Hydration..?

[KFor7007]

Hello all
I start my journey from my home in the UK towards SJPDP on Monday morning, and at this late stage I still have an unresolved question about kit that I'd like to ask for your expert advice about.

It's about carrying water. I've always got on well with my Platypus/Camelback type hydration system when I've been on long walks before. I really like the convenience of taking a sip without breaking stride and the system is light and flexible.

Then I read in one of the Camino guides that the author thinks that most stomach upsets experienced by walkers are due to the bugs that develop in these systems over the 5 weeks or so on the Camino. The tubes can be a real breeding ground for germs because they're not easy to clean out while on the Way, etc etc..

So most of my preparation walking has been with using water bottles. Perfectly ok, but not as convenient.

And now, as I'm making my final packing preparations, I'm thinking again about my hydration system and possibly taking sterilising tablets along too.

Any advice? Thoughts?

Thanks

Keith

 

[Tincatinker]

The contamination of platypus systems is usually attributable to detritus build up around the nipple from unwashed hands and the aggregation of skin cells, fat cells and mucous from the lips. And the risk that the nipple can be further contaminated from contact with the ground when the pack is removed. Nipple hygiene and a monthly flush of the entire system with Milton Fluid or similar should avoid any problems.

I don't use platypus type systems because it is inconvenient and sometimes downright difficult to refill them from the fuentes.

 

[nidarosa]

This is exactly why I chose a pack with dual entry side pockets so I can reach and replace my water bottles myself without stopping. I just buy one or two bottles of water, top up when I can and buy new ones if they start smelling or cracking. I have heard many stories of bacterial upsets because of hydration bladders. If you really want to take it, take the tabs too.

Buen Camino!

 

[tyrrek]

Hi from one Keith to another

I've always used a Camelbak-style water bag with no problems. I sterilise it before I go but just rinse it as I go. For a long Camino it probably would be wise to do it more frequently.

I'm pretty sure I drink more than average and also just like to wet my mouth regularly, so I can't imagine reaching round for bottles all the time. The only alternative that might work would be a double bottle holster if it didn't interfere with my pack.

It's just one of those personal preference things, I guess.

Buen camino!

 

[KFor7007]

Many thanks for these incredibly fast responses! The refilling question is one that hadn't occurred to me - I might go back to Plan B, ie two bottles in side pockets either side of my pack.

Keith

 

[Magwood]

I hated using a bladder and the inconvenience of refilling and not knowing how much has been consumed.

I use two 750 ml bottles, one carried in an insulated holder on my waist pack belt with a suction tube so it was very convenient to drink and to refill, and I had a top up bottle in my side pocket. This system worked well for most of the time, but when I wore my rainjacket I had to remove the bottle from my waist and keep it in a side pocket from where I could still reach the tube. See my full assessment of the product here

I will try a shoulder strap system next time I walk - I think this will work well for me.

 

[naplesdon]

My hydration plan is very simple. I carry a 0.50L bottle in my pocket all day long getting refills along the way at cafes and the safe fonts. On the days I know there are no water resources I carry a full 1.5L bottle in the top of my backpack to refill my smaller bottle, the rest of the time the larger bottle is carried empty. I replace the smaller bottle often enough to protect me from bacteria because I am forever walking away from cafes and restaurants inadvertently leaving it on the table.
So HaHa, drink wine not water, many of my good Camino friends will appreciate that advice.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

If you are inconvenienced by the extra 30 seconds in filling a bladder, cold showers will really throw you for a loop! Relax. Take the bladder. Hygiene is in your head with normal rinsing procedures. Hydrating without breaking stride is worth it. And you won't be spinning like a dog lying down trying to reach a bottle .

 

[dougfitz]

I use a bladder on all my walks, but after running out of water on the CF in 2010, I now carry a 750ml bottle in the top of my pack as well. It can be decanted into the bladder. While I didn't treat water on the Camino, I have elsewhere where I have collected water between towns. To do that, I refill the bottle and put a puritab into it, leave it for 30 minutes, and then repeat this process until I get to the next source of treated water.

If you take a bladder, clean it. It is, after all, much the same as any other food handling equipment, and you wouldn't leave that for days on end without washing it. I find washing the bladder and flushing the tube and mouthpiece with warm soapy water, followed by a rinse, is sufficient. I have also used the tablets sold by Camelback (expensive) or denture tablets (less expensive, but sold in larger quantities - not so much of an issue for me because I carry them anyway). And if you do choose to take bottles, they need cleaning from time to time too.

 

[KFor7007]

Thanks again. I'm going for the bladder/back-up bottle combination now.
Was very concerned to hear that there may be cold showers at times, though

Keith

 

[chilledKat]

My hydration plan is very simple.... drink wine not water, many of my good Camino friends will appreciate that advice.

All hail Don. Best Camino advice...I was cheeky Don and omitted a few of your sentences to make your plan more viable
Hippocrates used wine as an antiseptic, diuretic and sedative so if it was good enough for him it will be good enough for you, plus you have all bases covered then

 

[gidivet]

I just can't reach a water bottle on the side of my pack, and also like to take small sips of water through the day, so the hydration pack is indispensable. I do carry a small spare bottle as backup.
I did the Camino Frances with a Source Widepac, which is very easy to fill. I didn't need to take the pack out of the backpack hydration sleeve very often, apart from when cleaning it. I just unpacked my pack, went to a tap and half lifted the hydration bladder out to fill. I usually carried 1 to 1.5 litre of water so almost never needed to fill it up during the day.
I didn't have any problems with contamination (that I know of). Apart from just sensible hygiene I was somewhat reassured by the manufacturer's claim of anti-bacterial technology.

http://www.source-hydration.co.uk/

 

[Mark Lee]

Bought two bottles (1/2 liter size) of water in SJPDP. Carried them in the bottom side mesh pockets (left and right) on my pack and would drink and refill both at every water point, cafe etc. Kill two, fill two. Those same two bottles lasted the whole Camino and were unceremoniously dumped in a bin at Santiago.

