Too many poor pilgrims?

[Stephen]

I saw this posted on a Camino related Facebook page. I'd thought we pilgrims did contribute to the local economy.

“I'm a pilgrim. Will you shout me a drink?”

Number of visitors to pilgrim site of Santiago de Compostela is rising but spending is going down

elpais.com

 

[Tincatinker]

“Most get handed a sandwich in a plastic bag by their Tour Operator “!
They’ll rank along with the “smelly pilgrims “ who use all the hot water. El Pais’ passim. Oh, if only newspapers didn’t feel this desperate need to compete with the internet when it comes to publishing utter b@ll&cks...

 

[Rebekah Scott]

It is an interview with merchants who only want to serve people who have lots of money.
There ARE a lot of freeloaders out there, but they are usually hitting up their fellow pilgrims for handouts, not merchants. The people in the article have been living off pilgrims, and often becoming very wealthy in the process, for decades. They can well afford to spot someone a sandwich, but it does get tiresome, having people in $200 jackets demanding discounts.

 

[SYates]

"The average sum spent by tourists in the city that is Galicia’s capital was €51 ..."

Poor???

BC SY

 

[rappahannock_rev]

I saw this posted on a Camino related Facebook page. I'd thought we pilgrims did contribute to the local economy.

“I'm a pilgrim. Will you shout me a drink?”

Number of visitors to pilgrim site of Santiago de Compostela is rising but spending is going down

elpais.com

"But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest...." Matt 13:29-30

 

[oursonpolaire]

The article, I think, is a few years old and does not bear resucitation. There are merchants who are greatly distressed that we are not jonesing for 5-star rooms, and late at night they dream of New York and Paris prices. They are distressed at a €51 expenditure and weep that they are not raking in the hundreds. O well, that's too bad.

In ten (I am getting treatment for my problem) Caminos I have yet to hear anyone asking to be shouted a drink. The only freeloaders I have run into are well-paid professionals (including several of my own fellow-subjects) who drop two-euro coins in the donativo box and think themselves heroes for it.

 

[Roland49]

I don't think that there are too many poor pilgrims.
Maybe there are more beggars and poor people caused by the financial crisis who try to make their living out off pilgrims and the pilgrimage. The effects of the financial crisis were not totally ceased yet.

In fact I believe that most of the pilgrims are aware of too high prices, unnecessary expenses and scams along the way. Everybody want's to make a living. But I'm deeply convinced that people doing business on the Camino aren't there to offer everything for free.

If half of all walkers doing the trail only for vacancy or out of their wanderlust, the other half are true pilgrims making their way out of spiritual or religious reasons. Why treating them altogether the same?

Maybe the local governments should try to develop parts of the Camino for more recreational purposes and offering this to a more whealthy target group who are able to spend more money.

As I read the article I had to laugh out loud for the statement of a hotel manager. The Camino de Santiago is not NYC, why dreaming / fantasize about the hotel-prices of NYC?

As I written before, I'll try to spend not more than €25/day on the Camino, less is fine, more a no-go. But it will not hurt me to spend more, if I am in need for some special treats.

 

[Kathar1na]

As already pointed out, it's an article from 2017 about tourism statistics for Santiago de Compostela in the year 2016 with an attention catching headline and a few random statistical data including random quotes about foot pilgrims.

If you care to inform yourself about this more than superficially, you can see that the average expenditure per person and per day has gone down by 14 € since 2005, from 71,60 € in 2005 to 57,70 € in 2017, see for example here. The profile of tourists (and yes, that includes foot pilgrims of any kind) in Santiago has changed; the article from January 2019 attributes it to the economic crisis but also to globalisation: travelling has become more affordable if not downright cheap and so more people than ever can travel and that includes many who did not have the means at all to travel in earlier years and spend money in Santiago.

The growth of the albergues and hostels sector has outpaced the growth of the hotels and hostales sector in Santiago during the last decade.

I did not bother to look up total annual numbers of tourists visiting Santiago or their total expenditure but my guess is that both figures have gone UP. Pilgrims on foot are a small proportion of the total annual number of visitors.

 

[t2andreo]

Ask me for water and I will give you my last drop. Ask me for food and I will give you my last morsel. I have done this many times over my Caminos.

But ask me to buy you a beer or a glass of wine and I will likely say no, unless I know more of your backstory. This is especially true if I just encountered you. I might and often do spot a round with a table of fellow pilgrims. I am charitable, but not a sucker...

A beer is not as necessary as water for life, except to some. Mine is not to be an enabler of gluttony or sloth, but to encourage sharing and caritas... The trick is to identify what is indicated based on the moment.

Hope this helps.

