Albergue windows and doors open or closed at night now.

[RJM]

My question is for those currently on the Camino or perhaps recently on it, and who stayed in albergues with dormitory type sleeping quarters, even if in a room with a few fellow pilgrims.
Is the practice of shutting all the windows at night still being done, or has rational thinking prevailed in light of the current worldwide pandemic of a highly contagious airborne virus?
I would think that is the worst thing one could do now, shutting the room up at night, or daytime for that matter, with no circulation of fresh air.
I know that type of living contributed to the spread of the plague in medieval times.

 

[cbacino]

My question is for those currently on the Camino or perhaps recently on it, and who stayed in albergues with dormitory type sleeping quarters, even if in a room with a few fellow pilgrims.
Is the practice of shutting all the windows at night still being done, or has rational thinking prevailed in light of the current worldwide pandemic of a highly contagious airborne virus?
I would think that is the worst thing one could do now, shutting the room up at night, or daytime for that matter, with no circulation of fresh air.
I know that type of living contributed to the spread of the plague in medieval times.

It depends on the sensibilities of others in the albergue. I opened windows by my bunk only to find them closed later in the night. Those times I felt concerned about conditions, when possible, I moved to the common area and slept by myself on a couch. Somehow, in 850 miles, I managed to avoid getting sick.

 

[RJM]

It depends on the sensibilities of others in the albergue. I opened windows by my bunk only to find them closed later in the night. Those times I felt concerned about conditions, when possible, I moved to the common area and slept by myself on a couch. Somehow, in 850 miles, I managed to avoid getting sick.

Yeah, I did the grabbing my stuff and moving outside or common area routine a few times on the Frances pre pandemic.
I have also done the opening, closing and reopening routine quite a few times.
I just don't understand irrational and illogical behavior. Sigh....

 

[Tincatinker]

Culture and tradition are seldom influenced by rationality or logic.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

I would think with the current heatwave that Spain is experiencing, irregardless of culture or covid, that open windows would be necessary and appreciated by all.

 

[RJM]

Well, I have recently purchased the lightest inflatable travel ground sleeping pad I can find at a reasonable price. It stores down to the size of a large soda can, but weighs almost a pound, unfortunately. It does go against my walk the Camino minimalist philosophy, but current times force my hand I suppose. The one thing it will provide is piece of mind knowing I can sack out anywhere in decent comfort.

 

[trecile]

I would think with the current heatwave that Spain is experiencing, irregardless of culture or covid, that open windows would be necessary and appreciated by all.

You would think that, but I've been in albergue dorms on hot nights where there are some that want all the windows closed.

 

[mspath]

Well, I have recently purchased the lightest inflatable travel ground sleeping pad I can find at a reasonable price. It stores down to the size of a large soda can, but weighs almost a pound, unfortunately. It does go against my walk the Camino minimalist philosophy, but current times force my hand I suppose. The one thing it will provide is piece of mind knowing I can sack out anywhere in decent comfort.

RJM,
Great idea! Who makes/sells this wonder?

 

[Camino Chrissy]

You would think that, but I've been in albergue dorms on hot nights where there are some that want all the windows closed.

I've always walked in the spring, so never had to sleep in a stifling hotbox.

 

[Shazenalan]

I would think with the current heatwave that Spain is experiencing, irregardless of culture or covid, that open windows would be necessary and appreciated by all.

As a Brit - throwing open windows in hot weather is my first instinct too. I am currently on the Camino in Carabelos - be assured that opening windows only lets the heat in - it’s taken two Spanish heatwaves since May 5th when I got here to teach me
this . However for Covid reasons I totally agree max ventilation is best.

 

[DyanTX]

Thermarest makes very good and lightweight sleeping pads. I currently use the women's prolight for camping and backpacking. Weight 18 oz. There are lighter ones. Expensive, yes. But worth it for comfort if you decide to sleep outside the albergue room. https://www.thermarest.com/sleeping-pads/fast-and-light

 

[RJM]

RJM,
Great idea! Who makes/sells this wonder?

Got it on Amazon. About $30. Seems solid. Good reviews.

 

[RJM]

As a Brit - throwing open windows in hot weather is my first instinct too. I am currently on the Camino in Carabelos - be assured that opening windows only lets the heat in - it’s taken two Spanish heatwaves since May 5th when I got here to teach me
this . However for Covid reasons I totally agree max ventilation is best.

How does opening windows let heat in when there's an absence of air conditioning inside? The heat is there regardless. To open the windows allows some measure of air circulation which can bring in cooler temperature.
If it is 40° C outside and inside there's no air-conditioning, it will become 40° or more inside and could actually reach dangerous levels. Think of a car parked outside in the heat. If one were to sit in the car with no air conditioner running, windows completely closed, or even slightly opened for oxygen, one would fairly quickly become a heat casualty and perhaps even die.

 

[J Willhaus]

In Estella in July 2019, the tiny hospitalero room was hot no matter what time of day with window open or closed. We bought an oscillating fan for the common room which we took into the hospitaleto room at night.

