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domparisien

New Member
Past OR future Camino
Frances Spring 2022
Little unsure where the best spot to post this is (Frances or Live on the Camino? Also, this is my first post - whew!).

Hi, I’m Dominik! I’m on the Camino Frances doing my first Camino and I’m currently in Pamplona (started in Saint-Jean-Pied-de-Port). I’m disabled, travelling alone, and I have chronic daily pain and experience some violent convulsions and blackouts. You might spot me on the road wearing a helmet (I wear it when I’m experiencing especially high pain/more likely to collapse). If you happen to find me unconscious on the road please don’t call an ambulance. You can just put something under my head until the convulsions stop. It can look pretty scary and I’ll often scream while convulsing - that isn’t unusual for me, so please don’t panic. I’m not responsive during these episodes, so don’t be concerned if I don’t answer. I carry a similar note in my wallet in case people check for my identity. Don’t hesitate to say hello if you see me! Also, as a lot of folks have posted, it’s quite busy on the Frances!
 

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SabineP

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
some and then more. see my signature.
@domparisien welcome here on this forum!

Thank you for being so open about your health and how we should react when you are experiencing such a convulsion episode.

I do not want to criticize you but would a small plastified card attached to your pack not be better than only the note in your wallet?
Just an idea. And did you also translate the note into Spanish?

Buen Camino and stay safe!
 

domparisien

New Member
Past OR future Camino
Frances Spring 2022
Hi @SabineP. That’s a very fair question (and I’m realizing I omitted a line in my post). I have a copy of it also in the top pocket of my backpack in a plastic bag.

The note is in French, English, and Spanish. It’s rather long in three languages so it wouldn’t fit in just a small card.

Thanks!
 
Past OR future Camino
Next up 2022?
Buen (convulsion-free) camino, Dominik!
Good for you - I love your attitude and openness.
Others have good suggestions - a message in English and Spanish where anyone can easily see it would be a good idea. Another possibility is on a lanyard around your neck - that might accommodate a folded longer note.

One thing to remember is that the pilgrim grapevine is very effective. Telling fellow pilgrims what you told us will have an effect.
 
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MinaKamina

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Jacobspad 2017
Hi Dominik, and welcome to the forum.

I see you are in need of a bit of tough love, so here it comes:

There is NO FREAKIN' WAY that Spaniards will let you lay unconscious on the side of the road.
You'll be airlifted before you know it, and since you are unconscious anyway, be prepared to wake up in a hospital bed.

Spain has a Safety Plan for the main Caminos, and that plan is there for a reason. When they find an unconscious pilgrim, they will act according to the plan, despite the note - for which your first responders and doctors still will be grateful once they find it.

Sorry, but not really sorry, because I would do the same.

I wish you a wonderful Camino, with many guardian angels.
 

Lhollo

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
CF pt2, Belorado to Sarria, May 21 – June 12, 2022
First, I’m so glad for you that you’re doing the Camino! Many of us here, myself included, know how important the Camino is if you’re dealing with chronic pain and illness, albeit in most cases, not in the ways you yourself experience.

I have to add my voice to those above. My thoughts would be: recovery position; phone 112.

I don’t think I’d look through your belongings at all because that would feel intrusive. I think if I saw a notice on you in a prominent position, though, that would stop me in my tracks. But I would be in ‘Must Act’ mode.

That said, I’m very glad I read this because now I know! I’ll be on the Camino from Sunday (starting from Belorado then) and although I’ll probably be ahead of you then, I will mention this to other pilgrims.

A very Buen Camino, Dominik!
 

dbier

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
Last 114km Camino Frances, Jul 21
2023 - Camino P
Hi, Dominik.

I'm a nurse in the US, so the following observation is from a US perspective. What you *need* is a nurse or doctor in Spain to tell you how Spanish law works.

Anyway, if I were to stop for you as a Good Samaritan ( and believe me, if you're screaming or unconscious, I would absolutely stop), the * only* thing that would allow me to wait with you without calling emergency services would be a *visible* medic alert bracelet that says you have seizures. If I can't see that from just looking you over, then I *have* to call, or risk being sued for negligence (even as a Good Samaritan). If I dig in your pack, I could be accused of stealing.

Spain mileage may vary....
 
