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Gear / Weight - Packing List Thoughts, Opinions, Questions

Discussion in 'Equipment Questions' started by STLperegrino, Sep 14, 2017.

  1. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    First time posting anything here, but I have been lurking these forums for several months now. Thanks to all for their input and advice as it has helped me determine for myself what is important to focus on and what not to. I will brush aside blisters and bed bugs and 'bed races' and face those issues if/when they come, but I can't seem to shake off my concern about pack weight. I have hiked a few times with this setup on and it isn't that bad, but I keep going over in my mind about what else I could possible cut out or am missing from my final list.

    Some things to consider:
    • The lacrosse ball (I have lower back pains and this seems to help for foot/back massaging/relieving tension - also good for throwing around when bored :p), emergency bivy sack (always want to be prepared) and maybe my headlamp are at the top of my list for items to be removed
    • I am intentionally bringing zero electronics (minus headlamp), so unfortunately I can't transfer the guidebook, Bible or journal into one device.
    • I am spending a few days before/after in Paris, hence the button down shirt (doubles for layer on sunny days for sun protection / warmth on colder days and appropriate attire for Mass/nice outings) and the fleece (doubles as pillow and potential other outfit)
    • Since I am going to 'carry-on' my pack, I will consider buying a walking stick or trekking pole over there
    • My body is out to get me: seasonal allergies, acid reflux, insomnia, lower back issues. Meds will be a necessity in my first aid kit :p
    • [INSERT OTHER THINGS TO CONSIDER HERE]
    I do understand there is no right or wrong answers to this one and my *ahem* heavier weight throws the 10% rule out the window, but just wanted to gather your thoughts, opinions and questions on my packing list and if there are any ways to shave weight? Most of this gear I have simply acquired over the years and money is a little bit tight to go out and buy anything else if I can avoid it (especially since I leave in less than two weeks!). I am walking the CF from SJPDP to Muxia (God willing) from Sept 28 to ~Nov 6. The can of worms is now open! ;)

    5lb 1.8oz (81.8oz) PACK AND BAG
    Pack: REI Lookout 40 - 3 lbs 3oz (51oz)
    Pack Cover: North Face Medium Rain Cover - 2.8 oz
    Sleeping Bag: REI Helio 55 Travel Pack - 1 lb. 12 oz. (28oz)
    - My brother is going for the first week and is bringing a liner. I may swap for this when he has to leave to reduce weight. Only concern is the varying weather temps in Oct/Nov and if a liner is adequate.

    10lbs 1.10oz (161.1oz) CLOTHES
    20L dry sack for all clothes/sleeping bag - 3.2oz

    Footwear - 3lb 14oz (62oz)

    KEEN Durand Mid WP Hiking Boots - 3 lbs 1oz (49oz)
    Crocs - 13oz

    Outerwear - 1 lb 5.4 oz (21.4oz)
    REI Waterproof Rain Jacket - 12.6oz
    REI Co-op Quarter-Zip Fleece Pullover -8.8oz

    2x Pants - 1lbs 15oz (31oz)
    prAna Stretch Zion Convertible Pants - 1lb 1oz
    REI pants - 14oz

    Shirts- 1 lb 8.4 oz (24.4oz)
    2 synthetic, quick dry t-shirt - 15.6oz
    1 light, button-down long sleeve (roll up for short sleeve option) - 8.8oz

    Underwear - 12 oz
    ExOfficio Boxers x2 - 8oz
    Darn Tough Merino wool socks X2 - 4oz

    Gloves - .7oz
    Merino wool liners

    Hat - 6.4oz
    Sugoi Midzero Tuke - 1.4oz
    REI Co-op Paddler's Hat - 4oz
    Buff - 1 oz
    242.9 oz PACK AND CLOTHES TOTAL

    Toiletries/bag - 1lb 3.3oz (19.3 oz)
    REI Co-op Mesh Stuff Sack - .8 oz
    Shampoo and Conditioner bottle - 5 oz
    Quick dry towel - 3.1 oz
    Toothbrush and paste - 3 oz
    Dr. Bronners Bar Soap - 5 oz
    Mesh bag for soap - 1 oz
    Comb - 1 oz
    Toenail clippers - .4oz

    First Aid Kit (bag from REI) - 1lb (16oz) *supplies not bought/weighed yet - WIll look into just buying travel pack size for pills and consolidating into one baggy. And then stock up along the way.
    Individual tissue packets (for nose and bathroom emergencies)
    Imodium
    Ibuprofen PM
    Pepcid /zantac / gaviscon - - antacid // Omeprazole in spain
    Allergy medication
    Blister Pads / Compeed (in Spain)
    Neosporin
    Sunscreen
    Thread and needle
    Hand sanitizer (strap for outside of pack)
    bandaids
    Body/Foot Glide

    Miscellaneous - 3lbs. 9.8oz (57.8oz)
    couple of ziplock bags - 1oz
    1 Liter Nalgene bottle - 6.5 oz
    Passport / Credit and Debit cards / extra cash (all in ziplock bag) -- Put in passort wallet - 3oz
    Guidebook / Credencial - 11oz
    pocket Bible - 3 oz
    Journal and pen - 11.8 oz (will find lighter option)
    Digital watch with alarm - .9 oz
    Sunglasses with line - 1 oz
    Ear plugs - 0.2oz
    Sleep mask - .5 oz
    REI Co-op Mesh Stuff Sack 12L - 1.6 oz
    Nite Ize S double carabiner / twisty tie - 1.5 oz
    Sea to Summit Lite Line Clothesline / 10 brass safety pins - 2 oz
    SOL escape lite bivy - 5.4 oz
    Lacrosse Ball - 5.2 oz
    (will find lighter option)
    Black Diamond Headlamp - 3.2 oz

    **EVERYTHING WILL GET A FINAL WEIGH IN NEXT WEEK, TOTALS BELOW DO NOT REFLECT CURRENT UPDATES**

    21lbs (336oz) TOTAL

    2lbs 15oz (47oz) Lightest hiking outfit total / 17lbs 15oz (287oz) TOTAL POSSIBLE 'PACK WEIGHT'
    6lbs 1.4oz (97.4oz) Typical outfit total / 14lbs 14.6oz (238.6oz) TOTAL POSSIBLE 'PACK WEIGHT'

    HAVE FUN!
    Thanks in advance! :)
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2017 at 5:35 AM
    HedaP, kinnear and Nancy Drew like this.
  2. Kitsambler

    Kitsambler Jakobsweg Junkie

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    I am a bit confused: it appears you are adding in your 'worn clothing' in with your 'pack weight'. The way this topic is generally discussed in this forum, the 'pack weight' does not include the clothing or shoes you are wearing on your person.

