Shoes. Strength and stability vs. cushy and soft???

[Melinda Francis]

Hi All!
My first post on the forum!
I am having shoe dilemmas. I've tried many pairs and narrowed it down to 2 pairs - ASOLO Revert GT and Scarpa Terra's. I actually bought the ASOS but am still unsure and have 2 weeks to decide!
The ASOLO are a stiffer boot with a lot more stability (this is a plus for me as I have bad knees and ankles) and are goretex, however the Terra's are leather with goretex lining and are all cushiony and nice inside but the support is not as great. They weigh the same at 1200gm a pair. I'm sure the stiffer boot needs time to wear in but do I go for stability or cushioning?

Also - they measured my feet as a 41. I have plenty of toe wiggle room and as I have a narrow foot room on the edges. Is this enough or do I need to go up another size? I practiced walking the ramps and my toes don't hit the front of the boots when going downhill..

Thanks again! Melinda

 

[AlwynWellington]

@Melinda Francis , hi.

You used the word "narrow" in your message above.

Your message mentions how long your foot is and that there is an adequate wriggle room for your toes.

Two other measures can also be quite important.

One is width. For example, I need a 6E. And it is quite a challenge to meet that need.

Allied to width is the volume of the foot wear. A generous volume can help minimise heat build up.

With heat build up in mind do please consider the trade off between waterproof shoes with goretex or similar materials and the highly probable need for frequent stops (some say hourly for them) to change moist/damp socks. Many walkers associate damp socks (or tight fitting shoes) with blisters.

Kia kaha (be brave/strong)

 

[koilife]

Cushioning will break down, and with it the fit. Assuming you have good fit to start with, go for support and stability, and break the ASOS into your foot, and your foot to it. Also, you want to maximize breathability, so mostly GTX uppers will be more breathable than GTX lined leather uppers. Everything you describe suggests the ASOS as the better choice, in my opinion.

 

[Rick M]

Nobody can advise you on footwear. This is a personal choice since everyone's foot and mechanics is different. What is good for one is bad for another. Now that being said, when are you going? If its during the summer or early fall, consider walking in training shoes or sandals. You do not need a hiking boot for the Camino, a hiking shoe is fine. The trail has just a few rough places, but is mostly quite good. Its not like a wilderness trail or summitting Everest. If you are expecting wet, a waterproof shoe like a gortex or lined leather is a good idea, but bear in mind that waterproof shoes are uncomfortable when the weather is good, especially if your feet sweat. I actually took BOTH when we walked in April. Extra weight, I know, but it was the right choice for me. The gortex shoe was great in the rain/cold and offered support on the dreaded boulder stretches, and the running shoe was better on nice days and in towns, and easier on my feet on the dreaded flagstone stretches.

More important than anything is to train in your chosen shoes well before you leave. You have a chance to realize you have made a mistake, and try something else. It took me a few different shoes before I found one I could walk six hours in.

 

[jacobusg]

Have you looked at Vibram five-fingers?
I couldn't bear the thought of wearing my leather boots on the second camino because of the weight, and the lack of fit. An out-of-normal foot shape means few boots actually fit, and the one brand that did wasn't quite right.
I found the five-fingers to actually work for me, ultralight, and although they let in water it isn't as big a deal as with convenitonal boots since it's almost like walking barefoot (it's on the tin). I also carried a nearly 10kg pack. No problems.
You do need time to get used to them though.

 

[Rajy62]

Hi All!
My first post on the forum!
I am having shoe dilemmas. I've tried many pairs and narrowed it down to 2 pairs - ASOLO Revert GT and Scarpa Terra's. I actually bought the ASOS but am still unsure and have 2 weeks to decide!
The ASOLO are a stiffer boot with a lot more stability (this is a plus for me as I have bad knees and ankles) and are goretex, however the Terra's are leather with goretex lining and are all cushiony and nice inside but the support is not as great. They weigh the same at 1200gm a pair. I'm sure the stiffer boot needs time to wear in but do I go for stability or cushioning?

