Required level of French?

[inmari]

This may have been a topic earlier as well, but I would like to know how much French one has to know before entering the Tours route (or the route from Le Puy)? Are there any difficult dialects, and what is the normal speed of the spoken language? I have yet two years to o\improve my French, but I may use the time better if not needed!
Pilgrim-to-be Ingrid Marie

 

[Deleted member 3000]

how much French one has to know before entering the Tours route (or the route from Le Puy)? Are there any difficult dialects, and what is the normal speed of the spoken language?

I said, "Thank you" to the customs official on arrival, and he replied, "This is France. Speak French." That was the only "hostile" reaction I have ever received in three pilgrimages in France, so do not be sensitive about your French skills. On the Le Puy route, you will never be far from a translator when you really need one. There is not a lot of English spoken, but there is help if you are patient. Most of the time, you can get away with a smile and hand signals. On the Tours route, you will find even less English, so you need some of the basic phrases.

French is spoken at the speed of light, and apparently there are some strong regional accents. My tone- and language-deaf ear never perceived them. It took me a long time, but I discovered that the speed was the major problem for my vocabulary and grammar deficient French. We stayed with a couple on the Vezelay route, and the husband spoke virtually one word at a time. My comprehension skyrocketed. He spoke no English, and had had few English speaking pilgrims stop, but he had been in the wine export business and discovered decades ago that "plus lentement" was the key to his communication with non-French clients. It is hard to get the French to slow down. They like each sentence to be a single, long sound. Pleasantly have them repeat their words slowly.

You will love France and the French. The churches and chapels are almost all open, and you will find the key to the occasional locked church at someone's home nearby if you just knock on a few doors and ask. Learn the French phrase for that! You will be alone on the Tours route, so I would suggest the Le Puy route unless you really want to be alone.

 

[Kitsambler]

So you have two years to prepare? You should focus first on learning how to pronounce those phrases in the phrasebook (Livemocha.com, Rosetta Stone, and your local community college are all excellent resources). General politenesses, ordering in a restaurant, making a shop purchase, asking directions ... all the usual basics. Be able to make those understood. Then add "more slowly please" (ploo lawn-tee-mawn see-voo-play) and "can you write it please?" (ae-cree-vay see-voo-play?) and you will be able to navigate the basics. MMD indicates the English-speaking accommodations. And the Tourist Offices will also speak English (mostly). Your best resources for calling ahead will be the TO's, your current gite host, and the (numerous when I walked) Canadians.

One thing I noticed: the gite hosts would normally put me (non French speaker) with other English speakers when sorting us out into rooms. Germans and Swiss count as English speakers as far as the French are concerned, too. Once past Figeac on the Le Puy route, I started finding many more expat gite hosts.

 

[lynbru]

We have recently (April-May 2011) walked from Le Puy to St Jean-Pied -de-Port. As other respondents have said the Tourist Offices are really helpful & generally have someone that speaks English. However, the more you understand French the richer your experience will be-particularly reading notices (hours of opening of shops, information about historic sites, cost of groceries etc) & meeting other people.
The hardest thing when learning French is understanding what people are saying to you! At the minimum learn all the polite phrases--thank you, good morning/evening, please, how are you, my name is, "I don't speak French well" etc. Miming comes in handy also.
The French are very courteous & in our experience, will go out of their way to help a stranger who is obviously in difficulties. They do appreciate people trying to speak their language & conforming with their social customs. Have a great time.

 

[michaelwalker]

On the Tours route, it is hard but the people are helpful. At times it's lonesome, but it gives you time to think, pray and meditate.

I walked solo from Tours to Bordeaux last (2010) April to May. I stayed in hotels, camping grounds, slept in a forests (in my tent) and Chambre d'Hote. I'm aussie so have that twang, although I was told my French pronunciation was good.

Before I went I used Michel Thomas beginners French and took a Lonely Planet phrasebook. I'm glad I did. That phrasebook jigged my memory and helped me out a bit. It was a real confidence boost. The people are great, real down to earth country types. Obviously in towns they are more town like. But they don't speak much English or don't want to use it. Why would you, to be honest?

