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Peter E

New Member
Time of past OR future Camino
October '2018'
First thank you all for the wonderful guidance you have given to a Newby who is going to walk the Primitivo this Autumn. I have spent a whole weekend reading and am just starting to understand! I am now left with three questions.
On an earlier site I looked at, they made a big thing of a problem with bed bugs and suggested spraying the outside of the rucksack and the inside and outside of the sleeping bag with Permethrin and then using an inner sleeping bag liner. I dutifully bought an aerosol containing 0-46% Permethrin and 0-13% Allethrin and found in the smallest of print,
'Do not apply to clothing and bedding'!!!!!
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

My second question is that having never walked a Camino I have no idea how many miles or kms I will comfortably walk in a day until I have walked the very first day. I do know that I want this to be a happy, spiritual, meditative type of walk and from previous experience in India I know how having friendly, welcoming places to stay will enhance this experience. I would love to hear of anyone's favourite night stops for which I could push myself on for a few more kms rather than just stopping anywhere and what I could approximately expect to pay.

I would also appreciate any advice on whether there are cash machines enroute and whether you can pay by card in Pensiones, Hostels and Casa Rurals if I should manage to recognize one!
Many thanks, Peter
 
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Hi Peter,

are you really sure that you want to walk the camino primitivo?

I have walked various Caminos and would not recommend that one fore a beginner. It has lots of steep ascents and descents and places with accomodation are limited. So you are compelled to walk 20 km+ almost every day which is not a good option if you do not know by know that you can manage that.

On the French and on the Portugese Way there are far more places where you can stay, so you can simply start walking and see how far you get.

Cash Cards are not that widely accepted in Spain, so do not expect to pay with them in every bar or albergue or any other small type of accomodation.

I would not take chemicals to prevent bed-bugs, but keep my eyes open! Due to the excessive use of perimethrin bed-bugs start to build up resistances. The chemicals may irritate your skin and they are for sure poisonous for cats!
 
Thank you very much for taking the time to reply. Two years ago I walked 8 hours over the Brecon Beacons and last Summer wild camped on Dartmoor but I have never measured the distance. But 20 km sounds ok it is only three times the walk into town I do regularly, plus steeper hills! I just want to stop the night in special places whether they are at the 15 or 25 km point.
I am not happy about Permethrin either but it seemed everyone was using it on this other site.
If most places don't take cards and there aren't any cash machines I guess it will be a wad of cash then?
thanks again ,Peter
 
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I sprayed my sleeping bag, liner, backpack, and shoes with perimethrin and I’m glad I did. It wasn’t irritating and I had a couple bed bug scares, but those little buggers never got me.

I got out cash twice at banks on the Camino. I tried not to get below 50€ in my bag because most places won’t take credit cards. Stores and hotels will take them in the bigger towns, but for the most part it’s only cash. I only stayed in hotels and albergues so I can’t speak for the other options.

I haven’t done the primitivo, but have heard similar to what @Via2010 said, that it isn’t for beginners. Is there a particular reason you want to do the primitivo for your first time instead of the Frances?
 
Hi,

I took 600,00 € of cash with me on the primitivo and the money lasted comfortably until Santiago. Private albergues are at about 12 €/night, breakfast 3-5 €, dinner 10-12 €. This means you can get by with 30-40 €/day. I take a money belt and only put the money in my purse which I suppose to need that day.

You can get cash in any bigger towns, i. e. Grado, Cornellana, Salas, Tineo, Pola de Allande, Grandas de Salime, O Fonsagrada, O Cadavo-Baleira, Castroverde, Lugo, Melide, Arzua, Arca-Pedrouzo, Santiago.

Only between Tineo and O Fonsagrada - if you walk the "hospitales" - there is a longer stretch without "cajero automático". But it is recommendable, only to withdraw during the business hours of the bank - thus you can ask for help if the machine swallows your card...

BC
Alexandra
 
I would love to hear of anyone's favourite night stops for which I could push myself on for a few more kms rather than just stopping anywhere and what I could approximately expect to pay.

I walked the Primitivo earlier this year. Costs were typically €5 for municipal albergues and €10 for private ones. Some of my favourite places to stay were:

- San Juan de Villapañada: definitely worth the extra 4.5km from Grado. It's an atmospheric rural albergue with countryside views and a sheep pen. The people we met here became our Primitivo tribe for the rest of the walk. The hospitalero is a bit eccentric with rules.

