Packing VOLUME

[Peregrinopaul]

I’m curious about this. I am a bicigrino, so there are different priorities, but I have noticed that walker backpack discussions often focus on “Do I go for 36L or 44L?” …just my impression.

I’ve decided to try a different approach to my bike packing, and eliminate traditional panniers altogether. (They are heavy). I have bought a “trunk bag” which has drop-down, soft, side panniers. The total volume is 22.6L. I’ve just done a trial pack, and I have got everything in - with room to spare - except for the things which will go in my small handlebar/shoulder bag (perhaps 2L) which will contain my phone, day-wallet, snacks, glasses and other immediately-available sundries. Admittedly my water bottles (2) are attatched to the bike frame. Out of curiosity, I’ve looked at some walker sample packing lists and they do not differ significantly from mine. Surely with a 36L capacity there must be a lot of empty space? Or am I missing something?
I notice that my rain jacket is strapped to the top, so not part of the internal volume.

 

[J Willhaus]

I know our packs are a bit larger to accommodate CPAP and medications. I have seen some people with much smaller packs in summer and of course as a hospitalera, I have seen pilgrims with much larger packs, too. Also as a bicigrino, you will likely move more quickly and may not need to pack for a longer Camino that a foot pilgrim may undertake (for us that is even more CPAP supplies and medications). Our first Camino was 45 days walking. How long will your journey take in total? Will you resupply or make more than one Camino? Do you carry tools to repair your bike if needed and is that part of your packing? Do you carry a sleeping bag/liner. I think different modes of travel may just have different priorities. I have met many on a bike who also carry a tent and sleep pad so your pack may just be lighter or heavier even when compared to others on a bike.

 

[mspath]

Perigrinopaul,

I like your soft paniers. They remind me of the canvas ones I used 64 years ago this summer when 20 years old I biked from London to Rome in 4 months on a 3 speed Raleigh and
walked up the Alps. However the descent into Nice was great!

Happy packing and Buen camino!

 

[roving_rufus]

I have a 30l which includes camping gear (I am camino-ing down through western France this year) but serves easily on a winter camino with much more gear too minus the tent. In summer I would consider a smaller day pack but would probably still take my 30l as I am so used to it. But most advice will suggest larger - as 20litres is considered a daysack the next size up is generally the suggestion for multi days from most sources which is in the 30-50L mark. Most folks on their first walk tend to carry more in uncertainty of what it will be like so having more flexibility in packing can be useful than trying to cram everything in.

 

[peregrino_tom]

Surely with a 36L capacity there must be a lot of empty space? Or am I missing something?

It's because your lycra skinsuits take up less room than normal clothes

 

[Peregrinopaul]

... How long will your journey take in total? Will you resupply or make more than one Camino? Do you carry tools to repair your bike if needed and is that part of your packing? Do you carry a sleeping bag/liner. I think different modes of travel may just have different priorities.

This year I'll be 30 days on the Frances. I'm stopping en route quite a bit and making a couple of detours.
I carry minimal tools, in a small bag velcroed (?) to the frame. I have tubeless tyres which have never given me a problem, but will carry extra sealant just in case. Yes, this year I will have a down sleeping bag, which compresses to a small size, and a liner. ( I had very bad weather on the C de Madrid in 2018, and regretted not having these.)
I genuinely posted out of curiosity, because if my bag really is 22.6L as advertised, I'm amazed at how much I can fit in it - and it isn't crammed full.
My 2 Ortlieb panniers, used on some previous caminos are 20L each! Although they have roll-down tops so were probably nowhere near capacity.

 

[Peregrinopaul]

I like your soft paniers. They remind me of the canvas ones I used 60 years ago this summer when 20 years old I biked from London to Rome in 4 months on a 3 speed Raleigh and
walked up the Alps. However the descent into Nice was great!

Happy packing and Buen camino!

Thanks Margaret. I bought this bag as a front carrier on my trips here in WA, camping during covid. It was basically for water carrying - unlike the camino, it can be 150km between drinks over here. I'll bet the 3 speed Raleigh had those wonderful "in-hub" gears. I'm sorry they ever went out of fashion.

 

[Peregrinopaul]

I have a 30l which includes camping gear (I am camino-ing down through western France this year) but serves easily on a winter camino with much more gear too minus the tent. In summer I would consider a smaller day pack but would probably still take my 30l as I am so used to it. But most advice will suggest larger - as 20litres is considered a daysack the next size up is generally the suggestion for multi days from most sources which is in the 30-50L mark. Most folks on their first walk tend to carry more in uncertainty of what it will be like so having more flexibility in packing can be useful than trying to cram everything in.

