In response to the locked mushroom thread...

[Delecto]

QUOTE:
Hi Delecto,
I think yo have come to the wrong place. There has been no posts in this forum on this topic, so I suggest you try google to find the answer to your question.

Buen camino
Ivar

/QUOTE

Precisely why I started the thread! What, so you prefer the same "which backpack should I buy..." questions to be repeated every month? Your locking of the thread is very disconcerting. I was under the impression that the Camino community is populated by like-minded people who are open new thoughts and ideas even if they do not necessarily agree. Instead when I try to shed a new light to the Camino experience I am hushed up as if Spain is still living under Franco's Fascist rule :shock: :shock: . On a positive note, I'd like to thank those who've pmed with their thoughts and concern regarding the locking of that thread.

Joe

 

[William Marques]

Delecto

It was I not Ivar who locked the thread. As the only three posts you had written related to magic mushrooms and as our host had said that this was a topic better pursued elsewhere there seemed little point in leaving it open. Please PM those who are interested.

This forum is related to the pilgrimage to Santiago and although our moderating principles are very light handed some control is necessary to ensure that the ordinary reader is not driven away by a small number of people wishing to talk about topics of their own which are not related to the Camino.

William

 

[rioja routard]

Actually, it felt like the freedom of speech and ideas were being curtailed in this case.

It is something that has not been talked about before and sometimes the same old equipment questions and backpack questions go on and on and if people simply did a search they would see their very question has already indeed been answered.

People post these equipment questions as if they were going up the Eiger or the Matterhorn, not a daily walk across rurual Spain. When I first went I just chucked stuff in a back pack and that was it and since then get a feel of what to take. Over organisation simply frustrates the experience.

I'm not into any drugs myself apart from red wine but I've seen hippies smoking dope and liberally feeling the freedom to express themselves on their own spiritual journey so it felt a bit over authoritave to almost censor someones interest in experimenting with narcortic substances freely available.

 

[Telluridewalker]

People post these equipment questions as if they were going up the Eiger or the Matterhorn, not a daily walk across rurual Spain.

I had to chuckle when I read this. Are you somehow implying that finding an electrical outlet for your iPhone is not a concern of those headed up the Eiger?

As for the locked thread, it's a tough call. I respect the time and effort the moderators expend to keep this site relevant and enjoyable (which it most certainly is) but Delecto's post was up less than a day before it was decided that "not enough people are interested in this topic" and it was locked. As an amateur mycologist, I love to talk mushrooms, although I'm more interested in the culinary applications and not the mind expanding type.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Our regular chef, the guy who stepped forward every night to cook delicious meals, harvested mushrooms along the way. No one would eat his dinner that night!

 

[Deleted member 3000]

I don't know the law, but

 

[sillydoll]

When I first went I just chucked stuff in a back pack and that was it

I hope your backpack didn't look anything like the one in your avatar picture!!

 

[rioja routard]

Yup Sil

Metaphorically it did, because if you look carefully it is the world! :wink:

And that is what it felt like I was carrying when I first set out!

I did not look like a drifter though, perish the thought!

 

[Bridget and Peter]

How cool is this forum:

'shrooms (never thought I'd write that),
was Jesus a drifter,
the Pope and the menopause,
bears in the Pyrenees,
later mediaeval women pilgrims,
the propensity of military marching to cause shin splints (whatever they are)...

 

[colinPeter]

When I first went I just chucked stuff in a back pack and that was it and since then get a feel of what to take

In that case, just eat any mushrooms you see on the way, and get the feel of what to eat next time. No need to ask questions on a forum.
However, there's nothing like learning from the experience of others. That's why I want to know what your "stuff" consisted of and what "stuff" you would take next time.
Google turned up:
Psychedelic mushrooms 2.52 Million results
Magic Mushrooms 3.34 Million results
Backpack recommendation Camino Santiago only 2,570 results
So this is a great forum for good information that is not as easy to obtain as is mushrooms.
I would rather the moderators be a little "over zealous", than see a brilliant forum disintegrate to the level of the multitude of "anything goes" type forums.
Col

 

[Delecto]

When I first went I just chucked stuff in a back pack and that was it and since then get a feel of what to take

In that case, just eat any mushrooms you see on the way, and get the feel of what to eat next time. No need to ask questions on a forum.
However, there's nothing like learning from the experience of others. That's why I want to know what your "stuff" consisted of and what "stuff" you would take next time.
Google turned up:
Psychedelic mushrooms 2.52 Million results
Magic Mushrooms 3.34 Million results
Backpack recommendation Camino Santiago only 2,570 results
So this is a great forum for good information that is not as easy to obtain as is mushrooms.
I would rather the moderators be a little "over zealous", than see a brilliant forum disintegrate to the level of the multitude of "anything goes" type forums.
Col

My original question was regarding the hunting and gathering of mushrooms along the Camino itself. So this is very specific to the Camino de Santiago and very relevant to this forum. The issue here is that there's an unjust "bad stigma" attached to this topic because society and goverments (read: the word government derives from latin "steer" "mind") worldwide have sought to control the truth about these natural mind-expanding substances. Had I asked about the types of medicinal herbs or other general flora found on the Camino I'm sure the thread would not have been locked.

