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Alternative to Modern-Day Backpack?

Walk On

New Member
Time of past OR future Camino
CF (2017)
Future: 2019
Hello all,


Has anyone who has walked a Camino used an alternative to a modern-day backpack?


I am in the preparation stages of walking the CF in early spring 2017. I am experimenting with alternatives to a backpack: specifically rolling my sleeping bag length-wise into a long roll, then looping it into a horseshoe shape. I then loop the horseshoe over my shoulder and tie the two ends together. My extra clothes would be placed within the sleeping bag before rolling it into shape.


I will use a small side pack (carried on the opposite side) to carry small items such as toiletries and meds.


The efficiencies of using a modern-day backpack are more practical, I know. But I would like to consider a nod back to the ‘old days’.


Thank you, in advance, for any thoughts or input---they would be greatly appreciated.
 
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It might work but it's a long trip. Being kind to myself and protecting my feet and body are more important to me than a nod to the past. It's hard for me to feel spiritual when enveloped in pain. That's just my opinion of course, and I wish you the best however you choose to travel.
 
Hi Walk On! Welcome to the forum!

Pilgrims used a zurrón or a morral (sorry, I don't know how to translate this terms to English) or, if they went with animals (horse, donkey...), saddlebags... Just some tips.
 
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... Pilgrims used a zurrón or a morral (sorry, I don't know how to translate this terms to English)....

Satchel, haversack or (bread) bag ;-)

The main problem I see with this approach is how you will keep your sleeping bag dry when it rain ;-) Buen Camino, SY
 
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Hello all,


Has anyone who has walked a Camino used an alternative to a modern-day backpack?


I am in the preparation stages of walking the CF in early spring 2017. I am experimenting with alternatives to a backpack: specifically rolling my sleeping bag length-wise into a long roll, then looping it into a horseshoe shape. I then loop the horseshoe over my shoulder and tie the two ends together. My extra clothes would be placed within the sleeping bag before rolling it into shape.


I will use a small side pack (carried on the opposite side) to carry small items such as toiletries and meds.


The efficiencies of using a modern-day backpack are more practical, I know. But I would like to consider a nod back to the ‘old days’.


Thank you, in advance, for any thoughts or input---they would be greatly appreciated.
Interesting... nice in Winter, hot any other time
 
Has anyone who has walked a Camino used an alternative to a modern-day backpack? (...)

The efficiencies of using a modern-day backpack are more practical, I know. But I would like to consider a nod back to the ‘old days’.
.

How far back to the 'old days'? This pilgrim wore 14th century attire, no spare clothes or sleeping bag ... Probably no toiletries either ;)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35108393
 
No, but I was curious so I just googled it. I already kinda knew what it was from old movies and television shows and vintage photos I'd seen before.
The guy in the photo looks like one tired and miserable soldier.
And it looks like a scratchy wool blanket, rather than a modern fabric sleeping bag. Also he seems to have a little backpack as well.

I would like to consider a nod back to the ‘old days’.
There's quite a range of "old days" to pick from. As @domigee asked, what period do you want to evoke?
 
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Another issue to consider is the sleeping bag's all day's exposure to the elements as well as to your body. It will have dirt and dust on it, as well as sweat from your body. No big deal if you are camping outdoors (Such as the fellow in the photo with the wool blanket. I'm sure he slept on the ground every night.), but when sleeping in albergues it could be problematic putting a dirty sleeping bag on the bunk. A dirty sleeping bag would be as bad as a dirty backpack.
 
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Does it need to be "historical" or just any alternative? This July, I saw an elderly man on the Camino with a type of little cart with a long pole attached, that he pulled after him. Almost like a small bike trailer.
 
Your proposal conjures up the Australian song ' Waltzing Matilda ' Walk On :)
The pack you are describing is a ' swag ' , clothes and possessions rolled up into a blanket over the neck , food and billy [ . Swaggie.jpgcooking pot ] hung from a walking staff usually balanced on the right shoulder
 
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@Charles Zammit, hi

You mentioned Waltzing Matilda. At a gite I stayed in the twelve or so of us decided at dinner to each sing a song from our country. I found myself helping out the two Aussies. For quite a while after that the song would not go away. And I began to reflect on why this particular song was so enamoured of those who live on the south eastern coast.

