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Man arrested for triple homicide while walking Camino !!!

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Bob from L.A. !

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Camino Francis 2012, 2014, 2016. Camino Norte 2018. Many more to come in my future God willing !
Reading through several of my international news feeds I found a story dated July 16, 2021 in several news outlets regarding a man, who was walking a camino near Palenscia has been arrested for a triple homicide.
The story related the 53 year old Spanish citizen of Argentine origin was wanted for a triple homicide which had occurred in Rio de Janeiro Brazil several years ago. The news article stated he was only identified due to the Provincial Citizen Security Brigade, detected his identity when he entered and stayed a night in a hostel. (Apparently this law enforcement entity checks the names of individuals staying in hostels for wants/warrants via Interpol police).
The story, which did not identify the male by name, said the male was located while walking the camino, was detained and taken into custody until he could be positively identified via an Interpol "Red" notice.

I guess we never really know who we are walking next to sometimes. Let's be careful out there!
 
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dick bird

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Plata, Ingles, Madrid, Norte, Primitivo, Invierno, Aragones, Olvidado, Chemin D'Arles
Any establishment in Spain that provides overnight accommodation must register the identity of every guest using their ID (Passport or DNI). It is a really big deal and explains why hospitaleros have to be, and are, absolutely meticulous about checking everyone's ID. It might seem like bureaucracy/police state but it is what they do, and the law is definitely enforced.
 

nathanael

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Frances, Norte, Plata,
Reading through several of my international news feeds I found a story dated July 16, 2021 in several news outlets regarding a man, who was walking a camino near Palenscia has been arrested for a triple homicide.
The story related the 53 year old Spanish citizen of Argentine origin was wanted for a triple homicide which had occurred in Rio de Janeiro Brazil several years ago. The news article stated he was only identified due to the Provincial Citizen Security Brigade, detected his identity when he entered and stayed a night in a hostel. (Apparently this law enforcement entity checks the names of individuals staying in hostels for wants/warrants via Interpol police).
The story, which did not identify the male by name, said the male was located while walking the camino, was detained and taken into custody until he could be positively identified via an Interpol "Red" notice.

I guess we never really know who we are walking next to sometimes. Let's be careful out there!
good grief
 
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MinaKamina

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Developing story:

The man of Spanish nationality of Argentinean origin wanted by Interpol, accused of a triple homicide in Brazil in 2004, who was arrested in Palencia on Thursday morning, has been released. The accused of the triple homicide, whose passport has been withdrawn so that he cannot leave Spain, is obliged to appear before the courts every seven days, as decreed by the Court of Palencia, to whose disposition he passed on Thursday after being arrested by the National Police in a hotel in Palencia. The man, aged 53, was in the company of a woman when he checked into the hostel and was arrested.

https://www.burgosconecta.es/castil...717093346-nt.html?ref=https://www.google.com/

IMO this is unusual, to say the least. Not often a suspected murderer is released on these minimal conditions, let alone a suspected triple murderer.

from the article that @SabineP posted:

Sources at the police station told this newspaper that the arrest took place without any problems, as the detainee identified himself fully and did not oppose any kind of impediment. In fact, he was incredulous about the fact that he was wanted for such a serious crime of which he is accused by the Carioca authorities.

Here is the article.


The homicide took place in 2004.


Let's wait and see.... :rolleyes:
 

Marbe2

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2015-2019 walked all or more than half of CF 7 times... CP recently cancelled by Covid 19!
Reading through several of my international news feeds I found a story dated July 16, 2021 in several news outlets regarding a man, who was walking a camino near Palenscia has been arrested for a triple homicide.
The story related the 53 year old Spanish citizen of Argentine origin was wanted for a triple homicide which had occurred in Rio de Janeiro Brazil several years ago. The news article stated he was only identified due to the Provincial Citizen Security Brigade, detected his identity when he entered and stayed a night in a hostel. (Apparently this law enforcement entity checks the names of individuals staying in hostels for wants/warrants via Interpol police).
The story, which did not identify the male by name, said the male was located while walking the camino, was detained and taken into custody until he could be positively identified via an Interpol "Red" notice.

I guess we never really know who we are walking next to sometimes. Let's be careful out there!

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Let's Be Careful Out There: The Legacy Of 'Hill Street Blues'​

 

t2andreo

Veteran Member
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2022
I think it is important to note for all our readers, members or not, that this fellow was arrested according to a Red Notice issued by Interpol. This means that another country wanted this person for serious crimes committed on that country's territory. The crimes WERE NOT committed in Spain or on the Camino. The wanted person appeared to be laying low while on the Camino.

