Albergue in Rates not friendly towards luggage transfer

[wildb1]

I watched the attendant at the Rates albergue tell a couple that it is the policy of all “official”
association albergue to not accept people who transfer luggage. This albergue does not accept luggage transfer at the albergue. They are delivered to a coffee shop instead.

The attendant did accept these people but only after a fairly long lecture. I have experienced less tolerance on this route from volunteer’s at albergue’s than I have on the French route.

Note: When I talked to these folks afterwards they said the reason they transfered there backpacks was because they had a 22 mile rough day getting out of Porto and wanted a day to recover.

 

[wildb1]

I watched the attendant at the Rates albergue tell a couple that it is the policy of all “official”
association albergue to not accept people who transfer luggage. This albergue does not accept luggage transfer at the albergue. They are delivered to a coffee shop instead.

The attendant did accept these people but only after a fairly long lecture. I have experienced less tolerance on this route from volunteer’s at albergue’s than I have on the French route.

Note: When I talked to these folks afterwards they said the reason they transfered there backpacks was because they had a 22 mile rough day getting out of Porto and wanted a day to recover.

I feel like I need to add the below:

Since this event I have pivoted to the French route and feel blessed for doing so. I believe the above was my unique Camino experience that encouraged me to act. I hope the above is just my unique experience, and not common.

 

[Anniesantiago]

It is not unusual for albergues not to accept transfered luggage or the people who transfer luggage. It's just within recent years that it has become more acceptable on the Frances route in almost all albergues, but there still are some, such as the one in Rabanal del Camino, who will not let you stay if you transfer your luggage. It is a pilgrimage and they expect a pilgrim to carry their pack, I guess.

 

[Felipe]

Actually, backpack carriers demand a delivery point -that is, an albergue that accepts reservations. And since neither municipal nor parish albergues do that...
I think it is a matter of different policies, not of tolerance.

 

[NualaOC]

There's a lot of pressure for albergue beds on the Camino Portugués at the moment. I know everyone has different views on this, but I'm inclined to think that those who carry their packs should have priority in the bed race. There are plenty of private options (including reasonably-priced hostels) for those wishing to use the bag carrying services.

I say this having witnessed the crowds on this route a few weeks ago, and the large numbers of low-budget pilgrims setting off at 5am to secure their place in the albergue queue. It would seem very unfair (to me) if someone with a day pack deprived them of their bed without a valid reason.

 

[dfunghi]

someone with a day pack deprived them of their bed without a valid reason.

Who determines what a "valid" reason would be? Does age qualify? What about medical devices too heavy to carry? Seems like a slippery slope when people start to decide who has a valid reason for something and who does not.

Let me qualify this by saying I have yet to walk a camino and have heard of the "race for a bed" aspect of it many times by folks that have walked it and many here that have written about it. Still, it is not for anyone else to say who and who is not a pilgrim and whatever reasons that walker has to make their pilgrimage or how.

 

[dfunghi]

Is this type of "sorting out" of who gets a bed and who does not also apply if I was walking all day and as it got too dark I took a bus the last 3 -5K? DO I need to stealthily depart bus a few blocks away and be sure no one sees me? I am deeply troubled by the notion that bed space or any other type of judgement call on my walk and the way in which I must complete it is in the hands of those who can so easily decide whether or not I "qualify".

 

[Bradypus]

I am deeply troubled by the notion that bed space or any other type of judgement call on my walk and the way in which I must complete it is in the hands of those who can so easily decide whether or not I "qualify

The majority of albergues do not refuse beds to those who have used luggage transfer services. A small number choose to accept only those who have walked without vehicle support - principally to support those who choose to walk all the way while carrying their gear. For the first couple of decades of the modern Camino revival that was the norm, there were no luggage services and skipping sections by taxi unless in case of genuine medical problems was generally regarded as an abuse of the hospitality offered to pilgrims. Some albergues like Refugio Gaucelmo in Rabanal aim to make it possible for those who still wish to walk in that way to find beds which might otherwise be taken by those whose decision to forward their gear by van allows them to walk faster and further. The traditionalist albergues argue that it is unfair that those who actively seek to minimise the effort they expend end up having a marked advantage when beds are scarce. Those willing to use motor transport can also more easily move on to alternative accommodation. Those for whom walking the whole route is integral to their pilgrimage find that far harder.

 

[KinkyOne]

In my experience what I actually saw on arrival/pick up points of transferred luggage (on different Caminos close to SdC or to Fisterra) the people with clearly visible medical/age reasons are maybe (!!!) just 1/3 of all of them. I'm no MD but you can see how the person lift the backpack and put it on the back maybe just for those few meters into the dormitory.
I don't really care how someone is doing her/his Camino but it happened to me also on Salvador that I was deprived of a bed in albergue because of a group that used luggage transfer. No big deal, just a bit more expensive night for me.
BUT I would say if you have 5€ to spend on luggage transfer each day then I guess you have 15-20€ more for at least private (!!!) albergue if not pension/hostal.

Don't want to deteriorate the discussion from certain albergue. Just my two cents worth.

Buen Camino/Bom Caminho/Ultreia! to all

 

[VNwalking]

There's a lot of pressure for albergue beds on the Camino Portugués at the moment. I know everyone has different views on this, but I'm inclined to think that those who carry their packs should have priority in the bed race. There are plenty of private options (including reasonably-priced hostels) for those wishing to use the bag carrying services.

I say this having witnessed the crowds on this route a few weeks ago, and the large numbers of low-budget pilgrims setting off at 5am to secure their place in the albergue queue. It would seem very unfair (to me) if someone with a day pack deprived them of their bed without a valid reason.

The traditionalist albergues argue that it is unfair that those who actively seek to minimise the effort they expend end up having a marked advantage when beds are scarce. Those willing to use motor transport can also more easily move on to alternative accommodation. Those for whom walking the whole route is integral to their pilgrimage find that far harder.

