Ave Fenix in Villafranca del Bierzo bedbugs Oct 27, 2012

[Deleted member 3000]

Three pilgrims were eaten alive by bedbugs in Ave Fenix on Thursday night. The hospitaleros in Ruitelan washed all their clothes for them and put their packs in the freezer overnight! Reveille this morning in Ruitelan was Ave Maria, of course.

There are perpetual comments about bedbugs at Ave Fenix, a recurring problem that probably indicates that they do nothing to control them. Perhaps it is time to put them on the AVOID list.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

Re: Ave Fenix in Villafrance del Bierzo bedbugs

I question the effectiveness of this kind of posting. It puts a permanent black mark on a place, for a very temporary condition. Dozens of perfectly reputable albergues, hostals and hotels have periodic outbreaks, but no one puts them on "black lists" that could cost them their business and livelihood.

Ave Fenix is one of the flagship albergues of the Camino de Santiago. Jesus Jato and family have served pilgrims there from the very start of this great resurrection of pilgrimage. They did not achieve this success by intentionally ignoring a very present problem.

Bedbugs come and bedbugs go. They are not anybody´s fault -- Ave Fenix did not infect itself. Pilgrims brought the bugs there. So far, Ave Fenix has not banned pilgrims.

Bedbugs are disgusting creatures, but they are not deadly plagues. They are becoming part of the pilgrimage scene. Fastidious people need to get a grip on that, or go hiking someplace else.

 

[Abbeydore]

Surely you stayed where you stayed last time & snored the house down again!!

 

[SkyWalker]

It does not matter if you're staying at the Four Seasons or at the Ave Fenix, to imply that people should get used to bedbugs because "they're becoming part of the pilgrimage scene" is ludicrous!They are indeed disgusting creatures and no one should put up with it; it is 110% their fault, if all the albergues took proper prevention and action, this would not be a problem on the camino so it's our job to inform others when such problems arise. When pilgrims stop going to Ave Fenix and hundreds of others bedbug infested places I bet the owners will re evaluate their business methods. Get a grip on that

 

[wawpdx]

SkyWalker, I am writing in reaction to your disrespectful post in response to a specific forum member. I see that you are relatively new here. In my opinion, you have chosen to insult someone that, with more time on the forum, you will come to regard with respect and awe. Someone with a long term commitment to the Camino, who is a connecting bridge between many worlds. Keep reading.

Perhaps this should be a PM but I am responding to your public comment.

I also see that you have previously posted

Hello, Im also doing the Camino del Norte on Oct/Nov and considering bringing along an ultralight tent to be a little more independent and also to escape the horrors of bedbugs but fleas and dust mites sounds just as bad; [/quote

 

[peregrino_tom]

Are we just consumers? We demand a service (a clean bed for the night) and in return we pay approx. five euros. If that service fails to deliver we withdraw our custom and either the service provider improves their service or goes out of business. Hmmm.
Isn't the pilgrim network something a little more intertwined than this?
For a start, where do bed bugs come from? Pilgrims. And who carries them from one place to another, almost always in blissful ignorance. Pilgrims.
I stayed in Ave Fenix four years ago and it was a moving and thought-provoking experience. It wasn't the most comfortable place in early December but Xesus and family were looking after some people who appeared to be living on the fringes, providing them with food and somewhere to sleep. But all the practical aspects of running the albergue seems to be in the hands of the assistant hospitalera, Chris, who happened to be exceptionally well organised. I imagine another person might not manage all the tasks so well.
Bed bugs aren't going away and I think they need to be addressed in a concerted effort by all who have an interest in the camino – because they are everyone's problem.
I'd like to know more about what hospitalero/as think and how they address this through their informal network. And then from this, how we can support them. I know that the CSJ volunteers at Rabanal have spent a lot of their time tackling this problem and de-infesting pilgrims with a systematic approach. What are the elements of this? routine observation, relentless cleaning and some kind of de-infestation process presumably. How can we support them – do we need to change our behaviour and influence our peers. Do we need to have a whip round to fund de-infestation equipment? I don't know, but I think we are a big part of the problem and should be a big part of the solution. Thoughts?

 

[Al the optimist]

Well done Tom. A thoughtful and positive post. Thank you for your calm approach.
allan

 

[SkyWalker]

SkyWalker, I am writing in reaction to your disrespectful post in response to a specific forum member. I see that you are relatively new here. In my opinion, you have chosen to insult someone that, with more time on the forum, you will come to regard with respect and awe. Someone with a long term commitment to the Camino, who is a connecting bridge between many worlds. Keep reading.

Perhaps this should be a PM but I am responding to your public comment.