 

[J F Gregory]

I find this interesting spending cost per pilgrim may have dropped a few euros, but in the last 10 years the number of pilgrims has risen what? 200% maybe. They have be spending less but since there are many more pilgrims I am sure that business owners are making more money. Personally I like buying gifts for taking to my family and friends, I don't buy them until the end of the walk cause I don't want to carry them while walking.

 

[Kathar1na]

I find this interesting spending cost per pilgrim may have dropped a few euros

All these statistical data do not refer to pilgrims, they refer to visitors (visitantes) with two subgroups: turistas and excursionistas. Turistas are defined as those visitors who spend one or more nights in Santiago. For all we know about spending habits of foot pilgrims in SdC - which is next to nothing - they may even be spending more per day and person in Santiago then before. Foot pilgrims are lumped into the visitantes group and there are no pilgrim specific data to be found in these regular annual surveys/statistics that are done on behalf of the SdC tourism office and on which these newspaper articles are based.

Interestingly, 33% of the visitors name "pilgrimage" as the main reason for their journey to Santiago but only 11% of the visitors say that they arrived in Santiago on foot (2017 report). 49% arrived by plane and 23% travelled in their own car. Only 4% travelled to Santiago on a hired bus.

You can find the annual reports 2005-2017 here: http://www.santiagoturismo.com/centro-de-estudos-turisticos-usc

 

[J F Gregory]

Thanks for the information.

 

[RJM]

Yes, unfortunately the Camino, especially the Frances, has begun to attract and draw in increasing numbers of feral hippie types. Bumming food and money where they can. Smoking dope, sleeping outside in the bigger cities. Around the plazas and such. Walking the Camino simply because it is an easy place to be a nomad or vagabond, not for any spiritual or religious reasons. Not what one would call the faithful poor.
I can see where locals would tire of their presence.

 

[Delphinoula]

Yes, unfortunately the Camino, especially the Frances, has begun to attract and draw in increasing numbers of feral hippie types. Bumming food and money where they can. Smoking dope, sleeping outside in the bigger cities. Around the plazas and such. Walking the Camino simply because it is an easy place to be a nomad or vagabond, not for any spiritual or religious reasons. Not what one would call the faithful poor.
I can see where locals tire of their presence.

Do you remember the cardinal Christian virtues?
Or maybe you believe in an all companionate god?
Well from where I am standing you have not being listening what the Camino is trying to teach. But there is hope walk another one and still an other one.....one day maybe you can see with your heart and hear with your soul.

Sorry if sounded sanctimonious: YOU was meant as in one or the plural form of you. As a southerner would say youall. As a food of thoughts. Me included.

 

[Tincatinker]

This thread contains some interesting comments though it derives from some fairly speculative nonsense that has little regard or relation to most members and their concepts of Camino and Pilgrimage.

However, Members will be minded of the Rules of this forum and in particular Rule 1:

1) Please do not be rude or write anything that can be considered a personal attack. We can have opinions that differ on topics, but we should not get rude or personal. What is rude? or what is a personal attack and what is not? The "receiver" of a comment might think it is rude/a personal attack, while the author might disagree. The final judgement is made by the moderators (we will do the best we can).

 

[RJM]

Do you remember the cardinal Christian virtues?
Or maybe you believe in an all companionate god?
Well from where I am standing you have not being listening what the Camino is trying to teach. But there is hope walk another one and still an other one.....one day maybe you can see with your heart and hear with your soul.

 

[alexwalker]

Be careful judging others, lest be judged yourself. More than once, I have met people who started out as "tourists", but at the end of the day (SdC), had become true pilgrims. I have seen many tears in front of the Cathedral, at the end of the walk, suddenly realising that their walk was over. The force of The Way may be a life transformer for people, if they are lucky and susceptible/open to it. Let them try, and hopefully succed.

As for freeloaders etc. I haven't seen many of them. Those few are easy to spot. But in my years, I have met many kind people, who have grown along The Way.

 

[Hurry Krishna]

"The average sum spent by tourists in the city that is Galicia’s capital was €51 ..."

Poor???

BC SY

But remember some are spending E 500, staying at the Parador and the like. So if the average is 51, there will be a fait few who are spending closer to 5 Euro. But that is not really the point. Didn’t Jesus say something about if you have two tunics give one to he who has none and do likewise with food??? Most of us wouldn’t have the courage to do that. But there’s something so wrong about complaining about pilgrims not spending enough!!!!