Edit: So how many results did you get for "Magic Mushrooms Camino Santiago"?

 

[Delecto]

This issue is especially important when you consider the dangers of randomly picking mushrooms and accidentally injesting any of lethal strands that can be found. A healthy forum discussion and education can shed light on the issue and help prevent accidents. This is also why in the last thread I provided a link to the shroomery forum. Not only do they have pictures of the various types (good/bad) mushrooms found in Spain but they encourage newcomers to upload their own pictures if they are at all unsure of the species that they've found.

 

[Arn]

My suggestion:

Don't pick the mushrooms

Don't pick the asparagus

Do pick up the trash

Buen eat at a restaurant Camino

Arn

 

[alipilgrim]

it is not a good idea to encourage 'picking' of any kind. Too many farmers along the path rely on their produce to have pilgrims picking cherries, mushrooms, salads, etc etc. And unless one is very very knowledge about mushrooms, picking wild can be very dangerous. Support the local economy and buy in stores and restaurants!

 

[Telluridewalker]

it is not a good idea to encourage 'picking' of any kind. Too many farmers along the path rely on their produce to have pilgrims picking cherries, mushrooms, salads, etc etc. And unless one is very very knowledge about mushrooms, picking wild can be very dangerous. Support the local economy and buy in stores and restaurants!

Alipilgrim, I have to disagree with you. I think we need to get more in touch with the natural world around us. That means picking, trying, tasting and exploring. Within limits of course, like staying off private property or learning which mushrooms are in the "lose your lunch bunch". But confining ourselves to what's available in stores is way too limited, IMHO. Food doesn't come prewrapped in cellophane on a styrofoam tray.

For those curious about the concept, may I suggest Euell Gibbons' book, Stalking The Wild Asparagus (about foraging in your neighborhood) or French filmmaker Agnes Varda's Les Glaneurs Et La Glaneuse (The Gleaners and I) (about the French concept of gleaning, or picking up the waste crops).

So go ahead..put it in your mouth- you might be surprised...

 

[Timo]

Hello,
do you really have the urge to risk your life being unconcious of the severe dangers of eating unknown mushrooms, berries etc? I find these kind "advise" very unresponsible.
-T-

 

[colinPeter]

Google turned up:
Psychedelic mushrooms 2.52 Million results
Magic Mushrooms 3.34 Million results
Backpack recommendation Camino Santiago only 2,570 results
Col

....
Edit: So how many results did you get for "Magic Mushrooms Camino Santiago"?

Magic Mushrooms Camino Santiago 2,890
Backpack recommendation Camino Santiago only 2,570
Phew! Lucky me.
Col

 

[Deleted member 3000]

"Tastes like wild Hickory nuts" Gibson reached the ripe old age of 64.

I met two pilgrims in rehab, walking as part of their recovery; one actively stoned pilgrim; and quite a few drunks. I only wish I had found them as fascinating as I am sure they thought they were.

There is something to be said for being remorseful about self-destructive behavior. Being proud of it seems so self-absorbed.

 

[Delecto]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7yKpvBQhT

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YW31ruQG1X

 

[oursonpolaire]

In case anyone is really interested in picking mushrooms, they should take them into the pharmacy in the next pueblo to be examined by a pharmacist-- as in France, these professionals are trained in distinguishing the dangerous ones from the ones which can be eaten without injury. Note that some (not all) of the hallucenogenic fungi help the consumer achieve that status through damage to the nervous system.

Myself, I prefer my mushrooms in a revuelto de cepas.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

"Locked Mushroom Thread..."
Sounds like an ingredient in some exotic Asian recipe!

 

[Anniesantiago]

I'll preface this post by saying I'm a wild mushroomer.
We eat wild mushrooms all year long and belong to the Oregon Mycological Society.
I know what's safe and unsafe IN OREGON.

Someone said: I think we need to get more in touch with the natural world around us. That means picking, trying, tasting and exploring.

While I agree in some respects, I would like to caution that all it takes is one bite of the wrong mushroom and your kidneys and liver are dead, and so are you.

While there aren't that many mushrooms that will kill you, the ones that will are beautiful and often tasty. There are no known treatments for most serious mushroom poisoning.

You simply wait to DIE without organ transplant.

It's not worth it.

