Why stay in traditional albergues when you could sleep better elsewhere?

[Hobbyhorse]

I'm finishing notes for a local pilgrim group discussion and would like to include the voices of other forum members if some of you don't mind. Our subject is why many people who would normally avoid shared rooms & baths, and who could afford other options, nonetheless do choose to spend a good portion of their nights without privacy in pilgrim albergues. Even among snorers, or even if we are the snorers!

Apart from the practical points that communal sleeping etc is affordable, and the non-reservable kind of albergues don't disappear off the market days in advance, what more personal motivations would you mention?

I don't think that there is a 'right' choice of acommodation, or even that the same pilgrim would make the same type of choices every night, but if you personally do often default to the traditional type of albergues, why?

 

[RENSHAW]

but if you personally do often default to the traditional type of albergues, why?

Terrified of not getting a 'Sello' , visions of Sweeney Todd and naivety.............. Seriously ..........not enough time to organise a change in ones itineraty and knowing that there will be someone else that you know at the 'Traditional'?
Traditional albergues are usually very central

 

[Dancing Rain]

A way to connect with others, enhanced by a shared goal and experiences of delight and adversity.

 

[William Marques]

This thread may be relevant to your discussion.
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/com...ccommodation-doesnt-make-you-a-pilgrim.43115/

 

[oursonpolaire]

As a French pilgrim told me, there is an absolute and ontological equality in the sharing of misery. The sentiments of support in the albergues are astonishingly strong; and one meets the most extraordinary people. I will always remember the friends I made in the albergues on my first Camino (for clarity, my other caminos have been in private accommodation, as I found sleeping difficult to impossible in the albergues) and, for many people, this comes to be one of the strongest and most memorable aspects of their pilgrimage. I might add that the albergues are more sophisticated and comfortable now than they were 15 years ago.

 

[kelleymac]

I found that the albergues had people from different nationalities, and all different walks of life. In many ways, it they are a great equalizer of classes and professions. At hotels, and inns, everyone has a bit of money to rely on. (Some have more than a bit.)-- At the albergues, the conversation was often on what people had seen that day, the weather, a cautious "why are you walking the Camino?", and what's for dinner. We all wear similar clothes, we don't have cars to judge one another by. --- I was two days at an albergue once (taking a break because of my feet), when a man I had shared dinner with the evening before offered to look at my infected blisters. I laughed him off as my feet were pretty ugly, but he then explained he was a doctor. I had had no idea, and we had talked for hours. Our professions never came up.

Another thought - Albergues have changed my morning life. In a few of the Albergues one is woken up by music. There was one morning in particular, where we were awoken by Ave Maria. I was overcome by the beauty of the song. It brought tears to my eyes. --Since coming home I have brought music into our morning routine. I listen to music to set the day (Deer's Cry, or Ave Maria, or..), then I wake my children by music. I start out with something prayerful or meditative, and then move on to Mozart, or Bach, or folk music. Then, if the kids don't get out of bed, I change to the Pogues, or Lynyrd Skynyrd. My older son complains that the music is going through his head all day. I respond that Mozart going through your head all day, is better than "mom hollering at you" going through your head all day.

 

[SYates]

Because I know a lot of them from those ye' olde times back in the last millennium and love to revisit them again ;-) SY

 

[Felice]

I'm a very light sleeper, and surprisingly, I found that I slept better in albergues than I did at the average hostal! I found that if I put my earplugs in, and my eyeshades on, I was asleep in no time at all and the general noise and hubbub was like white noise in the background, soothing me gently to sleep. Contrast this with a hostal, where all was quiet until it was not quiet - someone came in and slammed a door, went to the bathroom etc - when I was fully woken and found it difficult to get back to sleep. Early morning plastic bag rustlers woke me in the albergue, of course, but so too did the people leaving early in the hostal.
And of course it was much easier to meet people in albergues. I stayed in 4 hostals, and only met another guest on one occasion.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Because I don't find the sleep I get is not as good in an albergue to start with, but mostly because a major part of the Camino, for me, if not the greatest part of it, is contact with others and I find that this happens first and foremost in albergues.

 

[Kitsambler]

(NB - I haven't walked any route in Spain yet.) One of the attractions of walking any camino route is the great difference from our routine everyday life. And part of that is learning to turn loose of control. So staying in the alburques is part of that: you are not in control of where you sleep, your bed, your companions, the people you meet. It makes a very intense pilgrim experience of the joys and sorrows of living in community.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

I'm a twin who shared a room until junior high, shared a call room in residency, and spent 30 years in the military...so communal sleeping is as natural to me as having my own room. Some routes I walked didn't have albergues open yet, and sometimes I chose not to use ones when available. When I stayed at one, it was often run by a church group, or by nuns or monks; sometimes it was a small, private-run albergue. I stayed for the opportunity to share in religious services at the convent/monastery, or to spend time with other walkers since it was extremely rare to see them on the road.

 

[Sheffield James]

I find the washing and drying facilities/space better in most albergues. Trying to find hooks, hangers, chair-backs , etc., for my wet clothes in more commercial establishments can be more of a challenge at times.

 

[SYates]

Big point! Yes, as nice as it is to have your own room and bathroom, washing and drying your clothes is a real challenge in most pensions/hotels. SY

 

[Mark Lee]

I chose to stay in communal albergues (of all variety) 90% of the time because it just seemed to be the thing to do, and I suppose the cost played in there as well, not to mention the social aspect. Also, communal living nothing new to me, having been in the military and also experienced it working as a civilian overseas.
I never found any of the albergues to be austere, primitive or miserable to stay in, in any way. They were clean and modern. Hot running water and showers and toilets. As I was always pretty tired by 10 pm I never really had an issue sleeping (little bit of wine with dinner or a couple of cold beers helps ). Sure a night here and there with an overly loud snorer, and a few times in quarters that became just unbearably stuffy, smelly and hot because of pilgrims with the archaic belief that windows must be shuttered at night, but overall comfortable and positive.

