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Just how difficult is it getting over The Pyrenees..

This thread has been around for awhile now, and I have avoided posting my SJPDP to Roncesvalles experience, for fear of unduly worrying people who were getting ready to walk for the first time. With a hundred posts, I guess it is safe to throw in my first day's experience into the mix.

A little background: when I first started actively planning my camino, I was carrying more weight on me than is healthy. However, I was pretty active and wasn't remotely concerned. Unfortunately, in 7 months between starting to plan and my first step out the door of the L'Esprit du Chemin, I managed to gain another 70 pounds. I would have been close to 320 lbs that day. The only plus I had going for me is I was used to walking a lot.

I had planned on trying the Napoleon route, and stopping at Orrison to split it up. However, in early April, the Napoleon route was still closed, so via Valcarlos I went.

I set out around 8 AM. Initially, it was fine, walking along quiet roads, passing some sheep grazing quietly on 70 degree slopes, ignoring some dogs who sole purpose in life appeared to be to bark continuously and loudly at anything that came within their visual range. There was some up and down, but on the whole, not a bad morning at all. By the time I reached Valcarlos, I was feeling somewhat tired.

There is a covered pavilion/stage just where you rejoin the main highway for awhile, and I had lunch there and considered my options. I had covered about half the distance in roughly 3.5 hours. However, most of the elevation gain on the Valcarlos route is at the end of day, and I was already feeling tired. My body was telling me to stop, particularly since this was the last place with accommodations before Roncesvalles. My brain decided to fixate on the 23-24 km I needed to average per day to finish in 5 weeks and that 12 km was just not enough. On remote hiking trails, this is the sort of thinking that gets people killed or lost. Fortunately, I wasn't on a remote hiking trail.

Soon after leaving Valcarlos, I began to slow down. Just past Ganecoleta, my right thigh muscle cramped for the time. Not long after, a rash began to develop, which slowed me down still further. By the time I reached the START of the long, sustained climb, I was exhausted. I figure the last 2.5 km I walked that day took me in excess of 4 hours. During those four hours, my right thigh had cramped twice more and the rash had become problematic, every step hurt. The last woman to pass me, at around 4:00 PM, had yelled back to me that she would let the staff at the albergue know that I was still on the trail.

At just before 7 PM I came out onto the road beside what the guidebook describes as a dog kennel. As best I could judge it, I had another 3km and 100 metres of elevation gain to go, it was cool and raining lightly, and it would be dark in an hour or so. I was beaten. I knew, KNEW, if I went back to into the woods to continue, someone would have to come get me. when i was younger and in better shape, I had lots of long day hikes, and while I had been tired, it was nothing like this. This feeling of being helpless was a new and unpleasant experience in my life.

So, I made the only decision I could. I crossed the road, and tried to flag down a passing vehicle. It took between 45 minutes and a hour to get a ride, during which time I started to worry about hypothermia. Like I said, it was cool and rainy, and I so exhausted that I found it very difficult to move much.

While I was waiting, I decided that coming here was a huge mistake, that I simply wasn't equipped to do this. I was going to find a place to stay in Roncesvalles overnight, take a cab or something to Pamplona in the morning, and figure what to do next.

While trying to get my bearings after being dropped off, I was approached by younger woman (25ish) and an older gentleman (early 50's), who offered to show me where the albergue was. They led me in and the guy carried my pack, which was good I wasn't entirely sure I could lift it my pack onto my back again. When I got there, I got checked in. I wasn't going to stay, but I felt obligated to let the albergue staff know I had made it. Sure enough, they were expecting me. I ended up staying, just because it was easier. One of the albergue staff had to tighten my sandals for me, because I physically couldn't reach to tighten them myself.

That night, it took several hours to fall asleep, because different parts of my body would take turns cramping. My thighs, calves, feet and one of my thumbs.

A few points in closing:

1. When I awoke in the morning, I was still convinced that it would be foolish to continue. However, I got up, threw away everything in my pack that didn't seem necessary, and walked out the door. I looked at the map and saw that the next village was only about 3km away and decided I could quit when I got there. And when I reached it, I decided the 3.5 km (mostly flat) to the next village was a distance I could cover before looking for that cab. For the next two days, that was pretty much how things worked. And, as you can tell from my profile picture, I did eventually make it to Santiago.