How far west? South of Bordeaux I took the Littoral along the coast in 2019. Loved it, but it proved expensive for accommodation.

 

[Peregrinopaul]

It's because your lycra skinsuits take up less room than normal clothes

Funny you should mention Lycra. I refused to wear the gear at first because I wanted to be seen as an old(ish) pilgrim who happened to be on a bike. My bum suffered accordingly. And now I really like the jackets too - just unzip when hot. And in dazzling safety colours. I'm a convert.

 

[Vacajoe]

I’m thinking it’s the type and amount of clothes walking pilgrims carry such as extra socks, hat, jackets/ponchos, etc. Biking gear tends to be lightweight and thin, quick drying, and can be worn multiple times between washing (it washed at all!) Most bikers have two sets of clothes: what they wear while biking and what they wear once stopped for the day. Walking pilgrims often have three sets to account for clothes needing to be washed or that didn’t quite dry. Additionally, 30-40 days on the trail means packing for multiple types of weather if not seasonal changes.

These are generalizations for sure, but I’d guess pilgrims who have walked more Caminos tend to approach your 30L packs.

 

[Keith H]

Some peregrinos carry extra food too. But I think it’s more the availability of different packs at the 30+ liter size. Finding one that is comfortable under load can be a mission. A larger pack also means you don’t have to do advanced level Pack Tetris to get everything back in daily.

 

[MesaWalker]

I have the same set of side-sided paniers on my bike at home (Topeak) that I have used for years. They have held up very well over the years, so it should get you through the Camino just fine. One word of wisdom - don't pack anything with sharp/hard corners against the bottom of the soft paniers - they can eventually wear a hole through the fabric, especially if you're going over rough terrain. That happened to me eventually carrying a laptop in one of the paniers.

 

[Tammom]

I’m using a 30L for my first Camino. It’s a bit tight, but it forces me to take only what I need.

 

[roving_rufus]

How far west? South of Bordeaux I took the Littoral along the coast in 2019. Loved it, but it proved expensive for accommodation.

Following the voie capitales from where I finished last summer in Nantes and swinging over to Royan to Voie Littoral. The issue on the Voie Littoral is the accomodation hence the tent.

 

[Tincatinker]

Funny you should mention Lycra.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mamil...MIL) is an,hugging jerseys and bicycle shorts.

 

[Peregrinopaul]

Following the voie capitales from where I finished last summer in Nantes and swinging over to Royan to Voie Littoral. The issue on the Voie Littoral is the accomodation hence the tent.

Did you post or blog anywhere about your Voie Capitales? I’m very interested in that route for a future Beginning in M Saint Michel seems as beguiling as finishing in Santiago.
One place on the Littoral I can thoroughly recommend is Villa Souvenir in Léon. And he’ll probably be happy for you to pitch your tent in his extensive garden if you don’t fancy a shared room.

 

[Peregrinopaul]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mamil#:~:text=Mamil (or MAMIL) is an,hugging jerseys and bicycle shorts.

I have to admit I am somewhat embarrased by it, because it makes a statement that is not me. It is, however, immensely practical.

 

[roving_rufus]

Did you post or blog anywhere about your Voie Capitales? I’m very interested in that route for a future Beginning in M Saint Michel seems as beguiling as finishing in Santiago.
One place on the Littoral I can thoroughly recommend is Villa Souvenir in Léon. And he’ll probably be happy for you to pitch your tent in his extensive garden if you don’t fancy a shared room.

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/camino-from-home-part-ii-cherbourg-to.76274/#post-1062029

And the Bretagne Association is amazing! Lots of pilgrim gites and pilgrim hosts along the route from Mont St Michel. I did have a tent but manageable without!

 

[Vacajoe]

Funny, we walked across Normandy from Caen TO Mont St Michel and found it lacking in not only pilgrim hosts and accommodations, but also food!!! It was oddly unsupported for a recognized route. Glad to hear that that is not the norm for that area.

 

[good_old_shoes]

Which size for the bags is not only defined by what you need to bring with you, but also personal preference.

I personally prefer to have lots of room in my bags, so choose bigger ones - all my current hiking backpacks have 70l+ and I'm very happy with that. I prefer not having to play "Tetris" to get my stuff to fit into the bag. Sometimes it's still difficult to fit everything in, especially if I went to the supermarket hungry, before reaching the campsite .