 

[Arn]

This is of course a personal issue and one bottle/camelback does not fit all.
I have found that the easier it is to get water...the more I drink. Not because my body needs it, but because it's there.
If you misjudge and sip along thinking "safe" water is available just up the Way...you may be wrong and. out of water.
I carry two bottles, one a used soda bottle (20oz/592ml)and the other a Katadyn My Water Bottle:
http://www.rei.com/product/799021/katadyn-mybottle-water-purifier
Thus, no matter the water source I can purify it and drink it. Another reason for this system, we have found while hiking in the desert for long periods of time, drinking TOO much water is actually a bad thing. As you drink, the water passes through your system and leaches away the electrolytes your muscles need to function under stress; thus causing severe cramping. To counter this, it's recommended that any water you carry have a split of 50% water and 50% sport drink. Even Tang, Gatorade,etc will work.
I'm not saying any one system is best, I'm just pointing out what I use and why.

Buen "I don't drink water...fish pee in it" Camino
Arn

 

[Kanga]

Whichever system you go with I am sure will be fine - this is not an issue that will make or break your Camino. So don't agonise too much - as they say "don't sweat the small stuff". I am sure the water bladder will be fine if you occasionally sterilise it.

I abandoned mine because (a) the mouthpiece seemed to always finish up on the floor when I took my pack off and related to that (b) the tube often got itself squeezed by the pack resting on it and leaked water and (c) it was a pain to take out of the pack and fill. I now use two water bottles that are always accessible inside my front pockets - one of the advantages of the Aarn pack.

 

[KFor7007]

Before I set off in the morning, can I just give a 'thank you' to all the good advice, positive thoughts and good wishes which have come from the contributors to this Forum. I'm looking forward - with only the slightest tredipation - to one of the great adventures of my life. Perhaps we'll meet one day.

Thanks again

Keith

 

[David]

This is where I take my stand! - I really don't like those water bladders, not at all, preferring two bottles.

Regardless of the hygiene issues, drinking from a tube as you walk is completely unnatural, no other animal does this .. it has a futuristic Star Wars, Trekky feel to it to me and - drinking from a tube - really! ... when do you stop to look at the view?

If you have a couple of bottles and you want a drink you stop. Put the pack down, stretch, look at the view, look back to where you came from ... it tempts you to sit down, take your boots and socks off and wriggle your toes ... it is pleasant, unhasty, marvellous. Also, with a bottle you can pour water over your head! You can give water to another pilgrim, to a dog or cat - you can water flowers that look thirsty .... therefore a bladder is another way of being isolated, don't you think?

What IS this haste that means drinking from a tube on the go? Crikey, pilgrims, take it easy, learn to slow down, enjoy moments - take a couple of bottles!!!

Buen Camino

 

[William Garza]

This is where I take my stand! - I really don't like those water bladders, not at all, preferring two bottles.

Regardless of the hygiene issues, drinking from a tube as you walk is completely unnatural, no other animal does this .. it has a futuristic Star Wars, Trekky feel to it to me and - drinking from a tube - really! ... when do you stop to look at the view?

If you have a couple of bottles and you want a drink you stop. Put the pack down, stretch, look at the view, look back to where you came from ... it tempts you to sit down, take your boots and socks off and wriggle your toes ... it is pleasant, unhasty, marvellous. Also, with a bottle you can pour water over your head! You can give water to another pilgrim, to a dog or cat - you can water flowers that look thirsty .... therefore a bladder is another way of being isolated, don't you think?

What IS this haste that means drinking from a tube on the go? Crikey, pilgrims, take it easy, learn to slow down, enjoy moments - take a couple of bottles!!!

Buen Camino

I having a crisis moment. reverse deja view of my self in a future setting...
"You can give water to another pilgrim, to a dog or cat - you can water flowers that look thirsty" e gads! shades of wonders to be!
I dont know about bladders isolating me, as on occasion, i plan to wander off the trail, and see whats off over beyond that fetching hill, or down in that empty pasture, or up on the other vista, and i may get thirsty as i go, and i may want to drink a lot of water as i am wont to do.. hence a bladder
maybe a bladder as back up to a easy access bottle?
the choices weigh on me..

i love the imagery you gave, and on a serious side, it is food for thought!

 

[AJ]

I agree with David. I once tried a bladder but the lid cracked. I carry two 750ml bottles one in each pocet and two 500ml bottles inside my pack. This is overkill on the CF. I once ran out of water. Don't want to do it again.

 

[naplesdon]

Love you Kat, AJ and David. Just keep it simple as I always say! The next thing the outfitters will be selling us is re-hydration kits. Because I had 1.5 litre bottle with me I was able to share water with Okie and his wife at the top of the climb to Roncesvalles when they were out of water. That's what the Camino is about.

 

[jimtim]

i am prepared to be falsely accused of being a Luddite but one of the questions i ask myself when i consider what products to use is, 'For how long have we been living very well without it?' how long have we be walking the camino without apps listing every albergue, every 200m rise and fall in the terrain, every bend in the road and shift in the weather? how long? and what's wrong with breaking one's stride to take a drink? i know, i know... LUDDITE! haha one thing i learned (from speaking with someone and not from an app) is a technique they use in the army - hydrate well the night before, drink well before you go to bed and you start the day ahead of the game. your vital organs need to be hydrated. if they don't have the water they need they pull from surrounding tissue and you're more likely to experience joint pain. and reserve the peepee jokes. a) you're not sleeping in your own bed and will probably get up anyway, b) you're probably a bit underhydrated so drinking before bed will bring you up to par not put you over your limit, and c) you're probably doing more physical activity than you normally do so it's great to flush out the liver and kidneys. the camino frances is not the serengetti or the third world - there is ample opportunity to fill a water bottle. (parts of the via de la plata are a different story!) hydrate before bed. if you choose a camel pack - give it rinse with vinegar every week to sanitize if you're worried. don't drink from streams. dust the inside of your boots with baking soda once a week and you'll never ever stink. and have a wonderful camino experience!!

