Name this flower (please)

[Bert45]

The photo of some flowers I saw on my camino was taken in October 2016 between Lacommande and Oloron. I had previously seen similar flowers in Spain -- fields of them giving the whole field a pink blush. I asked what they were called in Villalcázar de Sirga, and the barman said they were called "merendinas". Google tell me that this word means 'snacks', so I think that my Spanish was not good enough to ask the question or perhaps to understand the answer. They are like crocuses, and, perhaps, that's what they are, but I would like confirmation, please, from any gardening experts on the forum. They fascinate me because the flowers come out of the ground with no leaves. I am aware that some flowers have local names as well as official names. For instance, the rock-rose is 'jara' in Spanish but they are called 'estepas' near Ponferrada. [I was told it the opposite way round, but my dictionary has 'jara', but not 'estepa' for a flower.] So the barman could have been right for what they call them around Villalcázar de Sirga.

 

[Kathar1na]

I am not a gardening expert but I remember these flowers well. We saw them in Galicia in November. I was convinced that they are Colchicum autumnale which grows in autumn in meadows in many parts of Europe and which I know from my youth and love to see. However, further investigation revealed that there is a plant called Crocus serotinus which looks the same and grows in autumn in Spain, Portugal and north west Africa.

The English Wikipedia article says that Colchicum autumnale is also known as autumn crocus and that may be so in English but definitely not in other European languages where their equivalent word of autumn crocus refers to Crocus serotinus.

I remember an earlier thread about this plant. Whatever you saw between Lacommande and Oloron in France in October and at other times in autumn in Spain and whether they were the same plants or different plants, what I remember is that there are many local names in Spain for plants that look very similar to the one in your photo, grow in autumn and have no leaves.

 

[Kathar1na]

I asked what they were called in Villalcázar de Sirga, and the barman said they were called "merendinas"

Google merendera.

I see now that Colchicum and Crocus look alike and can be confused by the casual observer. To add to the confusion, there are autumn-flowering species of crocus. However, colchicums have 3 styles and 6 stamens, while crocuses have 1 style and 3 stamens. In addition, the corm structures are quite different—in colchicum, the corm is irregular, while in crocuses, the corm is like a flattened ball.

Well, that should make it easy to tell them apart.

 

[André Walker]

Could also be the 'Crocus tommasinianus'.

 

[Kathar1na]

Found it again! This Wikipedia article about Colchicum montanum aka Merendera Montana has a long list of local names in Spain. For the region of Castilla y Leon where Villalcázar de Sirga is located it is: alzameriendas, merendera, zampameriendas, espachapastores, merendera de monte, avergüenzamozos, merendera loca, no meriendes. The photo shows a flower without a stem but there are other photos where a stem can be seen.

As to the very similar plant Colchicum autumnale, there are over 50 local names for it in German or in locally spoken German dialects, ranging from France to Hungary.

In the region of Aquitaine where Oloron is situated, Colchicum autumnale is a protected plant, which means that it definitely grows there (Liste des espèces végétales protégées en Aquitaine). French names are safran bâtard, safran des pays, ail des prés, chenard, mort chien, tue-chien, tue-loup, vachette ou veilleuse. But Colchicum montanum also grows in this area and is protected, see here. Good site, shows you where stuff grows naturally, see Maps/Global presence.

 

[amancio]

crocus, indeed! they are said to announce the shortening of summer days and weather getting colder

 

[freespirit]

The photo of some flowers I saw on my camino was taken in October 2016 between Lacommande and Oloron. I had previously seen similar flowers in Spain -- fields of them giving the whole field a pink blush. I asked what they were called in Villalcázar de Sirga, and the barman said they were called "merendinas". Google tell me that this word means 'snacks', so I think that my Spanish was not good enough to ask the question or perhaps to understand the answer. They are like crocuses, and, perhaps, that's what they are, but I would like confirmation, please, from any gardening experts on the forum. They fascinate me because the flowers come out of the ground with no leaves. I am aware that some flowers have local names as well as official names. For instance, the rock-rose is 'jara' in Spanish but they are called 'estepas' near Ponferrada. [I was told it the opposite way round, but my dictionary has 'jara', but not 'estepa' for a flower.] So the barman could have been right for what they call them around Villalcázar de Sirga.
View attachment 106442

Hi for those of you who like to know

I am not a gardening expert but I remember these flowers well. We saw them in Galicia in November. I was convinced that they are Colchicum autumnale which grows in autumn in meadows in many parts of Europe and which I know from my youth and love to see. However, further investigation revealed that there is a plant called Crocus serotinus which looks the same and grows in autumn in Spain, Portugal and north west Africa.

The English Wikipedia article says that Colchicum autumnale is also known as autumn crocus and that may be so in English but definitely not in other European languages where their equivalent word of autumn crocus refers to Crocus serotinus.

I remember an earlier thread about this plant. Whatever you saw between Lacommande and Oloron in France in October and at other times in autumn in Spain and whether they were the same plants or different plants, what I remember is that there are many local names in Spain for plants that look very similar to the one in your photo, grow in autumn and have no leaves.

