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Bottle vs Bladder

Charles Zammit

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
St Jean Pied de Port - Finisterra 2017
GR70 France 2018
Via Francigena 2019
When bushwalking I use a bladder , while trekking a bottle . Both have advantages and disadvantages so I decided to combine both .
A bottle with a bite valve , easily made in a few moments using rubber bands a bite valve from a punctured bladder I had and a generic disposable water bottle .
The only ' fabrication ' needed is to make a hole in the bottle lid . A heated nail or screw driver will do this if you haven't got a drill .
Hopefully the photos are self explanatory , the hole should be tight and the end of the tube cut at an angle so it doesn't seal on the base of the bottle .
 

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F

Former member 31048

Guest
Hi Charles - long time no speak! Hope you and yours are well.

Is this a case of ‘lockdown is the mother of invention’ ?

I usually use a camelbak (plus water bottles if extra needed) and have found the downside of water bottles is I don’t drink frequently enough. So I like your innovation 👍
 

Charles Zammit

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
St Jean Pied de Port - Finisterra 2017
GR70 France 2018
Via Francigena 2019
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trecile

Camino Addict
Past OR future Camino
Francés (2016 & 2017), Norte (2018), Francés-Salvador-Norte (2019), Portuguese (2019)
Oh dear .
Here I go reinventing the wheel , again !
I actually used a tube and bottle system on my first Camino with a collapsible bottle. It was late August/early September, and in order to keep my water from getting hot I put it inside my pack, thus "inventing" a bladder system! 🤣
 

Sirage

Member
Past OR future Camino
Le Puy to Santiago (2005), Porto to Santiago (2007), Vezelay for 200 kms (2009), From Seville, May (2015), Le Puy to Sangüesa (2016), Norte-Primitivo (Sep-Oct 2016)
When bushwalking I use a bladder , while trekking a bottle
I bit of cross-cultural linguistic ambiguity ;): and when you ramble? or visit other countries?

A good idea, although the simplicity of a bottle or more on hot days has worked for me.

Maybe time for me to try your idea - thanks.
 

RRat

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
Planning 2017
When bushwalking I use a bladder , while trekking a bottle . Both have advantages and disadvantages so I decided to combine both .
A bottle with a bite valve , easily made in a few moments using rubber bands a bite valve from a punctured bladder I had and a generic disposable water bottle .
The only ' fabrication ' needed is to make a hole in the bottle lid . A heated nail or screw driver will do this if you haven't got a drill .
Hopefully the photos are self explanatory , the hole should be tight and the end of the tube cut at an angle so it doesn't seal on the base of the bottle .
Purchased a bottle of water in SJPDP. Refilled it as I went. Heard about lack of fountains in the Meseta so purchased a second smaller bottle in preparation. No problems and easy to rinse and refill. My biggest problem? Didn't realize the last fountain before a long hot stretch of the Meseta was foot operated. It was dark. Continued without filling.
 
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Geodoc

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
CF 2018 (across Pyrenees, then Sarria to SdC), CF 2019 (SJPdP to Finisterra & Muxia), CI 2019
I did something similar for my Camino - but I just used a couple of pieces of tubing (one rigid and one flexible) along with the rubber bands. No mouthpiece, so I had to be sure the tube opening was up and drained back into the bottle or else I wound up having water drain all over my chest.
 

biarritzdon

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF11, CF12, CP13, CF14, CA15, S.Anton15, CF&CI15
Ditch Pig16, CF&CP17, CdN18, CM18, CF18, LePuy19
I am a firm believer in bottle only on the Camino, a 50 in my pocket and a 1000 in my pack. Depending on the day refills when necessary. The idea of insuring a bladder is completely uncontaminated every day is a waste of time to me, besides they weigh down your load.
 

MaryB2624

New Member
Past OR future Camino
August/September 2018
Brilliant! I used a bottle and my partner used a bladder and neither of us were truly happy with our choices. I was carrying less water and had to fuss to get it out of the side pocket of my bag when I wanted a drink and he couldn't see the bladder in his bag to know when he was running low. Thank you for sharing!
 