 

[Icacos]

For probably too long, I had spend a great deal of time on my own, and had grown well accustomed to my solitude, which I enjoyed tremendously. When I went on camino I felt my pilgrimage would not be authentic, for me, unless I put myself - at least at some point - completely out of my comfort zone. Most of the time my companion and I stayed in albergue private rooms with shared bathrooms. We stayed in albergue dormitorios only a handful of times. We met lovely people. I was very uncomfortable with all the shared facilities, but that was the point.

 

[Yellowfriend]

For probably too long, I had spend a great deal of time on my own, and had grown well accustomed to my solitude, which I enjoyed tremendously. When I went on camino I felt my pilgrimage would not be authentic, for me, unless I put myself - at least at some point - completely out of my comfort zone. Most of the time my companion and I stayed in albergue private rooms with shared bathrooms. We stayed in albergue dormitorios only a handful of times. We met lovely people. I was very uncomfortable with all the shared facilities, but that was the point.

How do know if a Albergue has private rooms?
Thanks!

 

[Joe glach]

This is where my a

I chose to stay in communal albergues (of all variety) 90% of the time because it just seemed to be the thing to do, and I suppose the cost played in there as well, not to mention the social aspect. Also, communal living nothing new to me, having been in the military and also experienced it working as a civilian overseas.
I never found any of the albergues to be austere, primitive or miserable to stay in, in any way. They were clean and modern. Hot running water and showers and toilets. As I was always pretty tired by 10 pm I never really had an issue sleeping (little bit of wine with dinner or a couple of cold beers helps ). Sure a night here and there with an overly loud snorer, and a few times in quarters that became just unbearably stuffy, smelly and hot because of pilgrims with the archaic belief that windows must be shuttered at night, but overall comfortable and positive.

My archaic belief would be to open the windows If the smell or stale air became too much

 

[trecile]

I stayed mostly in albergues with a few hostales/pensiones thrown in when I really wanted some alone time and a long hot shower. However, I did feel pretty disconnected from other pilgrims on at least one occasion. For me, it was easier to find other pilgrims even if I was staying in a private accommodation if I was in a small town. In a larger city I felt lost in the crowd.

 

[mspath]

Simplicity can seem sublime!

All I have ever wanted whilst walking the camino these past 10 years is strength to take it as it comes and to be able to enjoy the good as well as bear the bad. Grateful at the end of each day for simple shelter, a place to sleep (preferably a bottom bunk ), working toilet, hot shower, something to eat and when possible good companionship.

February 2006 the path to Villafranca Montes de Oca was covered with several inches of snow. Walking had become dangerous. At the simple municipal albergue no one was about, but the front door was unlocked and one dormitory was open. No heat in the radiators, but piles of blankets and a hot plate. Considering the alternative it was great! Mid afternoon I snuggled into my sleeping bag; outside the storm steadily intensified. As night fell the radiators started up. Warm and sheltered how lucky I was!...Bliss.

 

[Mark Lee]

This is where my a


My archaic belief would be to open the windows If the smell or stale air became too much

Yes, and I did sometimes and even had on one occasion an argument over it. On the occasions where I was the lone fresh air circulation advocate in a room full of medieval, night air is filled with sickness thinkers, I had to capitulate (democracy). When that happened, if possible I slept out on a couch in the common area where there were open windows. Once I slept on top of big, heavy wooden table in the common area.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

How do know if a Albergue has private rooms?
Thanks!

begging pardon in advance for brief off topic answer
Hi Yellowfriend,
there are several ways to tell if the albergue has a private room...
1. click on the albergue on a site like gronze or eroski, and look to see what it says, for example
http://www.gronze.com/navarra/lorca/albergue-lorca shows this private albergue in lorca has a private room, or on http://caminodesantiago.consumer.es/albergue-o-candido clicking on the albergue O Candida took us to their website, where they list a private room http://www.ocandido.com/albergue.html
2. looking up a town on a booking website or app, for example but not limited to booking.com can point you to pensions, albergues, and hostals with private rooms
3. I found that some places with private rooms would put up notices on posts, billboards, etc along the way, or leave word at 'upstream' albergues, or even hand out leaflets.
4. you can always ask when you see someplace you want to stop.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

Yes, and I did sometimes and even had on one occasion an argument over it. On the occasions where I was the lone fresh air circulation advocate in a room full of medieval, night air is filled with sickness thinkers, I had to capitulate (democracy). When that happened, if possible I slept out on a couch in the common area where there were open windows. Once I slept on top of big, heavy wooden table in the common area.

I, on the other hand, shivered my way through many nights of snow blowing through the open windows because people believed warm air, rather than dirty hands, was the cause of spread of disease I put on every item of clothing I had, including down vest, gortex jacket and pants, and wool cap, and burrowed deep into my 4 season sleeping bag.
this is why I always laugh when people ask if they will be warm enough (in whatever situation)...clearly they have never shared a room with opposite gender or body build, or they would know there is no such thing as optimum room temperature.

 

[november_moon]

I have a pretty wide comfort range when it comes to sleeping, so normally this wasn't an issue for me, but there were a couple nights in alberques where it was so stuffy that I just wanted to go sleep outside.