Then it struck me, like your image, how much it reflected Australian culture. They have social skills in that they can dance, the waltz at least. They have cooking skills, at least they can boil water in the billy. And they can count, at least to three. I am sure there were other aspects of that song but three seems enough for the moment.

Swaggies, as they are also called, were once a feature of rural life this side of the ditch, carry all their possession in a bedroll, to give it another name. And keeping everything dry would have been a problem.

thumbnails


These are some climbers from about 1910 on a hill about the height of O Cebreiro (with an even bigger hill - Ruapehu at 8,000 feet - behind). The chap of the right has the very thing you have described over his right shoulder, with something else slung over his left shoulder. The chap on the left has a belt so the "braces" might be the straps for a back pack.
 
... I am experimenting with alternatives to a backpack: specifically rolling my sleeping bag length-wise into a long roll, then looping it into a horseshoe shape. I then loop the horseshoe over my shoulder and tie the two ends together. ...
A modern backpack, with a hip belt, is designed specifically to carry the weight on your HIPS and remove the weight from your shoulders. You are designing a system that is the opposite of that approach. I believe you are taking a giant step backwards with your approach. Even moderately light weights, carried on your shoulders, will cause fatigue and pain.

A modern backpack has a suspension system that typically has a heavy wire, or panel, or something that allows the pack's weight to rest on the hip belt. The best packs have articulated belts that move with your body and work with the pack. Some are shaped like a butterfly, or a hoop, etc.

A good pack will allow you to carry 25 or 30 pounds far more easily than a badly designed pack with only 15 or 20 pounds. You are choosing to carry everything on your shoulder, which might be even worse than a badly designed pack.

I'd also wonder about rain protection for your gear?
 
Thank you, in advance, for any thoughts or input...
If you are curious about this manner of luggage, then by all means try it out during your many Camino-training walks and hikes. Carry the full weight planned, all day, for consecutive days. (Six hours of walking on both a Saturday and Sunday, for example.) This is what training hikes are for - to sort out one's walking kit.

Many of us on this forum are a bit older, in less physical shape, and delirious at the thought of shaving off a few hundred grams of carry weight, while improving our physical comfort by staying dry. No one says you can't take a different approach. We look forward to hearing the results of your field research.
 
The focus is on reducing the risk of failure through being well prepared. 2nd ed.
Does it need to be "historical" or just any alternative? This July, I saw an elderly man on the Camino with a type of little cart with a long pole attached, that he pulled after him. Almost like a small bike trailer.

Here's an example I saw someone pulling along on my Day 1 west of Ponferrada in June.
 

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Type "bedroll" in YouTube. There you will find plenty of videos on how to make a waterproof pack "old style" if you so wish to go that route.
 
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I will consider to get/make/create a "suitable" deeper water proof rain cover for everything.
 
This is a bedroll as mentioned above my grandfather used this with a wool blanket & wore a very large wool coat during WW1. Before modern clothing/equipment.
Buen Camino
 
I was on the Caminoteca facebook page last night and there was a photo of a pilgrim who had fashioned her own "headpack".

https://www.facebook.com/caminoteca....1473005756./1113099845408854/?type=3&theater

This peregrina is from Portland, and from what I understand, she wasn't very happy about how others responded to her headgear. Though some were interested and friendly, many avoided her and she felt it. Not sure that it matters, but just sayin' . . . that's what I read anyway. She blogged it somewhere.
 
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While working as a volunteer this July-August at the Pilgrim Office at Santiago, I saw an amazing array of old-school methods for packing Camino gear. Included were these observations (each seen multiple times):

1. Pilgrims with two shoulder "haversacks," one over each shoulder in an "X" configuration. However, none of these folks were using two poles. If they had a pole, it was a single staff. The side-hanging haversacks would have likely impeded the swing of dual hiking sticks. Still, you can easily get up to 30 liters in these two bags - 15 or so liters in each.

2. Pilgrims with a long-rolled "bedroll." The ends of the "roll" were fastened with a tie or strap, like a huge piece of candy. This tie or strap was then attached to a second strap that permitted the entire roll to be carried on one or the other shoulder.

Interpolating from my US cowboy bedroll knowledge, the ideal way to construct this would likely be:
  • Lay out waterproof layer, like your poncho (folded in half - lengthwise, or in a square);
  • Lay out your sleeping bag or liner, folded to be smaller than the outer poncho
  • Lay out your dry, clean clothing on top of the sleeping layer
  • Lay out your "bumpy kit" toiletries, extra footwear, supplies, etc. on top of the clothing layer.
The closing step is two-stage. Pay attention! This is important.