Unless there is a breeze the heavy stucco or stone walls radiate the heat back inside some nights.

 

[gittiharre]

My question is for those currently on the Camino or perhaps recently on it, and who stayed in albergues with dormitory type sleeping quarters, even if in a room with a few fellow pilgrims.
Is the practice of shutting all the windows at night still being done, or has rational thinking prevailed in light of the current worldwide pandemic of a highly contagious airborne virus?
I would think that is the worst thing one could do now, shutting the room up at night, or daytime for that matter, with no circulation of fresh air.
I know that type of living contributed to the spread of the plague in medieval times.

Windows closed! I felt, I was suffocating.

 

[RJM]

Windows closed! I felt, I was suffocating.

Me too. A few times I awoke to stifling hot, smelly and stuffy conditions in an albergue dorm. All the windows and doors closed. Insanity. Grabbed all my gear and went outside for the rest of the night.

 

[chinacat]

Our old woollen mill has walls that are two feet thick.
It’s a cool haven in sweltering heat (a none-too-common occurrence here )
I love fresh air, but it’s often better to keep the south-facing windows closed in the heat.

My cousin’s house in Tasmania has a solid wall facing south and the windows all face north … because of the heat.

With the shutters that so many Spanish houses have on the windows, and the thick, white-painted walls, wouldn’t albergues remain a bit cooler inside?
Of course, a room full of pilgrims would soon become stifling in the summer heat.

We walked late September and October … I think I’d avoid Iberia in the summer/early autumn.

 

[Jennifer H]

I’ve been on Norte/Primitivo. Windows shuttered tight, doors closed, a few coughers. I deeply regret that I continued to stay in albergues after I saw those conditions the first night. Cautionary tale. I’m now stuck for an indeterminate time recovering from Covid and waiting until I’m not contagious. I feel very sad that I likely passed it on as well before I knew. Being sick and holing up in a hotel far from home sucks, and I have no idea when I’ll have the energy to continue.

 

[gittiharre]

I’ve been on Norte/Primitivo. Windows shuttered tight, doors closed, a few coughers. I deeply regret that I continued to stay in albergues after I saw those conditions the first night. Cautionary tale. I’m now stuck for an indeterminate time recovering from Covid and waiting until I’m not contagious. I feel very sad that I likely passed it on as well before I knew. Being sick and holing up in a hotel far from home sucks, and I have no idea when I’ll have the energy to continue.

Bummer....
I switched to private rooms for most of my walk, than sat opposite a guy last night, who was sneezing and coughing, claiming it was hayfever. This am, he said, he had felt really unwell last night.
I hope like he'll, he does not have covid, as I can't fly home to NZ if I am positive and changing flight date will set me back $ 2000 dollars.

 

[gittiharre]

I’ve been on Norte/Primitivo. Windows shuttered tight, doors closed, a few coughers. I deeply regret that I continued to stay in albergues after I saw those conditions the first night. Cautionary tale. I’m now stuck for an indeterminate time recovering from Covid and waiting until I’m not contagious. I feel very sad that I likely passed it on as well before I knew. Being sick and holing up in a hotel far from home sucks, and I have no idea when I’ll have the energy to continue.

Where are you now?

 

[J Willhaus]

Bummer....
I switched to private rooms for most of my walk, than sat opposite a guy last night, who was sneezing and coughing, claiming it was hayfever. This am, he said, he had felt really unwell last night.
I hope like he'll, he does not have covid, as I can't fly home to NZ if I am positive and changing flight date will set me back $ 2000 dollars.

If you have trip insurance (double check) it may cover an extra stay for COVID. Ours does.

 

[grayland]

For those now walking.....what are you finding for prices in private rooms...hotels...pensions, etc.

I have a feeling the prices have shot up this year.

 

[RJM]

I think some of these accounts reinforce the fact that you cannot trust your fellow pilgrims to do the right thing. Whether it involves a pandemic or not. Pre pandemic pilgrims got sick and still do from poor bathroom hygiene habits of other ones and they pass on good old traveler's sicknesses like norovirus to others. Unfortunately I would say there are those walking that feel to have the albergue completely open to the outside would be overreacting.

 

[gittiharre]

For those now walking.....what are you finding for prices in private rooms...hotels...pensions, etc.

I have a feeling the prices have shot up this year.

Staying in fab place A Lua de Camino with superb pool. Euro 55 for twin room.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

If you have trip insurance (double check) it may cover an extra stay for COVID. Ours does.

Has anyone on the Camino in Galacia who has had to quarantine due to covid been able to make use of the free lodging that was being offered in order to assure visitors they would be taken care of? I recall reading a thread about it a few months ago.

EDIT- The offer sounded almost "too good to be true". It would be interesting to hear if anyone needed and was able to take advantage of it, or at least tried to use it. I know at least several pilgrims/walkers developed covid from what I've read on the forum.

