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Daft question - External packing of Leki Micro Vario Trekking poles - Z-type

Ge1ert

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
I will
Does anyone have a method of attaching these z-poles to the outside of a pack (edited), when FOLDED? Not including in side pockets and not including inside the pack. I've looked online and can't find anyone who's managed this. Also, can't see anything on YouTube.
Very similar to this type. https://trekandmountain.com/2020/01...series-micro-vario-carbon-trekking-poles-195/
In this article it mentions that it's a disadvantage of them. I trekked through northern Norway last year with them taking up the room in an Osprey Xenith side mesh pocket. I'd rather free that up.
Thanks in advance.
G
 
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Ge1ert

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
I will
Sorry, I didn't make it clear at all. I want to know if anyone has a way of attaching the z-poles to the outside when folded. Lots of tight spaces and scrambles up mountain trails.
Thanks, though, Davebugg 👍
 

C clearly

Moderator
Staff member
Camino(s) past & future
Frances (2012, 2014, 2015, 2016), VDLP (2017), Mozarabe (2018), Vasco/Bayona (2019)
Why not put an elastic band of some sort (or wider piece of elastic material), and then just attach to whatever straps/fittings you have on your pack? For tight spaces and scrambles, they will likely still be awkward.
 
D

Deleted member 67185

Guest
Sorry, I didn't make it clear at all. I want to know if anyone has a way of attaching the z-poles to the outside when folded. Lots of tight spaces and scrambles up mountain trails.
Thanks, though, Davebugg 👍
I understood the question. The picture shows extended poles, but they work collapsed, too. I've used the suggestions with collapsed poles while backpacking.

You can also tuck the poles into the straps on the side of the backpack. You can also use the ice axe loops at the bottom of the pack twisted around the bottom of the collapsed poles, combined with add-on nylon straps or ties, attached to backpack's closure strap guides to then secure the tops.
 

Ge1ert

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
I will
Yeah. You're right. To be honest, since I came back, I haven't tried anything 'in practice' yet. I'll have a go. Thanks for your help. I just thought I might have been missing something obvious and being a bit twp! Ha !

Thanks c clearly. Will give it a go. 👍
 
D

Deleted member 67185

Guest
Yeah. You're right. To be honest, since I came back, I haven't tried anything 'in practice' yet. I'll have a go. Thanks for your help. I just thought I might have been missing something obvious and being a bit twp! Ha !

Thanks c clearly. Will give it a go. 👍
There are definitely a number of options. Personally, when thru-hiking the PCT, I simply placed the collapsed poles into the side compression straps, as I did not like the 'stow-n-go' usability with my Gossamer Gear or ULA backpacks.
 

Stivandrer

Perambulating & Curious. Rep stravaiging offender
Camino(s) past & future
I´ve got Camino plans until 2042,
- or till I fall flat on my face, whichever comes first !!
I use the Osprey Kestrel. There is an option of attaching a stuffbag here, horizontally.
I use my original LEKI cylinder bag ... (Leki Vario micro Ti)
inside the folded sticks have a basic strong, elastic band...
That means I have to take off my rucksack to get to them, of course, but I use this option when entering a train or do not want to lose sight of them for a longer period..
Have never lost them while walking. When tightened properly, they will stay there...
- loose straps tied in a square knot to keep them from snagging in benches and seats or whatever...

1587042691011.png

ps. when traveling in the hold, sticks are in vertical pockets on either side of sack, ( here: Osprey Kestrel 48 liter) gets packed first and then rest of luggage go in. In this manner they cannot possibly go missing, but the sack gets properly stuffed, of course.... Mark your poles and use reflective tape. In this way you are visual at night and in mist and you personalize your poles so they are mot mistakenly removed.....
 
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Ge1ert

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
I will
Really useful tips Stivandrer. Thankyou.