People come to the hospital where I work every year because they come from another land and pick/eat local mushrooms because they "look like" something common they know in their own country and "it tasted just fine." Unfortunately, it's often entire families who sicken or die.

The bottom line: To insist on 'tasting, sampling" and you aren't absolutely 100% sure that what you're eating is safe, is Mother Nature's way of cutting the "stooopid genes" out of the genepool.

 

[alipilgrim]

I stand by my 'support local shops&bars' statement. If every one of the 100,000 odd pilgrims in 2009 decided to start picking berries, mushrooms, etc it would decimate the local flora. I'd rather see a mushroom left in the wild for the next pilgrim to see than plopped on his dinner plate. Pick in your own backyard, not someone else's.

 

[Telluridewalker]

Someone said: I think we need to get more in touch with the natural world around us. That means picking, trying, tasting and exploring.


.

That was me so I think I should explain myself. I never said "Put everything you come across in your mouth"(although babies use that methodology to explore the world around them). I simply suggested people be a little more open to what the natural world offers us, within reason. To me, the Camino offers a great opportunity in that department.

As always, it's important to keep things in perspective. For example, in the US, 90%+ of all mushroom deaths are caused by one species, amanita phalloides...so if you learn to identify that one mushroom, you've just reduced your chances of dying by mushroom by 90%? (mathemeticians, help me out here...). And since the most people that have died in a given year due to mushroom poisoning in the US was 3 people in 1991, your chances of getting killed by a mushroom rank somewhere just under getting killed by a terrorist. (I don't have any figures on poisonings, sorry.)

My point (and I hope I have one) is that with the slightest amount of caution (like a knowlegeable fellow peregrino or a guidebook), one could stay reasonably safe on the Camino and still try expanding one's diet outside what's sold in the albergues and shops. Or spend some time with that dishevelled transient outside the iglesia whom you wouldn't give a second thought to if he lived near your home subway stop. I think exploration (i.e. risk taking) is one of the timeless themes of the Camino. Leave your cell phone, your regimented highly processed diet, your preconceived notions and your fears at the door and dig the utterly different and potentially life altering world of life on the road.

John

PS: The Problem of the Commons, as alipilgrim points out, is a real issue. Learn what it is, and proceed with care.

 

[oursonpolaire]

John--- I would agree with you 100% on the principle of being open to what the Camino offers us. It challenges so many of our preconceptions and notions on the world about us that it would take a book to discuss them adequately.

But on the mushroom issue, you are 100% wrong. Unless you are a mycologist with training on Spanish fungi, take it to the pharmacia for identification before you put it in your mouth.

 

[Anonymous]

Yes, and possibly a thousand years or so too late - think what all those pilgrims would do to Spain ... locusts aren't in it - those days are long gone (thank God).

And ..Telluride, well, please forgive me but I don't know where you live - but in Europe every town and city is full of shops that sell fresh local produce ... tables groaning with the weight of produce - none of it in stryofoam coffins or under poisonous clingfilm .. we are quite modern, in a medieval sort of way, a lot of us tend to eat fresh and well produced foods ...
so when you get on the Camino go to markets and the excellent shops and taste and touch from all the variety put there for you .....

and enjoy

(and by the way ... September fungi foraging on the Camino, and other drugs, whether 'herb o' de land' or from a factory, blow holes in your protective aura which then allows all sorts of rather nasty entities to enter :? - and takes years of good living to repair :shock: )

 

[sillydoll]

Just one comment - there are usually signs everywhere warning you NOT to touch the produce. Store keepers get really annoyed if you handle their fruit or vegetables.

 

[colinPeter]

Just one comment - there are usually signs everywhere warning you NOT to touch the produce. Store keepers get really annoyed if you handle their fruit or vegetables.

Is this the usual rule in Spain?
We would normally "feel" fruit/veges before we purchase, is this a "no no"?
So, I guess we might also be in trouble if we "taste tested" a grape prior to purchase?
Col

 

[ivar]

Just one comment - there are usually signs everywhere warning you NOT to touch the produce. Store keepers get really annoyed if you handle their fruit or vegetables.

Is this the usual rule in Spain?
We would normally "feel" fruit/veges before we purchase, is this a "no no"?

Yes... it is not normal. Usually you see, in addition to the plastic bags to put the fruits in, a stand with plastic gloves that you are supposed to put on before choosing your fruits/vegetables. Personally I normally do not use the gloves, but keep the "touching" to a minimum.

There are even stores that does not like the customers touch the fruits even with gloves. You point towards what you want, and the clerk pics it for you (this is especially true in El Corte Ingles).

My wife the first time she entered into the fruit section of a grocery store in the USA asked the clerk, "Where is the gloves?" ...and the clerk was wondering what the heck she was talking about...