Having established that very salient point, please allow me to point out that, historically, persons wanted by the authorities for one thing or another have 'hidden out' on the Camino for hundreds of years. In fact, I have met several 'pilgrims' who claimed to be living on the Camino for more than ten years. It is not uncommon - even without the issue of a pending criminal charge.

The reasons are as varied as the people you encounter. Some are running from bad relationships, to heal from a broken relationship, for some curative purpose - seeking a miracle, to honor a vow, or for no reason at all - they love the itinerant lifestyle. Then again, there are some folks who do seek to "hide out" on the Camino.

As a point in passing, this is also why you have to present your passport or national ID card at check-in to your accommodations each evening. These registers are made available to the Policia Nacional. I do not know if they have the ability to "run" every person every night at every location. But, this registry information DOES give them the capability to know who is where and when. So, hiding out on the Camino is difficult unless you camp out a lot and try to stay in places that do not record ID information - like home stays.

IIRC, long ago, some European judges or nobles dispensing justice in some countries even imposed doing a Camino as an alternative to imposing a severe penalty for some local infraction. Unless and until you could prove you accomplished the Camino, you could not return home.

I think I got all the historical stuff correct. Feel free to offer elaboration or charitable correction.

I hope this helps.

Tom
 
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Marc S.

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I think it is important to note for all our readers, members or not, that this fellow was arrested according to a Red Notice issued by Interpol. This means that another country wanted this person for serious crimes committed on that country's territory. The crimes WERE NOT committed in Spain or on the Camino.

The OP already made clear that the arrest was connected with a crime committed in Brazil some years ago.

The wanted person appeared to be laying low while on the Camino.

It is not clear to me how you arrive at this conclusion. I do not see any evidence of this in any of the news articles published. But if you have a source, please let us know.

Having established that very salient point, please allow me to point out that, historically, persons wanted by the authorities for one thing or another have 'hidden out' on the Camino for hundreds of years.

Interesting point. But I have not read any evidence that this person has been hiding out on the camino for years and years. But if you have a source, please let us know.

Let's not jump to conclusions on no evidence.

Could not agree more.
 
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Deleted member 61803

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UK Hotels and bnbs must also keep a register available to the police at all times, which includes overseas passport details. From my personal experience the same is true of all EU countries also.
 

MarkyD

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Year of past OR future Camino
Camino Francés 31/08/2018 - 20/10/2018
Reading through several of my international news feeds I found a story dated July 16, 2021 in several news outlets regarding a man, who was walking a camino near Palenscia has been arrested for a triple homicide.
The story related the 53 year old Spanish citizen of Argentine origin was wanted for a triple homicide which had occurred in Rio de Janeiro Brazil several years ago. The news article stated he was only identified due to the Provincial Citizen Security Brigade, detected his identity when he entered and stayed a night in a hostel. (Apparently this law enforcement entity checks the names of individuals staying in hostels for wants/warrants via Interpol police).
The story, which did not identify the male by name, said the male was located while walking the camino, was detained and taken into custody until he could be positively identified via an Interpol "Red" notice.

I guess we never really know who we are walking next to sometimes. Let's be careful out there!
Let's face it, the Camino network is a great way to stay off the radar to escape something or someone, at least to buy time for a couple of months or years even.
On my first Camino I shared a room with a guy who clearly seemed different to other pilgrims. We were at the albergue the other side of the bridge of Puente de Reina. On striking up a conversation with him, and politely declining his offer of liquor in a flask, he told me he was wanted by the Mafia and had to go "undercover" on the Camino. He was of East European origin, Bulgarian I think he said. He said he had spent time in prison in the UK too.
Whether his story was true or not, I will never know. He got up early the next day, first out of the door. I bumped into him a couple of days later in Viana, but after that I never saw him again. He seemed genuinely lonely, and despite his bravado I sensed a troubled soul. I hope he managed to sort himself out.
 
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Year of past OR future Camino
September 2019: first Camino, can only do partial this year due to recent knee replacement
Reading through several of my international news feeds I found a story dated July 16, 2021 in several news outlets regarding a man, who was walking a camino near Palenscia has been arrested for a triple homicide.
The story related the 53 year old Spanish citizen of Argentine origin was wanted for a triple homicide which had occurred in Rio de Janeiro Brazil several years ago. The news article stated he was only identified due to the Provincial Citizen Security Brigade, detected his identity when he entered and stayed a night in a hostel. (Apparently this law enforcement entity checks the names of individuals staying in hostels for wants/warrants via Interpol police).
The story, which did not identify the male by name, said the male was located while walking the camino, was detained and taken into custody until he could be positively identified via an Interpol "Red" notice.

