External-frame Packs?

[Glenn Rowe]

I know they're fast becoming extinct, but I have a complete external-frame backpack that I first bought in the 1980s and have used danged near everywhere. I "customized" it by shortening the frame so that nothing sticks up above my jawline -- a necessary modification when one frequently travels through pretty thick bush. (Did I mention that I'm originally from the central Gulf Coast - Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Florida?) When the packbag finally wore out I replaced it, but kept the frame and etc.

So here's my question. In my younger years I played American football, resulting in neck and shoulder problems plus two herniated lumbar discs. When properly adjusted, the external frame places about 90% of the weight on my hips, bypassing my "problem areas" almost completely.

So, what do y'all say about the possibility of my using it successfully on the Camino Frances?

 

[Anemone del Camino]

What matters most is how it fits and how much it weighs once filled. 8kg is a good number to aim for. If you can decrease the weight of its content to make up for the bag's own weight, then I can't think of a reason I would poopoo the idea. Especially considering your back issues.

Fill it up with what you plan on bringing and weigh it. Go for a couple of longish walks with it and see if it's still as comfortable as you remember it being.

An one thing is certain: no one will pick it up by mistake thinking its theirs.

 

[C clearly]

How much does it weigh, what is its volume, and how comfortable is it to carry for 20-km, day after day?

 

[Glenn Rowe]

How much does it weigh, what is its volume, and how comfortable is it to carry for 20-km, day after day?

It probably weighs about 4.5 pounds (2 kilos), volume approximately 45-50 liters not including the external sleeping bag storage if needed -- and it probably won't be. Back in the 1980s-1990s I routinely carried approx. 35 pounds (16 kilos), frequently cross-country, for days at a time. Aside from the natural resistance to torso-twisting, it was quite comfortable.

Of course, I was in my 40s and 50s then. I'm just a wee bit older now.

 

[C clearly]

Back in the 1980s-1990s I routinely carried approx. 35 pounds (16 kilos), frequently cross-country, for days at a time.

You are the best person to judge if it will work for you, especially since you have the pack there. Just load it up with what you expect to carry, and go out for 20 km! Then report back to us!

 

[SYates]

Have you actually tried out one of the more modern backpacks? If adjusted correctly they also place the weight on your hips! If your living near a REI store or similar you could try out different (and lighter!) models. The Camino isn't a wilderness walk and you will need far less stuff than you might think ;-)

Buen Camino, SY

 

[Deleted member 43985]

Sure it can work, just about anything can. Many of us obsess about the newest, lightest gear but tried and true is good too. If you are getting 90% on the hips and you can keep you weight to a minimum (16-18lbs for a fall Camino should be achievable) then I say buy a rain cover that fits and go for it. Worst case scenario? Buy a new one in Spain, there are many gear stores along the way for just such an occasion.

 

[Priscilla NC]

I have an Arc Blast pack from Z Pack (they are not sold retail, only through their website. It has carbon stays that are external -- and it only weighs one pound!! I love it, it fits me so well, and I feel like I'm not wearing a pack. It's not cheap, however. But the best piece of equipment I had on the Camino.

http://www.zpacks.com/backpacks.shtml

 

[dougfitz]

I'm in the 'only you can tell' school, but comparing my late 1970s Berghaus Centurion (~55 li, 1.67 kg) to packs I currently use, I would observe:

1. the harness is rudimentary. While it might achieve the load transfer to the hips, the hip padding is both narrow and thin by comparison, with the result that there will be higher pressures where it sits on the hips and shoulders. The shoulder strap webbing is only just as wide as that on my 18 li day bag I use locally - somewhat narrower than the straps on any of my larger packs. Similarly for the hip belt and mesh panel.
2. there are few load control features on the harness and bag. This probably isn't unusual for an external ladder frame arrangement, but it really is a relatively simple bag hung onto the frame. No side compression straps, mesh side or back pockets, hydration bladder sleeve, etc.
3. Rather than a pocket in the top flap, it has a simple flap and two side pockets at top of the pack. I remember that this wasn't an unusual approach at the time. However, features like a more secure pocket under the lid that isn't accessible from outside the pack, an internal storm flap or a strap at the top of the bag to secure the load were still a few years off.

So while I wouldn't expect to find anything all that much lighter in an equivalent modern design, they will have a lot more 'features', some of which will be more useful to you than others. But then, if you haven't missed these anyhow and find your current pack perfectly workable, you may not find any fancy feature list of practical value anyhow.

 

[Mark Lee]

If the pack works for you and is comfortable, I'd go with it. When walking the Camino Frances you can easily get away with 20 pounds or less of gear in your pack. It's a series of long day walks between towns and cities and not backpacking in the traditional sense.
My only concern with an external frame pack is any problems you might encounter if you decide to carry-on the pack on the airline.
Back in the 1980's when I used to do some backpacking with friends while in college, all we had were the aluminum external frame packs, and damn we used to put a lot of stuff in them, but they weren't as heavy when I was in my 20's, ha ha. I remember when a friend of mine got a new Coleman pack that had an external frame made of plastic that was lighter and conformed with your body when you carried it. We thought that was really high tech, ha ha.

