The meseta is a desert? Ummmm

[jo webber]

The other day I read a thread about the meseta. Some thought it was a desert, which made me laugh so hard. Fields of green or brown, something grows there.
This is the desert I live in.

 

[domigee]

Like it! The Meseta is fields after fields, not a desert in my eyes
Beautiful pic, btw!

 

[Waka]

Having walked (like so many others) the Meseta it would appear very hard to call it a desert.

 

[Anniesantiago]

It just depends on what time of year you are walking.

 

[Arn]

I am sure many on the Forum have read that the Meseta is long, boring and without redemption. I disagree, though initially, I accepted the hype. Here's what I found: the Meseta provides the opportunity to relax. In many cases, we look forward to or cringe at the thought of walking km after km in an unchanging panorama. Have you considered that the brain catalogues "Normal"? It's part of the "fight or flight" instinct. On the Meseta, the brain can process the unchanging, non-threatening and visually unrestricted view, thus allowing the pilgrim to walk km after km safe in the subconscious. Thus giving vent to reflection, contemplation, and realization that today and now are all that's important. The Meseta allows the connection between pilgrims, that can often be lost due to steep grades, winding roads or bustling towns. So often, the pilgrims we encounter become invisible, or at least "out of sight" to the point they are out of mind. These long, connected waterholes of humanity that mark the Meseta not so much as boring...but alive with opportunity.
May I suggest that you not take that bus or train that relegates you to less than an observer of the Meseta, but rather grasp the brass ring that fairly guarantees you an experience not to be missed.

Buen Camino,
Arn

 

[Mark Lee]

The Meseta is nothing like a desert no matter what time of year one walks it, and I laugh every time someone describes it as one.
It is flat stretches and rolling hills with a lot of agriculture growing. Sunflowers and grain. Reminds me of some parts of the US. It's not unique to Spain.
Also it's not any more difficult than any other part of the CF. Just different. It doesn't play with your mind, and I can't say I had any more or any less self reflection, deep thinking, or whatever when I walked it. Just another lovely stretch of a lovely walk.

 

[KinkyOne]

The Meseta is nothing like a desert no matter what time of year one walks it, and I laugh every time someone describes it as one.

Agree completely. I'm even in risk of the moderators wrath with writing this. I would say that someone thinking Meseta is like a desert that he/she definitely has a little really deserted (might be just a little piece ) and completely empty part of his/her soul.

It is flat stretches and rolling hills with a lot of agriculture growing. Sunflowers and grain. Reminds me of some parts of the US. It's not unique to Spain.

Oregon? Kansas? Yep, cereals, cereals, cereals, cereals, cereals, but the wind in them fields, AHHHHHHHH........., pure beauty. For me, that is...

It doesn't play with your mind, and I can't say I had any more or any less self reflection, deep thinking, or whatever when I walked it. Just another lovely stretch of a lovely walk.

Actally I think it does "play" with your mind. Or at least it could
It's very simple. When people asked me why I enjoy Camino so much I've always gave this example. Imagine there is a 12kms long valley (I remember a stretch from Villamajor de Monjardin to Los Arcos here, but it's not really like that there, similar, yes) and first 4 kms are all cereals. After 15 minutes my brain tells me what the heck, are you joking, it's all the same, and most of its capability goes to "sleep". Wait, I'll explain "sleep" later When I reach another 4kms of olive groves my brain is euphoric, something new, but after 15 minutes - are you kidding me, is there anything else or just that... And it goes to "rest" again. After that I come to another 4kms of vines. And the story with my brain repeated. First wow, in the end disappointment and switching off.
If I would drive in a car though that 12kms stretch it would be like zzzzzt, zzzzzzt and zzzzzt and nothing "important" would happened in my head, yes I'd see everything, but when I put my brain to so-called "sleep", my inner self, my problems, my memories are dealing with themselves without my intervention. All I have to do is to walk (Lthem?) and breathe as normal as I can. That's it. It's not yoga, it's not a meditation as such, but I came out of it like from under the shower. Fresh and all new. Time and time again, especially in flatlands...

Ultreia

Of course, it helps if you repeat it

 

[mspath]

During past caminos there have been Meseta stretches which seemed to be in another world. Gone were the hordes of camera-clicking tourists and/or pilgrims as well as any urbane atmosphere with a bar at every corner. All was reduced to simple basics; I was alone on a seemingly endless gravel path beneath the vast dome of an immense sky. The only sound was the companionable crunch of my boots and perhaps distant birdsong.