I guess we never really know who we are walking next to sometimes. Let's be careful out there!
Maybe he was using the Camino as penance, as they did back in the Middle Ages.
 
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kitepuppet

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The jail at the western end of Sarria. I think I remember reading a plaque nearby that stated that various bad sorts would hide out on the Camino, or use it a source of victims and would end up here. 'Twas ever thus!
 

LTfit

Veteran Member
Any establishment in Spain that provides overnight accommodation must register the identity of every guest using their ID (Passport or DNI). It is a really big deal and explains why hospitaleros have to be, and are, absolutely meticulous about checking everyone's ID. It might seem like bureaucracy/police state but it is what they do, and the law is definitely enforced.
We hospitaler@s not only have to register the name, ID number and birthdate of all pilgrims but also need to supply this information digitally to the local Guardia Civil on a daily basis.
 

Albertagirl

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Frances (2015); Aragones-Frances (2016); VdlP-Sanabres (2017); Madrid-Frances-Invierno (2019)Levante
We hospitaler@s not only have to register the name, ID number and birthdate of all pilgrims but also need to supply this information digitally to the local Guardia Civil on a daily basis.
Is this also the case in the donativos? I never did so when I volunteered in one in 2019, although the senior member of our group of volunteers may have done so without my knowing. I shall be volunteering again in the same albergue in November and given the prospective work load I cannot see that this could be possible, with half the volunteers that we had last time and the other volunteer perhaps not knowing about it either. We did keep records.
 

LTfit

Veteran Member
Is this also the case in the donativos? I never did so when I volunteered in one in 2019, although the senior member of our group of volunteers may have done so without my knowing. I shall be volunteering again in the same albergue in November and given the prospective work load I cannot see that this could be possible, with half the volunteers that we had last time and the other volunteer perhaps not knowing about it either. We did keep records.
I never had to do this when volunteering in donativos for HOSVOL but I understand that in some it is now required.

My experience in filling out the digital forms was when I had Albergue Villares de Orbigo which is a private albergue.
 
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No problem, if you have nothing to hide @Jimnorth
I agree completely. I usually carry a laminated copy of the important passport page which I hand to the receptionist, I have never been asked for my passport per se. ( on the back of that page I have a copy of my prescriptions and details about my heart devices).
 

RJM

Veteran Member
Year of past OR future Camino
A few times
View attachment 105142

The jail at the western end of Sarria. I think I remember reading a plaque nearby that stated that various bad sorts would hide out on the Camino, or use it a source of victims and would end up here. 'Twas ever thus!
Is that a working prison? Still being used?
 

Marc S.

Active Member
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Since 2012: CF, CdN, CP, Salvador, Aragones, Via Regia, Elisabethpfad, Jakobsweg NRW, Jakibspaad.
Maybe....have you contacted him yet to assist in his bond/bail? lol

Not sure if I understand your comment or perhaps we just do not share the same sense of humour.

Anyway, let' stick to the facts. This is what Interpol says about Red Notices :

Red Notices are issued for fugitives wanted either for prosecution or to serve a sentence. This follows judicial proceedings in the country issuing the request. This is not always the home country of the individual, but the country where the crime was committed. When a person is sought for prosecution, they have not been convicted and should be considered innocent until proven guilty. A person sought to serve a sentence means they have been found guilty by a court in the issuing country.
 
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gmag

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The day before this arrest, an Argentine pilgrim was in our albergue, who said he wanted to go to see Palencia.
He has to be the same, possibly he took the morning train to go from Frómista to Palencia, it is the only town on the Camino connected to Palencia, apart from León.
My pilgrim was the same age. He was a very correct man, educated, with a very pleasant face, very clean appearance, who spoke with others, went out for a walk, led a totally normal life.
Until he is tried and convicted he is innocent. And I would not be surprised if he is as he says, innocent. In any case, in our albergue everyone is checked in and any strange behavior is observed. Of course.
He is not the first person to have been to our albergue and is arrested the next day. It happened months ago with a Frenchman, I think he was not properly controlled in the previous albergues. This was a strange man, I was not surprised by his arrest.
 

Lurch

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looking at 2018-2019
He may be innocent until proven guilty, but if he is extradited back to Brazil, the odds are he will be seeing the inside of a jail cell until his trial is concluded.
 