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trecile

Camino Addict
Past OR future Camino
Francés (2016 & 2017), Norte (2018), Francés-Salvador-Norte (2019), Portuguese (2019)
Brilliant! I used a bottle and my partner used a bladder and neither of us were truly happy with our choices. I was carrying less water and had to fuss to get it out of the side pocket of my bag when I wanted a drink and he couldn't see the bladder in his bag to know when he was running low. Thank you for sharing!
I use a bladder and have a small plastic bottle partially full for emergency use, which I have only had to use once.
 

henrythedog

Loved and fed by David
Past OR future Camino
Frances 2017, 2018, 2019, Ingles 2018, (Madrid 2019 partial - retired hurt!) (more planned)
Brilliant! I used a bottle and my partner used a bladder and neither of us were truly happy with our choices. I was carrying less water and had to fuss to get it out of the side pocket of my bag when I wanted a drink and he couldn't see the bladder in his bag to know when he was running low. Thank you for sharing!
If you’re walking as a pair put your bottle in the outside pocket of your partner’s sack, and vice versa.

I have competed in mountain marathons in the past and it’s common to carry each other’s water, waterproof and snacks in accessible (by your partner) pockets.
 

vjpdx

camino-curious
Past OR future Camino
2022
I've always used a camelbak type bladder, but in one of @Robo's videos, he mentioned that he can monitor how low his water supplies are by using bottles. I'll get a tube/hose/straw like Trecile linked to for the bottle(s) or Charles' very good hack, and keep a full bladder as a just-in-case. That's my plan. Until you guys change my mind :)
 
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MaryB2624

New Member
Past OR future Camino
August/September 2018
If you’re walking as a pair put your bottle in the outside pocket of your partner’s sack, and vice versa.

I have competed in mountain marathons in the past and it’s common to carry each other’s water, waterproof and snacks in accessible (by your partner) pockets.
That is such a great idea! Thank you!
 
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Charles Zammit

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
St Jean Pied de Port - Finisterra 2017
GR70 France 2018
Via Francigena 2019
I made the adaptation for a number of reasons .
I find bottles far preferable on the Camino , the amount of water I drank was surprising and digging out the bladder to refill each time would become tedious . Water availability is not usually a problem so two small 750ml bottles seems to last between villages , especially if I drank as much as I could before refilling .
I did find that the most requested appeal for assistance from other pilgrims along the way was the plaintive cry of '' Could you please get my water bottle out for me ?'' Followed usually by '' Could you please put my water bottle back ? '' This was often followed by , it's the pocket on the left hand side , under the zipper , just to the right of the shell , you might have to stretch the elastic !
A compelling reason to use an Osprey pack ; as I do , if ever there was one . Still not everyone does .

The bottle has a number of other advantages , it's easily replaced if damaged or becomes unsavory and it also fits into more places than a hydration pack . A certain blue coloured bottle used for one brand has a wide neck that will admit ice blocks , I used these and would put the blocks left over from my drinks into it to keep the temperature down . You can easily see if you are running low so the temptation to fill up with extra ' just in case ' weight is less .
Nothing is worse than a leaking bladder , especially one that wets your clothes [ inside your pack I mean ] , a bottle in an outside pocket avoids this .
Bottles are lighter as well , being designed for a single use they are made as light as possible and if you don't require one when transporting or travelling to or from the Camino it can be discarded , my own hydration bladders weigh at least four times that of the average water bottle .
Air just returns through the hole around the tube in the cap usually , but if the bottle collapses it's just a matter of biting the valve for a moment without drinking to allow it to re expand .
It's not water tight when squeezed and it's rough and ready but it can be made on the go and just might save someone straining their shoulders, neck or elbows . It might also save the embarrassment of looking as if you are shooing flies away from your bum while reaching for that inaccessible '' bottle out the back somewhere''.
 

dougfitz

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2014, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011, 2019. CP (tbc)
I've always used a camelbak type bladder, but in one of @Robo's videos, he mentioned that he can monitor how low his water supplies are by using bottles. I'll get a tube/hose/straw like Trecile linked to for the bottle(s), and keep a full bladder as a just-in-case. That's my plan. Until you guys change my mind :)
I go the other way, and have a bladder, normally 2 li, and have a 500-600ml bottle in the top of my pack. I drink from the bladder, and if it empties, empty the bottle into it, which can be done without removing the bladder from my pack. I then have an empty bottle that is easier to refill at fonts, etc, and if necessary, treat with a water purification tablet and wait the necessary time for that to take effect.

