What do you think: Can I just wing it??

[VNwalking]

A query to the old hands and/or more adventurous around here:
I intend to walk somewhere on the Frances for 2 weeks between about the 22nd of March and the 6th of April next year. At the moment I can't make up my mind exactly where, though. The Meseta? The Invierno? The parts I've not yet seen in the sunshine? Lots of options and possibilities, and they all have their appeal. Really, the where matters less than the walking practice itself--and I certainly am not needing another compostela.

So I wonder. I'd be flying into and out of Madrid from elsewhere in Europe. So how would it be to just arrive at the Chammartin Station and take whatever train was going at a convenient time to wherever it goes (somewhere along the Frances), and walk from wherever that is?

Possible? Is there a particular time of day when this might be more do-able than others? And are the seats easy to come by on short notice? I realize this is in the middle of Semana Santa, and don't know if that would be an issue.

Normally I plan ahead. But it seems like this might be an interesting thing to try...
Thing is, I come from a part of the world where we don't have trains and so don't know the first thing about using them...or what's possible.
(Edited for clarity...)

 

[SYates]

Just do it! You have walked the Camino before so you already know the basics about what to expect. Buen Camino! SY

 

[peregrina2000]

Hi, VN,
I have been thinking something similar. Decide in Burgos whether to hop on a train to Ponferrada or León and walk either Invierno or Salvador/Primitivo. I have the same confidence in you as what SY expressed. However -- your ability to be totally spontaneous might be hampered by Semana Santa, which is one of the biggest holidays in Spain, as I'm sure you know. I think train availability will be very tight that week. I have one data point that surprised me this past summer, when in early July I arrived in Pamplona hoping to buy a ticket on the fast train to Ponferrada the next day. Impossible for the next day and I stopped looking after I got two or three days out. So we wound up on the milk train 8 hour journey. People have told me that RENFE is reducing cars, reducing trains, so that may also contribute to the problem. Buses are probably an easier way to maintain spontaneity -- head to Avenida de Américas' Intercambiador and see where you can go!

 

[Anniesantiago]

If you've already walked the Frances, why not just start walking in Madrid.
It's a lovely route.

 

[CaminoDebrita]

If you've already walked the Frances, why not just start walking in Madrid.
It's a lovely route.

I kind of like this idea as well.

 

[Kiwi-family]

Anniesantiago said exactly what I was going to! SNAP!

 

[CaminoDebrita]

Anniesantiago said exactly what I was going to! SNAP!

I actually considered just walking from Madrid, but for my first Camino, I wanted to do the Camino I actually considered just walking from Madrid, but for my first Camino, I wanted to do the Camino Frances! I'm glad I did, so I can really understand more about basic pilgrim culture – – and also about the fact that it's always harder than you think it's going to be, ha ha!

 

[peregrina2000]

Great idea! Two weeks is a perfect amount of time to walk Madrid to Sahagún. There is some "meseta like" country, some little towns with interesting churches, plazas, etc., nearly all off road walking, very little elevation gain (maybe a plus or a minus depending on your preferences), good albergue infrastructure, and the possibility to detour off to spend some time in Valladolid, which though not spectacular, has a great sculpture museum, and a few other things.

All you have to do is get to the Plaza de Castilla and start following the arrows, which are on the pole outside the Rodilla sandwich shop.





In next to no time, you are out of Madrid and in the country.



You guys are geniuses -- give it some serious thought Viranani!

 

[Kanga]

Yes, I think I'd go for the Madrid too! If time is short I'd hate wasting it getting to the starting point.

 

[VNwalking]

If you've already walked the Frances, why not just start walking in Madrid.

Well Annie (and others), I just like the CF!
But hmm. Thanks, everyone--exactly the feedback I was hoping for. Definitely worth pondering.

I think train availability will be very tight that week. .... People have told me that RENFE is reducing cars, reducing trains, so that may also contribute to the problem. Buses are probably an easier way to maintain spontaneity -- head to Avenida de Américas' Intercambiador and see where you can go!

Yes, this is my main question, Laurie. Perhaps to try getting a train pretty much anywhere on the CF and if none are possible, then to just go with the flow and walk to Sahagun. It's a lovely place to end up...and right near Peaceable Kingdom.
Solo woman? Until this year I wouldn't have given it any thought, but now, sadly, I do.

 

[peregrina2000]

Well Annie (and others), I just like the CF!
But hmm. Thanks, everyone--exactly the feedback I was hoping for. Definitely worth pondering.