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Welcome to the forum, @Dominik!
I totally agree with @dbier and others. You need a completely VISIBLE laminated type of alert; a special bracelet or a lanyard, otherwise people will definitely be callling 112 for help. Many pilgrims/walkers do not participate on this forum so they would not know your situation and that you prefer, and do not require any help. I would never be comfortable rummaging through your belongings.
How long do your siezures last...one, three, five minutes, or longer? It would be difficult for the average person to witness your situation for any length of time and not be motivated to take some form of action.
You are brave to go so far away from home to experience the Camino and I hope it meets your expectations.
All the best to you!
 
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Robo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF SJPdP to SdC
(May 2015)
CF Sarria to SdC
(May 2016)
CF SJPDP-SdC
(May 2018)
VdlP (2022?)
Do you have an option to walk with someone you trust to have look out for your wishes? It seems clear that most people who have responded here would not feel comfortable not calling for help.

It's a fair point you make.
@domparisien you are asking non-medical people to not react to a scene that many will find very distressing.
They will want to help in any way they can.
And for 99.9% of us, that will be calling for emergency medical help.
I for one, would not forgive myself if I did 'nothing' and things went badly.

But you are the one with this condition, and obviously know best how to handle it.

Perhaps make things a bit more obvious as others have suggested.
I for one would be calling an Ambulance,
not searching through pockets and wallets to find an explanation......

I would certainly be telling fellow Pilgrims around you.
I'm sure you have a casual / fun way of bringing their attention to it. like you have here :)

On a popular Camino route, the 'Camino Radio' will start to work.
That moving 'community' communicates in mysterious ways!
People will hear of you and your condition, and will be more aware of what to do to assist.

May you have a wonderful Camino!
Well done for raising the issue.
 
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MinaKamina

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Jacobspad 2017
Hi, Dominik.

I'm a nurse in the US, so the following observation is from a US perspective. What you *need* is a nurse or doctor in Spain to tell you how Spanish law works.

Anyway, if I were to stop for you as a Good Samaritan ( and believe me, if you're screaming or unconscious, I would absolutely stop), the * only* thing that would allow me to wait with you without calling emergency services would be a *visible* medic alert bracelet that says you have seizures. If I can't see that from just looking you over, then I *have* to call, or risk being sued for negligence (even as a Good Samaritan). If I dig in your pack, I could be accused of stealing.

Spain mileage may vary....

Spain and the rest of Europe would be the same. It is a cultural thing before a legal matter. Many people will not know the law, but they will help because it is the right thing to do.

In fact, I am surprised that this note in the pocket would work in Canada. Do Canadians check for notes in pockets before they alert medical assistance? :oops:

If they do, don't be that Canadian, press the button for medical assistance on Alert Cops and leave the rest to the experts.

You might download the Alert Cops app as well, Dominik, and make the request for medical assistance as soon as you feel a seizure coming. Alert Cops knows your exact location. The first responders will assess the situation, move you to a safer place if necessary and protect you from the weather, be it sunburn or hypothermia, from dehidration and sleep deprivation, and from robbery and theft.
 

zzotte

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
2012 Camino Frances, 2014 Lourdes to SDC, 2016 Camino del Norte
I‘m sorry about your issues, don’t you think that depending only to inform the people that reads this forum it’s enough? With all do respect perhaps you could enlist a companion?

zzotte
 

t2andreo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
2022
I recommend that, in addition to everything else everyone else has contributed that you use hiking poles to help maintain your balance. In 2015, I was subject to sudden onset syncope (fainting). Having the hiking poles helped me maintain my equilibrium and balance.

Can't hurt, might help. I also strongly recommend the bracelet - consider one for epilepsy.

FYI - I carry an ICE (In Case of Emergency) note, folded in to four panels in English, with the identical text and information in translated into Spanish, Portuguese and French on the other three panels. I keep it with my national passport in a plastic Zip-Lok in a cargo pocket. It is viewable without opening the Zip-Lok. I fold it according to the country I am in.

The contents contain all my identify and health stats, chronic illnesses, blood type, what prescription medications I take - in what dosages and what frequency. It also has a point of contact to call. Finally, as I am a Catholic, it asks the reader to please summon a priest if I am unconscious or very seriously injured.

Remember this is readable in four languages.

Hope this helps.

Tom
 
Last edited:

KennB

New Member
Past OR future Camino
Getting ready for El Camino "Frances" in 2022
Buen
Little unsure where the best spot to post this is (Frances or Live on the Camino? Also, this is my first post - whew!).