@vjpdx, if you are going to use the bottle and tube, it is not clear to me why you would carry a bladder, presumably with another hose, etc, rather than carrying another full bottle. I think I would take the approach of @biarritzdon, and have two bottles.

For me the alternative to a bladder is to lose enough weight so that I can once again reach around to the side of my pack and extract a bottle from the side pouches without taking the pack off;). I dream on!
 
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Camino Chrissy

Take one step forward...then keep on walking..
Past OR future Camino
Frances 2015;
Norte/Primitivo 2016;
Frances 2017;
Le Puy 2018;
Portuguese/FishermanTr. 2019
I use two Smartwater bottles. They are a smooth cylinder so are easy to pull in and out of the side pouches of a backpack. I purchase the ones with the attached flip top caps so I do not have to hold the cap with my other hand and possibly even drop it on the ground. They are sold in either a 750 ml or a 1 liter size and last for the whole Camino.
 
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Old Kiwi

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
2019
When you consider that everyone is doing their best to keep pack weight down to an absolute minimum, Why would you want to add an extra 2 to 3 kilograms to it by carrying so much water? I buy a 500mm bottle of water just before I start my Camino and just refill it as I go. I have never run out of water. As for having difficulty getting the bottle out of the side pocket of my pack, I have a very simple solution that costs nothing. I bring from home an empty baked beans can. This fits into the pocket and the bottle fits loosely into it. When I want the bottle, I just reach back and lift the bottle out. To put it back I just reach back until I feel the bottom of the bottle is over the can, and let go. Simple and easy. After removing the label from the can you are left with a shiny silver finish which reflects the suns rays, combined with the air gap between the bottle and the can it keeps the water cooler than if it was just in the pocket on its own, even the net covered pockets. I am a strong believer of the KISS theory. Keep It Simple Stupid. I am not calling anyone here stupid, just naming the theory. As a "by the by", my pack including water is 5 kilograms.
 

Camino Chrissy

Take one step forward...then keep on walking..
Past OR future Camino
Frances 2015;
Norte/Primitivo 2016;
Frances 2017;
Le Puy 2018;
Portuguese/FishermanTr. 2019
I bring from home an empty baked beans can. This fits into the pocket and the bottle fits loosely into it. When I want the bottle, I just reach back and lift the bottle out. To put it back I just reach back until I feel the bottom of the bottle is over the can, and let go.
A very clever idea!
 

dick bird

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Plata, Ingles, Madrid, Norte, Primitivo, Invierno, Aragones, Olvidado, Chemin D'Arles
When you consider that everyone is doing their best to keep pack weight down to an absolute minimum, Why would you want to add an extra 2 to 3 kilograms to it by carrying so much water? I buy a 500mm bottle of water just before I start my Camino and just refill it as I go. I have never run out of water. As for having difficulty getting the bottle out of the side pocket of my pack, I have a very simple solution that costs nothing. I bring from home an empty baked beans can. This fits into the pocket and the bottle fits loosely into it. When I want the bottle, I just reach back and lift the bottle out. To put it back I just reach back until I feel the bottom of the bottle is over the can, and let go. Simple and easy. After removing the label from the can you are left with a shiny silver finish which reflects the suns rays, combined with the air gap between the bottle and the can it keeps the water cooler than if it was just in the pocket on its own, even the net covered pockets. I am a strong believer of the KISS theory. Keep It Simple Stupid. I am not calling anyone here stupid, just naming the theory. As a "by the by", my pack including water is 5 kilograms.
There are caminos with stages where you cannot be 100% certain that you can fill your water bottle on the way. All of them. You should never, ever take less water then you need for the day. 2-3 kilos = 2 - 3 litres. This would be more than necessary, but 1 litre is the minimum. So you carry an extra 1/2 kilo? Worse things can happen.
 

