OBSOLETE COVID THREAD CDC Travel Advice to Spain

[Gadflyparexcellence]

I'm preparing for my fourth Camino walk in May. The current CDC travel advice for Spain for Americans reads: Avoid travel to Spain indicating a very high level of Covid-19 in Spain.

What continues to surprise me is that the Covid vaccination rate in the Iberian Peninsula has been one of the highest in the world, yet both Portugal and Spain are on CDC's highest alert category. Is there a reason behind the high infection rate, prompting the CDC warning? Anyone has any thoughts on this?

 

[Tincatinker]

The WHO dashboard is showing an 18% decrease in cases in Spain. https://who.maps.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/ead3c6475654481ca51c248d52ab9c61

Covid is now an Endemic not Pandemic disease. Make your decisions on your own assessment of risk. Oh, and on the validity of your travel insurance....

 

[Vacajoe]

The newest variant is in Europe (coming soon to wherever you may live!), so rates across the continent have climbed. If you are based/boosted, you may still get it, but it’s effects are less. As an endemic, the only way to truly avoid a chance of getting Covid is 100% isolation.

Travel has always come with risks (theft, food illness, malaria, injury, death, etc) and travelers have always evaluated the danger level versus their comfort level. Covid has now become a similar risk that you can take precautions against (vax) and prepare for (insurance), but never really eliminate from your plans.

 

[SeñorJacques]

I'm preparing for my fourth Camino walk in May. The current CDC travel advice for Spain for Americans reads: Avoid travel to Spain indicating a very high level of Covid-19 in Spain.

While I appreciate the CDC's vigilance their COVID-19 Travel Recommendations do tend to be formulated out of an abundance of caution, as is appropriate. (According to that map, all of Europe and most of the rest of the world aside from China, South Asia, and parts of Africa are currently under that same "avoid travel" recommendation as Spain is.) @Vacajoe's observation about the endemic risk of Covid moving forward strikes me as a sound one.

 

[melissay]

The CDC advisories are based entirely on the number of cases per 100k people not on vaccination levels/hospitalizations or anything else. For the level 4 status, that means it's 500 cases per 100k people. To put that in perspective, right now the United States itself meets that threshold along with like 100+ other countries. Just context.

 

[C clearly]

Is there a reason behind the high infection rate, prompting the CDC warning? Anyone has any thoughts on this?

Undoubtedly there are reasons behind it. We are just not sure what they are. There are more than a few people looking into all of this.

Anyone has any thoughts on this?

Most of us have worn ourselves out, with thoughts on the matter over the past two years. You won't get much enlightenment here.

 

[Kathar1na]

Is there a reason behind the high infection rate, prompting the CDC warning? Anyone has any thoughts on this?

You may have noticed that the CDC's warning is dated 20 December 2021. In December, all over Europe, the number of notified new Covid-19 cases per day skyrocketed. You can see the graph for Spain below. People who had been vaccinated and boostered tested positive, due to the Omicron variant.

However, these data do not reflect the severity of cases. Compared to last year and the year before, significantly fewer people got severely ill or even died. Many of those who were registered as positive because they had seen a GP or had a test in a pharmacy or test centre had light symptoms for a day or two or not even that. Overall, presumably thanks to the successful vaccination campaigns.

So, it's like @melissay says (quote below). Currently, Spain has, very roughly, 700 cases per 100k people over 28 days, and falling. By the time you travel to Spain in May, this figure may well be below 500 and the CDC may have lowered their Covid-19 advisory to Level 3 or 2.

The CDC advisories are based entirely on the number of cases per 100k people not on vaccination levels/hospitalizations or anything else. For the level 4 status, that means it's 500 cases per 100k people. To put that in perspective, right now the United States itself meets that threshold along with like 100+ other countries. Just context.

Spain, notified cases per day, since March 2020.

 

[Former member 91017]

I'm preparing for my fourth Camino walk in May. The current CDC travel advice for Spain for Americans reads: Avoid travel to Spain indicating a very high level of Covid-19 in Spain.

What continues to surprise me is that the Covid vaccination rate in the Iberian Peninsula has been one of the highest in the world, yet both Portugal and Spain are on CDC's highest alert category. Is there a reason behind the high infection rate, prompting the CDC warning? Anyone has any thoughts on this?

Infection is not expression of disease.
Vaccines prevent expression of disease. They cannot necessarily prevent infection. In this they are not unlike flu shots or HPV shots, nor even a series of others.
Countries with a small land base and high tourism base are probably going to have higher infection rates. What really matters *at this point* is “are people sick”?
Sickness is not overtaking Spain or Portugal anymore. But mass travel is back in Europe from outside.
Let’s face it: not anywhere near the milions who do business in and vacation in Europe want to come to the Laurentians or the Muskokas or to the BC beaches (I love them, but they are too cold for most people’s taste). PEI appeals to Japanese tourists but few others. We won’t be a tourist viral hotspot.
But I reiterate:
Infection is not disease.
The vaccines work and were not designed primarily to prevent infection (though surprisingly they appear to help with that in some settings).

