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Franciscan monk arrested at O Cebreiro

jefferyonthecamino

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#1
For those of you that have walked through O Cebreiro regularly, you may recall this monk dressed in Franciscan attire. He was arrested today for apparently abusing a girl, although this is not clear and the news is confusing.

In any case, even if innocent, I find this news to be very sad.

Here's the source (sorry, only Spanish and Galician):

http://www.lavozdegalicia.es/notici...abusos-discapacitado/0003_201502G25P15991.htm
 

KinkyOne

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
I'am not perfect, but I'm always myself!!!
#2
For those of you that have walked through O Cebreiro regularly, you may recall this monk dressed in Franciscan attire. He was arrested today for apparently abusing a girl, although this is not clear and the news is confusing.

In any case, even if innocent, I find this news to be very sad.

Here's the source (sorry, only Spanish and Galician):

http://www.lavozdegalicia.es/notici...abusos-discapacitado/0003_201502G25P15991.htm
I don't think revealing the identity of the monk until charges proven is adequate.
But if he is guilty and if I was the father of the minor mentioned in the article I wouldn't want to be either that minor, the monk or me, because... well, I don't want to go any further...

And these "things" are happening so regularly..., shame!
 

SYates

Camino Fossil AD 1999
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#3
I don't think revealing the identity of the monk until charges proven is adequate.
But if he is guilty and if I was the father of the minor mentioned in the article I wouldn't want to be either that minor, the monk or me, ...
Seems he is accused of two cases:

Abuse of a mentally/psychologically handicapped woman and of an under-aged girl. None of the victims are mentioned by name BUT showing the face/portrait of the, still unproven, offender might encouraged other victims, if there are any, to come forward. Sometimes silence benefits only the predator and silences the victim ... So sad, SY
 

KinkyOne

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#4
Seems he is accused of two cases:

Abuse of a mentally/psychologically handicapped woman and of an under-aged girl. None of the victims are mentioned by name BUT showing the face/portrait of the, still unproven, offender might encouraged other victims, if there are any, to come forward. Sometimes silence benefits only the predator and silences the victim ... So sad, SY
You might be right on that SY, but I (although a non-believer) do know the case of a priest (an acquaintance of mine) in Slovenia that was falsely accused. That's why the revealing of this monk's face/identity gave me some thoughts.
But overall I have to agree with you.
 
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#5
Even if he is innocent, he is already punished in advance. Those that are guilty certainly have punishment coming. Those that are not guilty are punished anyway in just another form of abuse by the media. Speculative stories like these are very disturbing, but I guess it sells copies.
 
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#6
Having been sexually abused as a child myself, I am still very leery of these reports.
They can ruin a person's life.
I stand by "Innocent until proven guilty" and in todays warped world where loving parents have their children taken away for letting them walk to the park alone, I'm even more suspicious of these worrisome reports. If he is indeed guilty, I hope he is severely punished. But for now, he is only accused, not proven guilty, and I will give him the benefit of the doubt.
 

SYates

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#7
I agree with all of you @KinkyOne @Widwil and @Anniesantiago BUT a lot of Churches, not only the Catholic one, have a sad history of hushing over such cases. I do know of exactly one priest accused unjustly and without proof BUT I know of dozens where the victims were, again, victimized by non-belief of their accusations. These cases have to be brought out into the bright sun light and investigated justly. And, so far, the report only states that said monk was arrested and accused of abuse, something what can and should be reported imo. He was not condemned but the fact that he is investigated might well get other people to witness in his favor or to add their own experiences (good or bad) with him. SY
 

fraluchi

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
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#8
[...] so far, the report only states that said monk was arrested and accused of abuse, something what can and should be reported imo. He was not condemned but the fact that he is investigated might well get other people to witness in his favor or to add their own experiences (good or bad) with him. SY
This thread is getting in the direction of "at night all cats are black". :mad: The pictures shown on the newspapers' articles are unfair, sensational and forming a distorted opinion.:( Which doesn't mean that the issue should be swept under the carpet by the authorities.:rolleyes:
 

KinkyOne

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
I'am not perfect, but I'm always myself!!!
#9
I agree with all of you @KinkyOne @Widwil and @Anniesantiago BUT a lot of Churches, not only the Catholic one, have a sad history of hushing over such cases. I do know of exactly one priest accused unjustly and without proof BUT I know of dozens where the victims were, again, victimized by non-belief of their accusations. These cases have to be brought out into the bright sun light and investigated justly. And, so far, the report only states that said monk was arrested and accused of abuse, something what can and should be reported imo. He was not condemned but the fact that he is investigated might well get other people to witness in his favor or to add their own experiences (good or bad) with him. SY
Agree, but his identity was revealed nonetheless.
It can be revealed upon proven guilty and at that time recognized by possible victims.
 