1. Roll the sleeping bag or liner, with everything except your rain gear into a long, tight bundle (like the longest cigarette or cigar you have ever seen). Fasten both ends, and perhaps add another fastener in the middle. I advise something like velcro straps, so they are easily adjustable, or adjustable web straps with adjusting fasteners and clip closings. You can use a very strong rubber band in the middle. The critical thing is to get this as narrow as you can tightly roll it.

2. Place the tightly rolled sleeping, clothing kit, onto one end of the flat, folded waterproof layer. If the folded waterproof is squarish, a diagonal roll from corner to corner works best to keep it tightly bound.

The two-stage roll is key to your being able to retrieve your waterproof gear when the inevitable rain comes (this is the Camino) without having to unwrap everything. That is how the cowboys did it...;)

Tightly roll the internal roll using the waterproof roll. When done, fasten the ends (like a piece of taffy). Fasten the securing straps to an appropriate shoulder line or strap.

Toss this over your shoulder and you are ready to go.

All said, I think (IMHO) that the resulting 6-8 kilos riding on one shoulder, even if alternated as you walk, would be more tiring and painful than using a standard, modern rucksack. Modern rucksacks are scientifically researched, designed, and tested to distribute weight properly without causing undue stress or strain on your skeleton.

Plus, there are several items that you could not, or would choose not to include in your "bedroll." Examples include: spare sandals or flips flops, water bottles, electronics, first-aid supplies, snacks, guide book, sunglasses & spare glasses, medications, etc.

At the end of this exercise, I see someone toting a "bedroll" over a shoulder necessarily carrying a second haversack over the other shoulder. The resulting load bearing capability would likely be far less satisfactory than using a rucksack, at least IMHO.

While I have seen these "alternative" carrying methods and wondered at length about them, I am not tempted to use one. I have done four Caminos using my Osprey Kestrel 48 rucksack.

After much experimentation and trying alternatives, I keep coming back to this bag, year after year. Once this rucksack "dissolves," I may consider another rucksack. But, I know from experience that I need about 45 liters of volume, a very good shoulder harness, waist band, and back suspension system.

Even on a shorter Camino, where I take less with me, I just pack looser and cinch the rucksack tighter. It all works. More importantly, my back "likes" the fit and "feel" of this harness and back support system. It feels natural to have it on. At the end of the day, when I take the rucksack off, it feels "odd." I maintain that is the sign of a well-fitted rucksack.

I hope this helps.
 
When I was in the army we'd go out with a poncho and a poncho liner when it was summer and if we were doing longer range patrolling. The poncho liner was a very thin quilt with strings on the corners which you tied to the corners of the poncho. You pulled the neck strings tight and twisted the hood inside. It was fairly light and thin compared to the big military bags we carried in the '80's. Some guys rolled it up and attached to the bottom of their ruck others made a U and looped it over the top and tied to the side and others just crammed it in the bottom--it sometimes depended on the boss and if they cared about looking uniform. You could make something similar and like mentioned above fold it properly i.e. burrito style to make it waterproof.
 
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
My dad was telling me that in the 1940's when he was in the Marines, they would carry their blankets in a somewhat similar fashion. It would be rolled up inside of their shelter half (canvas tent) for protection from the elements, and then it would be fashioned in a U or horseshoe pattern over the top of the field pack on their back. He said it worked quite well, but also said back then the packs put all the weight on the back and shoulders.
This is a photo from the net on what it looked like.
mpckcon2.jpg
 
When I was in the army we'd go out with a poncho and a poncho liner when it was summer and if we were doing longer range patrolling. The poncho liner was a very thin quilt with strings on the corners which you tied to the corners of the poncho. You pulled the neck strings tight and twisted the hood inside. It was fairly light and thin compared to the big military bags we carried in the '80's. Some guys rolled it up and attached to the bottom of their ruck others made a U and looped it over the top and tied to the side and others just crammed it in the bottom--it sometimes depended on the boss and if they cared about looking uniform. You could make something similar and like mentioned above fold it properly i.e. burrito style to make it waterproof.
Those poncho liners stuffed in a compression bag would work well on the Camino during the warmer months for sleeping in albergues. Warmer nights you can just lay it over the bunk and sleep on top. Colder nights, tie the strings together and use it sleeping sack style. I was always impressed how warm they are for their weight. They seem to reflect a lot of body heat back to you.
 
