The Delicate Matter of Toilet Paper on the Camino

[Sarahk]

Hi Peregrinos,
I'm concerned by all the toilet paper that's left behind in the pee spots along the Camino. As gross as it seems the first time you do it, it's really easy to put the used toilet paper into a Ziploc bag and toss the paper away when you get to your next alburgue. This is part of Leave No Trace hiking--pack it in, pack it out. it really makes a difference! If toilet paper is picked up, the pee spot (we all seem to find the same places!) will look (and smell) clean and be more pleasant to use.
Sarah

 

[Corwen]

I always carry a lighter to burn the paper when I am trekking if it is impossible to bury it. Obviously you have to be sensible and stamp out any remaining embers before leaving, but burning is a good solution where burying your paper is impossible and saves carrying shitty paper away with you!

 

[whariwharangi]

The problem with burning is that used toilet paper is soggy and hard to light.

If you aren't burying it then burning isn't enough. As the OP posted, the best way is to carry it with you in a ziploc and get rid of the paper next time you are near a toilet (but keep the ziploc).

Mark the ziploc so you don't later reuse it for your favorite treats ...

 

[Tincatinker]

Yes, please, always take your litter with you until you find a proper place for disposal. Soiled toilet tissue is a serious challenge to those who litter- pick on the Camino. They have enough to contend with collecting discarded water bottles, bocadillo wraps and unloved boots.

There are stretches of the France's that can seem more like a paper chase than a pilgrimage and yet the desecration is so unnecessary. For those suffering from the "yuk" sensation please remember that, unless you have one of a few serious infections, urine is sterile when it leaves your body and will remain so for a period subject to environmental conditions. In other words you can carry your soggy tissue to a bin or a lavatory without compromising your personal hygiene. (if your urine has a strong aroma you either do have one of those nasty infections or, more likely, you aren't drinking enough water).

There are numerous sources of information on how to perform the necessaries hygienically in the great outdoors. Google "what bears do".

 

[Corwen]

The problem with burning is that used toilet paper is soggy and hard to light.

Ladies use toilet paper for wee wiping, personally as a man I don't need to do this so I've found toilet paper with a little poo on it burns fine! Depends on the consistency of ones stools perhaps! :mrgreen: Too much information maybe!

 

[Anniesantiago]

Burn paper and you take a chance of starting a wildfire. Please don't.

It is easy and responsible to just carry out your paper. Better yet, do your shitting at the Albergue or where you have your first coffee.

Otherwise, please buy a hankerchief and use it then wash it out at night with your laundry. You can buy them at the 'China shops' for 75 cents to 1 euro each.

Women are the biggest pigs along the Camino, in my opinion. I have seen sanitary napkins and tampons also left along the trail. Who mothered (or rather, did NOT mother) these women???!!

This is a huge issue. You can follow the nast paper trail all the way to SantiAgo and it IS gross.

There are several long threads on this topic already if you do a search.

 

[PeregrinaIR]

"Shake it, shake it like a polaroid picture" - This is usually a good solution and involves no toilet paper whatsoever. - You have a shower at the end of the day, so don't get hung up on it. Last year on a couple of early morning walks (in my case starting at 7:30 - 7:45 ) I nearly stood in other people's mess on the edge of the footpaths a couple of times. I would hazard a guess that some of the eager beavers up and out at 5 a.m. had something to do with it, so bear that in mind if you don't want to be caught short. Otherwise, if you're going to leave more than a little water behind you, take something to bury it with. Buen Camino!

 

[Callea]

My question to the 2 guys who posted about poo paper is, where are you finding enough privacy to poo on the trail. I can't even get a moment alone for a quick pee. Haha! All of my TP use has been in actual toilets so far, as a result.

 

[Kanga]

Women of the Camino,
It is so easy. Wear a small pad. Shake, shake. The pad will absorb any excess. Change the pad at the next coffee stop.