Yes, this is my main question, Laurie. Perhaps to try getting a train pretty much anywhere on the CF and if none are possible, then to just go with the flow and walk to Sahagun. It's a lovely place to end up...and right near Peaceable Kingdom.
Solo woman? Until this year I wouldn't have given it any thought, but now, sadly, I do.

In fact, you might be lucky enough to have one of the owners of the Peaceable drive to Sahagun, pick you up, and bring you home for a nice night in their lovely abode. They've been known to do that in the past.

I know what you mean about walking alone, Viranani. This year I walked about 12 days alone total, after and before walking with LT and then Reb, and I won't deny that I walked past solitary parked vehicles in the middle of nowhere with a lot more of my antennae up than in previous years. On my second day on the camino towards Girona, on a solitary descent, a lot of noise in the bushes produced a single dissheveled man, and unlike in previous years (when I would have probably said hi or at least buenos dias), I just picked up the pace and walked faster. I don't necessarily think this heightened caution is a bad thing, but I think we really need to figure out how to integrate it into the reality that the statistics tell about how very safe the Camino is.

 

[Kiwi-family]

It's OK to like the Camino Frances AND to like the Camino de Madrid as well;-) Before long you'll be talking about what's favourite about each route!!! (and the Primitivo - you must do that one when you have a wee bit more time.....and the Via de la Plata, and Levante and Catalan....you might not even go back to the Frances....I have the stretch from Leon to Astorga to do in order to have completed the whole Frances, I'd like to do Saint Jean to Pamplona the right way - I've only done it in reverse.......but other routes keep calling! You have been warned)
(and now you have been tempted too)

 

[VNwalking]

You have been warned and now you have been tempted too)

Well..........I was trying to keep it simple. Thanks Kiwi-family, thanks a LOT!
Not that I haven't been tempted already. Several years ago, while taking a bus journey from Madrid through the Extrmadura to a small town near the Portuguese border (there is a Buddhist nunnery there, if you can believe it...), we went through Placencia...and I remember thinking how interesting it would be to explore this place. And then noticing later that it is on the Via de la Plata--this has definitely been tempting. And the route from Ourense as well. Nice and hilly.

BTW, Kiwi-family, please can you tell me where were these gorgeous pics were taken?

 

[peregrina2000]

Well..........I was trying to keep it simple. Thanks Kiwi-family, thanks a LOT!
Not that I haven't been tempted already. Several years ago, while taking a bus journey from Madrid through the Extrmadura to a small town near the Portuguese border (there is a Buddhist nunnery there, if you can believe it...), we went through Placencia...and I remember thinking how interesting it would be to explore this place. And then noticing later that it is on the Via de la Plata--this has definitely been tempting. And the route from Ourense as well. Nice and hilly.

BTW, Kiwi-family, please can you tell me where were these gorgeous pics were taken?

Not to be pedantic, because I always get confused about this, but there is Palencia, which is up in Reb's territory, and there is Plasencia, which is near, but not on, the Vdlp in Extremadura. But if you walk the Vdlp, you can take a wee detour and get there without too much difficulty!

p.s. those pictures are of Segovia, which you would get to savor if you walked the Camino de Madrid. It has a Renaissance cathedral and old town with several wonderful romanesque churches, a fairy tale castle (on which Disney is reputed to have based his design of the castle in Disneyland), and a jaw-dropping Roman aqueduct. Temptation, temptation......

 

[VNwalking]

Not to be pedantic, because I always get confused about this, but there is Palencia, which is up in Reb's territory, and there is Plasencia, which is near, but not on, the Vdlp in Extremadura.

Thanks, Laurie. That's kindness, not pedantry. I meant Plasencia.
Oh. Segovia...that IS tempting.

 

[Hugh Hertfordshire]

A query to the old hands and/or more adventurous around here:
I intend to walk somewhere on the Frances for 2 weeks between about the 22nd of March and the 6th of April next year. At the moment I can't make up my mind exactly where, though. The Meseta? The Invierno? The parts I've not yet seen in the sunshine? Lots of options and possibilities, and they all have their appeal. Really, the where matters less than the walking practice itself--and I certainly am not needing another compostela.

So I wonder. I'd be flying into and out of Madrid from elsewhere in Europe. So how would it be to just arrive at the Chammartin Station and take whatever train was going at a convenient time to wherever it goes (somewhere along the Frances), and walk from wherever that is?

Possible? Is there a particular time of day when this might be more do-able than others? And are the seats easy to come by on short notice? I realize this is in the middle of Semana Santa, and don't know if that would be an issue.