 

[Shazenalan]

How does opening windows let heat in when there's an absence of air conditioning inside? The heat is there regardless. To open the windows allows some measure of air circulation which can bring in cooler temperature.
If it is 40° C outside and inside there's no air-conditioning, it will become 40° or more inside and could actually reach dangerous levels. Think of a car parked outside in the heat. If one were to sit in the car with no air conditioner running, windows completely closed, or even slightly opened for oxygen, one would fairly quickly become a heat casualty and perhaps even die.

….. because shutters and blinds keep the sun out and the heat down.

 

[gittiharre]

….. because shutters and blinds keep the sun out and the heat down.

During the day yes but at night you want to get cool air and oxygen in.

 

[RJM]

….. because shutters and blinds keep the sun out and the heat down.

Air circulation is necessary to maintain cool temperatures when it's hot outside. Sure, sunny side of the building having an awning or such to shade the sun from doorways and windows makes sense. It reduces the temperatures at the doorway or window. Same with dark colors absorbing heat and lighter ones reflecting heat. If I were to paint one piece of steel glossy white and another flat black and laid them on the ground in the Sahara desert at noon, within an hour you would literally be unable to grab the flat black one as it would be painfully hot to the touch. The glossy one would be manageable.
I worked for a few years in the middle east and a lot of that time lived in austere conditions, tents and cots. The sides of the tents had to be rolled up in the heat of the day to allow air circulation (good Lord it was hot). We had these canvas water bags, desert water bags as they would call them. We would fill them and completely soak them on the outside, hang them up and let the air circulating around them cool the water inside. Worked pretty good.

 

[Katherine Radeka]

I don’t have AC in my hundred year old house in the Pacific NW.

In summer, we open the windows in the early am to let in cool morning air with window fans. Then close them all as soon as it’s warmer outside than inside, and close the blinds.

With things sealed up, interior fans and ceiling fans the house stays cool most of the day. We don’t open up again until the next morning.

And I imagine this works even better with thick stone walls.

 

[Jennifer H]

Where are you now?

I’m in Oviedo now in a hotel room w a little kitchenette so I can isolate better. I have until the 28 so i do have time to recover but won’t be able to do the full route (It would be very messy to extend the trip) I guess I just have to see what the next few days bring. The Spain tourism website said 5 days of isolation or until symptoms are totally gone plus 5 days of mask/distance. I’ve already been here 4 days but probably need at least 2 more in place maybe more. I have zero energy. If it’s walk through the mountains or skip some (maybe skip all the way to Lugo) but get the last 100k in … thoughts on which you’d pick? I want so bad to do both but it’s clearly not happening.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

Hi @Jennifer H,
I turned onto the Primitivo from the Norte at Oviedo and walked as far as Lugo, taking a bus to Santiago, being a bit pressed for time. I'd heard the stretch after Lugo was not as scenic so I had no regrets doing that as I already had a couple of Compostelas. For you it will depend how important it is to receive one in making a decision.

 

[Former member 95219]

Bummer....
I switched to private rooms for most of my walk, than sat opposite a guy last night, who was sneezing and coughing, claiming it was hayfever. This am, he said, he had felt really unwell last night.
I hope like he'll, he does not have covid, as I can't fly home to NZ if I am positive and changing flight date will set me back $ 2000 dollars.

You still need a PCR ago enter NZ?

 

[J Willhaus]

I’m in Oviedo now in a hotel room w a little kitchenette so I can isolate better. I have until the 28 so i do have time to recover but won’t be able to do the full route (It would be very messy to extend the trip) I guess I just have to see what the next few days bring. The Spain tourism website said 5 days of isolation or until symptoms are totally gone plus 5 days of mask/distance. I’ve already been here 4 days but probably need at least 2 more in place maybe more. I have zero energy. If it’s walk through the mountains or skip some (maybe skip all the way to Lugo) but get the last 100k in … thoughts on which you’d pick? I want so bad to do both but it’s clearly not happening.

Hi Jennifer
Do you want the compostella? If so make sure you do the last 100km with two stamps per day. If that is not important, then just walk as you are able. It gets quite busy toward the end which can be a shock to some people.
Janet

 

[dougfitz]

How does opening windows let heat in when there's an absence of air conditioning inside? The heat is there regardless. To open the windows allows some measure of air circulation which can bring in cooler temperature.
If it is 40° C outside and inside there's no air-conditioning, it will become 40° or more inside and could actually reach dangerous levels. Think of a car parked outside in the heat. If one were to sit in the car with no air conditioner running, windows completely closed, or even slightly opened for oxygen, one would fairly quickly become a heat casualty and perhaps even die.

The heat mass of a building is quite different to that of a car. You can expect the building to warm up more slowly inside than the rate of rise of the external ambient temperature, so it will stay cooler longer if the outside temperature is warmer. A car has almost no heat mass by comparison, and will quickly rise to the ambient temperature level.

Keeping windows closed in the absence of cooling (evaporative or air conditioning) will prevent hotter external air circulating during the day on hot days. Only when the external temperature has dropped below the internal temperature will opening windows cool down the inside of the building.

