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Breaking the journey from SJPP to Roncesvalles

marigold

Member
Time of past OR future Camino
(2009) Sarria - Santiago; (2011) SJPP - Navarette; (2012) Logrono - Santiago;( 2013) Leon - Santiago - Finesterre
Hi everyone!
I'm a bit nervous about my ability to walk the first part of the camino - I've heard it is very difficult if you are not that fit! :? So I thought I would walk it in two etaps, staying overnight somewhere. Does anyone know of a hostal on route that's not too expensive? Thanks :)
 
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Every farmhouse out of St.-Jean-Pied-de-Port seemed to offer rooms, but the two main stops are Ho(u)nto and Orisson. After that, there is nothing. Orisson is about an hour after Hounto, so if you start at SJPdP, you should be able to reach it. I had started at Ostabat, so was ready to quit at Hounto.
 
[qu Does anyone know of a hostal on route that's not too expensive? Thanks :)
I can highly recommend Orrison the private Aubergue there is good 12/15 euro and a good meal if wanted.
at dinner everyone is asked to stand up and introduce themselves which creates a great ambiance amongst the pilagrino's there.you then continue to meet these people all along the way to Santiago like family.its very popular and you have to book first in order to get in,
also tents round the back if you prefer.
Ian
 
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
Hi Marigold.
Yes, I agree Orrison is a good place for your first night out of SJPP.
However, I recommend you book well ahead if possible, as it is very popular.
http://www.refuge-orisson.com/
Buen Camino
Col
 
How long does it take to walk from SJPdP to Orrison? I'm reasonably fit (work out three times a week, walk a lot).
 
Thanks so much for the info about refuges (Orisson) on the way over the border. In the guide however it says that 'less fit walkers should not take the Napoleon route but should take the Road route'. Orisson is on the Napoleon route and I was going to take the road route. So.... do you know about stopping places on the road route? In the guide it mentions two places in Valcarios but they are expensive, and don't have contact details.
Also, how hard do you think this bit is for a first day for a not so young and not so fit person? Should I start at Roncesvalles? I really want to give it a go (from SJPP) but am I being foolish? I think I'll be going in May.
 
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It is about 10km from St. Jean to Orrison. Takes 2- 21/2 hours to walk mostly up all the time on a local road except for a shortcut after Hunto when you follow a path.
ranthr
 
To Orisson?
Usually on the camino I walk about 3-4 kms (the best days and no uphills 5 kms) per hour therefor I would count at least 4 (maybe 5) hours to Orisson with a rest in Hunto and another break by the wiew point taking a look all over the valley and SJPP. All the way to Orisson is uphill and about 10 kms. If I know I am staying the first night at Orisson there is no need to hurry. Maybe I could avoid getting the first blisters if the few first days can be walked without hurrying.
annie
 
marigold said:
In the guide however it says that 'less fit walkers should not take the Napoleon route but should take the Road route'.

Hi Marigold,
Yes, it's a tough walk for the first stage, but in good weather it is an absolutely wonderful walk.
"Less fit" is quite a broad category, so maybe talk to some more people on the forum before you completely rule it out. Ask as many questions as you like, search the forum you should get lots of help here.
Buen Camino
Col
 
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Sorry Anniethenurse, do not mean to misinform anybody.
The weather has been bad the three times I have walked there, twice from St.Jean and once from Hunto. Not really much to look at and not very inviting to sit down and rest. Rain,fog, wind and rather cold. The first time I had booked at Orrison, left St. Jean at 7.30 and was at Orrison around ten, so I went on to Roncesvalles. Next time I went from Hunto and used an hour or so to Orrison. Last October I left St. Jean 8.30 and was at Orrison around 11.
I am not young and fit (woman,63) and I think many people pass me on the road. I usually carry a heavy backpack.
By the way, I think the bit between Orrison and the cross where you leave the road is the worst. It is not so steep as the first part, but you walk and walk and walk and there seems never to be an end, always a new bend on the road and the same ahead. It is like a hard job that has to be done.
Walking down to Roncesvalles is hard for your legs. The best is to choose the road to Ibaneta if you are very tired.The path from Ibaneta to Roncesvalles was really good .
I have never walked the alternative via Valcarlos, but I have heard people say that the traffic is a problem in parts of it. Guess there is a lot of climbing there too.
ranthr
 
In my experience, there were plenty of "less fit" people who made it up to Orisson from St. Jean. They were tired but at the same time exhilirated when they arrived, so I think it's worth it. I remember particularly one group of "not spring chickens" French women, all over 70, who told me they stopped ever ten minutes or so on the steep parts, but they made it just fine. The other thing to put your mind at rest is that you will have a reservation, so you can take as long as you want! But for anyone who is reasonably fit (I know that's not a precise term), the St. Jean-Roncesvalles stage can be done in one day, and you will probably even arrive before the pilgrim's office opens.