Do you mind if I ask something else? I currently have a very large Xenith (Osprey), that I used on a solo two-part adventure that lasted almost 3 months, beginning in the Lofoten archipelago and culminating in the Camargue. My pack was very large because it combined Arctic conditions gear with Mediterranean suitable gear.
I'm looking at a smaller pack for another more indepth solo expedition in northern Scandinavia. I'm looking at many packs, including lightweight frameless packs. However, amongst actual Osprey packs, I wonder, do you have any views on the comparanle merits of the 3 packs, your Kestrel 48, the Talon 44 and the Exxos 48?
I'm asking on the off-change you have a benefits/disadvantages view on them. If not, no worries and thanks.
I may start a thread on this perhaps, if it's allowed.

I use the Osprey Kestrel. There is an option of attaching a stuffbag here, horizontally.
I use my original LEKI cylinder bag ... (Leki Vario micro Ti)
inside the folded sticks have a basic strong, elastic band...
That means I have to take off my rucksack to get to them, of course, but I use this option when entering a train or do not want to lose sight of them for a longer period..
Have never lost them while walking. When tightened properly, they will stay there...
- loose straps tied in a square knot to keep them from snagging in benches and seats or whatever...

View attachment 73271

ps. when traveling in the hold, sticks are in vertical pockets on either side of sack, ( here. Osprey Kestrel 48 liter)gets packed first and then rest of luggage go in. In this manner they cannot possibly go missing, but the sack gets properly stuffed, of course.... Mark your poles and use reflective tape. in this way you are visual in night and mist and you personalize your poles so they are mot mistakenly removed.....
 

WalkingJane

Active Member
Camino(s) past & future
May and October 2015
(2015 October)
June 2018 Portuguese
Does anyone have a method of attaching these z-poles to the outside of a pack (edited), when FOLDED? Not including in side pockets and not including inside the pack. I've looked online and can't find anyone who's managed this. Also, can't see anything on YouTube.
Very similar to this type. https://trekandmountain.com/2020/01...series-micro-vario-carbon-trekking-poles-195/
In this article it mentions that it's a disadvantage of them. I trekked through northern Norway last year with them taking up the room in an Osprey Xenith side mesh pocket. I'd rather free that up.
Thanks in advance.
G
Bungee cords?
 
D

Deleted member 67185

Guest
I'm looking at many packs, including lightweight frameless packs.
The comfort level and weight carrying capacity for frameless packs have limitations. What is the weight of your average load, for the conditions you will be walking in?
 

Dandabika

Member
Camino(s) past & future
Completed GR65 (2016)
Does anyone have a method of attaching these z-poles to the outside of a pack (edited), when FOLDED? Not including in side pockets and not including inside the pack. I've looked online and can't find anyone who's managed this. Also, can't see anything on YouTube.
Very similar to this type. https://trekandmountain.com/2020/01...series-micro-vario-carbon-trekking-poles-195/
In this article it mentions that it's a disadvantage of them. I trekked through northern Norway last year with them taking up the room in an Osprey Xenith side mesh pocket. I'd rather free that up.
Thanks in advance.
G
Hi, Use treking pole specific attaching equipment like this to attach them folded up to your pack loops or daisy chain or straps: https://www.gossamergear.com/collections/trekking-poles/products/lightrek-pack-bungee-attachment
 

Ge1ert

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
I will
Frameless will be if I get my kit plus simple camera down to 8 to 10Kg excluding pack weight, which I can if I'm economical and don't go to northern Scandinavia as late as I did last year. This would be for next year anyway. However, my main preference for using frameless would be for France, Spain or Slovenia; Trips I have in mind. I've been looking at mostly American brandsfor that. Mountain Laurel Designs (such as the Exodus at 450g), Gossamer Gear, Hyperlight. There're a couple of European options too.
Also, if I can find a decent one I can decide on, a possible foldable/rollable frameless for bikepacking in France. Similar to Zpacks Nemo perhaps. In that case my pack weight will be minimal for day/2 day hikes.
I do use a lightweight tent or tarp-style tent sometimes, but sometimes use a simple tarp. It depends on where and when.
As for when I do part of the Camino trails, pfrobably from Puy at first, I've not come to any decisions yet and I'm looking here for advice really.
I talk too much. I'll shut up now. 🙄
 
