Which guidebook for good maps?

[maria108]

Dear fellow-pelegrinos!
I am very happily planning to walk the VDLP in april-may this year. However, I am having trouble finding a good guidebook.
On the Camino Frances I used John Brierleys Guidebook, which has excellent maps.

And doing the VLDP on my own - not having a very strong sense of direction - I think I really need some good maps - aside from the waymarking.

The CSJ-bookshop does not have any editions of Alison Raju right now - they're working on a new version - not sure if I can obtain it before I go. The 'Walking the Via de la plata' by Ben Cole and Bethan Davies is sold out from the publisher's - so I don't think there are any other english guidebooks available?

I am open to suggestions for German or Spanish guidebooks - as long as they have good maps! But I would prefer english. (not a great idea to carry a heavy book in a language I only partially understand

There's a google-map online of the route - but...do you print out the whole thing piece by piece to bring it along?

Any good advice or experience is much appreciated! Thank you

 

[jl]

I have downloaded Mundicamino website maps ready to use (just google mundicamino). They are a sort of strip map and I have photo copied them onto double sided sheets and will then discard them as I go. I think that they are reasonably up to date, as they change their style part way through which suggest to me that they may have been updated. The German Rother guide has reasonable maps in it - quite small but pretty good nonetheless, but the trouble with that one is that it is only the Via de la Plata. There is another German guide (Outdoor - number 227) for the Camino Mozarabe published by Conrad Stein, but the maps are not as good as the ones in the Rother guide (Conrad Stein also does a guide for the VDLP)

El Pais Aguilar do a Spanish one (only VDLP - not Mozarabe), with "strip maps" in it. This is a VERY heavy guide - you would not want to carry it. I used the maps though when I did the del Norte - photo copied them again and discarded as I went. How up to date the maps are though I am not sure. It is my understanding that there is so much road works along part of the VDLP that there are quite a few changes and I doubt that at present there is any guide that would be up to date to cover that.

By the way the Cole / Davis was, I think, available from Amazon through their second hand book sellers - that might be worth a try. I purchased the German guides through the book depository - just typed into the search spot "jakobswege". Good luck, Janet

 

[jl]

Have just been on Amazon.com and found these maps / guides:-

VIA DE LA PLATA DE SALAMANQUE A SANTIAGO
by Jean-Paul LECLERE (Author), Lulu Publishing (Publisher)

VIA DE LA PLATA DE SEVILLE A SALAMANQUE [Unknown Binding]
Jean-Paul LECLERE (Author), Lulu Publishing (Publisher)

Via de la Plata Carnet de Route [Unknown Binding]
Jean-Paul LECLERE (Author), Lulu Publishing (Publisher)

And this book is available from the Book depository[/b]

The Via de la Plata: The Way of St. James from Seville to Santiago (Cicerone Guide) (Paperback)
By (author) Alison Raju

Cheers, Janet

 

[jl]

here is a link to the VDLP things listed in the previous post.


http://www.lulu.com/browse/search.php?fSearchData[author]=Jean-Paul+LECLERE&fSearchData[lang_code]=all&fSort=salesRankEver_asc&showingSubPanels=advancedSearchPanel_title_creator

 

[AJ]

Don't forget tourist information offices for maps, guides and accomodation lists. You might be surprised at the quality. In 2008 I inadvertently left my Ragu guide in my hostal in Malaga and had to rely on info from the friends of the Camino in Malaga and tourist info from Merida onwards. The few other pilgrims I met were using French and German guides. I generally found that I didn't need maps as the way was well marked at that time.

 

[Lydia Gillen]

Hi
I have Alison Ragu guide 2005. for Via de La Plata I will not be using it this year and would post it to you if you send me your address and you can return it when finished with it.

Buen Camino

Lydia

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Alison Raju was updated in 2010:

http://www.amazon.com/Via-Plata-Souther ... 128&sr=8-2

The maps are not great, but the step-by-step directions are good, and the historical information very useful. It fits easily into a pocket.

 

[LTfit]

Thanks Falcon for posting the link. Has anyone used the 2010 version?

I am in the same boot, looking for an up-to-date guide. I purchased the english guide Via de la Plata from Pili Pala Press (used their Camino Francés guide last summer) but took it back when saw that it was from 2004. They have some updates on their website but I am not so keen on using such an old version http://caminodesantiagomap.com/plata/updates.html.