- Bodenaya: my favourite albergue on the Primitivo. Extremely welcoming and friendly, oozing the spirit of the camino. The communal dinner, the information session on the days to come and the magic washing basket were all great.

- Castro: we walked the extra 5km from Grandas to stay at the albergue juvenil here and we're glad we did. Firstly because it allowed us to visit the ruins, but also because we enjoyed the albergue, which has a great dining hall and had decent options for special diets.

The theme running through all three of these is that we preferred to stay in smaller villages rather than larger towns where possible, which I think is good advice in general unless the larger towns in question have particular points of interest.
 
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I have no idea how many miles or kms I will comfortably walk in a day until I have walked the very first day

@Peter E , greetings

I cannot comment on the Primitivo. But it is likely that every day on every route will be different in detail.

I suggest that, as part of your training, you consider including the following:
a) work up to walking 15 km before stopping for breakfast
b) work up to achieving an elevation gain of 400 m before stopping for breakfast
The intention is to train both mind and body to better cope with the joys of walking day after day for 20 days or so

And of course do this with your pack loaded as you intend in Spain

Kia kaha (take care, be strong, get going)
 
Thank you all so much for your advice it will all be an immense help to me. I must admit I am a bit surprised to be warned off the Primitivo as too difficult when on this site a couple in their eighties had just completed it in about 19 days. They walked the Hospitales and only complained that the descent made their backs ache!!! However I suspect your warnings are valid but I seem to have a psychological fault that makes me enthused to do whatever seems most difficult.
Thanks again, Peter
 
Regarding difficulty, my view is that it's all relative to your expectations, physical condition and, especially, your previous experience. The Primitivo has more ups and downs than the Francés, so it is considered difficult by camino standards. But by mountain hiking standards, it's not difficult. I'm not in super good shape but I used to live in Switzerland and hiked in the mountains there a fair bit, so personally I didn't find the Primitivo difficult.
 
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St James' Way - Self-guided 4-7 day Walking Packages, Reading to Southampton, 110 kms
Alwyn, I only just saw your very good advice that made me smile and suspect there is something of the mystic ascetic in you! 15 km s before breakfast! I actually went out before breakfast this morning at 6 a.m with the full rucksack and walked 5 kms including a flight of 100 steps. Was you watching? I guess tomorrow I will have to do the route three times. How many flights of 100 steps are there in 400 metres? Good advice! Thanks
 
Thanks for the encouragement Jungleboy. Obviously people with experience know better but psychology is so importa, real challenges make me feel so alive and I tend to look on long challenges as just a number of short ones. Thanks again.
 
I bought the permethrin spray but decided not to spray my sleeping bag and pack when I read the same warnings you read. I did not get bed bugs. I was careful to inspect the beds, although I never did see evidence of bed bugs. I met one woman along the way who had gotten bit by bedbugs. If it was a big problem, I would have expected to run into more people who had gotten bit. My own view is that the bed bug issue gets overblown.
 
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Thanks for letting me know that, it makes a lot of sense. On the site I saw I got the impression that people were washing their clothes in Petherin on a regular basis plus spraying with deet I don't think I would want to live that way.
Best wishes, Peter
 
Permethrin doesn't actually repel bedbugs. It works great on mosquitoes which aren't an issue on the Primitivo. I didn't worry about bedbugs and never saw any sign of them. You can break the stages up so you don't have to walk 20+km per day. We took 200 Euros out at a time and did that about 3 times. We paid in cash almost everywhere except the hotels in Oviedo, Tineo, Lugo and Santiago. There are plenty of ATMs along the way, just make sure you have at least 50 Euros in your pocket each day just in case the ATM in the next town isn't working or something.
The Primitivo was our first Camino. It wasn't a big deal for us since we have experience hiking in the mountains. There are some steep ascents but as long as you are healthy and willing to walk steep hills at your own pace it's not an issue.
 