 

[rubyslippers]

I carry toilet paper with me everywhere I travel. In Tokyo you will need it too. I also carry a wet washcloth in a ziplock. Nothing worse that not getting yourself CLEAN and then hiking as you will end up in a "world of hurt." I use a "pee standing up" which I carry in a bag on my belt or in my cargo pant pocket. Carry everything away in a small garbage back. so easy to hook on your waist and easily tossed in a garbage. No one has to carry it for long. Not a big deal, but people who leave this stuff behind amaze me. Who raised them?

 

[november_moon]

Carrying a bit of used TP with you in a ziplock is quite easy - and if you get caught out and need to Number 2, then carry that with you too. Leaving it behind for someone else to deal with is gross and burning is potentially dangerous. Burying TP is ok if you are hiking in a sparsely-used area and you bury it well, but I can't see this working someplace like the Camino Frances - just too many people.

 

[PANO]

Basically, this REAL problem needs to be tackled from two sides:

1. Peregrinos: The same little plastic-bags used by dog-owners are light, take no space and let you pick-up droppings very hygienically. Very common in most European countries, they should be available in Spain too. At least pick-up the TP, the rest will decompose fast enough. (Re-useable ziploc bags....yuk!)



2. The municipalities and Provinces: Hosting an UNESCO World Heritage Site also gives them some responsibilities, among which is the up-keeping of the paths. While most of the bar-keepers, restaurants, etc. do an admirable job of contributing their facilities, it is obvious that urgencies occur on a well-walked path such as the Frances. The resulting hygienic calamity could be greatly diffused by "strategically" positioning bag-dispensers and waste bins. Part of the financing could be raised by charging 5 € or so for an official Credencial.



In today's age and civilisation, this problem can and must be solved.

 

[Anniesantiago]

There are long threads on this topic.

 

[k-fun]

I wrote a guest post on this topic called Letter from Spain: Caga and the Camino de Santiago. You may find some of the comments interesting.

 

[PANO]

I wrote a guest post on this topic called Letter from Spain: Caga and the Camino de Santiago. You may find some of the comments interesting.

Excellent! Thanks.

 

[ajp]

Having just completed my second Camino on the Frances this past fall , I agree the problem of human waste and mess is serious. One would think that with the tremendous amount of traffic now using the trail, and the greatly increased economic spin offs that come from all those pilgrims, that the local authorities would be actively installing washrooms, portable toilets and waste bins at strategic locations along the path. This would alleviate the problem greatly. As matters stand now, it seems every wooded copse or haystack becomes a convenient out house.....very gross.

 

[Tincatinker]

Not at all sure that there are any great economic spin offs for most of the poco pueblo along the Frances. Local bars might make a few euro out of the passing trade but they have to weigh that against the costs of opening up, firing up the coffee machine and staffing the jump. Even at 6.5 € an hour labour is expensive compared to a return of 10c on a cafe con leche, and if there is a bar there is also a toilet.
Installing portaloos and paying a contractor to empty and clean them on an at least weekly basis is way beyond the economic benefit deriving on yet another way station that doesn't even have a bar making a little bit of profit and paying a little bit of tax. Many of the paroquial Albergues are subsidised by the parish, there is no profit to expend or invest.
I'll make an assumption, based on no evidence other than my own experience, that most who walk the way do so with limited means and no intention of spending more than they absolutely have to. So they will pay €5-10 for a bed and another €8-10 for a meal, maybe €1 for a coffee and €3 for a sandwich. Just how much of that is left for installing rest-rooms, portaloos, or even a doggy-doo bin after the people who provided take there living?

The solution lies in our own hands, please pardon a yuk-making pun, clean up after ourselves - don't rely on others to do it for us.

 

[Pruden]

I always carry a lighter to burn the paper when I am trekking if it is impossible to bury it. Obviously you have to be sensible and stamp out any remaining embers before leaving, but burning is a good solution where burying your paper is impossible and saves carrying shitty paper away with you!

Burning is not a good option in Spain! Unless it's from October to May !
Fire are forbidden in countryside from June to October, because of high risk of Fire, and you could even end up in jail.