In winter, it is more likely that any open window will result in cooler air coming into the building. Air circulation might then be a concern. Perhaps there are places where the rooms are so small that there is insufficient air circulating, but I don't think that I have ever stayed in any where I felt that was a genuine concern. Then again, COVID 19 has revealed many things about air circulation patterns in buildings and the threats that emerge from designs that don't provide adequate fresh air circulation.

ps tents in the desert are unlikely to have much heat mass either. Cars and tents are not analogous to buildings when it comes to how they heat up and cool down.

 

[RJM]

I don’t have AC in my hundred year old house in the Pacific NW.

In summer, we open the windows in the early am to let in cool morning air with window fans. Then close them all as soon as it’s warmer outside than inside, and close the blinds.

With things sealed up, interior fans and ceiling fans the house stays cool most of the day. We don’t open up again until the next morning.

And I imagine this works even better with thick stone walls.

I have been to the Pacific NW during the summer. I found the weather to be even coldish. The highs for the day was in the 60'sF and lows in the 50'sF. Way cooler than Northern Spain can get the same time of year. Also it was the rare albergue I encountered on the Frances that had fans going in the sleeping quarters during hot weather and I think I have only stayed in one private albergue that actually had air conditioning.

 

[LavanyaLea]

If it’s walk through the mountains or skip some (maybe skip all the way to Lugo) but get the last 100k in … thoughts on which you’d pick?

In Lugo, 24th June is festival for San Juan, so expect it to be busy around that time, maybe book ahead for accommodation.

Wishing you speedy recovery!

 

[Sixwheeler]

Experience shows that (*massive generalisation incoming*) Brits like to sleep with windows open whatever the weather and continentals like to sleep with windows closed whatever the weather. Endless fun has been enjoyed in alpine huts over the years by throwing open the windows on arrival and seeing how quickly they get closed again then opening them again.......you get the idea.

 

[DoughnutANZ]

Bummer....
I switched to private rooms for most of my walk, than sat opposite a guy last night, who was sneezing and coughing, claiming it was hayfever. This am, he said, he had felt really unwell last night.
I hope like he'll, he does not have covid, as I can't fly home to NZ if I am positive and changing flight date will set me back $ 2000 dollars.

No pre-departure test needed for Aotearoa New Zealand as of 20th June so unless some intermediate country needs a test no one will know that you are infected until you get home.

 

[DoughnutANZ]

You still need a PCR ago enter NZ?

No

 

[gittiharre]

No

As of next week no test needed to enter NZ.

 

[Former member 95219]

As of next week no test needed to enter NZ.

Great news!

 

[JabbaPapa]

A sensible attitude towards open or closed should come from a majority preference and from weather conditions on the evening.

Nevertheless, when the open position is manifestly the correct one in such circumstance, and yet some busybody wants to impose closed, well, I guess that's one of the few things that covid is good for ...

 

[linkster]

I got tired of the constant opening and closing of the window. It almost turned into a fight a couple of times (not me). The FACT that the open window causes sickness is REAL to some, and there is no reasoning with them. I always tried to secure a bed by the window. I carried a piece of tack cord and usually found a way to tie the window open to something. I did wake during the night several times with a pilgrim wrestling with the window in attempt to close it, but most of the time they just fumbled in the dark and gave up.

 

[trecile]

The FACT that the open window causes sickness is REAL to some

I think that you mean the BELIEF, not fact.

 

[linkster]

I think that you mean the BELIEF, not fact.

Correct ... their belief that it is fact or their truth.

 

[Shazenalan]

Just to add another consideration in the window open/closed at night debate - biting insects love a room with hot tasty pilgrim flesh…... often mine in 2018 & 19

More seriously / cultural customs and personal risk factors will lead to individual preferences. I am dealing with this by staying in private rooms and looking at local conditions so that my sleeping choices don’t irritate or present a covid threat to anyone else.

 

[RJM]

The heat mass of a building is quite different to that of a car. You can expect the building to warm up more slowly inside than the rate of rise of the external ambient temperature, so it will stay cooler longer if the outside temperature is warmer. A car has almost no heat mass by comparison, and will quickly rise to the ambient temperature level.

Keeping windows closed in the absence of cooling (evaporative or air conditioning) will prevent hotter external air circulating during the day on hot days. Only when the external temperature has dropped below the internal temperature will opening windows cool down the inside of the building.

In winter, it is more likely that any open window will result in cooler air coming into the building. Air circulation might then be a concern. Perhaps there are places where the rooms are so small that there is insufficient air circulating, but I don't think that I have ever stayed in any where I felt that was a genuine concern. Then again, COVID 19 has revealed many things about air circulation patterns in buildings and the threats that emerge from designs that don't provide adequate fresh air circulation.

ps tents in the desert are unlikely to have much heat mass either. Cars and tents are not analogous to buildings when it comes to how they heat up and cool down.

