Albergues to avoid this winter

[Splate]

I'm almost halfway across, and had a great experience overall. But for those on their way, here are two albergues to avoid:
-Municipal/Polideportivo (San Cipriano) in Ayegui. Cold, no kitchen, and hospitaleros were mean (and a bit bigoted toward the Koreans I was traveling with). Then they charge 10euros, and do it simply because they know there are no other albergues in walking distance. Nearby Estella is a nice town and while no albergues open, might be worth getting a few folks together for a pension/hostel.
-Albergue Titas in Boadilla del Camino. It's a scam. They advertise 10Euro (even a flyer on the desk where you check in saying that), but they won't let you stay unless you buy dinner and breakfast from them as well. 23Euro they wanted, even though I'd already eaten. The hospitalero, Jose Gil, was particularly nasty. Much better to stay in Fromista (5km past).

 

[Botaivica]

I'm almost halfway across, and had a great experience overall. But for those on their way, here are two albergues to avoid:
-Municipal/Polideportivo (San Cipriano) in Ayegui. Cold, no kitchen, and hospitaleros were mean (and a bit bigoted toward the Koreans I was traveling with). Then they charge 10euros, and do it simply because they know there are no other albergues in walking distance. Nearby Estella is a nice town and while no albergues open, might be worth getting a few folks together for a pension/hostel.
-Albergue Titas in Boadilla del Camino. It's a scam. They advertise 10Euro (even a flyer on the desk where you check in saying that), but they won't let you stay unless you buy dinner and breakfast from them as well. 23Euro they wanted, even though I'd already eaten. The hospitalero, Jose Gil, was particularly nasty. Much better to stay in Fromista (5km past).

Hi Splate

These posts should be need us who are preparing to Camino. Specifically, what is right and what is wrong in albergues. Criticism can help to make albergues better.

Thanks

Bota

 

[Rebekah Scott]

stop by the Peaceable when you get to Moratinos. The pilgrim room isn't overly warm, but the welcome is.

 

[SYates]

I'm almost halfway across, and had a great experience overall. But for those on their way, here are two albergues to avoid:
-Municipal/Polideportivo (San Cipriano) in Ayegui. Cold, no kitchen, and hospitaleros were mean (and a bit bigoted toward the Koreans I was traveling with). Then they charge 10euros, and do it simply because they know there are no other albergues in walking distance. Nearby Estella is a nice town and while no albergues open, might be worth getting a few folks together for a pension/hostel.
...

Stayed there end October 2014 and had a lovely experience. Warm, very well equipped kitchen, friendly hospitalero. Experiences are different for different pilgrims and albergue situations can change very quickly. Buen Camino, SY

 

[purplesage]

I'm almost halfway across, and had a great experience overall. But for those on their way, here are two albergues to avoid:
-Municipal/Polideportivo (San Cipriano) in Ayegui. Cold, no kitchen, and hospitaleros were mean (and a bit bigoted toward the Koreans I was traveling with). Then they charge 10euros, and do it simply because they know there are no other albergues in walking distance. Nearby Estella is a nice town and while no albergues open, might be worth getting a few folks together for a pension/hostel.
-Albergue Titas in Boadilla del Camino. It's a scam. They advertise 10Euro (even a flyer on the desk where you check in saying that), but they won't let you stay unless you buy dinner and breakfast from them as well. 23Euro they wanted, even though I'd already eaten. The hospitalero, Jose Gil, was particularly nasty. Much better to stay in Fromista (5km past).

@Splate... Fromista is a great place. Lovely church just outside the albergue. One is a museum.. had to be "de-santified" so the people could have a museum there. All part of the process.. Buen Camino

 

[MichaelSG]

I'm almost halfway across, and had a great experience overall. But for those on their way, here are two albergues to avoid:
-Municipal/Polideportivo (San Cipriano) in Ayegui. Cold, no kitchen, and hospitaleros were mean (and a bit bigoted toward the Koreans I was traveling with). Then they charge 10euros, and do it simply because they know there are no other albergues in walking distance. Nearby Estella is a nice town and while no albergues open, might be worth getting a few folks together for a pension/hostel.
-Albergue Titas in Boadilla del Camino. It's a scam. They advertise 10Euro (even a flyer on the desk where you check in saying that), but they won't let you stay unless you buy dinner and breakfast from them as well. 23Euro they wanted, even though I'd already eaten. The hospitalero, Jose Gil, was particularly nasty. Much better to stay in Fromista (5km past).