Those poncho liners stuffed in a compression bag would work well on the Camino during the warmer months for sleeping in albergues. Warmer nights you can just lay it over the bunk and sleep on top. Colder nights, tie the strings together and use it sleeping sack style. I was always impressed how warm they are for their weight. They seem to reflect a lot of body heat back to you.
Yep seems to me they are getting hard to find. I usually hit military bases 3-4 times a year because I am retired Army but the equipment has changed so the poncho/liner has been replaced with Gortex coats so the surplus stores seems to be the only place a person could get lucky to find them. The civilian sleeping bag liners are easier to find.
 
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I shared a room in Azofra some years back with an American who was packing in just that kind of bedroll. Seemed very light and comfortable and he was very happy. Only downside seemed to be controlling all the loose gear in an albergue stay. Could easily be cured with a stuffsack. He protected everything in rainy weather with a poncho.
 
Thank you kindly for your input and thoughts.

I will keep working with my original plan to make a horseshoe-shaped bedroll and address the issues brought up in this thread. If it just doesn't feel like it will work out, I'll go with a backpack. My intention is to walk with the bare minimum and a bedroll seemed to fit that approach---but there is high value in being practical and realistic.

Everyone's input is greatly appreciated.
 
Yep seems to me they are getting hard to find. I usually hit military bases 3-4 times a year because I am retired Army but the equipment has changed so the poncho/liner has been replaced with Gortex coats so the surplus stores seems to be the only place a person could get lucky to find them. The civilian sleeping bag liners are easier to find.
Yeah, I still have two of them from when I was in. Never took one on a Camino, but if I were to do it in the spring months, I think it would fit the bill for sleeping in. May even have velcro strips sewn down the edges about 3/4 the way up to give it more of a sleep sack configuration, but still be able to lay it flat if need be.
 
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Yeah, I still have two of them from when I was in. Never took one on a Camino, but if I were to do it in the spring months, I think it would fit the bill for sleeping in. May even have velcro strips sewn down the edges about 3/4 the way up to give it more of a sleep sack configuration, but still be able to lay it flat if need be.
Have you seen the threads with folks making tents out of ponchos? The funny thing is how many nights we slept in the mud with just this poncho & liner. I still think about my grand dad & his wool bedroll in the trenches . Thank goodness for technology.
 
Luckily, I spent most of my time in Armor. We dropped a duffle in the bustle rack and attached the rucks to the outside of the bustle. So, always had room for the bag (and pretty much anything else you wanted) but found we often just wrapped up in the poncho liner at night. I still have one I bought at Ft. Knox.

I wonder how hard it would be carrying one of those huge rucks on the camino. They must have weighed 80- 100 pounds if you had to carry the radio plus a bunch of ammo.
 
Have you seen the threads with folks making tents out of ponchos? The funny thing is how many nights we slept in the mud with just this poncho & liner. I still think about my grand dad & his wool bedroll in the trenches . Thank goodness for technology.

For a fascinating account by another man who also wondered about his grandfather in WW1 trenches read Back to the Front by Stephen O'Shea who on his own pilgrimage/memorial walked and camped the long, long road foĺlowed by his grandfather's regiment across Belgium and France so many years ago.
 
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
For a fascinating account by another man who also wondered about his grandfather in WW1 trenches read Back to the Front by Stephen O'Shea who on his own pilgrimage/memorial walked and camped the long, long road foĺlowed by his grandfather's regiment across Belgium and France so many years ago.
Thank you!
 
Luckily, I spent most of my time in Armor. We dropped a duffle in the bustle rack and attached the rucks to the outside of the bustle. So, always had room for the bag (and pretty much anything else you wanted) but found we often just wrapped up in the poncho liner at night. I still have one I bought at Ft. Knox.

I wonder how hard it would be carrying one of those huge rucks on the camino. They must have weighed 80- 100 pounds if you had to carry the radio plus a bunch of ammo.
We have much in common I 19D to 19F to 19K over the years. Feel free to message so we don't take up space for what the Camino forum is for. More to the point why we found the call to the El Camino de Santiago.
Keith
 
Luckily, I spent most of my time in Armor. We dropped a duffle in the bustle rack and attached the rucks to the outside of the bustle. So, always had room for the bag (and pretty much anything else you wanted) but found we often just wrapped up in the poncho liner at night. I still have one I bought at Ft. Knox.