Robo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF SJPdP to SdC
(May 2015)
CF Sarria to SdC
(May 2016)
CF SJPDP-SdC
(May 2018)
VdlP (2022?)
When bushwalking I use a bladder , while trekking a bottle . Both have advantages and disadvantages so I decided to combine both .
A bottle with a bite valve , easily made in a few moments using rubber bands a bite valve from a punctured bladder I had and a generic disposable water bottle .
The only ' fabrication ' needed is to make a hole in the bottle lid . A heated nail or screw driver will do this if you haven't got a drill .
Hopefully the photos are self explanatory , the hole should be tight and the end of the tube cut at an angle so it doesn't seal on the base of the bottle .

Totally with you on that.......

 
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Robo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF SJPdP to SdC
(May 2015)
CF Sarria to SdC
(May 2016)
CF SJPDP-SdC
(May 2018)
VdlP (2022?)
When you consider that everyone is doing their best to keep pack weight down to an absolute minimum, Why would you want to add an extra 2 to 3 kilograms to it by carrying so much water? I buy a 500mm bottle of water just before I start my Camino and just refill it as I go. I have never run out of water. As for having difficulty getting the bottle out of the side pocket of my pack, I have a very simple solution that costs nothing. I bring from home an empty baked beans can. This fits into the pocket and the bottle fits loosely into it. When I want the bottle, I just reach back and lift the bottle out. To put it back I just reach back until I feel the bottom of the bottle is over the can, and let go. Simple and easy. After removing the label from the can you are left with a shiny silver finish which reflects the suns rays, combined with the air gap between the bottle and the can it keeps the water cooler than if it was just in the pocket on its own, even the net covered pockets. I am a strong believer of the KISS theory. Keep It Simple Stupid. I am not calling anyone here stupid, just naming the theory. As a "by the by", my pack including water is 5 kilograms.
500 ml? Really?

That would last me 5 kms. I'd end up dehydrated on longer stretches without fountains/cafes.
 

Robo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF SJPdP to SdC
(May 2015)
CF Sarria to SdC
(May 2016)
CF SJPDP-SdC
(May 2018)
VdlP (2022?)
There are caminos with stages where you cannot be 100% certain that you can fill your water bottle on the way. All of them. You should never, ever take less water then you need for the day. 2-3 kilos = 2 - 3 litres. This would be more than necessary, but 1 litre is the minimum. So you carry an extra 1/2 kilo? Worse things can happen.

I generally carry 2 x 600 ml bottles as a minimum.
But I'll always check the route before starting out.
If there are long sections without water or it's very hot weather, I'll take extra.
We're all different of course, but I've established my 'mileage' as 10 kms / litre.
 
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jsalt

Jill
Past OR future Camino
Portugués, Francés, LePuy, Rota Vicentina, Norte, Madrid, C2C, Salvador, Primitivo, Aragonés, Inglés
I bring from home an empty baked beans can. This fits into the pocket and the bottle fits loosely into it. When I want the bottle, I just reach back and lift the bottle out.
I do the same but using my plastic mug as the holder. And I carry another 500ml inside my pack.
 

dougfitz

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2014, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011, 2019. CP (tbc)
Well, if the bottle you are drawing from is rigid and the tube has a bite valve, a vacuum is created. How is this negated. A bladder is collapsible therefore not an issue.
I think it is likely that pressure equilibrium will be restored as you finish drinking and are releasing the bite valve.

But clearly there will be some negative pressure when you suck water from the bottle. A plastic bottle might deform a little to compensate for this. The next time you open the bite valve to drink, air will be returned to the bottle to restore equilibrium. Depending upon how well the bite valve seals, this might happen without the bite valve having to be opened. A rigid container might not deform so easily, unless one can suck hard enough and long enough to create a quite large negative pressure when it might be there waiting for air to rush in when next one goes to drink!
 