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ISABEL linares

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camino frances,camino del norte,camino frances
Reading through several of my international news feeds I found a story dated July 16, 2021 in several news outlets regarding a man, who was walking a camino near Palenscia has been arrested for a triple homicide.
The story related the 53 year old Spanish citizen of Argentine origin was wanted for a triple homicide which had occurred in Rio de Janeiro Brazil several years ago. The news article stated he was only identified due to the Provincial Citizen Security Brigade, detected his identity when he entered and stayed a night in a hostel. (Apparently this law enforcement entity checks the names of individuals staying in hostels for wants/warrants via Interpol police).
The story, which did not identify the male by name, said the male was located while walking the camino, was detained and taken into custody until he could be positively identified via an Interpol "Red" notice.

I guess we never really know who we are walking next to sometimes. Let's be careful out there!
An Agatha Christie novel.
 

Glamgrrl

Active Member
Year of past OR future Camino
Travel318
I agree completely. I usually carry a laminated copy of the important passport page which I hand to the receptionist, I have never been asked for my passport per se. ( on the back of that page I have a copy of my prescriptions and details about my heart devices).
Hmmm - so you e never stayed in places where they have a matching to scan your passport? I wonder if a laminated page would work.
 

RJM

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A few times
Well, without a doubt the Camino is a slightly safer place without an accused multiple murderer on it.
 
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Hmmm - so you e never stayed in places where they have a matching to scan your passport? I wonder if a laminated page would work.
Only scanned at airports and ferry terminals, used actual passport for that.

Albergues and Pensiones tend not to have that level of technology.
 

Mark L

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Done : Le Puy to SJPdP in 2020.
Planned : Saint Jean to Santiago in 2021
Reading through several of my international news feeds I found a story dated July 16, 2021 in several news outlets regarding a man, who was walking a camino near Palenscia has been arrested for a triple homicide.
The story related the 53 year old Spanish citizen of Argentine origin was wanted for a triple homicide which had occurred in Rio de Janeiro Brazil several years ago. The news article stated he was only identified due to the Provincial Citizen Security Brigade, detected his identity when he entered and stayed a night in a hostel. (Apparently this law enforcement entity checks the names of individuals staying in hostels for wants/warrants via Interpol police).
The story, which did not identify the male by name, said the male was located while walking the camino, was detained and taken into custody until he could be positively identified via an Interpol "Red" notice.

I guess we never really know who we are walking next to sometimes. Let's be careful out there!
Tbh if you read the rest of this thread …maybe he did something, maybe not

frankly either way it isn’t material to your day to day security …. Don’t wait for a “tripple killer” arrest before you consider not giving security s thought

keep documents and obviously cash plus phones, gadgets etc on you at all times …take a fold out backpack which is easy to carry and lève nothing unless loxked up.

form alliances but not if those could make you culner

Welcome to the World
 

dick bird

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Plata, Ingles, Madrid, Norte, Primitivo, Invierno, Aragones, Olvidado, Chemin D'Arles
I think it is important to note for all our readers, members or not, that this fellow was arrested according to a Red Notice issued by Interpol. This means that another country wanted this person for serious crimes committed on that country's territory. The crimes WERE NOT committed in Spain or on the Camino. The wanted person appeared to be laying low while on the Camino.

Having established that very salient point, please allow me to point out that, historically, persons wanted by the authorities for one thing or another have 'hidden out' on the Camino for hundreds of years. In fact, I have met several 'pilgrims' who claimed to be living on the Camino for more than ten years. It is not uncommon - even without the issue of a pending criminal charge.

The reasons are as varied as the people you encounter. Some are running from bad relationships, to heal from a broken relationship, for some curative purpose - seeking a miracle, to honor a vow, or for no reason at all - they love the itinerant lifestyle. Then again, there are some folks who do seek to "hide out" on the Camino.

As a point in passing, this is also why you have to present your passport or national ID card at check-in to your accommodations each evening. These registers are made available to the Policia Nacional. I do not know if they have the ability to "run" every person every night at every location. But, this registry information DOES give them the capability to know who is where and when. So, hiding out on the Camino is difficult unless you camp out a lot and try to stay in places that do not record ID information - like home stays.

IIRC, long ago, some European judges or nobles dispensing justice in some countries even imposed doing a Camino as an alternative to imposing a severe penalty for some local infraction. Unless and until you could prove you accomplished the Camino, you could not return home.

I think I got all the historical stuff correct. Feel free to offer elaboration or charitable correction.

I hope this helps.

Tom
Historically correct - they were known as 'picaros' and in the Middle Ages became increasingly common as various political and economic upheavals impoverished or dispossessed rural folk and many of them took advantage of the free accommodation offered by monasteries and hospedajes.

From having done a couple of stints as a hospi I can confirm that there are some homeless or marginalised people who more or less live on the camino, but the vast majority (and all the ones we saw) are completely harmless.

