Collapsible Trekking Poles as Carry-On?

[Lindsay Johnston]

Hi,

I'll be walking from Leon to Santiago in July. To get to Leon, I will be flying domestically from Barcelona -- I'd like to bring my hiking pack as my carry-on -- does anyone know if I can bring collapsible trekking poles in my carry-on bag on domestic flights in Spain?

Thanks!

 

[peregrina2000]

Hi, Lindsay,

Welcome to the forum.

There is not a lot of good consistent information on this. @Kathar1na has written to ask that question of the airport staff in Madrid and received an answer that basically consists of "maybe".

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/com...g-my-backpack-on-the-plane.40048/#post-404058

I can tell you that I have carried on collapsible poles through security in Madrid, on at least three occasions en route to a domestic flight to Barcelona, Bilbao, Valencia, but I don't know if there is a new policy. So I would be prepared to check them if necessary. I do know with certainty that you will not be allowed to carry them on on your way home if you fly from Santiago. Buen camino, Laurie

 

[whariwharangi]

Aena manages all airports in Spain. Trekking poles are not allowed as hand luggage in Spain.
http://www.aena.es/csee/Satellite/aeropuertos/en/Page/1048753077970//Hand-luggage.html

 

[Kathar1na]

Aena manages all airports in Spain. Trekking poles are not allowed as hand luggage in Spain.
http://www.aena.es/csee/Satellite/aeropuertos/en/Page/1048753077970//Hand-luggage.html

The website refers to EU law. The two pdf files are dated January 2010 and January 2014. The website text with its long list is not dated but I daresay that it is not the newest of the new. So just one minor remark, actually a quote from the European Commission's website on aviation security: In 2016 the whole set of previous implementing legislation [on aviation security] was updated.

There have been more updates prior to 2016. I am pretty certain that this is the reason why there is this constant conflict between what people quote from websites and what people report about their own experience at airports.

While looking through EurLex (database of EU law), I was amused to see that the English version of previous legal provisions on aviation security uses the word "alpenstock".

@Lindsay Johnston I second the advice already given: be prepared to check them if necessary.

 

[whariwharangi]

The website refers to EU law. The two pdf files are dated January 2010 and January 2014. The website text with its long list is not dated but I daresay that it is not the newest of the new. So just one minor remark, actually a quote from the European Commission's website on aviation security: In 2016 the whole set of previous implementing legislation [on aviation security] was updated.

There have been more updates prior to 2016. I am pretty certain that this is the reason why there is this constant conflict between what people quote from websites and what people report about their own experience at airports.

While looking through EurLex (database of EU law), I was amused to see that the English version of previous legal provisions on aviation security uses the word "alpenstock".

@Lindsay Johnston I second the advice already given: be prepared to check them if necessary.

Aena manages all of Spains Airports ... the list on their website is quite likely to be the one they are using in the security sections in the airports Aena is managing.

 

[Ahhhs]

I had no problem with my trekking pole in my pack as carry on luggage from Madrid to Pamplona or from Madrid to Porto.

They do NOT allow them as carry on for flights OUT of Santiago. But you can check the pole(s) separately for no charge if you want to carry on your pack.

 

[whariwharangi]

I had no problem with my trekking pole in my pack as carry on luggage from Madrid to Pamplona or from Madrid to Porto.

They do NOT allow them as carry on for flights OUT of Santiago. But you can check the pole(s) separately for no charge if you want to carry on your pack.

I would suggest that anecdotal stories about how-you-got-away-with-it are not helpful.

 

[Kathar1na]

Aena manages all of Spains Airports ... the list on their website is quite likely to be the one they are using in the security sections in the airports Aena is managing.

I'm merely offering a potential explanation to puzzled readers of this forum.

You have repeatedly, and very recently, stated that a prohibition of taking walking poles into the cabin is EU law and everyone who does not follow this is breaking (European) law. It isn't and they aren't. The "ski and walking/hiking poles" item disappeared from the EU list of prohibited items in cabin baggage sometime after 2008. It's cumbersome to search for the amending act in question and I'm reluctant to waste more time on this.