Anyway, most nights I slept very well in alberques - my body was tired from walking and just wanted to sleep. And the comradeship (is that the right word?) of staying in alberques was great. I met some really cool people. On nights that I didn't stay in alberques - once or twice a week I'd get a private room - I'd miss the other people.

 

[Mark Lee]

I, on the other hand, shivered my way through many nights of snow blowing through the open windows because people believed warm air, rather than dirty hands, was the cause of spread of disease I put on every item of clothing I had, including down vest, gortex jacket and pants, and wool cap, and burrowed deep into my 4 season sleeping bag.
this is why I always laugh when people ask if they will be warm enough (in whatever situation)...clearly they have never shared a room with opposite gender or body build, or they would know there is no such thing as optimum room temperature.

When I did the CF in 2015 I didn't bring any type of sleeping bag or liner with me at all, and didn't need one until the last night before I walked in to SDC. It was late in the afternoon in September, drizzly and cloudy when I reached Monte de Gozo and decided to stay there, figuring I'd walk into the plaza early in the morning. Well, Monte de Gozo is a big albergue, but there were maybe 20 pilgrims there and they put you up in 4-person rooms. There are no blankets available and the drizzly weather was a cold front pushing through. I gotta say, I froze me arse off that night. Slept terribly despite wearing my fleece pullover and long pants. I actually contemplated just getting up and walking into Santiago that night and finding a hotel or pensiones, ha ha. As it turned out I got up and out of there before 7:00 am the next morning and was in the plaza before 8:00 am. It was very cool and clear, but beautiful weather. As soon as one opened I got a room at a pensiones and that night got a proper rest.

 

[FLEUR]

In September we met two ladies from Denmark who like us were walking on the CF. They had hotel /pension accommodation booked for the whole of their trip. They both thought they were missing our on the camaraderie we experienced ( in the albergues) and want to return to walk the CF and stay in albergue accommodation.

We mostly used the albergues. At the Seminary Menor in Santiago we had single rooms, very basic but perfectly adequate. In the Polish albergue at Monte de Gozo we paid a little more for twin room en suite. In Portomarin we slept well in a massive dormitory.

 

[Mark Lee]

I have a pretty wide comfort range when it comes to sleeping, so normally this wasn't an issue for me, but there were a couple nights in alberques where it was so stuffy that I just wanted to go sleep outside.

Anyway, most nights I slept very well in alberques - my body was tired from walking and just wanted to sleep. And the comradeship (is that the right word?) of staying in alberques was great. I met some really cool people. On nights that I didn't stay in alberques - once or twice a week I'd get a private room - I'd miss the other people.

Yup, I experienced that too.
One of the best things of staying in the albergues is that occasionally you have a communal dinner with friends. Sometimes several, or sometimes maybe one or two. Either way, it's one of the nicest things to experience and I wouldn't want to miss it.

 

[Donna Sch]

I did the VDLP and the albergues are not that busy anyway - certainly not CF busy! And as a single female there is a high chance of getting a dorm or bathroom to yourself. I enjoy the conversations and I like being to cook and prepare food properly every now and again. All I need is a bed and a shower (although a bath is an absolute treat!) and somewhere to wash my clothes. A nice kitchen is great but not essential. Hostals really don't provide much more than an albergue and I rather would spend the extra cost on other things. There were some private albergues I avoided in north Extremadura as the owner basically had a monopoly so my friend and I opted for hostals. I don't have problems sleeping as a rule.

 

[Kanga]

Why do I chose to sleep in albergues most of the time, when I could afford my own room?

It's a whole lot more fun! Sleepover for grown-ups.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

Why do I chose to sleep in albergues most of the time, when I could afford my own room?

It's a whole lot more fun! Sleepover for grown-ups.

If we start seeing posts about pillow fights in the albergues, I will know the person to blame...even if teddy bear hankies aren't found at the scene

 

[Saint Mike II]

I have had some experience with large and small albergues & yes the camaraderie/conversations - even someone to share an evening meal with is important. Although if I decide on rest days in Burgos and Leon I will stay in a hotel - so that I get some real sleep. Cheers

 

[Ralph Keith Redhead]

I'm finishing notes for a local pilgrim group discussion and would like to include the voices of other forum members if some of you don't mind. Our subject is why many people who would normally avoid shared rooms & baths, and who could afford other options, nonetheless do choose to spend a good portion of their nights without privacy in pilgrim albergues. Even among snorers, or even if we are the snorers!

Apart from the practical points that communal sleeping etc is affordable, and the non-reservable kind of albergues don't disappear off the market days in advance, what more personal motivations would you mention?

I don't think that there is a 'right' choice of acommodation, or even that the same pilgrim would make the same type of choices every night, but if you personally do often default to the traditional type of albergues, why?

Interesting points of discussion, and most were, at some time, discussed with various people during my Camino Frances this year. From my experience, I found that there's far more noise and lack of respect at the private Alberques - although a couple of municiples were not much better, with people staying up late, drinking, music, loud, which was a great disturbance for those needing a peaceful nights sleep and early set-off the next moring. If people want to drink and make noise that's their choice and their way, but it all too frequently disturbed and upset the majority. However, Albergue Gaucelmo is run by volunteers and to traditional values - everyone agrees to their standards of respect and values, 'ground rules' if you like, so there is no discord or disturbance, we were all agreed to respect one another and knew what was expected of us. If someone didn't want those guidelines then they could find somewhere else to stay. Also, I like the way shared acccomodation - bunks, kitchen, showers etc, brings everyone to the same, human level. A few people - at the start of their Camino, were boastful and arrogant about their possitions in life, their jobs and possesions, etc. I, for one, sensed a changed in them along the way - in me too, in so much as they began leaving all that behind, thinking of and discussing other matters and far more contemplative, which is the 'Camino' effect, as far as I know, that we go on a way whichgives us time, space in nature, challenges and renews our perspective of self and life - for good or bad (I believe mainly for the good). In facing-up to the changes and challenges of being in close proximity to many strangers on a long and challenging walk, we leave behind our sterilized, complex, overbearing and problematic lives, and meet face-to-face people from all over the world, and open our perspectives and minds to others, learn again to live with and respect things we're becoming increasingly detatched from.