 

[dougfitz]

Regardless of the hygiene issues, drinking from a tube as you walk is completely unnatural, no other animal does this .. it has a futuristic Star Wars, Trekky feel to it to me and - drinking from a tube - really! ... when do you stop to look at the view?

If you have a couple of bottles and you want a drink you stop. Put the pack down, stretch, look at the view, look back to where you came from ... it tempts you to sit down, take your boots and socks off and wriggle your toes ... it is pleasant, unhasty, marvellous. Also, with a bottle you can pour water over your head! You can give water to another pilgrim, to a dog or cat - you can water flowers that look thirsty .... therefore a bladder is another way of being isolated, don't you think?

What IS this haste that means drinking from a tube on the go? Crikey, pilgrims, take it easy, learn to slow down, enjoy moments - take a couple of bottles!!!

@David, this is just so romantic! I take it you don't fly anywhere - another activity that might be seen as completely unnatural? And you still wear worsted wool and carry a canvas pack with a bentwood frame, all leather boots - including leather soles? And you seal up the stomach of some small domestic animal and drink from that? Ooops - you are carrying bottles! Glass, perhaps? Surely not made from that completely unnatural plastic that seems to abound?

I don't think it is particularly powerful argument to reject the advantages that can be afforded by modern materials and designs because they are somehow unnatural. I think most people would see that.

I agree that its important to take regular breaks - most hikers will know that it is always worthwhile taking five minutes or so for every hour's walking to get the weight off one's feét. One doesn't need to be using bottles to do that - it is just as easy with a bladder. More importantly, easy access to water is one of the keys to staying well hydrated. That is just so much more difficult if one's water is in bottles stored in or at the sides of one's pack.

 

[David]

No, I don't fly, not since 1966 - anyone who has read the smallest amount of information about global pollution would choose not to fly - though I realise that pilgrims from the far ends of the world have no choice - for me it is embarrassingly simple, a short ferry and I am on mainland Europe.

Also for me it is not about rejecting modern inventions. I am not a luddite, I do not hanker for a medieval past, I use every new gadget that is useful.

So - as to bladders versus bottles and drinking water in general - all reliable, trained, professional, people in this field will tell you that drinking when thirsty is too late. The whole thing is to hydrate before; not during, nor after - this is the key, the secret, hydrate before. (I don't mean don't drink on the way, we all drink on the way, I mean they say ensure you are well hydrated before ).

My point is that bottles force (enable?) one to stop - to stop that relentless moving forward to the next cafe/milestone/refugio/ - for me it is like this: the Camino is a time out - possibly, probably, the first time in one's adult life that one steps out of all the lies, the false viewpoints, the indoctrination - the lifetime of being enculturated into moving fast, into working not lazing, into fearing the future and working hard to stop a possible bad future coming; it isn't named the treadmill for nothing! - the Camino is a different place - it is not the real world, or rather, it IS the real world ... it is the place, the reality, where one has the opportunity to become what we really are, relaxed, kind, generous, spontaneous humans. Humans who go through personal pain, stress, fatigue ... but, by going through these things one becomes - well - free, connected, light ... the old world drops away (as long as iphones, music in headphones, constant mobile phone use, logging in at wi-fi machines is also rejected) .... this is YOUR TIME - it is outside the mediocre world - it is your time ..... so, I say (my personal opinion) forget the bladder camel-back system (camel-back - explains it all, don't you think?) ...

I say, go with two bottles. Just the cheap plastic bottles you buy in the supermarket that you can re-fill wherever you are, and walk out there (you can get 750ml ones!).
Forget the fear of not having a bed to sleep in, forget the fear of not walking enough miles each day - forget the fear, dismiss the fear, banish the fear - be there, in that moment, each moment ... so, bottles ... sure, it is almost impossible to slide one out when you are wearing your pack - so you are forced to stop ... we all know that each day you walk, unless you are really aware, you fall into projecting the day ahead; how many miles, which stop where, where will you get a coffee, where will you sleep and so on - and it is a rotten state of mind to get into - I say; walk as if there is not tomorrow, no booked flight, no fear of being bed-less - and that is a major part of me saying use bottles.

You get thirsty - you reach for a bottle and cannot quite grab it - so you stop, take the pack off - shrug, stretch, yawn, grin, shout "Hello world!" and then pull that bottle and take a big slug of that wonderful water. You smile at passing pilgrims - occasionally, maybe only once, a pilgrim will ask you for water because they have none - and then, at that moment, you are one of the saints, one of the humans, one of the Camino tribe - you give water to another in need .. you tell me! what could possibly be better than that?

I am accused of being romantic. Am I? - I prefer to think of myself as being human, or rather, an eternal undying unborn spirit, just like you, on a human journey - you tell me, what is better than giving a pilgrim, a dog, a cat, a flower, water ????

You tell me how striding along without stopping, not even to smell the flowers or see where you are at that moment, sucking on your tube, is better than being a relaxed, open, warm, friendly, caring, smiling, pilgrim, willing to share what they have, and whilst they wait to share what they have just revelling in the moment, that place they have stopped at, where they can see how far they have walked, and how far they may walk, that being in the absolute centre of it all - that Camino Experience?

Water isn't just water - it is a life gift, a gift of life ..... don't you think? Or am I just being romantic here?

This is my personal opinion, it is how I see it - what you do, well, it is your choice - no attacks on me are necessary ....
Buen Camino!

 

[William Garza]

I have known thirst
real, absolute and life threatening thirst
a few times.
some, i was duty bound to ignore it, the job comes first, last and always. 115-120 degree day with many miles and a broken truck, bad information and a timetable.
others,
on duty, didn't know i was 'falling out" until a supervisor pulled me down off my tanker, i ceased to understand language, i had overheated my core encased in uniform,nomex,rubber rain suit, full PPE...
super had called the ems and told me i had drank a gallon of water before i came back to reality, and drank another as we sat for a while , he for all his wisdom had been in the service and recognized heat related issues
I have lost 16 lbs before doing my job down in the unit

So as for me, i carry as much as i think the day will need, and then carry some more, in case there is someone in need
as i was privileged to do on some lonesome interstate
i gave the dad water
he passed it on to his son
and would not drink until his son was sated
humbling to say the least
two plus gallons between them
all my reserve
and my Soul was filled.