Sit in a fully zipped up tent during the day in the middle east for a few hours and then tell me about how much heat mass you experienced.
My original post on here was more concerned about the spreading of the covid-19 virus. The temperature of the room was secondary, and something that is a matter of comfort, not possibly serious health concerns, though even before the pandemic the practice of many people, I suppose in some albergues up to 50-60 all living in the same room together with all the windows and doors closed had its health hazards already just with ailments like the common cold or flu, and I suppose at the extreme side of it Tuberculosis. Yes, if somebody in the room your sharing has it you can catch it. I just figured perhaps that rational thinking may have forced itself into the minds of the archaic thinking because after all the covid-19 caused the deaths of millions, hospitalized millions more, devastating effects on economies which have not as yet recovered, and it is highly contagious and airborne. Not that I expect people to learn their lesson and not repeat damaging behavior. I remember an old saying "a dog won't stick his nose in a fire more than once". Maybe humans can take a lesson from dogs, lol.

 

[RJM]

I got tired of the constant opening and closing of the window. It almost turned into a fight a couple of times (not me). The FACT that the open window causes sickness is REAL to some, and there is no reasoning with them. I always tried to secure a bed by the window. I carried a piece of tack cord and usually found a way to tie the window open to something. I did wake during the night several times with a pilgrim wrestling with the window in attempt to close it, but most of the time they just fumbled in the dark and gave up.

I have argued as well to keep windows, or at least one window open. In one albergue everyone wanted the windows open and one pilgrim did not. We told that pilgrim they were overruled and they got angry and left. I presume went to another albergue. I remember thinking, wow .
I thought maybe there's a belief as well that animals might come in, or perhaps some of them have archaic beliefs that spirits or the like might come in, though they'd never admit it.

 

[gittiharre]

I was grateful to meet a nice Norwegian pilgrim. We have been sharing twin rooms for little more than dorms and the window is open wide! A relief!

 

[Peter Fransiscus]

What can help is ,
I asked sometimes before lights out who want the window open or closed.
The most votes win.
It's simple and it works.

 

[Albertagirl]

My first experience of this perennial disagreement was on my first night, on my first camino, at Orisson. I had somehow acquired a lower bunk, but in a tiny, crowded dorm room, with every bunk bed full. Everyone else in the room was French. After a short sleep, I woke to find the room stifling and all the windows closed. The only way to open one would have been to climb up on someone's bed to reach a window. I gave up and just lay there, wide awake and frustated. Eventually, I went into the toilet adjacent to the room. There was a window in there! I opened it, left the door open, and slept well for the rest of the night.

 

[Mycroft]

I got tired of the constant opening and closing of the window. It almost turned into a fight a couple of times (not me). The FACT that the open window causes sickness is REAL to some, and there is no reasoning with them. I always tried to secure a bed by the window. I carried a piece of tack cord and usually found a way to tie the window open to something. I did wake during the night several times with a pilgrim wrestling with the window in attempt to close it, but most of the time they just fumbled in the dark and gave up.

Perfect! I'm gonna pack some cord!

 

[RJM]

My first experience of this perennial disagreement was on my first night, on my first camino, at Orisson. I had somehow acquired a lower bunk, but in a tiny, crowded dorm room, with every bunk bed full. Everyone else in the room was French. After a short sleep, I woke to find the room stifling and all the windows closed. The only way to open one would have been to climb up on someone's bed to reach a window. I gave up and just lay there, wide awake and frustated. Eventually, I went into the toilet adjacent to the room. There was a window in there! I opened it, left the door open, and slept well for the rest of the night.

Every time I hear accounts of that I just think, that's absolutely whacked. Nuts.
It is one of the trifecta of behavior pet peeves of the Camino I have and a dead horse I shall forever whip, the other two are graffiti/trash (of course) and the bicyclists.

 

[gittiharre]

I’m in Oviedo now in a hotel room w a little kitchenette so I can isolate better. I have until the 28 so i do have time to recover but won’t be able to do the full route (It would be very messy to extend the trip) I guess I just have to see what the next few days bring. The Spain tourism website said 5 days of isolation or until symptoms are totally gone plus 5 days of mask/distance. I’ve already been here 4 days but probably need at least 2 more in place maybe more. I have zero energy. If it’s walk through the mountains or skip some (maybe skip all the way to Lugo) but get the last 100k in … thoughts on which you’d pick? I want so bad to do both but it’s clearly not happening.

It's quite a hard route, but it is a beauty.
Why don't you start from Oviedo in mini stages. It is lovely and it is possible to walk 12 km sections. The last 100 km are pretty awful. First lots of road walking, then heaps of crowds and endless bars from Melide. Not my scene...

 

[Peregrinopaul]

My first experience of this perennial disagreement was on my first night, on my first camino, at Orisson. I had somehow acquired a lower bunk, but in a tiny, crowded dorm room, with every bunk bed full. Everyone else in the room was French. After a short sleep, I woke to find the room stifling and all the windows closed. The only way to open one would have been to climb up on someone's bed to reach a window. I gave up and just lay there, wide awake and frustated. Eventually, I went into the toilet adjacent to the room. There was a window in there! I opened it, left the door open, and slept well for the rest of the night.