 

[HeidiL]

On longer walks, I like sleeping in a private room once in a while - say every five or six days or so. This becomes high luxury, something I'm really looking forward to, while it would be really boring to do it every night.

 

[newfydog]

Well, if you want to go to any authentic local restaurants remember they may be opening about the same time the albergue is locking up.

 

[Mark Lee]

Well, if you want to go to any authentic local restaurants remember they may be opening about the same time the albergue is locking up.

That is a downside to staying in albergues. Most have a curfew of 10-10:30 pm. There were a couple of the private ones that had no curfew and a pass code or similar to let you in, but those are rare on the CF.
Best advice is that of you are in one of the bigger cities like Pamplona, Burgos or Leon, get yourself some private accommodations if you want to stay out late for dinner, tapas, drinks etc.

 

[Rebekah Scott]

For some people, a pilgrimage is about stripping yourself down to the minimum, and learning how little you need to get by... And learning how to be grateful even for the minimum. I'd say 9/10ths of the people walking the camino on a given day can afford nicer places to stay, and well over half of them really ought to pay for a nicer room and stay there, to leave room in the albergues for people who can't afford elsewhere, and those doing a serious spiritual journey of simplicity. For that minority, sleeping in minimal places is part of the dressing, eating, spending minimally scene, part of the essential bare-bones existence they choose to live for a while. It's not always comfortable or sweet-smelling, but it's full of amazing revelations. Not everyone needs to walk that kind of camino, but the ones who do ought to be respected. They ought to be able to find a bed at the end of the day in an albergue. They are who the albergues were built for.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

" ....but the front door was unlocked and one dormitory was open. No heat in the radiators, but piles of blankets and a hot plate. Considering the alternative it was great! Mid afternoon I snuggled into my sleeping bag; outside the storm steadily intensified. As night fell the radiators started up. Warm and sheltered how lucky I was!...Bliss.

I have always wondered: why turn on the heat for the night, when people are in bed under blankets, instead of during the afternoon and evening when people are wet from a shower, not in their sleeping back, etc.? Makes no sens to me. But that is another topic.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

I have always wondered: why turn on the heat for the night, when people are in bed under blankets, instead of during the afternoon and evening when people are wet from a shower, not in their sleeping back, etc.? Makes no sens to me. But that is another topic.

because some of us, even in a four season sleeping bag and all of our clothes, and any available blankets, are freezing when the temperatures drop to their lowest point...the middle of the night
during the day I can always move around to generate body heat, but once in bed i'm kind of stuck

 

[tomnorth]

For probably too long, I had spend a great deal of time on my own, and had grown well accustomed to my solitude, which I enjoyed tremendously. When I went on camino I felt my pilgrimage would not be authentic, for me, unless I put myself - at least at some point - completely out of my comfort zone. Most of the time my companion and I stayed in albergue private rooms with shared bathrooms. We stayed in albergue dormitorios only a handful of times. We met lovely people. I was very uncomfortable with all the shared facilities, but that was the point.

I too wanted to get outside my comfort zone. I'd not spent one night of my life in a hostel prior to walking the Camino Frances. As I was walking the Camino on my own, I think I would have been terribly lonely had I not stayed in alburgues. That is where I met my Camino family members.

 

[newfydog]

For some people, a pilgrimage is about stripping yourself down to the minimum, and learning how little you need to get by... And learning how to be grateful even for the minimum. I'd say 9/10ths of the people walking the camino on a given day can afford nicer places to stay, and well over half of them really ought to pay for a nicer room.

Thanks Rebelah for your perspective. My wife and I have been forced into so many dumps
in our lives, first when we were seriously constrained by finanaces, and later by just going to primative places, that we don't y often appreciate those who actively seek out the simpler life. They have my respect.

I do remain influenced by a wealthy lawyer in a restaurant in Logrono boasting about how well he slept in the sponsored donativo albergues. When his dinner finally came he had five minutes to eat and run....too bad because he missed a first rate experience of traditional Spanish cuisine, something his buddies back home would understand as a highlight.

 

[SYates]

the sponsored donativo albergues

Where was that? Sponsored? SY

 

[vlebe]

For some people, a pilgrimage is about stripping yourself down to the minimum, and learning how little you need to get by... And learning how to be grateful even for the minimum. I'd say 9/10ths of the people walking the camino on a given day can afford nicer places to stay, and well over half of them really ought to pay for a nicer room and stay there, to leave room in the albergues for people who can't afford elsewhere, and those doing a serious spiritual journey of simplicity. For that minority, sleeping in minimal places is part of the dressing, eating, spending minimally scene, part of the essential bare-bones existence they choose to live for a while. It's not always comfortable or sweet-smelling, but it's full of amazing revelations. Not everyone needs to walk that kind of camino, but the ones who do ought to be respected. They ought to be able to find a bed at the end of the day in an albergue. They are who the albergues were built for.

Perfect answer @Rebekah Scott !
In te last couple of days I tried 3 or 4 times write a reply to this thread but couldnt find a way to do so without sounding bad to certain groups...
Your answer kind of says what I think!