Last edited:

Robo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF SJPdP to SdC
(May 2015)
CF Sarria to SdC
(May 2016)
CF SJPDP-SdC
(May 2018)
VdlP (2022?)
Well, if the bottle you are drawing from is rigid and the tube has a bite valve, a vacuum is created. How is this negated. A bladder is collapsible therefore not an issue.

The tube/bite valve assembly I use, must have a tiny 'return' air hole or something.
It never causes a vacuum.
 
F

Former member 19626

Guest
I think it is likely that pressure equilibrium will be restored as you finish drinking and are releasing the bite valve.

But clearly there will be some negative pressure when you suck water from the bottle. A plastic bottle might deform a little to compensate for this. The next time you open the bite valve to drink, air will be returned to the bottle to restore equilibrium. Depending upon how well the bite valve seals, this might happen without the bite valve having to be opened. A rigid container might not deform so easily, unless to can suck hard enough and long enough to create a quite large negative pressure it will be there waiting for air to rush in when next one goes to drink!
Indeed, I rest my case. 🥴
 
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Sauerwein

New Member
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances (2012)
Camino Portuguese (2019)
I've always used a camelbak type bladder, but in one of @Robo's videos, he mentioned that he can monitor how low his water supplies are by using bottles. I'll get a tube/hose/straw like Trecile linked to for the bottle(s) or Charles' very good hack, and keep a full bladder as a just-in-case. That's my plan. Until you guys change my mind :)
I have a bladder in my pack too but the weight is such a downside. So I'm going to use a Lixada Water Bottle set up on my next camino in May. $18 at Amazon. Worth a look.
 

CA_Pilgrim

Member
Past OR future Camino
El Camino Real de California
Camino Frances (2017)
Granted, I've not yet done a Spanish Camino, so I don't totally understand (yet) the water supply issue. Much more research to do before my May 2022 Camino! However, having done the 850 mile California Mission Trail (El Camino Real), I can say that I am an avid water bladder user. I would never consider going back to water bottles. For me it's all about easy access and weight distribution. I'd much rather have the weight centered on my back than hanging off to the side.

I don't understand criticisms of bladder weight because bladder materials are very lightweight and water weighs the same whether it's in a bottle or a bladder. It all depends on how much you put in the bottle or bladder. Regarding sanitation, it's easy to rinse it out daily and refill. There much less (if any) wash-back with bladders than with bottles. It is a good idea to sanitize them on occasion, but I rarely do it more than once a month.

To each their own! Buen Camino.
 
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dick bird

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Plata, Ingles, Madrid, Norte, Primitivo, Invierno, Aragones, Olvidado, Chemin D'Arles
Granted, I've not yet done a Spanish Camino, so I don't totally understand (yet) the water supply issue. Much more research to do before my May 2022 Camino! However, having done the 850 mile California Mission Trail (El Camino Real), I can say that I am an avid water bladder user. I would never consider going back to water bottles. For me it's all about easy access and weight distribution. I'd much rather have the weight centered on my back than hanging off to the side.

I don't understand criticisms of bladder weight because bladder materials are very lightweight and water weighs the same whether it's in a bottle or a bladder. It all depends on how much you put in the bottle or bladder. Regarding sanitation, it's easy to rinse it out daily and refill. There much less (if any) wash-back with bladders than with bottles. It is a good idea to sanitize them on occasion, but I rarely do it more than once a month.

To each their own! Buen Camino.
Absolutely. Discussions over how to carry your water are insignificant in comparison with how much.
 

Lindsay53

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
Frances April / May 19
When bushwalking I use a bladder , while trekking a bottle . Both have advantages and disadvantages so I decided to combine both .
A bottle with a bite valve , easily made in a few moments using rubber bands a bite valve from a punctured bladder I had and a generic disposable water bottle .
The only ' fabrication ' needed is to make a hole in the bottle lid . A heated nail or screw driver will do this if you haven't got a drill .
Hopefully the photos are self explanatory , the hole should be tight and the end of the tube cut at an angle so it doesn't seal on the base of the bottle .
Some excellent outside the box thinking! I too use a bladder when bushwalking but on the Camino a bottle is easier to refill at the frequent watering places. However this invention many be worth a try.
 