 

[Vacajoe]

PEI appeals to Japanese tourists but few others.

And us Anne of Green Gables fans!!!!!!

 

[Former member 91017]

And us Anne of Green Gables fans!!!!!!

That’s what the Japanese tourists go for as well.

 

[palmah]

We’re in Spain now and most people and businesses here wear masks even outdoors on the streets of the bigger cities. Where I live in the U.S. I think most people are not mask wearing even in stores. Whatever that means

 

[Vacajoe]

We attended an outdoor play tonight in California… total mask-wearers: 2. Us! It’s all relative. CDC will warn you against travel to foreign countries which are actually (statistically) safer than staying in the US. Protect yourself, plan for the worst, celebrate the best. Buen Camino

 

[Gadflyparexcellence]

We’re in Spain now and most people and businesses here wear masks even outdoors on the streets of the bigger cities. Where I live in the U.S. I think most people are not mask wearing even in stores. Whatever that means

Your feedback is very well taken.

 

[Elvis]

Infection is not expression of disease.
Vaccines prevent expression of disease. They cannot necessarily prevent infection. In this they are not unlike flu shots or HPV shots, nor even a series of others.
Countries with a small land base and high tourism base are probably going to have higher infection rates. What really matters *at this point* is “are people sick”?
Sickness is not overtaking Spain or Portugal anymore. But mass travel is back in Europe from outside.
Let’s face it: not anywhere near the milions who do business in and vacation in Europe want to come to the Laurentians or the Muskokas or to the BC beaches (I love them, but they are too cold for most people’s taste). PEI appeals to Japanese tourists but few others. We won’t be a tourist viral hotspot.
But I reiterate:
Infection is not disease.
The vaccines work and were not designed primarily to prevent infection (though surprisingly they appear to help with that in some settings).

BC beaches are warm all year round.

 

[txpeah]

I am leaving in a few days and noticed this as well when I registered with the State Dept. My reaction was similar to the thoughts above AND noticed there are very few countries on the Level 1 or 2 travel advisories. My possibility of infection is higher in north Texas - we have much lower vaccination/booster rates, much higher new cases and hospitalization rate, and folks are mostly mask-less in public. I am thoughtful about my precautions when out and about and plan to do the same in Spain.

We were extremely careful the last few years with exposure, but right now I am comfortable traveling with my usual PPE and hoping my Nov booster will serve me well in Spain as it currently does in Texas.

Best of luck as you figure out what is best for you.

 

[Charles Ross]

It’s all nonsense- masses of high infection rates - very few unwell even less in hospital. The planet needs to get over this. It’s not where the main threat lies!

We are traveling to Ireland, France and, finally, Spain in early April. We will be on the Camino until late May. We are going to be as careful as we can. It serves no purpose to be cavalier about this disease. Virus' do not have rules and even today we do not know very much about them; science cannot even agree if a virus particle is alive or not!
There is a useful example of a previous pandemic that is worth reading about: the 1918-19 pandemic. The first stage of that pandemic in Spring '18 was unremarkable, mild illness, few deaths. The second iteration in August, September was brutal, four to five hundred thousand deaths in the United States. The suspicion now is that the virus, in combination with bacteria, hid out in both pets and livestock in late Spring, early Summer. What was the average age of fatality? 28. Apparently many healthy young people would leave for work in the morning, come home with a cough and be dead in 48 hours.
Re: "It's not where the main threat lies". I can't think of anything that is remotely comparable to what has happened with this pandemic over the last 2 years. You know, it's not a visual like planes crashing into buildings or missiles striking apartment buildings. It all happens in walled off sanitized environments but here in the United States, at least, we're still having a '9-11' every three days, and in Ukraine, I would not be surprised if more people have been killed in the last month from Covid than from Russians invading. We're nervous about the amount of exposure that we are facing in the next two months. We're 70 and 75 and have gotten through this infection-free; we live in the most crowded neighborhood between Seattle and San Francisco; being vaxxed and boosted, masks, and distancing when possible, that's what has gotten us through. I'm rambling.

 

[Locamente adicta]

The newest variant is in Europe (coming soon to wherever you may live!), so rates across the continent have climbed. If you are based/boosted, you may still get it, but it’s effects are less. As an endemic, the only way to truly avoid a chance of getting Covid is 100% isolation.

Travel has always come with risks (theft, food illness, malaria, injury, death, etc) and travelers have always evaluated the danger level versus their comfort level. Covid has now become a similar risk that you can take precautions against (vax) and prepare for (insurance), but never really eliminate from your plan

My thoughts exactly. Endemnicity and natural immunity is the way ahead!

 

[peregrina2000]

I think it’s best to close the thread. The OP has gotten the factual advice asked for, and of course the reality is that things may be totally different in May.

The temptation to stray into politics has proven irresistible, so time to close.