100 kilometers.
Buen Camino
Some of us may have saved for a long while to do their pilgrimage and won't be able to do it again so may not be able to "return" two or three times. Whilst I hesitate to say it... has nothing changed? Can only the rich afford to be "godly"?
 
I am a member of the International Brotherhood (Fraternidad Internacional del Camino de Santiago.) I am working on an English translation of the document cited in the newspapers, but it will be a while in coming -- I start on the Way tomorrow.

The 300-km. document was written by an historian and a sociologist. It quotes Carlos II because those people who think history has no bearing on the present are doomed to repeat it; and those (of us) who appreciate history like to draw these parallels -- the 300 km radius cities (Zamora, Coimbra, Aviles, Oviedo, Leon) have had much to do with the history of Spanish piety and are still active parts of the modern camino.

The 100 km rule dates back to 1999. It was meant as a temporary measure to deal with an overwhelming Holy Year boom, but was set in concrete somehow. The unintended consequence was the commercialization and overcrowding along the final 100 kilometers into Santiago, and a strange mania for a fancy bit of paper. Latest numbers say 60% of pilgrims who get Compostelas walked only the last 100 kilometers of the path. IMHO, this seems to defeat the whole purpose of a long-distance pilgrimage.

The Camino de Santiago has always been seen, at least in Spain and Portugal, as an extraordinary, marathon long-distance journey for the devout and the fit, not a short-term "romeria" walk for everyone. Pilgrims who hike across continents should not be awarded the same as people who've done the four-day, four-star "Camino Quickee Tour." The cathedral seems to have abandoned its initial hope to keep the Compostela a "precious document of holy vows completed," and has simply gone into the souvenir business at worst, and traffic-policing at best.

As for who are the Brotherhood: We all are volunteers. We accept no funding from government programs or corporations or commercial interests. We paint waymarks, write guides, clean up caminos, staff albergues. Other initiatives include riding herd on redevelopment in downtown Sarria (so another Roman bridge is not demolished); overseeing enforcement of UNESCO heritage route disignations and Camino sites; and now lobbying local government agencies to improve pilgrim safety at 14 "black spots" along the paths, where pilgrims and traffic are not mixing well.
We are not doing this because we'll make money. We're doing this because we want to keep the camino spirit alive -- with or without souvenir scallop-shell socks, cool apps, mileage certificates, or even cathedrals.

We don't expect a lot of response from the Cathedral on this, but it's important that we keep this issue out there. Miracles are known to happen around here, you know.
I'm really sorry if I'm one of the "four day quickies".. for some people 100k ms IS a long way.
 
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I'm really sorry if I'm one of the "four day quickies".. for some people 100k ms IS a long way.
Anna. I can't comment on the time you have available for your Camino but will say that the last 100k are not nearly as rewarding, in my view it is because of the coach loads of pilgrims dropped off each day to walk a section. As for your ability to walk, I think everyone is slightly overawed by the idea of walking such a long way. You meet and make wonderful friends and settle down into a pace which suits everyone. Someone commented it's only for the rich, I'm not rich and walked for 65 days, it worked out at less than €30 a day.
 
I walked the Inglés as my first Camino, without that I doubt if I would have walked the Primitivo or any other longer route. As I said on the similar thread last year I hope that this does not happen as it will prevent those less able, but who do want to walk, from making their pilgrimage. To me it sounds like money talking and hopefully the Cathedral authorities will ignore it, and they make the rules.
The Ingles was my first as well. I walked it as a tester before my intended Frances. It was so much more than that and was in itself a life changer. As time passes and I see and feel the pains and tribulations of others less fortunate than I, all I can do is hope that their opportunities are not diminished by any changes.
 
I'm really sorry if I'm one of the "four day quickies".. for some people 100k ms IS a long way.
Anna, I think that you may be over estimating what it takes to walk 100km. The average age on the Camino has got to be well into the 50s, and the vast majority are people who are walking it are sedentary and have never done so ething like this before. With a good pair of shoes and as little as you can manage to carry this will not be difficult. The expense especially if you are coming from outside of Europe is no doubt an issue, but not the distance unless you face somesort of handicap. Don't worry so much about it.
 
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Anna. I can't comment on the time you have available for your Camino but will say that the last 100k are not nearly as rewarding, in my view it is because of the coach loads of pilgrims dropped off each day to walk a section. As for your ability to walk, I think everyone is slightly overawed by the idea of walking such a long way. You meet and make wonderful friends and settle down into a pace which suits everyone. Someone commented it's only for the rich, I'm not rich and walked for 65 days, it worked out at less than €30 a day.
I would agree with this if Anna was talking about walking from Saria but I doubt very much she will see many tour buses on the Ingles. A good choice to walk for that reason.
 

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