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Dandabika

Member
Camino(s) past & future
Completed GR65 (2016)
Frameless will be of I get my kit plus simple camera down to 8 to 10Kg excluding pack weight, which I can if I'm economical and don't go to northern Scandinavia as late as I did last year. This would be for next year anyway. However, my main preference for using frameless would be for France, Spain or Slovenia; Trips I have in mind. I've been looking at mostly American brandsfor that. Mountain Laurel Designs (such as the Exodus at 450g), Gossamer Gear, Hyperlight. There're a couple of European options too.
Also, if I can find a decent one I can decide on, a possible foldable/rollable frameless for bikepacking in France. Similar to Zpacks Nemo perhaps. In that case my pack weight will be minimal for day/2 day hikes.
I do use a lightweight tent or tarp-style tent sometimes, but sometimes use a simple tarp. It depends on where and when.
As for when I do part of the Camino trails, pfrobably from Puy at first, I've not come to any decisions yet and I'm looking here for advice really.
I talk too much. I'll shut up now. 🙄
Framelss is the lightest way to go, but only if you keep your weight down to less than 8 kilos. Using a lightweight pack with a mesh to keep it off your back is way more comfortable and keeps you from overheating and sweating. Problem with the Compostelle and Camino routes is many of the villages have little or no stores to restock your food supplies. Most of the villages also no longer have restaurants plus everything closes down over weekends making food very scarce; so that means you have to carry a minimum of 5 full meals in your pack roughly 60 percent of the time. The food is what will bump up your total pack weight to 11 or 12 kilos. Frameless packs are very uncomfortable at that weight level. I carried my stuff in a frameless pack on a trek from southern Mexico all the way to Nicaragua many years ago and also the Serengeti. I learned a painful lesson about weight and frameless packs then. Puy-en-Velay is a great place to start either the GR65 or GR70. I walked both of those plus the Camino Del Norte, Camino Primitivo and part of Camino Frances.
 

Ge1ert

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
I will
Excellent advice. Thanks. If I go framed, what size and brand of pack do you use as a lightweight framed pack these days? I was looking at the Talon (44?) for France, etc., but for colder climes, such as my planned return trip to Lofoten Islands with proper camera gear, I was thinking the Osprey Exos 58 looks a reasonable and comfortable compromise to my previously very large pack (I was in Lofoten plus journeyed down to the Camargue, so 2 weather condition packing). I'm a landscape semi-pro photographer, so a certain amount of essential-to-me camera gear is important to me. For France I can go lighter in most places and with less winter gear and also less camera gear.
So, when on the Camino from, for example Puy-en-Velay, what pack would you recommend with capacity for either tarp or very light tarp-type tent?
I guess it would be different again for the GR10 French Pyrenees route another I'm considering doing now I'm retired but still not too old. Lofoten was a good rehearsal for that. LOL! 🙄
 
D

Deleted member 67185

Guest
Frameless will be of I get my kit plus simple camera down to 8 to 10Kg excluding pack weight,
8 kg is right on the cusp of a wearer's comfort for the frameless backpack models, that are made by the manufacturers you mentioned. When hired to do gear testing of their frameless backpack models, for those manufacturers, I found that the sweet spot between comfort and performance was at around 17 pounds / 7.75 kg.

Most of the frameless backpacks are stated as having 'carrying capacities' or 'maximum load' capacities that go higher; some as high as 30 pounds / 13.5 kg. Those stated load capacities are for the material limits of the backpack, and not for the comfort feels to the user. :)

For weight loads, the ULA 'CDT' is the frameless backpack model I have tested for a manufacturer, that had a comfort level at the highest weight capacity. I felt like it was still fairly comfortable for a full 8 hour trail hike while carrying 20 pounds/ 9.2 kg.