You had a bad experience at two albergues and I agree with your solution but maybe we can do more. Let's not just boycott these albergues and take these people's livelihoods away from them but I think we should burn them at the stake as well. We really need to teach these people that they must meet your expectations - or else. Or not.

p.s. - I'm cool with honest negative reviews of any business but really, do you really want to put them out of business? I kind of doubt that they are really millionaire doctors who happen to have a hobby of running an albergue. They need to eat too, no?

 

[Botaivica]

You had a bad experience at two albergues and I agree with your solution but maybe we can do more. Let's not just boycott these albergues and take these people's livelihoods away from them but I think we should burn them at the stake as well. We really need to teach these people that they must meet your expectations - or else. Or not.

p.s. - I'm cool with honest negative reviews of any business but really, do you really want to put them out of business? I kind of doubt that they are really millionaire doctors who happen to have a hobby of running an albergue. They need to eat too, no?

Hi MichaelSG

I do not understand, why do not write bad experience here? The most links with a list of albergues have a lot of criticism, way not in this Forum too?

They need to eat too, OK, but for my money they must give me what I want. If I just want to sleep and they blackmail me for dinner and breakfast, what I'm not going to take, why do not tell the other pilgrims?

Criticism of them does not have to move away from business, if they are smart they will fix what bothers us and will have something to eat.


Bota

 

[ranthr]

I wonder whether we as peregrinos/walkers/tourists or whatever we are, sometimes expect too much for what we want to pay. The number of pilgrims are exstremely high nowadays which gives the opportunity for more private businesses. The camino has changed a lot since I did my first in 2005. In small pueblos we were happy if there was an albergue that had an eveningmeal to offer. The price was about the same as in 2015 , 9-12 euros for cena and 3 euros for breakfast. A bed cost 3-5 in municipal albergues and some more in private ones. A few were as now donativo. Those who found the albergues too primitive moved to private albergues and hostels.

During winter only a few albergues are open and even if I am the only host who keeps my albergue open for the few peregrinos that might drop in, my staying alive as a business might depend upon selling an eveningmeal as well.
Where else do you get a bed, dinner and breakfast for 23€? It is still a very cheap way of spending a holiday.
Sorry about being a bit mean!

 

[C clearly]

for my money they must give me what I want.

Amazing.

 

[SabsP]

A tourist demands. A pilgrim asks.

 

[Bernice M]

Hear, hear regarding Bar/Albergue Titas in Boadilla del Camino. I was there at the end of October 2015. The wife was very nice, but she departed and the husband was surly to the point of extreme rudeness. I wanted dinner (which turned out to be not the menu advertised, and frankly I was tiring of tortilla), breakfast (one square of nasty white bread, one cup of coffee reheated from the night before, one butter sachet, one jam sachet, one 200ml bottle of fruit juice), all topped by extraordinary rudeness. Cost of bed, dinner, breakfast was 23 Euro. I also had purchased two beers and paid for a load of laundry. After breakfast as I checked around my bunk to see that I had packed everything, I saw a bedbug crawling across my pillow. Got another pilgrim to confirm, yes, it was a bedbug. I went downstairs and told the surly man. He came up to inspect at my insistence, but the bedbug was gone, although the other pilgrim confirmed what it was. The proprietor then said it was my fault, as they cover their mattresses with plastic, as if that's the only protection needed. Yes, he may have been right, but attributing fault in these instances is a bit pointless. I was telling him so that he could take appropriate measures. The place provides bedding - sheets, pillowcases and a single blanket, but it was cold at night and the heating was off, so I wore compression tights, socks, and my down jacket. It cost me about 25 Euro to buy spray (with permethrin and malathion), and do hot washes for all my stuff. The place was otherwise very clean. This guy was the nastiest I met in over 11 weeks on the camino.
A few days later I met a bunch of people who had also stayed at Titas, and they reported the same surly rudeness. He had been recommended by the albergue owner of E Ultreia in Castrojeriz the previous night, who had phoned and booked me in. I'm sure that they would have been horrified that their recommendation was so inferior.

 

[KinkyOne]

A tourist demands. A pilgrim asks.

True. If you ask and you're given (= you get something like for free) you really can't complain an should show gratitude
But if there's something advertised and on sale that means business for someone. Yes, I agree that Pedro, Maria or Pablo have to eat but John, Janez and Giuseppe have to eat also. And if I pay for something advertised I'll raise all hell when not getting it, being pilgrim or called anything else!