Also - they measured my feet as a 41. I have plenty of toe wiggle room and as I have a narrow foot room on the edges. Is this enough or do I need to go up another size? I practiced walking the ramps and my toes don't hit the front of the boots when going downhill..

Thanks again! Melinda

Is it two weeks to start the Camino or decide on the boots and start training. These boots needs some breaking before the Camino. Hope it is the latter.

Looking at the specs, the Scarpa uses PU (polyurethane) midsole and the Asolo uses EVA. Your instinct is right, the reason Scarpa feels nice and confy is because it is probably using high quality PU midsole along with some softer synthetic interior. When it comes to quality cushioning PU is the king.

EVA is made popular by runners. They have great cushioning but lacks durability. So, technically Scarpa should be better in this respect.

The outer layer, leather vs synthetic is less important as both use gtx layer. May be Asolo with a slight edge.

Do you sweat a lot? If so, avoid any gtx layers at any cost in a boot. Leather breathes better and can provide sufficient water proofing. If you are considering this class of boots, have you tried the Lowa renegades? I used them on two Caminos. They come in leather lined version. Breathes better. And a good all around boot for the Camino which is hardly a technical trail. For knee issues I would use trekking poles.

 

[Rajy62]

Hi All!
Also - they measured my feet as a 41. I have plenty of toe wiggle room and as I have a narrow foot room on the edges. Is this enough or do I need to go up another size? I practiced walking the ramps and my toes don't hit the front of the boots when going downhill..

Thanks again! Melinda

It is generally a good idea to get a 1/2 size bigger for long distance walking, to allow for varying sock thickness and to have some wiggle room. Since you have a narrow feet don't need to size up too much. But, the shoe must fit snugly. If not, try shows that are made for narrow feet. Again, Lowa makes narrow widths.

 

[Melinda Francis]

Thank you Rajy.
I have 2 weeks to try out the boots - at least 3 months till Camino!
I don't sweat a lot but will wear moisture wicking liners and air my feet regularly. Also thinking of taking a pair of sandals as an alternative.....
I'm now concerned the weight of the boot is too much at 540gm each. Should I go for something lighter?
I don't think I can get Lowa in Australia. I haven't seen them anywhere.
Thanks again

Is it two weeks to start the Camino or decide on the boots and start training. These boots needs some breaking before the Camino. Hope it is the latter.

Looking at the specs, the Scarpa uses PU (polyurethane) midsole and the Asolo uses EVA. Your instinct is right, the reason Scarpa feels nice and confy is because it is probably using high quality PU midsole along with some softer synthetic interior. When it comes to quality cushioning PU is the king.

EVA is made popular by runners. They have great cushioning but lacks durability. So, technically Scarpa should be better in this respect.

The outer layer, leather vs synthetic is less important as both use gtx layer. May be Asolo with a slight edge.

Do you sweat a lot? If so, avoid any gtx layers at any cost in a boot. Leather breathes better and can provide sufficient water proofing. If you are considering this class of boots, have you tried the Lowa renegades? I used them on two Caminos. They come in leather lined version. Breathes better. And a good all around boot for the Camino which is hardly a technical trail. For knee issues I would use trekking poles.

 

[Rajy62]

Thank you Rajy.
I have 2 weeks to try out the boots - at least 3 months till Camino!
I don't sweat a lot but will wear moisture wicking liners and air my feet regularly. Also thinking of taking a pair of sandals as an alternative.....
I'm now concerned the weight of the boot is too much at 540gm each. Should I go for something lighter?
I don't think I can get Lowa in Australia. I haven't seen them anywhere.
Thanks again

Strictly speaking lighter weight shoes would be better. Then you need to consider ankle braces to gain some support. Since I don't face angle issues per se I cannot offer any concrete suggestion. I have seen lot of hikers with active ankle braces and trail shoes.
If you have weak ankles would sandals provide enough support?
Google shows this site selling Lowa in Australia. You may have to order online try/return. Three months is enough to find a suitable shoes.
If you plan to walk the Camino frances, approximately 50% of your walk will be on paved roads, some on gravel and some on rocky uneven trails but well developed. So you can get away with lightweight boot/shoes with some ankle braces. Good luck.