I also see that you have previously posted

Hello, Im also doing the Camino del Norte on Oct/Nov and considering bringing along an ultralight tent to be a little more independent and also to escape the horrors of bedbugs but fleas and dust mites sounds just as bad; [/quote

I have read the comment I posted a couple of times and I fail to see the disrespect and insult you mentioned (besides being disrespectfull to bedbugs and I really think they have a thicker skin than that). I do apologize if anyone else sees it that way, because it is not. In fact I extend my respect to everyone regardless of how many posts or how much free time they have to spend on a web forum. We're all here because we share a same interest but we all have different opinions. One thing that I won't do is to get used to those critters nor will I go hike somplace else. So Wawpdx, in response to your reaction to my reaction in response to another forum member's comment, thanks for keeping your comment public and for reading my previous posts...
Going back to the original issue, from the posts I've read on this forum it really is a big problem on the camino and perhaps there's more pepople getting used to them than there is people actually doing something about it; the problem with that is even though I agree with what Tom said that this should be an issue addressed by all who have an interest in the camino, realistically how much can a pilgrim do to help besides voicing their concern on websites like this, perhaps someone who is also concerned can share their inputs; after all you stay at an albergue for the night and then you're gone the next morning, if the albergues took proper measures to eliminate an infestation there would be no bedbugs for pilgrims to carry on, it seems like falcon269 did his part...

 

[FrancesK]

I disagree that this type of post should not occur. For once of occurrences, yes, potentially keep it off the forums (tho if i was checking in here as i hiked i would like to know which albergues to avoid - perhaps a post can be deleted once confirmation of de-bugging has occurred?). However, this is not a once off occurrence, nor does it seem to be being treated as a problem by the owners of the albergue. I, as did numerous other people, got bed bugs at Ave Fenix back in May this year. It was a horrible experience that led to feelings of being an outcast because I was 'infected'.

I feel terrbily sorry for the owners of the beautiful albergue in Ruitelan (and others a day trip or so from Villafranca) who then have to deal with the potential spread to their premises.

Yes every business that offers a bed can potentially have bed bugs, but it is a responsible premise that acts on it!

 

[sillydoll]

When the bed bugs first raised there little heads, the Spanish insisted that they were coming with pilgrims from France!
At the same time there was a recurring problem of bed bugs on the Ryanair flights to and from the UK and Spain. Bugs carried home by pilgrims!
No albergue wants bedbugs - especially if their livelihood depends on pilgrims staying with them. Every albergue has a policy and action on bedbugs. Every day an inspection is made, beds are disinfected. Volunteer hospitaleros (those that are trained by HOSVOL) keep a beady eye on pilgrims with suspicious spots. Action might include washing all the pilgrims clothing and placing the backpack in a black plastic bag and leaving it out in the sun. Pilgrims are asked not to put backpacks on beds. Every day a few wily bugs get past the scrutiny and end up in someones bed. One pilgrim will report being bitten in an albergue where the other 40 have not been bitten.
I have walked to Santiago six times, in May/June, June/July, September/October and have never been bitten or even seen a bedbug.
If you plan on taking insecticide with you on your Camino, please don't spray it in a closed room full of pilgrims. You could cause serious problems for people with chemical intolerance, asthma or other respiratory disorders.
Tea tree oil and lavender is a popular alternative to chemicals.

 

[Abbeydore]

Yes Tea Tree oil, oinment is a 'wonderful' treatment, & you know that manuka honey, comes from the manuka tree = tea tree

http://activenewzealand.com/resources/n ... -honey.php

Had my dose of manuka honey this morning, so hopefully all my ailments will behave today

ps If you end up doing your next camino in Kiwi, please don't blame me!(yes there is one)

David

 

[Deleted member 3000]

First, I am not big on rebuttals in forums; I say my piece, and avoid ongoing argument.

On my first camino I stayed at Ave Fenix. I saw my first queimada and my first bedbugs. They were all over my bunk in the afternoon. The Jato family is an institution, and I had a great time (the new highrise buildings have destroyed their view, however). I gave them the bugs I had killed. Since then, there have been regular reports in the Forum of bedbugs there, so I have not stayed there in the subsequent six times through Villafranca del Bierzo.

I did not make the original post lightly. I know bedbugs move along the Camino, and will always be a problem. However, I have come to doubt the eradication efforts at Ave Fenix. There are just too many reports about them. Their extermination efforts need to be more effective. Since there are so few repeat customers on the Camino, I am not sure that hospitaleros necessarily take bedbug reports seriously. I know that most do, but there is little economic reason to do so. Pilgrims who have been bitten are not in a position to tell new arrivals about the incident, and it is only on forums like this one that information is shared. How many Forum patches did you see on your last pilgrimage? Any? So I doubt that business at Ave Fenix will suffer from a report here. Tens of thousands will pass by next year, oblivious to the conditions at any albergue. Readers here can take or leave comments, so a posting on bedbugs is a scrap of information that may or may not be useful.

I treat my equipment with permethrin. After just finishing 52 days on various caminos, I did not have a single bite. My traveling companions were not so lucky. The Camino will provide, but it will not provide permethrin. You have to do that yourself! My pack and its contents went into a large plastic bag on my return, was sprayed with permethrin, and left overnight. The next day, the washables went into a hot water wash, and the gear and pack sprayed again with permethrin. I am pretty sure no hitchhikers will invade my home.