If I can be of any help, feel free to send me a PM. I'm happy to answer any questions that I can.
 

Ge1ert

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
I will
Thanks davebugg. That' really useful to know re stated load capacities and correlation to actual comfort. I'll remember that. I'll p.m. you if I have any burning questions. Thanks very much. 😊👍
 

Lost Pilgrims

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
Camino Portuguese (2017)
Does anyone have a method of attaching these z-poles to the outside of a pack (edited), when FOLDED? Not including in side pockets and not including inside the pack. I've looked online and can't find anyone who's managed this. Also, can't see anything on YouTube.
Very similar to this type. https://trekandmountain.com/2020/01...series-micro-vario-carbon-trekking-poles-195/
In this article it mentions that it's a disadvantage of them. I trekked through northern Norway last year with them taking up the room in an Osprey Xenith side mesh pocket. I'd rather free that up.
Thanks in advance.
G
When we travelled from Toronto to Lisbon via Air Canada, we packed our folding poles (like the ones mentioned in your post) inside our backpacks and carried the backpacks in carry on. This way they don't get caught on anything and there are no visible hazards for security to be concerned about. We have 36 litre Osprey packs so had lots of room. While walking the camino, we strapped them to the outside of our packs with the straps that are for that purpose.
So, I'm not sure why you would not want to put them inside your pack during travel. They don't take up much room.
 

Ge1ert

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
I will
Hi Lost Pilgrims.
Only because on that particular through-hike my pack was 'packed', for one thing, but mainly because I wanted easy access to the Z-poles during mountain trails and scrambles. Nothing to do with when in transit at airports, etc.. I managed to squeeze them in my side-pockets and my pack was in a cheap, but secure, safety bag. Other times I've used cling-film, but not last time.
So, no, I mean on mountain trails where, in side pockets they can catch in narrow gulleys and in undergowth. Some of the attachment suggestions I've had have been really useful though. Thanks everyone who's given me tips. 👍
 

Dandabika

Member
Camino(s) past & future
Completed GR65 (2016)
Excellent advice. Thanks. If I go framed, what size and brand of pack do you use as a lightweight framed pack these days? I was looking at the Talon (44?) for France, etc., but for colder climes, such as my planned return trip to Lofoten Islands with proper camera gear, I was thinking the Osprey Exos 58 looks a reasonable and comfortable compromise to my previously very large pack (I was in Lofoten plus journeyed down to the Camargue, so 2 weather condition packing). I'm a landscape semi-pro photographer, so a certain amount of essential-to-me camera gear is important to me. For France I can go lighter in most places and with less winter gear and also less camera gear.
So, when on the Camino from, for example Puy-en-Velay, what pack would you recommend with capacity for either tarp or very light tarp-type tent?
I guess it would be different again for the GR10 French Pyrenees route another I'm considering doing now I'm retired but still not too old. Lofoten was a good rehearsal for that. LOL! 🙄
I've used the Osprey Levity 45 and the Gossamer Gorilla 40. The Osprey is better if the weather is humid or hot. Problem with packs of higher volume is to begin with, they are heavier and when you load them up to the top the top weight throws your balance off a lot more than lower volume packs. The larger packs also wiggle a bit more making more friction on your shoulder and hip straps. After a few hundred kilometers you'll be sorry you got the larger bag with chafing in different places on your shoulders, hips, and lower back plus the chafing wears down your clothes faster. Go smaller and if need be, get a lightweight fanny pack worn to your front. That way the shifting is lessened and the weight is lowered, plus you can keep the essential camera gear handy. I used a small neoprene bag and carabiner hung off my hip belt; worked like a charm.
 