 

[jmcarp]

I'm in the 'only you can tell' school, but comparing my late 1970s Berghaus Centurion (~55 li, 1.67 kg) to packs I currently use, I would observe:

1. the harness is rudimentary. While it might achieve the load transfer to the hips, the hip padding is both narrow and thin by comparison, with the result that there will be higher pressures where it sits on the hips and shoulders. The shoulder strap webbing is only just as wide as that on my 18 li day bag I use locally - somewhat narrower than the straps on any of my larger packs. Similarly for the hip belt and mesh panel.
2. there are few load control features on the harness and bag. This probably isn't unusual for an external ladder frame arrangement, but it really is a relatively simple bag hung onto the frame. No side compression straps, mesh side or back pockets, hydration bladder sleeve, etc.
3. Rather than a pocket in the top flap, it has a simple flap and two side pockets at top of the pack. I remember that this wasn't an unusual approach at the time. However, features like a more secure pocket under the lid that isn't accessible from outside the pack, an internal storm flap or a strap at the top of the bag to secure the load were still a few years off.

So while I wouldn't expect to find anything all that much lighter in an equivalent modern design, they will have a lot more 'features', some of which will be more useful to you than others. But then, if you haven't missed these anyhow and find your current pack perfectly workable, you may not find any fancy feature list of practical value anyhow.

Good points, especially about the rigging and harness technology. One feature of most of the old external frame packs was a lot of external pockets; for some that is a plus, for others, maybe not so. The carry-on issue noted by @Mark Lee could be a problem, and even if the external pack is checked, there's a lot of straps and exposed frame components that could hang up or be damaged in the cargo bay, so placing the pack in a box or duffle may be advisable.

 

[jmcarp]

... I remember when a friend of mine got a new Coleman pack that had an external frame made of plastic that was lighter and conformed with your body when you carried it. We thought that was really high tech, ha ha.

I had one of those Coleman packs and thought I was pretty avant-garde at the time . I only recently gave it away to the grandson of a friend when my wife made me clean the packrat nest I call my basement.

 

[trecile]

I have an Arc Blast pack from Z Pack (they are not sold retail, only through their website. It has carbon stays that are external -- and it only weighs one pound!! I love it, it fits me so well, and I feel like I'm not wearing a pack. It's not cheap, however. But the best piece of equipment I had on the Camino.

http://www.zpacks.com/backpacks.shtml

Those Zpacks look awesome. If money were no object I'd love to have their Arc Zip backpack.

 

[Mark Lee]

I had one of those Coleman packs and thought I was pretty avant-garde at the time . I only recently gave it away to the grandson of a friend when my wife made me clean the packrat nest I call my basement.

I still have my old military ALICE pack with frame in the attic. I'm sure I'll never use it again, but slow to part with it, ha ha. Dang thing is low tech compared to today's stuff, but it sure is a durable and well made thing.

 

[Micah26]

Seems like trying 15-20 lbs in the old pack then in a newer one that's been fit to you is your best bet. It is all very specific to each person. Your old pack might be good enough to help out your neck and back. However, maybe a newer design could be lighter and do a better job. In the early 80's, I spend several months with quite an overly large backpack trekking through France, Italy, Switzerland, England and Ireland. At the time it did the job, carried probably 40 lbs mostly in my hips. Now at 54, post stroke I'm thinking no way would I carry that much weight on any part of my body. I've really come to respect the new packs I prefer the Osprey line. They seem to help me compensate for my age and limitations. But that's me... try some out. There are many places to buy on sale for a much cheaper price than I paid for my original pack. Good luck

 

[Glenn Rowe]

Have you actually tried out one of the more modern backpacks?

Many years ago I worked part-time in a camping/backpacking store, so the answer is yes. And, recently I have tried a Deuter, an Osprey, and one from L.L. Bean. (And I'm smack-dab in the middle between two REI stores.) I actually carried the Osprey on two outdoor adventures for use as a day-and-a-half bag. Liked the frame/belt/strap arrangements and function, but didn't care at all for the pockets and access arrangements.

If adjusted correctly they also place the weight on your hips!

They place some, or even most, of the weight on your hips, but not ALL of it.

====================================

Thanks to all for your responses!

 

[SYates]

Having a dodgy back myself I can only say it really, really depends on finding the right backpack for your back length and adjusting it accordingly. Give it a go! Buen Camino, SY

PS My Osprey 58 Exos is perfectly balanced on my hips and doesn't put any weight on my shoulders nor neck at all, but as the saying goes - Your Mileage Might Vary ...

 

[Glenn Rowe]

You are the best person to judge if it will work for you, especially since you have the pack there. Just load it up with what you expect to carry, and go out for 20 km! Then report back to us!

Challenge accepted, with a considerable grin!

 

[Glenn Rowe]

I still have my old military ALICE pack with frame in the attic. I'm sure I'll never use it again, but slow to part with it, ha ha. Dang thing is low tech compared to today's stuff, but it sure is a durable and well made thing.