You can download a free English language guide through this site:
http://caminodesantiago.consumer.es/los-caminos-de-santiago/via-de-la-plata/
It only goes from Sevilla to Astorga so if you want to add the Via Sanabrés then you need to use another site/book.

In addition to the Mundicamino site mentioned above, I find the Spanish Eroki site is also quite helpful:http://caminodesantiago.consumer.es/los-caminos-de-santiago/via-de-la-plata/.It also gives information on the Camino Sanabrés.

If you read Spanish I hear that the book Via de la Plata a pie y en bicicleta is also quite good:
http://www.casadellibro.com/libro-l...entos-paisajes-ab-ergues-etapas/2900001232684.
I had wanted to purchase it through this site but the postage to The Netherlands was as expensive as the book itself!

So still looking. May just end up printing out information from the Spanish sites although a book is nice to have. I have time since I won't be starting out till July 8th.

Keep us posted if you find anything else.

Cheers,
LT

 

[jl]

The following site (actually posted elswhere about albergues) also has mapping type information on it that you might find useful. Cheers, Janet

http://todosloscaminosdesantiago.com/ca ... abe-etapa1

 

[maria108]

Thanks a lot for the advice on guidebooks! I can only make it from Sevilla to Salamanca this spring, so VDLP-maps will be all I need.
Janet - Thanks for the tip on the German Rother guide - I might look into that - and also thanks for the links.
AJ - Good idea with the tourist-info. I'll try that in Sevilla
Lydia! How very sweet of you to offer to lend me your Alison Raju-guide. If I do not find a more recent guide-book, I'll get in touch with you. You're an angel!
Falcon - I don't think there's a 2010-version of the Raju-guide - it may just be a new print of the old book. Amazon says the new edition will be published in october 2011. But thanks anyway.

I think if I don't find a recent edition of an english guide, I might just follow the example of printing out the new maps - The Consumer-website looks like it's got very good maps!

 

[mmm042]

If you have an iPhone/iTouch/iPad, I'm about to publish an English-language guidebook app on the VDLP from Sevilla to Merida. I just walked that stretch in November, so I have the current road construction information (well, at least as of Nov. 2010). By the end of 2011, I'll have added the rest of the route and it will automatically upload. In addition to lots of written text and about 1,000 photos (for this first section), there's a Google mapping feature that shows you where you are, plus I've included a separate section called Tricky Spots that tells you exactly where to go when things aren't crystal clear (the text tells you, plus there are photos).

For this first issue, there isn't a trail map showing every step of the way like the ones you can see at Godesalco.com. But the software people are working on adding that in, and I hope that I can "draw" the route into the app by the end of the year. It will also be available on Droids at some point this year. If you have an iPhone (or later, a Droid), an app guidebook is great because you're not carrying extra weight.

If you're interested or have more questions, let me know.

Melanie

 

[Anniesantiago]

I used this guide and found it to be very good:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0973169818/?tag=casaivar02-20

I'd give you mine, but I left it at the convent in Leon

 

[Sagalouts]

I tend not to bother with maps too much, it can sometimes get in the way of why we are there.I tend to go with that great guide Yogi bear or some philosopher with a similar name.
"if you come to a fork in the road take it" ommmmm
Ian

 

[maria108]

Ian - I kind of agree with you
However...my sense of direction is really shitty, and so is my visuel imagination, when someone says "just go left, left, turn right at the bridge and pass this and that" - my mind goes blank. So a map is what makes me feel safe. And if I don't need it during a day, then that's great!

Annie - I'm trying to get hold af a used copy. Not possible to order anymore

Melanie - the app. sounds great! I was actually wondering if an iphone could be my solution? Could you access the internet on route? Isn't it crazy expensive? Google maps would probably work for me.
Pity it's only until Merida for now...

 

[peregrina2000]

When I walked last May, the only "guidebook" I had were the Eroski pages. The section "itinerario" gives you all the detail you need, if you speak Spanish, to find your way. Unfortunately, unless I'm missing something, the newly improved format on the website makes it difficult to print out a two or three page guide to each stage. It looks like there are many more sections and pictures added, which will mean more pages of printing. Last year I had a very manageable stack of paper, printed two sided, which took me from Sevilla to Santiago via Ourense. And the nice thing was that I could toss a few pages every day or so.