I had walked the Camino Frances twice from Roncesvalles, but the third time I went over the Pyrenees from St. Jean, and I wondered why I had waited so long to see those stunning vistas. Snow, green, cows, villages, it is just beautiful. And a sight that's not repeated on the rest of the Camino.

Buen camino, Laurie
 
Thanks everyone :) It sounds amazing.
I'm confused that the Confraternity Guide advises the road way (Valcarlos) as being an easier option, yet the tourist office advises the higher (Orisson) one. All of you seem to have gone the Orisson way too. I still fancy the road one and staying over in Valcarlos.....I think... :?
I've got to start some training now!
 
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The Pilgrim's Office in SJPP recommends the Napoleon Route simply because these days it is the most well-known and well used route, and the off-road paths on the Valcarlos Route are becoming overgrown and difficult to follow. If you're walking alone, and decide to take the Valcarlos Route, please stay on the road, don't be tempted to follow the off-road Camino signs. Though, if you're walking with someone else or a group, then you'll have the support of others and there shouldn't be a problem.

Three years ago I took the Valcarlos Route as I wanted the chance to stop in Valcarlos if it became too much for me. I'm glad I did because the weather turned quite bad and those on the mountain had a difficult time. However, I found I was the only pilgrim walking this way which was a bit disconcerting. The Valcarlos Route is a bit harder on the feet as you're walking on bitumen the whole time, and the last 7kms or so is a continual uphill climb with numerous hairpin bends. I had no problem with traffic, and walked on the left next to the guardrail.

It took me 10 hours in all, but this included two abortive attempts following the off-road paths (I had to return to the main road each time) which added a couple of hours to the trip. If you do decide to stay in Valcarlos there is, according to the CSJ guide, a municipal albergue with 8 beds in the Plaza de Santiago, cost is 5 euros.
 
Hi Marigold,
If you decide to take the lower route it's very doable in a day (even for a very unfit 50 year old) As we met very snowy weather up at the Cross on the RN we had to change our plan turn back and walk down to Arneguy and then go along the valley route to Roncevalles. That re-route made the journey a little longer/harder but as unfit, cold and wet as we were we made it to the monastery. After one or two hot ports we were tired, warm, happy, a little fitter and a lot more confident 50 yr olds.
Perhaps you could just wait and see how you feel by the time you get to Valcarlos and then decide if you'll stay or push on? At that stage you will have met up with some other pilgrims and, if they are walking at a pace that's good for you, are compatible and are heading on to Roncevalles, you might want to join them. If you plan to leave SJPP early there will be no need to book a bed in Valcarlos so you'll be free to make the decision to go on to Roncevalles if you wish.
The only issue with a loose arrangement like this is if you're having luggage transported as those services need a definite address for delivery.
Enjoy your journey whatever route you take.
Nell
 
Thanks for the info about the two routes and your experiences. This forum is great :D
Next question is, what happens if you arrive late in the day at Roncesvalles? If it takes 10 or more hours you would arrive early evening - then would all the beds be taken? Maybe you need to start out at dawn?
 
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marigold said:
Thanks for the info about the two routes and your experiences. This forum is great :D
Next question is, what happens if you arrive late in the day at Roncesvalles? If it takes 10 or more hours you would arrive early evening - then would all the beds be taken? Maybe you need to start out at dawn?
Hi Marigold Roncevalles is BIG! But what time of year are you going? If its Spring/Autumn should be OK. But be mindful it's a late Easter -24th of April this year so it gets a busy around that time. Even in the unlikely event that Roncevalles is'full' Burgette is about 2 or 3 km futher along and it has accommodation.
N
 