I wonder how hard it would be carrying one of those huge rucks on the camino. They must have weighed 80- 100 pounds if you had to carry the radio plus a bunch of ammo.

You forgot the M-60 tripod and extra barrel, or the inert M-47 Dragon training aid.

I could never imagine even carrying a pack that heavy on the Camino nor would I want to, since I'm not in the military anymore and not bound by a mandatory packing list, I can carry as much or as little as I choose, I like my knees to stay healthy for many years so I go as light as I can.
 
Technical backpack for day trips with backpack cover and internal compartment for the hydration bladder. Ideal daypack for excursions where we need a medium capacity backpack. The back with Air Flow System creates large air channels that will keep our back as cool as possible.

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For a fascinating account by another man who also wondered about his grandfather in WW1 trenches read Back to the Front by Stephen O'Shea who on his own pilgrimage/memorial walked and camped the long, long road foĺlowed by his grandfather's regiment across Belgium and France so many years ago.
Thank you for that information. Found it on amazon and it's in my shopping cart.
 
Have you seen the threads with folks making tents out of ponchos? The funny thing is how many nights we slept in the mud with just this poncho & liner. I still think about my grand dad & his wool bedroll in the trenches . Thank goodness for technology.
When my dad watches the news and embedded documentaries on television where they are following around a modern infantry unit, he cannot believe how big the rucks they carry are, and how much equipment they haul around. I tell him the days of wool and canvas are gone, and it's gore-tex and synthetics.
 
You forgot the M-60 tripod and extra barrel, or the inert M-47 Dragon training aid.

I could never imagine even carrying a pack that heavy on the Camino nor would I want to, since I'm not in the military anymore and not bound by a mandatory packing list, I can carry as much or as little as I choose, I like my knees to stay healthy for many years so I go as light as I can.

Ha! On one training run in full gear the M60 gunner hurt his ankle and I ended up carrying the 60 and the PRC77. I was not a big guy but the rest of the squad was full of light weights. I wish I was in that sort of shape still.
 
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When I was at aircrew survival training at Fairchild AFB (during one of the coldest/snowiest winters recorded) they had us fashion a backpack from a parachute and harness, and snowshoes from branches. After a couple of days we got real snowshoes (not much better for me since they were too big for small female feet). We did NOT get a real backpack that could support weight on our hips and would not slide around on us--we kept our home-made wonders. Most have flashbacks to the POW camp, but I have nightmares about that stupid pack rubbing me raw. There is a lot to be said for modern technology. I think after a few trial runs at home with a sleeping bag sling you might agree.
 
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Hello all,


Has anyone who has walked a Camino used an alternative to a modern-day backpack?


I am in the preparation stages of walking the CF in early spring 2017. I am experimenting with alternatives to a backpack: specifically rolling my sleeping bag length-wise into a long roll, then looping it into a horseshoe shape. I then loop the horseshoe over my shoulder and tie the two ends together. My extra clothes would be placed within the sleeping bag before rolling it into shape.


I will use a small side pack (carried on the opposite side) to carry small items such as toiletries and meds.


The efficiencies of using a modern-day backpack are more practical, I know. But I would like to consider a nod back to the ‘old days’.


Thank you, in advance, for any thoughts or input---they would be greatly appreciated.

We came from Kuwait, and I ended up ditching my backpack in favor of my extremely versatile ghutra (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keffiyeh ) and it worked great...sling, handbag...ultra light and expanded or contracted to fit the needs of the day...I the basic size is a square 1+ meters. I folded in half and knotted the ends for the pouch, then tied the other 2 ends to make the sling. Could carry the weight on either shoulder, front or back...worked great for me.
 

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We came from Kuwait, and I ended up ditching my backpack in favor of my extremely versatile ghutra (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keffiyeh ) and it worked great...sling, handbag...ultra light and expanded or contracted to fit the needs of the day...I the basic size is a square 1+ meters. I folded in half and knotted the ends for the pouch, then tied the other 2 ends to make the sling. Could carry the weight on either shoulder, front or back...worked great for me.
What time of year did you walk? Did you carry a sleeping bag or just a liner? Did you stay in alburgues? That is simply awesome. Rain gear?
 

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