Back to OP, which I'm certain just wished to warn future "walkers" of his bad experiences. Which we saw (or experienced) plenty all over our Caminos and other destinations. I don't know what's wrong with that??? And as someone already mentioned there were many similar posts and also almost the same experience in the same place. I see nothing wrong at all in this OP.

Ultreia!

 

[KinkyOne]

Oh, if I may add - if flyer advertise XX€ for overnight stay and later the owner demands you also have to pay for dinner and breakfast, well, that's misleading and criminal act in EU!!!

 

[C clearly]

I agree that misleading advertising is a valid reason for giving a negative review. And I am happy that people post negative reviews when justified. But expectations should be appropriate for the price and circumstances.

 

[MichaelSG]

Hi MichaelSG

I do not understand, why do not write bad experience here?

You didn't really read my whole post, did you?

I'll repeat myself for clarity. Giving honest negative reviews is fine. Advising people of potential bad experiences is fine. Asking pilgrim to boycott particular albergues because they did something that offends you is not fine. Clear?

23€ for a bed, shower, laundry facilities and dinner sounds like a pretty good deal to many pilgrims. It may not be fair advertising but it's not blackmail either, when you can walk away. 10€ for a bed, shower and laundry facilities is also a good deal, even if you (or the OP) think that it is not. Finally, some of the surliest hospitaleros made for my best and most memorable experiences on my first Camino. Once I convinced them that I wasn't one of the ingrates, they warmed up right away.

 

[Sailor]

Thank you Mister Splate for your post.
Thank you Miss Bernice for your post.
Que la luz de Dios alumbre su camino.

 

[CaminoDebrita]

Hear, hear regarding Bar/Albergue Titas in Boadilla del Camino. I was there at the end of October 2015. The wife was very nice, but she departed and the husband was surly to the point of extreme rudeness. I wanted dinner (which turned out to be not the menu advertised, and frankly I was tiring of tortilla), breakfast (one square of nasty white bread, one cup of coffee reheated from the night before, one butter sachet, one jam sachet, one 200ml bottle of fruit juice), all topped by extraordinary rudeness. Cost of bed, dinner, breakfast was 23 Euro. I also had purchased two beers and paid for a load of laundry. After breakfast as I checked around my bunk to see that I had packed everything, I saw a bedbug crawling across my pillow. Got another pilgrim to confirm, yes, it was a bedbug. I went downstairs and told the surly man. He came up to inspect at my insistence, but the bedbug was gone, although the other pilgrim confirmed what it was. The proprietor then said it was my fault, as they cover their mattresses with plastic, as if that's the only protection needed. Yes, he may have been right, but attributing fault in these instances is a bit pointless. I was telling him so that he could take appropriate measures. The place provides bedding - sheets, pillowcases and a single blanket, but it was cold at night and the heating was off, so I wore compression tights, socks, and my down jacket. It cost me about 25 Euro to buy spray (with permethrin and malathion), and do hot washes for all my stuff. The place was otherwise very clean. This guy was the nastiest I met in over 11 weeks on the camino.
A few days later I met a bunch of people who had also stayed at Titas, and they reported the same surly rudeness. He had been recommended by the albergue owner of E Ultreia in Castrojeriz the previous night, who had phoned and booked me in. I'm sure that they would have been horrified that their recommendation was so inferior.

Sadly, there were issues when I stayed there as well. I did not have an issue myself; I was trying to understand why the proprietor was so oddly cold and uncommunicative, and decided to eat there and try to be my friendliest pilgrim self. It was clean and very comfortable as far as I was concerned, but the hospitalero upset two pilgrims while I was there. They spoke with me about it, and I agreed that the gentleman came across oddly. A few days after I was there, a friend stayed there and had some less than positive comments.

He woke us up with loud music, and played with his i pad (which made loud beeping noises) through the night while at the desk, directly below sleeping quarters.

 

[CaminoDebrita]

Amazing.

It's just a second language phrase, I think.

 

[MichaelSG]

It's just a second language phrase, I think.

I bet it sounds just as bad in Croatian.

 

[C clearly]

It's just a second language phrase, I think.

Maybe. I did consider this and I restrained my response!

 

[CaminoDebrita]

I bet it sounds just as bad in Croatian.

*giggling*

 

[Saint Mike II]

stop by the Peaceable when you get to Moratinos. The pilgrim room isn't overly warm, but the welcome is.