2. I don't know the names of the people who led me to the albergue, or the albergue staff I interacted with that night (April 2), but on the remote chance that they frequent these forums, I did want to say thank you. Your kindness that night literally saved my camino.

3. Like I said at the beginning, I wouldn't want anyone to think my experience was typical. :)

Glen
 
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Thengel1.. I was cramping up just reading your story .. Wow , you really did conquer the mountain and went on . ^5! x 10 for your tenacity .

I have a road in front of my house that is 1/2 mile to descend then turn around and head back up (Pic) ,, I do this hill several times a week as a part of my preparation, for Sept this year ,with my backpack /poles .. I just hope its enough , after reading your story I think I need to step it up some .

83742.jpg
 
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To anybody still worried about the climb to Orisson and beyond, ie the Napoleon way... I'll throw my 2penny piece, for what it's worth... If it helps someone...
I was 57 or 58 (don't do ages) when I started my first camino, VERY worried as I had no idea whether I could hack it. I wasn't an experienced walker, hadn't had time to do much practice walks and I was a smoker! So I booked at Orrisson. In the end, i arrived so early that I cancelled the booking and went on as I had already made friends who were telling me 'don't leave us'....
I must say there were times when I thought - during that initial climb to Orrisson - that I might die, that my heart would stop beating... It didn't worry me unduly because...what a great way to go! I don't even know how much water I carried, probably the 750ml bottle I started with. I refilled on the way, this was July and very hot.

The key is to stop whenever you need it, it isn't a race, I made so many friends going up, we picked blueberries, we laughed and talked. I was very slow but made it and more importantly, enjoyed it. (Well, I hadn't died! And it doesn't get worse after Orrison ).

The friends who were urging me not to leave them were waiting for me at the top, fearing I had got lost... They were surprised to see me arrive cool as a cucumber!

Now the descent. I wanted to go the easy way but somehow went wrong and went through the woods, the steep way. I loved it! I arrived at Roncesvalles in one piece , happy and elated.

Now my second camino. I was much fitter as I had walked all year, it wasn't difficult. Tiring yes, but not difficult. Oh and I wasn't a smoker then , wow the difference!
So if you are younger and fitter than I was the 1st time, no probs. The descent, on the other hand, for some reason I found went on for ever, and I didn't enjoy it. At all. Go figure.

But please don't panic at the idea of doing this leg of the journey, as long as the weather is good. Take your time. Do it your way, one step at a time. You'll get there. And remember not to carry too much.

Buen camino
 
This was taken the day I crossed from SJPDP to Roncesvalles 27 May 2011. I sincerely have never walked more than 5 miles in my life. I am a runner and that may had helped, but still.... DSC03878.JPG
 
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I think a big factor seems to be the weather. Walking in hot weather is tough. July and August will be very warm. Other side months could also be very warm depending on how the year turns out. For me the hot weather is very tough and I am only a young lad. I just sweat a lot and I find that very uncomfortable. I would much prefer cooler weather as you can wrap up and as you walk you generate a bit of heat. So picking the right time of year to walk is important. As others have said get a few practice walks in and it should make a big difference. We are stopping at Orisson for our first night. My wife would not have done a huge amount of walking and so I feel this will help to break us in to the walk. If any small issues come up on that first stretch we will not have to walk too far to sort them out.
 
The focus is on reducing the risk of failure through being well prepared. 2nd ed.
Hi Amybell,

2 years ago I made it to Roncesvalles in 10 hours.

It was tough but the good part is after the first day every day was a piece of cake because the toughest part was over :)

Some days I managed to walk 40 kilometers and arrived Compostela at 29th day.

Good luck and buen camino !!!
 