 

[dougfitz]

I'm now concerned the weight of the boot is too much at 540gm each. Should I go for something lighter?

The two boots you have listed are going to be very competent four-season bush-walking boots in Australia. If these were recommended by an outdoor retailer, I suggest you make it clear what you are going to use them for, or find another retailer. There are Camino savvy outdoors retailers in many Australian capital cities but there may not be much experience in most regional centres.

Unless you have specific issues with ankle stability, both these boots will 'over match' the conditions you will meet on the vast majority of the CF. A mid-height boot with a low cut back should suffice, as should a good walking shoe.

@Rajy62, Lowa are not retailed in Australia. Under the circumstances, I am not sure I would be recommending an online purchase.

 

[Melinda Francis]

Thank you Doug.
I really feel you are right and the boots are too much. They are heavy and though they would be great for tough trails I get the impression they are overkill for the Camino.
I did tell all the retailers that I was doing the Camino and went to Sydney to visit all the stores but most only had a rough idea of what it was.
I am now looking at trying hiking shoes instead. I am taking poles so that will give me extra stability. Tbh my ankles aren't too bad it's mostly my knees that are buggered.

The two boots you have listed are going to be very competent four-season bush-walking boots in Australia. If these were recommended by an outdoor retailer, I suggest you make it clear what you are going to use them for, or find another retailer. There are Camino savvy outdoors retailers in many Australian capital cities but there may not be much experience in most regional centres.

Unless you have specific issues with ankle stability, both these boots will 'over match' the conditions you will meet on the vast majority of the CF. A mid-height boot with a low cut back should suffice, as should a good walking shoe.

@Rajy62, Lowa are not retailed in Australia. Under the circumstances, I am not sure I would be recommending an online purchase.

ks

 

[Melinda Francis]

Yes I think I will look at hiking shoes instead. My ankles shouldn't be too bad if I take care of my knees. Hopefully hiking poles will help with that!
Im only looking at taking the sandals as a backup in case my feet need airing

Strictly speaking lighter weight shoes would be better. Then you need to consider ankle braces to gain some support. Since I don't face angle issues per se I cannot offer any concrete suggestion. I have seen lot of hikers with active ankle braces and trail shoes.
If you have weak ankles would sandals provide enough support?
Google shows this site selling Lowa in Australia. You may have to order online try/return. Three months is enough to find a suitable shoes.
If you plan to walk the Camino frances, approximately 50% of your walk will be on paved roads, some on gravel and some on rocky uneven trails but well developed. So you can get away with lightweight boot/shoes with some ankle braces. Good luck.

 

[Ove Garpeman]

I saw a guy in Flip-Flops today

 

[Rajy62]

Yes I think I will look at hiking shoes instead. My ankles shouldn't be too bad if I take care of my knees. Hopefully hiking poles will help with that!
Im only looking at taking the sandals as a backup in case my feet need airing

Melinda,
Knowing that its your knee is more of a problem than ankles, you MUST try the Hoka one shoes. Your knees and all your joints will thank you!
I have tried their trail shoe Mafate 4 and didn't want to take it off my feet until 40 minutes into it my small toes started hurting. Because i have a wide foot. It might be perfect for you.
They also have a hiking shoe, Summit series, comes in low and mid cut with eVent (instead of gtx). Since you don't sweat as much, these can be good choice. Benefit with mid cut is you can wear rain pants over the shoes without gaiters. These shoes are feather lite compared to the boots you were considering. Hope you can find a Hokaone store near you. http://hokaoneone.com.au/

@dougfitz, yes normally online purchase is not the best. Except when it comes to well known brands whose fit/sizing is consistent. Too bad Lowas are not sold in AU, as the renegade is voted one of the best women's boot.

 

[trecile]

Look at the Hoka Challenger.

 

[Melinda Francis]

Lol he's tougher than me! Or crazier.....