SYates

Camino Fossil AD 1999
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#10
The picture just shows a person detained by another, I can't see anything sensational in the composition of this picture. And, just food for thought and trying to see the victims perspective (independent from the location of the victim, might happen anywhere):

  • You, the victim, got abused by somebody.
  • This somebody is highly regarded in your local community.
  • You try to tell a couple of people about what had happened to you.
  • They rebuke you because that person is highly regarded in your community.
  • You retreat into yourself because it can't be that such a highly regarded person did anything bad to you.
  • It must be your fault that something bad has happened to you.
  • You read that it might have happened to others and you are not alone anymore nor the 'bad person that accused somebody'.
  • You feel relieved because you realize that the abuse wasn't your fault nor are you alone.

Just food for thought, SY
 

KinkyOne

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
I'am not perfect, but I'm always myself!!!
#11
The picture just shows a person detained by another, I can't see anything sensational in the composition of this picture. And, just food for thought and trying to see the victims perspective (independent from the location of the victim, might happen anywhere):

  • You, the victim, got abused by somebody.
  • This somebody is highly regarded in your local community.
  • You try to tell a couple of people about what had happened to you.
  • They rebuke you because that person is highly regarded in your community.
  • You retreat into yourself because it can't be that such a highly regarded person did anything bad to you.
  • It must be your fault that something bad has happened to you.
  • You read that it might have happened to others and you are not alone anymore nor the 'bad person that accused somebody'.
  • You feel relieved because you realize that the abuse wasn't your fault nor are you alone.

Just food for thought, SY
Agree on all acounts!!! But only AFTER proven guilty.
OK, I'm a male (well, boys got abused also, but not so often as girls) and was never abused, but as a film director I've made 3 documentaries on the topic and spoke alot to abused individuals. Therefore I dare to claim I'm aware of all this and also (as highly emphatic person by default) I still stand behind my words that identity of arrested should be hidden until proven guilty.
 

SYates

Camino Fossil AD 1999
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#12
Emphatic, photographer and vino lover? We do have to meet. SY *This is so badly off topic that I do feel slightly embarrassed posting it*
 
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SYates

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#14
I really, really, really try hard to not be a judge, if anything I would like to be a decent journalist getting all the facts out into the open for others, more qualified than me, to judge ... SY
 

fraluchi

Veteran Member
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#15
No, SY, leave the judging to the judges. And the qualification of "decent journalists" is like "beauty is in the eye of the beholder"! No personal feelings intended, but just recently, in our small world, the "freedom of expression" has been mutilated with dangerous consequences.o_O
 
A

Anemone del Camino

Guest
#16
I don't think revealing the identity of the monk until charges proven is adequate.
But if he is guilty and if I was the father of the minor mentioned in the article I wouldn't want to be either that minor, the monk or me, because... well, I don't want to go any further...

And these "things" are happening so regularly..., shame!
Since when is the identity of a person being arrested private? I'm actually surprise he was not named - only initials used. Many people get arrested and then released, but the arrest is always public - at least in OECD countries (at least one would hope).
 

KinkyOne

Veteran Member
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#17
Since when is the identity of a person being arrested private? I'm actually surprise he was not named - only initials used. Many people get arrested and then released, but the arrest is always public - at least in OECD countries (at least one would hope).
Revealing the identity of a person who's just a suspect so far, doesn't seems very ethical to me. In case that all the charges will be droped it could ruin that person's life anyway. I see this kind of attitude as a "witch-hunt", sorry.
 
A

Anemone del Camino

Guest
#18
Revealing the identity of a person who's just a suspect so far, doesn't seems very ethical to me. In case that all the charges will be droped it could ruin that person's life anyway. I see this kind of attitude as a "witch-hunt", sorry.
It's still the way it works.
 

KinkyOne

Veteran Member
Camino(s) past & future
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#19
Since when is the identity of a person being arrested private? I'm actually surprise he was not named - only initials used. Many people get arrested and then released, but the arrest is always public - at least in OECD countries (at least one would hope).
Furthermore (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organisation_for_Economic_Co-operation_and_Development) OECD member is also Mexico, just for an example, and I think lots of people know about Mexico judicial system.
OECD is not the same as EU, thanks to " ............. " (insert by your choice).
 