I am starting the Camino on 22nd May. Up untill now I have felt quite positive about my ability to be able to walk over the pyrenees, untill I read and I quote ' It is brutal, harsh and at times death would seem a better option'!!!!!!!!!!! Please someone tell me its not that bad!!!! or indeed if it is that bad then equally please tell me !!! thankyou
Hi there!
Well, to be honest with you- having passed the Pyrenees in June this year (19th), my friend and I swore never to do it again... I know I probably will, but that day was awful. The rain started as son as we left Saint Jean, and stopped five minutes before Roncesvalles... It was quite windy as well. We knew it was going to be challenging, but not THAT much. Some advice: bring water, FOOD and something to sit on ( a plastic bag will do!). And do this regardless of weather!
A few weeks later we did the steep climb to O'Cebreiro, and many pilgrims had told us that it would be a lot worse than the first day. But in our opinion, with the rainy climb in a very vivid memory, that climb was nothing compared to the Pyrenees! And as for the magnificent view? We saw...fog. But I will be back!
 
After the climb to Orrison, what's the second toughest climb?

Karl
A mentally strenuous day is the ascent to O´Cebreiro. On my ascent, I had showers of rain coming down in May, going up in what seemed like an endless winding staircase that 20 lorries had dumped their content of stone rubble down into. I slipped, I cursed but it was so worth it coming into the bright sunligt and the endless view at the top..
But it was a mental hardness I felt, I am sure, so in hindsight it is just a hard bit of trail.
 
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I am starting the Camino on 22nd May. Up untill now I have felt quite positive about my ability to be able to walk over the pyrenees, untill I read and I quote ' It is brutal, harsh and at times death would seem a better option'!!!!!!!!!!! Please someone tell me its not that bad!!!! or indeed if it is that bad then equally please tell me !!! thankyou

No, not so difficult, you just put one foot in front of the other and do it! But don't stress, the going-down part may be difficult if it's raining -take it nice and slow and you will be alright!
 
Well, I hope amybell made it over the Pyrennees OK, as she was last seen setting off in May 2013 :D:rolleyes:
 
Hi all. I am planning on walking the Camino starting in mid June 2016. I am quite an experienced bush walker so I plan to walk SJPP to Roncesvalles on the first day. I will be walking by myself so my query regarding this section of the walk is; How well is the track sign posted? I am guessing it is well marked but no-one seems to have touched on this issue. Maybe that is a good thing because if it were poorly marked I am sure people would be mentioning it.
 
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You would have to make a real effort, or have really ugly weather like dense fog, to achieve that. Buen Camino, SY
 
The focus is on reducing the risk of failure through being well prepared. 2nd ed.
Hi, amybell,

The difficulty of the Pyrenees crossing depends on two things -- your fitness level and the weather. Here are the elevation numbers, as provided a few years ago by Johnnie Walker:

St Jean Pied de Port - Roncesvalles Altitude at departure: 180m/594ft.

On the way Orisson stands at 1095m/3614ft, then further on Col Lepoeder stands at 1430m/4719ft - this is the highest point on this route. There is then the descent to Puerto de Ibaneta and Roncesvalles.

Altitude at arrival: 920m/3036ft.

The toughest part is from St. Jean to Orisson because of the short distance -- 3100 feet elevation gain over about 8 miles.

So you can see that the total elevation gain is 4100 feet or about 1300 meters. If you compare that to walks/hikes you've taken you can get some idea about whether it's in your range or not.

Good luck and buen camino. Laurie
Thanks Peregrina. It's easier to visualize a elevation gain of 3100 feet in 8 miles than to visualize "a death march" . :)

Buen Camino

Happy Trails
 
Again, this was not my experience walking in early spring, particularly on the Mesata where several fonts were dry, including those in some villages. By the time I got to Leon, I had stopped relying on fonts being available, and made sure that I filled up more regularly when I stopped for a coffee or snack.

I got caught out a few times with dry fonts. I would treat fonts as a bonus, and not rely on them...
 
I applaud recently-posted challenges to the arrogant legion of "aquatheists" who never tire of dictating water requirements, often with warnings about dire consequences of not guzzling the stuff. People ARE different. I, for instance, am a camel: I have done the CF twice, every step from St. Jean to Santiago, and have NEVER carried ANY water. It's heavy, whether in containers or the belly. I do drink coffee and carry wine, which should always be bought by the bottle and stored in a bladder.
Sorry, dkenagy, I could not disagree with you more - not about the "people are different" - that part is true - sort of. But ALL people require copious amounts of water to survive. To suggest that you don't need to take ANY water is about as sensible as suggesting that new pilgrims walk the Camino barefoot. Not advisable at all, at all. I am an extremely experienced hiker, and I've seen lots of hikers airlifted out of the damnedest places because they didn't bring water. Never saw anyone more than slightly inconvenienced by the weight of two liters of water.
 