Hi Rebekah & Paddy - I found the room very comfortable and the food fantastic. Cheers (Oh PS have just started reading the Moorish Whore - so far great!!)

 

[Saint Mike II]

I'm almost halfway across, and had a great experience overall. But for those on their way, here are two albergues to avoid:
-Municipal/Polideportivo (San Cipriano) in Ayegui. Cold, no kitchen, and hospitaleros were mean ... They advertise 10Euro (even a flyer on the desk where you check in saying that), but they won't let you stay unless you buy dinner and breakfast from them as well. 23Euro they wanted, even though I'd already eaten. The hospitalero, Jose Gil, was particularly nasty. ... .

Hola Splate - yes you are perfectly entitled to state an opinion about the conditions as you found them "at this time of the year". A couple of questions - did you voice your concerns to either of the hositaleros?; was there a comments book where you could write these comments?
Another question - were either of the hospitaleros there on a full time basis or just there during the winter months? If they are full time then the senior management needs to know - the one in Estella is a municipal operated and I would think the city councilors would want to know about your " problems". Unfortunately the Titas is privately operated so maybe you were dealing with the owner, in which case the post here could come back to bite in the season. Cheers

 

[Botaivica]

Amazing.

A tourist demands. A pilgrim asks.

Hi SabineP and C clearly

look, private albergue work for what, may beautiful eyes or for money?
How I see, 90% albergue is private and they work for money not for Caritas or Red Cross. I see that open new albergue in places where it already exist.
It just means that business is going well. For owners it's just business, a business that makes profit.
Look the prices, private albergue is almost always expensive then
municipal or religious. Why?
For me it is not important only a price, also is important kind mode and approach. Why allow someone to blackmailing me for dinner and breakfast?
Pilgrims a consumers and we pay for their service. When we are not satisfied, we move on.

And write in the Forum


Bota

 

[Botaivica]

I'll repeat myself for clarity. Giving honest negative reviews is fine. Advising people of potential bad experiences is fine. Asking pilgrim to boycott particular albergues because they did something that offends you is not fine. Clear?

Clear

23€ for a bed, shower, laundry facilities and dinner sounds like a pretty good deal to many pilgrims. It may not be fair advertising but it's not blackmail either, when you can walk away. 10€ for a bed, shower and laundry facilities is also a good deal, even if you (or the OP) think that it is not. Finally, some of the surliest hospitaleros made for my best and most memorable experiences on my first Camino. Once I convinced them that I wasn't one of the ingrates, they warmed up right away.

Clear too

You didn't really read my whole post, did you?

Post is OK, but p.s. a little less

Bota

 

[dougfitz]

Hi SabineP and C clearly

look, private albergue work for what, may beautiful eyes or for money?
How I see, 90% albergue is private and they work for money not for Caritas or Red Cross. I see that open new albergue in places where it already exist.
It just means that business is going well. For owners it's just business, a business that makes profit.
Look the prices, private albergue is almost always expensive then
municipal or religious. Why?
For me it is not important only a price, also is important kind mode and approach. Why allow someone to blackmailing me for dinner and breakfast?
Pilgrims a consumers and we pay for their service. When we are not satisfied, we move on.

And write in the Forum

Let me make two points. The first is that analysing the way the camino works using simplistic one-dimensional accounting principles doesn't work. It appears to me that many private albergues are not run purely on a profit motive, and the owner's have different motivations to remain open to provide a service to pilgrims. Suggesting everything on the Camino can be understood as if it were driven by classic rationalist economic principles may not be a particularly helpful way of understanding why things are the way they are.

The second is that we should pay more than just lip-service to the principles of natural justice, and if we have had an unpleasant stay and want to do something about it, then is needs to be taken up with the albergue management, not aired as gossip on this forum. It is impossible for us to get a fair perspective on whether the reports made by an individual represent a systemic problem, or a transient one that will be resolved, and it is certainly not within the power of anyone here to address the problem.

 

[MichaelSG]

... And if I pay for something advertised I'll raise all hell when not getting it...

That's the pilgrim spirit!!

Back to OP, which I'm certain just wished to warn future "walkers" of his bad experiences.

If that is what he meant, why didn't he say that? I'm pretty sure he said to avoid the albergues twice.

Which we saw (or experienced) plenty all over our Caminos and other destinations. I don't know what's wrong with that???

Nothing is wrong with that... which is exactly what I said in my first post on the subject. If only the OP had said what you thought and I said....