Happily for me while tramping along and alone crossing the ' meseta wilderness ' I often sensed that special moment when everything 'clicked' realizing that this was, indeed, MY way and that all was and would be good. ...Perhaps such secular transcendence felt while walking might be akin to what runners call 'the zone'. Your body can handle the task while your spirit glows with the effort. Neither easy, nor impossible; all simply is. ... How I wish that it could be so once again and not only in a dream!

MM

 

[SYates]

Perhaps 'desert' sounds better for some people when they tell their Camino stories at home? You know the ones that start

"Last year I was walking 800km across Spain, climbing high mountains and crossing deserts ..."

Buen Camino, SY

 

[AcrossTheWater3008]

I have to admit I was not happy whilst walking the Meseta..... it was HOT, temperatures was 39C, I think, plus, the scenery was just brown (parched) and terrain flat....... then, I witnessed/heard of some unhappy incidents. In my mind, it is a desert - maybe I need to walk it in the spring, to erase that unhappy mental image.

During that trek, a pilgrim developed severe foot problem and was unable to walk, so one of the heroic pilgrims had to carry her heavy backpack plus his own..., 2 of my friends were so dehydrated - one ran out of water (an experienced CF pilgrim) and another almost fainted from the heat and lack of food (another experienced CF pilgrim)..... another pilgrim lost his phone when he stopped to answer nature's call, and he had to backtrack 12 km (in the heat!) to look for it (he found it, thanks to some help) so I guess, mentally, I think of the Meseta with some misgivings.

 

[galliano]

I am sure many on the Forum have read that the Meseta is long, boring and without redemption. I disagree, though initially, I accepted the hype. Here's what I found: the Meseta provides the opportunity to relax. In many cases, we look forward to or cringe at the thought of walking km after km in an unchanging panorama. Have you considered that the brain catalogues "Normal"? It's part of the "fight or flight" instinct. On the Meseta, the brain can process the unchanging, non-threatening and visually unrestricted view, thus allowing the pilgrim to walk km after km safe in the subconscious. Thus giving vent to reflection, contemplation, and realization that today and now are all that's important. The Meseta allows the connection between pilgrims, that can often be lost due to steep grades, winding roads or bustling towns. So often, the pilgrims we encounter become invisible, or at least "out of sight" to the point they are out of mind. These long, connected waterholes of humanity that mark the Meseta not so much as boring...but alive with opportunity.
May I suggest that you not take that bus or train that relegates you to less than an observer of the Meseta, but rather grasp the brass ring that fairly guarantees you an experience not to be missed.

Buen Camino,
Arn

More or less the words I have been trying to find in myself.
Thank You so much.

Don't skip the Meseta. At least, give it a try.

 

[TaijiPilgrim]

Arn also eloquently articulated some of what I felt on the meseta. Sometimes, as they say, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. I walked with a friend in May, who had originally said she looked forward to the meseta. Perhaps on the 3rd day, she grumpily declared the meseta was so desolate and dead. I, on the other hand, disagreed because I was finding it full of new life and growth and the promise of wheat for food. We were clearly experiencing the same camino in our own unique ways! She took the train to Leon while I continued walking. The meseta was where my spiritual journey began.

 

[Mark Lee]

wow, some very ummm, how would you say, interesting and creative descriptions of farmland in northern Spain....
next time I'm on the CF I would love to smoke what y'all were smoking ha ha

 

[Mark Lee]

I have to admit I was not happy whilst walking the Meseta..... it was HOT, temperatures was 39C, I think, plus, the scenery was just brown (parched) and terrain flat....... then, I witnessed/heard of some unhappy incidents. In my mind, it is a desert - maybe I need to walk it in the spring, to erase that unhappy mental image.

During that trek, a pilgrim developed severe foot problem and was unable to walk, so one of the heroic pilgrims had to carry her heavy backpack plus his own..., 2 of my friends were so dehydrated - one ran out of water (an experienced CF pilgrim) and another almost fainted from the heat and lack of food (another experienced CF pilgrim)..... another pilgrim lost his phone when he stopped to answer nature's call, and he had to backtrack 12 km (in the heat!) to look for it (he found it, thanks to some help) so I guess, mentally, I think of the Meseta with some misgivings.

y'all should have gotten a taxi....