Exactly my experience too at Orisson. But I wasn't aware of the toilet solution.

 

[Shazenalan]

On a lighter note… my first dorm experience was in Pamplona. Finding it stuffy and being s Brit I threw open the shutters on a window beside my bunk. I was greeted by a 180 view of the dorm next door with a few quite surprised faces……

 

[RJM]

Any closed albergue windows and doors advocates on this forum? I would love to hear the counter point, why they should be closed at night, especially when it is hot outside and even more especially now in times of a pandemic of global proportions involving a highly contagious virus that is spread airborne.
Just as in the threads bashing graffiti I may hear only crickets in response. If there are advocates they seem to be too timid to counter point.

 

[Former member 92300]

I would think with the current heatwave that Spain is experiencing, irregardless of culture or covid, that open windows would be necessary and appreciated by all.

This varies. I was just in an albergue that kept the windows closed so as not to let the heat in. Later someone opened the windows and it was like a sauna.

 

[RJM]

This varies. I was just in an albergue that kept the windows closed so as not to let the heat in. Later someone opened the windows and it was like a sauna.

"let the heat in" "sauna"? I don't see how that scientifically possible?
What Camino was that? The Camino tropical rainforest?

 

[Former member 92300]

Just completed the Norte to Oviedo and am on the Primitivo. We have usually opened the windows during the day but most if not all get closed at night to keep the room from getting too cold. Some we can leave the windows open a little. The last couple days it was warmer but 1 place advised that opening the windows would let the heat in. Later some pilgrims opened them anyway and it did indeed get too warm. Right now we have 1 window open and the storm is coming so it is getting cold. Window will probably be shut soon. Haven’t come across sick people in the dorms though- at least - not symptomatic. No current reports of anyone getting COVID though I did hear of one positive that already finished the Norte recently.

 

[RJM]

Just completed the Norte to Oviedo and am on the Primitivo. We have usually opened the windows during the day but most if not all get closed at night to keep the room from getting too cold. Some we can leave the windows open a little. The last couple days it was warmer but 1 place advised that opening the windows would let the heat in. Later some pilgrims opened them anyway and it did indeed get too warm. Right now we have 1 window open and the storm is coming so it is getting cold. Window will probably be shut soon. Haven’t come across sick people in the dorms though- at least - not symptomatic. No current reports of anyone getting COVID though I did hear of one positive that already finished the Norte recently.

Wow, that sounds foolish to tempt fate by closing windows and sharing air with others in the midst of a worldwide pandemic.
As they say, you can lead a horse to water but cannot make it drink. Perhaps the metaphor of lemmings following each other over a cliff's edge may apply, too.

 

[Jennifer H]

It's quite a hard route, but it is a beauty.
Why don't you start from Oviedo in mini stages. It is lovely and it is possible to walk 12 km sections. The last 100 km are pretty awful. First lots of road walking, then heaps of crowds and endless bars from Melide. Not my scene...

Thank you! I suspect we share similar perspectives. I started walking today and am feeling great! (Stopped at 20km in Paládin). Pretty confident I can walk to Lugo then bus to Santiago. BTW this is the first place I’ve stayed in Spain with screens on the windows! (I’m in a private room not the dorm, of course, for a few more days per cdc guidance but it looks to be the whole place). Villa Paládino is awesome— great outdoor spaces, pool, hanging wicker chairs over a stream, decent restaurant, ….

 

[dougfitz]

"let the heat in" "sauna"? I don't see how that scientifically possible?
What Camino was that? The Camino tropical rainforest?

It happens because the insides of buildings do not heat up and cool down at the same rate as the external environment. There are also many approaches to building design and construction that can ensure that on warm days, the interior stays cooler for longer, and vice versa. Not everyone here lives in their car or a tent!

 

[gittiharre]

Thank you! I suspect we share similar perspectives. I started walking today and am feeling great! (Stopped at 20km in Paládin). Pretty confident I can walk to Lugo then bus to Santiago. BTW this is the first place I’ve stayed in Spain with screens on the windows! (I’m in a private room not the dorm, of course, for a few more days per cdc guidance but it looks to be the whole place). Villa Paládino is awesome— great outdoor spaces, pool, hanging wicker chairs over a stream, decent restaurant, ….

Perfect!

 

[Tincatinker]

Ty-nant, the Welsh long-house I had the privilege to occupy briefly in its long history, is perhaps an examplar of why windows are opened in the day and closed at night.

Built of double free-stacked slate walls with a mud/river sand in-fill the internal temperature never varied between much more than 50 - 60 degrees Fahrenheit. Even with half an oak stump burning in the walk-in fireplace.

 

[RJM]

It happens because the insides of buildings do not heat up and cool down at the same rate as the external environment. There are also many approaches to building design and construction that can ensure that on warm days, the interior stays cooler for longer, and vice versa. Not everyone here lives in their car or a tent!