Ultreia
Vagner

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

Where was that? Sponsored? SY

I'm assuming (possibly incorrectly) he means supported or championed by, as in church sponsored, municipally sponsored...not a private business

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

As for leaving the municipal and church albergues to those who can't afford anything else I say: gladly for the munis where I found too many drunks, but the cost of a muni was not a lot less than a private albergue which is not there for the poor but rather as a business, or as a support to everyone--especially on routes where there are no other lodging options. For the church donativos...if they only took the people who leave nothing in the box, it would be a shame, and exclude many who would value the experience more than the "poor" walkers (and whose generous donativos make up for the many who leave little or nothing). One can always save longer for the Camino--I get that delayed gratification is unpopular,but everyone who claimed poverty when I walked had plenty of money for wine and cigarettes.

 

[Icacos]

I too wanted to get outside my comfort zone. I'd not spent one night of my life in a hostel prior to walking the Camino Frances. As I was walking the Camino on my own, I think I would have been terribly lonely had I not stayed in alburgues. That is where I met my Camino family members.

You are quite right. We met one woman who stayed in pre-booked, private accommodation throughout; she said she felt very lonely going back to her empty hotel room every night. On the other hand, I venture to say that not everyone who does the Camino, and I include myself here, is up to the camaraderie found in the albergues, no matter how friendly everyone is. In my case, I was fortunate that I was with two travel companions, and they provided a buffer for me against all the socializing.

 

[Pete Dunn]

For me, it's very simple. I met nobody when staying in the occasional hotel on the Norte, but have made lifelong friends from staying in the albergues.

 

[Deleted member 56069]

If I had done my Camino's solo, I would have stayed in the communal bunk rooms. But since I have done all three Camino's with my wife we like our own space after a day of walking.
At most Albergues that have a private room option you still the opportunity to interact with fellow pilgrims and a communal dinner. But after doing the daily 'half marathon' of walking I need a good uninterrupted sleep.
My wife and I are very early risers, usually walking no later than 6:30 AM (this has been in April all three Camino's) so it is before sunrise. Out of respect for fellow pilgrims that like to sleep longer, it is not fair in our opinion to disturb those that wish to sleep longer.
We have found the private room option works well for us and not diminished our Camino experience at all.
Also since we can afford the private room option and even occasional hotel, it opens up spots for students or those on a tight budget.
No wrong way here, whatever works best for each pilgrim is fine

 

[DurhamParish]

You are quite right. We met one woman who stayed in pre-booked, private accommodation throughout; she said she felt very lonely going back to her empty hotel room every night.

I did a 100K "guided tour" camino with my wife and 4 friends a couple of years ago. We stayed in casa rurals, and were usually the only ones staying at these places. Although I had a marvelous time with my wife and companions, they were the only other pilgrims with which I had much interaction.

 

[leicoppes]

Sleeping in an albergue is nice because you become more close to your fellow-pelgrims.The camino is not only to walk but also to talk.But I must say mostly when I took 3 nights a albergue,then I needed also a Hostel for one night,just to sleep a whole night.

 

[DyanTX]

I just got back from walking the CF with a friend. We are both backpackers so we're used to "rustic" accommodations and did not mind sharing a bathroom - although the co-ed ones were - shall we say 'interesting'! We walked slower than others and found that the bottom bunks were gone by the time we arrived. I'm fit - but at 64 I do not want to climb in and out of a top bunk during the night! We ended up staying in albergues with private rooms if we could or if not - a hostal or pension. I don't believe it diminished our Camino experience and it sure improved the amount of sleep we got and thus our ability to walk the next day.

 

[gml]

I set out staying only in albergues and wanted to continue to do that. I like simple, basic living and, as a solo walker, I appreciated the camaraderie in the evening. However, I had to switch to hostals and pensions because, despite my industrial ear plugs, the loud snoring in the albergues prevented me from getting enough sleep to stay sane. Often, one or two people interrupted the much-needed rest of dozens, and I wondered how these loud snorers justified inflicting such misery on so many. They are the ones who should have been segregating themselves in private rooms.

 

[Icacos]

.......loud snorers ..........They are the ones who should have been segregating themselves in private rooms.

Not so! I see you are fairly new to the forum. I've been on this forum long enough to know it is..........not so. Check the other threads!

 

[dougfitz]

Often, one or two people interrupted the much-needed rest of dozens, and I wondered how these loud snorers justified inflicting such misery on so many. They are the ones who should have been segregating themselves in private rooms.

In the past when this suggestion has been raised, I said this:

I think it quite an unrealistic expectation that snorers should not use communal dormitories in albergues. This is not a matter of courtesy - in my experience it comes from an elevated sense of entitlement that unfortunately some pilgrims seem to have, while at the same time overlooking their own annoying and disruptive habits. Albergues are there for all pilgrims - if you feel you need to avoid the disruption of sharing with snorers, it is up to you to pay the cost of more private accommodation.

My views haven't changed.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

First, I have spent a lot of nights sharing accommodations through most of my life--childhood, college, residency, military. I spent more than a few nights on the Camino awake all night (for other reasons)--everyone snores.

There are, however, things that make snoring worse. A considerate person, because he/she is sharing accommodations would do their best to avoid making their snoring worse if they know they snore loudly. Alcohol--no one has to drink. No, seriously, you don't. If you snore loudly and must make it worse with alcohol, you could be nice and also choose (along with alcohol) a separate room. Or sleep on your side by using a pillow or your clothing to keep you from rolling onto your back. Or prop yourself up with pillow, blankets, clothing. You could carry an extra pillow or blanket to help with this. So lots a person could choose to do in order not to disturb others: skip alcohol, prop on side/prop up (carry blanket/pillow if necessary), get a separate room if unwilling to forgo booze or sleep on side.