O-dear-merciful-Heavens! Ye olde "Kidney-Killer", if I still had one, would certainly not be in contention. The ALICE pack (medium or large, because the frame is the same) is one of those "close, but no cigar" designs that should probably forever remain in the history books. In this case it's a matter of about four vertical inches....

And BTW, you say you're from da Big Easy. I grew up just a bit east of you, in Mobile, the site of the first-ever Mardi Gras in the New World. Of course, Mobile was founded before da Big Easy, by de same folks dat founded da Big Easy. Lassiez le Bon Temps Roulez...

 

[Mark Lee]

O-dear-merciful-Heavens! Ye olde "Kidney-Killer", if I still had one, would certainly not be in contention. The ALICE pack (medium or large, because the frame is the same) is one of those "close, but no cigar" designs that should probably forever remain in the history books. In this case it's a matter of about four vertical inches....

And BTW, you say you're from da Big Easy. I grew up just a bit east of you, in Mobile, the site of the first-ever Mardi Gras in the New World. Of course, Mobile was founded before da Big Easy, by de same folks dat founded da Big Easy. Lassiez le Bon Temps Roulez...

I have been to the Mardi Gras there before.....

 

[Glenn Rowe]

I have been to the Mardi Gras there before.....

A bit more reserved/low-key, wouldn't you say?

 

[Mark Lee]

A bit more reserved/low-key, wouldn't you say?

Yeah, it was (not the Bacchanalian, booze soaked blast the one here can be, ha ha). It was several years ago when I went. We decided to go that morning, on a whim. All in all it was pretty cool.
Nowadays I'm pretty boring on the festivities. A couple of bloody Mary's on the morning of the parades and I'm happy.

 

[Glenn Rowe]

A couple of bloody Mary's on the morning of the parades and I'm happy.

I absolutely, positively, resemble that remark!

 

[wcsjms]

I know they're fast becoming extinct, but I have a complete external-frame backpack that I first bought in the 1980s and have used danged near everywhere. I "customized" it by shortening the frame so that nothing sticks up above my jawline -- a necessary modification when one frequently travels through pretty thick bush. (Did I mention that I'm originally from the central Gulf Coast - Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Florida?) When the packbag finally wore out I replaced it, but kept the frame and etc.

So here's my question. In my younger years I played American football, resulting in neck and shoulder problems plus two herniated lumbar discs. When properly adjusted, the external frame places about 90% of the weight on my hips, bypassing my "problem areas" almost completely.

So, what do y'all say about the pos


So, what do y'all say about the possibility of my using it successfully on the Camino Frances?

I used my Kelty 65L external frame backpack on the Camino Frances this past September 2016. I like you have spinal issues , having being paralyzed once, 1999. Your external pack will work fine, but what I found out is because of it's size, I had a tendency to overload it and going up and down the mountains and hills with 35-40 lbs of stuff ( was carrying some of wife's stuff too) was a bit trying. I found an Osprey Kestrel 48L that carries the weight even more comfortably and I limit my load because of it's size. Everyone is different so try some new ones with weght. I ordered on Amazon with free shipping(Prime) and free returns to try out new packs. My wife and I (Mimi and Pop) have tried on about 30 in last two months until we settled on the Osprey Kestrels. BTW .. I am 6'1" 230lbs and 67 yrs old. having a had a heart attack in 2005 due to mold exposure. We did a max of 24K a day but we were limited because my wife broke a bone in her foot about a week into the Camino Frances. So I say to people, check with your Dr's but do it. We are returning in the fall of 2017 for another Camino, most likely the Norte' this time but starting in Scandinavia hopefully. You WILL BE FINE !!! I still have my external frame !!!

 

[Jakke]

Mine is a (Finnish) Savotta, which I left in Finland last year (Camino Portugues) because of the same reason: the size tempts me to take too much stuff with me. The new Portuguese pack I bought in Lisbon for the camino is good, but certainly not better. I love the Savotta for the comfort and the size when I must take a lot of gear with me. You see it in the profile photo (from the late '80s). I have double scoliosis, but I can carry a lot with that pack (provided I pack and adjust it as one should).

 

[wcsjms]

Mine is a (Finnish) Savotta, which I left in Finland because of the same reason: the size tempts me to take too much stuff with me. But, I love it for the comfort and the size when I must take a lot of gear with me. You see it in the profile photo (from the late '80s). I have double scoliosis, but I can carry a lot with that pack.

In our photo, my wife and I are wearing our old Ospreys 65L that we used to backpack through Italy and Switzerland. As you can see I evolved from internal frame to external frame and back to internal, but I love my external frame ! Buen Camino Jakke !!!

 

[Glenn Rowe]

Hola! This unusually continuous Southern California rain has kept me from "hoof-testing" my external-frame pack. Since I have the means, I weighed my external-frame pack and a Deuter ACT-Lite 65+10 pack.

My external-frame pack weighs in at about 6 pounds (2.7 kilos), while the Deuter weighs in at about 4 pounds (1.8 kilos). In my book, that qualifies as a "just-noticeable difference."

And yes, I've backpacked enough to know that 2 pounds on one's back gets marginally "heavier" with each step, so that by the end of the day....