Mis-use yellow arrows

[Nanc]

I am deeply indebted to which ever groups mark the Way with yellow arrows. They were life savers on my Camino.

But a disturbing trend is happening that I would like to know if we can change. It was mildly hard for this newbie to accept and adjust to albergues using formal blue signs with scallops and arrows. They eventualky became identifiable by their size and location. (But it still bugged me)
But many time in towns, albergues are using strong yellow arrow on the street, walls and side walks. These can be indescernible from true Camino marking. Some intersections have become a mess of yellow markings. It's confusing, misleading and wastes time.
I appreciated some towns that blacked out the arrow head or arrow all together .


Could there be anyway to require albergues to use another color? Some areas seem to use blue for bike tours or Camino so what about orange or peach?
Can any organization have a wide spread impact to control this mess?

Any while we're at it, get more arrows on the way out of Ponferado?
Nanc

 

[Deleted member 36903]

Any while we're at it, get more arrows on the way out of Ponferado?
Nanc

I second that Nanc, I think that I went in every direction but the correct one in trying to leave town, even though local people pointed me in the right direction, my gut instincts just couldn't accept it.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

the main place I recall a lot of scratched out and repainted yellow arrows was where the road split enroute to Astorga into the 'old' road route and 'new' more scenic one...seemed to be a war of the albergues going on...for me the most confusing spot getting out of town was Santander (and to the albergue oviedo)...luckily I always stumbled over a nice local in the know (even if it took over an hour in oviedo).
edit: although getting lost in Santander seems to be part of walking the Norte so I don't know that it should be changed

 

[alexwalker]

Could there be anyway to require albergues to use another color? Some areas seem to use blue for bike tours or Camino so what about orange or peach?

Peach is a fruit, not a color. Orange too, when I come to think of it.

Seriously though, this is a problem in some places, it irritates me that we are sometimes mislead, and I wish the albergues could use another color like white, and also paint "Albergue" or "Bar" besides a white arrow. I guess it is "smart" marketing... But surely, you learnt enough Spanish during your first walk to understand answers when you asked for directions to the Camino?

Any while we're at it, get more arrows on the way out of Ponferado?Nanc

The exit from Ponferrada is quite well marked, IMHO. Did you enjoy the Knights Templar Castle there?

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Having different colours would defeat the purpose: to con people into walking by their business. Location, location, location. I find that is when a guide comes in handy: when arrows point in a different direction than the guide mentions a red flag should go up.

 

[domigee]

The yellow arrows make it much easier, yes, but surely we could manage without???
We have maps (says she who gets lost very easily, but hey, all part of the experience)

 

[alexwalker]

The yellow arrows make it much easier, yes, but surely we could manage without???
We have maps (says she who gets lost very easily, but hey, all part of the experience)

The yeallow arrows are indispensable and should not be tampered with, as Nanc points out. Not all of us want to walk with a smartphone (or paper maps) up our noses.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

the first time I missed my turn was on the top of the Napoleon route, the second was enroute to Markina...walking through the woods my guidebook told me that when i came to two oak?beech? trees (as opposed to the other trees in the forest, of course) turn and I would see the church of the town below. I began to suspect that the logging that was going on in the forest had felled not only those two special trees, but all of the ones bearing yellow arrows...of course, later on the route the guide also told me I would know when to head to the road because I would see an old rusted tractor. then there was the blue bridge, but it had been painted white and was actually closed, meaning a long re-route asking locals and bus drivers to try to find my way...but if these things didn't happen, we'd have no good stories to tell our friends and families.