8

The photo of some flowers I saw on my camino was taken in October 2016 between Lacommande and Oloron. I had previously seen similar flowers in Spain -- fields of them giving the whole field a pink blush. I asked what they were called in Villalcázar de Sirga, and the barman said they were called "merendinas". Google tell me that this word means 'snacks', so I think that my Spanish was not good enough to ask the question or perhaps to understand the answer. They are like crocuses, and, perhaps, that's what they are, but I would like confirmation, please, from any gardening experts on the forum. They fascinate me because the flowers come out of the ground with no leaves. I am aware that some flowers have local names as well as official names. For instance, the rock-rose is 'jara' in Spanish but they are called 'estepas' near Ponferrada. [I was told it the opposite way round, but my dictionary has 'jara', but not 'estepa' for a flower.] So the barman could have been right for what they call them around Villalcázar de Sirga.
View attachment 106442

The photo of some flowers I saw on my camino was taken in October 2016 between Lacommande and Oloron. I had previously seen similar flowers in Spain -- fields of them giving the whole field a pink blush. I asked what they were called in Villalcázar de Sirga, and the barman said they were called "merendinas". Google tell me that this word means 'snacks', so I think that my Spanish was not good enough to ask the question or perhaps to understand the answer. They are like crocuses, and, perhaps, that's what they are, but I would like confirmation, please, from any gardening experts on the forum. They fascinate me because the flowers come out of the ground with no leaves. I am aware that some flowers have local names as well as official names. For instance, the rock-rose is 'jara' in Spanish but they are called 'estepas' near Ponferrada. [I was told it the opposite way round, but my dictionary has 'jara', but not 'estepa' for a flower.] So the barman could have been right for what they call them around Villalcázar de Sirga.
View attachment 106442

Hi for those.of you who like to know the names of flowers, where ever you travel there is a app you can get called Picture this worth a try.

 

[Kathar1na]

or those.of you who like to know the names of flowers, where ever you travel there is a app you can get called Picture this worth a try.

I agree. I have this app, it is called PictureThis, on online plant encyclopedia and plant identifier. You take a photo of a plant or tree and the app tells you what it is called. https://www.picturethisai.com

 

[Bert45]

Thanks, all of the above. Is it odd that 'merendero' means snack-room, tea-room, and picknicking place, while merendera is this flower? What a difference a letter makes! Plenty of English words change their meaning radically if you change one letter -- of course, I can't think of one now. It seems I may have misheard the barman, or I had forgotten what he'd said by the time I got to write it down. I shall be counting the petals, styles and stamens of the flowers in my photos. I couldn't dig any of the corms up as I didn't have a trowel with me and it's probably illegal.

 

[Sue127]

Interesting post, thank you. I just assumed autumn crocus:, now I know better.

 

[Scott Sweeney]

The photo of some flowers I saw on my camino was taken in October 2016 between Lacommande and Oloron. I had previously seen similar flowers in Spain -- fields of them giving the whole field a pink blush. I asked what they were called in Villalcázar de Sirga, and the barman said they were called "merendinas". Google tell me that this word means 'snacks', so I think that my Spanish was not good enough to ask the question or perhaps to understand the answer. They are like crocuses, and, perhaps, that's what they are, but I would like confirmation, please, from any gardening experts on the forum. They fascinate me because the flowers come out of the ground with no leaves. I am aware that some flowers have local names as well as official names. For instance, the rock-rose is 'jara' in Spanish but they are called 'estepas' near Ponferrada. [I was told it the opposite way round, but my dictionary has 'jara', but not 'estepa' for a flower.] So the barman could have been right for what they call them around Villalcázar de Sirga.
View attachment 106442

Saffron.

 

[Kathar1na]

 

[Eleonore]

The photo of some flowers I saw on my camino was taken in October 2016 between Lacommande and Oloron. I had previously seen similar flowers in Spain -- fields of them giving the whole field a pink blush. I asked what they were called in Villalcázar de Sirga, and the barman said they were called "merendinas". Google tell me that this word means 'snacks', so I think that my Spanish was not good enough to ask the question or perhaps to understand the answer. They are like crocuses, and, perhaps, that's what they are, but I would like confirmation, please, from any gardening experts on the forum. They fascinate me because the flowers come out of the ground with no leaves. I am aware that some flowers have local names as well as official names. For instance, the rock-rose is 'jara' in Spanish but they are called 'estepas' near Ponferrada. [I was told it the opposite way round, but my dictionary has 'jara', but not 'estepa' for a flower.] So the barman could have been right for what they call them around Villalcázar de Sirga.
View attachment 106442

I believe in the US we call them Naked Ladies. My daughter has them in her garden.

 

[David Tallan]

I believe in the US we call them Naked Ladies. My daughter has them in her garden.

<bites tongue>

 

[Rick of Rick and Peg]

Plenty of English words change their meaning radically if you change one letter -- of course, I can't think of one now. It seems I may have misheard the barman,

Or was that batman?