In addition, as I said before, every EU country is in principle allowed to have more stringent rules, and the same goes for every airport and every airline. As to Spain, the only thing that seems to be certain is that walking poles are not allowed into the cabin at Santiago airport. I wonder whether that's more a safety issue than a security issue.

 

[Ahhhs]

I would suggest that anecdotal stories about how-you-got-away-with-it are not helpful.

I wasn't trying to "get away with" anything. Backpacks are always screened carefully. Of the many airports that screened my pack, only Santiago seemed to have a rule about trekking poles, perhaps because of the large volume of them from coming from the Camino(s). Of course there may be others. The OP asked about experiences in Spain and I shared mine.

 

[whariwharangi]

I wasn't trying to "get away with" anything. Backpacks are always screened carefully. Of the many airports that screened my pack, only Santiago seemed to have a rule about trekking poles, perhaps because of the large volume of them from coming from the Camino(s). Of course there may be others. The OP asked about experiences in Spain and I shared mine.

This is where the problem lies .... my interpretation of the OPs question is whether trekking poles are allowed through baggage claim. I don't think the question was about personal experiences.

I'll reiterate trekking poles are not allowed ... regardless of whether or not security is lax in enforcing the rules.

 

[Kathar1na]

If you fly from Madrid (Madrid Barajas International Airport), you may also want to consult the airport's website directly: http://www.aeropuertomadrid-barajas.com/eng/home.html

Under The Airport/Restrictions hand luggage/Objects prohibited in hand luggage you will NOT find a list that contains trekking poles. You will find this: There is no a specify [sic] or definitive list of dangerous objects due of its ambiguity (rods, tripods, sports accessories ...). The final decision rests with the security staff. If you have doubts about some object, please access the security control with enough time in advance.

 

[Kathar1na]

You will find this: There is no a specify [sic] or definitive list of dangerous objects due of its ambiguity (rods, tripods, sports accessories ...). The final decision rests with the security staff. If you have doubts about some object, please access the security control with enough time in advance.

In Spanish it reads as follows: No hay una lista concreta o definitiva de objetos peligrosos debido a su ambiguedad (bastones, trípodes, accesorios deportivos, etc.); la decisión final queda en manos del personal de seguridad).

My Spanish is quite poor but I understand this to mean that bastones in particular have this ambiguity about them. As if we didn't know ... .

The website of Barcelona-El Prat to which the OP's question refers has exactly the same text for hand luggage.

 

[whariwharangi]

If you fly from Madrid (Madrid Barajas International Airport), you may also want to consult the airport's website directly: http://www.aeropuertomadrid-barajas.com/eng/home.html

Under The Airport/Restrictions hand luggage/Objects prohibited in hand luggage you will NOT find a list that contains trekking poles. You will find this: There is no a specify [sic] or definitive list of dangerous objects due of its ambiguity (rods, tripods, sports accessories ...). The final decision rests with the security staff. If you have doubts about some object, please access the security control with enough time in advance.

The same list I posted earlier in this thread does appear. Your quote is correct; there is no definitive list ... which only means the staff can take away stuff that is not on the list.

Here is the list on your website ... see 'bastones de esquí y excursionismo'
http://www.aeropuertosenred.com/objetos-prohibidos.htm

 

[whariwharangi]

If I were the czar of the forum, which I am not, I would decree that there could be no more discussion of hiking poles as carry ons. I know there are a lot of passionate opinions and beliefs on this topic but I don't think it's fair to characterize one side as the "how you got away with it" side of the debate. There are many pilgrims who have carried on their hiking poles, not trying to get away with anything, and there are some who have been told that they cannot carry them on.

How about a truce for the US debate?
Can we agree that:
1. Many US pilgrims have successfully and with the full knowledge of TSA carried hiking poles on the plane.

2. Some forum members have strong feelings that hiking poles should be banned in the cabin.

3. One US pilgrim forum member has friends whose poles were not allowed through TSA.

Its not about strong feelings. The information being provided by TSA and EU regulations regarding hand luggage are clearly indicating trekking poles are not allowed. I don't get it how people are being allowed through with trekking poles in their luggage.