Buen Camino and be careful.

 

[StuartM]

Burning is not a good option in Spain! Unless it's from October to May !
Fire are forbidden in countryside from June to October, because of high risk of Fire, and you could even end up in jail.

Buen Camino and be careful.

After seeing how quickly dried up scrub catches light I'd be very wary of burning anything regardless of the legal position.

Apart from anything else, the bit that burns best is the, ahem, clean bit so doesn't really solve much problem anyway.

 

[Brendan Dawson]

The way that I see it.....is simply, most of us pick up after our pets (it's the law where I live) so I figure picking up after myself.....when emergencies occur.......really isn't all that challenging.
It seems a very small......but not inconsequential......price to pay for access to the Camino!

 

[MTtoCamino]

I like most others in our new global warming environment have to find ways to make things work in this case the destruction of TP when out in nature. I also burn my TP. I live in the mountains of Montana were the fires get extreme. Matter fact we have a friend who flys all over the world training other country's in fire management. What I do is use the heel of my boot to kick a hole into the earth kick the TP into it & light it making sure there is no fuel close to it. You can add rocks if you are concerned around the pile. If the feces can fit throw /kick/scoop it into the hole after the TP becomes ashes. A light garden trowel works perfect for this duty. Simple yet effective gift for those following.

 

[Brendan Dawson]

I just purchased a box of 24 (lifetime supply, I hope) of human liquid/solid waste bags on "amazon".
I plan on adding a few to my backpack for the "Emergencies) that won't happen.

 

[cher99840]

I carried the very thin bags found in produce sections in grocery stores. They took up very little space and weighed next to nothing.

 

[november_moon]

I live in the mountains of Montana were the fires get extreme. Matter fact we have a friend who flys all over the world training other country's in fire management. What I do is use the heel of my boot to kick a hole into the earth...

I am sure that you are responsible and would never inadvertently start a fire. I am a Californian, so am also QUITE familiar with wildfires. I have spent a lot of time in the woods, had countless campfires, camped wild, know how to be fire safe, etc. I'm confident that I too could burn my TP without setting fire to Spain. I think the issue here though is that there are a lot of people on the Camino, many with NO outdoor experience or practical knowledge of fire safety, so the advice people give has to apply generally.

 

[Christine15]

When I walked last September I too was distressed seeing the disgusting litter, I am in my 60's and found I could "hang on" till I reached a village or town etc. I was prepared though with zip lock bags and toilet paper in each, the plan being if I needed to use them the paper would return to the bag and I would dispose of it at the next garbage bin. Like others posting here, we are not the problem and we do the right thing, however the message needs to be posted in all accommodation along the Camino and when checking in asked to read it. This may not cure all the problem but it might jolt some of the offenders into doing the right thing and from what I saw there are a lot of them.

 

[homa_bird]

Def some TMI ahead, reader beware.

As a lady hiker who has spent lots of time in india, sri lanka...I'm used to no toilet paper (these countries somehow, (easily) get by without toilet paper, paper towels, napkins...it is very refreshing/enlightening/simple and economical), so I have no problem "wiping" pee with a hand. shake hand dry, no problemo. wash hands before eating, there is simply no problem.

For more solid emissions, it's a question of timing, and surely we as adults can all time ourselves appropriately? I mean, you know it's coming, just stay a few more minutes at the cafe, albergue or inn till it's taken care of. I did have one emergency instance after ingesting way too many plums, and believe me I felt pretty badly, as if I'd soiled the land I only wanted to respect and love. Even so, it wasn't hard to get a ways off the trail and bury all traces.

I don't understand the trash and elimination detritus left about by fellow pilgrims along the way, just don't get it. It's like wee children who don't know better were walking there... We should seriously leave no trace. It's not that hard.

And yes, burning tp seems like a crazy risk on a bone dry meseta, a piney wood, or a dusty ditch with dried dock, thistle and spent fennel stalks waiting for a bit of wind blown ember to conflagrate.... muy unwise imho.