D

Deleted member 67185

Guest
I was thinking the Osprey Exos 58 looks a reasonable and comfortable compromise to my previously very large pack
Outside of size, is there a reason why you want to change to a different backpack? Sometimes the reduction in weight by going to a smaller pack, or the need to have a backpack small enough to use as a carry-on for airline use are examples of why some go to smaller backpacks.

I have a backpack that I have used, Gossamer Gear Mariposa, that has a large volume. I have used it for a PCT thru-hike (along with a ULA Catalyst in different sections), and a Colorado Trail thru-hike. And i have also used it for a Camino. I have also used it for dayhikes.

The point is, if a backpack feels good and fits well, but it has more space than is needed, I wouldn't make a change. If you had other reasons, like reducing some base weight off of your load, then that is something to consider, if your budget allows. :)

Because your gear and clothing needs for backpacking or Camino walking are unique to you, it is hard to make a suggestion as to what volume-capacity to look for in a backpack.

The best method for choosing an adequate carrying capacity, is to gather all of the gear and clothing that you will need for the coldest weather that you will hike in and place it into a bag of a box. Then, take that box of stuff with you when you start looking for a new backpack. You can then fit all of that gear and clothing into the backpack you are assessing, and it will allow you to accurately choose the smallest capacity that will hold all your stuff. This will also keep you from having to dangle stuff on the outside of your backpack because the pack was too small in its volume.

Be sure to have your gear and clothing and stuff that is in your box, organized in the same stuff sacks, etc. that you normally use with your backpack.

Keep in mind that extra space in a backpack is a good thing, because it makes it easier to pack and remove items as needed.
 
D

Deleted member 67185

Guest
I've used the Osprey Levity 45 and the Gossamer Gorilla 40. The Osprey is better if the weather is humid or hot. Problem with packs of higher volume is to begin with, they are heavier and when you load them up to the top the top weight throws your balance off a lot more than lower volume packs. ....................
I absolutely agree that it is ideal to have the smallest capacity backpack that will comfortably carry all the gear and clothing needed, without cramming and squishing it. I also do not discount your own unique experiences that you relate in your post.

Because my experiences have been different, I thought perhaps some of my observations may be useful to the thread as added to your own. :)

I have never found a larger backpack, which was fitted properly to my spine length and waist sizing, to have the same issues that you have experienced with wiggling and friction and chafing, etc.

I agree that it is possible. It is why I spend a lot of time, when consulting with beginning backpackers, to properly size and fit their backpacks. If a larger volume backpack is chosen, then it becomes even more critical to assure proper fitting and adjustments to the shoulder harness and waist/hip belt assemblies. Proper tensioning of the straps, if the pack is properly sized to the wearer to begin with, has not created the wiggling and friction you have experienced, even with heavier loads.

Sometimes smaller means lighter, but not always. In fact, the larger volume Gossamer Gear Mariposa is actually lighter than the Gorilla, but has better adjustability with the inclusion of its load lifter straps (which are lacking on the Gorilla), due to it potential higher weight load.

A larger volume backpack is adaptable to the load required. For example, on my PCT and Colorado Trail thru-hikes, when I needed to carry all food and fuel for 7 to 10 day stretches between re-supply points, my total load weight was about 22 to 24 pounds. The backpack, Mariposa, that was used on those trips were also used on my Camino Frances pilgrimages where my total load weighed only 9 to 10 pounds.

A large capacity backpack does not mean that it has to be filled. For Camino, the Mariposa was filled to only 1/2 its volume, and that was with things packed and organized in a loose manner. :)

I agree with the potential problem of load shifting and the potential for top-heavy balance issues. A user can deal with those issues by knowing the guidelines for proper loading of the backpack, and using the compression straps to eliminate shifting of contents. This will keep the center of gravity from creating balance issues.

This is a guideline I wrote about backpack fitting and adjustments that I have posted before. Given the various topics in this thread, I thought it might be useful. :)

Correct Sizing of a Backpack

The size of the pack is determined by the length of your spine, not by how much the pack can carry.