Yeah, just don't see it dude. Never experienced that anywhere on the Camino where the opening of windows let in heat into a building already hot and stuffy with the outside temperature and the heat generated by several human bodies. The examples cited in response don't involve buildings where there's a large, barracks style room in which several people are residing together, and sleep only a few feet away from each other.

 

[dougfitz]

Yeah, just don't see it dude. Never experienced that anywhere on the Camino where the opening of windows let in heat into a building already hot and stuffy with the outside temperature and the heat generated by several human bodies. The examples cited in response don't involve buildings where there's a large, barracks style room in which several people are residing together, and sleep only a few feet away from each other.

I think you have stopped listening to reason here, and I am happy to let you keep ranting. Bye.

 

[nycwalking]

Whether - or + degrees I need an open window. Even if only cracked a bit.

Covid only heightens the need.

 

[WGroleau]

My question is for those currently on the Camino or perhaps recently on it, and who stayed in albergues with dormitory type sleeping quarters, even if in a room with a few fellow pilgrims.
Is the practice of shutting all the windows at night still being done, or has rational thinking prevailed in light of the current worldwide pandemic of a highly contagious airborne virus?
I would think that is the worst thing one could do now, shutting the room up at night, or daytime for that matter, with no circulation of fresh air.
I know that type of living contributed to the spread of the plague in medieval times.

If there is a person expelling viruses into the room, an open window is not going to make a big difference. It will improve the odds slightly.

 

[Pilgrim2023]

Even before 2020 I never understood why pilgrims would always shut windows and not let any air circulate, even if it's warm outside.

 

[Former member 92300]

"let the heat in" "sauna"? I don't see how that scientifically possible?
What Camino was that? The Camino tropical rainforest?

Primitivo and yes - the building was cool (stone and brick) until the windows were open and the heat and humidity came in and mixed with bodies felt like a sauna. Don’t have to believe me but that was our experience I. This one albergue a few nights ago. As I said in another post - it is cooling off now and another storm is rolling in.

Wow, that sounds foolish to tempt fate by closing windows and sharing air with others in the midst of a worldwide pandemic.
As they say, you can lead a horse to water but cannot make it drink. Perhaps the metaphor of lemmings following each other over a cliff's edge may apply, too.

quite critical eh? I know all about the pandemic. It is been not only my life, but my work for 2+ years. I am hardly following anyone off a clif. And this horse knows when to drink the water. Those of us on the Norte and Primitivo chose these routes in part due to the lower numbers of pilgrims. Therefore we have significantly lowered our risk compared to the Frances. We spend most of the day outdoors and mostly spread out. Dorm situations have varied widely but for the most part we are still socially distanced. Most albergues are airing the rooms out during the day. But at night? Gotta get some sleep and if it is too cold to keep the windows open? They will get closed. That said - those of us who are still concerned about the virus that we know is still circulating have gotten vaccinated and boosted. Those who aren’t have chosen to take that risk. Also on the Norte and Primitivo - I have yet to see a knowingly sick pilgrim in the albergues. Not one person complaining of any signs of illness. Ot even a runny nose or sore throat. We have not heard of anyone on our stages having tested positive for COVID. So we are able to weigh the risks and are choosing to stay in dorms - and yes - windows get closed many nights. If I was concerned? I could easily move to private rooms. As can the majority of other pilgrims walking my stages. So please quit with the insult. (Written as I sit in a dorm room on a cold rainy day with windows closed and no top bunks are being filled and we are all healthy and 6 or more feet apart. BTW - seems the heat wave has ow ended where I am).

 

[linkster]

This thread is helping me remember the emotion involved with opening and closing a window on the Camino.

 

[domigee]

Experience shows that (*massive generalisation incoming*) Brits like to sleep with windows open whatever the weather and continentals like to sleep with windows closed whatever the weather. Endless fun has been enjoyed in alpine huts over the years by throwing open the windows on arrival and seeing how quickly they get closed again then opening them again.......you get the idea.

Not all continentals!
The fear of people insisting on closing windows in albergues made me choose private accommodation both last year and this year. It was bad enough in ‘normal’ times, but now with Covid…

 

[Shazenalan]

This thread is helping me remember the emotion involved with opening and closing a window on the Camino.

Yes….. and even when NOT on the Camino.