This kind of policy is an effective way of filtering out the organized tours who use albergues to house their clients. I'm all for it. Albergues were originally meant for those who cannot afford alternative accommodation - and if you can afford a tour with bus support, luggage transport, and multiple guides/drivers you can surely afford a hotel. In this case, the companies organizing these kinds of tours are basically being parasites of a system that was never meant to benefit them.
As far as idividual peregrinos are concerned, presumably the hospis have the discretion to welcome injured, indisposed, or late peregrinos.

 

[Bradypus]

As far as idividual peregrinos are concerned, presumably the hospis have the discretion to welcome injured, indisposed, or late peregrinos

The Refugio Gaucelmo's "no vehicle support" policy is very clear in making an exception for those with genuine injuries or illness. I think it fairly unlikely that any albergue will refuse point blank to accommodate a pilgrim in serious medical need who arrives by vehicle.

 

[peregrina2000]

I find it hard to come to a clear line in this debate, but one thing that I definitely think is unfair — people who have their packs transferred, for whatever reason, should not be able to get beds by having their transported pack used to save them a bed. This happened to Kinky when I was in the La Robla albergue. A taxi full of backpacks arrived, there were 12 or 13, and the keeper of the backpacks, who was a member of the group and taking a day in a taxi, “claimed” all the remaining beds for his group, putting sleeping bags, etc on all the beds. Kinky arrived way before the members of the group arrived, and he had to go to a pensión. And then I never saw him again on this camino, so maybe that adds to my negative assessment of those people.

 

[KinkyOne]

I find it hard to come to a clear line in this debate, but one thing that I definitely think is unfair — people who have their packs transferred, for whatever reason, should not be able to get beds by having their transported pack used to save them a bed. This happened to Kinky when I was in the La Robla albergue. A taxi full of backpacks arrived, there were 12 or 13, and the keeper of the backpacks, who was a member of the group and taking a day in a taxi, “claimed” all the remaining beds for his group, putting sleeping bags, etc on all the beds. Kinky arrived way before the members of the group arrived, and he had to go to a pensión. And then I never saw him again on this camino, so maybe that adds to my negative assessment of those people.

Ah, Laurie, that wasn't necessary to mention. I guess it affected you more than me but thanks anyway

But we did see each other that year once more. In Tertulia with Jerry

 

[Robo]

This kind of policy is an effective way of filtering out the organized tours who use albergues to house their clients.

If it is, I would fully support it.
But sadly any 'filtering' system might also filter out those who have legitimate reasons to use luggage transfer, age, health, injury or whatever.

 

[Robo]

I find it hard to come to a clear line in this debate, but one thing that I definitely think is unfair — people who have their packs transferred, for whatever reason, should not be able to get beds by having their transported pack used to save them a bed. This happened to Kinky when I was in the La Robla albergue. A taxi full of backpacks arrived, there were 12 or 13, and the keeper of the backpacks, who was a member of the group and taking a day in a taxi, “claimed” all the remaining beds for his group, putting sleeping bags, etc on all the beds. Kinky arrived way before the members of the group arrived, and he had to go to a pensión. And then I never saw him again on this camino, so maybe that adds to my negative assessment of those people.

That seems very unfair........... I would have acted in a very un-Pilgrim like manner I can tell you

 

[Bradypus]

A taxi full of backpacks arrived, there were 12 or 13, and the keeper of the backpacks, who was a member of the group and taking a day in a taxi, “claimed” all the remaining beds for his group, putting sleeping bags, etc on all the beds.

I am assuming from the way you tell the story that this group did not have reservations and the albergue worked on a "first come first served" basis. If so that is an appalling situation. I feel quite strongly that people should be required to check in individually and in person - no one should be allowed to race ahead and make a block booking for a group in an albergue which does not accept reservations.

 

[KinkyOne]

I am assuming from the way you tell the story that this group did not have reservations and the albergue worked on a "first come first served" basis. If so that is an appalling situation. I feel quite strongly that people should be required to check in individually and in person - no one should be allowed to race ahead and make a block booking for a group in an albergue which does not accept reservations.

Exactly. Doesn't matter if I was the "loser" in this situation but muni albergues don't/shouldn't operate on reservation basis.
I remember from 2011 on Frances that I was maybe 15 minutes ahead of my companion and walked into the muni albergue (doesn't matter where). Albergue wasn't even half full and I knew there is hardly anyone between me and my companion. Since I owed her few Euros I wanted to pay also for her stay with just one money transaction. No go! Where is peregrina, was the question. Nothing helped

 

[Anamya]

If it is, I would fully support it.
But sadly any 'filtering' system might also filter out those who have legitimate reasons to use luggage transfer, age, health, injury or whatever.

Any system will always fail someone at some point. But it is still better than no system.

 

[Bradypus]

But sadly any 'filtering' system might also filter out those who have legitimate reasons to use luggage transfer, age, health, injury or whatever.

I see the point you are making. When luggage transport services began to appear the argument was often that it would open up the Camino to those less able. Little to object to in that. The idea that it would rapidly become a labour-saving convenience for the fit but unwilling was little mentioned. Now it feels as if luggage transport has almost become the default position and those of us who decline to use it are an endangered species

For Camino dinosaurs like myself the proliferation of baggage transport services, specialist travel agencies offering readymade packages, booking.com and so on are all symptoms of the commercialisation and Disneyfication of the Camino and destroys the essential simplicity that pilgrimage on the Caminos used to have: pick up your pack, walk, find a bed, wash, eat, sleep, repeat until you reach the end! Where is the spontaneity if you have to choose your destination every morning and label your bag for pickup? Where is the room for serendipity? The satisfaction of self-reliance? The trust that it will probably work out ok - and the willingness to deal with things falling apart when it doesn't without whingeing about it? ;-)

 

[Robo]

Quite agree @Bradypus. Hence my desire to move on from the CF and walk other more remote Caminos; that don't have baggage services

 

[VNwalking]

But sadly any 'filtering' system might also filter out those who have legitimate reasons to use luggage transfer, age, health, injury or whatever.

