Communion on Camino: Comments and an Observation

[CaminoDebrita]

As an Episcopalian, I took Holy Communion along the Way, and found it to be very comforting and important to my journey and spiritual growth.

I did have some really wonderful Protestant friends tell me that technically, they could not take Communion as it was given in Catholic churches, but I --as an Episcopalian who recites the Nicene Creed every Sunday--felt that it was appropriate. I had also done a bit of research to learn that it was appropriate and acceptable for me to do this.

Question:

1. Have any of the rest of you struggled with whether it is acceptable or not?

2. I had read in this forum--somewhere--that Episcopalians were okay to take Communion.

This is not a religious debate, but just information gathering, so please be careful and don't violate Forum policy here.

I will note that the first and only time I have EVER seen a priest leave Communion providing was when a woman took Communion at SdC and did not eat the host. He literally raced down the aisle to have her eat it. All in attendance were rather shocked that she did not seem to know what the significance was and just tried to quietly respect the situation as it unfolded.

Thanks--Deb

* edited to change "wafer" to "host"

 

[Lydia Gillen]

there is a "rule" which would state that a person has to be baptised into the Catholic Church in order to be in communion with it and therefore receive communion. !

Everyone who is baptised is baptised into the Christian Faith.

If a Christian is unable to partake in worship within their own denomination (which happens for the members all the reformed churches when travelling in Northern Spain) then they are free to partake fully in the Catholic Mass, which obviously includes receiving holy communion.

Recently (just a few weeks back) the wife of Catholic who was not herself a Catholic asked Pope Francis if she could receive Communion when she accompanied her husband to Mass and he indicated very clearly that she was free to do so.

I hope this helps to clarify the situation for you Deborah.
Jesus prayed "That they all may be one" and we continue to pray it

 

[Kanga]

At the last Pilgrims Mass I attended in Santiago there was a very clear instruction given, in many languages including English, that those "baptised into the Catholoc faith" were invited to take communion.

I never do, but that is a personal decision.

 

[CaminoDebrita]

there is a "rule" which would state that a person has to be baptised into the Catholic Church in order to be in communion with it and therefore receive communion. !

Everyone who is baptised is baptised into the Christian Faith.

If a Christian is unable to partake in worship within their own denomination (which happens for the members all the reformed churches when travelling in Northern Spain) then they are free to partake fully in the Catholic Mass, which obviously includes receiving holy communion.

Recently (just a few weeks back) the wife of Catholic who was not herself a Catholic asked Pope Francis if she could receive Communion when she accompanied her husband to Mass and he indicated very clearly that she was free to do so.

I hope this helps to clarify the situation for you Deborah.
Jesus prayed "That they all may be one" and we continue to pray it

Thank you! Love, and blessings.

 

[SYates]

First of all you might want to join this private forum here https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/social-forums/non-catholics-on-the-camino.3/ where such matters can be discussed without offending the forum rules. That groups has been very quiet, so participation would be beneficial to a lot of us.

As an Anglo-Catholic (Church of England) I agree with you that receiving Communion on the Camino is a tremendous source of strength, but sadly, officially we are not welcomed (nor are any other members of Churches that are not in full communion with the Roman-Catholic Church - and yes, that means also Espicopalians) to do so by the Roman-Catholic Church. As I arrived after more than 3,000 km pilgrimage in Santiago I actually heard it pronounced in the cathedral itself 'please remember that only Roman-Catholics that are in good standing with our own Church are allowed to come forward to receive the Holy Sacrament.

What I did during my pilgrimage, but bear in mind that I am a fluent Spanish speaker, was always to ask the officiating priest if I would be allowed to take Communion, explaining that I did believe in the true presence of Christ in the Eucharist. Most of them welcomed me, some went out of their way to do so, some rejected me. The sad reality of the divided body of Christ ...

As for the woman you mentioned not consuming the host immediately, that is one of the several reasons many priests are so careful about whom to give the sacrament to/the reason for the aforementioned announcement in Santiago cathedral. It is a holy/sacred thing and somebody partaking in it without being aware of that sacredness is frankly a huge problem. SY

 

[SYates]

... If a Christian is unable to partake in worship within their own denomination (which happens for the members all the reformed churches when travelling in Northern Spain) then they are free to partake fully in the Catholic Mass, which obviously includes receiving holy communion. ...

Unfortunately the Roman-Catholic canon law contradicts you there. That is simply not the case. I really wish it would and it kind of was some time ago, but the newer Church ruling by the Roman-Catholic Church put an end to this exception. Also even under this exception the person wanting to receive the sacrament had to profess that s/he believed in the teaching of the Roman-Catholic Church regarding this sacrament, meaning regarding communion in the true presence of Christ in the Eucharist. SY

 

[CaminoDebrita]

First of all you might want to join this private forum here https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/social-forums/non-catholics-on-the-camino.3/ where such matters can be discussed without offending the forum rules. That groups has been very quiet, so participation would be beneficial to a lot of us.

As an Anglo-Catholic (Church of England) I agree with you that receiving Communion on the Camino is a tremendous source of strength, but sadly, officially we are not welcomed (nor are any other members of Churches that are not in full communion with the Roman-Catholic Church - and yes, that means also Espicopalians) to do so by the Roman-Catholic Church. As I arrived after more than 3,000 km pilgrimage in Santiago I actually heard it pronounced in the cathedral itself 'please remember that only Roman-Catholics that are in good standing with our own Church are allowed to come forward to receive the Holy Sacrament.

What I did during my pilgrimage, but bear in mind that I am a fluent Spanish speaker, was always to ask the officiating priest if I would be allowed to take Communion, explaining that I did believe in the true presence of Christ in the Eucharist. Most of them welcomed me, some went out of their way to do so, some rejected me. The sad reality of the divided body of Christ ...

As for the woman you mentioned not consuming the host immediately, that is one of the several reasons many priests are so careful about whom to give the sacrament to/the reason for the aforementioned announcement in Santiago cathedral. It is a holy/sacred thing and somebody partaking in it without being aware of that sacredness is frankly a huge problem. SY

Thank you. Yes, this latter situation was shocking to all of us.

 

[Castilian]

If a Christian is unable to partake in worship within their own denomination (which happens for the members all the reformed churches when travelling in Northern Spain)

Let's recall there are some reformed churches in Spain too. For example, a map showing where are churches that are part of the Anglican Communion can be found at: www.anglicanos.org/web_iglesia_anglicana/g_general/g_sit_iglesia_anglicana_espana.html As you can see from the map, they are present in Pamplona on the Camino Francés, in Bilbao on the Camino del Norte (and on the Camino Olvidado), in Oviedo on the Camino Primitivo...

 

[MichaelB10398]

The Catholic Church has a closed communion. When in doubt you are encouraged to talk directly to the priest of the church you are attending.

To avoid such circumstances as the individual not eating the host mentioned above; if you are not familiar with rite then you should not be participating. In such a situation it is far better to remain seated, observe, and learn. If what is observed is of more interest to you, then talk to your local Catholic Church upon your return.

There is an alternative position that if an individual feels comfortable, feels led, to partake of communion then do so. However, this action only comforts the individual and is often viewed as violating the position of the Catholic Church. Talk to the local priest before the start of mass remains the best advice I know. Their response will be varied as has already been stated above.