Someone with a bike who stays in hotels or upscale albergues with sheets and blankets, would probably be fine with even less litres than what you have now.

For me who's a cold sleeper carrying a winter sleeping bag even in summer and also a tent and food ect., a 30l bag would (maybe) be enough for toiletries and first aid kit, or suitable as a shopping bag for the afternoon, max...!

I'm always impressed by people travelling long distances on bikes. I tried once, gave away the bike for free to the first person that would take it, after only 150kms, and continued walking

 

[roving_rufus]

Funny, we walked across Normandy from Caen TO Mont St Michel and found it lacking in not only pilgrim hosts and accommodations, but also food!!! It was oddly unsupported for a recognized route. Glad to hear that that is not the norm for that area.

Even the Mont Saint Michel path from Cherbourg had more options than I saw you had on the Caen route - my first night on it at Le Rozel was a pilgrim gite full of camino photos and camino paraphernalia which was a lovely start! But the Mont St Michel to Clisson section which is dual way (to the Mont and to SdeC) has had alot more work than the other routes - there are several municipal pilgrim gites including Antrain and Besle, a few walkers gites such as in Messac, Blain, a basic pilgrim refuge at La Roche run by the couple who own the restaurant who are pilgrims, a few youth hostels in Rennes and Nantes, a few campsites have basic campetoiles available for bikers/ walkers plus a decent list of pilgrim hosts. And plenty of food! (Even found an open shop on a public holiday!)

 

[Vacajoe]

A shop open on a public holiday in FRANCE?!?!? Surely this is an April Fool’s prank.

 

[good_old_shoes]

A shop open on a public holiday in FRANCE?!?!? Surely this is an April Fool’s prank.

I once found a bakery that was open on a public holiday in France. I felt so lucky!

 

[mattythedog]

I’m curious about this. I am a bicigrino, so there are different priorities, but I have noticed that walker backpack discussions often focus on “Do I go for 36L or 44L?” …just my impression.

I’ve decided to try a different approach to my bike packing, and eliminate traditional panniers altogether. (They are heavy). I have bought a “trunk bag” which has drop-down, soft, side panniers. The total volume is 22.6L. I’ve just done a trial pack, and I have got everything in - with room to spare - except for the things which will go in my small handlebar/shoulder bag (perhaps 2L) which will contain my phone, day-wallet, snacks, glasses and other immediately-available sundries. Admittedly my water bottles (2) are attatched to the bike frame. Out of curiosity, I’ve looked at some walker sample packing lists and they do not differ significantly from mine. Surely with a 36L capacity there must be a lot of empty space? Or am I missing something?
View attachment 143879I notice that my rain jacket is strapped to the top, so not part of the internal volume.

Like MesaWalker, I have Topeak soft panniers at home. For summer bike hiking they hold tent, sleep sack, air mattress, running shoes (i use clipless bike shoes to ride) and full set of extra street/hiking clothes. I have a large handle bar bag for food, toiletries and other stuff. You would not need the tent and air mattress on Camino, and you dont need to carry food, but might want a heavier Gortex shell and rain pants for cold wind/rain protection if you ride fast. For walking many Caminos over 3 seasons, I use a 33 liter pack (cause it fit me well and the 24 did not), but could easily put all my gear into a 24 liter pack. I have also stuffed it into a 20 liter pack during testing. You are not missing anything- you don't need the 36 just because so many others want to carry the kitchen sink. I biked the CF in 2016 using the relatively large rented panniers, but walked from SJPP to Roncessvalles to get the bike, and I carried a 36 liter frameless pack stuffed with 25 lbs of bike shoes, tools, my own pedals, too many street clothes, plus an additional 10 lbs of food and water having confused the 26 km trek with a 26 mile trek!! I hardly touched the food and water during the 7 hour hike because I ate breakfast at Orrison and got more food at cantina further up. Live and learn!

 

[Peregrinopaul]

Like MesaWalker, I have Topeak soft panniers at home...

An interesting post, Matty - (or is he the actual dog like Henry?). I'm getting the point that walkers prefer a bigger pack for both comfort, fit and ease of access. Makes sense.
With my Topeak trunk-bag, I have the added benefit of several compartments. I should mention that on my last trip I used an Ortlieb lightweight backpack which I attatched to the seatpost, using the roll-down clip, and secured to the rack with velcro. The pack holds a generous 20L, and was totally waterproof. This was really convenient. Weight 330g.