Normally I plan ahead. But it seems like this might be an interesting thing to try...
Thing is, I come from a part of the world where we don't have trains and so don't know the first thing about using them...or what's possible.
(Edited for clarity...)

If there was only one place on the Camino which I could stay at it would have to be San Bol. I bathed in the Roman spring at 0600 and swam in the cistern. The hostel is heated by a hyperCast and we laid out clothes on the floor to dry. We were ten who gathered together on the Camino and thought San Bol magical

 

[VNwalking]

If there was only one place on the Camino which I could stay at it would have to be San Bol. I bathed in the Roman spring at 0600 and swam in the cistern. The hostel is heated by a hyperCast and we laid out clothes on the floor to dry. We were ten who gathered together on the Camino and thought San Bol magical

Hugh, sadly at that time of year, San Bol, San Anton, and San Nicholas are all closed. (This trio of simple Meseta albergues is precious--and only exist thanks to generosity and very hard work. So if you can stay there, please DO be generous! You're investing in the Camino future in doing so.)

 

[VNwalking]

Now I'm in trouble.
I made the mistake of looking at a map. I could basically take a train to anywhere....

OK...so I ruled out the San Salvador/Primativo a while ago already, before I posted this thread--too early too long for the few weeks I have. Later, if I'm fortunate.
And the Portugese and Norte don't appeal at the moment, for some reason, who knows why.
The Invierno really pulls, but because it's without albergues I'd probably be over budget in an instant.
The VdlP does look interesting, I have to admit.
I trudged from Puente la Reina to Burgos in off and on chilly rain this year. It sure would be nice to see this stretch again, perhaps next time in the sunshine if I'm lucky.
And I have an ongoing love affair with the Meseta.
So now I'm reflecting, trying to narrow things down a bit...I love SdC and one question I'm asking myself is how much do I want to reach there at all or from wherever I start?
Well, I have a few shell offered to me by a friend in NZ for Denise that I'd like to deliver to Faith in person, and a rock for the Cruz de Ferro. Just in case......
And any other opinions gleefully accepted. The planning mind is definitely revving up....

 

[peregrina2000]

Ok, you are one conflicted pilgrim. I know these aren't life's biggest most traumatic decisions, but I understand your pullings and yearnings completely. One way to do this is to first decide whether it's important to arrive in Santiago or not. That's a tough one, as you have already told us. But if you can decide that, and iff the answer is yes, your job is instantly easier. Then you can look at the Camino maps and see the reasonable two week points on the Frances or on the Vdlp/Sanabres. (Zamora to Santiago could be squeezed into two weeks or a little bit more if you have some leeway).

But if you decide that arriving in Santiago isn't high enough on the list of wants, then you're back where you started to pick a piece of the Frances, which seems to be your first instinct. So the obvious points are Pamplona, Leon, or Burgos, just because they will be the easiest places to arrive via train/bus from Madrid. Maybe Astorga too. Keep on twisting and turning, you'll figure out something that sits well, but maybe not for a while!

 

[VNwalking]

No kidding, Laurie. Conflicted is right. But a good sign, actually...I can be too decisive too soon.

But if you decide that arriving in Santiago isn't high enough on the list of wants, then you're back where you started to pick a piece of the Frances, which seems to be your first instinct.

Or as you have all suggested, Laurie and Annie and Deb and Kanga and Kiwi-family, I just start from Madrid...which hadn't occurred to me at all.....
The simplicity of that is definitely appealing.

I need another simplifying piece of information: what do you think the daily budget would be for the Invierno, going as simply as possible?

Keep on twisting and turning, you'll figure out something that sits well, but maybe not for a while!

If prolonged Camino planning counted as a mental disorder, we'd all be in trouble.

 

[obinjatoo@yahoo.com]

You are correct. The "where" and "how" don't really matter. Whatever it is you are needing, The Way will provide. It always does and will. Wing it!!!

 

[DurhamParish]

And the Portugese and Norte don't appeal at the moment, for some reason, who knows why.

I was just going to suggest the Portuguese. You can catch a flight from Madrid to Porto. You don't even have to leave the airport. Just sayin' . . . . . .

Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[Hugh Hertfordshire]

I was just going to suggest the Portuguese. You can catch a flight from Madrid to Porto. You don't even have to leave the airport. Just sayin' . . . . . .

Good luck with whatever you decide.