    The bivy sack can stay home.
    Your pack is itself quite heavy, and you can save a pound there.
    The journal is heavy - can you take a smaller size?
    The first aid kit seems heavy - look for a smaller size Body Glide, and look for smaller/fewer on the meds
     
    STLperegrino likes this.
  3. VNwalking

    VNwalking Veteran Member

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    Hi, and welcome, ST!
    Already you're doing OK, but here's what I'd ditch or adjust:
    • REI Waterproof Rain Jacket - 12.6oz (Consider switching to an Altus poncho - it's much lighter and covers your pack, too. I bought one in SJPP and mailed my Goretex to Santiago...and have had zero regrets in several caminos since).
    • If you get the Altus you can ditch the pack cover and the dry sack.
    • REI Co-op Paddler's Hat - 4oz (The heavier of your 2 hats - you will only need one)
    • Shampoo and Conditioner bottle - 5 oz (use the Dr B's for everything)
    • 1 Liter Nalgene bottle - 6.5 oz (use a much lighter disposable bottle that you can get once you're in Europe)
    • SOL escape lite bivy - 5.4 oz (no need)
    • Black Diamond Headlamp - 3.2 oz (Try one of those super-light hand-held LEDs instead. A headlamp is overkill and will make no friends if you use it in the albergue at night...)
    When you get stuff for 1st aid and toiletries, of course get travel-sizes if possible and discard any unnecessary packaging.
    [I hear you and left in your ball, bible, and journal. A super small journal could save you weight. And kudos for disconnecting!!!;) Other considerations aside (another topic...), you'll save plenty of weight not taking the tech stuff.]
    Buen Camino!
     
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  4. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Kitsambler - Yeah the "totals" at the end are worded a bit weirdly, my apologies. Makes sense in my head, but my wordage is probably a bit off. While wearing an outfit, I am left with roughly 15-18 pounds for my backpack/contents.

    The journal is a bit of a before/during/after project, but I suppose I could find one small and then re-write it when I get home.

    The first aid kit is just a guess-timate at this point. It is the only thing I have yet to go out and buy/weigh. If I can find small 5-10 count packs at the pharmacias along the way, that would be more ideal than lugging 30 days worth of pills around for sure! Do you happen to know if they carry smaller counts for medication over there?
     
  5. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    VNwalking - Thanks! I have considered the poncho route for simplicity (versus jacket and rain cover). Just haven't been able to see/try out the Altus. Would definitely shave some weight. 2 concerns with it. If it rains in Paris, the poncho would certainly be a fashion statement :D (not that I personally care about that though haha). But my bigger concern in body heat. The jacket keeps me plenty warm in colder weather. In your opinion, how does the Altus poncho stack up in colder weather/wind?

    I am thinking of ditching the Sugoi hat and just pull my buff up over my ears in cooler weather. The paddler has a wide brim for the sun protection, so that would be my first choice.

    While I want to use the Dr. for everything, unfortunately the bar doesn't work on my flowing locks. It leaves it all gummy and nappy and I am not quite ready for dreadlocks :p I am running to the store tomorrow to pick up some Lush and see if that will solve the one-for-all soap debate.

    The Nalgene and bivy I can probs leave at home, you're right on that one. And as for the headlamp, I have read up plenty on here about etiquette and won't even consider turning it on while in the albergue :) I'll check into some flashlight alternatives before I go though. Thanks!
     
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  6. C clearly

    C clearly Veteran Member Donating Member

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    Hi, welcome, and kudos for braving the forum with a packing list!

    On first read, I thought that most things were quite reasonable. If your pack would typically be about 15 to 18 pounds (about 7-8 kg), that is not unreasonable. However, it concerns me that you say "It isn't that bad" to carry. That's not a ringing endorsement! And you mention lower back issues. Are you sure you have the backpack properly fitted so that the weight is transferred to your hips? I agree with the others that the pack itself is not as lightweight as some, but it's more important that it fit right. Also, do get two walking sticks,

    Of course it is desirable to reduce weight as much as possible. Here are a few things to consider:
    • Medications - Take only a day or 2 days supply of over-the-counter medications. Just enough to get to the pharmacy if more are needed. Just take 3 immodium pills, antacid, allergy, etc., unless you really think you'll need more. Don't worry about the size of the packages in the pharmacy in Spain. Just give away what you don't want to carry.
    • Lacrosse ball - You won't need it to alleviate boredom. Is there no lighter weight substitute?
    • Skip the bivy. You should find beds in October-November.
    • Get a lighter weight journal. 11.8 oz is a lot. It's not necessary unless it a fashion statement to show how important your journaling is. :p
    • Tear pages out of your guide, or consider taking a maps-only book.
    • Those t-shirts seem a bit heavy.
    • I agree that the Nalgene bottle is too heavy and you can buy a couple of small bottles of water in Spain and refill them
    • If the paddler's hat is good for sun protection, you might still want to take it.
    • VNwalking suggests ditching the jacket for a poncho. That's a personal preference and I wouldn't do it. I use the jacket as a windbreak and for insulation even when it isn't raining. However I also take rain pants, especially at that time of year (which is a great time to walk, by the way).
    I would also add a third pair of socks.

    Finally...
    That's not good enough if you have back problems :mad::(. Get yourself 2 trekking poles as soon as you arrive in SJPP!

    As I've been writing, I see that others have continued to respond with good ideas. You just need to use that ones that seem to suit you best. Good luck!
     
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  7. tomnorth

    tomnorth Active Member

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    Ditch the bivy sack. Other than that I'd be nitpicking.
     
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  8. VNwalking

    VNwalking Veteran Member

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    It does OK in the shoulder seasons I walk in, especially with something thermal underneath. I've walked in sleet and snow and plenty of wind. It is a bit chilly under those conditions, but I'm still sold on it.
    (I don't use rain pants and am Ok with damp lower legs; the Altus is long enough for me. But I know others take the pants. As @Cclearly says, it's a personal decision. Check it out when you get to SJPP and see what you think.)
    I got curious and found these. Light as can be!
     