 

[KinkyOne]

I don't really remember these kind of "arguing" yellow arrows on CF but then again I've walked it completely back in 2011.
Anyway I do remember some fake arrows this year on Camino Ingles soon after Sigueiro on the last leg into Santiago. When you come to the factory Mosquera (the photo is taken as view back) which would be on your right there is a T-junction. One arrow pointing to the right and few meters after that to the left on slightly uphill dirt path while others (with sprayed "Original Camino") are pointing to the left. I didn't really checked my guide but my guts told me that "real/original" Camino wouldn't need special mention of originality sprayed on the tarmac so I turned right. And there I met this local woman and I've asked her about it. She just smiled and kind of nodded like "well, you know,...". Later I again met four Spanish girls that went left (they have stopped at the bar on the "original Camino") and they told me they have walked all the way without any shade. But I've had plenty of it away from busy road towards Santiago


I know some people doesn't have good sense of orientation, but some common sense could be also useful

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

I thought I had some other pictures, where arrows had been repeatedly crossed out, but this one shows each side kept adding more yellow arrows to convince you. The situation you describe may be similar. In this case an alternate route was created and albergues formed on it (or the other way around)...guidebooks mentioned both in 2012...but clearly each side felt the other was draining away profits

the new 'alternate' route here was a bit longer, as were the newer 'alternates' on the Norte...probably because they veered off the main road, which the original Camino had become over the centuries

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Originally, yellow arrows took the pilgrim to the albergue. Then there was more than one albergue, and dueling yellow arrows appeared. I don't think a handful of English-speaking pilgrims is going to change Spain. It is quite likely that the local Camino group in charge of yellow arrows has fully approved multiple yellow arrows that promote their neighbors' commercial interests, particularly if they eventually lead you back to the actual route. One lesson I got from walking was to avoid worrying about the small stuff.

 

[JohnnieWalker]

I don't really remember these kind of "arguing" yellow arrows on CF but then again I've walked it completely back in 2011.
Anyway I do remember some fake arrows this year on Camino Ingles soon after Sigueiro on the last leg into Santiago. When you come to the factory Mosquera (the photo is taken as view back) which would be on your right there is a T-junction. One arrow pointing to the right and few meters after that to the left on slightly uphill dirt path while others (with sprayed "Original Camino") are pointing to the left. I didn't really checked my guide but my guts told me that "real/original" Camino wouldn't need special mention of originality sprayed on the tarmac so I turned right. And there I met this local woman and I've asked her about it. She just smiled and kind of nodded like "well, you know,...". Later I again met four Spanish girls that went left (they have stopped at the bar on the "original Camino") and they told me they have walked all the way without any shade. But I've had plenty of it away from busy road towards Santiago
View attachment 29559

I know some people doesn't have good sense of orientation, but some common sense could be also useful

This little "arrow war" continues at present and the local Amigos and the Xunta are dealing with it. The alleged "original route" is no more than 30 years old and runs alongside the main road which was broadened around that time. The history department of the Xunta have maps showing the existence of wells and springs from several centuries ago in the neighbouring hamlets. The argument is that pilgrims would have used these and so this has justified rerouting a few kilometres of the route away from the highway - the new way is MUCH better. However as has happened also on the Camino Portugues a local hostelry isn't pleased at the changed and is vandalising the new signs. They'll sort it out in time!

 

[Marion-SantiagoInLove]

Can any organization have a wide spread impact to control this mess?

If such thing has ever been true anywhere on Earth.........

 

[domigee]

The yeallow arrows are indispensable and should not be tampered with, as Nanc points out. Not all of us want to walk with a smartphone (or paper maps) up our noses.

I disagree with 'indispensable' but so be it, it's just me. It is the 'should not' that I object to... Yes, indeed, in a perfect (?)world, the yellow arrows take us to destination, without detours, to a 'perfect' albergue, to a 'perfect' meal and no snorers, no 'early risers'... Etc etc
In a 'perfect' countryside, too. No suburbia, no boring bits....

Those people who change the arrows do it because for them it's a matter of staying in business or not. I have every sympathy with them. I curse them at the time (and how! ) but I still understand.