If your considering the Portuguse have a look at the Portuguse Costal. Fewer crowds fantastically welcoming people. Lovely hostels and varied walking Did it from Oporto all the way up the Portuguse coast then the Spanish to Vigo and on to Redondella

 

[NualaOC]

Hi @Viranani - a quick thought re. winging it on the Frances and the transport challenges of Semana Santa. If you're willing to have a plan B 'just in case', you could pre-book a bus ticket from Madrid (city or airport T4) to Burgos. It's not hugely expensive, so it wouldn't be a disaster if the universe guides you to somewhere completely different when you arrive. Buen Camino and enjoy this lovely dilemma . There are so many fantastic options.

 

[gigibarry]

My two cents... a couple of years ago we were walking during Semana Santa. We flew to Madrid and rented a car so that we could stop in Santo Domingo de Silos on the way to Burgos. We were there for Palm Sunday which was amazing. From the glimpses through the dark on the way there, we were wishing that we could do a little walking in that area as well. We then ditched the car in Burgos and caught the bus to Santo Domingo de la Calzada and walked from there to Astorga. Although I like my heat, it was a nice time to cross the Meseta. We did stay in San Bol (I think it had only opened for the season a day or two before) and had a memorable time. The caretaker lit a fire in the pit outside which is supposed to heat the floor in the dormitory. But there seemed to be a crack in the system so the room filled up with smoke instead of heat and we had to open the window on a cold, wet night. There were only four of us so after the power was cut we disassembled the dining room table and brought the mattresses out to crowd around the tiny wood stove in the dining room to sleep. Unfortunately, they only left us about 6 pieces of wood so we could have slept on top of it by that point without fear of combustion! It was a nice little slumber party vibe though and a good laugh. And we did put the table back together before we left!

Segovia, Segovia...you people are so, so bad for my efficiency Now I'm going to while away half the day doing a fantasy walk through Segovia!

 

[VNwalking]

Segovia, Segovia...you people are so, so bad for my efficiency Now I'm going to while away half the day doing a fantasy walk through Segovia!

Gigi, I know how you feel.
Nuala, that's a grand idea. I've unintentionally walked during 2 Semana Santas in a row and loved the vibe but know all too well about the crowds. This year I was thinking I would be too early...but, no.
And for all you Portuguese fans out there...well, maybe later. Carl, I have to say your idea definitely appeals to the part of me that wants it all planned out, but this is intended as an exercise in seeing how well I can cope with uncertainty. There are no rules in my play-book for this game, so even though there is no 'cheating' possible, that would definitely count as chickening out!

 

[gigibarry]

I've unintentionally walked during 2 Semana Santas in a row and loved the vibe but know all too well about the crowds.

When we walked that week we found that most of the Spanish went home on the Wednesday to spend the rest of the week with their families (we were in Burgos at that point and everyone was doing a mass evacuation to the train station!) leaving just us foreigners for the rest of the trip and making for a quiet walk across the Meseta. Maybe it depends on what section you're walking?

 

[VNwalking]

Maybe it's also a matter of choice. Not everyone likes the Meseta.
Leon/Astoga (this year) and Bierzo/Galicia (last) were both busy at the end of the week.

 

[HeidiL]

We walked 8 days from Madrid at Easter (meeting ONE pilgrim in that time, but having lovely talks with dozens of locals) and will continue from Valdestillas next Easter. When we get to Sahagún, we'll probably go off and do the Inglés as an addition - we've done enough Meseta walks for a while, I think.

The Madrid route is lovely, but requires more Spanish knowledge than the Francés.

 

[Deleted member 12253]

Great idea! Two weeks is a perfect amount of time to walk Madrid to Sahagún. There is some "meseta like" country, some little towns with interesting churches, plazas, etc., nearly all off road walking, very little elevation gain (maybe a plus or a minus depending on your preferences), good albergue infrastructure, and the possibility to detour off to spend some time in Valladolid, which though not spectacular, has a great sculpture museum, and a few other things.

All you have to do is get to the Plaza de Castilla and start following the arrows, which are on the pole outside the Rodilla sandwich shop.


View attachment 22377


In next to no time, you are out of Madrid and in the country.

View attachment 22379

You guys are geniuses -- give it some serious thought Viranani!

I was stuck for my next Camino but you made my mind up. Buen camino

 

[Eliza Eager]

A query to the old hands and/or more adventurous around here:
I intend to walk somewhere on the Frances for 2 weeks between about the 22nd of March and the 6th of April next year. At the moment I can't make up my mind exactly where, though. The Meseta? The Invierno? The parts I've not yet seen in the sunshine? Lots of options and possibilities, and they all have their appeal. Really, the where matters less than the walking practice itself--and I certainly am not needing another compostela.