The Camino is for all regardless of religion, belief, or faith. However, the moment we enter a Catholic Church we enter into a sacred community that has survived for thousands of years. Its teachings and rites are held extremely sacred by their members. I have heard often that we should follow our conscience, but always remember to be respectful.

 

[Deleted member 36903]

I am an Anglican but have not been confirmed, so therefore I understand that it would be wrong of me to go to the altar for Communion, but I can go and receive a blessing, signalling this by crossing my arms across my chest. At the Mass in English I attended at the cathedral in SdC, the priest, Father Postlethwaite, told anyone who did not wish to take communion, but who wished to receive a blessing to do the same as I do in the Church of England.

 

[MTtoCamino]

Very interesting discussion, as we each have a bit different take as per our training. I raised by the local church carpenter & went to a catholic school was always accepted to take communion. Even though I was never baptized Catholic. I accept communion in every Christian church. We each follow our faith.

99.99% on this forum seem to be very good people. So thank you for that!

 

[Anemone del Camino]

I'm surprised people would be told that of baptised they could take communion. It is my understanding that to take communion one must have had their first communion, with the education and ritual that comes with it. Also, at least for some, that one must have gone to confession before taking communion. No?

 

[Rebekah Scott]

I won't comment on laws and rules of churches. All I can say is right at the high point of the Mass, the priest, quoting Jesus' words at the Last Supper, holds up the host and says, "Take this, ALL OF YOU, and eat it. This is my body..."
And a moment later, he holds up the chalice, and says, "take this ALL OF YOU, and drink from it..."

Not sure what part of that people don't understand.

 

[cynwhite]

One of my companions on the way is Catholic, and we attended the Mass where we could find it. I am from a non-Catholic tradition that welcomes all Christians to participate in Communion/Eucharist. I knew that the Roman Catholic Church does not offer the Eucharist to non-Catholics. And I knew that I could go forward to ask for a blessing, which I did.

For me hospitality goes both ways. As a guest in a faith community that provided me opportunity to reflect and worship, it seemed inhospitable of me to 1) pretend to be Catholic, or b) insist on asking for something that would be awkward or offensive to my hosts. I found moment after moment of grace, and never experienced disappointment.

 

[MichaelSG]

I won't comment on laws and rules of churches. All I can say is right at the high point of the Mass, the priest, quoting Jesus' words at the Last Supper, holds up the host and says, "Take this, ALL OF YOU, and eat it. This is my body..."
And a moment later, he holds up the chalice, and says, "take this ALL OF YOU, and drink from it..."

Not sure what part of that people don't understand.

I'm pretty sure that quote was from when Christ was in a room with a dozen or so apostles, not during the sermon on the mount.

 

[fraluchi]

[...] if you are not familiar with rite then you should not be participating. In this situation is it far better to remain seated, observe, and learn. [...]

... and investigate what Rebekah so rightly mentions. Notice the crowds lining up for Communion who don't worry (ignore?) about the "rules and regulations".

 

[CaminoDebrita]

Thank you to all for information and opinion. I appreciate the insight, sentiments, and advice. At this point, I feel that I have the information that I was looking for.

Again, thank you, and I respect you all very much---and appreciate you---and yes, love many of you here.

Cheers, and happy holy days.

Deb

 

[joanneking]

At the last Pilgrims Mass I attended in Santiago there was a very clear instruction given, in many languages including English, that those "baptised into the Catholoc faith" were invited to take communion.

I never do, but that is a personal decision.

Yes, I heard that too in Santiago recently.

 

[zzotte]

As far as I know the answer is no unless there is danger of death or other "grave circumstances". and
"In cases of danger of death or grave necessity, Catholic ministers may (by the permission of their conference of bishops) give the Eucharist to Protestant Christians who (a) cannot approach a minister of their own community, (b) who ask for the sacraments, (c) who share the Church's faith concerning the Eucharist, and (d) are properly disposed to receiving it (CIC 844:4)." Or you convert to the Catholic faith.

Zzotte

 

[DurhamParish]

I also am a member of the Episcopal Church here in the US. When attending a Catholic Church here, or anywhere else in the world, I always observe the Catholic Church's rules on communion. The one exception that I make is taking Communion as a Pilgrim on the Camino. On the Camino the Masses, including Holy Communion, mean a lot to me spiritually. I will not try to justify that decision, even though I know it is wrong in the eyes of the Catholic Church. It's just what I do.

 

[SabsP]

It's all good Deb.And good to see how this thread stayed civil.

And btw not all Catholics will always partake in the Communion when invited.

 

[jbear]

Just one thing to add, I know the Eastern Catholic Church invites Roman Catholics to partake in the Eucharist, and have been told by by priests from both that the reciprocal is true as well. Of course, this assumes you are able to do so with your home church.

 

[julia-t]

While I am Church of England (Anglican, Protestant), and have been both baptised and confirmed into this faith, I was educated for most of my school years in a Roman Catholic boarding school. While we non-Catholics rarely went to Mass or received Holy Communion, we learned a deep understanding of the Catholic faith.

I've only walked for a few days (so far) but I did attend the Pilgrim Mass in Roncesvalles. I knew it would be wrong for me to take Communion though I really wanted to. I did go up to the altar and receive a blessing. I tried explaining to several people why a non-Catholic should not receive Communion, yet few seemed to be bothered about it, and said they'd go up for it if they felt like it.

Maybe it's a Camino lesson for me to learn, that while I really would like to receive Communion I cannot, yet those who aren't particularly bothered will do so regardless. But even in those first days I found myself feeling resentful of their nonchalance. I'm sure God and the Holy Spirit forgives them, so why does it feel like a sin for me to do what they do?

 

[MTtoCamino]

While I am Church of England (Anglican, Protestant), and have been both baptised and confirmed into this faith, I was educated for most of my school years in a Roman Catholic boarding school. While we non-Catholics rarely went to Mass or received Holy Communion, we learned a deep understanding of the Catholic faith.

I've only walked for a few days (so far) but I did attend the Pilgrim Mass in Roncesvalles. I knew it would be wrong for me to take Communion though I really wanted to. I did go up to the altar and receive a blessing. I tried explaining to several people why a non-Catholic should not receive Communion, yet few seemed to be bothered about it, and said they'd go up for it if they felt like it.

Maybe it's a Camino lesson for me to learn, that while I really would like to receive Communion I cannot, yet those who aren't particularly bothered will do so regardless. But even in those first days I found myself feeling resentful of their nonchalance. I'm sure God and the Holy Spirit forgives them, so why does it feel like a sin for me to do what they do?

Pray sister, the Holy Spirit gives light to many things

 

[Anniesantiago]

If I feel like taking Communion, I do.
If I don't, I don't.
I'm not a practicing Catholic.
I'm a Catholic/Mormon/Pagan/Jew.
But I figure God knows my intentions and can sort it out.

 

[obinjatoo@yahoo.com]

R

I won't comment on laws and rules of churches. All I can say is right at the high point of the Mass, the priest, quoting Jesus' words at the Last Supper, holds up the host and says, "Take this, ALL OF YOU, and eat it. This is my body..."
And a moment later, he holds up the chalice, and says, "take this ALL OF YOU, and drink from it..."

Not sure what part of that people don't understand.