Maybe but not necessarily. This is where discernment on the part of the hospi comes in. And it's pretty obvious when a group is involved, like the one @KinkyOne and @peregrina2000 are describing.

Hence my desire to move on from the CF and walk other more remote Caminos; that don't have baggage services

Ditto....

 

[Bradypus]

Albergues were originally meant for those who cannot afford alternative accommodation

Only partly true I think. In the 1980s and early 1990s quite a few places along the Camino Frances had no commercial accommodation at all. So you either slept in a refugio or you slept outdoors however deep your pockets were

 

[dfunghi]

Well I guess my weighing the decision of whether or not to use a service has now shifted to not. I hope to walk my Camino in peace and w/o fear of judgement. I had planned to send my CPAP and the clothes for after the Camino ahead each day and carry (in my 38L bag) all I need for the walk itself absent the very heavy CPAP (actually it is the power supply that is so darn big and heavy). I had also thought since I need to arrive no later than 15 days after I leave Porto that I would rather use transport for last few K when needed rather than an entire stage if I get too far behind. Allowing 15 days for what should be a 12 day walk means I will likely be fine but either way I suppose now I have to add this to my decision making.

My thoughts of walking the Camino began in 1995 when on our honeymoon we were in P D Lima and learned about it. In 2000 on my first visit to Santander I promised myself "someday". In 2019 that day will finally arrive. My passion for doing this now was never driven by how easy it has become, it was driven by age (I am getting old) and a realization that sometimes in life you just have to do it and stop wishing or dreaming about it.

I guess it comes down to if a person is on a pilgrimage or simply wants a walking, trekking adventure. I would hate to have to be the one to decide who qualified for which and would hope the walker themselves would know and make arrangements accordingly. My Camino is a pilgrimage, for many personal reasons, and I do not expect nor do I want it to be easy, but I do not want to make it so hard I can not complete it. A 38L pack filled is too heavy for me to go 12 miles a day. At least it is right now. I have purchased a very lightweight bag and a 2L bladder. I do not expect to have more than one change of clothes and a few socks / underwear changes along with some outerwear. I suppose I could find a way to buy the $600 portable CPAP and also send Ivar my extra bag on arrival. I had thought I may need to swap a few things in and out as I went along.

Whatever I decide I will likely keep it private and hope if I do need to avail myself on a day or two of public transportation (to complete a stage) or luggage transfer I will not be shunned, frowned upon or in any way demeaned. My pilgrimage will be hard enough w/o adding other's judgement on to it.

I am not doing this to collect a document at the end that would maybe not fully reflect my effort, I am doing this because it has intrigued me for decades and because I want to do things in my life that feel important to me. I am not going with anyone, this is a solo journey that in fact began in August when my training and dieting began.

For the record, I think what happened to Kinky is deplorable and we have all seen these types of events both on and off the Camino. Some people just feel and act entitled.

Peace all,
D

 

[OzAnnie]

A taxi full of backpacks arrived, there were 12 or 13, and the keeper of the backpacks, who was a member of the group and taking a day in a taxi, “claimed” all the remaining beds for his group, putting sleeping bags, etc on all the beds. Kinky arrived way before the members of the group arrived, and he had to go to a pensión.

I agree that La Robla albergue would be perfect pickings for a selfish group as above, as it (when I stayed in 2015) there was no ‘in house’ hospi to see that fairness prevailed. First there if locked , phones for the key and hospi comes and explains all and leaves. So I can see Kinki was too much of a gentleman to argue the point with that group. He shouldn’t have had to in usual situation. I’m sure they would not have got away with this the whole camino though.
Annie

 

[KinkyOne]

Well I guess my weighing the decision of whether or not to use a service has now shifted to not. I hope to walk my Camino in peace and w/o fear of judgement. I had planned to send my CPAP and the clothes for after the Camino ahead each day and carry (in my 38L bag) all I need for the walk itself absent the very heavy CPAP (actually it is the power supply that is so darn big and heavy). I had also thought since I need to arrive no later than 15 days after I leave Porto that I would rather use transport for last few K when needed rather than an entire stage if I get too far behind. Allowing 15 days for what should be a 12 day walk means I will likely be fine but either way I suppose now I have to add this to my decision making.

My thoughts of walking the Camino began in 1995 when on our honeymoon we were in P D Lima and learned about it. In 2000 on my first visit to Santander I promised myself "someday". In 2019 that day will finally arrive. My passion for doing this now was never driven by how easy it has become, it was driven by age (I am getting old) and a realization that sometimes in life you just have to do it and stop wishing or dreaming about it.

I guess it comes down to if a person is on a pilgrimage or simply wants a walking, trekking adventure. I would hate to have to be the one to decide who qualified for which and would hope the walker themselves would know and make arrangements accordingly. My Camino is a pilgrimage, for many personal reasons, and I do not expect nor do I want it to be easy, but I do not want to make it so hard I can not complete it. A 38L pack filled is too heavy for me to go 12 miles a day. At least it is right now. I have purchased a very lightweight bag and a 2L bladder. I do not expect to have more than one change of clothes and a few socks / underwear changes along with some outerwear. I suppose I could find a way to buy the $600 portable CPAP and also send Ivar my extra bag on arrival. I had thought I may need to swap a few things in and out as I went along.

Whatever I decide I will likely keep it private and hope if I do need to avail myself on a day or two of public transportation (to complete a stage) or luggage transfer I will not be shunned, frowned upon or in any way demeaned. My pilgrimage will be hard enough w/o adding other's judgement on to it.

I am not doing this to collect a document at the end that would maybe not fully reflect my effort, I am doing this because it has intrigued me for decades and because I want to do things in my life that feel important to me. I am not going with anyone, this is a solo journey that in fact began in August when my training and dieting began.