Robo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF SJPdP to SdC
(May 2015)
CF Sarria to SdC
(May 2016)
CF SJPDP-SdC
(May 2018)
VdlP (2022?)
When bushwalking I use a bladder , while trekking a bottle . Both have advantages and disadvantages so I decided to combine both .
A bottle with a bite valve , easily made in a few moments using rubber bands a bite valve from a punctured bladder I had and a generic disposable water bottle .
The only ' fabrication ' needed is to make a hole in the bottle lid . A heated nail or screw driver will do this if you haven't got a drill .
Hopefully the photos are self explanatory , the hole should be tight and the end of the tube cut at an angle so it doesn't seal on the base of the bottle .

You know you can buy drinking tubes designed to fit on a bottle? ;)
And they have a return valve.
It's what we use in the photo above.
 
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AlexB

New Member
Past OR future Camino
Francés
The longer stretch in the Camino Frances is from Carrión de los Condes and Calzadilla de la Cueza in the Meseta 18kms, I was carrying almost threes kilos of extra weight, so I dumped the bladder and kept a 750ml bottle and it worked perfectly for me
500 ml? Really?

That would last me 5 kms. I'd end up dehydrated on longer stretches without fountains/cafes.
 

MikeyC

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
CF - September 2016
CF - April May 2017
Shikoku - October 2017
Kumano Kodo - October 2017
CF - 2019
Decathlon have an adapter cap and pipette for their Tritan water bottles.
 

davebugg

A Pilgrimage is time I spend praying with my feet
Past OR future Camino
2019
Some excellent outside the box thinking! I too use a bladder when bushwalking but on the Camino a bottle is easier to refill at the frequent watering places. However this invention many be worth a try.

There are adapters that fit right on the feeding tube which allow one to refill the water reservoir/bladder without even the need to take off your backpack. When used for Camino, I do not use it with a water filter as I would when wilderness backpacking.

In use, I grab my collapsible 1 liter water bottle, remove the quick disconnect cap I have screwed on, fill the bottle with as much water as I want, quick connect the bottle to the adapter on the feed tube and allow the water in the bottle to refill the bladder. It takes me less than 30 seconds to do this, and as I mentioned, I do not need to take off my backpack. The reservoir never needs to be removed for refills.

The link to a video about quick disconnect adapters. Ignore the water filter that is part of the assembled system. For potable water, the quick disconnect goes directly onto the refill bottle.

This is the collapsible water bottle that I use, although there are numerous products that also work just fine. If I want to be sure I do not accidentally run out of water, I will keep about 0.5L of water in the bottle, and then decrease the amount of water I carry by the same amount. So, for example, if I want to carry a total of 1 liter of water, 0.5L is in the bladder and 0.5L is in the collapsible water bottle.


NOTE: Some individuals may need to filter even potable water due to immune system issues or other health concerns. If that is the case, it is very easy to filter all microbials and parasites by adding a small inline filter - designed for backpackers - to the quick refill system.
 

Lindsay53

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
Frances April / May 19
There are adapters that fit right on the feeding tube which allow one to refill the water reservoir/bladder without even the need to take off your backpack. When used for Camino, I do not use it with a water filter as I would when wilderness backpacking.

In use, I grab my collapsible 1 liter water bottle, remove the quick disconnect cap I have screwed on, fill the bottle with as much water as I want, quick connect the bottle to the adapter on the feed tube and allow the water in the bottle to refill the bladder. It takes me less than 30 seconds to do this, and as I mentioned, I do not need to take off my backpack. The reservoir never needs to be removed for refills.

The link to a video about quick disconnect adapters. Ignore the water filter that is part of the assembled system. For potable water, the quick disconnect goes directly onto the refill bottle.