 

[SWi]

There's Camino stories and there's reality. Often seperate worlds. In our fast world with all these loud and colourful media it seems we need Big Stories, like the terrible Pyrenees and the dangerous hot Meseta... Well, I loved it, and I don't mind lots of people skip it. Gives even more space... and it can be the most profound part of the Way. http://sobercamino.blogspot.nl/2015/06/always.html

 

[Rebekah Scott]

I love the Meseta so much I decided to live right in the middle. If you think it is a desert, you have never been here with your eyes open. Even in August and September, when the grain is cut and the dust lays uniform over everything, it's golden. It's a Thomas Hart Benton painting. It is severe, serene, beautiful.
People who say the Meseta bores them are saying more about themselves than about the region. They may be better off skipping on by if they just don't "get it."

 

[alexwalker]

People who say the Meseta bores them are saying more about themselves than about the region. They may be better off skipping on by if they just don't "get it."

That was the statement I was looking for. The Meseta for me is tranquility, peace and reflection. It is one of the best stretches on the Camino Frances.

On the Meseta, the brain can process the unchanging, non-threatening and visually unrestricted view, thus allowing the pilgrim to walk km after km safe in the subconscious. Thus giving vent to reflection, contemplation, and realization that today and now are all that's important. The Meseta allows the connection between pilgrims, that can often be lost due to steep grades, winding roads or bustling towns

Indeed. Very well said. I echo it entirely.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

I was the one who mentiond the word "desert", but not my description but what I expected from what I had read/heard. In fact, on C1 (first Camino), the couple I walked with a lot had skipped the Meseta on their C1 due to injury, and were walking again to redeem themselves from that skip.

Then again, I am also the person who read the Meseta was about walking on tyme, moss, etc.

Neither are right, andI frankly enjoyed the Meseta jist as much as the other bits. I really wish guide books, posts, etc., would stop making it look as if it is any different then the rest od the Frances.

Heck, if you're not going to walk it all, skip the burbs, walk the Meseta.

Oh, wait... Burbs make it a pilgrimage, showing you not all is pretty in life.

Oh rats, maybe jump the rainy Galiza. And first and foremost skip the last 100km of tne Frances.

Yes, that one I do mean, in fact, the Forum should give a certificate to those who walked any othwr 100km, allowing the last ones to go back to what they used to be, ie not too horible. ;0).

 

[KinkyOne]

Oh rats, maybe jump the rainy Galiza. And first and foremost skip the last 100km of tne Frances.

Yes, that one I do mean, in fact, the Forum should give a certificate to those who walked any othwr 100km, allowing the last ones to go back to what they used to be, ie not too horible. ;0).

Not a bad idea at all

 

[susanawee]

The Meseta for me was a special part of my Camino Journey - a walk of deep reflection and contemplation away from all the hustle and bustle of towns, villages and cafes. The terrain, when I walked it in May, put me very much in mind of our beautiful wheatbelt here in Western Ausralia.....mile after mile of beautiful landscape, golden and green.

 

[Penny Kingma]

Maybe it's a typo. It's the dessert after the other experiences. Not something to dread but look forward to. A simple S change the whole picture

 

[SWi]

This day in June. Lingering, seeing what I can see. And knowing the hot afternoon sun is waiting. With a burning sun and a straight path all the way to Calzadilla de la Cueza. I am late. I walk alone. My brothers are further up the road. The other pilgrims have gone by.
All I want is sit in the shadow. But the path has to be taken. And there is no shadow. My water is not endless. A sense of fear. But what can happen, the earth will carry me. I force myself to collect stones. And write them. And lay them on the path. Don't look back.

(last year's M. experience http://sobercamino.blogspot.nl/2015/06/always.html)

 

[sjhannes]

The other day I read a thread about the meseta. Some thought it was a desert, which made me laugh so hard. Fields of green or brown, something grows there.
This is the desert I live in.
View attachment 29499

Perhaps the reference was symbolic

 

[Wupatki]

A peregrino, who otherwise was a clever and perspicacious companion, once said of the meseta, "There's nothing there." I asked him if he had noticed the sky.