 

[Marbe2]

When we stay in albergues, I have noticed more and more pilgrims opting out of meals. But, many of these pilgrims appear to be on very strict budget and may really not have extra money. Almost every camino we try and help out one or the other pilgrim to a free meal or two. On the other hand, one thing that bothers me is a pilgrim wearing an expensive jacket,staying at a donativo,and then complaining because the woman who offered to cook a homemade...a decent sounding meal for 9 euros...was refused because he felt she was “cheating” him at 9 euros.. No thought for her situation. When you go on a camino and can afford a few extra euros...think of those who may really need it! Pray yes,but do good!

 

[Kathar1na]

But that is not really the point. Didn’t Jesus say something about if you have two tunics give one to he who has none and do likewise with food??? Most of us wouldn’t have the courage to do that. But there’s something so wrong about complaining about pilgrims not spending enough!!!!

I don't recall this particular quote but if Jesus said it he didn't mean to say: "Do this when you are camino-ing or when you are in Santiago de Compostela". He meant: "Do this every day of your life".

 

[Seamus68]

Interesting Article , what would happen if all the Pilgrims decided, ok we are no longer wanted here. I bet there would be a lot of unhappy not only local people but business men. I could name loads of villages eg Hornillos , Acebo , that survive because of pilgrims. Local people setting up Albergues. The Logrono issue is sad, I remember sitting at dinner with a group of 20 people having dinner, spending money ! I bet the owner was not complainin. He would if no one came .

A lot of other countries Hungary ( the peace walk), Ireland, Japan are now learning what walks can bring to their economy. Look at pilgrims been ripped off by tacky goods in Santiago. Be careful what you wish for !

 

[Kathar1na]

I'd thought we pilgrims did contribute to the local economy.

We do but perhaps not as much as we like to think. Maybe you are thinking of the stories of reviving communities like Foncebadon (which is not in Galicia, btw).

According to a recent news article, also based on USC studies, walking pilgrims currently directly account for 2.3% of tourism spending in Galicia.

 

[Damienw]

I saw this posted on a Camino related Facebook page. I'd thought we pilgrims did contribute to the local economy.

“I'm a pilgrim. Will you shout me a drink?”

Number of visitors to pilgrim site of Santiago de Compostela is rising but spending is going down

elpais.com

You reap what you sow ! If the Galician government is complaining of the low spend what are they proposing to encourage the pilgrims to spend more. On my first pilgrimage from St. Jean in 2018, my fellow pilgrims were in their mid to late twenties and would describe themselves as budget travellers. They were greatly disappointed by the Galician government’s policy of stripping the kitchens bare of utensils to prevent all the visitors to the municipal Albergues from the means of cooking a simple evening meal.

 

[Felipe]

Sometimes newspapers don't publish info or analysis, but sensationalist, provocative stuff to attract clicks (that's how they make a good part of its income, currently). This one, particularly, is from 2017, came in the wake of another about an irrelevant "Logroño protest" (see this previous thread in the forum) and refers to a statistical survey of ¡2015!
I'd add that a dip of spending average from 53 to 51 euros is well into the margin of statistical error, and quite compensated by the continuous increase of visitors.
My own impressionist view is that the general tendency goes contrary to these note assumptions: all of us have seen and commented the increased (almost rampant) commercialization of the last 100 km. And pilgrim tour operators, as we have extensively commented here, don't come cheap, but anyway they seem to be making a successful operation.

 

[oursonpolaire]

We do but perhaps not as much as we like to think. Maybe you are thinking of the stories of reviving communities like Foncebadon (which is not in Galicia, btw).

According to a recent news article, also based on USC studies, walking pilgrims currently directly account for 2.3% of tourism spending in Galicia.

I would say that 2.3% of tourism spending is pretty impressive for two reasons: tourism spending in Spain is 16% of the country's GDP, a larger proportion than many other countries (Canada, with a large tourism sector, has tourism as 1.9% of GDP); and given that much of this is directed into a series of villages and towns with little other industry, the impact is the difference between viable and non-viable communities. Having walked in parts of rural Spain where the Camino is not a factor, the difference is extraordinary. When I first walked the Camino-- only 16 years ago-- most pueblos had no more than an albergue and a few bars; now the majority of villages have several forms of accommodation and a number of bars and restaurants.

What looks to us like a small figure is actually a very big one in its impact. This article (www.interregeurope.eu/greenpilgrimage/news/news-article/3616/economic-impact-of-pilgrims-on-st-james-way/) can provide some metrics for those interested.

 

[Kathar1na]

This article (www.interregeurope.eu/greenpilgrimage/news/news-article/3616/economic-impact-of-pilgrims-on-st-james-way/) can provide some metrics for those interested.