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  9. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    C Clearly - Sorry, a little tongue in cheek sarcasm about the weight; I need to learn about appropriate times for sarcasm haha. Who wouldn't love walking around with just a few pounds on their back? Am I right? :D But for all that I am carrying, I don't think the overall weight is too unreasonable, given my circumstances. It really isn't bad at all.

    The pack (while slightly old and heavy) is fitted properly with the straps and weight distributed evenly at the hips and is comfortable to carry. A couple of poles will certainly help even more tho.

    As for the meds, I get pretty brutal seasonal allergies but I will certainly start off with a small count and restock often along the way. Same with the other meds.

    And no, I certainly don't want to draw attention to my poor writing skills. The journal I currently am using is a work-in-progress thing. I will look into a smaller book and re-write the entries when I get home. And as much as I am about being a book stickler, I will be tearing out unnecessary pages from the guidebook. Will also ditch the nalgene and bivy.

    Thanks for all of the advice! :)
     
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  10. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Nitpicking is what got me into this mess in the first place. I knew what I was going to get when I asked though hahah Thanks for the reply! :)
     
  11. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Yeah I knew the rain jacket versus poncho debate would spark some conversation. I hear ya guys on it being a personal decision for sure! I will at least try out one of the Altus ponchos while I am over there, as I am simply curious about the things given how much they are mentioned on here. But I think the deciding factor will be how the weather turns out before I leave. Can't predict that one at the moment though. :p

    Funny enough, now that I think about it, I actually have a set of those Moleskines lying around here somewhere. Now if only I could find them...
     
  12. CaminoDebrita

    CaminoDebrita Veteran Member Donating Member

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    Hey, new pilgrim!

    Others have give you great advice. I will only add that the end of CF--I think you're walking CF?--will get cold in the mornings (and some nights). O'Cebreiro, Galicia, mountains, mornings can become very chilly.

    It was wonderful as long as it stayed dry, but if you get cold at night, don't forget to wear all your clothes and cover yourself with your altus or rain poncho. The plastic that insulates you so well during a rainy day (and makes you sweat!) will help keep you warm at night also.

    I would recommend just using the liner, but be ready to go to bed in your socks and dressed. I am almost sorry to see you don't have a stretchy merino wool undershirt with long sleeves to sleep in.
     
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  13. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    CaminoDebrita - I am a big guy and tend to sleep warm (especially depending on the variables like room temp, extra bodies in the room, etc). My bag is rated to 55 (don't know what my brother's liner is if we decide to switch), but I also plan on wearing the next day's outfit to bed, so I should be okay warmth-wise. And in a pinch I can use my fleece for warmth instead of a pillow.

    And I would have loved to have had more merino wool in my gear setup but it wasn't really in the budget; just working with what I've got for now. Maybe Santa will be good to me this year :p Being from St. Louis, I can tolerate the extreme weather changes pretty well, so I am hopeful that my gear will get me through it. If not, I can always pick something up along the way. Appreciate the tips! :)
     
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  14. jozero

    jozero Oh... That's what the shell is for... Donating Member

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    Hi - by October I think the need for sunscreen won't be very high or allergy medicine even as blooms will have come and gone. If really needed it will be easy enough to grab some at a pharmacy. I agree with the other about the bivy. The Camino is a path walk from town to town with very few mountain/forest scenarios where one could have an emergency. For Oct and Nov I think you will def want to keep the sleeping bag. I sleep warm too but when you've walked all day in cool weather your body won't have the normal energy and a good nights sleep is important to recover. For earplugs, I'd recommend 2-3 pairs. Easy to misplace those little suckers and life as we know it is over without them in an Albergue! Last one; swap you lacrosse ball for a tennis ball. Lighter and still rolls under the body fine. It's a great first-timer list and shows you've done your homework. Take it slow, rest when you need to, stretch when you feel an issue and I think you'll do just fine.
    Buen Camino, Peregrino!
     
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  15. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Thanks Jozero! Apart from the gear and common sense subjects, I am actually trying to plan as little as possible and place my faith and trust in God, the Camino and others around me (ie, don't worry about bed bugs, where the best place in town to sleep is, what to expect along the way, etc. and just let things be what they are), but it certainly doesn't seem to be the case when it came to planning the gear hahah. Much of my gear list though has been acquired through these forums so I do have that much to be thankful for. And now that I am in the home stretch of breaking down the final odds and ends, this advice is awesome!

    Yeah I don't know what it is about the autumn months but even after things start dying, I still get pretty bad allergies (dust and hay and whatever pollen remnants are still around). So being out in the countryside, I will probably err on the side of caution. But I can certainly start small and see how the body reacts.

    Definitely ditching the bivy for sure now. I didn't think I'd need it, but reading everyone's comments has assured me of that point. I did manage to squeeze a few pair of ear plugs into the container that it came with, so I think I will be good there too (unfortunately I am guilty of contributing to the need for them in first place :(). And I like the tennis ball idea. My bro runs marathons and mentioned the lacrosse ball, but I am certain I have a tennis ball lying around the house that I can try out. As for the sunscreen, my face and arms are pretty well-weathered from the St. Louis summer, so I probably won't need the sunscreen (or at least to start off with it anyways). Thanks so much for all of the advice!
     
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  16. Duayne Meyer

    Duayne Meyer New Member Donating Member

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    STL Peregrino,
    First, here's to your most excellent camino adventure!
    Second, as has been mentioned, much of what you take with you is what you are most comfortable/confident with. There have been some great ideas posted.
    Third, and in the category of pretty important (and redundant, I know), I would say that good rain gear is a must. Folks have already addressed this point. I can tell you from my own experience, an REI rain jacket won't get you through several hours of heavy wind and rain, so be prepared to improvise if that should happen to you. I wouldn't leave home without rain pants either.
    You can buy reasonably priced trekking poles in SJPP, close to the pilgrim's office. The poles are nice to have on slippery surfaces and on steep downhills.
    Buen Camino
     
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  17. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Cheers Duayne! Love the advice, tips and input I have been getting thus far. Always appreciate another's thoughts :) Curious about your experience with the REI line of rain jackets. I have had the Rhyolite Jacket for about a year now and has held up to rain, snow, wind and cold perfectly well thus far. Not doubting/questioning your personal experience, but would love input/advice on your rain gear setup. In a pinch I can always try to find an Altus poncho along the way for added protection, but I have been dry through my walks/hikes (one hike was 3 hours straight with rain) thus far with this jacket in particular. Like you said though, it is what you are comfortable/confident with.