Thanks for that response. Before I shoot my mouth off which it looks I'm going to do anyway and to quote somebody I don't know who, "What would Jesus Do?" The answer is obvious to me.

 

[Sue M]

We organised a pilgrimage to Santiago in June and took an Anglican Bishop with us. He was allowed to celebrate Communion in Roncesvalles Abbey, the church at O'Cebreiro, San Isodoro in Leon and in a side chapel in Santiago Cathedral. Previously when walking by myself I have gone to Mass in various churches. As Jesuit Gerry Hughes once said on a Retreat I attended, "Can we inter-communicate? As a good Catholic I have to say absolutely not - but if Jesus tells you something different, who am I to argue?".

 

[movinmaggie]

As an Episcopalian, I took Holy Communion along the Way, and found it to be very comforting and important to my journey and spiritual growth.

I did have some really wonderful Protestant friends tell me that technically, they could not take Communion as it was given in Catholic churches, but I --as an Episcopalian who recites the Nicene Creed every Sunday--felt that it was appropriate. I had also done a bit of research to learn that it was appropriate and acceptable for me to do this.

Question:

1. Have any of the rest of you struggled with whether it is acceptable or not?

2. I had read in this forum--somewhere--that Episcopalians were okay to take Communion.

This is not a religious debate, but just information gathering, so please be careful and don't violate Forum policy here.

I will note that the first and only time I have EVER seen a priest leave Communion providing was when a woman took Communion at SdC and did not eat the wafer. He literally raced down the aisle to have her eat the wafer. All in attendance were rather shocked that she did not seem to know what the significance was and just tried to quietly respect the situation as it unfolded.
Hi Deb, I'll keep this brief so as not to get too 'far off' the Camino. As a non-catholic, I did do a self-retreat at a a Benedictine Monastery in Elgin, Scotland several years ago. While I did not partake of communion, with arms crossed in front of my heart, I did received a blessing from the Abbott. It's something you do that tells them you are not of the Catholic religion.
Thanks--Deb

 

[movinmaggie]

Guess my msg did not go through last time. I will keep it brief so as not to tread too far off the Camino. As a non Catholic, I was still able to do a self-retreat for 10 days at a Benedictine Monastery in Scotland several years ago. While I did not partake of Communion at the services, I did cross my arms in front of my heart and received a blessing from the priest. It is a commonly understood gesture.

 

[MichaelB10398]

While I am Church of England (Anglican, Protestant), and have been both baptised and confirmed into this faith, I was educated for most of my school years in a Roman Catholic boarding school. While we non-Catholics rarely went to Mass or received Holy Communion, we learned a deep understanding of the Catholic faith.

I've only walked for a few days (so far) but I did attend the Pilgrim Mass in Roncesvalles. I knew it would be wrong for me to take Communion though I really wanted to. I did go up to the altar and receive a blessing. I tried explaining to several people why a non-Catholic should not receive Communion, yet few seemed to be bothered about it, and said they'd go up for it if they felt like it.

Maybe it's a Camino lesson for me to learn, that while I really would like to receive Communion I cannot, yet those who aren't particularly bothered will do so regardless. But even in those first days I found myself feeling resentful of their nonchalance. I'm sure God and the Holy Spirit forgives them, so why does it feel like a sin for me to do what they do?

Julia, I don't think we sin in ignorance; we only sin when knowing we are doing wrong and choose to do so anyway. As MT mentioned above, the Holy Spirit guides and we should encourage all to follow his quiet guidance. One thing to consider, where the Spirit dwells there is no sin.

God bless you for your respectful observance and God bless those who follow the Spirit in all things. We cannot identify or judge these things; no need to resent anyone. We daily should put ourselves and everyone else in God's tender care and trust that his will be done.

 

[rappahannock_rev]

As an Episcopalian, I took Holy Communion along the Way, and found it to be very comforting and important to my journey and spiritual growth.

I did have some really wonderful Protestant friends tell me that technically, they could not take Communion as it was given in Catholic churches, but I --as an Episcopalian who recites the Nicene Creed every Sunday--felt that it was appropriate. I had also done a bit of research to learn that it was appropriate and acceptable for me to do this.

Question:

1. Have any of the rest of you struggled with whether it is acceptable or not?

2. I had read in this forum--somewhere--that Episcopalians were okay to take Communion.

This is not a religious debate, but just information gathering, so please be careful and don't violate Forum policy here.

I will note that the first and only time I have EVER seen a priest leave Communion providing was when a woman took Communion at SdC and did not eat the wafer. He literally raced down the aisle to have her eat the wafer. All in attendance were rather shocked that she did not seem to know what the significance was and just tried to quietly respect the situation as it unfolded.

Thanks--Deb

At my parish I never ask to see anyone's 'paperwork'. I recite the Invitation to Communion from the Book of Common Prayer (1928), and anyone who can then come in good faith to the rail is offered Communion. If I err I prefer to err on the side of inclusivity.

I'll stack my catholic bona fides up against anybody's, but I also feel that it would be disrespectful for me to enter a Roman church and then deliberately violate its 'closed communion' rule.' On the Camino I go to Mass just about every chance I get, but I do not receive. Its more a matter of common courtesy than theology for me. (But I confess that I'm not much of a theologian!)

 

[Beth_J]

As others have mentioned, the answer by the rules of the Catholic Church is you must be baptized and in good standing (not really baptized in the Catholic faith as they recognize the baptism as Lutherans and Anglicans --- we don't get "re-baptized" if we convert). I'm a baptized and confirmed Lutheran and a practicing Episcopalian (Anglican). I come from a family that is 1/2 Catholic and was raised knowing "the rules." The Catholic side of the family could not take communion in the Lutheran Church when visiting (Missouri Synod - I know this is different in different Synods) and the Lutherans could not partake in the Catholic side. As mentioned - you can cross your arms and get a blessing. As a practicing Anglican now - I still understand despite our very strong ties to the Catholic church (we often have visiting Catholic Priests) - we are still not in full communion with the Roman Catholic Church. And technically, since I'm taking communion in a different church, I can not take the Lutheran communion when I go with my brothers to church per Lutheran rules. Is God going to strike you down if you go up for communion? Of course not. I was raised that this was just the respectful thing to do - to honor the church you were in's beliefs.

 

[Harington]

First of all you might want to join this private forum here https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/social-forums/non-catholics-on-the-camino.3/ where such matters can be discussed without offending the forum rules. That groups has been very quiet, so participation would be beneficial to a lot of us.

As an Anglo-Catholic (Church of England) I agree with you that receiving Communion on the Camino is a tremendous source of strength, but sadly, officially we are not welcomed (nor are any other members of Churches that are not in full communion with the Roman-Catholic Church - and yes, that means also Espicopalians) to do so by the Roman-Catholic Church. As I arrived after more than 3,000 km pilgrimage in Santiago I actually heard it pronounced in the cathedral itself 'please remember that only Roman-Catholics that are in good standing with our own Church are allowed to come forward to receive the Holy Sacrament.

What I did during my pilgrimage, but bear in mind that I am a fluent Spanish speaker, was always to ask the officiating priest if I would be allowed to take Communion, explaining that I did believe in the true presence of Christ in the Eucharist. Most of them welcomed me, some went out of their way to do so, some rejected me. The sad reality of the divided body of Christ ...