Thanks for this link. It leads to a nicely done USC report with lots of graphics, following their 2017 survey of pilgrims who walked the Camino Frances through Galicia. This is something you rarely see: where pilgrims actually spend the night. I'm not quite sure how to interpret the number of 1,220,000 nights (I guess it's based on the assumption that each pilgrim spent around 7 nights in Galicia) but it's clear that pilgrims mainly stay in private albergues and hotels and not in the public albergues.



Source: http://www.turgalicia.es/aei/portal/docs/documentacion_vinculada/ir3487.pdf

 

[Rick of Rick and Peg]

A lot of other countries Hungary ( the peace walk), Ireland, Japan are now learning what walks can bring to their economy.

This reminds me of the state of Michigan's tourism agency promoting backpacking about 40 years ago. A state legislator complained about the waste of money saying something like "Backpackers come into the state with a $10 bill and an extra pair of underwear and leave it without changing either."

 

[Delphinoula]

Poor is always relatively speaking.
I had times in my life when I had a meal and did not know if there would be next one coming. But I never really felt poor.
I was shocked to hear the at the end of 2016, the rate of unemployment among young people was 42.91% in Spain. The school dropout rate is high. So some of the drop out you may see along the way maybe you see them with a bit compassion.
So tourism is an employment factor.
In a hot country water is precious, so I take showers accordingly.
If someone is putting an effort and a good value in what they are offering Iam willing to pay the price I can afford.
I have good gear, but I got it used or borrowed or someone gifted it to me. I shard my food and if this meant I had to cook in the Albergue the next night a modest meal, this is ok. I could not eat out every night.

I am respectfull to my host and learnt not to insult if something is given to me by refusing to accept it. As if this was not good enough for me. I am great full for the given hospitality and am not short with thank you and complements.

Some people who complain or feeling cheated, are they really complaining about this or is there somethingelse on the bottom of this.

If I see someone is going to the trash to find something eatable I am respectful not to shame this person.
Many homeless have health issues and can’t fit in a regular live. Some have addiction problems.
They all do not disappear, because you are walking the way.

I can’t help everybody, but I can listen to their stories if the want to tell and I can make them feel valued, because they are.

Are there professional beggars and professional pilgrims on the Camino, sure. If you read Hugo and his description of the court of miracles you may realize this is a very old phenomenon.
For me 50 Euros per day is a lot of money. So in the donativo I gave what I could.
On the way from Finisterre to Muxia I gladly gave in a donativo 5 Euros for a cup of coffee, I valued it and I could. A fellow pilgrim was helped to a donativo and next morning they said to give what it was worth to him and he gave 100 Euros, because it was worth it to him.
Economic reasoning discussed in the media are always relative geared to the buying public.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

You reap what you sow ! If the Galician government is complaining of the low spend what are they proposing to encourage the pilgrims to spend more. On my first pilgrimage from St. Jean in 2018, my fellow pilgrims were in their mid to late twenties and would describe themselves as budget travellers. They were greatly disappointed by the Galician government’s policy of stripping the kitchens bare of utensils to prevent all the visitors to the municipal Albergues from the means of cooking a simple evening meal.

It is NOT Galician government policy to strip the kitchens of utensils. Attempts were made for several years in a row to supply the kitchens, and everything vanished. Whodunnit? It wasn't Galicia. Maybe it was the locals who run restaurants. Maybe it was someone who had a kitchen of their own and saw an opportunity. Maybe it was the pilgrims themselves, who can be remarkably light-fingered when they want something.

Supplying the kitchens was like throwing away money, so the duenos gave it up.

Pilgrims are not entitled to anything.

 

[Thornley]

The only freeloaders I have run into are well-paid professionals (including several of my own fellow-subjects) who drop two-euro coins in the donativo box and think themselves heroes for it.

Completely agree
Like sitting in the front row at church

 

[Thornley]

Thanks for this link. It leads to a nicely done USC report with lots of graphics, following their 2017 survey of pilgrims who walked the Camino Frances through Galicia. This is something you rarely see: where pilgrims actually spend the night. I'm not quite sure how to interpret the number of 1,220,000 nights (I guess it's based on the assumption that each pilgrim spent around 7 nights in Galicia) but it's clear that pilgrims mainly stay in private albergues and hotels and not in the public albergues.

View attachment 51936

Source: http://www.turgalicia.es/aei/portal/docs/documentacion_vinculada/ir3487.pdf

From O Cebreiro there is 7 stages [ according to JB] over 150km
Without doubt there would be 172 ,000 people per annum pass these ways over the year and without doubt with all the tour companies Public Albergues run a very poor third. [ 172 k x 7 nights = 1,220,000]
In fairness we were heading to Pensions and Private one's by this stage .