 

[ouroboros]

I agree with falcon in that last post.

Just got back from the Camino Frances in early November.
Bedbugs were present all along the Camino, and whenever I was able,
I reported them to the hospitaleros. Not all pilgrims will go to lengths
to find the hospitalero in the morning, as they usually are not around
as you prepare to leave, plus the pilgrim might be embarrassed,
but there should be a system in the albergue, like a chalkboard,
where a pilgrim could leave a message saying where they found bedbugs,
which bunk, etc. if they found nobody to report the bugs.
Near the end of my camino, a bunk mate in the private albergue (O Apalpador Albergue Turistico in Melide, adjacent to the municipal albergue there)
where we stayed was photographing a bedbug crawling across the floor.
I left there in a hurry and later that day spread everything in my pack out in a sunny field,
and shook the bejeezus out of every single item and let them sit in the sun some
more before repacking. My DH and I got not one bite, but met many who suffered
from bites.
I had protected everything I carried with permetherin, including my silk long underwear/pyjamas and my fleece hat, my boots, my pack, my sleeping bag and liner. We had not one bite, and I do think the permetherin treatment protected us several times.

When I got home, I left the packs and boots outside in the sun, and they stayed outside through several nights of hard frost before being brought in. All clothes and other items went into the hot wash.

 

[dmartin53]

Guess I was lucky. Walked the Camino Frances mid Sept through Oct and managed to avoid the bedbugs. I did spray my pack, sleeping bag and silk liner with permethrin before leaving. I also did a visual exam of my sleeping space before settling in. In my travels I only heard of one story of someone getting bites.

 

[nreyn12]

One important thing to know about bedbugs is that they BITE only about one in ten people who come near. But they may still hitch a ride in your clothes or backpack, so anyone can be helping to move them along the trail without knowing it.

Just because the person in the bed next to you got bit, and you didn't, doesn't mean you don't have them! Treat your stuff accordingly...

 

[Mmc_56]

I think part of the problem is related to us packing everything up in the dark. You could so innocently carry bugs from one town to another. I had treated my bed bug sheet, sleep sac and pillow cover, backpack before leaving...usually rolled everything up in the dark, but for some reason, this one morning, I turned on the flashlight on my phone. Caught up in my bug sheet was a critter !! I had used mosquito netting, doubled over, as suggested by another here on the forum, and he got tangled up in it. I was horrified ! I killed it, flushed it down the toilet and left a note on my bed to alert the owner...it was a private Albergue. When we checked in, the first thing she asked was if we had been in contact with any bedbugs, and we had not, so she was certainly trying to keep them out of her place. There was an older gentleman on a bunk beside us that appeared to have bites of some sort...bedbug bites ??? Who knows.

Unfortunately, a few days later, I spoke with a young girl who had also stayed there, she had over 80 bites on her upper torso, and she got the bugs from the same place. Luckily for her, the next place she stayed, they washed and sprayed her stuff, but she said that no one would have anything to do with her after that because of the bites. I was lucky, I did not get bitten...but it certainly made my skin crawl for quite some time ! We did a thorough washing and search of our things, and luckily had no more incidents...but it can happen so easily.

 

[Priscillian]

Bedbugs...nasty little bastards
Ave Fenix: wonderful atmospheric and historic albergue (refugio) which I wouldn´t have missed for the world on either of my Caminos Frances
Conclusion: recognise what is given, forgive what is not perfect, and move on...
(And tell the next albergue IMMEDIATELY..and remember the NLB´s take 24 hours to manifest their effects often: i.e. it could have been the Albergue before.)
Jato is a Camino personality: I´d risk a bedbug bite or five if it meant I would have a chance to experience what he has taken many, many years to create at Ave Fenix, or maybe to talk with the old Brujo (bless him) himself.
You scared? Apprehensive? Disgusted? Villafranca has a nice Parador...

 

[jennysa]

I worked as a hospitalero in October and also walked to Santiago afterwards. We only had one case of a pilgrim arriving with bedbug bites (from Navarette but then they proceeded to Azofra before arriving at our albergue) and we immediately took all the recommended steps of disinfecting backpacks ans sleeping bags, washing their clothes in hot water, etc. On my walk from Somport to Santiago, I came across 2 pilgrims only that had been bitten by bedbugs - around Cacabelos and the other was bitten at an albergue soon after Astorga. From first-hand experience, I know that bedbugs are something that every albergue dreads, not only because it can spread throughout the albergue, but it also affects their reputation so as far as I am aware most albergues go to great lengths to take precautionary measure, and they also immediately go into action when any pilgrim arrives with bedbug bites. Where I worked, we meticulously sprayed skirting boards, nooks, crannies, mattresses, blankets and floor boards every day with chincha spray.