    As for the pants, I am probably crazy/stupid/ignorant (all the above :p) when I say I don't want to deal with them. For the added weight and costs, I can't justify it over simply being uncomfortable with wet/cold legs (which don't normally bother me anyways). Only concern I have there would be rain soaking through the pants leg and into my socks/shoes. But it's a concern I might have to suck up and deal with, unless there are some cheaper pants alternative to what I already have? Any recommendations? Should I be more concerned with rain pants for this time of year?
     
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  18. alaskadiver

    alaskadiver Active Member

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    Won't be returning in 2018 going on a dive trip instead.
    I took the same sleeping bag as you. I loved it because even though in May on the Primitivo it was generally to warm to use as a sleeping bag, it worked great as a quilt. I solved my shampoo problem using these little sachets that i found at Walmart. Check out my packing list to get the details. I personally hate ponchos. They are saunas to me and when the wind kicks up they are a pain. Plus with a rain jacket I could comfortably wear around villages in the evening if it was raining.
    Definitely ditch the bivvy sack. Also, with the pack cover and your clothes in stuff sacks you won't need a dry bag inside your pack. Just get a dry bag compression sack for the sleeping if that is going to sit in the bottom sleeping bag compartment. Otherwise it will get damp when you set it down in wet mud and stuff.

    http://www.musingsfromthelastfrontier.com/post-camino-de-santiago-packing-list/
     
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  19. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Hi Alaskadiver! Yeah that was one of the main reasons I liked this bag in particular, ie the versatility of it. I have found it comfortable using it on my back porch in the 60s the last few nights. I am sure I can fiddle with my sleeping setup along the Camino no problem. And I am definitely in the rain jacket over poncho camp, but I am curious to experience how the "other half live" :D I think my personal pros outweigh those in the poncho camp, but I do like the idea of a single cover-up system that Altus ponchos can provide.

    Due to my hair being well past shoulder length at this point, I am not sure those individual packets would work. But a quick trip to Wally World is needed anyways so I will look into them. I love the idea of disposable packets like that!

    Bivy sack has already been taken out of my pack, per the request of literally everyone hahah

    And I already had the 20L dry sac from a previous trip so it holds all of my clothes and sleeping bag no problem. I would ditch the NF rain cover otherwise since I don't mind the rest of my gear/pack getting wet, except I am uncertain of a ziplock bag holding up over several weeks in order to keep all of my books/papers dry in the front compartment of my pack. Tempted to test fate in order to save another few ounces though...

    Loved your packing list website! While I am definitely a shorts and flip flops kind of guy in winter, I don't think I am brave enough to go commando though.... :D
     
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  20. alaskadiver

    alaskadiver Active Member

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    Won't be returning in 2018 going on a dive trip instead.
    My hair was down to my shoulder blades. I trimmed it to come to the top of my shoulders. But the packets were enough to do my long hair. You only need to scrub the scalp and soap up the locks.
    My comando husband...yes.. left over from the Infantry days.
    I pass on ziplock bags, too. I prefer nylon stuff sacks made for backpacking. They have served us well in the backcountry during wet weather in Alaska along with the pack cover. But a dry bag will work fine. Especially if you don't mind the extra weight.
    Hope you have a blast on your trip. Buen Camino :)
     
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  21. Robo

    Robo Veteran Member Donating Member

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    (May 2015)
    Alone.
    ------------------------------
    CF Sarria to SdC
    (May 2016)
    with my wife Pat.
    ------------------------------
    CF SJPDP-SdC
    (Apr/May 2018)
    together again :-)
    Welcome to the Forum :)
    Packing lists are lots of fun. I've been working on my next one for months.

    Not that you really want to be changing gear I suppose, but my 2 cents with are.....

    21 lbs (9.5kg) is not bad as an all up weight. Nice to get down to 8kg if you could.
    Sleeping bag at 800 gms is quite heavy. but not over the top
    Maybe cut the soap in half.
    A lot of the meds you can get over the counter as you go.
    Lose the ball. use a coke can or similar along the way.
    Lose the guide book, maybe just cut out the maps. or scan it, and take a phone ;)
    Lose the bivvy.
    Lose the journal. Take a phone and write in that or better still record your thoughts on audio.....on the phone... (can be done whilst walking!)

    But Hey. It's not a bad list and not that heavy. Well done. :)

    Welcome to the 'Addicts Club'........
    Oh. Maybe you think it's not addictive.
    yet..............:rolleyes:
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017
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  22. spursfan

    spursfan Veteran Member Donating Member

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    This is completely crazy, I'm afraid but, as you say, you're reluctant to buy more equipment and you've chosen stuff that you have (everything you have by the look of things!)

    You're not walking the Appalachian trail - you're doing a sequence of short day walks across a generally-warm country (even in October) with lots of chances to buy additional clothes and more pharmacies than you can shake a stick at - and, you're not camping out, you're staying indoors where you can expect some heating and probably additional blankets if needed

    And, if there's a thunderstorm, you can easily stop walking or shelter for a few hours

    You could ditch three-quarters of the items and not suffer that much and lots of your items are just far, too heavy - my trail running shoes with Vibram soles weight about the same as your Crocs and my rain jacket weighs under 4oz (but they are relatively expensive)

    Don't pack for what might happen, pack instead for the typical day - ditch the technical shirts, instead buy yourself two cheap Merino wool long-sleeve shirts, hat, gloves, even silk balaclava - and night - Helly Hansen polypropylene

    Yes, your cheap sleeping bag and fleece will add volume to your pack but you can still be ruthless about the heavy / less-frequently needed items

    And , no need for special clothes for Paris or mass - if it's good enough for the Camino, it'll do anywhere
     
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  23. Tia Valeria

    Tia Valeria Veteran Member Donating Member

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    C. Primitivo '12
    Norte-C. de la Reina '13
    C. do Mar-C. Inglés '15
    Basically the list looks good and you know what works for you. You can travel too heavy, but also too light - especially in autumn/early winter.
    The allergy and acid reflux meds etc can be bought in Spain. Bring the paper insert from your allergy meds and enough to get you started. The farmacias will then use the paper to match you a replacement if needed. Gaviscon etc is readily available as well as Nurofen/Ibuprofen tablets and gels.
    If you bring prescription Meds from home bring the wrappers/boxes until you have cleared Customs, then ditch all the un-needed wrappings but keep the paper insert. Saves weight and bulk. One year I put all my prescription tablets out of their foil 'bubble' wrappers into a tight sealed little plastic bottle. They kept OK for the time on the Camino, although it wouldn't be recommended at home.
    I took A4 (foolscap) paper, folded smaller to make pages, for a journal. Kept in a thin plastic bag. Saved weight as it had no outer covers.
    Buen Camino
     