 

[MTtoCamino]

I burn mine as stated earlier but I found this article in our local paper, this was down in Alabama. Not so great idea if you end up destroying someone's property.

Hazards of Toilet Paper
After someone rolled a house and trees in Dora, Ala., homeowner Cheryl Crausewell and her son cleaned up most of the mess, but some of the toilet paper remained stuck in a magnolia tree. Crausewell said they set fire to a piece of toilet paper to remove it, but the wind blew it into the front yard, setting the grass on fire. Within seconds, Crausewell said the fire spread to the backyard, where a propane gas tank from a grill fueled the blaze, which destroyed the house. (Birmingham’s WBRC-TV)

 

[emaol]

Perhaps there is an element of local habits we are missing here? I've looked at the floor of a few Spanish bars and seen discarded tissues and cocktail sticks used whilst eating and with no rush from the owner to clean these away. Is the issue of discarded tissue, whether for peeing or from nose-blowing, just more accepted in Spain?

 

[Anniesantiago]

Perhaps there is an element of local habits we are missing here? I've looked at the floor of a few Spanish bars and seen discarded tissues and cocktail sticks used whilst eating and with no rush from the owner to clean these away. Is the issue of discarded tissue, whether for peeing or from nose-blowing, just more accepted in Spain?

There is a huge difference between dropping trash in a bar where the barkeep can sweep it away each night and dropping it in the open, where it sits along a public path and rots. And I doubt the bar tissue has urine and feces on it.

And no, it is not accepted.
It is a disgusting habit of pilgrims who would be screaming obscenities if I dropped my drawers, peed or pooped on their front lawn, and left the tissue (or sanitary napkin), but have absolutely no regard for the people who are hosting them!

 

[emaol]

Hi Annie
You say "And no, it is not accepted", can I ask what you base that on?

The majority of pilgrims are Spanish (http://www.caminoforums.com/general-chat/2604-pilgrim-statistics-when-they-walk-where-theyre.html) and a cursory glance at expat forums points out that some English-speaking expats regard the Spanish attitude to litter as definitely different to their own (http://www.expatforum.com/expats/la-tasca/77510-litter.html).


I'm not looking to blame anybody here (or condone), just offering my own thoughts on why it happens. To my mind, the majority of people who walk the camino don't see the issue, hence why it continues. You travel to Chine, you'll experience a level of spitting that would appal most westerners but is generally socially accepted in that country.

 

[Tincatinker]

In China it is socially acceptable to spit in the street, so in China I will spit. In the USA it is socially acceptable to carry a gun, and to use it it certain circumstances, so in the USA I will carry a gun. In Spain everyone drops litter on the Camino, so...
So perhaps I should behave as I wish to behave, not as others do. Perhaps I should pick up litter, not scatter it. Perhaps I should be grateful to the litter scatterers that there is litter that I may pick but, perhaps I might be more grateful if I could make my pilgrimage without a litter sack in my hand.

It may be true that the average Spaniard has a different attitude to litter and littering to say the average inhabitant of Singapore (and with little to do with the draconian penalties for littering in the latter), but as I picked up some some of the rubbish around the shelter at the top of the hill outside Castrojeriz a (not Spanish) pilgrim told me "we do not have this problem in my country" before walking away leaving his bocadillo wrap and empty Fanta can on the bench where he had sat. The use of the bar floor as a litter receptacle that can be readily swept and saw-dusted ready for the next onslaught has no correlation with the desecration of the Camino by the barely potty-trained.

 

[MTtoCamino]

Another reason this format works. In the back forests of Montana we don,t have much choice, In a country road in an emergency one doesn't either

 

[MTtoCamino]

Hit send accidentally, we all have choices let's be kind to the folks following & use a bag. I can change.

 

[Brendan Dawson]

Hit send accidentally, we all have choices let's be kind to the folks following & use a bag. I can change.