It looks a bit precarious, but in fact was very stable, and quick to remove. The blue dry-bag contained my fleece jacket, the orange one had tools. The disadvantage of this arrangement was that I found it tricky to mount and dismount the bike, as I intuitively swing my leg over the saddle.
I'm testing out putting the Topeak on the front. (My Thule rack can go either front or back). I like this arrangement. It helps equalise the load on the wheels, and actually damps down the steering in a very comfortable way. I can't think of any disadvantage.
I am somewhat in awe of your treck over the Napoleon with that lot on your back. I suspect that you're younger than some of us!
I have one more photo of my loaded bike on a camping trip here in W Aus during Covid. This involved camping between far-flung roadhouse stops, so the Deuters on the front had 8L of water (and cooking/eating gear) - hot temps here. I'm not sure which bag carried the sink!

 

[mattythedog]

An interesting post, Matty - (or is he the actual dog like Henry?). I'm getting the point that walkers prefer a bigger pack for both comfort, fit and ease of access. Makes sense.
With my Topeak trunk-bag, I have the added benefit of several compartments. I should mention that on my last trip I used an Ortlieb lightweight backpack which I attatched to the seatpost, using the roll-down clip, and secured to the rack with velcro. The pack holds a generous 20L, and was totally waterproof. This was really convenient. Weight 330g.
View attachment 144298
It looks a bit precarious, but in fact was very stable, and quick to remove. The blue dry-bag contained my fleece jacket, the orange one had tools. The disadvantage of this arrangement was that I found it tricky to mount and dismount the bike, as I intuitively swing my leg over the saddle.
I'm testing out putting the Topeak on the front. (My Thule rack can go either front or back). I like this arrangement. It helps equalise the load on the wheels, and actually damps down the steering in a very comfortable way. I can't think of any disadvantage.
I am somewhat in awe of your treck over the Napoleon with that lot on your back. I suspect that you're younger than some of us!
I have one more photo of my loaded bike on a camping trip here in W Aus during Covid. This involved camping between far-flung roadhouse stops, so the Deuters on the front had 8L of water (and cooking/eating gear) - hot temps here. I'm not sure which bag carried the sink!
View attachment 144299

HI Paul, Matty was our Great Pyrenees/Golden retriever, God rest his dog-soul. Impressive loadout! I like the idea of that Ortlieb pack and the way you have it secured. I would consider something like that along with a large handlebar bag for my local bike hikes which don't last more than a week. I would not need the Topeak in that case, and it would be much easier to lock up the bike and carry most of the stuff with me while waling around town or other hiking. On Camino, with the two 20 liter heavy Ortliebs and large handle bar bag that came with the rental, it was a real pain to dismount and carry all that gear into cafes, museums, albergues, etc,

I have never tried panniers on the front, but many long haul cyclists use them, and I am sure it helps with balance and weight distribution.

Yes, I was a bit younger, 56, back in 2016 during that walk up to Roncessvalles for my very first Camino. I knew nothing about trekking poles either. On subsequent Caminos with base weights dialed down to the 10-14 lb range and with poles, it became a pleasant 6 hour hike, and that included a long coffee break at Orrison.

Yes, I know most pilgrims carry 35+ liter packs. Most get through fine, but I also know many who ditched a lot of unnecessary gear, and a few inexperienced folks who cut their Camino short due to exhaustion or injury.

I can tell you will do fine whatever arrangement you decide.

 

[Tigger]

So, the long of the short on this topic seems to be perspective. Some carry a larger pack with everything easily stuffed inside while others mentally feel they have less by carrying a smaller pack with large items connected to the outside... or in a second bag on the handle bars. In the end we all seem to have the same amount of creature comforts for the type of travel and time length of our venture. The Jack Reacher Way is a nice thought. However, somethings do fall into the list of necessities.

 

[mattythedog]

So, the long of the short on this topic seems to be perspective. Some carry a larger pack with everything easily stuffed inside while others mentally feel they have less by carrying a smaller pack with large items connected to the outside... or in a second bag on the handle bars. In the end we all seem to have the same amount of creature comforts for the type of travel and time length of our venture. The Jack Reacher Way is a nice thought. However, somethings do fall into the list of necessities.

Did you carry a large stuffed Tigger (outside your pack) in Sep/Oct 2017 on the CF?

 

[Tigger]

No, I carry a bear named after my Grandfather. He fits comfortable in the outside pouch to enjoy the hike and inside during the ️.