 

[alexwalker]

I disagree with 'indispensable' but so be it, it's just me. It is the 'should not' that I object to... Yes, indeed, in a perfect (?)world, the yellow arrows take us to destination, without detours, to a 'perfect' albergue, to a 'perfect' meal and no snorers, no 'early risers'... Etc etc
In a 'perfect' countryside, too. No suburbia, no boring bits....

Those people who change the arrows do it because for them it's a matter of staying in business or not. I have every sympathy with them. I curse them at the time (and how! ) but I still understand.

You are wrong and do not understand... Sorry, but that's MY opinion.

 

[domigee]

I withdraw from the conversation, as I would do in a real albergue . We don't seem to understand each other, no big deal , doesn't matter in the least.

 

[RobertS26]

Done the wrong way.

 

[RobertS26]

Done the right way.

 

[domigee]

Yeah, that one I like

 

[Anemone del Camino]

You are wrong and do not understand... Sorry, but that's MY opinion.

What are you going on about? Who is wrong and about what?

 

[Markkan]

I noticed the same 'problem' on my first camino this summer. The way I dealt with it was that I made sure I didn't patronize the places that used the yellow arrows as I felt misguided and they were doing it for commercial reasons. So ultimately their commercial strategy worked the opposite for me.

This is similar to when I saw flyers scattered all over the trail in spots for accommodation...I kept a flyer to make sure I didn't stay at the place that littered up the paths.

I am deeply indebted to which ever groups mark the Way with yellow arrows. They were life savers on my Camino.

But a disturbing trend is happening that I would like to know if we can change. It was mildly hard for this newbie to accept and adjust to albergues using formal blue signs with scallops and arrows. They eventualky became identifiable by their size and location. (But it still bugged me)
But many time in towns, albergues are using strong yellow arrow on the street, walls and side walks. These can be indescernible from true Camino marking. Some intersections have become a mess of yellow markings. It's confusing, misleading and wastes time.
I appreciated some towns that blacked out the arrow head or arrow all together .


Could there be anyway to require albergues to use another color? Some areas seem to use blue for bike tours or Camino so what about orange or peach?
Can any organization have a wide spread impact to control this mess?

Any while we're at it, get more arrows on the way out of Ponferado?
Nanc

 

[alexwalker]

Sorry for being maybe too harsh: I just meant that the arrors are necessary, many are sent astray by "double" markings..

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Sorry for being maybe too harsh: I just meant that the arrors are necessary, many are sent astray by "double" markings..

Alex, noone disagrees with you. I think there may have neen a language barrier issue in these emails.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

I noticed the same 'problem' on my first camino this summer. The way I dealt with it was that I made sure I didn't patronize the places that used the yellow arrows as I felt misguided and they were doing it for commercial reasons. So ultimately their commercial strategy worked the opposite for me.

This is similar to when I saw flyers scattered all over the trail in spots for accommodation...I kept a flyer to make sure I didn't stay at the place that littered up the paths.

I do the same thing. One sign or poster fine, but having stikers on all posts or flyers laying around, flying around with the wind, just has me walking the opposite way. I would send the Camino police after these people. You make me walk 50 extra yards just so I end up on your business' doorstep and then have to walk back to the route and I will go without what ever it is I was hoping to get.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

The only time I was upset by the arrow nonsense was when some started putting distances (as in only 12km to...) and the distances were wrong. I think there is enough confusing info about how far it is to someplace without added mis-information from bars/albergues....but after it happened once I knew that i should probably add another 5km at least to any painted estimate of distance
(and before anyone says distances don't matter...I made it a point to use actual toilets while walking, and sometimes that meant titrating fluids near the end of the day)

 

[Rebekah Scott]

No one is in charge of the camino. The yellow arrow is less than 30 years old, and before that it was just "head west!"
Sadly, people hungry for money feel they can re-create the camino to suit their purposes; others re-route pilgrims because conditions really are better along the "newer" way!
At the end of the day, all roads lead to Santiago.