For the record, I think what happened to Kinky is deplorable and we have all seen these types of events both on and off the Camino. Some people just feel and act entitled.

Peace all,
D

@dfunghi , your health situation and wish and determination to walk the Camino is the border point at which we are all happy that luggage service exists at all.

Wish you Bom Caminho!

 

[Iriebabel]

@dfunghi I read your account and like you I have medical needs. I walked the majority of the camino with my pack and a heavy metal knee brace. There were days where I had to accept that I needed to use service and I am greatful it was available. I did not have in my mind that I’d rather break my leg rather than use transport services and I did not feel I was taking a bed away from anyone. Yes I saw some dirty looks but they don’t live in my skin, they dont know my needs and I didn’t feel the need to explain myself or defend myself. Had more important things to think of like the next days Walk. Many people said I couldn’t and yes I could have stopped at any point and gave up. I chose to continue walking, I eased my load only if the pain was unbearable, comforted my ailing joints and carried on hoping that one day without additional weight on my joint was another day closer to Santiago. As each day went by I adjusted finding different ways and methods to keep me on my feet. Quitting was not an option. You can read my summary if you like
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/com...le-with-post-camino-summary.57400/post-651790
I don’t think I could have completed the camino otherwise. I hope other people’s judgements do not stop you from using a services that you need. There should be no guilt on your part. The camino does not have to be hard and and I believe this is not the dark ages. You know that you are not abusing the system so I think it’s ok if you send your medical items forward. I don’t think anyone would question your needs and if they do, well they need to understand the original meaning of the camino. The fact that you want to and can walk the camino is a testimony to your strength in spirit. However you decide to do it should be based on your needs.

On the other side of the coin there will always be people who abuse the privilege, who think only of themselves or are unaware of how their action affects others. The situation discribed by @peregrina2000 is unbelievable and unfortunate. @KinkyOne was unfortunately affected by their poor behavior. Sadly these types of people live their lives unaffected and unwilling to think of something bigger than themselves. There were days that I cursed under my breath as I struggled up a hill only to be pushed aside by tourigrinos. I tried not to think of them pulling ahead walking faster and me possibly not getting a bed because I was slower and less capable. I instead stopped sooner or walked on beyond those albergues I knew they were planning to stay based on the normal stages.

You should not have to sacrifice an extra pair of pants or underwear for your cpap battery. I wish you a good next walk. That was the End of my dissertation I now step off the soapbox

 

[Iriebabel]

Quite agree @Bradypus. Hence my desire to move on from the CF and walk other more remote Caminos; that don't have baggage services

I would be ok with that too and plan my stops accordingly. Ask me next spring when cyborg turtle is on the Norte

 

[Albertagirl]

Whether or not to use one of the currently available camino services is, these days, mostly the decision of the walker, with the traditional donativo albergues making decisions for their own facilities. I did not expect to ever do so. But on my first day out from Sevilla on the VdlP, very hot and dry, the hospitalera of Albergue Luz del Camino in Guillena saw that I was exhausted and insisted that I accept her offer to get my pack transported the next day. I paid a few euros, but this was not a formal bag transport service but a kindness on her part. The following night, a fellow walker was arranging to book a taxi to take him and about half of the others for the first 16 km along the road towards Almaden de la Plata, with packs taken on to Almaden (29 km total). He offered to have my bag carried with the others, for a small fee, and I accepted. I had never anticipated making such arrangements, but the heat and dryness were extreme and I talked myself into having some common sense. I never accepted a ride. I wanted the certificate of distance for the VdlP; 1,000 km felt symbolic, somehow. My four siblings, all brothers, brag about it for me when I meet their friends. I am glad that I accepted the offer of bag transport for two days. I learned that necessary self-care is more important than bragging rights.

 

[grayland]

I see the point you are making. When luggage transport services began to appear the argument was often that it would open up the Camino to those less able. Little to object to in that. The idea that it would rapidly become a labour-saving convenience for the fit but unwilling was little mentioned. Now it feels as if luggage transport has almost become the default position and those of us who decline to use it are an endangered species

For Camino dinosaurs like myself the proliferation of baggage transport services, specialist travel agencies offering readymade packages, booking.com and so on are all symptoms of the commercialisation and Disneyfication of the Camino and destroys the essential simplicity that pilgrimage on the Caminos used to have: pick up your pack, walk, find a bed, wash, eat, sleep, repeat until you reach the end! Where is the spontaneity if you have to choose your destination every morning and label your bag for pickup? Where is the room for serendipity? The satisfaction of self-reliance? The trust that it will probably work out ok - and the willingness to deal with things falling apart when it doesn't without whingeing about it? ;-)

Bravo..Bradypus.
You have managed to state the heartfelt feelings of many of us..especially those whose introduction to the camino dates before the current fad. It is most depressing to hear those who are in the early planning stages be excited about the "luggage" service. The description of these services has morphed from "pack" transport to "luggage" transport. "Luggage" brings a suitcase to my mind.

None of what Roland states above or what I am saddened about has anything to do with anyone who has a physical or medical reason to transport their pack...it never has..even when such a thing was rare.

On certain camino Facebook sites it is very common now for people to be admonished and advised to NOT carry a pack as if it would be incredibly stupid. I am never sure if these folks are sincere or just feeling a bit regretful that they operated in this manner and hope to make it feel better by having more people do it.

 

[Saint Mike II]

Who determines what a "valid" reason would be? Does age qualify? What about medical devices too heavy to carry? Seems like a slippery slope when people start to decide who has a valid reason for something and who does not.

Let me qualify this by saying I have yet to walk a camino and have heard of the "race for a bed" aspect of it many times by folks that have walked it and many here that have written about it. Still, it is not for anyone else to say who and who is not a pilgrim and whatever reasons that walker has to make their pilgrimage or how.