Hi, I’m Dominik! I’m on the Camino Frances doing my first Camino and I’m currently in Pamplona (started in Saint-Jean-Pied-de-Port). I’m disabled, travelling alone, and I have chronic daily pain and experience some violent convulsions and blackouts. You might spot me on the road wearing a helmet (I wear it when I’m experiencing especially high pain/more likely to collapse). If you happen to find me unconscious on the road please don’t call an ambulance. You can just put something under my head until the convulsions stop. It can look pretty scary and I’ll often scream while convulsing - that isn’t unusual for me, so please don’t panic. I’m not responsive during these episodes, so don’t be concerned if I don’t answer. I carry a similar note in my wallet in case people check for my identity. Don’t hesitate to say hello if you see me! Also, as a lot of folks have posted, it’s quite busy on the Frances!
BUEN CAMINO!!! and take it slow
 
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Rex

One Step at a Time
Past OR future Camino
2018
Not being a medical professional, if I saw you, I'd immediately call for help. I've witnessed someone die of a heart attack right in front of me on a city street and it's not an experience I want to repeat!
"Dial 112" would be my first thought and assessing the situation would come after I summoned help.
Buen Camino, Dom. May angels walk beside you and watch over you... your courage is admirable.
 

makingtrax

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
El norte2010
Portuguese 2014
Primativo 2016
Frances sept 2017!
Little unsure where the best spot to post this is (Frances or Live on the Camino? Also, this is my first post - whew!).

Hi, I’m Dominik! I’m on the Camino Frances doing my first Camino and I’m currently in Pamplona (started in Saint-Jean-Pied-de-Port). I’m disabled, travelling alone, and I have chronic daily pain and experience some violent convulsions and blackouts. You might spot me on the road wearing a helmet (I wear it when I’m experiencing especially high pain/more likely to collapse). If you happen to find me unconscious on the road please don’t call an ambulance. You can just put something under my head until the convulsions stop. It can look pretty scary and I’ll often scream while convulsing - that isn’t unusual for me, so please don’t panic. I’m not responsive during these episodes, so don’t be concerned if I don’t answer. I carry a similar note in my wallet in case people check for my identity. Don’t hesitate to say hello if you see me! Also, as a lot of folks have posted, it’s quite busy on the Frances!
Bon camino and enjoy your walk.
 

jeanineonthecamino

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances 2021, 2022
Do you have an option to walk with someone you trust to have look out for your wishes? It seems clear that most people who have responded here would not feel comfortable not calling for help.
Yes, this. As a nurse, I can totally understand where you are coming from and your desire not to end up in the hospital for a condition that is part of your normal life. I agree with others - make your medical information as visible as you are comfortable making it. Medic alert necklace/bracelet in addition to some sort of medical note that is not buried within a pack or wallet. Or even a visible note that directs the responder to more information. But your best bet is to walk near someone who is willing to be your advocate while on the Camino. Even if that is someone different every day - letting the people around you know about your condition in advance is really the only way to maybe get your wishes honored. Beyond that - your best bet is to simply hope you wake up before the ambulance arrives and/or before you are transported to a medical facility. But the fact is, most people would be uncomfortable with not calling for help. Especially if they don't know you and your medical history well. Even then - most people are more likely to panic and give in to their urge to call for help - especially if your seizure last longer than they are comfortable with. Wishing you a buen camino though - and I hope it goes well without any incidents!
 
Past OR future Camino
Latest: Rota Vicentina '19; Portuguese '19.
But your best bet is to walk near someone who is willing to be your advocate while on the Camino. Even if that is someone different every day - letting the people around you know about your condition in advance is really the only way to maybe get your wishes honored.
Good point as he didn't mention any walking partner able to join him.
 
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ken2116

Member
Past OR future Camino
Someday. But have hiked the Sierra and the Pyrenees.
Dominik's situation raises the general question of how to respond to an unconscious person whose health history and overall situation is unknown. Taking a first aid or, better yet, an advanced first aid course can prepare one for many situations - I've taken several classes over many decades and on several occasions have put the training to good use - it mostly provided me the confidence to protect and support the victims while awaiting the EMT's, but a few incidents were in wilderness situations where we were on our own.

One also might consider carrying a satellite emergency communicator like a Garmin InReach, etc., which can summons help from remote places.
 