 

[Mark Lee]

This day in June. Lingering, seeing what I can see. And knowing the hot afternoon sun is waiting. With a burning sun and a straight path all the way to Calzadilla de la Cueza. I am late. I walk alone. My brothers are further up the road. The other pilgrims have gone by.
All I want is sit in the shadow. But the path has to be taken. And there is no shadow. My water is not endless. A sense of fear. But what can happen, the earth will carry me. I force myself to collect stones. And write them. And lay them on the path. Don't look back.

(last year's M. experience http://sobercamino.blogspot.nl/2015/06/always.html)

it's only about 17k from Carrion to Calzadilla......

 

[xin loi]

Might be worthwhile If you did not walk along side of a road with traffic all day! It is NOT a rural pathway through fields like some people expect it to be--but best part last month was watching a juvenile red fox catch mice in the weeds between the Camino pathway and the road.

The Camino is an Intelligence Test and if you walk all of the Meseta, you failed.

 

[SYates]

... The Camino is an Intelligence Test and if you walk all of the Meseta, you failed.

Then I failed multiple times. SY

 

[Toreld]

I have to admit I was not happy whilst walking the Meseta..... it was HOT, temperatures was 39C, I think, plus, the scenery was just brown (parched) and terrain flat....... then, I witnessed/heard of some unhappy incidents. In my mind, it is a desert - maybe I need to walk it in the spring, to erase that unhappy mental image.

During that trek, a pilgrim developed severe foot problem and was unable to walk, so one of the heroic pilgrims had to carry her heavy backpack plus his own..., 2 of my friends were so dehydrated - one ran out of water (an experienced CF pilgrim) and another almost fainted from the heat and lack of food (another experienced CF pilgrim)..... another pilgrim lost his phone when he stopped to answer nature's call, and he had to backtrack 12 km (in the heat!) to look for it (he found it, thanks to some help) so I guess, mentally, I think of the Meseta with some misgivings.

I walked the Meseta this year in the beginning of June and it was a walk in a wild flower garden. So beautiful.
So fragnant.
Most of my pictures were of flowers.

 

[AcrossTheWater3008]

I walked the Meseta this year in the beginning of June and it was a walk in a wild flower garden. So beautiful.
So fragnant.
Most of my pictures were of flowers.

Hey... I am glad I walked the meseta.... I enjoyed walking and wonder at the changing landscapes of northern Spain as I wound my way to Santiago...

Edit : spelling mistakes!

 

[Rebekah Scott]

It's not an intelligence test. It goes way out beyond intellect. It's a pilgrimage. It's a spiritual exercise. The landscape, and how you feel about it, is secondary.
You get caught up in judging the entertainment value or beauty or ugliness of the landscape you're walking through, well. You're stuck down on that intellect level.
THAT's where you fail.

 

[Saint Mike II]

I have to agree with Rebekah. Why would anyone ever consider ANY part of the Camino Frances an intelligence test. I cycled the section from Burgos to Sahagun, but due to totally adverse weather I rode the train from there to Leon. I so much enjoyed the Meseta I shall be returning in May 2017 to walk from St Jean to Santiago. I have seen the brown Meseta and now want to see it Green. So it will not, by any stretch of the imagination, be an intelligence test, just maybe an endurance test.

 

[Toreld]

The road is the goal ❤

 

[VNwalking]

The Camino is an Intelligence Test and if you walk all of the Meseta, you failed.

Then I'm very happy to be a multiple failure.
And...what @Rebekah Scott said.
The Meseta is the heart of the Camino for me--the only way it could be called a 'desert' is in the sense of the kind of inner and outer wilderness that Jesus went into to confront his demons. Walking across the Meseta may not be a 40 day fast but it definitely cracks open the heart and reveals all sorts of things that need to be confronted. The inner truth is laid out for me to see clearly...which may not always be easy, but it's deeply wonderful.

 

[Kanga]

I'm very happy to be among the failures. In fact, delighted not to share the gifts of the meseta with those fixated on winning.

 

[Penny Kingma]

Might be worthwhile If you did not walk along side of a road with traffic all day! It is NOT a rural pathway through fields like some people expect it to be--but best part last month was watching a juvenile red fox catch mice in the weeds between the Camino pathway and the road.

The Camino is an Intelligence Test and if you walk all of the Meseta, you failed.

Yes some parts run along the roadway...not unlike other parts of the Camino...such as in life...good and bad.