I don't think we should be giving information that is contrary to published regulations even if there are anecdotal stories of getting through security with the poles.

 

[Kathar1na]

Its not about strong feelings. The information being provided by TSA and EU regulations regarding hand luggage are clearly indicating trekking poles are not allowed. I don't get it how people are being allowed through with trekking poles in their luggage.

I've kept out of the discussions about TSA regulations and US airports, so no comments from my side about this.

As to the EU side: you don't get it how people are being allowed through with trekking poles in their luggage because you have not bothered to read what I have posted repeatedly about current EU law on aviation security concerning hand luggage. I'm not a national expert for aviation security but I do know a thing or two about how to properly research what's currently in force. I don't have the same strong feelings about trekking poles or pocket knifes that some posters express. I merely tried to understand and explain the actual legal situation. I've told myself a dozen times that I will not wade into this discussion anymore. I hope I will manage from now on. It will be not be easy ... .

 

[Kathar1na]

published regulations

Current EU law - in particular implementing acts which are the subject of discussion - is published in the Official Journal of the European Union. The OJ is online. You will find in the OJ: current law, repealed law, amended law, consolidated versions. Enjoy .

 

[C clearly]

trekking poles

published regulations

Definitions, please!

 

[whariwharangi]

Definitions, please!

Regulations:
http://www.aena.es/csee/Satellite/aeropuertos/en/Page/1048753077970/

Definitions: look up 'walking sticks' and see the pictures.

I've been reading a lot for my entire life ... it bugs me when the words I am reading don't match the facts behind the authorities actions ... perhaps my understanding of the language is deficient ... maybe I should start with 'Dick and Jane' again.

 

[Kathar1na]

I've been reading a lot for my entire life ... it bugs me when the words I am reading don't match the facts behind the authorities actions ... perhaps my understanding of the language is deficient ... maybe I should start with 'Dick and Jane' again.

I recommend the following reading material:

Commission Implementing Regulation (EU) 2015/1998 of 5 November 2015
Commission Regulation (EU) No 185/2010 of 4 March 2010 [repealed]
Commission Regulation (EC) No 820/2008 of 8 August 2008 [repealed]

All three of them are laying down detailed measures for the implementation of the common basic standards on aviation security (Text with EEA relevance). 820/2008 is repealed by 185/2010, and 185/2010 is repealed by 2015/1998 which is currently in force. All of them have annexes with various lists.

In the 2008 regulation, "ski and walking/hiking poles" are included in the list of articles which are prohibited in cabin baggage. In the 2010 and 2015 regulations, these items have disappeared from this list. This does not mean that they are always and everywhere allowed. It means, at least in my humble view, that things are not as clear cut as you may think they are when you only read websites, and that people are not "getting away with it" and that airport security staff is not "lax in enforcing the rules" - what bugs others are claims to the contrary.

These comments refer to EU and EEA level, not to national level, not to the US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand etc.

 

[Vieja]

In Spanish it reads as follows: No hay una lista concreta o definitiva de objetos peligrosos debido a su ambiguedad (bastones, trípodes, accesorios deportivos, etc.); la decisión final queda en manos del personal de seguridad).

My Spanish is quite poor but I understand this to mean that bastones in particular have this ambiguity about them. As if we didn't know ... .

The website of Barcelona-El Prat to which the OP's question refers has exactly the same text for hand luggage.

the most important part in that is ... la decisión final queda en manos del personal de seguridad). ... the final decision is in the hands for security ... many on here have said to be prepared to check them and have them in a tube ... I think that is the best advice I have heard here ... best of luck and have a great camino ... un abrazo ...

 

[NancySpencerTracy]

After finishing the Camino, I just (2 days ago) flew from Madrid to Paris on Air France with my backpack as a carry on. My collapsed poles were inside my pack and TSA had no problem whatsoever with my carry on. I then flew from
Paris to the US with the same carry on. (My intent is not to start another treking pole debate, but just report my experience for those who are still worrying about their poles.)

 

[grayland]

There does not seem to be much more to gain in this thread.
Re-posting your understanding of the various confusing rules is simply more confusion.
I suggest you make your own decision.

Thread will be closed for now.