Past OR future Camino
Portuguese camino
Little unsure where the best spot to post this is (Frances or Live on the Camino? Also, this is my first post - whew!).

Hi, I’m Dominik! I’m on the Camino Frances doing my first Camino and I’m currently in Pamplona (started in Saint-Jean-Pied-de-Port). I’m disabled, travelling alone, and I have chronic daily pain and experience some violent convulsions and blackouts. You might spot me on the road wearing a helmet (I wear it when I’m experiencing especially high pain/more likely to collapse). If you happen to find me unconscious on the road please don’t call an ambulance. You can just put something under my head until the convulsions stop. It can look pretty scary and I’ll often scream while convulsing - that isn’t unusual for me, so please don’t panic. I’m not responsive during these episodes, so don’t be concerned if I don’t answer. I carry a similar note in my wallet in case people check for my identity. Don’t hesitate to say hello if you see me! Also, as a lot of folks have posted, it’s quite busy on the Frances!
Hello Dominik, Thank you for sharing this. I am very moved by your post as my brother in law, Nicolas de Rauglaudre, with an amputated leg has walked 4200 kms on the caminos (often on his own) He suppered terrible phantom pains and also bad blistering and sores from his prothesis.
I think it would be interesting for both of you to connect up.
(email address removed by moderator - send a private message to @Jaujauzimbo to connect)

All the best for your camino Dominik.
 
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Past OR future Camino
2022
If I found an unconscious person on the Camino, or a person convulsing on the ground and screaming, I would call 112 first and ask questions later.

While waiting for the ambulance, I then might do a closer check on the person, if unconscious, to check if he/she was breathing or bleeding. I would take appropriate first aid action (first rule: do no harm).

I would most likely expect heat related issues so I might grab my water bottle and prepare to place a cold compress on a forehead. I would stay with the person, fanning with my hat, until the ambulance arrives.

Going through the pockets of the person to look for a note would not enter my mind. Even if I did and the note read, "Don't worry, I'm really OK," I would still proceed as noted above. Same for a note on a helmet - I would not expect to find medical info there (although I might now).

At least, all the above is happening in the movie in my head. I hope I would actually do this in reality.

It is good that you are taking the precaution to tell people around, that this may be an issue for you. If something happens, they can give a balanced report of what may be happening to the proper authorities.
 

Robo

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
CF SJPdP to SdC
(May 2015)
CF Sarria to SdC
(May 2016)
CF SJPDP-SdC
(May 2018)
VdlP (2022?)
Dominik's situation raises the general question of how to respond to an unconscious person whose health history and overall situation is unknown. Taking a first aid or, better yet, an advanced first aid course can prepare one for many situations - I've taken several classes over many decades and on several occasions have put the training to good use - it mostly provided me the confidence to protect and support the victims while awaiting the EMT's, but a few incidents were in wilderness situations where we were on our own.

One also might consider carrying a satellite emergency communicator like a Garmin InReach, etc., which can summons help from remote places.

Without risking to hijack this thread....you raise a great point.

My wife Pat, who is rather more cautious than me, insisted prior to our last Camino that we both undertake a First Aid course. I think her motivation was more that we could help each other in remote areas. I am a lot older than her, and a lot more unhealthy! She was particularly attentive during the training on dealing with heart attacks!

The point? A First Aid course is always of great value.
Over the years (20 years in Military) I have done many First Aid courses. But we forget stuff........
Refreshers are a good idea.

Our course was in 2018.
I'll certainly do another before my next Camino.
Here, a basic First Aid course, is one day.....

If you have not done a First Aid course, maybe consider one.
Even very basic knowledge, can save a life.

Back to @domparisien .
Well done for raising this and being so open about your condition.
As I am sure you have found already, the Camino community is a very caring one.
Pilgrims really do look out for each other.......

I hope you are having an amazing experience.
 

trevorcc

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
SJPD to Santiago 2013,2014, Camino de Levante Sept. 2016, Frances March 2018, planning 2020
Little unsure where the best spot to post this is (Frances or Live on the Camino? Also, this is my first post - whew!).