 

[Sailor]

Thank you Mister Splate for your post.
Thank you Miss Bernice for your post.

Additional thanks.
Thank you Miss Debra for your post, y que la luz de Dios alumbre su camino.

 

[Botaivica]

If we have list of favorite albergues

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/resources/a-selection-of-favorite-albergues-on-the-camino-francés.140/updates

why we do not have a list with non favorite albergues?

 

[C clearly]

If we have list of favorite albergues
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/resources/a-selection-of-favorite-albergues-on-the-camino-francés.140/updates
why we do not have a list with non favorite albergues?

In fact, we have had threads on both. The contradictory reports on different albergues soon make it very obvious that what one person loves, another hates. So, they cancel each other out, but create disharmony in the meantime. I am quite a blunt person and do not follow the dictum "If you can't say something good, then don't say anything." However, I do believe that a thread on non-favourite albergues could be unpleasant.

 

[CaminoDebrita]

In fact, we have had threads on both. The contradictory reports on different albergues soon make it very obvious that what one person loves, another hates. So, they cancel each other out, but create disharmony in the meantime. I am quite a blunt person and do not follow the dictum "If you can't say something good, then don't say anything." However, I do believe that a thread on non-favourite albergues could be unpleasant.

I agree. And as so many others have said, an unpleasant experience on Monday could be a pleasant experience on Tuesday. One experience does not equal all experiences, and I think most are intelligent enough to understand that.

I wish you all well. Let's all try to understand that Spain doesn't owe us a thing. If it's a good experience, be grateful. If it's mediocre, grateful. Did I get shelter? grateful. Was it unpleasant? walk on, and be grateful you have legs to carry you.

 

[mspath]

When weary after walking for 6 hours while carrying a pack all I ask for resting is a simple shelter with preferably a lower bunk, working toilet, hot shower, and when possible pleasant companions and something to eat. Is anything else really necessary? Luxury is heat in winter as well as an electric socket to charge the phone. Nothing more.

 

[dougfitz]

If we have list of favorite albergues

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/resources/a-selection-of-favorite-albergues-on-the-camino-francés.140/updates

why we do not have a list with non favorite albergues?

I think that this is a good question. My immediate response when I saw it is that the benefits and harms associated with promoting something as good and suggesting something is bad are not symmetrical.

This could be explained like this. The damage that could be done by an unjustified report of an unsatisfactory experience of any kind is far more significant than the damage that might be caused by an unjustified report of an allegedly satisfactory experience. First, it appears to be a fairly natural human behaviour to share our dissatisfaction with a good or service than the alternative. This post illustrates the issue - the OP had completed nearly half his camino, and presumably has stayed in 15 or so albergues and other accommodation, yet has only reported on two places as being unsatisfactory. We might assume that he found the remainder to be satisfactory. Clearly that is a quite asymmetrical reporting pattern, and I am suggesting it would not be unusual.

Second, the consequences of an unjustified report are quite different. For an unjustified positive report, a pilgrim might spend a small amount extra on a particular night at an albergue that is not as good as it has been pumped up to be. Where pilgrims avoid staying at an albergue because of an unjustified negative report, the albergue has lost all the revenue that would have been generated.

Taken together - the likelihood of reporting an unsatisfactory experience and with it the rise in potentially unjustified reports, and the differences in the scale of the damage that might result for an unjustified report - this results in a significant asymmetry in the harms that might be done.

For me that implies that any reporting of an unsatisfactory experience should attract a higher standard of care in making that report. For example, already in this thread there are hearsay reports of incidents that were not the direct experience of the interlocutor. It is impossible for us to directly question the person who might have originally suggested they had a bad experience to test the what, why and wherefore of that report. That is not fair if there is the possibility of having a detrimental effect on someone's livelihood.

 

[C clearly]

Brilliant, @dougfitz - a pleasure to read. (Your previous response, too.)

 

[Rebekah Scott]

There's a consumer rights office in every Spanish province. When a business does not meet your expectation, especially if they are apparently dishonest, simply tell the proprietor you want a "hoja de reclamaciones," they are required to provide them. The hoja is an official complaint form you fill in, hand the guy his copy, keep one yourself, and send the other bit to the municipal address on the form. Supposedly the county officials will pay the guy a visit, especially if enough people complain, and evidence is produced, i.e. your reciept alongside the flyer that advertised another price, etc.
Some businessmen straighten right up when you ask for the hoja. Others don't give a good damn. But there is a system in place for this.