Hola & welcome to the forum. The question of not admitting pilgrims who do not carry the backpacks has been discussed here a number of time. As was indicated above the municipal & donativo albergues operate on low overheads and are there to provide a bed for those "pilgrims" walking the camino on a budget.
The privately operated albergues are free to choose who they admit and who they do not. As to what constitutes a "valid reason" well again that is up to the albergue operator to determine.
There are a number of albergues that operate via a collective reservation system so you can book ahead from one to the other. These places will usually operate & cooperate with the luggage transporters. If you intend to walk the camino (say the Frances - the traditional route from St Jean to Santiago via Burgos and Leon - and intend to have your backpack transported then I would recommend you opt to stay in private albergues.
As for who is a pilgrim and who is not - well again that is a regularly discussed subject with almost as many opinions as there are posters.
I know I have not answered your question directly, because its not one that can really get a YES/NO answer. Its all a matter of degrees.
To conclude - come and walk the camino, meet it with an open mind and see what transpires. What I do know is that the vast majority of pilgrims (camino walkers if you wish) will welcome you and meet you as an equal. They will not judge you on a first meeting basis. Oh and this majority probably wont care if you have your backpack transported. (I know that some who have read some of my earlier posts may see that I have changed my opinion - well yes, more tolerant in my senior years). Cheers for now!!

 

[NualaOC]

Seems that I opened or stirred a can of worms with my comment on this thread!

For those who haven't yet walked a Camino, there's no 'shame' in using the pack transport service. On the final 100km of the Camino Francés and Portugés a significant percentage of people (possibly more than 50% at times) use these services and most accommodations accept them. You don't need to justify your needs or preferences - the service exists and many of us have used it. It's unlikely that you'll experience negativity or judgement from other walkers.

The albergues that choose to refuse transported packs represent a small proportion of the available beds. It's not something to be unduly concerned about, but it's useful to know that policy and the reasons for it.

And finally ...... why do some of us choose to trudge along with a heavy backpack when it can be sent ahead for a few euros? I do it because for reasons I don't quite understand, I'm blissfully happy when that pack is on my back. If it's too heavy, I leave stuff behind and discover how little I really need to be happy. I've also described it as my anti-ageing handbag, as when I put it on, I feel at least 20 years younger! On a Camino, there's also the added advantage of flexibility about where to stop each day. I struggled with that concept on my first couple of walks, but I now love the freedom of being able to change my plans depending on how things work out on the day. No doubt there will come a time when my ageing body no longer loves my pack - when that happens, I'll have no qualms about taking whatever help is available to ensure I can keep walking.

Buen Camino everyone and don't sweat the small stuff! Be brave and embrace a little uncertainty - who knows what wonderful things might happen.

 

[Former member 49149]

I watched the attendant at the Rates albergue tell a couple that it is the policy of all “official”
association albergue to not accept people who transfer luggage. This albergue does not accept luggage transfer at the albergue. They are delivered to a coffee shop instead.

The attendant did accept these people but only after a fairly long lecture. I have experienced less tolerance on this route from volunteer’s at albergue’s than I have on the French route.

Note: When I talked to these folks afterwards they said the reason they transfered there backpacks was because they had a 22 mile rough day getting out of Porto and wanted a day to recover.

Hi. I have just scanned the posts, and here is my tuppenceworth: as a hospitalera the policy was/is to accept luggage, look after it, but not to assign a space to the owner if said owner arrives after all beds are taken. I did see one situation where two young women gave up their beds for the owners of luggage. No problem, and two more chairs were fitted around the table for dinner. On my last camino, I accepted an offer from the hospitalera to take my backpack to the next place and was I grateful. You bet! This is a vexed question, and all we can hope for is the spirit of being pilgrim to operate and prevent argument and bitterness, because as has been noted, that response adds a weight that sits on the back even if the pack is transported...

 

[angus55morrison]

It's quite possible you don't reach your backpacks destination ! A hard night could follow without your gear.Buen Camino.

 

[Bradypus]

I never accepted a ride. I wanted the certificate of distance for the VdlP; 1,000 km felt symbolic, somehow. My four siblings, all brothers, brag about it for me when I meet their friends. I am glad that I accepted the offer of bag transport for two days. I learned that necessary self-care is more important than bragging rights.

Your brothers are right to do so. You passed me mid-morning as I took a break by the roadside on the Castilblanco to Almaden "stage from hell". While a number of people far younger than either of us chose not unreasonably to take a taxi to the Berrocal park gate to shorten that difficult day you walked it all. As I watched your back passing out of view up the hill I was almost convinced that you left a trail of dust Roadrunner-style in your wake. It may be a faux pas to comment on a lady's age but it was inspirational to see the energy and commitment (and also the speed) of someone considerably richer in years and shorter in legs than myself It gave me hope that despite some wear and tear I may be able to do the same for a while yet. If accepting a kind offer of help now and again makes that possible then so be it. There may conceivably be principles worth dying for. Being able to smugly declare that "I always carried my own rucksack" from your hospital bed is not one of them

 

[Bradypus]

Is this type of "sorting out" of who gets a bed and who does not also apply if I was walking all day and as it got too dark I took a bus the last 3 -5K? DO I need to stealthily depart bus a few blocks away and be sure no one sees me?

I am a little puzzled by this question. As you have explained above you have specific needs which limit your ability to walk with a pack. Most people walking the Caminos these days seem to be walking daily stages somewhere around the 20km mark and finish their walking in the early afternoon. Given that you already recognise your limitations why would you plan your daily stages with distances so great that you think you may still be 5km short of your destination by nightfall - several hours after the majority of walkers have stopped and incidentally taken up most of the available beds? Are you tied to a fixed schedule which means that you must walk such ambitious stages? If your time is limited would it not be a better plan to start from a point closer to Santiago and walk shorter stages which you are more confident will be within your own ability?

 

[Deleted member 67185]

Three times: the number of instances I was out of luck for an alburgue space due to daypackers who sent bags ahead, and the delivery driver securing reservations.