Its not just water i think, that we carry
it is not just water that we give

there is hope
what diamonds do they see in the suns reflections as the cup of kindness is offered
what deep and abiding joy....

On the Road
i am my brothers keeper

Bottles, cans. plastic, rubber tube or grateful lips to the edge of a glass, in some far away Gite,Albergue or with a fellow on some sun setted trail
its all the same
its the best of being Human
Peace

 

[JoeNYC]

I think this is a rather silly topic to have strong feelings about. You can carry water in a bladder or you can carry water in plastic bottles.

The important thing is to hydrate before you begin walking and carry enough water for your needs-- taking into account the availability of fill-ups along the route.

Simple.

 

[JennyH94]

Hi everyone -

I like the bottle option, for the reasons so well set out above, and it's what works well for me too.

Consider this: where have you bought your bladder? More times than not, as it's something you used in your training and that you'll keep for a long time, you probably bought your bladder in your home country, and very likely from one of the major outdoors equipment and apparel chains. Yes, it's good to support those businesses who probably employ local people. So you're supporting local people and helping them to keep their jobs. That's a good thing.

However, we all know everyone's doing it hard in Spain - small business particularly. Think of all the small shops on the Camino who benefit in part from all the pilgrims passing through. We pilgrims rely on these small shops - and they, too, I would say, to reasonably large extent, rely on us for our custom. Bottled water is so inexpensive in Spain - it's so easy to replace the bottles when they get a bit manky after a while - and you help support small business when you buy a couple of new bottles. That's another good thing.

Yet another good thing - when you go into a small shop wherever you are on the Camino to buy those bottles of water that you need, you won't just be walking out with the bottles of water - you will have had the connection with a shop owner that you might not have had otherwise, had you not needed those bottles of water - an opportunity to ask how they're doing, how's business, etc etc. I have found in small shops on the Camino, unexpected connections and kindnesses happen (the gift of the most delicious peaches I have EVER tasted is just one example). I'm sure I'm not the only one - I'm sure many Forum members will have had the same experiences. That's a really good thing.

Cheers - Jenny

 

[naplesdon]

Jenny, so well stated.
Like I said in an earlier post about sharing my 1.5L bottle with some fellow pilgrims at the top of the climb over to Roncesvalles. My friends were out of water close to the top the hill and it was a hot, windy day with at least 8 km left to walk. Their photo is attached.
How would one do that act of kindness with a bladder?
It reminds me of the totally self absorbed walker with ear bugs listening to music, missing out of the sounds of nature around them, much less hearing the random biker who might actually have bell to ring a warning !
Maybe a moderator coulda ,shoulda shut down this thread, SVP.

 

[JennyH94]

Jenny, so well stated.
Like I said in an earlier post about sharing my 1.5L bottle with some fellow pilgrims at the top of the climb over to Roncesvalles. My friends were out of water close to the top the hill and it was a hot, windy day with at least 8 km left to walk. Their photo is attached.
How would one do that act of kindness with a bladder?
It reminds me of the totally self absorbed walker with ear bugs listening to music, missing out of the sounds of nature around them, much less hearing the random biker who might actually have bell to ring a warning !
Maybe a moderator coulda ,shoulda shut down this thread, SVP.View attachment 13418

Cheers Don. Great pic of your friends - BTW - I was intrigued though by the painting behind them ... those faces!

 

[chilledKat]

All good points but.......did anyone stop to consider that no one cares what vessel one drinks wine out of??

Jam jar, vegemite jar, plastic bottle, bladder.....drink wine and be merry I say.

Any takers?

 

[JennyH94]

All good points but.......did anyone stop to consider that no one cares what vessel one drinks wine out of??

Jam jar, vegemite jar, plastic bottle, bladder.....drink wine and be merry I say.

Any takers?

Just as long the wine itself comes out of a Spanish bottle, Kat! IT'S THE BEST !!!

 

[saltwaterpearl]

While I don't take it personally, because, well, this is just a message board of strangers, so why would I take it personally..... however.....
I admit I'm feeling a little insulted (maybe just mildly irritated) by the judge-y-ness (yes, that is a word) of some of the recent postings.

I use a water bladder/tube. I stay better hydrated and less thirsty by taking regular small sips as I walk, rather than downing a whole bottle when I stop for a break. A water bladder/tube system is also the lightest weight reusable hydration solution. I've had mine for years, and know how to keep it clean and hygienic.

While disposable water bottles can be reused for awhile, let's face it, many are pretty flimsy, and the vast majority of people chuck them after a short time and buy new ones, rather than clean them and reuse them indefinitely. Very, very wasteful and polluting. Please google "great pacific garbage patch".

I can and do support Spanish businesses by purchasing food, drugstore items, etc. What on earth does buying disposable water bottles specifically have to do with supporting local people or having meaningful interactions with shopkeepers?

I also, despite my tube-sucking ways, walk slowly, take lots of breaks, remove my pack often, enjoy many views, put my feet up or soak them regularly, and otherwise "stop and smell the flowers", both figuratively and literally. I also share my food and wine and first aid and company and conversation with fellow pilgrims.

It is a weird and baffling implication to make that hydration tube users are somehow selfish and/or cartoonishly oblivious to the wonders of the Camino.