 

[Kathar1na]

<bites tongue>

I bet I know what you wanted to say. <straight face>

Something like this:

Colchicum autumnale, commonly known as autumn crocus, meadow saffron or naked ladies, is a toxic autumn-blooming flowering plant that resembles the true crocuses, but is a member of the plant family Colchicaceae, unlike the true crocuses which belong to the family Iridaceae. The name "naked ladies" comes from the fact that the flowers emerge from the ground long before the leaves appear.​

​

Did I guess right?

 

[Kanga]

I think Amaryllis belladonna is also commonly called a naked lady. Same reason, the flowers emerge from the ground before the leaves. Toxicity also seems common! Beware the naked lady.

 

[André Walker]

I think Amaryllis belladonna is also commonly called a naked lady.

True: when my wife is naked, I always call her "Bella donna".

 

[Kathar1na]

While I was looking for something else, I saw a comment by people from Grañon on the Camino Francés and a photo of flowers that they call quitameriendas, a sure sign that summer is coming to an end.

These lucky people who live in lands where summer is coming to an end towards the 1st of October!!! Where I live it is the end of August, and we can already see and feel that summer is coming to an end.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

This past October on the Via Francigena I came across many of these pinkish/lavendar flowers in wooded areas. Very impressive as they often blanketed large areas in huge clusters. The most interesting thing is they have absolutely NO leaves. The little stems shoot out of the ground with a little flower on top. I think it is a variety of Colchicum.

 

[mspath]

This past October on the Via Francigena I came across many of these pinkish/lavendar flowers in wooded areas. Very impressive as they often blanketed large areas in huge clusters. The most interesting thing is they have absolutely NO leaves. The little stems shoot out of the ground with a little flower on top. I think it is a variety of Colchicum.
View attachment 138115

Camino Christy,
If your photo is stored in Google Photos tap it with Google Lens and an answer should appear.
Good luck and happy research.

 

[VNwalking]

The most interesting thing is they have absolutely NO leaves. The little stems shoot out of the ground with a little flower on top. I think it is a variety of Colchicum.
View attachment 138115

These are cyclamen.

 

[Camino Chrissy]

These are cyclamen.

The article says cyclamen have leaves...I'm confident mine had none and are very tiny.
"...valued for their flowers with upswept petals and variably patterned leaves."

 

[VNwalking]

The article says cyclamen have leaves...I'm confident mine had none and are very tiny.

Of course they have leaves.
Vascular plants do unless they are parasitic. But they are not always obvious and sometimes as in this case are not there all year round; in some Eurpoean Cyclamen taxa, flowers can appear when there are no leaves.

From the wikipedia article I linked to in my post above:

In most species leaves come up in autumn, grow through the winter and then die in spring,

Most cyclamen species originate from the Mediterranean, where summers are hot and dry and winters are cool and wet, and are summer-dormant: their leaves sprout in the autumn, remain through the winter and wither the next spring.

Flowering time may be any month of the year, depending on the species. Cyclamen hederifolium and Cyclamen purpurascens bloom in summer and autumn, Cyclamen persicum and Cyclamen coum bloom in winter and Cyclamen repandum blooms in spring.

 

[dbier]

I downloaded and ran the original picture through PictureThis, and to no one's surprise, it came back as Autumn Crocus, a species of Naked Lady (Colchicum).

Which is why, when my husband and I planted autumn crocus this year, we did the best we could to make sure we had Crocus, not Colchicum

 

[Anamiri]

This past October on the Via Francigena I came across many of these pinkish/lavendar flowers in wooded areas. Very impressive as they often blanketed large areas in huge clusters. The most interesting thing is they have absolutely NO leaves. The little stems shoot out of the ground with a little flower on top. I think it is a variety of Colchicum.
View attachment 138115

They look like cyclamen

 

[Kathar1na]

I downloaded and ran the original picture through PictureThis, and to no one's surprise, it came back as Autumn Crocus, a species of Naked Lady (Colchicum

That is the picture in post #1, right? Not to be confused with the picture in post #20. I pointed PictureThis on it, and, to hardly anyones‘s surprise, it came back as Cyclamen. To be precise: as Ivy-leaved Cyclamen, botanical name Cyclamen hederifolium.

 

[Kathar1na]

One of the Italian names for the Ivy-leaved Cyclamen is Ciclamino Napoletano.

It is often useful to google a native plant in the language of the country or region where it is common. You then read for example the question that someone posted on an Italian gardening forum: "Around February I bought cyclamen tubers. They have been popping up since the end of July, I have noticed that they are different from the usual ... the first thing I noticed is that they do not have leaves, which are so beautiful in the cyclamen!" Answer from a more knowledgeable person: "I think your salesman gave you some wood [wild] cyclamen, that's why they don't have leaves." And a further answer: "It sounds like the Neapolitan cyclamen .... at first the plant grows its flowers (pink colour) and then its leaves."

The Wikipedia link that @VNwalking provided in post #22 includes a distribution map of the ivy-leaved cyclamen or ciclamino napoletano (in Italy mainly in the more northern parts of the country) as well as a photo in the gallery where it is shown during a stage where it has no leaves. It flowers in autumn.