 

[Albertagirl]

To those who agree with one another on the damage that may be done with unfavourable reviews of albergues, I should like to express my own experience on my recent camino. I never wrote a review, favourable or otherwise, although I had some wonderful experiences, especially with the many amazing parochial albergues on the camino. But I read and paid attention to reviews, both favourable and critical. This is how I was directed by experienced pilgrims to the spirit of the parochial albergues. I made a point of being generous when I was able to stay at those that were donativo. And this is how I was directed away from those couple of albergues which were described in ways that seemed that they might be dangerous to a woman travelling alone. In addition, I made a continuing effort to avoid any albergues that were described in this forum as infested with bedbugs and not dealing systematically or successfully with outbreaks. I met many pilgrims who had experienced bedbug outbreaks once or more, but there was never an active outbreak in any albergue in which I stayed. In one albergue, there had been an outbreak and I could see that pilgrims who stayed there with me shortly afterwards were not co-operating in the efforts of the hospitaleros to avoid further problems. So I acknowledge that it is very difficult to avoid outbreaks, which may sometimes be attributed to the carelessness of pilgrims. But I did not stay in albergues with a current reputation of carelessness about outbreaks. It was part of ultimately successful attempt to avoid bedbugs, particularly to avoid bringing them home. To summarize, I avoided the couple of places which might be dangerous to single women and the many albergues where forum members commented unfavourably on responses to bedbugs. I enjoyed my camino and never was afraid for my safety nor did I encounter bedbugs. In both these issues, I relied on the comments of other forum members, and I would do so if I went on camino again, rather than risk my safety or a greater risk in carrying bedbugs home with me.

 

[CaminoDebrita]

To those who agree with one another on the damage that may be done with unfavourable reviews of albergues, I should like to express my own experience on my recent camino. I never wrote a review, favourable or otherwise, although I had some wonderful experiences, especially with the many amazing parochial albergues on the camino. But I read and paid attention to reviews, both favourable and critical. This is how I was directed by experienced pilgrims to the spirit of the parochial albergues. I made a point of being generous when I was able to stay at those that were donativo. And this is how I was directed away from those couple of albergues which were described in ways that seemed that they might be dangerous to a woman travelling alone. In addition, I made a continuing effort to avoid any albergues that were described in this forum as infested with bedbugs and not dealing systematically or successfully with outbreaks. I met many pilgrims who had experienced bedbug outbreaks once or more, but there was never an active outbreak in any albergue in which I stayed. In one albergue, there had been an outbreak and I could see that pilgrims who stayed there with me shortly afterwards were not co-operating in the efforts of the hospitaleros to avoid further problems. So I acknowledge that it is very difficult to avoid outbreaks, which may sometimes be attributed to the carelessness of pilgrims. But I did not stay in albergues with a current reputation of carelessness about outbreaks. It was part of ultimately successful attempt to avoid bedbugs, particularly to avoid bringing them home. To summarize, I avoided the couple of places which might be dangerous to single women and the many albergues where forum members commented unfavourably on responses to bedbugs. I enjoyed my camino and never was afraid for my safety nor did I encounter bedbugs. In both these issues, I relied on the comments of other forum members, and I would do so if I went on camino again, rather than risk my safety or a greater risk in carrying bedbugs home with me.

Hey, bedbugs have to eat too!

(just kidding, of course)

 

[Dutch]

I wonder, does nobody here ever surf to, say, tripadvisor and read the reviews of xyz hotel? Or do you just look at the positive ones?

Does nodody here ever read reviews of restaurant critics? Or movie reviews? Or also, just the good ones? Does nobody here ever have a bad opinion about anything?

What is so wrong with giving a bad review of an albergue?? Why not? Because its an albergue? And maybe they mean well? Not very realistic now is it?

With the way some praise certain albergues straight into heaven, its not so bad that now and than a different sound pops up, because really, thats just the way it works and if you think someone can start a business in the hospitality sector and not get bad reviews, especially in this day and age, think again.

 

[MichaelSG]

What is so wrong with giving a bad review of an albergue??

Nothing is wrong with an honest, negative review. Why would you think otherwise?