On my first pilgrimage from St. Jean in 2018, my fellow pilgrims were in their mid to late twenties and would describe themselves as budget travellers. They were greatly disappointed by the Galician government’s policy of stripping the kitchens bare of utensils to prevent all the visitors to the municipal Albergues from the means of cooking a simple evening meal.

And on their return home did they find that the meals offered in the villages with wine included were 30%
of the costs they are now paying for just one course. If you repeat a Camino Damien have a big "lunch"walk on a short distance , have a kip and you will find cheese, sliced meat , biscuits , fruit and Tinto is a beautiful evening meal .

Look at pilgrims been ripped off by tacky goods in Santiago.

Completely agree , its properly why the Compostela is not at the 200km mark.

 

[MichelleElynHogan]

It shows how decrepit the level of marketing knowledge is. In any analysis, the first thing is to identify the Market and its segments. With that, there are individuals who will spend €10, a small number. Then there are the €30 to €50 spenders. And then you have €60 to €100 and €200 and up spenders. Each group has specific demands of value, convenience, needs.

Now, here is what is happening. All these people, transient, tourist alike, have walked a long way to get to SdC. They have reached the destination. We all know what everyone wants. Rest, relaxation, inspiration, food and drink, and maybe a few chachkis to take home.

As a service provider / retailer, it is a common problem, too many sellers for the buyers, too many choices for the Euros coming in.

Along with this, there will be poor pilgrims. Those who have completed a full trek, it is not unheard of for them to be a bit broke at the end, and they still have to get home.

So, what is the solution? It will require a full market analysis and the more accurate information that can be provided, the better the result. It means gathering data from both buyers and sellers, in a number of languages and then reporting the data to the Sellers and perhaps providing crucial information to them on what should be dropped and, maybe a few things that can be added that are presently not being offered. This is where that €51 per person average spend rate can be increased.

Does work create profit? Yes. But smart work will increase profit.

 

[David Tallan]

Interestingly, 33% of the visitors name "pilgrimage" as the main reason for their journey to Santiago but only 11% of the visitors say that they arrived in Santiago on foot (2017 report). 49% arrived by plane and 23% travelled in their own car. Only 4% travelled to Santiago on a hired bus.

I think the focus on walking as the essence of pilgrimage rather than getting oneself to the holy place is relatively modern and not commonly associated with pilgrimage destinations. When I think of other Christian pilgrimage sites, for example - Jerusalem, Rome, Lourdes - I don't think many walk to them, but rather fly or drive, and they probably still consider themselves pilgrims. These statistics don't surprise me.

 

[David Tallan]

I remember when I first arrived in Santiago de Compostela in 1989 paying 200 or 300 pesetas ($2 or $3 Canadian) a night for my own room. What really struck me about the city was that while it was certainly aware that it was a destination city, with plenty of souvenir shops, it wasn't out to gouge the visitor.

 

[Gaddong]

I am grateful the camino has provisions not only lodging but sustenance at a very affordable price and a well maintained path... I wonder who pays for all that because the 5 to 10 euro for lodging does not cut it in my book... the maintenance of the path, the signs etc. The camino is a very inexpensive therapy (In many positive ways) for so many of us and we should not be super cheap about our stay... the cafe con leche y croissant con chocolati for 5 euro no tip is very cheap in Seattle that would be about $9 +1 Tip so you dont get a stare... So dont be scared to spend even a buck or 2 more. On The Other Hand... the bus tourist being provided plastic sandwiches is super cheapskates. They use facilities for free and who pays for their TP, water and soap etc. AH the complaint has merits I think we are just reacting because the article hit us with the POOR word... get over it. I am going back and will pick up some of the plastic water bottles I see along the way... and will give a little tip for good service, there are a lot of great abuela that cooked special Torta con atun for me... I love it.

 

[Thornley]

All these people, transient, tourist alike, have walked a long way to get to SdC.

The 7 stages i have mentioned is where ***most start from , they have NOT walked many km's at all.
The ones commencing from O Cebreiro or Sarria have as much chance of staying in a Public Albergue as flying to the moon.
They are already booked into Private Albergues and Hotels as they allow bookings from tour companies.
*** Check figures

It shows how decrepit the level of marketing knowledge is.

The Camino is very well marketed , life is very simple in Spain don't over complicated it.
If you want marketing experience book a session with the donor of the Albergue in Cumbria , *** he is nearly the best in the world and he has a simple message with this property ......wheelchair pilgrims first then walkers , no cyclists and no booking.

So, what is the solution? It will require a full market analysis and the more accurate information that can be provided, the better the result. It means gathering data from both buyers and sellers, in a number of languages and then reporting the data to the Sellers and perhaps providing crucial information to them on what should be dropped and, maybe a few things that can be added that are presently not being offered. This is where that €51 per person average spend rate can be increased.