57.00: the amount of extra Euros neede for lodging as the result of the above.

There have been a lot of people on Frances right now. A lot of daypckers and bike tour groups (not teams or local cycle groups). It is a lot different feeling and concentration of daypacks and bikers than I saw last year.

 

[Felipe]

Uhmmm....I was afraid that this topic would fall in the endless "real pilgrimism" issue.
My personal position is that I am bound to the rules as stated in my credencial: it is for pilgrims on foot, bike or horse. Not taxis or buses are mentioned. When I sign the credencial, I consider that as a moral contract. I feel that I have to respect it, unless there is a solid reason not to do that.
Everything else is just an opinion. That includes carrying (or not) the backpack. I personally prefer to do it, as a matter of convenience and also as a symbol (yes, I consider the Camino as a metaphor for life...). But I once resorted to a carrying service (long stage, feeling sore and tired...)
Plase note that this is just a personal belief -I am not judging other walkers.

 

[dfox]

If you can afford a tour with bus support, luggage transport, and multiple guides/drivers you can surely afford a hotel.

One can financially afford having luggage transport, may not have the physical stamina to carry his/her backpack for the pilgrimage.

 

[grayland]

One can financially afford having luggage transport, may not have the physical stamina to carry his/her backpack for the pilgrimage.

It it very important to understand that no one has posted any negative comment directed toward anyone who may have a physical or medical restriction.

In actual fact..this point is made in all discussions on this subject.

 

[Albertagirl]

it was inspirational to see the energy and commitment (and also the speed) of someone considerably richer in years and shorter in legs than myself It gave me hope that despite some wear and tear I may be able to do the same for a while yet. If accepting a kind offer of help now and again makes that possible then so be it.

@Bradypus
Well, ok. But not that much "richer in years".

 

[gloria lowe]

You people who judge someone because they ship their pack ahead are just such a true Pilgrim. What you see is not always the whole picture. So this 70 y/o lady with fat legs, had 2 heart attack’s with 4 stents, 4 leg and knee surgeries will just keep walking along with her day pack, but don’t worry I won’t take your municipal albergue bed. Please don’t label and judge people you know nothing about. Each is walking the Way their way.

 

[Chris Gi]

I watched the attendant at the Rates albergue tell a couple that it is the policy of all “official”
association albergue to not accept people who transfer luggage. This albergue does not accept luggage transfer at the albergue. They are delivered to a coffee shop instead.

The attendant did accept these people but only after a fairly long lecture. I have experienced less tolerance on this route from volunteer’s at albergue’s than I have on the French route.

Note: When I talked to these folks afterwards they said the reason they transfered there backpacks was because they had a 22 mile rough day getting out of Porto and wanted a day to recover.

My husband and I are old in years (79) but young in spirit and we were thankful for the luggage transfer system. We had no problems at all where ever we stayed....a couple of albergue owners even carried our transfered bags to our beds ....we must have looked pretty bad. The transfer system does provide work for the locals so it’s not all bad.

 

[Bradypus]

@Bradypus
Well, ok. But not that much "richer in years".

I am a 1962 vintage model.

 

[NualaOC]

I am a 1962 vintage model.

That was a very good year

 

[NualaOC]

You people who judge someone because they ship their pack ahead are just such a true Pilgrim. What you see is not always the whole picture. So this 70 y/o lady with fat legs, had 2 heart attack’s with 4 stents, 4 leg and knee surgeries will just keep walking along with her day pack, but don’t worry I won’t take your municipal albergue bed. Please don’t label and judge people you know nothing about. Each is walking the Way their way.

This has been a fair and measured discussion, with very little judgement about people's arrangements for their Camino. Thankfully we don't often see the term 'you people' on this forum - there may be cultural differences around that, but it's not (IMO) a polite way to address other members. However, if I'm one of those who caused you offence or made you feel that you were being judged, I offer my sincere apologies.

Wishing you a Buen Camino - I've met many pilgrims over the years who manage the walk despite a catalogue of health issues. I never fail to be impressed and inspired by their stories - you should be very proud of what you've done and what you'll hopefully keep on doing.

Peace, love and happy walking to all!

 

[domigee]

The description of these services has morphed from "pack" transport to "luggage" transport. "Luggage" brings a suitcase to my mind.

On the Camino inglés this Summer ...

 

[C clearly]

You people who judge someone because they ship their pack ahead are just such a true Pilgrim... Please don’t label and judge people you know nothing about.

Please don't label and judge people on this thread. There has been no suggestion at all, that people with needs should not get appropriate help and consideration.

 

[Deleted member 36903]

On the Camino inglés this Summer ...View attachment 46857

But why do people do this? It's a daily 'tax' on the journey, there's always a risk of suitcases (!) going astray, plus what other folks have said about being limited to arrive at the place where your stuff is being transported to. Also suitcases can be sent to Ivar or (usually) the destination accommodation for safekeeping while walking. I will never forget the party of French women who were staying at Casa Albergue de Jesus - not exactly five star accommodation - trundling their very large suitcases down the stairs. But oh my what a contrast with my own clean but dishevelled appearance as they had appeared with freshly coiffeured hair and newly pressed clothes.

 

[Bradypus]

I will never forget the party of French women who were staying at Casa Albergue de Jesus - not exactly five star accommodation - trundling their very large suitcases down the stairs. But oh my what a contrast with my own clean but dishevelled appearance as they had appeared with freshly coiffeured hair and newly pressed clothes.

Reminded me of David - a young Italian man I met on the descent from Grand Saint Bernard pass on the Via Francigena carrying a huge pack. We shared a room a couple of nights later. Before he went for his shower he pulled 2kg of dried rice and a heavy cotton towelling dressing gown from his rucksack. In August. He reckoned his pack weighed 17kg and I believed it. The next day he gave up and went home with knee trouble. I'll settle for "dishevelled" any day.