BTW, an honest negative review sounds more like:

An albergue with an unusual rule to be aware of:
I'm almost halfway across, and had a great experience overall. But for those on their way, here is information that you should consider if you plan on staying in Boadilla def Camino:
-Albergue Titas in Boadilla del Camino. A bed there is 10€, which is more than municipal albergues but normal for private ones like this. Be aware, however, that the hospitalero insists that in order to stay there, you must also pay for the 10€ pilgrim dinner and 3€ breakfast. There aren't any other restaurants in town but if you don't eat the evening or morning meal or if you carry your own food, this turns out to be an expensive place to stay. The hospitalero, Jose Gil, was particularly nasty when I demanded my right to refuse the meals and stay there anyway. Feel free to keep walking like I did to the next closest albergue which is in Fromista (5km past).

 

[Dutch]

Oh i'm sorry, i didnt know there were rules on how to write a good or bad review.


And why would i think otherwise? Maybe you should read this thread again.

 

[MichaelSG]

I'm not sure what you were reading, Dutch, no one said anything about rules or not writing honest negative reviews but if you can't tell the difference, then I can't help you.

Buen Camino.

 

[Kathar1na]

One of the establishments discussed here is funded and run by a local authority and the other one is newly built and you don't need a credencial to stay there; there is an article and interview on the web where the owners say how much money they invested to build their inn plus bar plus annexes - wow, Northern European price range. Does it happen often along the camino that one is requested - or pressured - to take breakfast and one meal in addition to the bed or room? I had the impression that it was rather unusual in this part of Spain?

 

[Dutch]

 

[Dutch]

I cant remember one albergue where you must take breakfast and or diner with a nights stay. Anywhere.

 

[wayfarer]

I cant remember one albergue where you must take breakfast and or diner with a nights stay. Anywhere.

The Virgin of Guadalupe in Cireuna. €10 per night, €7 for dinner and €3 for breakfast. If you did not want dinner or breakfast it was still €20, the place was damp and cold with one working lukewarm shower for everyone, this was in 2012 and I found it to be the only bad experience I had with albergues, I posted about it here the day after I stayed and was roundly criticized for doing so by some but supported by many others who felt that negative reports were important too.
For me this is no different than reporting bedbugs and if many albergues can provide good facilities for what they charge then why not highlight the ones who don't to our members here, after all you would warn a family member if something was not right and are we not all family here.

 

[Dutch]

@wayfarer in my eyes you could not be more right.

Strangely enough, even people reporting bedbugs can get critizised here, because the hospitalero is so nice or the albergue has been around for 30 years or 3 months ago there were no bedbugs or maybe it was your fault or.....ect ect....I just dont get that.

Some people are way to protective of 'the camino'.
Relax, i say, the camino will survive, with or without your protection.

 

[Devon Mike]

Albergue Titas in Boadilla del Camino. A bed there is 10€, which is more than municipal albergues but normal for private ones like this. Be aware, however, that the hospitalero insists that in order to stay there, you must also pay for the 10€ pilgrim dinner and 3€ breakfast. There aren't any other restaurants in town but if you don't eat the evening or morning meal or if you carry your own food, this turns out to be an expensive place to stay. The hospitalero, Jose Gil, was particularly nasty when I demanded my right to refuse the meals and stay there anyway. Feel free to keep walking like I did to the next closest albergue which is in Fromista (5km past).

I stayed at the Municipal Albergue in Boadilla del Camino back in 2014, but had dinner and breakfast at Albergue Titas as it was the best option. The food was fine and the price perfectly acceptable. Service was OK too.

This year I may stay at the Albergue Titas and take dinner and breakfast there, as 23 euros all in is not bad.

 

[Kanga]

I think that one of the differences between this forum and, for example, TripAdvisor, is that criticised establishments do not know they are being criticised and have no right of reply.

One thing that we must be careful about is defamation. Because this is on the internet it is "published" in many jurisdictions. I do not know the laws of other countries but I can tell you that in Australia criticising a person (for example implying dishonesty) on this forum would make both the poster and those who manage this forum liable to be sued. It is Ok to criticise a business or a product, but not an individual.

There are defences to defamation but who wants to go to court?

 

[Deleted member 3000]

In winter my advice is to take what is offered and save your ire for spring. I have had second coffee three times at my destination. Nothing is open!! (Almost)

 

[CaminoDebrita]

Look, let's tuck this one in and move on to discussing weather. I think Kanga summed up one issue, and everyone else represented the issue very adequately.

 

[Botaivica]

I think that one of the differences between this forum and, for example, TripAdvisor, is that criticised establishments do not know they are being criticised and have no right of reply.

One thing that we must be careful about is defamation. Because this is on the internet it is "published" in many jurisdictions. I do not know the laws of other countries but I can tell you that in Australia criticising a person (for example implying dishonesty) on this forum would make both the poster and those who manage this forum liable to be sued. It is Ok to criticise a business or a product, but not an individual.