Buen camino, you will love this walk! Laurie

 

[Canuck]

I I'm trying to get hold af a used copy. Not possible to order anymore

Maria,

You can get a new copy here:
http://www.mapsworldwide.com/publisher_ ... ing+Guides

Hurry! Last one...

Jean-Marc
P-S. I used this guide in 2009 and liked it very much. If you purchase it, make sure to amend it according to the many updates available on the Pili Pala Press site.

 

[maria108]

Jean Marc: ha ha - not sure how you know it's the last one - but I bought it! Now let's hope it's in stock...

Laurie: Thanks for the tip. Yes, the Eroski-page is not that easy to print from - I tried already.. Also my Spanish is not that great. But the maps look o.k., though. I read your 'blog' from your journey last week - Thanks a lot for the info you're putting out there! Can't wait to go!

Extra question (perhaps for a new thread, but here goes):

1) Do I need to bring a sleeping mat or not?? (will be between Sevilla and Merida during Easter...)

2) I read that you might have to wade through a lot of water in spring on VDPL. My boots are lightweight - not waterproof. Should I bring some kind of hiking-sandals, too? Didn't need them on the Camino Frances, but then again, there seems to be a lot of streams to cross on VDPL? Just not happy about adding weight to my backpack.

 

[peregrina2000]

Hi, Maria,

I will let others comment on the sleeping mat. I know Easter time, especially Holy Week right before Easter, is extremely busy on the Vdlp. At least that's what I've heard. I've never used a sleeping mat on any camino, but that's because I'm old and gray :lol: and when the albergue is full I go to a pension or hotel so I can sleep in a bed.

About the water. I expect you will have some crossings that you won't want to do in your boots. There is one on the first day, right before Guillena. I remember that last year in early spring, there was a detour because the water was so high. There were some posts about it:
camino-mozarabe-and-via-de-la-plata/topic7656.html?hilit=guillena#p50478

Another spot is on the day after Monesterio. Last spring it was up to my mid-calf, but the year before it was up to my knee.

And another possibility is the day leaving Fuente de Cantos. There were several places where we had to either walk in high water or try to go across on some precarious logs.

What I think many people do is bring a pair of water sandals that can serve many purposes -- for wearing into the shower (bare feet in albergue showers is not a good idea); for walking around at night with or without socks depending on weather, as an alternative keeping your boots/hiking shoes on; and for crossing streams. I have some Tevas, which are very popular, as are Keenes.

Buen camino! Laurie

 

[Anniesantiago]

Hahaha! It was not the last one.. I bought it TOO!

So there must be more.. but it is difficult to find, so I'd suggest you buy one if you are walking the VDLP.. it really was a good little book. Someone got a free copy in Leon

 

[LTfit]

Hi Annie and Jean-Marc

Just curious, didn't you find it out of date or incorrect (auberges, route, etc.) given it's from 2004?

I bought it last August in a small travel bookstore here in Holland but took it back thinking that it was out-of-date...wondering if I should go back and see if it is still there.

Cheers,
LT

 

[Anniesantiago]

I didn't think it was out of date, but for August it wasn't SAFE because a lot of the fountains it listed were dry.

By the way, I laughed too soon!
I got an email this morning telling me it was out of stock and out of print! lol

Oh well, I have Cicerone's guide.

 

[Canuck]

Hi Annie and Jean-Marc

...didn't you find it out of date or incorrect (auberges, route, etc.) given it's from 2004?

LT,

Once you've updated it with the additional information provided on the Pili Pala Press web site, it's a very good guide, albeit not perfect. There is always the odd small error or change that didn't take place but nothing to send you astray.
I wouldn't hesitate to use it.

In any case, If you really don't like it, you could always fall back on the option of selling it to Annie... :twisted:

Cheers,
Jean-Marc

 

[maria108]

Or sell it to me!

"Dear Maria,
Thank you for your order, but unfortunately one of the items that you have
ordered is out of print with no alternative available to offer you.
Our apologies. You have not been charged for this item. Thank you.