 

[Kathar1na]

I will never forget the party of French women who were staying at Casa Albergue de Jesus - not exactly five star accommodation - trundling their very large suitcases down the stairs. But oh my what a contrast with my own clean but dishevelled appearance as they had appeared with freshly coiffeured hair and newly pressed clothes.

I think the discussion gets often so confusing because many aspects are mixed together. For example, according to Gronze.com, the albergue Casa de Jesús in Villar de Mazarife (perhaps the albergue in question?) is "orientado a los peregrinos" but it is "not exclusively for pilgrims" and it also has several double rooms whereas the albergue in Ratos is exclusively for pilgrims. That makes a difference. Only-on-foot and only-with-my-backpack pilgrims may wish that it isn't so but it is.

 

[Jon Hebertson]

I watched the attendant at the Rates albergue tell a couple that it is the policy of all “official”
association albergue to not accept people who transfer luggage. This albergue does not accept luggage transfer at the albergue. They are delivered to a coffee shop instead.

The attendant did accept these people but only after a fairly long lecture. I have experienced less tolerance on this route from volunteer’s at albergue’s than I have on the French route.

Note: When I talked to these folks afterwards they said the reason they transfered there backpacks was because they had a 22 mile rough day getting out of Porto and wanted a day to recover.

Hi, which route did they take out of Porto?

If they were struggling enough to order luggage transfer along the route, why not cut the day short instead of going 22miles to rates!

Jon

 

[VNwalking]

One can financially afford having luggage transport, may not have the physical stamina to carry his/her backpack for the pilgrimage.

You people who judge someone because they ship their pack ahead are just such a true Pilgrim. What you see is not always the whole picture. So this 70 y/o lady with fat legs, had 2 heart attack’s with 4 stents, 4 leg and knee surgeries will just keep walking along with her day pack, but don’t worry I won’t take your municipal albergue bed. Please don’t label and judge people you know nothing about. Each is walking the Way their way.

Of course. If you read what carefully, you'll see that we aren't talking about that at all, nor criticizing those who use pack transfer because of medical issues. The large supported tour groups are another matter. It's fine that they are there, but IMHO they should stay in hotels and leave the albergues for others.

It it very important to understand that no one has posted any negative comment directed toward anyone who may have a physical or medical restriction.

Exactly. @NualaOC said it perfectly.

There have been a lot of people on Frances right now. A lot of daypckers and bike tour groups (not teams or local cycle groups). It is a lot different feeling and concentration of daypacks and bikers than I saw last year.

Where are you now, Dave? @David was saying something similar. Hopefully once you get to the meseta, all that will thin out and it will feel more like the camino. Ultreia and buen camino!

 

[Deleted member 67185]

Of course. If you read what carefully, you'll see that we aren't talking about that at all, nor criticizing those who use pack transfer because of medical issues. The large supported tour groups are another matter. It's fine that they are there, but IMHO they should stay in hotels and leave the albergues for others.

Exactly. @NualaOC said it perfectly.
Where are you now, Dave? @David was saying something similar. Hopefully once you get to the meseta, all that will thin out and it will feel more like the camino. Ultreia and buen camino!

I’m in Carrión right now. It has been like this since after Pamplona. Out of St Jean I never would have guessed about the number of daypacks and bikes. From conversation a lot I’ve talked with started from Pamplona.

 

[VNwalking]

Wow, on the meseta, too?
Buen camino, and keep your eyes peeled for @David who may be out there tending peregrino's blisters.

 

[bmcbride]

I watched the attendant at the Rates albergue tell a couple that it is the policy of all “official”
association albergue to not accept people who transfer luggage. This albergue does not accept luggage transfer at the albergue. They are delivered to a coffee shop instead.

The attendant did accept these people but only after a fairly long lecture. I have experienced less tolerance on this route from volunteer’s at albergue’s than I have on the French route.

Note: When I talked to these folks afterwards they said the reason they transfered there backpacks was because they had a 22 mile rough day getting out of Porto and wanted a day to recover.

 

[bmcbride]

We were there recently and had a similar experience. I knew that municipal do not usually accept luggage, but the company we used listed the municipal Albergue as the only option for delivery in Rates, so when we arrived I asked the hosptalera if our bag had been delivered there. A simple Yes or No question, but she went into a 10 minute rant on the policy, and how other pilgrims would be upset if they saw us dragging in luggage. I explained that we had carried our backpacks, and that the extra bag contained items for a holiday after our Camino. The extra bag was not even going to be brought into the Albergue, but I needed to check to make sure that it had arrived. I then asked if she knew where it would have been delivered, and she continued to berate us and asked why we had not sent our extra bag directly to Santiago. We were concerned about delivery from Portugal to Spain, and there were items in the bag that I could not take the risk of losing. The whole experience was unpleasant for everyone, as she did her rant in front of ten other pilgrims, in a raised voice. It was, in my opinion, extremely inappropriate. I would have liked to speak with her privately about my concerns, but unfortunately I could never see her alone and was not going to do it in front of other pilgrims. I believe that the role of a hospitalera/o is to provide support for pilgrims; not to sit in judgement of them. A simple, calm explanation that the Albergue does not accept baggage, and a polite suggestion as to where bags might be sent would have sufficed.

 

[MilosWay]

On my next Camino, I will try a transportation service too. And I will arrive early then, to make a photo of the Hospitaleros face, while the courier unloads my Ruffwear Dog Pack. This will be awesome!

 

[tpmchugh]

It is not unusual for albergues not to accept transfered luggage or the people who transfer luggage. It's just within recent years that it has become more acceptable on the Frances route in almost all albergues, but there still are some, such as the one in Rabanal del Camino, who will not let you stay if you transfer your luggage. It is a pilgrimage and they expect a pilgrim to carry their pack, I guess.