marigold said:
I'm confused that the Confraternity Guide advises the road way (Valcarlos) as being an easier option, yet the tourist office advises the higher (Orisson) one.
The Pilgrim Office in SJPP gives out a map that includes both routes. And when I walked in 2008, their advice was that you could take the higher Napoleon route if the weather was ok, but that you listen to the locals if they suggested you needed to take the lower Valcarlos route. We were fortunate to have good calm weather, a little bit cloudy so it wasn't too hot, and with amazing views. The morning after, when we woke in Roncesvalles, the rain was intense, and I can't imagine it would have been nearly so nice doing the crossing.
Margaret
 
the aubergue at roncesvalles sleeps around 200 people and does not let people in till 3/4 pm and a lot of people are coming in on the bus from Pamplona to start their Camino from Roncesvalles.the bus gets in about 8pm.So your window is between 3 and 8pm lots of time for you to get there.
you buy your accommodation slip from the office across from the accommodation (barn) and a que forms.the dutch people in charge let people in by country-they tend to start with English speakers.
in order to get a pilgrim meal from either of the 2 cafe's you have to pre book and pay-sometimes 2 sittings starting about 8-00.the pilgrim mass is about 9 and the doors to the barn Aubergue are locked at 10pm.
you have lots of time Marigold,I like you was so nervous when I first walked this way at 61 years of age-I was scared of not making it (heart attack) but it realy is not that bad only the weather can make it hard. poco poco is the way you have so much time.
Ian
 
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Refugio "Itzandegia"

Dependiente de la Real Colegiata de Roncesvalles. Un espacioso salón restaurado, originario del siglo XII. Dispone de 124 literas. Está dotado con calefacción, agua caliente para la ducha y servicios. Solamente se puede pasar una noche en él, salvo casos de circunstancias de dificultad mayor. Es necesario presentar a la entrada la Credencial del Peregrino y el tiket de inscripción. Precio: 6 euros.
From the Roncesvalles albergue website. The place does fill up, but they have a stack of mattresses that expand the capacity a little bit. Occupancy limits are sometimes enforced in Spain for safety reasons, are are almost always enforced in France (if you are interested). If you imagine a fire in the Roncesvalles albergue with its one door, you will understand the attitude of the junta officials. They do not want to be part of a news conference where pilgrims were trapped because mattress obstructed a rapid exit.
 
Hi Marigold,
As mentioned weather can be an issue in spring on the Napoleon Route.
However, when we walked in spring 2009, the owner of Refuge-Orisson would transport everyone staying at Orisson, by van to a similar distance already walked, but on the Valcarlos Route, if the weather closed the Napoleon Route. Others might know if he still does that, but I assume he has to, in order make way for those booked for that night.
The other thing to consider is that when you set out from Orisson across the high section you will be leaving together with those who stayed at Orisson overnight, around 40 I think. You usually find that there is someone who walks at your pace, and if you’re really slow then others walking from SJPP should be catching you before you get to Roncesvalles.
Buen Camino
Col
 
On my first Camino, I had made reservations to stay at Orisson.

The hospitalero at SJPP told me, "Oh, don't stop there.. just keep going to Roncevalles.. it is not that difficult and you can do it!" :roll:

So we cancelled our reservations.

I cursed his name for the last two hours, every step into Roncevalles. :evil:
I thought I was going to die. :(

I would NEVER personally attempt that in one stage ever again. :!: :!: :!:
There is no reason to break your body and your feet that first day!

Yes, it is a SPECTACULAR walk and I think it should not be missed.

BUT..
that little short stage the first day gets you used to the pace, and rested enough to make the walk into Roncevalles pleasureable rather than the "hell-day" many pilgrims complain about. It makes a HUGE difference to stop and rest and go fresh next morning. So I strongly suggest it to anyone who asks.

If you are in excellent condition, or 18 and fit, then by all means make the whole stage.
But if you are not, then do yourself a favor and break that first stage up into two days.
It can make the difference on the entire next week of walking.

That's my two cents! :lol:
 
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For my 2011 walk in September, I'm starting in Cahors where I stopped in 2010. I think I"ll have time to reach Ronceveaux. Since I'll be 3 weeks into the walk by the time I reach the Pyrenees, do I still need to plan on making the break at Orisson? Or is that only really needed if one is starting out cold at SJPP?
 
Personally, I think if you have already walked 3 weeks, you'll be fine to do the entire stage...it's VERY difficult for a first day walk. After 3 weeks, you'll probably be in the shape to do it without so much discomfort.