The 2024 Camino guides will be coming out little by little. Here is a collection of the ones that are out so far.
Sorry, dkenagy, I could not disagree with you more - not about the "people are different" - that part is true - sort of. But ALL people require copious amounts of water to survive. To suggest that you don't need to take ANY water is about as sensible as suggesting that new pilgrims walk the Camino barefoot. Not advisable at all, at all. I am an extremely experienced hiker, and I've seen lots of hikers airlifted out of the damnedest places because they didn't bring water. Never saw anyone more than slightly inconvenienced by the weight of two liters of water.

Very sensible comment!

Yes we all seem to require differing amounts of water. I carried at least a litre most of the time. On some sections where villages and fonts were far apart, I carried up to 2.5 litres. Next time where villages are more frequent I might carry less. But with less than a litre I feel vunerable. What if the next font is not working, or there is no shop open in the village. Or no shop at all. It happens.

Surely the best guide is to 'watch your pee'!

I was always taught when hiking that if you have not pee'd in the last 4 hours you are probably dehydrating..... I've always found that reliable advice.

Also get in the habit of watching your pee colour. (The best guide) There are colour charts on the internet. Dark yellow, you are already dehydrated. Clear, you are fine. Mid yellow, drink some water.

I ran low on water a couple of times and it's not pleasant. You tire quickly, get muscle cramps, Achilles tendons hurt (mine were damaged anyway)

If you have ever worked on industrial sites in warm climates, they drum this into their staff all the time! They even have pee colour charts posted up in the toilets!

Of course time of year and heat levels make a big difference.
 
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I applaud recently-posted challenges to the arrogant legion of "aquatheists" who never tire of dictating water requirements, often with warnings about dire consequences of not guzzling the stuff. People ARE different. I, for instance, am a camel: I have done the CF twice, every step from St. Jean to Santiago, and have NEVER carried ANY water. It's heavy, whether in containers or the belly. I do drink coffee and carry wine, which should always be bought by the bottle and stored in a bladder.
Wow, I'm really jealous. I would be at the complete opposite end of the spectrum.
 
I am starting the Camino on 22nd May. Up untill now I have felt quite positive about my ability to be able to walk over the pyrenees, untill I read and I quote ' It is brutal, harsh and at times death would seem a better option'!!!!!!!!!!! Please someone tell me its not that bad!!!! or indeed if it is that bad then equally please tell me !!! thankyou

buen camino Amybell, my wife and I just returned home from the Camino France's. If I may, I'd like to give you what I believe to be very good advise and also hopefully answer your question.

the Pyrenees from SJPP to the albergue at Roncsavalles is not a high mountain hike. I could be bias though, I live at 6600 ft in the rocky mountains. It is however a walk over a grassy pastoral mountain road/trail rising to about 4500 ft. and then down the other side. Many younger people walk it in one day but my wife and I did not, we overnighted in Orisson (reservations required and highly recommended) on night one and then finished Orisson to Roncsavalles the next day. A word of caution is prudent at this point. We left Orisson on a beautiful sunny morning along with many other pilgrims. By noon we were walking in 60 mph winds. Maybe the scariest and hardest thing I have ever done. We just happened to catch the remnants of the coastal tropical storm Henry as it blew its way inland. It took us 10 hrs to get to Roncesavalles.

Here is my best advise for a person not used to 500 mile thru trek pilgrimages.