Personally I don't have trouble sleeping through snoring, but people who claim there's nothing they can do actually mean there's nothing they choose to do, and are putting their wants above others. Which is their choice of course. People who are bothered by snoring might also consider walking further.

 

[Icacos]

Not so! I see you are fairly new to the forum. I've been on this forum long enough to know it is..........not so. Check the other threads!

Oops! I have to retract some of what I said. It's been pointed out to me by PM that the person to whom my post referred has been a forum member longer than I. I was led, mistakenly, by the far fewer posts.

 

[Icacos]

I did a 100K "guided tour" camino with my wife and 4 friends a couple of years ago. We stayed in casa rurals, and were usually the only ones staying at these places. Although I had a marvelous time with my wife and companions, they were the only other pilgrims with which I had much interaction.

Interesting that you say this. Although I was very happy to have my companions with me, and we met some wonderful people - and a few email addresses were exchanged - I do not now keep in touch with anyone I met on camino. I often wonder if and how things might have been different had I walked alone. Likewise, I wonder (or worry) if my companions at the time wonder the same.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

I wonder if 'keeping in touch' is also a function of what it means to the individual to stay connected to those with whom they walked. Maybe the camaraderie was the highlight of their journey, perhaps they never experienced something like that before. Maybe they are they type of person who stays in touch with their best friend from third grade, and everyone from summer camp still gets a Christmas card from them. I enjoyed meeting the people I did while walking, but I have little enough time to stay in touch with people with much tighter bonds than the camino: friendships from a long list of deployments, close friends and family spread across the country. I occasionally exchange a short letter with a priest I met, but otherwise....making new friends was definitely not anywhere on my list of reasons to walk.

Since I occasionally stayed in pensions I ran into a few tour groups (so my observations are admittedly based on a very tiny 'n') but: I don't think being part of an organized group will prevent social butterflies from spreading out and making 100 new BFFs, those of average sociability probably wouldn't make more or stronger contacts if they had walked solo, and the more shy probably make a few more contacts than if they walked solo.

 

[C clearly]

I often wonder if and how things might have been different had I walked alone. Likewise, I wonder (or worry) if my companions at the time wonder the same.

Of course the experience would have been different - better in some ways, worse in others. If you are "wondering" happily, then go on doing so. However the "wonder (worry)" about your friends wondering, doesn't seem like the best way to approach an otherwise happy memory! (I'm just trying to ease the urge to ask "what if?")

 

[dougfitz]

Alcohol--no one has to drink. No, seriously, you don't. If you snore loudly and must make it worse with alcohol, you could be nice and also choose (along with alcohol) a separate room.

I think it odious to suggest there might be classes of pilgrims, some of whom are able to enjoy their camino without any particular constraints, and others who are pressured into foregoing participation in some activities. Certainly there are ways for an individual to reduce the level of their snoring - but that relies in the first instance in them acknowledging that they are a snorer. My view is that this is far less likely than one might initially think.

There might also be snorers who choose, for their own reasons, to seek more private accommodation or to avoid alcohol, but it would be wrong for us to deliberately pressure them into this.

Really, if you are intolerant of what is relatively natural and almost normal behaviour like snoring, it is up to you to resolve the issue by seeking out more private accommodation.

 

[Older Guy]

Good discussion. I have always been a fan of Aristotle. By that I mean balance and not overdoing anything. On my CF I stayed at a variety of types of lodgings. I stayed at one Rural Farm Association place, three hotels, several albergues, a few that were community, organization, or religious. I also stayed at a few hostals with private rooms. One of the most interesting places was the Hospederia Cisterciense run by nuns. I really did like the albergues with the comunial meals. But in the small villages, you could easily meet fellow pilgrims at the restaurants in the town square. It was fun to try different things. Unless you are going with a large group or get adopted by a large group, or have really constrained finances, I am not sure why you would want to do only Albergues and opt for an occasional private room with private bath.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

I think it odious to suggest there might be classes of pilgrims, some of whom are able to enjoy their camino without any particular constraints, and others who are pressured into foregoing participation in some activities. Certainly there are ways for an individual to reduce the level of their snoring - but that relies in the first instance in them acknowledging that they are a snorer. My view is that this is far less likely than one might initially think.

There might also be snorers who choose, for their own reasons, to seek more private accommodation or to avoid alcohol, but it would be wrong for us to deliberately pressure them into this.

Really, if you are intolerant of what is relatively natural and almost normal behaviour like snoring, it is up to you to resolve the issue by seeking out more private accommodation.

I am not pressuring you or anyone into anything. I believe it was you who said anyone that is disturbed by loud snoring should get a private room. I am just saying there are always choices we make, and we should be honest with ourselves when making them.

first, I said everyone snores at some point to some degree. I spend a lot of time awake in communal sleep areas. I know. But to say it is to be accepted at all degrees as normal is not. Some are very loud, and often it is due to lifestyle choices. How much louder a loud snorer wants to be is of course up to him or her, but they should not deny the fact that some things they choose impacts the snoring. If they snore loudly enough to disturb many others, and then make choices to consciously increase their snoring...then they chose to do so other than staying somewhere else or limit the lifestyle choices. I didn't say this was bad, or that you had to do it, just made it clear the choices made...for you, you want to stay in albergues, and if your alcohol consumption, and desire to sleep on your back increases how much you disturb others, then it is fine with you. you have a rights hierarchy. that I understand, and I don't criticize, just observe.

Some with PTSD would sleep better with their dog, or lights on...but in fairness to others, they don't insist on either.