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  24. DoubleD

    DoubleD New Member

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    I've said before, but I love reading threads like this....lots to learn. I don't have high enough self esteem to post my own packing list...so I learn through others. HA.
    I'm at the stage where I have everything...I just need to organize it and then decide what to trim back.
    I use a lacrosse ball daily for my feet...but I couldn't pack it...weighs too much. My wife found some other type of ball that is sturdy (not soft) and has spikes or nubs. Weighs considerably less and does the trick. Another option that I was going to consider was one of those orange street hockey balls. I'm from Canada, so they're everywhere...but their the size of a lacrosse ball, extremely light weight, but quite hard. Hmm..maybe I should go get one and try it out myself.

    Good luck! I leave a week from today for Madrid, starting in Astorga and going to Finisterre. I wish had the time to do the full Camino....another time.
     
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  25. CaminoDebrita

    CaminoDebrita Veteran Member Donating Member

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    Wow, "completely crazy"?

    Let this kind gentleman know what you think he's missing, or could do without, but let's leave the mental health assessment to the professionals!

    I remember the very first time I walked CF--September of 2015. Initially it was hotter than hades, but on the second day (2 Oct), I woke up at Orisson. Clouds were gray, and there was a bite in the air. I began the trek up the mountain. Just as I got off the path that begins going over the pass, the rain, a torrential downpour, began. Visibility was down to almost nothing. I was glad I had my Altus rain poncho.

    At Burgos, I made the decision to send my sleeping back ahead to SdC. I regretted it, as it then got very, very cold. The last week of October and the first week of November found me sleeping in everything, with the altus poncho on top. I was so glad that I had lots of layers, but from year to year, we can't know what it will be like.

    Anyway, I think the merino wool is a great expenditure too, but if the gentleman is satisfied with what he's got, there we go! Everyone walks the first time and gets to learn on their own. Those of us who are asked for advice need to be pretty kind about it!

    Hey, here's a great tip for those of you with access to EBay: you can get icebreaker t shirts for under 30 dollars rather than buying them from icebreaker. And no, I don't get a commission!
     
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  26. Duayne Meyer

    Duayne Meyer New Member Donating Member

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    Ingles, April/May 2018
    Hi STL Peregrino,
    I wore my rhyolite jacket (which I still have and like a lot) on my Camino in April, 2016 and got fairly soaked during a day long torrent of sleet, rain, snow and - oh yeah - heavy winds. Of course there is the matter of how much is wicking through and how much is coming in from the outside. So this may have been an unfair test.
    By the way, in heavy winds, many of the folks with ponchos look like they have open parachutes on their backs. Last Spring, on a day of roaring winds and pouring rain on the Meseta, the poncho wearers really struggled, even more than the rest of us. So, if you are thinking about a poncho, you are right to go with something like the Altus which should have enough length (and zip down features) to keep from inflating (as much). For me, the Altus is just a bit too big and bulky and is too specific in functionality. That's just me.
    As you can tell, I haven't given in to the poncho-thing, as I use my jacket in the mornings as a shell and still prefer a jacket. I have since picked up an Arcteryx rain shell at an REI garage sale. I actually like the fit of the REI better, but the Arcteryx is pretty bullet proof. After a month or so, the rhyolite fabric may begin to breakdown, particularly at the backpack straps (mine did). I use a Trail40 (the successor to your Pack 40) and, as much as I wish I could find a pack I like more, I can't. So I put up with the little bit of extra weight.
    Speaking of weight, in an effort to save a bit, I figured I would skip getting rain pants on my first camino. The person from REI convinced me otherwise. When I noticed the cross of St.James tatooed on his arm, and he told me about a couple of his experiences on the Camino, I figured he knew what he talking about; and he did! My Marmots weigh 8 ounces. I wouldn't - and won't - leave home without them. Again, that's just me. There are others who probably disagree and can/will do so vehemently. Mine have been a godsend on two occasions, the difference between hunkering down and pushing through. It's not that your legs will get wet in a driving rain, it's that they will get wet and cold, maybe freezing cold. Given the season you are walking, I think it's important to keep this possibility (in my case, certainty) in mind.
    I don't have waterproof shoes, but I do treat them with waterproofing wax. No matter, your feet very well may get wet. It's a good idea to have an extra pair of socks. I concur with another person's recommendation to throw a third pair of socks in your bag. It's good to change them once during the day, even when it's a dry day. Again, that's just my opinion/personal preference. It's probably more luck than anything, but, so far on two caminos I have avoided blisters; I've probably jinxed that now! Many moons ago my Scoutmaster (in metro STL no less), convinced his charges that the feet are the most important part of your body to take care of on hiking excursions. I also carry an extra pair of insoles in the event my shoes get wet. A change of insoles and socks and I'm ready to press on. Believe it or not, I have managed to keep my pack weight under 18 pounds, excluding my water bottle.
    I bought my trekking poles in SJPP last Spring and, if I recall, paid $60 for them with the intention of bringing them back home with me. I think there were cheaper pairs for sale. Just the walk down to Roncesvalles on the first day made the purchase worthwhile. I used them at least part of every day thereafter. Pamplona, Logrono, Burgos and Leon - just to name a few cities - all have a lot to offer, if you should decide to change/add any gear along the way.
    Regardless of what you do (and don't) carry along with you, I am sure you are in for a most excellent adventure.
    Traveling mercies.
     