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Peter, a good idea would be to check the suggested stages and maps on the gronze website https://www.gronze.com/camino-primitivo

The website is in Spanish, but very straight-forward even if you don't know the language. It'll give you an idea of the length of the stages as well as the elevation profiles for each one. Of course, these are only the "suggested" stages and you can map your own route, but as you'll see on the maps (which indicate where you'll find accommodation) there isn't that much wiggle room on the Primitivo.

I walked the Francés last year, and the Primitivo in mid-June, and found that the same distances on the Primitivo took significantly longer, even without the frequent coffee stops!
 
The focus is on reducing the risk of failure through being well prepared. 2nd ed.
Thanks to all three of you for this wealth of information and the websites which I shall study. I noticed on the Permethrin can that bed bugs were not among the beasties mentioned but assumed it was an oversight. So we can assume all the people on the other site who coated their clothes in Permethrin and were successful in not being bitten were actually not bitten because there weren't any bed bugs to do the biting in the first place!!!
 
Just to say that I loved the elevation profile map on Grunge but whether I will love the reality is another matter.On this tablet the Godesalco site stayed in Spanish but still that km calculator is fantastic for planning. Thanks I am now going to overlay recommended night stops!
 
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Was you watching?

Absolutely!! And shouting encouragment from the distant sideline.

Going up stairs is even better than going up a path: it excerises the muscles in the upper legs. I would need a hand-rail to keep me steady, with or without a pack on my back.

When going up steep paths (nor stairs) you may try taking short steps: the steeper the path the shorter the step. At my shortest step the heel of one foot stops about halfway between heel and toes of the other foot - a step of about 150 mm or six inches.

The point is you do not need to lift your leg, thus conserving energy. And if you breathe in on one foot-fall and out on the other you maintain a rythm that is a world beater in terms of covering the ground, even if only 150 mm at a time.

Kia kaha (take care, be strong, keep it up, get going)
 
Hi Alwyn,
ah I see Buddhist breathing techniques! Is it mindfulness meditation on the pain of every small step?
I will have to practice that step although I often run up the first hill near here but my back went three times over about 6 months of recovery until I learnt to shorten my step over that particular part of the slope. At the moment I am walking with a full rucksack one morning and riding a bike the other morning to strengthen my knees.Should I just concentrate on the walking now?
best wishes, Peter
 
Just to warn you so that you’re not disappointed if it is not a grand challenge.....I have walked the route with three pre-teens! We can’t go even a kilometre from our home without meeting hills so that probably helped, but it isn’t Everest. Hopefully you’ll find it to be somewhere between a challenge to get your teeth into and a walk in the park!
 
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Thank you for the cycling advice. I have been surprised by the different attitudes of members to walking the Primitivo and I am beginning to wonder if the difference is due to some walking in perfect conditions while others have been baked and dehydrated the whole way,and others have trudged through strength sapping mud from beginning to end.
best wishes, Peter
 
Hi, lots of good advice here.

My two cents on training is try to do some consecutive days as the challenge of Camino presents itself cumulatively rather than in the effforts of a single day. Do you use hiking poles? We found them helpful overall and invaluable on descents.

If you have the time - take your time. I think I regret treating our Norte and Primitivo as a time trial most - but we had only a limited amount of vacation time.

Our last night of Primitivo before joining the main route we stayed in lovely inn run by an English couple near O Hospital Casa Camino. Wow. Best bed and dinner in Spain. Not an alburgue but a nice treat.
 
St James' Way - Self-guided 4-7 day Walking Packages, Reading to Southampton, 110 kms
Hi Peter

I also walked the primtivo in June this year and it was my first Camino, so like you was not sure what to expect. I am a reasonably fit 56 year old but did not walk regularly prior to my Camino but followed a training plan I found on the internet. The plan was good but we ended up walking further than I had previously done in training on most days without any real problems. It will be a wonderful experience so take your time and enjoy it.

on pemethrin, I sprayed my rucksack inside and out only but bought a Craghoppers (UK brand) sleeping bag liner which seemed to work well, no bites :) https://www.craghoppers.com/nosilife-sleeping-liner-dark-khaki/.

Most Albergues were good but we used Gronze for reviews and reserved a place when possible the day before so we didn't feel pressured to get to our destination and had time to look round places of interest.

Good luck

Buen Camino

Andy
 
Peter, you can always pay by credit card at supermercados.
 