 

[Arn]

Jenny, so well stated.
Like I said in an earlier post about sharing my 1.5L bottle with some fellow pilgrims at the top of the climb over to Roncesvalles. My friends were out of water close to the top the hill and it was a hot, windy day with at least 8 km left to walk. Their photo is attached.
How would one do that act of kindness with a bladder?
It reminds me of the totally self absorbed walker with ear bugs listening to music, missing out of the sounds of nature around them, much less hearing the random biker who might actually have bell to ring a warning !
Maybe a moderator coulda ,shoulda shut down this thread, SVP.View attachment 13418

In all honesty, I (and my fellow Mods)resist shutting any thread/post down. Open, reasoned discussion clears the air better than a duck tapped mouth. That said:
The Dr is IN:
OK bunkie, you got all that out. You've told us how you really feel. Now, that we have all that "cleared up". Count to 10...mindfully breathe deeply through your nose, deep into you stomach area, slowly release. If a stray thought about bottles versus bladders should appear. Gently, but firmly recognize it's there and deliberately return to your deep breathing.
A word of caution: If it's not a stray thought...but really a call FROM your bladder...Please answer!!!
Buen "I'm drinking my Way back to you babe." Camino,
Arn

 

[jimtim]

i am prepared to be falsely accused of being a Luddite but one of the questions i ask myself when i consider what products to use is, 'For how long have we been living very well without it?' how long have we be walking the camino without apps listing every albergue, every 200m rise and fall in the terrain, every bend in the road and shift in the weather? how long? and what's wrong with breaking one's stride to take a drink? i know, i know... LUDDITE! haha one thing i learned (from speaking with someone and not from an app) is a technique they use in the army - hydrate well the night before, drink well before you go to bed and you start the day ahead of the game. your vital organs need to be hydrated. if they don't have the water they need they pull from surrounding tissue and you're more likely to experience joint pain. and reserve the peepee jokes. a) you're not sleeping in your own bed and will probably get up anyway, b) you're probably a bit underhydrated so drinking before bed will bring you up to par not put you over your limit, and c) you're probably doing more physical activity than you normally do so it's great to flush out the liver and kidneys. the camino frances is not the serengetti or the third world - there is ample opportunity to fill a water bottle. (parts of the via de la plata are a different story!) hydrate before bed. if you choose a camel pack - give it rinse with vinegar every week to sanitize if you're worried. don't drink from streams. dust the inside of your boots with baking soda once a week and you'll never ever stink. and have a wonderful camino experience!!

and for the record i love! polypropylene hiking gear that dries within an hour of being washed instead of soggy cotton, love the lightweight materials we now have, sleep sacs instead of sleeping bags, compression sacs, Aleve - o thank you for Aleve!... but then i also prefer the organic feel of a wooden walking stick. in St Michel up on the pinnacle in le Puy there's a quote something to the effect of - the steps a pilgrim takes are like scales of the snake falling away. true on many levels. one level being all the information we start a camino with... after about a week's walking, so much 'falls away' and we see what our needs and habits are and we hone things down into the tools and patterns that fit us best.

 

[Mark Lee]

Just as long the wine itself comes out of a Spanish bottle, Kat! IT'S THE BEST !!!

Especially when the bottle says "Rioja".....
That stuff is damn good.

 

[Anniesantiago]

Do what you're comfortable with.

I carry one 8 ounce bottle and fill up at fountains along the Way.
Joe carries his bladder and loves it.

Just be sure to clean it often, if you take the bladder.

 

[Dennis D]

No, I don't fly, not since 1966 - anyone who has read the smallest amount of information about global pollution would choose not to fly - though I realise that pilgrims from the far ends of the world have no choice - for me it is embarrassingly simple, a short ferry and I am on mainland Europe.

Also for me it is not about rejecting modern inventions. I am not a luddite, I do not hanker for a medieval past, I use every new gadget that is useful.

So - as to bladders versus bottles and drinking water in general - all reliable, trained, professional, people in this field will tell you that drinking when thirsty is too late. The whole thing is to hydrate before; not during, nor after - this is the key, the secret, hydrate before. (I don't mean don't drink on the way, we all drink on the way, I mean they say ensure you are well hydrated before ).

My point is that bottles force (enable?) one to stop - to stop that relentless moving forward to the next cafe/milestone/refugio/ - for me it is like this: the Camino is a time out - possibly, probably, the first time in one's adult life that one steps out of all the lies, the false viewpoints, the indoctrination - the lifetime of being enculturated into moving fast, into working not lazing, into fearing the future and working hard to stop a possible bad future coming; it isn't named the treadmill for nothing! - the Camino is a different place - it is not the real world, or rather, it IS the real world ... it is the place, the reality, where one has the opportunity to become what we really are, relaxed, kind, generous, spontaneous humans. Humans who go through personal pain, stress, fatigue ... but, by going through these things one becomes - well - free, connected, light ... the old world drops away (as long as iphones, music in headphones, constant mobile phone use, logging in at wi-fi machines is also rejected) .... this is YOUR TIME - it is outside the mediocre world - it is your time ..... so, I say (my personal opinion) forget the bladder camel-back system (camel-back - explains it all, don't you think?) ...

I say, go with two bottles. Just the cheap plastic bottles you buy in the supermarket that you can re-fill wherever you are, and walk out there (you can get 750ml ones!).
Forget the fear of not having a bed to sleep in, forget the fear of not walking enough miles each day - forget the fear, dismiss the fear, banish the fear - be there, in that moment, each moment ... so, bottles ... sure, it is almost impossible to slide one out when you are wearing your pack - so you are forced to stop ... we all know that each day you walk, unless you are really aware, you fall into projecting the day ahead; how many miles, which stop where, where will you get a coffee, where will you sleep and so on - and it is a rotten state of mind to get into - I say; walk as if there is not tomorrow, no booked flight, no fear of being bed-less - and that is a major part of me saying use bottles.

You get thirsty - you reach for a bottle and cannot quite grab it - so you stop, take the pack off - shrug, stretch, yawn, grin, shout "Hello world!" and then pull that bottle and take a big slug of that wonderful water. You smile at passing pilgrims - occasionally, maybe only once, a pilgrim will ask you for water because they have none - and then, at that moment, you are one of the saints, one of the humans, one of the Camino tribe - you give water to another in need .. you tell me! what could possibly be better than that?

I am accused of being romantic. Am I? - I prefer to think of myself as being human, or rather, an eternal undying unborn spirit, just like you, on a human journey - you tell me, what is better than giving a pilgrim, a dog, a cat, a flower, water ????