This is the collapsible water bottle that I use, although there are numerous products that also work just fine. If I want to be sure I do not accidentally run out of water, I will keep about 0.5L of water in the bottle, and then decrease the amount of water I carry by the same amount. So, for example, if I want to carry a total of 1 liter of water, 0.5L is in the bladder and 0.5L is in the collapsible water bottle.


NOTE: Some individuals may need to filter even potable water due to immune system issues or other health concerns. If that is the case, it is very easy to filter all microbials and parasites by adding a small inline filter - designed for backpackers - to the quick refill system.
Very interesting, a nice bit of kit! Thanks Dave.
 

Old Kiwi

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
2019
Robo, Your 500ml for 5 k would be about 2.5 litres for a standard 25k day. I would drown in that much water. Usually I refill my bottle once during the day. I have never had a problem with 500ml across the meseta. I used to run marathons until I was 65 and only ever had a drink at the halfway mark. Obviously I don't need as much water as some people.
 
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dougfitz

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2014, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011, 2019. CP (tbc)
Noting and being mindful of the comment by @dick bird earlier, I thought it still worthwhile to put some objective information up for comparison. The choices vary. I was able to weigh several, but for others I have relied on their published specification. The results are listed in descending order of carrier weight per litre of water when full.

  1. Osprey 2 li Hydraulics Reservoir - 150 gm/li
  2. Europlus 2li bladder with insulated drinking tube - 80 gm/li
  3. Source 2 li bladder ~75 gm/li
  4. Generic 'solid' disposable bottle 700 ml - 67 gm/li
  5. Lixada soft bottle 500 ml - 66 gm/li (there are many similar products around the same weight)
  6. Smartwater bottles (x2) and Platypus drink tube kit - 64 gm/l
  7. Source 3 li bladder with plain tube - 60 gm/li
  8. Platypus 1 li soft bottle - 35 gm/li
  9. Generic thin-walled disposable bottle 1 li - 35 gm/li
  10. Generic even thinner walled disposable bottle 600 ml - 25 gm/li
Clearly quite a range of weights, although I have known for some time that thin-walled disposable bottles are the lightest option. This doesn't mean that I am suggesting you do dispose of them after a single use. They can be re-used, and could well last a whole camino. And when you do have to replace one, find a place where it will be re-cycled to do that.
 

dougfitz

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2014, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011, 2019. CP (tbc)
Robo, Your 500ml for 5 k would be about 2.5 litres for a standard 25k day. I would drown in that much water. Usually I refill my bottle once during the day. I have never had a problem with 500ml across the meseta. I used to run marathons until I was 65 and only ever had a drink at the halfway mark. Obviously I don't need as much water as some people.
I have done some simple measurements of my fluid expenditure on local walks in summer. On a moderately hot day, ie temperatures in the high 20s and low 30s, my expenditure gets to around 700 ml/hr. Locally, if I know I can collect water, I carry a 2 li bladder and a 600+ml bottle, and I use this approach on the camino. If I cannot be sure of collecting water, I replace the 2 li bladder with a 3 li bladder for day walks.

Even then, there is always the prospect of becoming dehydrated, and having to do something about that at the end of the day after one has sorted out accommodation for the night!! There are less pleasant tasks to attend do.
 

Robo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF SJPdP to SdC
(May 2015)
CF Sarria to SdC
(May 2016)
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Robo, Your 500ml for 5 k would be about 2.5 litres for a standard 25k day. I would drown in that much water. Usually I refill my bottle once during the day. I have never had a problem with 500ml across the meseta. I used to run marathons until I was 65 and only ever had a drink at the halfway mark. Obviously I don't need as much water as some people.

Sure you can walk with less water.
But I would suggest at the levels you are taking in, you are walking dehydrated to a degree.