  27. CaminoDebrita

    CaminoDebrita Veteran Member Donating Member

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    Frances SJPP to SdC Oct/Nov 2015
    Frances Burgos toSdC March/April 2016
    W. Highland Way August 2016
    Camino Somewhere September 2017
    My packing list:
    lipbalm
    Glide (my foot stuff of choice)
    medications
    sunscreenstick
    sunglasses
    reading glasses

    i phone / charger (accommodates more than one)
    small flashlight (tiny)

    a small down-filled blanket (Costco)
    My walking sticks (Diamond Z poles)
    one shorts / one pants
    one t shirt / one long sleeve merino
    three socks / three under / two b.'s
    One boots or Merrell's (thinking about last times) and one pair crocks

    one fleece / one rain jacket / one buff
    one fingerless m wool gloves
    one towel
    two small soaps with net bag from Rioja Soap Company (@JillGat makes these--brilliant)
     
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  28. C clearly

    C clearly Veteran Member Donating Member

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    Only one pair of long pants, and no rain pants or poncho? Hat? What do you sleep in ?

    How much does it all weigh?
     
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  29. jozero

    jozero Oh... That's what the shell is for... Donating Member

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    You're kidding, right? This is one of the most level-headed lists I've seen, especially for a first-time walker. If you think he could drop 3/4 of his items and not suffer I have to wonder if you actually read the list and his reasons for packing them. This wasn't a very constructive post.
     
  30. CaminoDebrita

    CaminoDebrita Veteran Member Donating Member

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    Frances Burgos toSdC March/April 2016
    W. Highland Way August 2016
    Camino Somewhere September 2017
    My tights also, and no rain pants (wet legs = no problem). I had already mentioned my altus poncho, so whoops, should have been on list. I sleep in tights and t shirt! With my water, should come in at about 14 pounds this time (under seven kilos, maybe less). Probably packing my visor too, actually--or maybe a baseball hat. Given I'm in line for a surgery, maybe a wrist brace.
     
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  31. CaminoDebrita

    CaminoDebrita Veteran Member Donating Member

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    Frances Burgos toSdC March/April 2016
    W. Highland Way August 2016
    Camino Somewhere September 2017
    Scrap that
    Scrap that--No poncho this time. Just my event wear rain jacket from REI which is amazing.
     
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  32. C clearly

    C clearly Veteran Member Donating Member

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    That's OK as long as you have the dry tights for the evening!
     
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  33. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    I might have to try out the packets from Wally's then. Other option is to just keep picking up travel shampoo bottles along the way. That or get Lush bar for everything. So many options... haha

    And yeah I haven't had the best experiences with ziplocks myself. But one of them plus a rain cover should be sufficient if I can't squeeze it all into the dry sac. 3 ounces for the security of dry books and pack/contents is probably worth it to me. Thanks for the tips!
     
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  34. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Thanks Robo! I am okay with 21lbs, but certainly could afford to shed a little weight (couldn't we all? haha) Just after last night's posts, I have already removed 14oz. So I am off to a great start! But thanks for the support and feedback! Time will tell, but given my desire for this Camino, I have a feeling I will reach addict levels soon enough :D

    I'm pretty sure I will swap for my bro's liner once he departs after the first week, so that should cut down a significant amount of weight.

    I have been experimenting with my Dr. B's soap bar for several weeks now. I think I could easily shave 1/3 if not half of it off and be fine for the trip.

    Not sure if a coke can will support my weight with me rolling around on top of it, but I'll give it a whirl before a leave. Another suggested a tennis ball which I believe weighs half of what a lacrosse ball does. It just happened to be what I had one lying around.

    My bro has the guidebook at the moment since he is going cold turkey at the last minute to join me, but I will probably dissect the heck out of it to save weight, or just print off a few of the documents I have seen on here and maybe laminate them. I like the idea of having a little info with me as I pass through towns, but 11oz is a bit much, I do admit.

    And alas, I do desperately want to take the phone for the convenience it could carry (Guidebook, Bible, journal, camera, music). But my previous job led to a bit of an addiction with it, and so I want to remove that distraction for the time being. I love photography so not having a camera (even on the phone) is a big sacrifice for me. Hence the paper journal that I can at least do some sketches and entries in. Now if only I could find a magic pen that could dictate for me hands-free as I walk.... :p

    Thanks for the advice! :)
     
  35. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Thanks Tia! This was the conundrum I was facing and why I initially wanted to post the gear list (also because I am a glutton for punishment :p), as my biggest concern is how to layer properly in the shoulder months with the gear I currently have versus the recommendations of others. For me, there is a fine line between too light and too heavy, but I'd rather err on the side of caution and not get caught out ill-equipped for a cold, rainy morning. With the distances between towns, I figure I will survive most outcomes; just wanted to be prepared if I could help it. The advice given here thus far has been great!

    And I will probably just pick up an individual packet of most meds, as I don't plan on get bad indigestion every night of the week hahah Only one would be maybe a 10-15 packet of allergy meds as I am already having to take it daily and the stuff I currently have seems to be working this season. I will definitely bring the label though so that can try to match it. I just don't know how comparable Spain's autumn/allergies compare to what I am already dealing with and if the allergies will stretch that far into late October.

    Thanks for the tips! :)
     
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  36. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Hi Double D! I am definitely a glutton for punishment (perhaps my reason for my interest in the Camino altogether haha). But like I said, I had been lurking for some time and reading other's lists as there certainly is plenty to learn. Less than 24 hours after posting my list, I have already shaved 13 ounces with plenty of potential for more. Face your fears! Catharsis is great! :)

    And I have seen the "massage balls" at the store, as well has the hockey balls. Definitely lighter options, as was the tennis ball recommendation. At least with a tennis ball, I could borrow someone's walking stick and play a pickup game of baseball; street hockey might be tough unless everyone's got a stick with 'em! :p But rolling "something" under the feet has been most welcome during my training. This is definitely a "luxury item" for sure!

    As you make your final preps, best of luck and Buen Camino!
     
  37. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Thanks again, CaminoDebrita! Your story is exactly what I had been contemplating as a possible worst-case scenario. I prefer to err on the side of caution, hence maybe having a bit too much gear. But you and the others have helped me be a little more conscious of what to look out for and some possible gear recommendations (I'll have to check out ebay today and see what's up!). Much to be thankful for! :)
     
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  38. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Yeah I do suppose that is a possibility with the rain jacket. Over time, with wear and tear, water will get through the jacket. Maybe I just haven't put mine through the proper paces yet. I guess the other thing to consider is applying some more DWR. Might consider treating it before I leave, as a precaution.