The local police don't check the register every day (they don't have the resources), but they do check them on a regular basis if only to make sure it is being done, and would occasionally spot wanted names, especially if they are looking for a specific person.
 
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Well, without a doubt the Camino is a slightly safer place without an accused multiple murderer on it.
Without a doubt the camino is a relatively safe space in this fraught world.

The person in question? Even to say he was 'lying low' is to assume guilt. He was walking a camino. Period.

Anybody can be accused of anything.
Even you, @RJM. So if someone accuses you of multiple murders, is the camino a safer place because you aren't there? ;)
 
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Albertagirl

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This man was arrested because there was an Interpol Red Notice out for his arrest. Not because "Anybody" accused him of "anything." Interpol is not "anybody" and procedures must be gone through in order to get it to issue the Red Notice. The man has not yet been tried, so his guilt or innocence have yet to be determined, we hope by a fair trial, but this was not a casual arrest.
 

RobertS26

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The OP already made clear that the arrest was connected with a crime committed in Brazil some years ago.

Actually, the OP did not make that clear until 61 words into the post. A much better opening line would have been, "A man wanted for an old 2004 triple homicide in Brazil was arrested in Spain while walking the Camino two weeks ago."

Of course, that would be no where sensational as the original. But, it does prevent those who skim headlines and articles from accidently coming away with the wrong impression.

There are enough people out there who are already convinced that the Camino is one long, lawless, take your own life into your hands, walk. We should do everything possible not to accidently feed those grossly inaccurate misconceptions.
 

Albertagirl

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How "old" does a triple homicide have to be in order to not be sensational? If it happened, three people were murdered by someone. I would prefer not to share an albergue dormitory with a person accused of such a crime, until after it had been tried or the charge dropped.
 

RobertS26

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How "old" does a triple homicide have to be in order to not be sensational? If it happened, three people were murdered by someone. I would prefer not to share an albergue dormitory with a person accused of such a crime, until after it had been tried or the charge dropped.

If the homicides were days, or weeks old, the person sought may be still be in a frenzy. When a triple homicide is seventeen years old, it can hardly be claimed that they are scared of being caught. In fact, it appears that they felt safe enough to go on vacation.

Sadly, as a former prosecutor and a criminal defense attorney, I have learned a lot about the criminal mind.
 

RJM

Veteran Member
Year of past OR future Camino
A few times
Actually, the OP did not make that clear until 61 words into the post. A much better opening line would have been, "A man wanted for an old 2004 triple homicide in Brazil was arrested in Spain while walking the Camino two weeks ago."

Of course, that would be no where sensational as the original. But, it does prevent those who skim headlines and articles from accidently coming away with the wrong impression.

There are enough people out there who are already convinced that the Camino is one long, lawless, take your own life into your hands, walk. We should do everything possible not to accidently feed those grossly inaccurate misconceptions.
Is there a difference between an old triple murder and a new one? lol
I suppose to the victims there is no longer any sense of time in the afterlife, but I suppose to their families 2004 is like yesterday.
 
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RobertS26

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Is there a difference between an old triple murder and a new one? lol
I suppose to the victims there is no longer any sense of time in the afterlife, but I suppose to their families 2004 is like yesterday.

Yes, there is a difference. A person who just committed a triple homicide is usually in a frenzy. They are often willing to kill again to avoid capture. They steal cars and take hostages. In other words, they are extremely dangerous to others.

On the other hand, someone who has been walking free for seventeen years is well over that frenzy. They pose little if any risk to other around them.

If you are criminal defense attorney/former prosecutor like me, you understand this important distinction.

["LOL"]
 

RJM

Veteran Member
Year of past OR future Camino
A few times
Yes, there is a difference. A person who just committed a triple homicide is usually in a frenzy. They are often willing to kill again to avoid capture. They steal cars and take hostages. In other words, they are extremely dangerous to others.

On the other hand, someone who has been walking free for seventeen years is well over that frenzy. They pose little if any risk to other around them.

If you are criminal defense attorney/former prosecutor like me, you understand this important distinction.

["LOL"]
Spoken like a true defense attorney, lol.
I am a tad bit familiar with the criminal mind having been one of the guys who gave you customers for over seventeen years. ;)
 
Year of past OR future Camino
2019
This man was arrested because there was an Interpol Red Notice out for his arrest. Not because "Anybody" accused him of "anything." Interpol is not "anybody" and procedures must be gone through in order to get it to issue the Red Notice.
You're right @Albertagirl. Interpol is not 'anybody.'
But an IRN depends on judicial proceedings. Which have been known to (more than occasionally) convict innocent people - and certainly have been used to disable political enemies.
Somehow I can't get excited by the scaremongering.
Who knows?
 
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