But the bottom line is "only you know" how many kilometers you can comfortably walk each day.
 
Kitsambler, I had been walking all the way from Le Puy when I tackled the climb over the Pyrenees, and struck good weather for it. I still stayed the night in Orisson to break the journey and am glad that I did. Although I completed the 20km or so stetch from Orisson to Roncesvalles in good time, I was still quite tired when I arrived, as there had been some steep climbing and some steep descent. Personally, I am glad it wasn't a 28km day as well, as it would have been if I had done the whole thing at once. The other reason I am glad I stayed at Orisson has to do with the 'good fortune' we struck that evening: a magnificent rainbow stretched right across the skies, in front of the mountains. One of those mountain views I will remember for my lifetime!
Margaret
 
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Hi =I just checked on the web for the private albergue listed at Orisson-
the price listed was 30 euro-
Although it looks a beautiful place to stay (and the only one) the cost does seem rather high for pilgrims. I noted a member on this forum said the cost was 15...hmm...does not seem to be the case.
 
It might be 15 without a meal, but there is nowhere else to purchase or cook food. Actually Orisson is in France still, and the price is quite typical of a private gite in France for demi-pension- with a bed, dinner and breakfast.
Margaret
 
To walk from SJPP to Ronceveaux, you can also use a walking way passing by a valley: Arneguy, Valcarlos and Ronceveaux.
All along this way you have red and white marks of the "GR". It is in guides like MMDD.
This way is previous as variant if there is snow or bad weather in the mountain (fog if clouds are low or storm).
You can sleep in Valcarlos where there is a gite for pilgrims ( clean and cheap 10€ breakfast included) a kitchen and groccery.
You walk along a torrent with many shadow and rest places.
This way is not so hard than the one by the mountain, no problem with the weather, you save energie. No so much difference of level (1400m by the mountain, 480m by the valley), you save 4km.
This way by the valley was the way that the pilgrims used in the middle age and also in 1980, 1983, dates of my first pilgrimages.
André Hospitalet (from France)
 
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Actually, in my opinion, the two routes are similiar and the Route Napoleon is not any harder than the Valcarlos route. The distance is very close.
The main difference is that there are several villages and stops along the Valcarlos route and much of way is along the highway (which can be harder on feet).
Not really as much difference as usually posted here. I think that "bragging rights" to have done the Napoleon :shock: is often at work. :wink:
Do them both and compare.
 
My wife and I followed the valley route this past December and found it very pleasant. We spent one night at Valcarlos at the albergue (very nice) and then continued on to Roncesvalles the next day. We walked the roadway and took all the off road tracks when they were available. We had no difficulty finding our way and had no problems with traffic for the times when we were on the road. As I recall most of the road work was in the early stages (approaching Valcarlos), and was on a secondary road. The trip up from Valcarlos, after a few K's on the road, is mostly on paths and was quite enjoyable. We did not experience any foot problems as a consequence of walking the roadway.

Buen camino,
John
 
I agree with John. Each Camino I have walked via Valcarlos. The new municipal albergue is very comfortable with a nice kitchen for pilgrims. During 'the season' there are several simple bars and restaurants open in the small village. During winter the albergue has efficient electrical heat. From Valcarlos to Roncevalles the path mounts up, partly along the N135 highway and partly along forest paths. In winter snow for ease and safety I have always walked only along the roadway. This is a pleasant approach to the Ibaneta pass and Roncevalles.

Buen Camino!
 
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There is a lot of road on the Napolean route, too. The weather was poor, so we walked the road on the descent into Roncesvalles when the regular route heads into the mud. The road joins the Valcarlos route a few kilometers before town.
 
Hi all,

Just wondering if the route via orisson is way more beautiful than the road route via valcarlos? My fitness level is a bit tragic (I'm sure this will sort itself out after a couple of hundred kms!!) and it looks like the route between orisson and roncesvalles is much harder and longer than valcarlos to roncesvalles. Has any one done them both and can fill me in? I would be hugely grateful since I am trying not to kill my body in the first two days. But I have to admit that I love "pretty" and don't really want to go via valcarlos if its an ugly route for two days.

Any suggestions?