    As for the poncho, that is probably one of the bigger concerns, the affect wind plays with them. I could always makeshift a belt/strap with my clothesline, but it doesn't seem like the effort is worth it versus just zipping up a jacket. I would love the Arcteryx shell but it is one of those brands that is always way above my price range; I am sure it is worth the extra cost if I could afford it though! Same with the pack; it was one thing I was willing to concede on and find a worthwhile replacement. My pack is several years old but it has served me plenty well on hikes and various trips and is comfortable enough that I couldn't be swayed to pull the trigger on something new. Although this will be its greatest test, so time will tell. I will run to REI and try out some pants asap tho. I have no experience with them, so I am certainly open to your advice one them. Thanks! :)

    One thing not mentioned thus far though is that I am heavily considering picking up another pair of Darn Toughs. I have yet to have a single issue with them, I love my pairs I own. But with feet being my biggest priority (totally agree with ya there! my Scoutmaster taught us the same thing), a third pair might be wise, especially if I don't get rain pants and water soaks through the legs. If one pair isn't fully dry and after a rain soaked day the other is in the same boat, having that third pair would be a God-send. I can easily stretch wearing a pair an extra day or two and putting up with the mild smell they let off (taking into consideration the noses of those around me, of course :p), but if one is washed and not dry the night before and the following morning you go out in the rain, a third pair would be most welcome. Without knowing ahead of time which albergues I will be staying at and if they have a dryer to make sure wet clothes are good to go the following day, cold, wet feet might be the thing I'd look forward to the least.

    Last thought for this novel of a post/discussion :p (which has been great, by the way. Thank you.). I would certainly not rely on it as that would be ridiculous, but how likely is it that I would happen to find trekking poles in a "drop box" during the early stages? I know that as my body adjusts, those first few days are when I would want them the most, but I have read here and elsewhere that many of the stages those poles become unnecessary weight. With my lower back pain tendencies, I would probably disagree with that point and use the poles regardless, but if I could hang in there for a few days before finding a pair, my wallet would always appreciate it.

    Thanks for the help!:)
     
  39. kirkie

    kirkie Active Member Donating Member

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    Frances(2006) portugues(2013)San Salvador (2017)
    Hi. You have lots of comments already, so I will limit my contribution. In recent years I NEVER go out without factor 50 sunscreen. Walking poles: for me, indispensable. Some people find them along the way. If you need to find them, they will make themselves visible to you! Buen Camino.
     
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  40. Priscilla NC

    Priscilla NC Active Member

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    +1 for the Darn Tough socks! They are awesome. They aren't the fastest to dry, so 3 pairs might be good.

    About meds (I don't have prescriptions, this suggestion is for OTC stuff only): I use ziplock snack bags for things like immodium and ibuprofen and other OTC things like allergy pills that one can easily differentiate by sight.

    For instance, I might take 3 individual blister packs of immodium (and I've rarely had to use even 1), a few ibuprofen, and a couple of OTC allergy pills -- all in 1 ziplock snack bag, since I can easily see which is which. This weighs next to nothing, and leaves the weightier packaging behind. You can always get more of these.

    Same for other first aid items. I rarely take anything in its original packaging.

    Oh, and I understand that it's not easy to find travel size of anything in Spain (others correct me if I'm wrong?).

    And: I hesitate to broach this subject: might you consider getting a haircut? Many of us do, and trust me, it does grow back. It's so much easier on the Camino! (ducking and running).

    But I do say, in a heartfelt way, Buen Camino!
     
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  41. cher99840

    cher99840 Veteran Member Donating Member

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    Location:
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    Camino(s) past & future:
    2013, 2017 Camino Frances SJPP-Santiago
    2015 St. Olav's Way Oslo-Trondheim
    2017 VdlP Seville-Merida
    Run @Priscilla NC Run. :)
    I wish I had a euro for every time someone suggested how much easier it would be for me to take care of my hair on the Camino if I would just cut it. Here is how I handled mine. It might work for others and it might not. First, I did NOT even think about washing it every day. If you think wool socks take a long time to dry, think how long it takes hip length hair to dry. I wore a long braid to keep it out of my back pack straps (and my face). I always wore a wide brim hat and on cool mornings a fleece beanie hat under the wide brim. When I took a shower at the end of the day I wore a light weight shower cap. After the shower I combed it out and put it in a very loose braid for the night. The next morning, braid and hat again. If it got TOO dirty and if I had a shot at drying it, I used Dr B even tho it didn't do a lot for me. Braid and hat the next day kept me from caring about that. Here's the kicker. I stayed in a lot of private rooms. Some had little bottles of shampoo and a hair dryer. One little bottle wouldn't do it for me; I needed two. So I saved from the first place so supplied and washed and dried my hair in the next place. I know that last part about the private rooms isn't in the cards for a budget minded pilgrim, but the getting past clean fluffy hair on a daily basis and settling for "Camino clean" might be.
     
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  42. trecile

    trecile Veteran Member Donating Member

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    Location:
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    Camino(s) past & future:
    Camino Frances August - September(2016)
    July - August (2017) - Camino Frances, Muxia and Finisterre
    I totally agree on the sunscreen. If it's daytime you can get burned, regardless of how cloudy it is. Especially when you are outside for most of the day.
     
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  43. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Camino(s) past & future:
    CF - Sept/Oct/Nov (2017)
    Thanks, Kirkie! I have quite a keen eye for walking sticks in the woods. Maybe why I haven't considered proper trekking poles yet. But I have a feeling sticks will be present sooner rather than later. Cheers! :)
     
  44. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    Camino(s) past & future:
    CF - Sept/Oct/Nov (2017)
    Great advice! Thanks, Priscilla! :) As I have been trying to hand wash my socks lately, I have noticed this too about the Darn Toughs. Looks like I might have to make a last minute purchase...