Thank you very much for taking the time to reply. Two years ago I walked 8 hours over the Brecon Beacons and last Summer wild camped on Dartmoor but I have never measured the distance. But 20 km sounds ok it is only three times the walk into town I do regularly, plus steeper hills! I just want to stop the night in special places whether they are at the 15 or 25 km point.
I am not happy about Permethrin either but it seemed everyone was using it on this other site.
If most places don't take cards and there aren't any cash machines I guess it will be a wad of cash then?
thanks again ,Peter
There are plenty of cash machines along the Camino, at least there were on the Norte and Frances.
 
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Hi, lots of good advice here.

My two cents on training is try to do some consecutive days as the challenge of Camino presents itself cumulatively rather than in the effforts of a single day. Do you use hiking poles? We found them helpful overall and invaluable on descents.

If you have the time - take your time. I think I regret treating our Norte and Primitivo as a time trial most - but we had only a limited amount of vacation time.

Our last night of Primitivo before joining the main route we stayed in lovely inn run by an English couple near O Hospital Casa Camino. Wow. Best bed and dinner in Spain. Not an alburgue but a nice treat.
Hi, lots of good advice here.

My two cents on training is try to do some consecutive days as the challenge of Camino presents itself cumulatively rather than in the effforts of a single day. Do you use hiking poles? We found them helpful overall and invaluable on descents.

If you have the time - take your time. I think I regret treating our Norte and Primitivo as a time trial most - but we had only a limited amount of vacation time.

Our last night of Primitivo before joining the main route we stayed in lovely inn run by an English couple near O Hospital Casa Camino. Wow. Best bed and dinner in Spain. Not an alburgue but a nice treat.

There are plenty of cash machines along the Camino, at least there were on the Norte and Frances.
There are plenty of cash machines along the Camino, at least there were on the Norte and Frances.
Sorry I am a bit useless at this replying technology! But thank you Redvespablur, Andy,Csutak and Dinah for all of your helpful advice which I h have noted down.
as to not treating it as a time trial it seems that a lack of stopping places on the Primitivo means that you are forced to walk a number of 25 km stretches in a day but am I missing something? I have tried walking with two sticks but miss having my hands free but certainly for the downhill stretches I will use them. The Inn before O Hospital Casa Camino sounds great I trust it is obvious to see?
I was planning to go in October but an old Rugby back injury just kicked in again today so I guess it will now have to be Spring. It normally goes once a year for the past 50 years and this time it was about 8 weeks ago and I have been like a footballer rushing, trying to make it back to fitness for the World Cup. Now I shall have to be patient which will give me more time to plan. Peter
 
Welcome Peter. I really recommend the Primitivo, it´s one of my favourite Caminos so far (El Salvador being most favourite). Try and include an extra day for Oviedo, it´s a wonderful city especially in September during the festival. As for walking, there is a steep climb at the beginning and end of most days but I found it okay (only around 25k a day with a couple of days shorter than that) and if the weather permits, I strongly recommend the Hospitales route -simply glorious!
 
Hi Lainey,
it is the mountain scenery that really attracts me to the Primitivo especially the Hospitales. I am very interested to know why El Salvador was your favourite route?
 
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Hi Peter, well I had not planned to walk El Salvador but it was one or two of the veterans of this forum who recommended it and I was so glad they did! First of all it starts in Leon which is a great city and it finishes in Oviedo again another wonderful city. It is such a quiet Camino compared to the Portuguese and certainly the Frances and the scenery is stunning with some good "stretches of the legs". There are also great albergues and hospitaleros en route. It is a very short Camino about 130K and a stay at Sandra´s in Herías is an unique and not to be missed Camino experience.
 
Hello,
I just completed the Camino Frances - what an experience!

I bought a ‘bedbug sheet’ which I suppose was treated with permethrin, it came with metal rings on the corners which I attached elastic to which meant it stayed on the mattress. I have to say that I didn’t have to use it very often as many of the Albergue’s use special anti bug mattresses or there was a clean sheet on the bed. I bought a bottle of permethrin that was for tents, clothes and sleeping bags which I used to spray my rucksack and sleeping bag. Unfortunately, on the last few days my son and I did get bitten but we were not sure if it was bed bugs!