Measuring for a correct fit involves determining your spine's proper length. That measurement is done by using a tape measure and measuring from the protruding 'knob' on the back of your neck which is at the base of the cervical spine, to the place on your spine that is even with the top of the crest of your hips.
  1. Tilt your head forward and feel for the bony bump where the slope of your shoulders meets your neck. This is your 7th cervical (or C7) vertebra—and the top of your torso length.
  2. On each side of your body, slide your hands down the rib cage to the top of your hip bones (aka the iliac crest). With index fingers pointing forward and thumbs pointing backward, draw an imaginary line between your thumbs. This spot on your lumbar is the bottom of your torso measurement.
  3. Stand up straight and measure - or have your friend measure - the distance between the C7 and the imaginary line between your thumbs. That’s your torso length.


59589



(The above instruction set and picture courtesy of REI)


60881



Once you have that measurement in inches or centimeters, you can then look at the backpack manufacturer's sizing guide. This guide will be used to match your spine length, to their stated size range.

Sometimes the sizes are expressed as Small to Extra Large. Sometimes that size scale will combine the sizes like: S/M, M/L, L/XL. When the sizes are combined, it usually means that there is a good amount of adjustability to the frame of the pack to customize the fit. That will usually be in the shoulder harness and the hipbelt so that a fine tuned fit can be achieved.

Here is a good video which will help with fitting. Ignore the reference to the manufacturer as the method is pretty universal.



Fitting The Shoulder Harness

First, let me mention that there are differences in the shapes of shoulder straps. The standard shoulder strap shape has been what some manufacturers describe as a "J" shape. This shape tends to fit the chest shape of the male better than the female due to the lesser fullness of the chest. However, even with some men who have bigger chests, the J strap shape can be uncomfortable.

A few manufacturers, ULA and Six Moons Design are the most notable, have developed what is called an "S" shaped strap. This shape has solved many of the fit issues for women, allowing for the straps to properly sit on the shoulders without the uncomfortable compression and chafing due to breasts of larger chests. Here is a link which shows the difference between the two strap shapes:


The shoulder harness should wrap around over your shoulders and sit slightly below the top of the shoulder. The shoulder straps should sit comfortably toward the middle of the shoulder girdle, although that may vary a bit. It should not feel like they are going to slip off your shoulders or sit tight against the base of your neck.

The sternum strap should NOT be required to keep the shoulder straps in place. The sternum strap does connect the shoulder straps, but it is designed to help control where the straps sit on the shoulders with excess pack movement; it is not meant to overcome a poor fit and placement of the shoulder straps.

After fastening the sternum strap in place, pull the adjustment strap until you feel a bit of tension.

The sternum strap on a good pack can adjust up and down on the shoulder straps. The usual placement is somewhere just below the collar bone, but body types and builds will cause a variation of where the sternum strap placement feels best.

Hip Belt Adjustments

For the hip belt, the pad of the belt should sort of 'cradle' the crest of the hip bone: the top of the pad should be slightly above the top of the crest while the bottom of the pad should be slightly below the top. Again, the belt, when it is snugged down, should cradle. The belt should not entirely sit above your hips so that the pad compresses your waist, nor should the entire pad sit below the crest of your hips totally squeezing the hip bones.

There is a lot of misinformation about how a pack's load is distributed between shoulders and hips. It is NOT true that the waist/hip belt carries the entire load of the pack. It definitely CAN do that, but doing so is undesirable.

There are reasons which make it necessary to keep the shoulder harness unweighted with the full load weight on the hipbelt. These include damage or injury to the shoulder girdle. There are folks who prefer a total load on the hipbelt even though their shoulder girdle is healthy, but it is a practice which has potential complications associated with it. Even so, it is up to an individual to decide.