Somebody back in time suggested a little book...."How to shit in the woods" by a river guide named Kathleen Meyer.
I thought it was joke....but found it in Amazon. Turns out that she handles a delicate subject very amusingly....good storyteller!
I just finished it and found it amusing....As well as very useful!
Check it out!
(No, I don't receive royalties)
Buen Camino

 

[Olivia Luna]

Doggie bags!!! Light, multiuse, and come in rainbow colors... so add pretty to the pluses of bringing them along

 

[Anniesantiago]

Hopefully, most people do their BM business in the morning, before they leave, and not on the trail.
Most of the TP I see on the trail is from women urinating.

 

[Olivia Luna]

I posted this before, but will do it again because, ladies, IT WORKS!! No paper necessarily when instructions are followed, put it in the doggie bag and rinse at the next stop, throw away the doggie bad and it is ready to go again. And no, no royalties, just sharing a good thing!!

 

[Providence]

Hi Peregrinos,
I'm concerned by all the toilet paper that's left behind in the pee spots along the Camino. As gross as it seems the first time you do it, it's really easy to put the used toilet paper into a Ziploc bag and toss the paper away when you get to your next alburgue. This is part of Leave No Trace hiking--pack it in, pack it out. it really makes a difference! If toilet paper is picked up, the pee spot (we all seem to find the same places!) will look (and smell) clean and be more pleasant to use.
Sarah

But where does one find a Ziplock bag?

 

[mspath]

But where does one find a Ziplock bag?

Bring a few Ziplocks from home or buy them in a supermarket on the way. Ziplock bags are often available in the same section/aisle as sponges or paper towels.

 

[Providence]

Bring a few Ziplocks from home or buy them in a supermarket on the way. Ziplock bags are often available in the same section/aisle as sponges or paper towels.

Ok, I see I have to add to my backpack: something I do not want to do. Oh, well... thanks for the advise.

 

[MichaelSG]

Hopefully, most people do their BM business in the morning, before they leave, and not on the trail.

Most? Probably. Everyone? Certainly not according to my hound dog nose. There were lots of places along the French route where poop was within inches of the trail. Lots of other places it wasn't far off the trail.

I understand that nature doesn't always allow everyone to confine themselves to a daily discharge before walking out the door or the ability to wait until the next town with an open bar but.... carrying out, or at least burying the paper and the poo is the right thing to do.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Ok, I see I have to add to my backpack: something I do not want to do.

Leave your sleeping bag at home before leaving ziplock bags ; water logged toilet paper does not work well. Neither do water logged clothes or cameras. The bags do not weigh much, but they are quieter than supermarket plastic bags, open and close easily, and keep things dry that you do not want wet (or keep wet things from making others things wet inside your pack; it is not uncommon for laundry to still be wet in the morning). I needed to ice an ankle one camino, and the spare ziplock bag was perfect. My passport, wallet, camera, phone, and credential were all inside ziplock bags, and when it rained, I was glad they were.

 

[Stephen]

What about bringing a few dog poo bags? They weight practically nothing and don't cost much. The paper could be carried in one until the next rubbish bin.

http://www.petco.com/assets/product_images/8/800443104699c.jpg

 

[jefferyonthecamino]

it really is no that difficult an issue, and even if it were, sort it out, it's our responsibility.

really, we wouldn't leave our toilet paper hanging from the bushes in our backyard or in our neighbourhood park... the locals do not appreciate it, we are not entitled to it, and it is just wrong!

 

[whariwharangi]

Ok, I see I have to add to my backpack: something I do not want to do. Oh, well... thanks for the advise.

Use ziploc bags for keeping your passport, your return ticket, your credencial, your wallet and all the money in it, and your toilet paper dry.

Nothing more pathetic than someone hanging out their euros to dry and wondering how to prove they entered the country legally when the ink on the stamp in their passport has run. Never mind whether there is enough photo left of you after the stuck together pages are pulled apart.

The despair truly sets in when they find their soggy toilet paper.

The rain in Spain does not fall mainly in the plain. It falls on your stuff.