The most important thing I learnt on the Camino is that everyone has their own pace, and it is very important to walk at you own comfortable pace.

As for the Albergue’s, I found a PDF of favourite Albergue’s for the Frances, however, what is one persons favourite may not be your favourite!!!

Have a great walk, Buen Camino
 
Hi Peter, well I had not planned to walk El Salvador but it was one or two of the veterans of this forum who recommended it and I was so glad they did! First of all it starts in Leon which is a great city and it finishes in Oviedo again another wonderful city. It is such a quiet Camino compared to the Portuguese and certainly the Frances and the scenery is stunning with some good "stretches of the legs". There are also great albergues and hospitaleros en route. It is a very short Camino about 130K and a stay at Sandra´s in Herías is an unique and not to be missed Camino experience.
thanks Lainey,
that was very helpful I can see that I have so much too learn. I will look the route up and have a close look at it. Best wishes Peter
 
The focus is on reducing the risk of failure through being well prepared. 2nd ed.
Hello,
I just completed the Camino Frances - what an experience!

I bought a ‘bedbug sheet’ which I suppose was treated with permethrin, it came with metal rings on the corners which I attached elastic to which meant it stayed on the mattress. I have to say that I didn’t have to use it very often as many of the Albergue’s use special anti bug mattresses or there was a clean sheet on the bed. I bought a bottle of permethrin that was for tents, clothes and sleeping bags which I used to spray my rucksack and sleeping bag. Unfortunately, on the last few days my son and I did get bitten but we were not sure if it was bed bugs!

The most important thing I learnt on the Camino is that everyone has their own pace, and it is very important to walk at you own comfortable pace.

As for the Albergue’s, I found a PDF of favourite Albergue’s for the Frances, however, what is one persons favourite may not be your favourite!!!

Have a great walk, Buen Camino
hi Pipmahoe,
thanks for the information but another member has pointed out to me that Permethrin doesn't work on bed bugs and indeed they are not on the long list of bugs that Permethrin will kill on the can of Permethrin I have bought. It is rather baffling.
Best wishes, Peter
 
I always try essential oils, ever since I got rid of my daughter's lice with Rosemary oil

Found on the internet: Effectively repellent essential oils include cinnamon oil, lemongrass oil, clove oil,peppermint oil, lavender oil, thyme oil, tea tree oil, and, finally, eucalyptus oil. In my experience, all or any of these oils have laid claim to both killing as well as repelling bed bugs.
 
Hi Natbee,
thank you for all of your research. The oils sound a much better option than spraying with chemicals. peter
 
The focus is on reducing the risk of failure through being well prepared. 2nd ed.
There is an issue that is worth serious consideration for those who are of a mind to use things like essential oils for bed bug prevention. One must be aware that the odors of such products can have a serious negative impact if you are sharing space with other pilgrims. It is not infrequent to have a percentage of fellow pilgrims that cannot tolerate strong odors, which for them can cause a variety of symptoms and problems which may range from nausea to migraines.

If you wish to use this sort of protection (which has debatable efficacy against bedbugs, as well as the fact that the issue of bedbugs, while real for the few, are greatly blown out of proportion as to the perceived number of pilgrims impacted) consider staying at other lodgings with private rooms.
 
Q: paying by credit card:
Hotel, restaurants will let you use card only when amounts are over 25 Euro.
If you are really hard up, you might pay for the large communal meal at a restaurant by card and let your pals reemburse you...

Furthermore, there might be a higher exchange rate outside banks, so better get used to taking out alarger aomount for a week or so !
 
I sprayed my sleeping bag, liner, backpack, and shoes with perimethrin and I’m glad I did. It wasn’t irritating and I had a couple bed bug scares, but those little buggers never got me.

I got out cash twice at banks on the Camino. I tried not to get below 50€ in my bag because most places won’t take credit cards. Stores and hotels will take them in the bigger towns, but for the most part it’s only cash. I only stayed in hotels and albergues so I can’t speak for the other options.


Ditto except for the hotels and I applied Tiger Balm to my extremities and the one time I got bit was when I didn't use my Tiger Balm. I think the eucalyptus and camphor in it keeps them at bay.
 
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Can anyone recommend a good snack to buy for the hospitalès route Nothing major just something to keep me going Many thanks

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