So I wonder. I'd be flying into and out of Madrid from elsewhere in Europe. So how would it be to just arrive at the Chammartin Station and take whatever train was going at a convenient time to wherever it goes (somewhere along the Frances), and walk from wherever that is?

Possible? Is there a particular time of day when this might be more do-able than others? And are the seats easy to come by on short notice? I realize this is in the middle of Semana Santa, and don't know if that would be an issue.

Normally I plan ahead. But it seems like this might be an interesting thing to try...
Thing is, I come from a part of the world where we don't have trains and so don't know the first thing about using them...or what's possible.
(Edited for clarity...)

In terms of the camino, winging it is no problem at all. In terms of trains during semana santa, you might be adding a layer of complication if my experience is a guide. I've gone to the train sta before and had all seats reserved. Don't forget that there're bus options as well - often with handier schedules. All said - if you are truly open for whatever arises - DO IT. People have before, I know!

 

[VNwalking]

Thank you, Eliza and others for your encouragement and good ideas/advice!

In terms of the camino, winging it is no problem at all. In terms of trains during semana santa, you might be adding a layer of complication

That was the main gist of my question. So it's very good to read of your experience...perhaps the bus is the way to go.
And since I can always walk from Madrid (something suggested here that I hadn't thought of), whether things become complications or opportunities is very much up to me!

 

[Kiwi-family]

Do it - Camino de Madrid! It's Segovia you can hear calling your name;-) And simplicity.
You didn't know you wanted to, but now it's clear!
(By the way, I understand your pulling one way then another - earlier this year my hubby and I decided to walk for two weeks to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary. We were torn between Porto and Madrid and the kids said "Do the Portuguese seeing as you haven't been there before" - and in an instant the decision was made. We still want to walk the Madrid some time, but the Via de la Plata is next because we have a longer time frame. It's great to Just Make A Decision! This year we were tossing up three different routes and now that we are committed to one there is a lovely feeling of anticipation)

 

[HeidiL]

Bring a driving licence and a credit card! We ended up having to rent a car in Santiago at Easter once when all trains and buses to Madrid were full. The car was small and cheap and just right to get us to the airport in Madrid.

 

[peregrina2000]

Bring a driving licence and a credit card! We ended up having to rent a car in Santiago at Easter once when all trains and buses to Madrid were full. The car was small and cheap and just right to get us to the airport in Madrid.

Great advice about the drivers license, Heidi. My walking partner once needed to get home very quickly and found that the taxi alternative was way more expensive than the one way car rental would have been.

 

[VNwalking]

Do it - Camino de Madrid! It's Segovia you can hear calling your name;-) And simplicity.
You didn't know you wanted to, but now it's clear!

Maybe, maybe....

Bring a driving licence and a credit card!

Welllll good idea...but I don't drive anymore and don't have a credit card. (!!) It's not so easy to navigate in the modern world without these, but somehow I manage. It feels subversive in the best possible way, but it does get complicated--and so to get to the camino I have to either hoof it or take public transport.

 

[Kanga]

Well, for the first time in forty years, last September I hitchhiked. Robyn and I had organised to meet some friends in Saldaña, after visiting the Roman Villa La Olmeda. As it is only about 5 kilometres we were planning to walk. But the villa was fabulous and we spent far more time than we had planned, so we only had about ten minutes to get 5 kilometres. Easy in a car, impossible on foot when you are two women in your sixties (with packs). Robyn, being much braver than me, and also a beauty even at 60, just stuck out her hand and made the classic gesture.

Amazing that a kindly couple on holidays from Seville picked us up and took us all the way. They had no intention of going to Saldaña but once they saw it they were blown away and were last seen wandering around slightly gobsmacked. So we did them a good turn too!

 

[VNwalking]

Very brave, Kanga...but there were 2 of you!
"Do not try this at home??" Well, to be honest, I'd be too chicken to....

 

[VNwalking]

Beginning to keep score, as there are now so many good ideas floating around...the Invierno, the Madrid to Sahagun, Ebro/Lana to the Francés from Santo Domingo de Silos, the Sanabrés from I'm not sure where (Pueblo de Sanabres?), and various bits of the Francés...
So today there's a point each for the Invierno and Sanabrés...I just read that the Puerta de Pardon will be open at the Cathedral. Well...that's an opportunity, isn't it?