So, YES, learn some French but I only had a rudimentary idea of the French language. I could say in French; hello, please, thank you, I would like.., how much is etc type stuff, do you have a room / bed, where is ... etc. A real great phrase to learn is how do you say .... in French while you use sign language.

I found there are local changes in tone when you walk into differing regions. At times this can catch you but it is rare. It got me thinking when I got back and I found this page that shows you where the language changes are. The map on the page is spot on. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Langues_d'o%C3%AFl

For the le Puy route this page will help http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_France

Obviously they all speak French as they are taught it in school but that map shows where the tonal changes occurred.

One thing I remember is that they count the money back to you at times, so I learnt that way. Try saying ninety in French! It is four twenties and ten. http://www.wordreference.com/fren/quatre-vingt-dix That used to get me.

A hint before you go, there is a moderate amount of road walking on the Tours route, unless you use the GR tracks. If you are on the edge of a long road, swap sides at times so your feet don't get blisters on one side and your ankles are balanced. Also if one knee is hurting, your pack might be out of balance. (I wish I had heard that advice before I went.)

 

[AJ]

A person who speaks 3 languages: trilingual;

A person who speaks two languages: bilingual;

A person who speaks one language: French.

I have walked the Voie de Vezelay and the Via Francigena and found survival level French to be most useful and appreciated by the locals. If your French is crap, do not despair, the locals will love you for trying.

 

[michaelwalker]

I just walked the Voie Littoral alone from Sanguinet to Bayonne then the Tours route from Dax with my brother. we are in Spain now. I found having more French than last year profoundly improved the experience. More French farmers and villagers spent time with me and patiently tried to explain where I lacked but having some French was the key. learn as much as you can before you go. Oh by the way, those that know any English were more willing to speak it with me after I had approached them with French. We met in the middle speaking some weird hybrid.

 

[Kitsambler]

I've just returned from walking Cahors to SJPP in Sept 2011, after walking Le Puy to Cahors in Sept 2010. In 2010 I knew essentially no French (greetings and restaurant orders is all), but this year I had spent some months learning some basic French. The difference in the quality of my travel experience was enormous. If you are planning to walk in France, go learn French! You've got all winter to do it -- get started now.

The resource I used most was http://www.livemocha.com which was excellent, providing a good grounding in grammar and important vocabulary. Just before departure I discovered the Michel Thomas (http://www.michelthomas.com) iPhone app, which very rapidly and significantly improved my proficiency with thinking on my feet.

 

[newfydog]

Thanks for the Michel Thomas link! I want to pick up a little Italian, and it looks like a good method.

I keep working on my French, and in the past year I've really improved my fluency by having a skype based teacher. Twice a week I have a video chat with a French teacher in Narbonne. Sometimes we do grammar, but mostly we talk about the same sort of stuff one would discuss while travelling, hiking, biking and eating in France. We link photos of places we've visited and talk about good places to see, stay, eat etc. I paypal her 10 Euros a class.

There are a number of skype schools available now. Myngle.com is a good place to start. Laurent Boquet is a good teacher over there.
http://www.myngle.com/users/Laurent/lid/10

 

[David]

I used to live in France and I speak French (but am stubbornly hopeless, utterly hopeless at Spanish) - and find that the French tend to be old-school courteous and are inordinately proud of their language and patrimony. Usually an attempt to speak French will result in a kind response - but they will then think you speak French and will give you a fast and long answer that you won't understand!
If someone has a problem, with, say, a broken down car they will not say to a potential helper "I have a problem" but "we have a problem"

Do not attempt to speak with anyone from Toulon - even the French cannot understand them :lol:

By the way - and worth knowing. Men always shake hands when they meet and find it very rude when people don't. and, it is a criminal offence in France not to go to the aid of someone in distress such as their being in an accident or being attacked by another person or persons - which I rather like - vive le Republique!!