As for the woman you mentioned not consuming the host immediately, that is one of the several reasons many priests are so careful about whom to give the sacrament to/the reason for the aforementioned announcement in Santiago cathedral. It is a holy/sacred thing and somebody partaking in it without being aware of that sacredness is frankly a huge problem. SY

I am a Roman Catholic, but feel strongly that when on a true pilgrimage, Our Lord should be available to all who believe. I am going to dare to say the obvious: how would an officiating priest know if one was Catholic or not? If you present yourself you will not be turned away. Jesus didn't turn people away.
I too saw someone take the Host and not eat it, and was pounced on by about three Cathedral officials.

 

[SYates]

Nobody that sees me partaking in Mass would suspect I am not a Roman-Catholic, my reason I ask for permission is out of respect. Buen Camino, SY

 

[CaminoDebrita]

At my parish I never ask to see anyone's 'paperwork'. I recite the Invitation to Communion from the Book of Common Prayer (1928), and anyone who can then come in good faith to the rail is offered Communion. If I err I prefer to err on the side of inclusivity.

I'll stack my catholic bona fides up against anybody's, but I also feel that it would be disrespectful for me to enter a Roman church and then deliberately violate its 'closed communion' rule.' On the Camino I go to Mass just about every chance I get, but I do not receive. Its more a matter of common courtesy than theology for me. (But I confess that I'm not much of a theologian!)

Thank you, Father. Very helpful.

 

[SabsP]

And let us not forget that local parish priests are closer to " the flock " and have a more lenient approach to all things liturgical than the clergy in the big cathedrals. Again my very humble opinion.

Give it time...,most probably only in 200 years , and there wil be another Vatican Consilium with new more " open " ideas.

Just another thing : in this country Belgium whch is predominantly Catholic ( if only in numbers seeing our churches are empty except for the older generation that attends ) the crossing of the arms, as a way of not wanting to receive Communion but only a blessing, is not something that is widely known. I can imagine that this might be the case too in Spain. So priests do not always know how to react.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

just for the record: walking the camino with the people around you is a very real form of Communion, open to everyone. The holy spirit inhabits that place just as much as any exclusive ritual in any church. Jesus said "Where two or three are gathered in my name, there I am, in the midst of them." As pilgrims minister to one another, they are Christ's hands, voice, and actions.

 

[julia-t]

I also feel that it would be disrespectful for me to enter a Roman church and then deliberately violate its 'closed communion' rule.

Yes, that's my feeling exactly.

I was raised that this was just the respectful thing to do - to honor the church you were in's beliefs

Yes, me too.

I know no priest would know if I were Catholic or not, and I know I would be unlikely to be struck down for taking Catholic Communion, but I would know and feel guilty. I like SYates suggestion of asking permission first - but I will seriously have to work on my Spanish!

 

[SYates]

I could tell you what I ask, but the problem would be to understand the priests answer and his subsequent questions about your beliefs regarding the Eucharist. SY

 

[David]

This is a difficult question to answer properly as we skirt precariously on the edge of discussing religious views so please read what you will find below as historical, that you can check for yourself, therefore not my 'views' -
for me, well, I am an Unitarian Franciscan and as far as the Roman Church are concerned, no matter how much they may love me, I am a heretic. Clubs are clubs and they each have their own rules and I think that we should abide by them if only out of courtesy. "When in Rome do as Romans do" does not cut it in this case as if we aren't a full member of the Roman Church then we are not entitled to the full benefits, which include receiving their version of Communion. So when I go up to the altar I cross my arms, bow my head, and wait for a blessing and I have yet to not feel something marvellous happen at that point.

I would mention though, that what the Gospels say is that when they were all gathered at a meal bread and wine were distributed.
If one reads the Gospels one finds that the bread and wine were distributed at completely different times. At the beginning of the meal Yeshua said grace and broke the bread into pieces and said "do this, in remembrance of me". The point here is that it was the breaking of the bread that was to be done in remembrance, not the eating of it, as the broken bread represented his broken body.
At the end of the meal he shared the wine and said "do this as often as you drink it in remembrance of me" - note the "as often as you drink it."

So the Communion that is now generally accepted has only a passing similarity to what happened at the original Passover meal.
The early Christians, as part of their ritual, ended their morning service with a community (communion) meal and "did this in remembrance of him" with both bread at the beginning and wine at the end of the meal and all invited shared - as they do today within Unitarian churches, all are welcome - I do not remember any exclusions from Yeshua nor, actually, do I remember Yeshua excluding anyone in the Gospels.

So - what the Romans do is particular to their understanding and they have the right to accept or ban whom they wish and I, as a happy heretic, am content to go along with that.

Buen Camino.

 

[julia-t]

I could tell you what I ask, but the problem would be to understand the priests answer and his subsequent questions about your beliefs regarding the Eucharist. SY

I realise that, but thank you. I have also only just realised it's YOUR book I have on my kindle! So thank you again, very much, for all your helpful advice which I took advantage of before setting off on the first few steps of my Camino.

 

[rappahannock_rev]

"Let us not forget that local parish priests are closer to " the flock " and have a more lenient approach to all things liturgical than the clergy in the big cathedrals."

Absolutely correct.

 

[CaminoDebrita]

I realise that, but thank you. I have also only just realised it's YOUR book I have on my kindle! So thank you again, very much, for all your helpful advice which I took advantage of before setting off on the first few steps of my Camino.

Isn't it impressive that we have wonderful authors and helpers on this forum? Seriously, purchasing her book was part of the Joy of Camino for me during a somewhat difficult year, which--I will add--was made tolerable because of planning and reading.

 

[Introibo]

To receive communion in a Catholic church you must have been baptised into the Catholic church and
also "be in good standing". This is generally accepted as having made a good confession at least once a
year. ( your "Easter duties" ). That is what the church teaches.

I've followed the thread and have the greatest sympathy for all that has been said and respect others
viewpoint.

The great scandal that comes to Catholics is when the Blessed Sacrament is abused. Whilst in Santiago
I saw a young girl receive the Blessed Sacrament, laughing and giggling as she did, and then walk away
without having consumed the host. The elderly priest followed her as best he could and so did I. We
cornered the girl and gave her the choice of consuming the host in front of the priest or returning the
host to him. Some in the congregation seemed shocked at how insistent the priest and I were. I believe
in the Real Presence and no one was going to abuse My Lord.

Every one is welcome into a Catholic church, but we are all there as guests.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Maybe it's a Camino lesson for me to learn, that while I really would like to receive Communion I cannot, yet those who aren't particularly bothered will do so regardless. But even in those first days I found myself feeling resentful of their nonchalance. I'm sure God and the Holy Spirit forgives them, so why does it feel like a sin for me to do what they do?

Without getting on a slippery slope, I have to admit that I was strangely annoyed, and defensive, when I read about this nonchanlace. I was raised Catholic, went to Catholic school, grand mother recited the rosary daily, although I am not practicing and even question my faith. And yet I felt very protective of the Church reading these posts. Strange isn't it. I guess it's all part of "It's my Camino and I will do what I please". I would have paid to have seen this priest run behind the woman who walked off with the host! No wonder the traditional way of doing it is on the tongue ;0) No, it's not a souvenir. For that you visit the nuns who give you little paper stars when they bless you ;0)

 

[Scott Sweeney]

The Catholic Curch does not allow non-Catholics to receive the Eucharist. The Eucharist is what sets those of Catholic faith apart from other faiths. Not all Catholics can receive this sacrament.