- Pack as light as you can. two changes of cloths, toiletries, jackets and poncho, one pair of shoes. you can buy anything else on the Way.
- Drink a minimum of 2 liters of water per day.
- Start out walking as if you are a retiree and finish like a collage grad. START SLOW. the first two weeks we only walked 5-8 miles per day.
- We both walked 500 miles in Keen walking sandals with an enlarged toe box and one size larger than our normal shoe size. We each had two pairs of Wright socks, double lined, ankle high. We never had warm spot or blisters, none.
-We used the Briery Guide (i can recommend it) for his albergue information and the trail pictorial and optional ways. DO NOT WALK THE DISTANCES HE SUGGESTS. Only pain will result from that. He only suggests the distances between overnight stopping points if you want to complete your pilgrimage in 33 days. If you have time, please stretch it out, we took 45 days.

I hope this helps....
 
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Well, it's not that bad after all. The problem with mountains, however, is that the weather is unpredictable. Sometimes even by locals. The best advice is to get knowledgable information on the conditions once you are in SJPP. The locals are used to the circumstances, assessing the conditions of ..... the pilgrims ( :p ) and suggesting the best ways to cope for the individual with the crossing to Roncesvalles. Don't be pessimistic, but be prepared to sit out possible adverse weather.
Ultreya! :)

End of the day comment, everyone does it. its not that hard. Mind the weather, take water, pack a lunch to enjoy during a break and while viewing the great views. You'll do just fine. Yahoo....your getting ready.
 
I know for my first experience I used Briery Guide, Could have nearly Killed me, I set out march 2015
I left from florida march ,arrived in spain march 2nd was not able to sleep due to a screaming child the whole flight LOL, time I arrived in Saint jean it was 8pm Could not sleep people were snoring over my better judgment I set out with the group that was there.

As I was very tired but pumped up at the same time I forgot to fill up my water in the next town error of judgment on my part, when I walk I drink a lot no matter what other people say I know my body, I used to be in the army so I should have known better. as for me not knowing exactly how far the next water source was made it psychologically difficult when seeing I was down to my last sip of water and that took its toll taking into account out of water,tired, jamming this first day into one shot was a recipe for disaster I went down so I filled my water bottle with snow so to melt it and drink it in a panic less then 2.6 km from Roncesvalles {not knowing that's how close I was} , a local gave me some water just before emergency arrived and drove me the last few km.

I felt defeated and had thoughts of going home the 2nd day the group from the first day all took off leaving me in the dust as I could see them looking back at me when all I wanted was someone to walk with me as I was unsure of myself after what could have been a near death experience the day before. lest just say when I got to Pamplona toured the city got my own hotel seen the sights as a morale booster things started looking up and was a great experience. from Pamplona On I carried two 1 liter bottles with me I was not taking a chance to repeat day 1 again. once I was the last 50 km I ditched the 2nd bottle I was pretty sure I would be ok



I pretty much walked by myself minus a few days did what I could to help others, I left bottles of wine before I left for pilgrims who would come the next day, even left euros and told where I stay if someone walks in dog tired this is for them.

I reached Santiago and im planning 2016's camino now I know what mistakes not to make but we know the camino will throw you a curve ball
 
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The first time I went over I was totally unprepared. When I got to the top and was finally able to breathe normally about 3 in the afternoon, I started the way down throught the woods which is a living hell for someone who hadn't walked great distances up or down mountains like me. The next day I walked with some other pilgrims and we compared the first 27km to an allegory about life. You spend your life pushing and pushing yourself up a hill which at times is steep and at times seemingly level, then when you reach the top "of your career/life" you learn after accomplishing that feat that you still face difficulties in your life; i.e. it's not an easy, breezy glide going downhill after succeeding retirement. Take heart, I almost gave up on the first day climbing that first few kilometer after leaving St. Jean Pied de Port, it's a killer so don't let it get you down. Savor every kilometer of the Camino and the pilgrims you meet along your route. Buen Camino!
is the route Napoleon on paved road? gravel? rocky?
 
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I would not describe it as rocky. Paved road, then dirt tracks, on the steep descent covered in slippery beach leaves - although one can choose the slightly longer less slippery road.
 
I would not describe it as rocky. Paved road, then dirt tracks, on the steep descent covered in slippery beach leaves - although one can choose the slightly longer less slippery road.

I took that road on my 3rd camino as it had been raining (instead of the descent through the woods). It was lovely! Don't hesitate to choose it, even though it is supposed to be slightly longer, you don't notice it. :)
 
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