    And that is something I was thinking about earlier today. Often my allergy meds are trial and error each season as sometimes one works better than others. But I will have to keep a keen eye on what I end up with so that I don't mix stuff up. Great points! I have seen 2, 5 and 10 counts at the stores here. So while I am sure a few imodium pills and a small pouch of antacids should do me fine for the trip (I only get the reflux when I don't pay attention to what I am consuming, but mindfulness is the best remedy), a 15 count for allergies might be a tad excessive but the best compromise overall to save me the hassle of purchasing several packs and discarding the rest due to the weight concern. 15 pills didn't even register on my scale, so if i find something working here, i will probably just throw them in my bag. Thanks for the tips! :)

    And I am certainly not offended by the hair question. To me, it's just hair; I actually have no real reason to keep it OR cut it. My love/hate relationship with my hair confuses me too, hence the constant debate in my head (or should I say, on top of my head...). Maybe I'll find a nice barber shop along the way, but for the moment I am bit too fond of it ;)
     
  45. STLperegrino

    STLperegrino New Member

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    CF - Sept/Oct/Nov (2017)
    Cher, that is some AMAZING hair you have growing there! :) I don't think I could let me hair get that long, but still pretty awesome! That would be too much maintenance for me personally, but I respect your dedication. As long as the hair is manageable and "clean enough", after I put it up with a band in the morning, I can live with it. But with all my other conditions, I think my hair is the least of my concerns. I do have a few rest days in the big cities planned and will probably find a decent hotel where I can give my hair the proper attention, but otherwise I'll find a way to make it work. Good tips if do decide to let get that far though :)
     
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  46. Tia Valeria

    Tia Valeria Veteran Member Donating Member

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    Location:
    UK
    Camino(s) past & future:
    Pt Norte/Pmtvo 2010
    C. Inglés 2011
    C. Primitivo '12
    Norte-C. de la Reina '13
    C. do Mar-C. Inglés '15
    Sunscreen is the one thing I have always carried (travel size) and never used! We walk in May/early June which is comparable to late September.
    I walk in long sleeved shirts and zip-off trousers with the legs 'on' to keep the sun off. A Tilly hat protects my face, neck and ears, with my shirt collar turned up occasionally if needed.

    I too have a narrow line between comfortable and overweight pack. The margin for me is about 100-150gms (4-6oz). :)
     
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  47. Bungkus

    Bungkus New Member

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    Location:
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    Camino(s) past & future:
    Tours Route; Camino Frances; Santiago to Muxia (2014)
    Camino Portugués (2017)
    I'd ditch the shampoo, conditioner and hand sanitiser -- the Dr Boners soap will be adequate and you can also use it to wash your clothes. Consider cutting it in half and carrying both halves, that way it lasts longer and doesn't just wash down the sink. Ibuprofen is really cheap in Spain too. Keep the headlamp -- very useful for reading in bed and walking early mornings as the days get shorter.
     
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  48. Patzerdog

    Patzerdog New Member

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    Emma "Grandma" Gatewood made it 2050 miles, the entire Appalachian trail, in her sixties. She carried everything in a sack slung over her shoulder and walked in Keds. She was the first woman to through hike that trail. She used a shower curtain for a tent.
     
  49. NorthernLight

    NorthernLight Member

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    Camino(s) past & future:
    Le Puy to Santiago via the Frances 2012-2013. EPW2015.
    Caminos Aragonese & Frances 2016.
    Saints Peter, Paul, James, Mark, and Thomas; and Jerusalem.
    If your autumn allergies are ragweed, which inflicts its pollen from about mid August to just after the first killing frost, you will be delighted to know that the Camino Frances is generally free of ragweed. I always carry a multiple day supply of the antihistamine of my choice, because I am prone to react to mold and some pollens and don't want to have to find a pharmacy when I need supplies for that.

    I'm graduating to a Lush shampoo & conditioner bar. I have a second (cut in half) bar of detergent.

    A tennis ball is in my bag, picked up on the Aragonese last year, and I refuse to go without it now - it is magic at the end of a long day.

    I bring both the rain jacket and pants as well as the poncho. The jacket and pants are useful for warmth in the evening, and for wearing when all of the clothes are in the occasional washing machine. I like a poncho as it keeps the rain from running down between the backpack and my back, soaking the harness.

    There are heaps of places along the Frances where you can buy more clothing should you need something.
     
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  50. Duayne Meyer

    Duayne Meyer New Member Donating Member

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    Location:
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    Camino(s) past & future:
    Frances, April, 2016
    Frances, April/May, 2017
    Ingles, April/May 2018
    I think you will find trekking poles in a drop box, but most likely not in SJPP; very probably in SDC :). It's worth asking along the way. I never found my poles a hassle, weight-wise or for any other reason. I was sure glad to have them coming down from El Perdon and at a great deal many other times and places. HOWEVER, I think you'll see a lot of people without them, so there are many who manage without poles.

    Rainpants... I have seen them for under fifty dollars in a number of places, including REI.

    As for socks... a 3rd pair of Darn Tough is a darned good idea in my opinion.

    STL, Here is my unsolicited advice: Enjoy the journey. Mind your feet and soul. Be attentive, Stay open, be kind and listen to the Camino. It is remarkably gracious and giving.
     
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  51. Marbe2

    Marbe2 Active member

    Joined:
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    Camino(s) past & future:
    2015 SJPD to Burgos
    2017 Leon to Santiago
    Pamplona to Santiago de Compostela planned for March 2018
    We walked last year in March and April! I wore a Merrill waterproof jacket and will bring it again this year from last week in February to first week in April on CF. The ponchos may be lighter, but my jacket with hood kept me dry in torrential rain and wind. I used it as an outer layer when crossing Cruz de Ferro and up to Ocebriero in blizzards! Was the right choice for me! Kept me warm, dry and protected!
    My total weight with bag of carried items will be at 6 lbs. only one pair of pants & two pair of Patagonia base layer pants (one to sleep in or wear if others are being washed) base layer pants weigh 4 oz each. No rain pants. 1 long sleeve silk shirt and three LS capeline lite tops. All four shirts weigh abt 1 lb., 3 sock liners, 1 merino wool socks, a lite fleece full zipper jacket, a balaclava, a lite hat, sun glasses and see through lite builders eye glass protectors. They are great when walking at night or inclement weather to keep the bugs out of my eyes, or to keep torrential rain off my eye glasses without fogging upglasses. I bring Very few toiletries...half of a tiny hotel complementary bar of soap, an emory board, a couple of safety pins, 3 oz of hydrogen peroxide, maybe a foot of silver tape, a couple of bandaids, 2 oz of vasoline(footcare)and limited prescription meds as well as a few of the over the counter pills. If I need to cut nails again, I buy a clipper, use it, and donate it! I bring a travel sized tooth paste, small tooth brush, and strong dental floss which I use for hanging clothes when needed. No water bottle. I buy bottles of water, refill a few times and then purchase new ones. I carry them in my pockets and can get at them easily. We buy lemons in the stores and cut up one each day, and/or order lemon with tea! They are great source of vitamin C, a terrific hand sanitizer, helps your PHh balance for those with reflux, and helps keep things flowing!
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2017 at 1:51 AM
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