You tell me how striding along without stopping, not even to smell the flowers or see where you are at that moment, sucking on your tube, is better than being a relaxed, open, warm, friendly, caring, smiling, pilgrim, willing to share what they have, and whilst they wait to share what they have just revelling in the moment, that place they have stopped at, where they can see how far they have walked, and how far they may walk, that being in the absolute centre of it all - that Camino Experience?

Water isn't just water - it is a life gift, a gift of life ..... don't you think? Or am I just being romantic here?

This is my personal opinion, it is how I see it - what you do, well, it is your choice - no attacks on me are necessary ....
Buen Camino!

I'm with you all the way David. Happy to share your view of the Camino Experience.

 

[musicagl]

I'm in the wide-mouth platypus camp. Served me very well and I probably drank more often and stayed hydrated because it was so easy to get at it.

 

[t2andreo]

It is time for my two cents worth...

"De arbiter, non potest esse controversia..." (latin)

Concerning matters of taste, there can be no dispute. (direct translation)

To each his own.... (functional translation)

Whatever...! (colloquial translation)

I hope this helps.

 

[Lynda t]

With bottles you can see how much water you have left. Very important.

 

[wayfarer]

I use two half litre plastic water bottles with a tube attachment on one. I found better hydration with the tube as I left it too long between water brakes and became dehydrated a few times, but as t2andreo says each to his own.

 

[pilgrim b]

Well me and peregrino b carry two bottles each and then pour the water down into our bladders which both work perfectly well

 

[JoeNYC]

Well me and peregrino b carry two bottles each and then pour the water down into our bladders which both work perfectly well

Haha. Sounds like you got it ALL covered!

 

[annakappa]

Already the word bladder sort of puts me off, especially if I'm supposed to drink from it Anne

 

[JennyH94]

Well me and peregrino b carry two bottles each and then pour the water down into our bladders which both work perfectly well

'Glad to hear that all's well with the waterworks b and b!

 

[Dennis D]

Well me and peregrino b carry two bottles each and then pour the water down into our bladders which both work perfectly well

Thanks for the smile - it made my day.

 

[JennyH94]

While I don't take it personally, because, well, this is just a message board of strangers, so why would I take it personally..... however.....
I admit I'm feeling a little insulted (maybe just mildly irritated) by the judge-y-ness (yes, that is a word) of some of the recent postings.

I use a water bladder/tube. I stay better hydrated and less thirsty by taking regular small sips as I walk, rather than downing a whole bottle when I stop for a break. A water bladder/tube system is also the lightest weight reusable hydration solution. I've had mine for years, and know how to keep it clean and hygienic.

While disposable water bottles can be reused for awhile, let's face it, many are pretty flimsy, and the vast majority of people chuck them after a short time and buy new ones, rather than clean them and reuse them indefinitely. Very, very wasteful and polluting. Please google "great pacific garbage patch".

I can and do support Spanish businesses by purchasing food, drugstore items, etc. What on earth does buying disposable water bottles specifically have to do with supporting local people or having meaningful interactions with shopkeepers?

I also, despite my tube-sucking ways, walk slowly, take lots of breaks, remove my pack often, enjoy many views, put my feet up or soak them regularly, and otherwise "stop and smell the flowers", both figuratively and literally. I also share my food and wine and first aid and company and conversation with fellow pilgrims.

It is a weird and baffling implication to make that hydration tube users are somehow selfish and/or cartoonishly oblivious to the wonders of the Camino.

Hi saltwaterpearl -

I'm very sorry that my post has caused some irritation here - to you and to others. The thread's been so interesting - right from the opening post - and the purpose of my post was to introduce another line of discussion - only that.

The pros and cons with both bladders and bottles are numerous, and at the end of the day, as t2andreo says 'to each his own' and we will always do what works best for us.

We all recognise that it's a terrific thing to support the small shops on the Camino. Buying the bottled water is one more thing we can do to support those shops financially - every little bit helps. And if you're able to strike up a conversation with the shopkeeper, that's a fantastic thing.

My apologies and with best wishes -

Jenny

 

[David]

Saltwaterpearl, you wrote "While I don't take it personally, because, well, this is just a message board of strangers, so why would I take it personally..... however.....
I admit I'm feeling a little insulted (maybe just mildly irritated) by the judge-y-ness (yes, that is a word) of some of the recent postings."

All is well - it is a forum, an open forum, and we all express our personal opinions, and that is the thing, they are merely personal opinions. Of course, with the limitations of text versus face to face speech there are sometimes problems in transmitting how one is saying something, but think, say, of a group of pilgrims - also strangers - outside a bar on Camino. Drinking and chatting and laughter ... each opinion freely given, some laughed at (nicely), some derided, some agreed with .... it is just the usual mix of being human.

No one really cares how another carries water - why would they? It is just that this is a meeting of pilgrims, all of whom are different - so, we have different opinions - no need to think yourself attacked or judged, no need to be upset - what would you say at that table on the Camino? Well then, just say that and then chink your glass with your verbal 'opponent' and smile - all is well.

Buen Camino

 

[wayfarer]

Well put David, that is exactly how I see it too. Treat every conversation (post) here as if you were talking around a table with new friends.

 

[JennyH94]

Hi David and Wayfarer -
I like, Like, LIKE your posts so very much. Our Forum 'table' is a massive one, and as such, for the people sitting around that table, participating in the discussions on a myriad of different threads, there will always be varying opinions. To think of that table and to think of those new friends each time we post has to be the absolute best thing in the spirit of our Forum.
Thank you to you both -
Cheers - Jenny

 

[chilledKat]

And that's why we need to open a nice Rioja, celebrate diversity of opinions and remember to not take ourselves so seriously.

Maybe channel our passion towards more deserving topics other than directing it at bottles or bladders. I don't think these objects have got so much attention in their lives

Cheers

 

[David]

Hang on! This pilgrim table on the Camino .... if we were all there .... 36,195 members .. say 3 feet space each, one pilgrim facing another across the table, 18,010 (1809.75) pilgrims either side ... we would need a table 18,010 yards long - 10.233 miles!!! (and 36,195 chairs of course) ... and .. at least 36,195 bottles of Rioja!! Now that is what I call a forum!!

mind you, the waiting staff would need small motorcycles .... and as they would be on motorcycles and carrying things - well now! they would need bladders on their backs!!!