I am sure nobody will go to hell for taking communion in a Catholic church but understand the church would not welcome you to receive the Eucharist
http://www.catholiceducation.org/en...s/should-non-catholics-receive-communion.html

 

[Lydia Gillen]

I am sitting here crying as I read through these posts, as I think of the brokenness of the body of Christ. The suffering, the pain, and it still goes on.

I am a committed Roman Catholic, yet I know that most of Luther's condemnations of the authorities within the church at the time were fully justified. Right down through the centuries those with responsibility often used their positions for their own pride and comfort and power, and failed to "feed my Sheep" as Peter had been requested.

What divides us are small theological technicalities. I often wonder how men can be so proud as to think that they know exactly all about God, so much so that they are determined to stick to their own way of thinking even if it means division between Christians.

Years or even centuries of 'doing' or 'thinking' does not necessarily make a thing correct. It is good to keep an open heart and mind. Often change happens from below. ( I was thrown out of the line for communion one winters morning at 7.30 by an old biddy because I had no hat on. I was eight at the time. I was so upset that I stopped going to daily Mass and so ashamed that I would not even tell my mother why. Nowadays nobody wears a hat!!)

Let me conclude with the words of the Prophet Micah said, "Let us act justly, love tenderly and walk humbly before the Lord our God."

 

[Scott Sweeney]

I am sitting here crying as I read through these posts, as I think of the brokenness of the body of Christ. The suffering, the pain, and it still goes on.

I am a committed Roman Catholic, yet I know that most of Luther's condemnations of the authorities within the church at the time were fully justified. Right down through the centuries those with responsibility often used their positions for their own pride and comfort and power, and failed to "feed my Sheep" as Peter had been requested.

What divides us are small theological technicalities. I often wonder how men can be so proud as to think that they know exactly all about God, so much so that they are determined to stick to their own way of thinking even if it means division between Christians.

Years or even centuries of 'doing' or 'thinking' does not necessarily make a thing correct. It is good to keep an open heart and mind. Often change happens from below. ( I was thrown out of the line for communion one winters morning at 7.30 by an old biddy because I had no hat on. I was eight at the time. I was so upset that I stopped going to daily Mass and so ashamed that I would not even tell my mother why. Nowadays nobody wears a hat!!)

Let me conclude with the words of the Prophet Micah said, "Let us act justly, love tenderly and walk humbly before the Lord our God."

Lydia , I completely understand your point of view and I believe we have all seen these irrational actions at a Mass. I was invited to services at a Nazarene Church once, my reply was that I was Catholic. The ministers reply was that "it doesn't matter how you worship your God as long as you are the best Catholic you can be".... that blew me away! With that said I am born and raised an Irish Catholic. My school years were Mass every morning, CCD twice a week and Mass on Sunday. I was not given the luxury of going on Saturday afternoon or evening and knowing my soul and all would be well. I am a Catholic ruled by Irish and Catholic guilt, I am a divorced Catholic (not a sin) in love with the most incredible Presbyterian women I have ever known and which God could ever create. I love her more than I would have ever believed possible but................I am not welcome to celebrate the Eucharist at Mass on Sundays. It pains me more then anyone (non Catholics) could ever understand. Can I tell myself that my belief in my God is strong enough to brush the Catholic Catechism ????

Perhaps some are, perhaps some believe that just the belief and acknowledgement of "our" Lord is enough. I don't even begin to pass judgement, or even give someones faith a second thought but if you are not a Catholic please understand the Catholic faith also. Every Catholic can pick apart what they do and don't like about the Catholic faith..........it is up to the individual. Burt I think that faith must be respected and not minimized.

 

[jeffnd]

When one receives the Eucharist, they are making a public statement saying that they are in full agreement with the beliefs and teachings of the Catholic Church. If you are a Lutheran for example, you do not. If you feel like you should be able to take Communion anyway, then already you are going against what the Church teaches. You may not agree, but those are the rules.

Imagine you were attending a Native American Pow-Wow. You wouldn't just walk into a drum circle and start playing, would you? It's the same thing with Communion in the Catholic Church. Each faith has the right to set the rules for their practices and we need respect those rules, even if we don't necessarily agree with them, or even if our intentions are good.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

May I say how much I have enjoyed this thread? No moderating needed, on such a delicate subject. I suppose that when it trully matters we all know how to behave. Bravo us!

 

[CaminoDebrita]

May I say how much I have enjoyed this thread? No moderating needed, on such a delicate subject. I suppose that when it trully matters we all know how to behave. Bravo us!

I was just thinking the exact same thing! We have become such a respectful forum. It's quite remarkable. Bravo us indeed!

 

[CaminoDebrita]

I am sitting here crying as I read through these posts, as I think of the brokenness of the body of Christ. The suffering, the pain, and it still goes on.

I am a committed Roman Catholic, yet I know that most of Luther's condemnations of the authorities within the church at the time were fully justified. Right down through the centuries those with responsibility often used their positions for their own pride and comfort and power, and failed to "feed my Sheep" as Peter had been requested.

What divides us are small theological technicalities. I often wonder how men can be so proud as to think that they know exactly all about God, so much so that they are determined to stick to their own way of thinking even if it means division between Christians.

Years or even centuries of 'doing' or 'thinking' does not necessarily make a thing correct. It is good to keep an open heart and mind. Often change happens from below. ( I was thrown out of the line for communion one winters morning at 7.30 by an old biddy because I had no hat on. I was eight at the time. I was so upset that I stopped going to daily Mass and so ashamed that I would not even tell my mother why. Nowadays nobody wears a hat!!)

Let me conclude with the words of the Prophet Micah said, "Let us act justly, love tenderly and walk humbly before the Lord our God."

I enjoy you so much. You have such a kind heart.

 

[Scott Sweeney]

As an Episcopalian, I took Holy Communion along the Way, and found it to be very comforting and important to my journey and spiritual growth.

I did have some really wonderful Protestant friends tell me that technically, they could not take Communion as it was given in Catholic churches, but I --as an Episcopalian who recites the Nicene Creed every Sunday--felt that it was appropriate. I had also done a bit of research to learn that it was appropriate and acceptable for me to do this.

Question:

1. Have any of the rest of you struggled with whether it is acceptable or not?

2. I had read in this forum--somewhere--that Episcopalians were okay to take Communion.

This is not a religious debate, but just information gathering, so please be careful and don't violate Forum policy here.

I will note that the first and only time I have EVER seen a priest leave Communion providing was when a woman took Communion at SdC and did not eat the wafer. He literally raced down the aisle to have her eat the wafer. All in attendance were rather shocked that she did not seem to know what the significance was and just tried to quietly respect the situation as it unfolded.

Thanks--Deb

In the Catholic faith , the host and wine are "ARE" the body and blood of Jesus Christ! It is not symbolic nor is it metaphorical , it is "IT IS" the body and blood of Jesus Christ our Lord. Not pretend , not metaphorically, but the body and blood of the son of God, our Lord Jesus Christ.