The albergue in Rabanal has this policy because they are a ' donativo'. They do not want to unfairly take custom away from the other albergues so refusing to accept backpacks sent ahead sends pilgrims who want to do this to the other albergues. It is in the spirit of good neighbourliness in the village. They will however make an exception for pilgrims 70 and over.

 

[GraemeHall]

This thread has saddened me but I can't explain why. I am 70, recently completed SJPP to Muxía and Finisterra entirely on foot and carrying my own burden. I saw many different approaches and did not judge. But the defensiveness coming through the thread has me wondering if the sense of pilgrimage is now in the past.
Sorry.

 

[dfunghi]

I am a little puzzled by this question. As you have explained above you have specific needs which limit your ability to walk with a pack. Most people walking the Caminos these days seem to be walking daily stages somewhere around the 20km mark and finish their walking in the early afternoon. Given that you already recognise your limitations why would you plan your daily stages with distances so great that you think you may still be 5km short of your destination by nightfall - several hours after the majority of walkers have stopped and incidentally taken up most of the available beds? Are you tied to a fixed schedule which means that you must walk such ambitious stages? If your time is limited would it not be a better plan to start from a point closer to Santiago and walk shorter stages which you are more confident will be within your own ability?

A) because the best laid plans still fail and B) I am going in late March when days are very short and C) I do not believe I will have this misfortune and doing 12 M (20+K) a day will be done in about 5 hours time. Six with a meal. I do not fear losing space or not finding a bed. My point was more about being frowned upon for arriving on a bus. I have no idea if I will make the same distances there as I am doing here in training. It could be pouring rain, windy and dark at 4:30. I believe I have it in me to do 240K in 12 days.

For the record I will have a pack, a rather full pack at that, but would like to avoid carrying my CPAP and its heavy power pack. I have a 38L Kestral that will likely weigh in around 15-18 pounds.

I really have zero desire to comment further on this. I am kind of sorry I commented at all. My walk will be what it will be and my experiences all will be what they will be. I won't be adding to this thread again. I like the tone set here on this forum and do not want to feel like I am being questioned about how, why or in what manner I plan to walk. I shall keep most of my thoughts on this private form here on out to help preserve for myself the wonderful spirit of community I have found here.

 

[Ernesto.IT]

I find it hard to come to a clear line in this debate, but one thing that I definitely think is unfair — people who have their packs transferred, for whatever reason, should not be able to get beds by having their transported pack used to save them a bed. This happened to Kinky when I was in the La Robla albergue. A taxi full of backpacks arrived, there were 12 or 13, and the keeper of the backpacks, who was a member of the group and taking a day in a taxi, “claimed” all the remaining beds for his group, putting sleeping bags, etc on all the beds. Kinky arrived way before the members of the group arrived, and he had to go to a pensión. And then I never saw him again on this camino, so maybe that adds to my negative assessment of those people.

And this is why after 7 continuously pilgrimage started in 2012 I said my goodbyes to James for ever.

 

[IngridF]

The Refugio Gaucelmo's "no vehicle support" policy is very clear in making an exception for those with genuine injuries or illness. I think it fairly unlikely that any albergue will refuse point blank to accommodate a pilgrim in serious medical need who arrives by vehicle.

Depends on the person behind the desk. It happened to me..injured...and I will leave it at that.

 

[VNwalking]

This thread has saddened me but I can't explain why. I am 70, recently completed SJPP to Muxía and Finisterra entirely on foot and carrying my own burden. I saw many different approaches and did not judge. But the defensiveness coming through the thread has me wondering if the sense of pilgrimage is now in the past.

Maybe, or maybe it's just getting diluted by a lot of other elements. It's still out there, and is most obvious on the less-walked routes.
Congratulations and well done, Graeme!

 

[Albertagirl]

This thread has saddened me but I can't explain why. I am 70, recently completed SJPP to Muxía and Finisterra entirely on foot and carrying my own burden. I saw many different approaches and did not judge. But the defensiveness coming through the thread has me wondering if the sense of pilgrimage is now in the past.
Sorry.

@GraemeHall
This question "if the sense of pilgrimage is now in the past" may be based on an idealized conception of what pilgrimage was in the past. I suspect that, then as now, it was many things to many people. One thing that it was then but seldom is now, was a judicial sentence on someone who had committed a crime. Other meanings of pilgrimage which are strong now and can be seen in texts from the past are opportunities for persons along the pilgrim routes to make money providing services to pilgrims, and/or cheating them or robbing them. A popular function of pilgrim routes these days is to provide a cheap holiday in a scenic location. You can see most of these approaches to pilgrimage related in Chaucer's Canterbury Tales from 14th century England. But the "sense of pilgrimage" as I suspect that you mean it was alive then, as it is now. There have been many threads on this forum where future pilgrims ask for advice and suggestions for suitable reading, trusting that some persons on this forum who walk the pilgrim routes have felt some sort of spiritual call to pilgrimage and can help them prepare. We try to be careful in discussing such matters, as they may lead to conflicting expression of religious perspectives. This is forbidden on this forum, to keep the peace. But many of us have experienced a "sense of pilgrimage" and responded to it, as you have, by walking a pilgrim route in Spain. Now you will need to integrate your pilgrimage experiences into your life at home. Maybe this is the hardest part of a pilgrimage. Blessings on your Way.

 

[Anniesantiago]

The albergue in Rabanal has this policy because they are a ' donativo'. They do not want to unfairly take custom away from the other albergues so refusing to accept backpacks sent ahead sends pilgrims who want to do this to the other albergues. It is in the spirit of good neighbourliness in the village. They will however make an exception for pilgrims 70 and over.

What was their reason before the other albergue opened?

 

[grayland]

There have been many opinions shared in this thread with different points of view expressed without rudeness or using the "J" word.

Thanks to all who have shared experiences and opinions.

Again to those who seemingly have misinterpreted some posts and mistakenly come to believe that anyone here has included anyone who has physical or medical limitations in the transport discussion.

It may be a good place to close the thread while everyone is playing nice.