Oh! and if you shouted "Buen Camino!" at one end of the table it would take five seconds for the pilgrims at the far end to hear you!!

Buen Camino

 

[chilledKat]

Hang on! This pilgrim table on the Camino .... if we were all there .... 36,195 members .. say 1 metre space each, one pilgrim facing another across the table ... we would need a table 18,0975 metres long! 19,792 yards! 11.2455 miles!!! (and 36,195 chairs of course) ... and .. at least 36,195 bottles of Rioja!! Now that is what I call a forum!!

mind you, the waiting staff would need small motorcycles ....

Hilarious dearest David. But how cool would that be for the worlds longest table on the Camino!?

I will need to speak to Betty White about where she sourced her wine glasses though

 

[Dennis D]

"You get thirsty - you reach for a bottle and cannot quite grab it - so you stop, take the pack off - shrug, stretch, yawn, grin, shout "Hello world!" and then pull that bottle and take a big slug of that wonderful water. You smile at passing pilgrims - occasionally, maybe only once, a pilgrim will ask you for water because they have none - and then, at that moment, you are one of the saints, one of the humans, one of the Camino tribe - you give water to another in need .. you tell me! what could possibly be better than that?" - David


Nothing can be better than that. David, thank you for the gentle reminder. See you at the forum - I'll be the guy holding a bottle of vino tinto and a couple of Betty's wine glasses.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

I'm very sorry that my post has caused some irritation here - to you and to others. The thread's been so interesting - right from the opening post - and the purpose of my post was to introduce another line of discussion - only that.

Besides specific information, the Forum has lots of venting. That may be its best feature, whether it is holding a pity party or urging less litter, Members get stuff off their chests.

If it holds water, I have carried it. With my Aarn pack I even go for small water bottles because they fit nicely in the front pockets, where I can balance the weight. My general bias against water bottles comes from a camino where my partner had water bottles in the side pockets of his pack, where he could not reach them. Every water stop involved ME removing and replacing the bottles. His water breaks became my responsibility. I endured, but I confess to some irritation. I had a Camelbak, so I could sip continuously, a benefit almost completely lost when someone else's water bottles became part of my hydration routine.

From the comments most pilgrims with water bottles are self-reliant. So my comment should be taken only as a caution to those who might unknowingly become a burden to others. Be sure you can reach your water bottles. My objection to pullover ponchos is only to the fact that many of them require the assistance of others to put them on or take them off.

I say all this to try to be informative, not to demand that others do what I do! If I don't want to help you with a water bottle or poncho, I am more than willing to say "no."

 

[Griffin57]

I just became a 'bladder convert' this weekend! I walked to Burgos last year and definitely didn't drink enough, the masseur at Los Arcos advised me to aim for 4 litres of water daily on top of coffees and colas and wine! I thought this a bit excessive but felt much better when I came close to achieving this amount.

Returning to Burgos in 12 days time to complete my journey to Santiago and have invested in a bladder for my Osprey pack that works really well. I can't see myself going back to bottles though may carry a small one as emergency for other pilgrims. I think we should if possible try both methods before setting out? Though if you know you're happy with bottles then a bladder would be a false investment?

I must admit the other bladder is a bit of a worry as I'm returning to the Mesata! Wondering if I really should have invested in the Macabi skirt???
Sarah

 

[Dennis D]

" My general bias against water bottles comes from a camino where my partner had water bottles in the side pockets of his pack, where he could not reach them. Every water stop involved ME removing and replacing the bottles. His water breaks became my responsibility. I endured, but I confess to some irritation. I had a Camelbak, so I could sip continuously, a benefit almost completely lost when someone else's water bottles became part of my hydration routine." Falcon


When I first started walking on the Camino I was a naive peregrino with no clue. I am grateful for those who helped me along the way. Especially during my first few days of walking. After I figured out "what to do" I tried to help other beginners along their way. I made friends with a couple from France and we walked together for a number of days. We enjoyed this bonding experience including helping each other get each others water bottles and putting them back on our packs. I never dreamed that there would be an alternate view. I assumed that the Camino was about the fellowship, sharing and helping each other. For me, that was part of the positive experience.

Next year when I am thirsty, I am going to take Davids advice and stop, remove my pack, drink some water and enjoy the moment. I will be more than happy to help anyone else passing my way.

 

[William Garza]

water thingerwooger for your pack!

 

[AnnieY]

water thingerwooger for your pack!

yuk!

 

[William Garza]

yuk!

Ime a Water reservoir kinda guy..i'm hydration maintenance intensive..

 

[dougfitz]

Next year when I am thirsty, I am going to take Davids advice and stop, remove my pack, drink some water and enjoy the moment. I will be more than happy to help anyone else passing my way.

The bit of David's advice that I do agree with is that it is important to drink BEFORE you are thirsty. As falcon269 suggested, it is easier to do this with a bladder where you can drink without stopping and removing one's pack. My view is that people who have to remove their pack to drink are more likely to delay that until they are noticeably thirsty. Certainly carry water in bottles - that is not the point. Make sure they are accessible.

BTW - this doesn't mean you need to walk continuously. Taking a break is important for other reasons as well.

 

[JennyH94]

Hang on! This pilgrim table on the Camino .... if we were all there .... 36,195 members .. say 3 feet space each, one pilgrim facing another across the table, 18,010 (1809.75) pilgrims either side ... we would need a table 18,010 yards long - 10.233 miles!!! (and 36,195 chairs of course) ... and .. at least 36,195 bottles of Rioja!! Now that is what I call a forum!!

mind you, the waiting staff would need small motorcycles .... and as they would be on motorcycles and carrying things - well now! they would need bladders on their backs!!!

Oh! and if you shouted "Buen Camino!" at one end of the table it would take five seconds for the pilgrims at the far end to hear you!!