Yours sincerely,
Mapsworldwide Ltd"

So...I have no guidebook whatsoever.

So I am looking at printing maps of the internet. Which maps are the most up-to-date and accurate?

1) EROSKI's: http://caminodesantiago.consumer.es/etapa-de-sevilla-a-guillena

2) Mundicamino's: http://www.mundicamino.com/ingles/

3) That french pdf with handdrawn maps... (can't find the URL but saved the pdf)

Or should I simply go German? (Rother?)

(Alison Raju's guide with all text to describe the route won't work for me)

 

[peregrina2000]

Hi, Maria,

I used Eroski as you know, and it was fine. But I've taken a quick look at Mundicamino and their descriptions of the actual stages and where to walk also sound totally accurate to me. Given the abundance of the arrows, I think either one would be fine. I would see which one can be printed out more easily, because as I said in an earlier post, the new configuration of the Eroski site makes it hard to print out only the essential information -- it's all interspersed with pictures, comments,etc.

But, if you read German, I would go with the German guide book in a minute. When I walked the Camino del Norte, I frequently found that my German friends had all sorts of information that was crucial and helpful that I didn't have in my schematic and out of date English guides. They all used that German series of yellow pocket-sized guidebooks whose name I don't know.

All of the German speakers I met on the Vdlp also had the same series. I assume it was equally excellent, but since I had plenty of information with my Eroski guide and the notes I had squeezed into the margins, I never found myself in the position of having to ask my German speaking friends for help with the route, accommodations, etc. So, that's a long way of saying that you are not going to have a problem no matter which way you go. Buen camino, Laurie

p.s. I see you mention "Rother" guides -- I just took a quick look on the internet, and that looks like the red series. I think most of the Germans I know prefer the yellow series, though you will see both on the Camino. It is also totally possible that I have my colors backwards, so I will leave this question to our German speakers. All I know for sure is that there is a red German guide and a yellow German guide to many Camino routes.

 

[servaasgoddijn]

Hi Laurie and Maria,

De yellow German guidebooks are called OutdoorHandbucher and are edited by Conrad Stein Verlag. They seem very accurate to me. I say seem, because I didn´t use them till now. I´m starting in two month time. They are little and weight near to nothing. After removing the cover and the introduction, the guide for the Norte weights 180 gram. The Primitivo 100 gram. Conrad Verlag gives regularly updates on internet about accomodations, restaurants and prices, that you can write in the margins. Also telephonenumbers, commentaries, and so on.
Servaas

 

[maria108]

Ahhh, the contemplations - going back and forth on what to bring - is half of the fun in doing a pilgrimage

Thanks a lot for the advice on the German Guide. I do read (basic) German, so the yellow guide seems like a good option.

But then I read the advice from Bills Camino http://billscamino.wordpress.com/2010/11/30/additional-information-on-via-de-la-plata/

- and now I am wondering if any of you have some experience with the spanish guide
La Via de la Plata a pie y en bicicleta” by Paco Nadal
http://www.elpaisaguilar.es/index.php?s=libro&id=512

- Is it heavy (to carry along, that is)
- good maps?
- good info?

It would make sense to learn some Spanish - using a Spanish guidebook. My Spanish is not at reading-level, but this would force me to learn some more...

 

[jl]

Hello Maria,

I have both the German books - the yellow Outdoor one weighs 210 grams and the red Rother weighs 235 grams. I also have the Spanish El Pais which weighs around 525 grams. The maps in the Rother guide are far more detailed than in the Outdoor - the Rother has one stage per map whereas the Outdoor has several stages to the one map. The el Pais guide has what I would call a strip map with little drawings to indicate villages, mountains etc on it - however it is quite good at showing distances and provides on the map details of villages such as where there is accommodation, restaurants etc. It really only has the details of the path itself with the odd road that intersects also marked.

If I could read German I would choose the Rother Waderfuhrer guide over the Conrad Stein Outdoor, and I am still considering copying the maps from the el Pais guide. I used the same style of map in 2009 from the El Pais guide on the Camino del Norte, and found them quite helpful.

All three guides do a cross section of the stage walk too.

By the way - if you go onto Google Books you should be able to find the Davis and Cole book there if you want to print it off. Cheers, Janet

 

[maria108]

Janet - it seems that it is only the first 40 pages you can find on Google books. So no maps. But thank you for the advice and especially the weight of the books!