Will never occur and neither should it.

Michelle , If you have walked these paths you will know that Spain is a different kettle of fish.
I think the OP now realises how lucky he was and how little it cost to do his Camino so to complain about missing utensils is childish , as Gaddong just quoted .....how's his 9 buck coffee going now he's home?

 

[Margaret Butterworth]

Regarding missing utensils in Galicia, how do the albergues in other parts of Spain manage to avoid this?

 

[Thornley]

how do the albergues in other parts of Spain manage to avoid this?

TOOOOO far to carry Margaret .

 

[Thornley]

A state legislator complained about the waste of money saying something like "Backpackers come into the state with a $10 bill and an extra pair of underwear and leave it without changing either."

In a Weekend Magazine associated with a newspaper here in Australia i was astounded to see this add;
The Crux Of The Camino.
**Captains Choice is a very , very expensive tour company.
Advertising 21 days , walk the MOST magnificent legs of the Camino with a luxury vehicle to whisk you onwards at any point.
The people who use this between 15/5 to 29/5 will only be staying in **** plus class hotels and i notice after San Sebastian , where they commence ............. Sarria gets a mention before SDC.
Luxury room then a Big breakfast ** then little will be spent on the coffee , beer or wine stopovers.
Yes in Galicia [ From Sarria ] the communal albergue is a dying monument.

 

[lizlane]

Walking the way mendicant is perfectly acceptable, holy even.

I'm reminded of my dear friend Jim K, an American vet who lived in Thailand in a rural village because it was paradise for him and offered better living conditions on his service pay/retirement. I met him here on the forums. His moniker was No Money Jim. And when I first saw him posting, after almost eight months of scrimping every which way I could to save for the Way, I thought him foolish, perhaps even bit of a con artist and in my heart of hearts I loathed him. He was raising money on the forums for his trip for a local orphanage in his direct community. We had long messages between us, me telling him walking with no money was unwise, me secretly hoping he wouldn't make it to Spain before me (I was here first, a new Catholic convert and yet still spiritually sick to spout 'a pilgrim thanks...does not demand yet harbor entitlement to God) In fact we became quite good friends and turned out we had much in common. He'd been sober for years in the same 12-Step program I was, with many more years of sobriety. We became friends on FB, messaged often him in Thailand, me in my stale hometown I was born in, a shared dream in common.

Truth be told I probably had the funds for the plane ticket but not to live. I was just jealous. Jim went and I stayed stuck. When Jim got back, he wrote blogs about his lessons "Sunday Coffee with JIm" I would read them but by this time I'm no longer sober. Jim walked and I drank, crushed by my own soul sickness. Jim didn't judge. Jim didn't shun. Everyone in my life had opposed me walking and it crushed my spirit. I opposed him walking but Jim flew to his dreams. Long story short, No Money Jim suffered a massive stroke shortly after returning from his Camino. He had to learn how to walk all over again and his Sunday blogs were about how the lessons he learned on his Camino were helping him LITERALLY to move forward step by step. He did learn to walk again but a second stroke took his life and with news of his death, a little more hope died with me.

Fast forward...it's now almost seven years later. I still haven't walked. I've buried both of my parents, am estranged from my brother and the only Camino fixes I get are from buying everything I can on Netflix relating to it. I'm sober but still stuck spiritually. It's been ages since I prayed a rosary or gone to confession or communion. I've had a massive fight with my sponsor because she made a flippant comment on a FB post I made about the Camino about "if God wills it." (I mean come ON! It's been seven years and the desire hasn't left me!) I buy another random Camino doc late at night because I need something to cling to. Imagine my surprise when almost an hour into it, there is my dear friend "No Money Jim" K being interviewed for the film. Talking about his spiritual awakening and 3rd Step, how he decided to turn his will and life over to the care of God. To see him so serene, this man I never met, knowing what he would face on his return, skinny, knowing there were times he went dumpster diving because sometimes the Camino provided trash for meals, knowing how I had judged him thousands of miles of way and begrudged him the most meaningful experience of his life. Well there are just no words to say with what depth this struck me. First it broke me. Then...It renewed me.

This is what the Camino does. It connects people to people and people to God. It takes all types for that to happen. No amount of capitalism can squelch that. Would I buy someone a meal or a drink on the Camino?