Saludos,
Ivar

 

[Deirdre]

You are absolutely right, Ivar! As anyone who has ever been tu the US knows, our grocery store produce (and every other kind of market as well!) is stacked high and available for inspecting, shaking, sniffing, squeezing... :lol: The only ones who handle with gloves are the grocery employees who place the fruit/veg on the displays!

Old habits die hard, and even though I know the cultural difference in Spain, I have sometimes forgotten and been soundly rebuked as I happily inspected a pretty apple or peach!

And once again, cultural differences. Normally, most Americans would never bother a store clerk to get something for them that they can perfectly well get for themselves. It seems somehow ridiculous or lazy to have to ask someone to get something that is right in front of you. But there I was in the market in Santiago standing in fornt of five dozen peaches. The 'dependiente' was behind a high counter completely out of reach of all the produce. I only wanted one peach and one apple to take with me as I began my walk to Muxía/Fisterra. But I pleasantly asked the 'dependiente' for my fruit and she pleasantly came down, out and around to provide me with my little bag and select my fruit for me..... And then wished me 'Buen Camino"

 

[Anonymous]

.. by 'touch and taste' I did not mean touch and taste things belonging to other people - I meant go to the markets and shops and buy some of that produce then touch and taste .... the point that I was making was that European food isn't all packed in plastic, nor is there only narrow choice .. so one can easily touch and taste and enjoy a great variety of local foods ....

Crikey - you surely couldn't think that someone would suggest walking through a market touching and tasting the food on display???? :shock: really - :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[colinPeter]

I really appreciate some of the cultural things you learn on this forum. In some cases probably more important than the great travel, accommodation advice ect. Thanks!

...Crikey - you surely couldn't think that someone would suggest walking through a market touching and tasting the food on display????

Actually quite common in Australia. Might be a bit of a convict thing, sort of thing we were sent out here for in the first place. And very common to see people eat small things like grapes or cherries (just one),sort of try the green grapes, then the red and buy the best tasting.
Col
Decendant of William (Farm servant ), arrived on the Andromeda II in 1833, from Northampton, convicted in 1832 of poaching (sort of like eating someone elses grapes)

 

[Anniesantiago]

I understand the "no touching the fruit" rule... and am happy to report I only received GOOD, fresh, sweet fruit when I allowed the salesperson to pick it for me.

 

[Delecto]

Epic hijack guys, well done...

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Potheads are greatly offended when the topic is not pot.

 

[Anonymous]

Hijack? you think? Delecto? Funny, I thought that it was you trying to hijack this forum.

The thing is, the drug-taking mind is utterly psychopathically selfish and self-centred, therefore it sees the world through its' own skewed and delusional perception.

So, that mind tends to think that enlightenment (whatever is meant by that) is the end result of taking the right halucinogenics - but this is utterly false. That route leads only to eventual madness and death.

The myths of Jesus and mushrooms are false, when the Beatles went to India to their guru and smoked cannabis, believing that they were on the path he sent them away, telling them to come back when they weren't chemically insane.
You only need to look at how many singers and musicians die young to see where it all leads - to look at teenage mass killers and their drug habits - madness and then death

True enlightenment is from a different path Delecto - (I know that you won't believe that).

So the thread has run elsewhere because people would rather have tea and conversation with sane people than mad people ...

and that is how it actually is .... and not meant to be offensive, just observational.

Crikey! - why is it all problems seem to boil down to touching fruit? :wink:

 

[Delecto]

The thing is, the drug-taking mind is utterly psychopathically selfish and self-centred, therefore it sees the world through its' own skewed and delusional perception.
:

You cannot be any further from the truth. Mushrooms and other psychedelics give us a great understanding about the life and the world we live in, that we are one and are all interconnected. There was a time when this spiritual inducing substance was commonplace in the human experience (ancient societies) and has played a crucial role in the creation of religions (including the bible). The rise of western culture however has cut us off from the connection we once had with nature. Today we live in a materialistic, ego-centered world that is seeing the destruction of our once cherished planet.

 

[Delecto]

You only need to look at how many singers and musicians die young to see where it all leads - to look at teenage mass killers and their drug habits - madness and then death

There have been little-to-no deaths associated with the use of mushroom, cannabis, and salvia usage. Cocaine, Heroin and other alterations of Opium however are a serious problem and should not be confused with entheogens. Don't even get me started with Alcohol and Tabacco, which are "socially accepted" drugs that kill tens of thousands each year...

 

[sillydoll]

My favourite author - Carl Sagan - said that he regularly smoked pot. It inspired him to a deeper understanding of the universe!

 

[ivar]

Alright... I will close this thread.... and let us move on to topics related to the Camino de Santiago de Compostela.

Saludos,
Ivar