I've decided to follow Lauries advice and work out my own guidebook! I have copy-pasted the maps from Mundicaminos site + added commentaries from Laurie and Bill + I have added spanish commentaries from Eroski and Mundicamino - by simply using Google translate.

If anyone is interested in a Sevilla-Salamanca-maps-and-recent-advice-in-english-guide, I'll find a way to post it here when I am done

 

[ria]

yes, the german conrad stein books (yellow ) are really good. but you have to be able to read german. i used the edition for the portugese last year, and i bought the plata one to do the second half of the plata this year (first part i did with the spanish book of paco nadal, which is also quite good, but too heavy).
last year i was really sorry i didn't bring the norte and the primitivo editions of this guides, because at first sight i didn't like them because of the little crappy maps. but the descriptions are amazingly accurate. i think you can walk a whole camino with it without a single yellow fletcha.
litlle anecdote about me & the guide:
one day - when i was walking on the norte in the woods somewhere, regretting i didn't have this book - it was on the path in front of me! just covered with a little mud. I was so happy. but i decided it is not nice to loose your book, so in the evening i asked every german looking person in the albergue whether they had lost their guide book. none. so it was mine. then, 2 days later a girl appeared in my room in a youth hostel and asked for me, and then for her book. pelgrim tam-tam had spread the news that someone lost the book.... so i had to give it back again
the camino gives and takes
ria

 

[LTfit]

Maria,

Would be great to see what you have come up with. You are in fact a few steps ahead of me as I was doing the same thing this past week-end! I first went through all the blogs of forum members (if you need a list let me know) and am now looking at the Mundicamino and Eroski sites. I don't mind cut & paste but I do like holding a book.

Ria,

If you want to unload Paco Nadal's book after the completion of the Vdlp please let me know. Did you buy it in Amsterdam or over the web? I tried the later but the postage was almost as expensive as the book. You mention that it is heavy but otherwise would you recommend it for the content?

Thanks for advice!
LT

 

[ria]

LT,
I bought Paco Nadal in Santiago after I did the norte, primitivo, ingles, portugues, when I decided I definately needed to do the plata as well
I ripped out the pages after I completed an etappe, to get rid of the weight, and in Salamanca, when I stopped to go back to Amsterdam, I gave the rest of the book to this really cute korean guy who had forgotten his guidebook from korea.
But: you can buy it in amsterdam, at pied a terre at the overtoom, which is two blocks away from my house, so if you want me to buy it for you and mail it, let me know. although i still would recommend the conrad stein book (couldn't find that one in santiago that's why i bought the paco nadal).
Next week i will be in Seville for a few days, so I could find you another spanish guide as well . let me know
ria

 

[Antoinette]

If you have an iPhone/iTouch/iPad, I'm about to publish an English-language guidebook app on the VDLP from Sevilla to Merida. I just walked that stretch in November, so I have the current road construction information (well, at least as of Nov. 2010). By the end of 2011, I'll have added the rest of the route and it will automatically upload. In addition to lots of written text and about 1,000 photos (for this first section), there's a Google mapping feature that shows you where you are, plus I've included a separate section called Tricky Spots that tells you exactly where to go when things aren't crystal clear (the text tells you, plus there are photos).

For this first issue, there isn't a trail map showing every step of the way like the ones you can see at Godesalco.com. But the software people are working on adding that in, and I hope that I can "draw" the route into the app by the end of the year. It will also be available on Droids at some point this year. If you have an iPhone (or later, a Droid), an app guidebook is great because you're not carrying extra weight.

If you're interested or have more questions, let me know.

Melanie

This sounds very interesting since I plan to walk in May/June 2012. What are the details for getting your info? Antoinette

 

[LTfit]

Thanks for your post Ria and offer to pick up the book when you are in Sevilla. I will be in Amsterdam next week so will check it out myself.