You bet. I do that even still stuck in my stale hometown. The difference is I know when I'm doing it to feel better for myself and when it's God directing me to. Neither are in and of themselves bad or negative. I'm just more grown up now and I'm just as likely to call it a hustle to a person's face but with a knowing smile so THEY know they can be real back with me. And I'm a small-town southern American woman. I'm pretty sure that business owners in a well-traversed place like Santiago can spot the hustlers from indigent, even if they like me, have never left the place of their birth.

This is not new news. What would be new news would be that every person called to the Camino this year would be adequately prepared for their lessons. I'm finally not the spoiled child I was and despite my internal suffering living with the desire for the journey all these many years, I will probably still get blisters. At least they won't be emotional and spiritual ones. Or fester.

FINAL NOTE: The documentary was called "Travel Light", done by women much younger than me and they dedicated their film to my friend Jim.

 

[Robo]

It shows how decrepit the level of marketing knowledge is. In any analysis, the first thing is to identify the Market and its segments. With that, there are individuals who will spend €10, a small number. Then there are the €30 to €50 spenders. And then you have €60 to €100 and €200 and up spenders. Each group has specific demands of value, convenience, needs.

Now, here is what is happening. All these people, transient, tourist alike, have walked a long way to get to SdC. They have reached the destination. We all know what everyone wants. Rest, relaxation, inspiration, food and drink, and maybe a few chachkis to take home.

As a service provider / retailer, it is a common problem, too many sellers for the buyers, too many choices for the Euros coming in.

Along with this, there will be poor pilgrims. Those who have completed a full trek, it is not unheard of for them to be a bit broke at the end, and they still have to get home.

So, what is the solution? It will require a full market analysis and the more accurate information that can be provided, the better the result. It means gathering data from both buyers and sellers, in a number of languages and then reporting the data to the Sellers and perhaps providing crucial information to them on what should be dropped and, maybe a few things that can be added that are presently not being offered. This is where that €51 per person average spend rate can be increased.

Does work create profit? Yes. But smart work will increase profit.

I struggle to find things to spend money on in SdC...........

I stay in Hotels, but mid range.
I love to eat out, but don't find the restaurants that good. (OK shoot me)
Every time I go there I look to buy nice souvenirs but 95% of the shops in the old town just sell tourist 'junk'.

 

[RJM]

I struggle to find things to spend money on in SdC...........

I stay in Hotels, but mid range.
I love to eat out, but don't find the restaurants that good. (OK shoot me)
Every time I go there I look to buy nice souvenirs but 95% of the shops in the old town just sell tourist 'junk'.

That is true. Probably the only thing one could really splurge on would be accommodations, and even then the really expensive hotels are few and far between on the Frances. Most are in the range of 20-50 euros.
My biggest expenses on the Camino was buying replacement items I lost or damaged. Sunglasses, watch, sandals, shirts, trekking poles, a rain parka, hat.

 

[Thornley]

My biggest expenses on the Camino was buying replacement items I lost or damaged. Sunglasses, watch, sandals, shirts, trekking poles, a rain parka, hat.

What else did you have left ??

 

[Prentiss Riddle]

This reminds me of the state of Michigan's tourism agency promoting backpacking about 40 years ago. A state legislator complained about the waste of money saying something like "Backpackers come into the state with a $10 bill and an extra pair of underwear and leave it without changing either."

Is this a universal saying in tourist regions? In Galveston, Texas, it went: "People come from Houston with a $5 bill and a dirty shirt and go back home without changing either one." I heard it attributed to when there was a train serving daytrippers between Houston and Galveston, so it would be a lot older than 40 years ago.

 

[Icacos]

I can't pass up this opportunity.
Could someone who knows how to do it, please post this link properly.

Edit: Oh, it worked!

 

[RJM]

What else did you have left ??

Good one.
That loss etc occurred on multiple Camino walks.

 

[Loretta Jane]

Regarding missing utensils in Galicia, how do the albergues in other parts of Spain manage to avoid this?

I walked the Camino in 2005. There were no pots and pans in Galicia public refugios then. The story was ... to make pilgrims eat out. I can't see pilgrims stealing pots and pans. And there were plenty of pots and pans before Galicia. The public albergues then were also the dirtiest even though they were supposed to have paid help. Seemed weird to me why things changed so much stepping into Galicia. And Santiago seemed so expensive compared to the rest of the camino for food, accommodation, souvenirs. Haven't been since 2006 so I will see quite a change next time by the sounds of it.

 

[gerip]

You reap what you sow ! If the Galician government is complaining of the low spend what are they proposing to encourage the pilgrims to spend more. On my first pilgrimage from St. Jean in 2018, my fellow pilgrims were in their mid to late twenties and would describe themselves as budget travellers. They were greatly disappointed by the Galician government’s policy of stripping the kitchens bare of utensils to prevent all the visitors to the municipal Albergues from the means of cooking a simple evening meal.