Hi, I’m Dominik! I’m on the Camino Frances doing my first Camino and I’m currently in Pamplona (started in Saint-Jean-Pied-de-Port). I’m disabled, travelling alone, and I have chronic daily pain and experience some violent convulsions and blackouts. You might spot me on the road wearing a helmet (I wear it when I’m experiencing especially high pain/more likely to collapse). If you happen to find me unconscious on the road please don’t call an ambulance. You can just put something under my head until the convulsions stop. It can look pretty scary and I’ll often scream while convulsing - that isn’t unusual for me, so please don’t panic. I’m not responsive during these episodes, so don’t be concerned if I don’t answer. I carry a similar note in my wallet in case people check for my identity. Don’t hesitate to say hello if you see me! Also, as a lot of folks have posted, it’s quite busy on the Frances!
Thanks for your story, you maybe the person during an episode that brings the best out in a stranger, so fear not your illness will create many Camino miracles for others I am sure. God bless.
 
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K_Lynn

New Member
Past OR future Camino
2021
Hi @SabineP. That’s a very fair question (and I’m realizing I omitted a line in my post). I have a copy of it also in the top pocket of my backpack in a plastic bag.

The note is in French, English, and Spanish. It’s rather long in three languages so it wouldn’t fit in just a small card.

Thanks!
Consider placing the note in multiple visible locations (on the sleeve/shoulder of your shirt, exterior of your pack, or shoulder straps) as you may be in any number of positions when someone comes by. Maybe augment your note with a big yellow smiley face so it's more visible and implies there is no need to panic.

Best of luck to you on Camino! Buen Camino!
 

MinaKamina

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Jacobspad 2017
Hi Dominik, so sorry to read that you got injured, yet glad to read that people stayed with you until the ambulance came.

Sending you positive vibes and may the Camino continue to provide Get well soon!

🌻🌻
 
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Albertagirl

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Frances; Aragones; VdlP; Madrid-Invierno; Levante
I appreciate the reminder to update my first aid course and shall be contacting the Red Cross about this. I have the AlertCops app on my phone and found out that I cannot activate it without a Spanish phone number. So for my first month, on the Podiensis, I shall have to rely on telephoning the emergency services from whatever number I am assigned when I get a new SIM card in Le Puy. Is 112 the general emergency number in Europe, or at least between France and Spain? I also carry a SPOT emergency beacon, which will send an alarm via satellite to a monitored central location, which can alert the emergency services in Europe and most other places in the world. I know that Dominik will have completed his camino before I begin mine, but I consider this thread to be a good reminder, for myself and others. I find it somewhat daunting that a person having a medical emergency on the camino may have only myself to rely on. Fortunately, on five caminos walked, it hasn't happened yet. I am reminded to check for a medic alert necklace or bracelet if I come upon someone in medical distress and unable to communicate.
 

SeaHorse

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
Frances 2015 (SJPDP-Finisterre), planning Norte
Hi @SabineP. That’s a very fair question (and I’m realizing I omitted a line in my post). I have a copy of it also in the top pocket of my backpack in a plastic bag.

The note is in French, English, and Spanish. It’s rather long in three languages so it wouldn’t fit in just a small card.

Thanks!
European here. If I see somebody having a medical problem in the middle of nowhere I absolutely do call an ambulance. No way I’m going to dig in their pockets or backpack or anywhere else in their stuff. I think the only way you get people not call the ambulance is by having a friend or walking buddy who stays with you during the seizure and can tell what’s happening. Even then I wouldn’t guarantee they would listen. The same about prints on your clothes: could be a thrift store find, could be a joke, I wouldn’t risk somebody dead because of a print on their t-shirt.
 

Canche

Volcano Climber
Past OR future Camino
Norte/Frances 2016, San Salvador & Primitivo 2021
@domparisien welcome here on this forum!

Thank you for being so open about your health and how we should react when you are experiencing such a convulsion episode.

I do not want to criticize you but would a small plastified card attached to your pack not be better than only the note in your wallet?
Just an idea. And did you also translate the note into Spanish?

Buen Camino and stay safe!
Agree. something on the outside of your pack or on your shirt would be helpful.
 

jeanineonthecamino

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Camino Frances 2021, 2022
Did I miss a post on this thread??
No - I was looking for one though! But I did find an updated post from him on Facebook Camino de Santiago 2022 page. He had a couple falls and minor injuries and some helpful pilgrims stayed with him until the ambulance arrived. He seems to be doing well though. He was resting at the time of his update - but that was the 16th so he may be walking again by now.
 