People who come in late or leave early could flip on the overhead lights, but usually they don't...in fairness to others.
I don't care what those who snore do, since their snoring, with or without alcohol or sleeping on their side (and please note, I suggested both as possible alternatives to loud snoring) doesn't keep me awake. But choosing to make one's snoring worse, when there are alternatives (such as sleeping on one's side, or not drinking alcohol) are choices they make. Which, you may recall, I said was entirely up to them.

we all live together in a camino society. eastern society teaches the importance of communal needs, western tends to emphasize the individual. both systems have merit. I don't care where someone puts 3 glasses of wine vs. sleeping on their side vs snoring enough to raise the dead (and force some to stay in private rooms rather than the albergue they would prefer). just pointing out there are options.

edit: also pointing out that I have frequently stressed ear plugs and walking further to those who are bothered...everyone could choose to get along more...but not everyone does.

 

[DurhamParish]

Interesting that you say this. Although I was very happy to have my companions with me, and we met some wonderful people - and a few email addresses were exchanged - I do not now keep in touch with anyone I met on camino. I often wonder if and how things might have been different had I walked alone. Likewise, I wonder (or worry) if my companions at the time wonder the same.

I generally don't keep in touch with people I meet on the Camino. The only exceptions are people from this forum that I meet.

 

[newfydog]

. So lots a person could choose to do in order not to disturb others: skip alcohol, prop on side/prop up (carry blanket/pillow if necessary), get a separate room if unwilling to forgo booze or sleep on side.

I have done all of that as well as had several operations and still snore. I do not appreciate self appointed sleep experts suggesting I am inconsiderate when all I am trying to do is breathe.

 

[Smallest_Sparrow]

I have done all of that as well as had several operations and still snore. I do not appreciate self appointed sleep experts suggesting I am inconsiderate when all I am trying to do is breathe.

if you are doing that then you are doing all you can do. I did not say anyone was inconsiderate who tried to decrease their impact on others. i didn't even say those who chose not to do decrease their impact on others were inconsiderate. I said considerate people try to decrease their negative impact on the well-being of the group. that, by your statement, includes you.
i am not a sleep expert. I am a medical professional. and there are well known lifestyle choices that can help decrease snoring in many, including weight loss, alcohol avoidance, stopping smoking, and sleeping on one's side. obviously none of these helped you. but they would help some, if they chose to follow them...which again, is entirely up to them.
i object to those who refuse to modify in any way their disruption of others' sleep, then tell them if they don't like it, sleep somewhere else because there is nothing that can be done. That would be like me saying I need to sleep with the lights on, if you don't like it, sleep somewhere else because there's nothing that can be done. not nice and not true.

 

[dougfitz]

@Smallest_Sparrow, I am afraid that you seem to be mis-interpreting my position on this, and possibly the positions offered by others. Rather than further inflame the matter, I will leave others to read my views, both earlier in the thread, if they are interested in what I have to say.

I don't have anything further to add on the matter.

 

[Icacos]

Of course the experience would have been different - better in some ways, worse in others. If you are "wondering" happily, then go on doing so. However the "wonder (worry)" about your friends wondering, doesn't seem like the best way to approach an otherwise happy memory! (I'm just trying to ease the urge to ask "what if?")

Thank you. That's very sweet of you @C clearly. I guess I am 'wondering happily' since, in my case, there is no doubt that the advantages of traveling with companions far outweighed any disadvantages. [Anyway, I think perhaps the subject of this little digression here really belongs on another thread.]

 

[PEI_Heather]

Yes, and I did sometimes and even had on one occasion an argument over it. On the occasions where I was the lone fresh air circulation advocate in a room full of medieval, night air is filled with sickness thinkers, I had to capitulate (democracy). When that happened, if possible I slept out on a couch in the common area where there were open windows. Once I slept on top of big, heavy wooden table in the common area.

About 10 days, erm, nights ago, when a woman started to snore like a sailor in an albergue (with 9 bunkbeds and only five people), I left the dorm room for the lounge area. Unfortunately, a couple also staying at the albergue got to the lounge first, so I put a couple of cushy comfy chairs together, used the chair pads of the loveseat for a mattress of sorts and attempted to fall asleep. Unfortunately (again), the guy part of the couple, who was sleeping in the lounge, also snored like a deckhand. I am a very light sleeper and earplugs don't work for me. It was too cold to sleep outside. But! Fortunately, the couple woke up around midnight and moved back into the dorm. I had a great sleep the rest of the night on my makeshift bed! And in the morning, when the couple caught up to me while we were walking, and I told the guy that he was excellent in the art of snoring, his wife laughed and thanked me--he had been telling her she was wrong, that he didn't snore. She felt vindicated but I was just happy that they left the lounge, haha! And yeah, the windows of the dorm room were also shut and the air had a bit of a 'hum' to it. Ach!

 

[Mark Lee]

About 10 days, erm, nights ago, when a woman who started to snore like a sailor in an albergue (with 9 bunkbeds and only five people), I left the dorm room for the lounge area. Unfortunately, a couple also staying at the albergue got to the lounge first, so I put a couple of cushy comfy chairs together, used the chair pads of the loveseat for a mattress of sorts and attempted to fall asleep. Unfortunately (again) the guy who was sleeping in the lounge also snored like a deckhand. I am a very light sleeper and earplugs don't work. It was too cold to sleep outside. But! Fortunately, the couple woke up around midnight and moved back into the dorm. I had a great sleep the rest of the night on my makeshift bed! And in the morning, when the couple caught up to me, and I told the guy that he was excellent in the art of snoring, his wife laughed and thanked me--he had been telling her she was wrong, that he didn't snore. She felt vindicated but I was just happy that they left the lounge, haha! And yeah, the windows of the dorm room were also shut and the air had a bit of a 'hum' to it. Ach!