There are defences to defamation but who wants to go to court?

Hi Kanga

we criticizes the albergus and what is the situation in it, not individual.

Here is the link on EROSKI CONSUMER on that albergues.

http://caminodesantiago.consumer.es/albergue-titas


I read four pages of comments (google translator), it's 12 comments and 11 is negative. Including one that also speaks of blackmail with breakfast and dinner. The comments were written by Spaniards, locals people, not somebody who does not speak Spanish.

If they can write reviews, why we not be able to?

Bota

 

[MichaelSG]

Bota, Dutch, anyone else.... I am still looking for the first post that says that we can not post honest negative reviews about albergues. Please, please, please point to one of them! My eyesight may not be great but I've enlarged the print enough that I have been able to read all of the posts. Kanga gives a reason for not criticising a hospitalero personally like calling him a blackmailer (which really, really does not fit this situation) and asks us not to but she also says "it's okay to criticise a business or a product".

If it helps you at all, I disagree with her about not giving honest negative of hospitaleros but that's not a fight I'll get into.

 

[Botaivica]

I think that this is a good question. My immediate response when I saw it is that the benefits and harms associated with promoting something as good and suggesting something is bad are not symmetrical.

This could be explained like this. The damage that could be done by an unjustified report of an unsatisfactory experience of any kind is far more significant than the damage that might be caused by an unjustified report of an allegedly satisfactory experience. First, it appears to be a fairly natural human behaviour to share our dissatisfaction with a good or service than the alternative. This post illustrates the issue - the OP had completed nearly half his camino, and presumably has stayed in 15 or so albergues and other accommodation, yet has only reported on two places as being unsatisfactory. We might assume that he found the remainder to be satisfactory. Clearly that is a quite asymmetrical reporting pattern, and I am suggesting it would not be unusual.

Second, the consequences of an unjustified report are quite different. For an unjustified positive report, a pilgrim might spend a small amount extra on a particular night at an albergue that is not as good as it has been pumped up to be. Where pilgrims avoid staying at an albergue because of an unjustified negative report, the albergue has lost all the revenue that would have been generated.

Taken together - the likelihood of reporting an unsatisfactory experience and with it the rise in potentially unjustified reports, and the differences in the scale of the damage that might result for an unjustified report - this results in a significant asymmetry in the harms that might be done.

For me that implies that any reporting of an unsatisfactory experience should attract a higher standard of care in making that report. For example, already in this thread there are hearsay reports of incidents that were not the direct experience of the interlocutor. It is impossible for us to directly question the person who might have originally suggested they had a bad experience to test the what, why and wherefore of that report. That is not fair if there is the possibility of having a detrimental effect on someone's livelihood.

Hi dougfitz

you see, many times in life we have situation that we say or do not say something what is true. For example; tell a woman that is too salty lunch, a colleague at work that doing something wrong, a friend that his wife is cheating .........

All of these are truths, but we are in a dilemma, say or not to say.

My opinion is that we should tell the truth, not only for them but
for ourselves. Perhaps a woman be angry, colleagues blame me and friend take leave, maybe. But I feel okay, because I told the truth. And the truth sometimes hurts.

Equally on this topic, why not tell the truth even if they hurts.

Bota

 

[C clearly]

Equally on this topic, why not tell the truth even if they hurts.

I agree that negative reviews should be welcome on this forum and hopefully will have constructive effects in improving the camino. I too thank people for reviews, both positive and negative. However, for the various reasons that have been mentioned, I think it is "good" to take a little extra care in providing a balanced and fair review when you are posting a particularly negative review. Truth may be a virtue, but it is not the only virtue to be considered when you are in a dilemma such as the salty soup.

Not sure who is ridiculing whom here.

OK, the weather is not bad so I'm going out for a walk.

 

[Margaret Butterworth]

Ivar's app, Camino Places, is a good tool for reviews both "thumbs up" and "thumbs down".

 

[Camino Yogini]

stop by the Peaceable when you get to Moratinos. The pilgrim room isn't overly warm, but the welcome is.

How do you get to the Peaceable Kingdom, Rebekah? When I was in Moratinos back in 2014, I wanted to stay there but couldn't find it. Ended up walking on to Sahagun.

 

[ivar]

Closing this thread so that we can move on to other Camino related topics. Some posts has been removed.