Thanks heaps!
Juani xx
 
Hi Juani,
The Valcarlos route is (in my opinion) very beautiful with views, streams, mountains, etc.
The Valcarlos route is NOT a piece of cake and is difficult also if you elect to walk the entire way. I have not stopped on either route and walked through but probably will stop next time on whichever route I take. It really is a load to make the whole thing on the first day.
Just do the one that you have some comfort with so that you do not start out with anxiety. You can do it without major problems.
You can be proud of either one...regardless of what some will say.
 
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Juani,
Another thing to think about is whether you really feel it is 'essential' to start in SJPP, especially is you say you are not all that fit yet. Although some guidebooks make the start in SJPP, people actually start from many different places, eg Pamplona, Leon...
Margaret
 
:wink: :wink: Keep in mind that the 1st couple of days will be difficult no matter where you start. This is true even for those who are pretty fit. :shock:
 
Marigold:

I just completed the Camino Frances on April 25th. I started in SJPdP and took the Napoleon route. I am 61 and reasonably fit. It took me 8 hours and 40 minutes to walk to Roncesvalles. I would recommend you take the Napoleon route but stay overnight in Orrison. When you break the first day into 10km and 16km walks it is easily doable. Just take your time and enjoy the views. I have never walked the road but traffic in several places (in particular the large cities) along the way detracts from the peace of the Camino. One city I found that was even somewhat dangerous is crossing the bridge leaving Leon. I recommend staying away from the raods where possible.

Another reason for breaking the first day into two is to reduce the impact on your body. The first few days are tough, as fit as you might or might not be, and you will have some soreness that will last a few days.

As far as Roncesvalles is concerned, There is a new very modern facility versus the old barn. I do not think you will have any problems finding a bed. The weekends might be a little more crowded but a weekday should be fine.

Take your time and enjoy.

Ultreya
Joe
 
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Hello everyone

We have decided to go for a short start and break the SJPdP > Roncesvalles in 2 days, stopping over at Orisson. What worries me is the weather unpredictability we may face on day 1, as we'll be hiking the uphill in the afternoon. Too much sun and we're baked, too much rain and we're soaked. But that applies to pretty much all the camino doesn't it?

Meanwhile, as for our transfers to SJPdP, if anyone is interested to share an Express Bourricot taxi from Pamplona straight to SJPdP or from any eastward point thereafter, we're catching one from Pamplona train station on 23rd May 11:20am. Don't forget to book your ride via apcaroline@hotmail.com, or http://www.expressbourricot.com.

Countdown started ... :arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :arrow:

See you along the way. Ultreya
 
Lots of good information here. I was also wandering if I should go to Roncesvalles in one day, but I think I will play it safe (I chicken out). Do we have to have reservation at Valcarlos?
 
Lots of good information here. I was also wandering if I should go to Roncesvalles in one day, but I think I will play it safe (I chicken out). Do we have to have reservation at Valcarlos?
Well, seeing that you have almost two years to get conditioned to walk across Spain, I would say simply walk all the way to Roncesvalles the first day via the Napoleon route, unless advised otherwise (bad weather) by the pilgrim's office to take the ValCarlos route.
The walk to Roncesvalles isn't that bad. Most pilgrims walk all the way to Roncesvalles the first day. I guarantee you a bunch did it today and are sleeping there right now.
cheers
 
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
I changed my profile, thanks to your comment I noticed that I have 2017 as oppose to 2016. My plan is for 2016 May, still enough time to get ready, however, I still think I will take it easy and go to one of the two refugios Orisson or Valcarlos. I understand that the views from SJPDP to Roncesvalles are amazing.
 
Hi =I just checked on the web for the private albergue listed at Orisson-
the price listed was 30 euro-
Although it looks a beautiful place to stay (and the only one) the cost does seem rather high for pilgrims. I noted a member on this forum said the cost was 15...hmm...does not seem to be the case.
Think I payed about 30 with evening meal and breakfast Inc...in April this year...Good place to stop...nice pilgrims meal where you meet a small number of pilgrims many of whom will feature in your pilgrim family at various times until Santiago....I liked it.
 
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The Refuge Orisson is listing lodging/dinner/breakfast at 35 euro. That is the maximum of what I have budgeted per day on my Camino so I know I will have to be mindful of expenses at some time during my walk. I have sent an email via the website and still have not heard back after several days. I am planning to stop at Orisson but have to bear in mind that if they do get back to me and are full or if I stop on my way through and they are full then that means a further walk to Roncesvalles. I guess that means an early start from SJDP no matter what.
 
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