If the Hip/waist belt carries the entire weight of the pack
  1. it means the shoulder harness is unweighted and there can be significant pack movement which, during difficult walking terrain, can create problems with your center of gravity. I have seen people lose their balance and fall as a result.
  2. It also can result in your core muscles being overworked, stressed and fatigued trying to compensate from that extra movement.
  3. All of that weight on the pelvis can create significant compression forces by requiring the hipbelt to be over-tightened in order to prevent it from slipping down. This can cause numbness and pain as blood flow and nerve compression is experienced.
  4. All of the weight on the hipbelt will also place additional strain to the hip sockets and knees.
The load ratio will be about 5 to 15 percent for the shoulders and 85 to 95 percent on the hips. This will allow for the proper engagement of your core muscles to help carry the backpack.

Steps To Adjusting a Backpack Before Walking

I'll add a link to a video (ignore the manufacturer) that shows the best steps to follow when putting on a pack and adjusting it. The basic steps are these:
  1. Loosen all of the straps on the shoulder harness and hip belt.
  2. Put on the pack and very slightly tighten the shoulder straps so that the hip belt is slightly below the hips.
  3. Shrug your shoulders up, and then fasten the waist belt as you are getting it roughly into position.
  4. Slightly tighten the shoulder straps to assist with the hip belt adjustment.
  5. Position the hip belt padding to let the padding sit half above and half below the crest of the hips. The padding of the belt should never sit entirely above the hips. The padding should sort of wrap itself over the top of the hip bone and hug the hips.
  6. Tighten the belt just enough to keep it in position. At this point, nearly 100% of the packs weight is resting on the hips.
  7. Snug the shoulder straps to take up 5 to 15 percent of the packs weight. You will feel just a slight unloading of the weight off the hips.
  8. At the top of the shoulder straps and toward the pack, are smaller straps called 'load lifters'. Grasp them and pull to your front. You will feel the weight of the pack lift up slightly and pull more snugly toward your back. This helps with center of gravity and balance. You can experiment with how snug or how loose you want to pull on the straps. A properly adjusted load lifter strap will form a sort of 45 degree angle when viewed from the side.
  9. On some waist/hip belts there can be a small strap connected to each side of the belt. Again, pulling forward on those straps will bring the bottom of the pack closer to your back, helping with balance as you are walking.


It is important to remember that after you make the first pack adjustment before starting to walk, that you will frequently be changing those adjustments while walking: tightening, loosening, pulling, having the pack higher or lower....

Pack adjustments are a dynamic thing, not a static thing. As you walk, how the pack feels, pressure points, center of gravity, etc WILL change. This is why it is important to become so familiar with your pack that making adjustments becomes second nature as you walk, requiring no real thought or consideration.

A good pack, loaded and adjusted properly will be so integrated to your body while walking that you sometimes forget you are wearing it. Now, NOTHING will make a weighted load in a pack disappear, but it will help keep that load from becoming an agonizing exercise in torture :)
 
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Ge1ert

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
I will
Thanks both. There's a lot here to absorb and consider. And all of it useful.
Just so that you may gulp! and probably laugh at my expense (no problem btw), you can perhaps understand where I'm coming from in wanting to go lighter on this next cold-weather ONLY mountain trekking trip in Nordland when I tell you that, on the Lofoten Islands and then afterwards trekking down through Scandinavia (Noway, Sweden, Denmark and n. Germany), and ultimately reaching Bern and then on to the Camargue, I was packing a 105L Osprey Xenith, inluding base tent, camera and electronics and tarp for summit attempts with smaller collapsible daypack. Even though I needed to pack cold and warm weather gear for dual climate-type destinations (sub-zero Lofoten, 32'C Camargue), it was far too much weight to make it 100% comfortable. I'm 5'10". It was a 3 month solo trip and 22Kg including 2.7Kg Xenith.
Yes. A good workout. Ha! Still an utterly amazing post-retirement 3 months though. 🙄
 