 

[Glenn Rowe]

Hello everyone. This is my first post on this site.

I haven't yet walked the CF (will be doing so in abt. 2 years), so I cannot speak of the Meseta. However, I have walked through, slept in, and marveled at, many areas of the American Southwest. There is much to see, and much to learn, in any desert. All one must do is go silent, then open the senses and mind.

 

[Penny Kingma]

The Meseta is truly beautiful

 

[jpflavin1]

The Meseta is by no means a desert. It is basically farmland with rolling hills, imo, and well worth walking through.

Ultreya,
Joe

 

[Felipe]

Viewed in the Meseta. It gives you some perspective...

 

[Rebekah Scott]

If you consider the Meseta a desert, you've failed the intelligence test!

 

[KinkyOne]

Viewed in the Meseta. It gives you some perspective...
View attachment 31293

Castrojeriz

 

[JabbaPapa]

A desert is any uninhabited wilderness.

ermmm, the meseta ? er nope, doesn't qualify ...

 

[Glenn Rowe]

A desert is any uninhabited wilderness.

Just a bit over-broad. If true, the Boundary Waters/Quetico Wilderness is a desert, as is the Oxbow region of Oregon and large portions of Canada.

 

[JabbaPapa]

Just a bit over-broad. If true, the Boundary Waters/Quetico Wilderness is a desert, as is the Oxbow region of Oregon and large portions of Canada.

Most of Canada is populated, albeit very sparsely. Nature parks/reserves such as Quetico may or may not be inhabited, and in Quetico's case the Lac La Croix natives were forcibly removed from their homes there, though they still maintain a presence.

It's true though that the definition of what a desert is varies culturally -- rather than uninhabited I should probably have used uninhabitable. Some cultures, like the French, don't much distinguish between wilderness and desert.

 

[susanawee]

I fail to see what arguing and debating about whether the Meseta is or is not a desert, or whether Canada is or is not populated, is really of any benefit or help whatsoever to people who are coming to this wonderful Forum for help and advice about their forthcoming Camino journeys, or, even to those of us who just want to share some of our experiences and insights along the way. Pardon me if I am treading on any toes here, but, with everything that is going on in the world at the moment, this just seems like a rather pointless and divisive debate.

 

[dougfitz]

A desert is any uninhabited wilderness.

I think not! It is not clear to me why one would not use the standard geographical definition, nor is it clear that responding to some of the inflammatory posts makes much sense either. But then, I have failed the @xin loi intelligence test, and might do so again.

 

[Peter Fransiscus]

Might be worthwhile If you did not walk along side of a road with traffic all day! It is NOT a rural pathway through fields like some people expect it to be--but best part last month was watching a juvenile red fox catch mice in the weeds between the Camino pathway and the road.

The Camino is an Intelligence Test and if you walk all of the Meseta, you failed.

Happy that I failed.
Wish you well, Peter.

 

[Glenn Rowe]

Gotta say that I love "Xin Loi" as a screen-name. It speaks volumes. The whole thing was beaucoup dien cai dau.

 

[JabbaPapa]

Dunno about "inflammatory" -- but susanawee's point about irrelevance is taken.

 

[Mark Lee]

I fail to see what arguing and debating about whether the Meseta is or is not a desert, or whether Canada is or is not populated, is really of any benefit or help whatsoever to people who are coming to this wonderful Forum for help and advice about their forthcoming Camino journeys, or, even to those of us who just want to share some of our experiences and insights along the way. Pardon me if I am treading on any toes here, but, with everything that is going on in the world at the moment, this just seems like a rather pointless and divisive debate.

Well the topic of the term "desert" to describe the relatively short section of the entire Camino Frances known as the "meseta" (plateau) is kinda important to prospective pilgrims who have never been there before. To the average person when you describe a location as a desert, they think (geographic and weather) sand, cactus, extremely high temperatures, very little water, scorching sun, etc. Like a Beau Geste movie. It is in fact nothing like that, and no special equipment or changes in walking is needed. It's just a flatter part of the walk and it goes through a lot of agriculture fields.
Now if someone enjoys the whole bit about it being a desert of the mind, or it being flatter plays mental games with them? Well, that's cool I suppose. Not my thing, but whatever.
So, any prospective pilgrims reading this....just ignore this banter, walk the Camino. Don't skip the part called the meseta and don't think you need any special prep or equipment for it.