That is the difference between Catholics and those of other faiths, I don't proclaim we are correct and others are wrong ....but this is our belief

This is why were are who we are,

guilt ridden Catholics

 

[Maryimelda]

I won't comment on laws and rules of churches. All I can say is right at the high point of the Mass, the priest, quoting Jesus' words at the Last Supper, holds up the host and says, "Take this, ALL OF YOU, and eat it. This is my body..."
And a moment later, he holds up the chalice, and says, "take this ALL OF YOU, and drink from it..."

Not sure what part of that people don't understand.

These words were spoken by Jesus at the Last Supper. His speech finished with the words "Do this in memory of me" what he did not say was "but only if you are a baptised Catholic in good standing with the church....etc". It was a gift offered to all, but sadly the Catholic Church has put conditions on it where Jesus did not.. Remember too that when Jesus instituted The Eucharist at the Last Supper, there was no such organisation as the Catholic Church or any other formalised Christian Church for that matter, so this is why I tend to take Christ at his word and take holy communion in memory of Him. BTW I am a practising Catholic, do you think I will be burned at the stake for heresy???

 

[MichaelSG]

These words were spoken by Jesus at the Last Supper. His speech finished with the words "Do this in memory of me" what he did not say was "but only if you are a baptised Catholic in good standing with the church....etc". It was a gift offered to all, but sadly the Catholic Church has put conditions on it where Jesus did not.. Remember too that when Jesus instituted The Eucharist at the Last Supper, there was no such organisation as the Catholic Church or any other formalised Christian Church for that matter, so this is why I tend to take Christ at his word and take holy communion in memory of Him. BTW I am a practising Catholic, do you think I will be burned at the stake for heresy???

The Catholic Church does not stop anyone from receiving communion. They just set the rules for receiving communion from a Catholic priest / Eucharistic Minister in a Catholic service. I believe the Catholic church would be thrilled that non-Catholics would receive communion in their own church.

If anyone wants to know what the position of the Catholic Church is on the matter, here are some very good explanations:
http://www.usccb.org/prayer-and-wor...guidelines-for-the-reception-of-communion.cfm
http://www.catholic.com/tracts/who-can-receive-communion


.

 

[grayland]

It seems that every time this subject comes up in a thread that it can only last for a short period before religious arguments and statements start.


In accordance with the forum rules some posts have been deleted and the thread is closed for now.

 

[grayland]

The thread has been reopened by request.
Hope it can stay open. Be thoughtful before posting.
Thanks.

 

[SYates]

Thank you! SY

 

[Introibo]

When attending Mass in the Vatican during the opening week of the jubilee I was surprised to see communion being distributed using the practice of tincture. I've never seen this before. On practical terms, it did prevent people receiving communion in the hand, ensuring that the host was consumed at the place of reception.

 

[SYates]

I actually do prefer to take communion that way, but it is me that dips the consecrated host in the offered chalice. I do dislike it when somebody else places the host in my mouth. But, on the positive side, that means the Vatican was distributing communion under both kinds! SY

 

[Introibo]

The Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ are present fully under each species. Receiving both does not add anything.

Could I ask those who are not Catholic, but receive Our Lord at Mass, do you also genuflect before the Blessed Sacrament ? Do you seek out Our Lord in the tabernacle of an otherwise empty church and find solace in His presence ? Do you assist during Hours of Adoration?

The Real Presence is at the centre of Catholicism. Receiving communion is only a part of the belief

 

[DurhamParish]

Could I ask those who are not Catholic, but receive Our Lord at Mass, do you also genuflect before the Blessed Sacrament ? Do you seek out Our Lord in the tabernacle of an otherwise empty church and find solace in His presence ?

Yes.

 

[Introibo]

Then you believe in the Real Presence.

 

[MTtoCamino]

The Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ are present fully under each species. Receiving both does not add anything.

Could I ask those who are not Catholic, but receive Our Lord at Mass, do you also genuflect before the Blessed Sacrament ? Do you seek out Our Lord in the tabernacle of an otherwise empty church and find solace in His presence ? Do you assist during Hours of Adoration?

The Real Presence is at the centre of Catholicism. Receiving communion is only a part of the belief

Yes

 

[SYates]

... Could I ask those who are not Catholic, but receive Our Lord at Mass, do you also genuflect before the Blessed Sacrament ? Do you seek out Our Lord in the tabernacle of an otherwise empty church and find solace in His presence ? Do you assist during Hours of Adoration?....

Yes

 

[Anemone del Camino]

When attending Mass in the Vatican during the opening week of the jubilee I was surprised to see communion being distributed using the practice of tincture. I've never seen this before. On practical terms, it did prevent people receiving communion in the hand, ensuring that the host was consumed at the place of reception.

So I wikied tincture to ensure I knew what was being referred to, and it is what I thought... Although... Wiki says the communiant is not supposed to do the dipping herself. That is the only way I have ever seen it done. As for the host, the Dominican church I visit uses pita bread. How Montreal of us, a true "mosaic" city. The church I went to as a child has hosts that were very thick, and darker. Almost like comparing white sandwhich bread to wholesome all wheat bread. Have never seen that elsewhere.

Question: getting communion without having had a "first communion", like the beautiful ones we still see on the Camino. Is that ok? Is that new? I thought the first communion with all the teachings that come as part of the preparation was the only way to go. Thank you.

 

[David]

In UK Unitarian churches the vicar takes bread, blesses it, and breaks it into small pieces, which are then handed round, most times on a tray, as she/he speaks the relevant words of the last supper from the NT. Usually the congregation has moved to sitting in a close circle. It is not believed, in our understanding, that the bread transmutes - the bread is bread, the wine is wine - instead this is done, as instructed by Yeshua, our exemplar, "in remembrance".
The same open and vulnerable hearts are there. Our differences do not divide us, we are all of One family under the Good God.

 

[domigee]

Question: getting communion without having had a "first communion", like the beautiful ones we still see on the Camino. Is that ok? Is that new? I thought the first communion with all the teachings that come as part of the preparation was the only way to go. Thank you.

I am not aware anything has changed, 'first communion' for the young ones, with the preparation and being taught by a Cathechist is still required.
Adults converting to Catholicism also have to follow a course of 'teachings' but they don't have the special day with the nice clothes At least my husband didn't

 

[Anemone del Camino]

I am not aware anything has changed, 'first communion' for the young ones, with the preparation and being taught by a Cathechist is still required.
Adults converting to Catholicism also have to follow a course of 'teachings' but they don't have the special day with the nice clothes At least my husband didn't

I'm asking before in the first few posts on this thread it seamed as if the "condition" for being able to receive communion in a Catholic church was only baptism, giving the impression any baptised Christian was good to go, not making any mention of first communion.

 

[koilife]

Sometimes in asking "What would Jesus do?" I find myself wondering, "What did Jesus actually say?" and sometimes I'm rather surprised that what I thought he said wasn't actually what he said. I've likewise found that what I thought the Church taught (and why) wasn't actually what she teaches (or why she does).