Or no kitchen at all. From what I've seen that policy has been put into force long before Galicia. And it's not like many of these towns/villages offer a variety of attractive places to eat. My next leg of the CF I'm carrying an alcohol burner and a titanium pot for those mornings when the first cup of coffee is an hour's walk away.

so many of us and we should not be super cheap about our stay... the cafe con leche y croissant con chocolati for 5 euro no tip is very cheap in Seattle that would be about $9 +1 Tip so you dont get a stare... So dont be scared to spend even a buck or 2 more.

I dunno. A coffee on the main drag in SJPP was €7 last October, while at the coffee bar Oggi Berri (or any random bakery in Pamplona), a coffee was €1.80. If the locals aren't paying inflated prices for a cafe con leche why should I?

 

[Hurry Krishna]

I don't recall this particular quote but if Jesus said it he didn't mean to say: "Do this when you are camino-ing or when you are in Santiago de Compostela". He meant: "Do this every day of your life".

True! But I’m sure he didn’t give special dispensation to any one to reduce generosity of spirit on the Camino either

 

[MichelleElynHogan]

The 7 stages i have mentioned is where ***most start from , they have NOT walked many km's at all.
The ones commencing from O Cebreiro or Sarria have as much chance of staying in a Public Albergue as flying to the moon.
They are already booked into Private Albergues and Hotels as they allow bookings from tour companies.
*** Check figures

The Camino is very well marketed , life is very simple in Spain don't over complicated it.
If you want marketing experience book a session with the donor of the Albergue in Cumbria , *** he is nearly the best in the world and he has a simple message with this property ......wheelchair pilgrims first then walkers , no cyclists and no booking.

Will never occur and neither should it.

Michelle , If you have walked these paths you will know that Spain is a different kettle of fish.
I think the OP now realises how lucky he was and how little it cost to do his Camino so to complain about missing utensils is childish , as Gaddong just quoted .....how's his 9 buck coffee going now he's home?

A problem was given, asking for help, thoughts. I do my best to be helpful in the things I know about. Sorry that I made myself a target. That was not the plan.

 

[Mugatu]

I struggle to find things to spend money on in SdC...........

I stay in Hotels, but mid range.
I love to eat out, but don't find the restaurants that good. (OK shoot me)
Every time I go there I look to buy nice souvenirs but 95% of the shops in the old town just sell tourist 'junk'.

very true, I think I only found two shops I found worth visiting ...Sargadelos and an artisans shop next to it located in a quaint basement... its name escapes me

 

[alex440]

. I'm sober but still stuck spiritually. It's been ages since I prayed a rosary or gone to confession or communion.

I suggest you do breathing meditation. I don't know if you tried it, i suppose you did as a part of 12 steps...

My story is that I also was exhausted of my praying, but breathing meditation gave me a new life. I'm not kidding - after years of being spiritually dead, it returned me that childish ability of being whole and relishing in the moment, while accepting all the pain and the hard feelings being grown up and in complicated relationships inevitably brings...

Also, it slowly trains you to intercept urges and negative thoughts and to live fully in their presense.

What made the difference is lectures by someone called Tara Brach and her book Radical Acceptance. It's based on the Buddhist tradition, but on the parts that are by clinical experience, and I don't see any contradiction of it with being a Christian - I still visit church weekly, and pray sometimes, and I can tell that the quality and the focus of the prayer increased significantly since I've been sitting daily.

Somehow, for me this eastern tradition brings back spirituality to the religion, something I looked for a long time in my community and couldn't put the finger on.

Well, sorry for the many words, it was not connected to the premise of this thread, but maybe it can change someone's life the same way it changed mine.

P.S.There are several simple tricks I had to learn to make the meditation effective - like the pose of sitting and how to treat thoughts, if it's interesting to someone please reply and I can elaborate.

In 3 months we are going to our 2nd short camino - the "noob" Sarria-SdC route.
The previous one was a bit hard on us because my partner was not prepared for walking and I planned every stop from before so we had to struggle walking a pace of 2 km per hour for 10-12 hours per day to make it to the booked accomodation... not a fun way to do the camino...

But we learned and also it will be the first since I discovered the meditation, and I'm eager to see how it will work out.

I hope the way of your life will at some point intersect with the way of the camino...


Buen caminoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!! ))

 

[Evan Lacer]

This reminds me of the state of Michigan's tourism agency promoting backpacking about 40 years ago. A state legislator complained about the waste of money saying something like "Backpackers come into the state with a $10 bill and an extra pair of underwear and leave it without changing either.

Shame on him/her. Stereotyping is never cool.