Maybe you walk in cooler weather?
Down a litre before you start?
Stop at every cafe for a can of soda?
But hey, we are all different ;)
 
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Robo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF SJPdP to SdC
(May 2015)
CF Sarria to SdC
(May 2016)
CF SJPDP-SdC
(May 2018)
VdlP (2022?)
I have done some simple measurements of my fluid expenditure on local walks in summer. On a moderately hot day, ie temperatures in the high 20s and low 30s, my expenditure gets to around 700 ml/hr. Locally, if I know I can collect water, I carry a 2 li bladder and a 600+ml bottle, and I use this approach on the camino. If I cannot be sure of collecting water, I replace the 2 li bladder with a 3 li bladder for day walks.

Even then, there is always the prospect of becoming dehydrated, and having to do something about that at the end of the day after one has sorted out accommodation for the night!! There are less pleasant tasks to attend do.

Interesting comparisons @dougfitz

So my 'mileage' works out at 100 ml /km.
But I walk slowly. 4 kph.

You probably walk faster.
Let's say 6 kph.
700 ml / 6kms - 116 ml / km.
 
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dougfitz

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Spain: Mar 2010, Apr 2014, May/Jun 2016. Norway/Sweden: 2012, 2018. Other: 2011, 2019. CP (tbc)
Interesting comparisons @dougfitz

So my 'mileage' works out at 100 ml /km.
But I walk slowly. 4 kph.

You probably walk faster.
Let's say 6 kph.
700 ml / 6kms - 116 ml / km.
Are we close to over-thinking this yet, or is there time for a couple more exchanges? Lets see!!

Knowing one's fluid expenditure, in either time or distance terms, is probably a good thing in terms of planning out one's walking day if you want to really finesse how much water to carry. I don't do that, but it seems a legitimate way of managing this.

I prefer to carry a full water bladder and reserve bottle, and not worry too much about stopping at every bar or font. I would normally refill wherever I had lunch, although I do recall forgetting on a couple of days and having to deploy my reserve bottle!
 

Robo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF SJPdP to SdC
(May 2015)
CF Sarria to SdC
(May 2016)
CF SJPDP-SdC
(May 2018)
VdlP (2022?)
Are we close to over-thinking this yet, or is there time for a couple more exchanges? Lets see!!

Knowing one's fluid expenditure, in either time or distance terms, is probably a good thing in terms of planning out one's walking day if you want to really finesse how much water to carry. I don't do that, but it seems a legitimate way of managing this.

I prefer to carry a full water bladder and reserve bottle, and not worry too much about stopping at every bar or font. I would normally refill wherever I had lunch, although I do recall forgetting on a couple of days and having to deploy my reserve bottle!

I don't think it's overthinking at all @dougfitz . I think for Newbies in particular, planning for water consumption is something to be recognised and considered.

I'm not stupid about it, (the planning) but I think it's common sense to look at the route for the day, and assess where water tops ups might be available. I generally only carry 2 x 600 ml bottles, that I top up along the way, unless I see that there are longer sections between fountains/villages.

90% of the time I top up from fountains.

In hot weather on a longer stretch, I might carry an extra 600 ml bottle of two.

I also carry a small 300 ml bottle that has rehydration powder in it.
I sip that later in the day along with my regular water.

I have run out of water twice. On my first Camino.
Both times in hot weather. 30C+

Once as the water bladder tube leaked and I did not notice.
Once it was just so hot I drank a lot more than expected.

I do not want to repeat those experiences..........
Extreme tiredness, muscle cramps....

Of course it was only a matter of a few kms to the next water top up, but still a very unpleasant experience.

Water Management does require a bit of thought in my view.

Afternote.
I have never really 'researched' water usage while hiking.
Rather, on my first camino, I just took a 3L bladder and learnt by trial and error.

This thread got me researching though as I was curious to know what a 'recommended' water consumption is.

There are many guides and articles on the topic. One 'rule of thumb' that seems to be often quoted is 1 litre of water per 2 hours. But most stress that individual needs will vary, along with temperature, humidity etc etc. And can be 1.4 lits in warmer weather.

So the water quantity we allow @dougfitz seems to actually fall within accepted norms.

A key of course is to also measure water 'output'! Lots of guides online about this.

Quantity. If you are not peeing regularly you are dehydrating.
Colour. The darker the pee colour the more dehydrated you are.

 
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