Buen Camino

Where's Ivar going to sit?

 

[JennyH94]

Wow! Kat! 'Hope Betty's having "just the one"!

 

[NicoZ]

This is where I take my stand! - I really don't like those water bladders, not at all, preferring two bottles.

Regardless of the hygiene issues, drinking from a tube as you walk is completely unnatural, no other animal does this .. it has a futuristic Star Wars, Trekky feel to it to me and - drinking from a tube - really! ... when do you stop to look at the view?

I don't know. I think most mammals start out with something similar.

 

[NicoZ]

I just became a 'bladder convert' this weekend! I walked to Burgos last year and definitely didn't drink enough, the masseur at Los Arcos advised me to aim for 4 litres of water daily on top of coffees and colas and wine! I thought this a bit excessive but felt much better when I came close to achieving this amount.

Last month I was in vacation in Greece. Temps in the low to mid 40Cs. Drinking five to six litres a day I was borderline dehydrated. There are symptoms you can look for but it's safer to drink a bit more then not enough

 

[tyrrek]

I must have had a guardian Camino angel hanging around me when I bought my pack, because I stumbled upon one ideally suited to a bladder. It has a separate pocket right on the back, so to check how much water is left you just unzip it and look. (I usually check at each coffee break or fountain if I'm unsure.) It's easy to remove the bladder when necessary for filling or sharing.

As my pack nears the end of its life I've been looking at others. Many seem to have more difficult access inside the main part of the pack, which concerns me a bit.

My main 'criticism' of bladders is that they're often bigger than bottles and it's tempting to overfill them.

 

[dougfitz]

My main 'criticism' of bladders is that they're often bigger than bottles and it's tempting to overfill them.

I am puzzled. Once I have filled them to the top, any more water I add always seems to leak out. How do you 'overfill'?

 

[chilledKat]

Wow! Kat! 'Hope Betty's having "just the one"!

Nope dear Jenny....am sure she has a bladder pack hidden somewhere under her jacket....just for good measure of course

 

[tyrrek]

I am puzzled. Once I have filled them to the top, any more water I add always seems to leak out. How do you 'overfill'?

Sorry, that wasn't clear. I meant that I fill more than necessary. Mine is 2l, I typically fill it to 1.5l, but often 1l would be sufficient. The same could be true of bottles of course, but the size carried in side pockets would typically be 0.5l each.

 

[Sixwheeler]

I use a bladder (2L) which I rinse out every 2 days with a little water and quarter of a Milton tablet, paying particular attention to the mouthpiece. Swoosh it all around and run some through the tube, leave overnight then rinse out and refill in the morning. Works for me and tastes OK too.

 

[dougfitz]

Sorry, that wasn't clear. I meant that I fill more than necessary. Mine is 2l, I typically fill it to 1.5l, but often 1l would be sufficient. The same could be true of bottles of course, but the size carried in side pockets would typically be 0.5l each.

I have a simpler approach. I use a 3li bladder and fill it each morning. I refill about lunch time, although maybe not completely, and expect to consume about four to five litres while I am walking.

 

[Magwood]

I'd like to bet that the original poster had no idea how many and varied responses there would be, or how passionate pilgrims feel about how they carry their water supplies. What a great place this is!

 

[Saint Mike II]

Hola all "wet" pilgrims. I think I have a foot in both camps. I first used a bladder when I went to Tanzania to climb Mt Kilimanjaro. I knew the "rules" about 3 to 4 litres in every day and at least 2 litres out (via the kidneys). The best was to achieve this was via a 2 ltr bladder which was refilled at lunch time. I continue to use one on my shorter day/training walks.
However!! on Camino the two 1 ltr bottle plan worked a lot better - balanced the load and as pointed out - on those extra hot Spanish days it is important to know how much is left - those you know when to top up.
Now for Betty's small wine glass - that one would keep the Spanish football/soccer team going for about 1 hour.
Hi Kat - glad to see you have kept your sense of humour. How are the feet??
Buen Camino to all!!

 

[JennyH94]

I'd like to bet that the original poster had no idea how many and varied responses there would be, or how passionate pilgrims feel about how they carry their water supplies. What a great place this is!

Absolutely Maggie! Unlike those wonderful and ancient Camino paths, here on the Forum there are no yellow arrows and waymarker stars, so you NEVER know which way a thread will go! It really is one of the best things about the Forum, isn't it? I love it!
Cheers - Jenny

 

[hampshire!tim]

SOURCE have an attachment to allow refilling a bladder without unpacking it, and also a system attaching to bottles.

So assuming hygienic maintenance, this seems more of a "to sip or not to sip" preference than any other issue.

On my first Camino I did not hydrate enough, so the next will be sipped all the way, from bladder and from bottle.

 

[whariwharangi]

Drinking hard hat ... it holds two beer can sized containers.

 

[Saint Mike II]

Tim - about that refiller - where do we get one??
Whari - I am not to sure about this hat or its attachments. The extra weight would give me a headache or pain in the neck not to mention the two cans of probably very warm to hot beer. I think I will stick to water bottles on the road and a beer or two, or three in bar at days end!!

 

[dougfitz]

Tim - about that refiller - where do we get one??

I bought mine at Mountain Designs.

 

[lettinggo]

17 pilgrims sat in a taverna having a drink.
41% of them drank water through their mouth.
72% didn't feel thirsty.
52% had some kind of water transportation system.

How many reached Santiago?

 

[pilgrim b]

17 pilgrims sat in a taverna having a drink.
41% of them drank water through their mouth.
72% didn't feel thirsty.
52% had some kind of water transportation system.

How many reached Santiago?

The ones who ordered Gin and tonics? maybe!

 

[hampshire!tim]

Mike, I bought mine as part of a full system, as better value together :
http://sourceoutdoor.com/en/reservoirs/129-ultimate-hydration-system.html
It's the blue 'ribbed' piece in the picture.

You can also buy independently :
http://sourceoutdoor.com/en/accessories/88-uta-qmt-kit.html

Tim