Jesus does NOT actually say, "Take this, all of you, and eat it." Only in Matthew 26:27 is there a reference to "all of you" and that is in receiving the chalice. The other Gospel writers make no mention of "all" in their accounts, and neither does Paul in 1 Cor 11:23-26, which is the other account of what is often referred to the "institution narrative" (of the Eucharist). The Greek word that Matthew used, depending on its grammatical context, can mean either "all" of a more universal collective or "each" member of a smaller restricted group (i.e those present). In the case of Matthew 26:27, it grammatically indicates each member of the restricted group. Therefore, there simply is no basis from the institution narrative to infer a universal directive for the reception of the Eucharist. [For the record, this is not just a Catholic translation issue, it also holds with the KJV, which I double checked.]

The Roman Catholic Church does NOT teach that the person must be Roman Catholic to receive the Eucharist. Anyone who is a member of a denomination that is in full communion of belief with the Roman Catholic Church can lawfully receive (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Full_communion#List_of_Catholic_churches_in_full_communion for a rather large list). The roots of this predate Luther and the Reformation by more than FOURTEEN centuries. In 1 Cor 11, we see Paul chastising on the issue of divisions and factions (a lack of communion) in participating in the Eucharist, and he strongly condemns reception without "discerning the Lord's body" (i.e. a lack of belief, or failure to recognize that the person receives the Lord's body and not merely bread).

The issue of the necessity of a common belief (communion) was present throughout the earliest life of the Church. Even from Paul's time, people were not admitted to the Eucharistic table unless they had 1) been initiated into the Church (e.g. Baptism) and 2) received some measure of catechesis on what they were doing (else, how could they "discern" as Paul states). The first and second generation inheritors of the teachings of the apostles were consistently faced with differences in belief and repeatedly had to reinforce the necessity of communion of belief. St. Justyn Martyr (also recognized a saint by Anglican/Episcopalian and Orthodox churches) explained, a little over 100 years after the death of Christ, “we call this food Eucharist, and no one may take part in it unless he believes that what we teach is true, has received baptism for the forgiveness of sins and new birth, and lives in keeping with what Christ taught.”

Thus, the issue of communion of belief as a fundamental condition for the reception of Eucharist is in the very DNA of the Roman Catholic Church. You see it also (and arguably more strongly enforced) in the Orthodox Churches.

 

[koilife]

I'm asking before in the first few posts on this thread it seamed as if the "condition" for being able to receive communion in a Catholic church was only baptism, giving the impression any baptised Christian was good to go, not making any mention of first communion.

Catechesis is required for reception of "First Communion."

"The administration of the Most Holy Eucharist to children requires that they have sufficient knowledge and careful preparation so that they understand the mystery of Christ according to their capacity and are able to receive the body of Christ with faith and devotion." (Code of Canon Law, 913.1)

 

[koilife]

I am not aware anything has changed, 'first communion' for the young ones, with the preparation and being taught by a Cathechist is still required.
Adults converting to Catholicism also have to follow a course of 'teachings' but they don't have the special day with the nice clothes At least my husband didn't

Most times, adults enter the Catholic Church at the Easter Vigil, so your husband is something of an exception in that regard.

 

[koilife]

The Real Presence is at the centre of Catholicism. Receiving communion is only a part of the belief

Belief in the Real Presence is not limited to Catholicism. And, it is only part of the belief of the Church that must be present to be considered in full communion.

 

[domigee]

In my experience, no. My husband could not take communion in the Catholic church and he was a baptised and confirmed Anglican. I was allowed to take communion in his church though, after talking to the priest, but I have since learnt that it isn't generally allowed either.
And as another poster previously said (I'm sorry, I can't remember who and can't find the post now ), not all Catholics can receive holy communion either. If you haven't followed the teachings of the Church, for ex if you have remarried etc..., you cannot take Communion.

 

[domigee]

Most times, adults enter the Catholic Church at the Easter Vigil, so your husband is something of an exception in that regard.

It was on Maundy Thursday.

 

[MaggieFitz]

A non-Roman Catholic Christian who has questions about reception of Holy Communion in an RC church might want to consider consulting a Catholic priest in their home area before embarking on their journey. If you have Catholic friends, they might be able to identify one who would be good to chat with. Canon 844, which governs this subject, is not simple, and the concept of being "properly disposed" is really too much to get into in a forum such as this. The potential for misunderstanding & hurt feelings is pretty high here, so consulting a "subject-matter expert" might be very helpful.

 

[VNwalking]

Mods, thank you for re-opening this thread. It's been a learning experience.
And I'm fascinated; in my tradition the only injunction is 'Come and see for yourself' without any intermediary ritual. This is a totally different universe. Thank you everyone, for the very civil sharing...it is quite an education for this outsider.

 

[Betty Bauer]

If one is a member of a parish outside of the Roman Catholic Church, which has valid orders, one is allowed to receive communion at a Roman Catholic mass if that is the only possibility for services at that point. This isn't common among Episcopalians/Anglicans though, and can be a headache. I myself changed to the Roman Church after some friends and I were traveling in England, and for the first time in our friendship I had to attend a separate service from them. It's hard not to feel/take it personally.

 

[DurhamParish]

Then you believe in the Real Presence.

I'm not really sure.

I think you are looking for a 'black-or-white' type of an answer, so I guess I have to say that I don't believe it 100%, but The Eucharist does have great meaning to me. I'm not partaking in The Eucharist lightly.

 

[Introibo]

I wasn't really expecting an answer to my question to be honest. If I had I'd have framed it less bluntly.
Apologies if it came across as a challenge.

They're the questions I ask myself when, oft in the stilly night, doubt gathers round me. I know that if I wish
to remain in the Catholic Church I have to believe it 100%. In my heart, it's easy. In my intellect ? I guess
that's where faith plays it's part. "The adherence of the intellect to the Truth revealed by God"

 

[VNwalking]

This is an internet forum?! (You guys are going really deep and being incredibly honest...I'm on the sidelines with my jaw hanging open. Beautiful...I bow to you,)

 

[DurhamParish]

I wasn't really expecting an answer to my question to be honest. If I had I'd have framed it less bluntly.
Apologies if it came across as a challenge.

Thanks. It was an honest question and I thought it deserved an honest answer.

The're the questions I ask myself when, oft in the stilly night, doubt gathers round me. I know that if I wish
to remain in the Catholic Church I have to believe it 100%. In my heart, it's easy. In my intellect ? I guess
that's where faith plays it's part. "The adherence of the intellect to the Truth revealed by God"

In our (the Episcopal Church of the US) Book of Common Prayer, in the Baptismal Covenant where the celebrant asks a series of questions such as "Will you continue in the apostles' teaching . . . etc.", "Will you persevere in resisting evil . . . etc.", "Will you seek and serve Christ . . . . etc.", the response is "I will, with God's help."

All we can ask for when it comes to articles of faith is that we try, and trust in God's help.

Peace be with you.

 

[Introibo]

Et cum spirtitu tuo

 

[VNwalking]

DP and Introibo, thank you for being such gentlemen....in the very best sense of the word.

 

[CaminoDebrita]

I really appreciate this thread. Thank you, all.

 

[SYates]

I wasn't really expecting an answer to my question to be honest. If I had I'd have framed it less bluntly.
Apologies if it came across as a challenge.