 

[SYates]

No one is in charge of the camino. ...

And that is the beauty of it - Long may it continue! Buen Camino, SY

 

[Tia Valeria]

Surely some common sense can prevail so that there are yellow arrows for direction plus markers to bars with approx distance 'off route'. This was done, for example, when there was a bar at Vizoño on the Camino Inglés and at A Brea to the O Meson on the Francés. Then the pilgrim can choose whether to take a slight detour or not and hopefully the café-bars etc will get sufficient trade as well.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

and really, if you're going to find any common sense applied to this arrow business, it will happen first on the Camino Ingles, with all those sensible, well-organized pilgrims

 

[Tia Valeria]

and really, if you're going to find any common sense applied to this arrow business, it will happen first on the Camino Ingles, with all those sensible, well-organized pilgrims

Aided by @JohnnieWalker - who works so hard on our behalf.

 

[Albertagirl]

Last year, walking out of Leon, I wanted to take the route to Mazarife. I found what seemed like it might be the correct road, but there were no official markings. I asked a local woman, who had no idea where Mazarife was (probably my accent). However, Brierley had commented that there was some sort of local battle of the businesses going on, and there was paint all over the road just short of the correct intersection. I went by this paint war and turned left at the appropriate country road. I would have preferred a sign pointing to Mazarife, but at least this got me there.

 

[sillydoll]

Aided by @JohnnieWalker - who works so hard on our behalf.

Tia - do you remember this corner on the Ingles? Common sense made us go straight ahead!

 

[GRR]

Yes, I walked 8km out of my way one day following one of those hijacked yellow arrows that pointed to an alburgue. I didn't realize it until I got there. And then, the alburgue was closed. I wasn't very happy.

 

[Tia Valeria]

Tia - do you remember this corner on the Ingles? Common sense made us go straight ahead!
View attachment 29651

No, I can't say that I do, but did find one elsewhere that showed a U turn type right turn after a bridge. Johnnie's guide said about a right turn but after a little distance we thought. Common sense suggested KSO and we then found the correct turn OK. The other we suspected went to the hotel up on the road!
One of the reasons for carrying a paper guide and trusting it.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

Confusing war of the arrows is one of the many reasons I prefer this Camino (which will remain un-named)

shhhh...keep the secret

 

[David n5a]

I am deeply indebted to which ever groups mark the Way with yellow arrows. They were life savers on my Camino.

But a disturbing trend is happening that I would like to know if we can change. It was mildly hard for this newbie to accept and adjust to albergues using formal blue signs with scallops and arrows. They eventualky became identifiable by their size and location. (But it still bugged me)
But many time in towns, albergues are using strong yellow arrow on the street, walls and side walks. These can be indescernible from true Camino marking. Some intersections have become a mess of yellow markings. It's confusing, misleading and wastes time.
I appreciated some towns that blacked out the arrow head or arrow all together .


Could there be anyway to require albergues to use another color? Some areas seem to use blue for bike tours or Camino so what about orange or peach?
Can any organization have a wide spread impact to control this mess?

Any while we're at it, get more arrows on the way out of Ponferado?
Nanc

I have to concur with Nanc. A problem with arrows is developing on the Camino Frances. Businesses including albergues are using the yellow arrows to lure pilgrims past their store fronts.

 

[Albertagirl]

I have to concur with Nanc. A problem with arrows is developing on the Camino Frances. Businesses including albergues are using the yellow arrows to lure pilgrims past their store fronts.

There were competing yellow arrows as I walked into Puente de Orbigo this morning. I think they have appeared since last year and are very aggressive - painting out competing arrows in black and adding numerous superfluous arrows, as well as painting competing comments on the road. I just went straight ahead to the bridge and did not see any possibly interested businesses until the bar just before the bridge. As the point of the arrows, comments, etc. is to direct walkers to the bridge, I do not see how I could get there any quicker by turning left first, as one set of arrows and comments insists.