I saw a guy in Flip-Flops today

Lol

 

[Melinda Francis]

I ended up returning the Asolos. They seemed like overkill and were heavy. I tried just shoes but found my toes slipped to the front of the shoe when going downhill because there was nothing to hold my ankle back - I'm hoping to keep my toenails so went with a mid boot - the salomon x ultra mid - they're lightweight and instantly comfy - I didn't have to talk myself into them! I also replaced the inner soles with Green Superfeet for arch and heel support. Thank you all for your help- hitting the home trails and hoping for the best!

 

[Kanga]

Dear @Melinda Francis - I've just returned from walking the Camino Frances (again) entirely in sandals. That is not for everyone but as a general rule, all other things being equal, the lighter the shoe the better. It may be hot in July, possibly very hot.

 

[C clearly]

I ended up returning the Asolos. They seemed like overkill and were heavy. I tried just shoes but found my toes slipped to the front of the shoe when going downhill because there was nothing to hold my ankle back - I'm hoping to keep my toenails so went with a mid boot - the salomon x ultra mid - they're lightweight and instantly comfy - I didn't have to talk myself into them! I also replaced the inner soles with Green Superfeet for arch and heel support. Thank you all for your help- hitting the home trails and hoping for the best!

I also use a Salomon boot that fits my entire foot like a glove, holding it in position but leaving good wiggle room in the toe box. I haven't found another brand that fits my foot so well.

 

[Melinda Francis]

Dear @Melinda Francis - I've just returned from walking the Camino Frances (again) entirely in sandals. That is not for everyone but as a general rule, all other things being equal, the lighter the shoe the better. It may be hot in July, possibly very hot.

Thanks Kanga. I am going to take sandals too and rotate. Which did you use?

 

[Kanga]

I wear Ecco's Off-road (mens). They are heavy duty hiking sandals. Not water sandals and they do take a while to dry, although I wear them in mud and water. I also took plastic sandals for the shower.

But really, asking other people is only to get a list of things to try. You have to find the ones that suit your foot.

Last autumn we came across one girl during the last 100km who was walking barefoot. She'd had trouble with several pairs of shoes and sandals. She had taped the bottom of her heel and the balls of her feet, but otherwise nothing. She was happy. Still, I would like to try it on the sharp rocks on the path coming down from the Crux de Ferro.

 

[Track bunny]

Hi All!
My first post on the forum!
I am having shoe dilemmas. I've tried many pairs and narrowed it down to 2 pairs - ASOLO Revert GT and Scarpa Terra's. I actually bought the ASOS but am still unsure and have 2 weeks to decide!
The ASOLO are a stiffer boot with a lot more stability (this is a plus for me as I have bad knees and ankles) and are goretex, however the Terra's are leather with goretex lining and are all cushiony and nice inside but the support is not as great. They weigh the same at 1200gm a pair. I'm sure the stiffer boot needs time to wear in but do I go for stability or cushioning?

Also - they measured my feet as a 41. I have plenty of toe wiggle room and as I have a narrow foot room on the edges. Is this enough or do I need to go up another size? I practiced walking the ramps and my toes don't hit the front of the boots when going downhill..

Thanks again! Melinda

Hi Melinda. I've been doing a bit of long distance walking over the years and I've found that Teva sandals are a really good alternative. I found the problem with wearing ankle top boots was that over time my ankles got lazy and weaker as a result. Since walking in Keens and Tevas I've never had a problem. Nice cool feet too.

 

[Pam Scott]

Hi All!
My first post on the forum!
I am having shoe dilemmas. I've tried many pairs and narrowed it down to 2 pairs - ASOLO Revert GT and Scarpa Terra's. I actually bought the ASOS but am still unsure and have 2 weeks to decide!
The ASOLO are a stiffer boot with a lot more stability (this is a plus for me as I have bad knees and ankles) and are goretex, however the Terra's are leather with goretex lining and are all cushiony and nice inside but the support is not as great. They weigh the same at 1200gm a pair. I'm sure the stiffer boot needs time to wear in but do I go for stability or cushioning?

Also - they measured my feet as a 41. I have plenty of toe wiggle room and as I have a narrow foot room on the edges. Is this enough or do I need to go up another size? I practiced walking the ramps and my toes don't hit the front of the boots when going downhill..