They're the questions I ask myself when, oft in the stilly night, doubt gathers round me. I know that if I wish
to remain in the Catholic Church I have to believe it 100%. In my heart, it's easy. In my intellect ? I guess
that's where faith plays it's part. "The adherence of the intellect to the Truth revealed by God"

I didn't read nor answered it as a challenge, I took it as it was meant, an open, curious and more than everything else a sincere question. As for the second part of your post - we are all in the same boat, even if we are sailing different ships over the same ocean of faith with its waves of doubt and try to weather the storms that try to divide us ... Buen Camino, SY

 

[domigee]

Beautifully said.

 

[pilgrim b]

Late to forum

The Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ are present fully under each species. Receiving both does not add anything.

Could I ask those who are not Catholic, but receive Our Lord at Mass, do you also genuflect before the Blessed Sacrament ? Do you seek out Our Lord in the tabernacle of an otherwise empty church and find solace in His presence ? Do you assist during Hours of Adoration?

The Real Presence is at the centre of Catholicism. Receiving communion is only a part of the belief

Yet another Yes, Introibo my friend and brother.

 

[pilgrim b]

They're the questions I ask myself when, oft in the stilly night, doubt gathers round me. I know that if I wish
to remain in the Catholic Church I have to believe it 100%. In my heart, it's easy. In my intellect ? I guess
that's where faith plays it's part. "The adherence of the intellect to the Truth revealed by God

There you nailed it Introibo, faith/ heart/ trusting and open mindedness to further understanding.

 

[CaminoDebrita]

Thanks. It was an honest question and I thought it deserved an honest answer.



In our (the Episcopal Church of the US) Book of Common Prayer, in the Baptismal Covenant where the celebrant asks a series of questions such as "Will you continue in the apostles' teaching . . . etc.", "Will you persevere in resisting evil . . . etc.", "Will you seek and serve Christ . . . . etc.", the response is "I will, with God's help."

All we can ask for when it comes to articles of faith is that we try, and trust in God's help.

Peace be with you.

I loved your answer, @DurhamParish .

Today was a day of miracles, and I want to just make a note about that.

When we consider "things that happen" and I mean things that make us stop, notice, and be still--and know that [He] is God--it is, to me, God's communication to us that all is well, and that we are thought of, and that our prayers are answered and/or listened to. We get what we need, and what nourishes us.

--Today, I communicated very well with a family member who has just lost her mother. I felt the holy spirit in me as I talked her through some very difficult feelings.

--I found, today, in a local thrift shop some items that spoke very strongly to me--a set of dishes identical to those that had been my grandparents', and my grandparents and parents and I were exceptionally close. God wraps me in gifts this time of the year, and while dishes may sound mundane, to be nourished and fed--both body and soul--is a blessed event.

Today, instead of feeling bad and defensive--as I had a rough moment earlier--I turned on some Loreena McKennit music and stopped my thoughts.

I'm very appreciative for this day, and this thread.

 

[MaggieFitz]

I loved your answer, @DurhamParish .
<snip>

--I found, today, in a local thrift shop some items that spoke very strongly to me--a set of dishes identical to those that had been my grandparents', and my grandparents and parents and I were exceptionally close. God wraps me in gifts this time of the year, and while dishes may sound mundane, to be nourished and fed--both body and soul--is a blessed event.

The dishes aren't mundane. They are a Valentine from Him. (Not seasonal, I know, but that is how I think of such happenings!)

 

[Anniesantiago]

The Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ are present fully under each species. Receiving both does not add anything.

Could I ask those who are not Catholic, but receive Our Lord at Mass, do you also genuflect before the Blessed Sacrament ? Do you seek out Our Lord in the tabernacle of an otherwise empty church and find solace in His presence ? Do you assist during Hours of Adoration?

Yes

 

[annakappa]

Most times, adults enter the Catholic Church at the Easter Vigil, so your husband is something of an exception in that regard.

Adults entering the Catholic Church at the Easter vigil is a very appropriate moment, but not the only moment. I received the Holy Sacrament for the first time at our wedding Mass.
One of my granddaughters just last month received her First Communion at the rather late age of 12. She received a shortened version of Catechism and did not wear a white dress, but however did wear a lovely dress. Our youngest grandson is receiving the traditional year- long classes of Catechism and will receive his First Comunion next year on Corpus Christi. One of the requirements, however, before receiving your First Communion is to go to Confession and in the case of children here, they receive a certificate.

 

[VNwalking]

This is the most profound and wonderful thread in a long time.
Thank you all for your open-hearted and beautiful contributions--and the many ways of expressing what is a profound and inexpressible mystery.
I do not understand much of the ecclesiastical context, of course, but in spite of our differences there's obvious community and connection...at the deepest possible level.

 

[DurhamParish]

I loved your answer, @DurhamParish .

Thanks.

--I found, today, in a local thrift shop some items that spoke very strongly to me--a set of dishes identical to those that had been my grandparents', and my grandparents and parents and I were exceptionally close. God wraps me in gifts this time of the year, and while dishes may sound mundane, to be nourished and fed--both body and soul--is a blessed event.

Having been married to Mrs. Durham Parish for over 32 years now, I fully understand the importance of a set of dishes, especially a set that have a pattern with an emotional tie. I'm glad they brought you comfort.

Today, instead of feeling bad and defensive--as I had a rough moment earlier--I turned on some Loreena McKennit music and stopped my thoughts.

A couple of weeks ago I found her album "Live From The Alhambra". It is essentially the material from her "Book Of Secrets" and "Ancient Muse" albums performed live at the Alhambra. It is great, and I can just imagine what it would have been like to be there and experience a concert like that in that beautiful setting.

 

[AlwynWellington]

Firstly, thanks for re-opening this thread. I was away on an intensive course and only came across it after it had been closed. I have greatly enjoyed

Could I ask those who are not Catholic, but receive Our Lord at Mass, do you also genuflect before the Blessed Sacrament ? Do you seek out Our Lord in the tabernacle of an otherwise empty church and find solace in His presence ?
The Real Presence is at the centre of Catholicism. Receiving communion is only a part of the belief

Yes. But with a small distinction.
Belief in the Real Presence is not confined to those who have Pope Francis et al as their first bishop.
Another rock of catholicism is the creeds agreed to by the Church many many days ago. These are read each Sunday in many strands of the Church, East and West.

 

[AlwynWellington]

Beautiful...I bow to you

No, Viranani, not to us. You and I and others walk together.

 

[AlwynWellington]

Et cum spirtitu tuo

And also with you, Introibo.

 

[AlwynWellington]

Firstly, thanks for re-opening this thread. I was away on an intensive course and only came across it after it had been closed. I have greatly enjoyed

About 15 years ago I met a woman (and we later married) who was born into the Roman version of the catholic faith.

The first liturgical thing we did together was attend sung Compline (night prayer) in my Anglican cathedral on Ash Wednesday.

When she invited me to go to Mass with her on Sunday I raised the question of receiving Communion. Her reply: I would not invite you to a meal and then refuse to feed you.

A few years later she was asked to read the Gospel and provide a homily for a young friends wedding at a Roman Catholic church some considerable distance from our home. At the invitation to Communion the presiding priest said "My bishop says 'If this is a special occasion for you and you believe as we do then you are welcome to receive Communion.' "

I understand this to be a pastoral approach (an important part of being a bishop or priest) rather than a rules based way of doing things.

 

[Introibo]

If only the local incumbents showed the same pastoral approach to the celebration of the "Extraordinary Form" of Mass