D

Deleted member 67185

Guest
Thanks both. There's a lot here to absorb and consider. And all of it useful.
Just so that you may gulp! and probably laugh at my expense (no problem btw), you can perhaps understand where I'm coming from in wanting to go lighter on this next cold-weather ONLY mountain trekking trip in Nordland when I tell you that, on the Lofoten Islands and then afterwards trekking down through Scandinavia (Noway, Sweden, Denmark and n. Germany), and ultimately reaching Bern and then on to the Camargue, I was packing a 105L Osprey Xenith, inluding base tent, camera and electronics and tarp for summit attempts with smaller collapsible daypack. Even though I needed to pack cold and warm weather gear for dual climate-type destinations (sub-zero Lofoten, 32'C Camargue), it was far too much weight to make it 100% comfortable. I'm 5'10". It was a 3 month solo trip and 22Kg including 2.7Kg Xenith.
Yes. A good workout. Ha! Still an utterly amazing post-retirement 3 months though. 🙄
I own several different backpacks which are used for differing activities. I do hundreds of miles of backpacking each year in varying conditions, so my gear gets a lot of use that justifies the expense of owning multiple backpacks.

Budget and use. . . those will be the drivers of whether or not to match a specific activity to a single backpack, or to get one backpack which can deal with multiple types of backpacking activities. In the case of the latter, you would get the backpack that will handle the most 'extreme' need (large loads over multiple days or weeks or months), and adapt it for the less extreme need (walking a Camino where food, lodging, and just-in-case backups are not needed).

At over 5 pounds in weight, going to a backpack, like a Gossamer Gear Mariposa (60 liter) or a ULA Circuit (63 liters) or a Osprey Levity (60 liters), etc. will save a lot of weight. Saving weight, without shedding equipment performance and usability, makes walking more enjoyable and decreases potential for stress injuries.

The key is to not 'make due' just to save weight. Make sure that the fit and feel of whatever backpack you are looking at works for you and not against you. Next is a backpack's usability. . . If fit and feel are equal, then choose the backpack that makes life on the trail/path/road the easiest for your day-to-day travels.

Then comes weight. If you have the choice between a 5.5 pound / 2.5 kg backpack that does everything right, and a backpack that weighs 2.5 pounds / 1.14 kg, guess which one I am choosing? :)

Dropping body weight in exchange for a heavier backpack weight is something discussed, but they are not interchangeable for a variety of reasons. However, because it is the total backpack weight that matters, it is an effective strategy to exchange the keeping or using a heavier backpack, with lightening up the weight of what goes into that backpack.

Get a lighter tent. Use a backpacking quilt, instead of a sleeping bag. Instead of filling up a water reservoir to the top, fill it only with as much as is needed to get to the next water source. Reduce the amount of stove fuel needed, by incorporating meals that can be eaten without cooking. Get a lighter sleeping mattress or pad.

Spend time examining what can be saved in ounces / grams. "Ounces lead to pounds, and pounds lead to pain".

For camino, where one is basically walking from town to town, the amount of weight that is carried, compared to wilderness backpacking, is automatically reduced. So, if you reduce your backpacking weight for a Camino by several Kg, then the weight of a heavier backpack, that is excellent in fit and feel, is offset by what you do not need to carry on Camino. :)
 

Ge1ert

New Member
Camino(s) past & future
I will
Fabulous davebugg. Solid sensible advice. Thankyou. I've read this through but will send it to my PC for printing out to read and absorb properly at my leisure later; It's not as if I don't have time on my hands at the moment stuck at home. :) Thankyou for taking so much time and effort. If I need to pm you I will take up your offer if that's still okay. Thanks. 🙄👍
 
D

Deleted member 67185

Guest
Fabulous davebugg. Solid sensible advice. Thankyou. I've read this through but will send it to my PC for printing out to read and absorb properly at my leisure later; It's not as if I don't have time on my hands at the moment stuck at home. :) Thankyou for taking so much time and effort. If I need to pm you I will take up your offer if that's still okay. Thanks. 🙄👍
My PM is always open. :) I am glad if what I have posted might be of use to you, or others.
 

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