A

Anemone del Camino

Guest
#23
Emphatic, photographer and vino lover? We do have to meet. SY *This is so badly of topic that I do feel slightly embarrassed posting it*
It may be sad, but why this suprises you I don't understand. Perhaps we should hold trials secretly until someone is "proven guilty" - because let's not forget that it is not about real "proof", but a process with its rules. You may well have committed the crime, but if there was an error in the trial you are declared innocent, and yet ... There is no black and white answer hear, just no reason to be surprised.
 

KinkyOne

Veteran Member
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#24
It really makes me sad that more people here care about the (supposed) offender than the (supposed) victim. SY
SY, I don't care more about the "supposed" offender here. But the article speaks (shows actually) more about him than the "supposed" victim. That's why I've made initial response.
 

SYates

Camino Fossil AD 1999
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#25
SY, I don't care more about the "supposed" offender here. But the article speaks (shows actually) more about him than the "supposed" victim. That's why I've made initial response.
Because the supposed victim is protected from the public eye, which I find the right way to do things. SY
 

SYates

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#27
It may be sad, but why this suprises you I don't understand. Perhaps we should hold trials secretly until someone is "proven guilty" - because let's not forget that it is not about real "proof", but a process with its rules. You may well have committed the crime, but if there was an error in the trial you are declared innocent, and yet ... There is no black and white answer hear, just no reason to be surprised.
I seriously have no idea what are you writing about, can you clarify please? SY
 

SYates

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#28
Err no thanks, we have tried that under Messirs Stalin, Mao & Pol Pot to name a few
I sooo agree that I have to hold myself back cheering! Which would be inappropriate considering the topic! SY
 
A

Anemone del Camino

Guest
#29
I seriously have no idea what are you writing about, can you clarify please? SY
When a person gets arrested, it is public. That simple. When they are just brought in for questioning it is not, but when they are arrested, hopefully with enough evidence, it is public. Now, if they get through the hoops of the system (DKS-NYC for instance) it does not mean that the act did not happen, just that it could not legally be proven. Legal does not mean true or just. It's just a system. Hope this explains.
 
A

Anemone del Camino

Guest
#30
Err no thanks, we have tried that under Messirs Stalin, Mao & Pol Pot to name a few
SY, how can you like this when this is exactly what you are proposing when I was being sarcastic? Holding things from the public until a person is deemed guilty is just what these countries were doing, hence my reference to "OECD countries - hopefully". Because if I didn't opt for that choice of words, OECD, I could have started to pinpoint many other countries that don't quite do things "in a civilized mater". Yes, ohhh that term ;0)
 

Kanga

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#31
In Australia we are in the middle of a huge Royal Commission investigating institutional child sex abuse. And controversy about a report into children held in immigration detention. The biggest problem is always the attempt to safeguard reputation at the expense of the victims. Without pre-judging anyone, let's put the safety of children at the centre of everything.
 
Camino(s) past & future
Nearly every year since 2006, often walking more than one route. 2018 will be Camino #14.
#32
It really makes me sad that more people here care about the (supposed) offender than the (supposed) victim. SY
I am a victim.
I care.

But I also know that people are very quick to judge.
If YOU were the one being accused, you might wish everyone waited to hear the evidence before they convicted you and ruined your life.

It's more than possible that the priest is the victim.
 
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#33
I knew one person that was accused, found guilty was punished accordingly. I know another who is accused and was innocent and was never accepted within that community or even in that part of the state which he lived in and will forever carry a stigma because of the accusation.

One needs to care about the accuser and the victim both until things are figured out. it is an awful thing no matter what.
 

Pruden

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#36
Only a word to be said !
They got in his computer some very nasty photos with some of this abused kids!
Let's justice do the rest , even the church angry on this !
 
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#37
as a victim of abuse including figures of authority I KNOW that people can be multifaceted and show the parts to some that they want to be seen, hide others and be different to different people in many situations
( we all do that but living transparently and being on the outside what you are on the inside is what counts in relationship honesty)

i believe that the line is in the conversation after presenting facts.
Fact : father so and so was arrested under suspicion of 2 counts of child abuse or molestation
yada yada

any further comments not based on first hand knowledge, will feed the gossip, fears, prurient curiosity and general conversations that are not helpful nor in line with the mission of this forum- (I believe)
IMHO
 


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