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David Tallan

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
1989
My first thought when reading the initial posting was along the lines of many - I am unlikely to go through pockets and wallets and better to have the note in a visible position. Now, I'm not sure if I would pay attention to it even if it was visible.

I understand and respect OP's desire not to have a lot of fuss and unnecessary ambulance calls for a routine and non-threatening occurrence in their life. And, in general, I agree that they should be in charge of their medical decisions. That said, if I were to come across them unconscious on the path with their helmet on, and their note visible, I have no way of knowing if they are unconscious because of their disability or because they've suffered a cardiac arrest. I assume that their disability doesn't render them immune from all other potential causes of unconsciousness. I would imagine myself blithely going on my way having read the note when, in fact, they'd had a heart attack and never received medical attention because everyone read the note and walked on. I'd imaging how I would feel when I learned of their demise. Then I'd call for help.

Having a walking companion who can speak for you is probably the best route to the desired outcome.
 

Albertagirl

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
Frances; Aragones; VdlP; Madrid-Invierno; Levante
My first thought when reading the initial posting was along the lines of many - I am unlikely to go through pockets and wallets and better to have the note in a visible position. Now, I'm not sure if I would pay attention to it even if it was visible.

I understand and respect OP's desire not to have a lot of fuss and unnecessary ambulance calls for a routine and non-threatening occurrence in their life. And, in general, I agree that they should be in charge of their medical decisions. That said, if I were to come across them unconscious on the path with their helmet on, and their note visible, I have no way of knowing if they are unconscious because of their disability or because they've suffered a cardiac arrest. I assume that their disability doesn't render them immune from all other potential causes of unconsciousness. I would imagine myself blithely going on my way having read the note when, in fact, they'd had a heart attack and never received medical attention because everyone read the note and walked on. I'd imaging how I would feel when I learned of their demise. Then I'd call for help.

Having a walking companion who can speak for you is probably the best route to the desired outcome.
But then, the walking companion would have to be very familiar with the particular medical condition and might also miss the signs of a heart attack or other serious medical event, if he or she were not medically trained. And yet, I wouldn't want to prevent someone from walking as a pilgrim because of my decisions about their medical condition. There are many simple monuments along the pilgrim routes to those who died while walking, and some may have chosen not to just wait for death at home. Groups like that started by the authors of "I'll push you" may be one answer to this dilemma.
 

David Tallan

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
1989
But then, the walking companion would have to be very familiar with the particular medical condition and might also miss the signs of a heart attack or other serious medical event, if he or she were not medically trained. And yet, I wouldn't want to prevent someone from walking as a pilgrim because of my decisions about their medical condition. There are many simple monuments along the pilgrim routes to those who died while walking, and some may have chosen not to just wait for death at home. Groups like that started by the authors of "I'll push you" may be one answer to this dilemma.
I was remembering when OP said
experience some violent convulsions and blackouts
and thought their blackouts tend to be prefaced by violent convulsions. If I come across an unconscious person I have no idea what caused it. If someone is walking with them and is familiar with the person and sees violent convulsions leading to a blackout, they are likely to see the unconsciousness as a typical result of the disability and can reassure others. On the other hand, if they see their companion just drop unconscious without the typical convulsions, they can recognize it as likely something else. And being with the person, they will have seen the lead up. They are also more likely to be able to distinguish the typical convulsions from other pre-blackout activity that might indicate something else is going on.
 

SeaHorse

Active Member
Past OR future Camino
Frances 2015 (SJPDP-Finisterre), planning Norte
I was remembering when OP said

and thought their blackouts tend to be prefaced by violent convulsions. If I come across an unconscious person I have no idea what caused it. If someone is walking with them and is familiar with the person and sees violent convulsions leading to a blackout, they are likely to see the unconsciousness as a typical result of the disability and can reassure others. On the other hand, if they see their companion just drop unconscious without the typical convulsions, they can recognize it as likely something else. And being with the person, they will have seen the lead up. They are also more likely to be able to distinguish the typical convulsions from other pre-blackout activity that might indicate something else is going on.
Or there's convulsions followed by blackout followed by something else and non medics never notice the difference.
 
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SabineP

Veteran Member
Past OR future Camino
some and then more. see my signature.
Well hopefully the OP will return to tell us of his experiences. Aside from what he posted recently on his public Twitteraccount.
 

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