Thanks again! Melinda

Boots are a very personal thing, what suits some, doesn't suit someone else, but I walked in the Scarpa Terra's on the Camino. They were so comfortable, I didn't know I had them on and no blister Buen Camino.

 

[Pam Scott]

Hi

Hi All!
My first post on the forum!
I am having shoe dilemmas. I've tried many pairs and narrowed it down to 2 pairs - ASOLO Revert GT and Scarpa Terra's. I actually bought the ASOS but am still unsure and have 2 weeks to decide!
The ASOLO are a stiffer boot with a lot more stability (this is a plus for me as I have bad knees and ankles) and are goretex, however the Terra's are leather with goretex lining and are all cushiony and nice inside but the support is not as great. They weigh the same at 1200gm a pair. I'm sure the stiffer boot needs time to wear in but do I go for stability or cushioning?

Also - they measured my feet as a 41. I have plenty of toe wiggle room and as I have a narrow foot room on the edges. Is this enough or do I need to go up another size? I practiced walking the ramps and my toes don't hit the front of the boots when going downhill..

Thanks again! Melinda

Hi Melinda. I wore Scarpa Terra's. They were extremely comfortable and light. The bonus no blisters.
Please bare in mind, boots are very personal, what suits one person doesn't suit someone else. Walking trainers are good but if you have wet weather or mud you are more likely to get wet feet, which can easily leave you with blisters. Sandals are good for the evening to give your feet a breath of fresh air, bliss!
As I said I found the Scarpa perfect for the Camino, but everyone's feet are different. Buen Camino x

 

[newgabe]

I just did 350kms of the Camino in ultra lightweight (less than 300kms a pair) extremely cushy/ultra resilient/bouncy soled Rivers Barefoot walkers (easily available in Oz, and cost about $35. I added a pair of Kingsole insoles (made for skateboarders so very bouncy and cushioning- similar price). I sprayed them with waterproofer which was perfectly adequate (it was quite wet for half the walk) as they dry off very fast anyway. Wore bamboo and merino socks that wicked brilliantly so even if/when my feet did get a bit wet they never blistered- I just changed my socks once or twice a day which my feet loved.. it was like starting afresh mid afternoon I did use micropore tape once or twice as a preventative.
I also wore them everywhere for a month before i left, and a lots of street and steps walking for a month in Portugal afterwards. They are just beginning to wear out under the balls of the feet, so at that price I've just retired them and put on another pair. I swear by them. Not a blister, not a twinge in any part of the body.

There's lots of evidence for the principle that trapping feet in stiff shoes just weakens them, and the ankle, and is perilous for the knee. As in.. what happens when we put a plaster cast on a broken bone? The muscles weaken, other areas of the body take the strain for the lost flexibility and unnatural weight and rehab is required. So why splint feet that aren't broken...losing all that multidirectional flexibility in the huge number of muscles ligaments tendons in the feet and ankle, and overloading knees that are only designed to move in one direction. Way better IMHO.. and the opinion of many- to rehabilitate and strengthen the ankles and feet, not imprison and weaken them. Walking on sand is excellent training for this.
Over the walk I saw so so many people with bad knees, tending awful blisters, talking about the nervy pains etc they were experiencing, walking wounded. It never seemed that it was the camino track that had leaped up and hurt them, but was their unwieldy/ stiff shoes. I was floating in my flex shoes and was happier with them on than off . Didn't even want to take them off at the end of the day cos they also cushioned the tiled floors of most accommodation

Then there's the weight issue. this article addresses that well. The body's made to have light flexible things )toes, fingers) at the extremities, not stiff weights. Heavy pendulums on feet affects all the leg/hip.
http://www.backpackingnorth.com/ultralight-makeover-give-your-feet-a-break/

(also a bit off topic but congrats on deciding to use poles. Another huge lifesaver to knees and slip avoider. I'm also a huge fan of Pacer Poles, (only available from the UK maker) but at least if using 'normal' straight/flimsier ones, good idea to read the Pacer Pole info on their website on how to use poles effectively.. e.g. midstride/behind you, not waving them too short in front then having to use the arms too much.) Hope you have a wonderful trip and discover the joys of float-not-trudge