 

[gittiharre]

Primitivo and yes - the building was cool (stone and brick) until the windows were open and the heat and humidity came in and mixed with bodies felt like a sauna. Don’t have to believe me but that was our experience I. This one albergue a few nights ago. As I said in another post - it is cooling off now and another storm is rolling in.

quite critical eh? I know all about the pandemic. It is been not only my life, but my work for 2+ years. I am hardly following anyone off a clif. And this horse knows when to drink the water. Those of us on the Norte and Primitivo chose these routes in part due to the lower numbers of pilgrims. Therefore we have significantly lowered our risk compared to the Frances. We spend most of the day outdoors and mostly spread out. Dorm situations have varied widely but for the most part we are still socially distanced. Most albergues are airing the rooms out during the day. But at night? Gotta get some sleep and if it is too cold to keep the windows open? They will get closed. That said - those of us who are still concerned about the virus that we know is still circulating have gotten vaccinated and boosted. Those who aren’t have chosen to take that risk. Also on the Norte and Primitivo - I have yet to see a knowingly sick pilgrim in the albergues. Not one person complaining of any signs of illness. Ot even a runny nose or sore throat. We have not heard of anyone on our stages having tested positive for COVID. So we are able to weigh the risks and are choosing to stay in dorms - and yes - windows get closed many nights. If I was concerned? I could easily move to private rooms. As can the majority of other pilgrims walking my stages. So please quit with the insult. (Written as I sit in a dorm room on a cold rainy day with windows closed and no top bunks are being filled and we are all healthy and 6 or more feet apart. BTW - seems the heat wave has ow ended where I am).

Well on the Primitivo, I encountered plenty of people obviously sick, coughing etc.
I teamed up with another pilgrim and moved to twin rooms.
I came across 3 pilgrims, I had contact with who tested positive 2 days later. These are only the ones I know of.

 

[Caminamos un otra vez]

My question is for those currently on the Camino or perhaps recently on it, and who stayed in albergues with dormitory type sleeping quarters, even if in a room with a few fellow pilgrims.
Is the practice of shutting all the windows at night still being done, or has rational thinking prevailed in light of the current worldwide pandemic of a highly contagious airborne virus?
I would think that is the worst thing one could do now, shutting the room up at night, or daytime for that matter, with no circulation of fresh air.
I know that type of living contributed to the spread of the plague in medieval times.

The plague was not airborne. It was spread by lice and mites.

 

[RJM]

The plague was not airborne. It was spread by lice and mites.

Would you live in a shuttered up room full of strangers if the plague was about? Didn't think so.

 

[Walkerooni]

No pre-departure test needed for Aotearoa New Zealand as of 20th June so unless some intermediate country needs a test no one will know that you are infected until you get home.

Seriously? Indeed, maybe no one will know. But you'd know you were potentially infecting a plane full of people. Are you saying you’d be OK with that? This is why the pandemic will just keep cycling. Apparently it’s all about me, me, me. No concern for others.

 

[dougfitz]

Seriously? Indeed, maybe no one will know. But you'd know you were potentially infecting a plane full of people. Are you saying you’d be OK with that? This is why the pandemic will just keep cycling. Apparently it’s all about me, me, me. No concern for others.

It's not so much that no-one will know, but where the risk is being managed.

At least Aotearoa New Zealand requires RAT testing (twice) after arrival and provides tests kits for that and requires the results to be reported, even if negative. My own country (Australia) requires testing, but doesn't supply kits nor does it mandate negative reporting. It appears from the travel.gc.ca site that Canada, like many other countries, has abandoned any form of on-arrival testing.

As for the doomsday suggestion that one might infect a whole plane-load of people, I haven't seen any evidence that any infection is likely to spread beyond the immediate vicinity of where someone with COVID is sitting. The gradual removal of mask wearing requirements indicates the risk to others is decreasing further. If this wasn't merely hyperbole, and you have some evidence to justify it, would you share that with us please. I would like to be informed about these risks if they do exist.

 

[C clearly]

Seriously? Indeed, maybe no one will know. But you'd know you were potentially infecting a plane full of people. Are you saying you’d be OK with that? This is why the pandemic will just keep cycling. Apparently it’s all about me, me, me. No concern for others.

There's no need for outrage. @DoughnutANZ noticed that a member was apparently not up-to-date with travel requirements and procedures, and clarified that point with a statement of fact.

 

[RJM]

The original purpose of my starting this thread was my wondering if in times of an airborne worldwide pandemic, were some (not all) albergues still shuttering up all the windows and doors at night in the sleeping quarters. If they were I personally feel that's an unhealthy, perhaps even dangerous thing to do now due to the pandemic and it goes beyond an inconvenience. It becomes a public health matter. I personally would not sleep in an albergue now that was shuttered up and I have to question the sensibilities of anyone who feels it's a safe thing to do.
Bedbug bites heal up, snoring can be blocked by earplugs but sometimes a virus kills you.

 

[Sheesh]

And the last word goes to.... hopefully a moderator to close this thread.; the poor horse has been flogged to death.

 

[RJM]

And the last word goes to.... hopefully a moderator to close this thread.; the poor horse has been flogged to death.

In an earlier comment on this thread I stated the three Camino horse's I will always beat mercilessly after death are littering/graffiti, bicyclists on the walking path and shuttered sleeping quarters at albergue.

 

[Tincatinker]

Well, “flogging a dead horse” was always regarded as a waste of time. That horse wasn’t going to get up and pull that overladen cart another inch.
Futility was perhaps best described by Einstein as “repeating the same experiment in anticipation of a different result”.
Meanwhile I am minded that this horse has run its race. Time to put it to bed.