 

[Debinq]

David forgot to mention ... whatever you do, don't say 'tu' or use 'toi' when speaking to a stranger; the polite form vous/votre is absolutely de rigeur
and while on matters dear to the French : Allez les bleus! (get in there amongst the black and unpick them!)

happy trails
Peter

 

[David]

Avance le Bleus!

 

[Debinq]

Ouai...le jour de boire va arriver! :wink:

la vie s'arrange...
P

 

[newfydog]

David forgot to mention ... whatever you do, don't say 'tu' or use 'toi' when speaking to a stranger; the polite form vous/votre is absolutely de rigeur
and while on matters dear to the French

I recently stayed with a French friend in Paris, 70 years old, who remarked about how much this has changed in his life. When he was young, some kids had to address their parents as vous. Now it is much more informal, and in a casual situations, such hiking on the Chemins, or running marathons (the guy is 70, but an animal) total strangers far younger than him start right off with tu-toi.

I prefer the safe side, and use vous with my teacher, because if I use tu all the time, it is inevitable that I'll use it with a policeman, a restaurant proprietor, or some place when it is still inappropriate!

Any Spanish speakers out there who can comment on the modern state of tu-usted?

 

[Nena68]

I am a french language major, and have lived/studied in Sherbooke, Quebec for a year, so I am descent in french language (I can read and write quite well), english is my native language.

Soon my husband will be attending McGill college, so I'm wondering what level of french I need to work in Montreal? I can understand people and express myself well-enough, but I wouldn't call myself flawless or fluent.

Here in sherbrooke, people can be kind of critical and seem annoyed if my french isn't perfect...is it more easy going in Montreal? I pride myself on good customer service, so I think I would be ashamed if a customer was annoyed by my little grammar mistakes.

Anyhow, any suggestions of jobs? I've heard about the west island and a few other places. I think I'd like to have a job where I interact with francophones, so I can continue to improve my french ^_^ But maybe somewhere a bit flexible as I learn!

Sorry this is a bit long, thanks to everyone for their help and suggestions...! I do appreciate it! ^_^

*Unlike the other askers who are seeking english-only jobs, I am looking for bilingual jobs, where I can improve my french*

 

[michaelwalker]

I walked the last part of the Tours route from Dax to St Jean Pied de Port, in the end of September 2011.

Knowing conversational French made a LARGE difference from when I walked Tours to Bordeaux June 2010.

The people respond more, your confidence level is increased, if you meet French pilgrims (my brother and I met a Parisian and a Quebecois) you can have a good chat.

Every minute spent learning before you go is well worth it. I used the Michel Thomas recordings. I am an auditory learner so they are best for me. Ask yourself, are you an auditory or visual learner. Then look for resources to match.

PS. Quebecois is slightly different to the French, some words and the pronunciation, but they know French and we communicated well.

 

[sulu]

I recently stayed with a French friend in Paris, 70 years old, who remarked about how much this has changed in his life. When he was young, some kids had to address their parents as vous. Now it is much more informal, and in a casual situations, such hiking on the Chemins, or running marathons (the guy is 70, but an animal) total strangers far younger than him start right off with tu-toi.

I prefer the safe side, and use vous with my teacher, because if I use tu all the time, it is inevitable that I'll use it with a policeman, a restaurant proprietor, or some place when it is still inappropriate!

Any Spanish speakers out there who can comment on the modern state of tu-usted?

I decided that I would 'tutear' everyone on the camino, on the principle that we are all camino 'brothers'. This worked fine with the Spanish and the Germans, the young spanish 'tutear' anyway. Some of the older Spanish looked a bit surprised but were than happy to continue. (by everyone I mean fellow pilgrims!)
However it never worked with the French, they always insisted on vousvoying me. This may have something to do with age, I am in my 60's and I was usually speaking to middle aged french, but I have now accepted that I will always use 'vous' when speaking to strangers in french, if it makes them happy

 

[dannyjoy]

I think initial level is must if you are entering the tour route, at least you can understand the language if you can't speak and if you can speak, there is no major difference if it is poor. You can survive.