Have fun in Sevilla!
Cheers,
LT

 

[LTfit]

Was in Amsterdam today and stopped by Pied à Terre travel bookstore. What a gem! I have never seen such a HUGE selection of Camino de Santiago guidebooks. They also have books and maps for other pilgrim routes. Guides are available in English, Dutch, Spanish, German and French. Here is their website in case interested. I enquired and they ship all over the world:http://www.piedaterre.nl

With regard to the Via de la Plata: after looking through Paco Nadal's guide Via de la Plata a Pie y a Bicicleta I decided not to buy it. I found it quite heavy and a quarter of the book was the connection from Astorga to Santiago via the Camino Francés. I hope to take the Via Sanabrés through Ourense instead.

What I did buy was the Spanish/English guidebook: De Sevilla a Santiage por el Camino Mozárabe published by Asociación de Amigos Via da Plata - Camiño Mozárabe (ISBN 978-84-613-8715-1). It is up-to-date (2010), fairly light and gives concise information regarding etapas, albergues, etc. What it doesn't give is historic/cultural information.

For those interested they also had one copy of the English Via de la Plata from Pili Pala Press (2004).

 

[ria]

Yes LT,
Pied a terre is very good
I spend loads of money there, because it's too close to my house.
good that you found a good book.
I'm also going to do the sanabres part of the plata, but with the little german thing.
ria

 

[maria108]

Hey LTfit,

The guidebook you bought in Amsterdam - what year is it from? And do I understand you correctly that it is both in Spanish AND english??

Does it have maps?

Thanks!

 

[LTfit]

Hi Maria,

The book was printed in 2010 so I assume up to date! And yes, it is in Spanish and English.

The maps are basic but pretty much like those on the Eroski and Mundicamino sights. For each stage they have 2 maps, one with the km and altitude and one showing the route, parallel roads, train crossings, rivers, ruins and towns, etc. I prefer the maps in the Via de la Plata guide from Pili Pala press but 2004 is too old for my liking.

Although weighing less than Paco Nadal's book, it is not light. I just weighed it on my kitchen scale and it is almost 300 gr. This is due to the spiral binding and high quality paper and colored pictures. By comparision my book Walking the Camino de Santiago by Pili Pala Press which I took last year on the Camino Francés is 200 gr.

So although glad I bought it, not sure if I will actually take it. How are you doing with your 'cut and paste' project?

Cheers,
LT

 

[maria108]

LTfit - Thanks for getting back to me with description of the guidebook! Makes me wonder...I also do not want to bring anything too heavy.

My copy-paste-project is almost done. However, the google tranlate version of the spanish text from the Eroski-site has resulted in some pretty weird grammar! PM me if you want me to e-mail you my version so far?

My brother just gave me his "old" iPhone (3) and it's great! If I bring it along, I don't need to take a camera, I can store citymaps and lots of other information in it. I would want to bring a phone anyway (travelling alone) - and even if I'll probably not use it much, it might come in very very handy with GPS, google maps and so on... Also I won't need to bring a book - I can just store one on the iPhone itself. And eventually have a bit of music in my ears, if the road gets too long and lonely. Don't get me wrong - I could do without all this, but if I want to bring camera and phone, it's the perfect all-in-one solution.

So now I'll get in touch with Melanie from the start of this thread and see about her upcoming app. to the iPhone!

 

[maria108]

Woohoo - the new edition of the CSJ via de la plata guide is out. I have already ordered. Hope it contains maps...

 

[ffp13]

I have the kindle app loaded on my iPhone , there are a few camino ebook guides available from kindle (amazon) so no more carrying heavy books for me.

 

[Bocodillo Boy]

I can not think how I could walk a Camino without taking the most up to date edition of the CSJ Guide. I make annotations in ballpoint before my departure with my own notes lifted from other sources of information.

It can be out of date but I also take a photocopy of only the relevant pages of the Cicerone Guide and each morning stuff the page(es) for that day's walk in my pocket so that I can refer to it without stopping throughout the day - It doesn't matter if it gets wet or crumpelled because at the end of the day I simply throw away that page and my pack gets a tiny bit lighter! I particularly enjoy the historical bits of the Cicerone guide and these don't become dated.

 

[LTfit]

Maria - Have you received the new CSJ guide for the via de la plata and if so would you recommend it?

 

[maria108]

I have not yet received the Guidebook, althought the CSJ bookshop claim to have sent it to me 17 days ago. And I have paid already...So I'm not quite happy...

Copenhagen is not 17 days away from UK. Unless you walk...