Improvise, overcome and adapt.
In one small albergue I stayed at just before Leon, the sleeping areas consisted of those small rooms with about 3-4 bunk beds in them. The one I was put in only had two other occupants. Two young women. Before I went to sleep I opened the window, but at about 1:00 am I woke up, and saw the window had been closed, and I swear the air was so heavy in that room I had difficulty breathing (the door was closed, too). The two women were sleeping soundly, and I gave in to chivalry and vacated, dragging my bag liner behind me like Linus in Peanuts with his blanket, and made my way to an old, musty couch in the hallway. It was lumpy, and only about 5' in length, but both windows in the hallway were open and there was a clean, fresh breeze blowing through. I could breath which meant I could sleep, ha ha.

 

[PEI_Heather]

Improvise, overcome and adapt.
In one small albergue I stayed at just before Leon, the sleeping areas consisted of those small rooms with about 3-4 bunk beds in them. The one I was put in only had two other occupants. Two young women. Before I went to sleep I opened the window, but at about 1:00 am I woke up, and saw the window had been closed, and I swear the air was so heavy in that room I had difficulty breathing (the door was closed, too). The two women were sleeping soundly, and I gave in to chivalry and vacated, dragging my bag liner behind me like Linus in Peanuts with his blanket, and made my way to an old, musty couch in the hallway. It was lumpy, and only about 5' in length, but both windows in the hallway were open and there was a clean, fresh breeze blowing through. I could breath which meant I could sleep, ha ha.

In Arzua about eight days ago, I took a bed in a nice looking albergue. The place I had planned to go had unexpectedly shut down for renovations a couple of days before. The owner of the albergue showed me the bathroom, laundry room, lounge and then led me to the one dorm room he had open. There were six men and one woman in it. Despite my pleas, the owner would not move me to another room and didn't have single rooms. The room was funky--one of the guys did a hand laundry and hung his clothes in the room to dry...he didn't get them quite clean enough.
I opened the window and was able to air the place out a wee bit.
This was one of the few albergues that still has a computer and wifi available for pelegrinos; I was on the computer for a bit and when I returned to the room, one of the guys was at the window. It looked like he was closing it. Ach, damn, I thought: window wars. But nope, he said he was opening it a bit more, to let in more fresh air. And the window remained open during the night! (Though when I left to go to the bathroom in the middle of the night, and returned to the dorm room, there was a definite 'oh-dure' to it. Fresh air can only do so much... ) The other thing that was amazing was that only one of the guys snored and that was so miniscule, even I was able to sleep! Great sleep that night, surprisingly!

Window wars were potential in Mazarife when I was in the bottom bunk and my friend Brittany was in the bottom bunk of the bunk beds beside the one I was in. We had the window open a crack. A crack! Sometime in the night (I was still awake), a guy from across the room--his bunk nowhere near us or the window--came over and was about to walk in between our two bunks to close the window. "Do not even think about touching that window," I said (or something to that effect). He didn't comment or even attempt to leap at the slightly opened window to close it...he quietly turned around and went back to his bed, about 200 m away from us. (OK, about 10 m away from us...dramatic effect; 200 m sounds so much better, hahaha!)

 

[Saint Mike II]

Not so! I see you are fairly new to the forum. I've been on this forum long enough to know it is..........not so. Check the other threads!

Not sure what your point is? Care to expand? Cheers

... However, I had to switch to hostals and pensions because, despite my industrial ear plugs, the loud snoring in the albergues prevented me from getting enough sleep to stay sane. Often, one or two people interrupted the much-needed rest of dozens, and I wondered how these loud snorers justified inflicting such misery on so many. They are the ones who should have been segregating themselves in private rooms.

I agree about the "chainsaw" snorers - I experienced one in Carrion even 8/10 metres away the ear plugs did not work. I seem to recall some years back seeing a post where one hospitalero separated the snorers from the others. I understand those in the "quieter" room were much appreciative. Happiness is a quiet room and a comfortable bed!! Cheers

 

[PEI_Heather]

I'm a very light sleeper, and surprisingly, I found that I slept better in albergues than I did at the average hostal! I found that if I put my earplugs in, and my eyeshades on, I was asleep in no time at all and the general noise and hubbub was like white noise in the background, soothing me gently to sleep. Contrast this with a hostal, where all was quiet until it was not quiet - someone came in and slammed a door, went to the bathroom etc - when I was fully woken and found it difficult to get back to sleep. Early morning plastic bag rustlers woke me in the albergue, of course, but so too did the people leaving early in the hostal.
And of course it was much easier to meet people in albergues. I stayed in 4 hostals, and only met another guest on one occasion.

Unfortunately the door slammers, plastic bag rustlers and other things people do when they don't seem to realize how much they are disturbing the other folks aren't confined to the hostels. These things happen also in albergues. Just got back from walking the Frances again; stayed at all sorts of accommodations including albergues, hostels, single rooms in albergues and hostels and a couple of times in small hotels.

 

[PEI_Heather]

There was a fellow Canadian who became notorious on the Camino over the last number of weeks: he was a horrendous snorer. He even admitted it and said that his snoring was what was keeping the grizzly bears out of Spain. (See?! It worked!) People, including myself, would get to an albergue and ask if Stuart was staying there. If no, people would check in. I experienced first hand the depth and breadth of his snoring at Laguna de Castilla...he got to the albergue just before me. We were assigned to the same dorm room (noooooooo!!!!!!); he lay down on his bed, on his side and promptly fell asleep. Man I wish I had that talent. As soon as he fell asleep, he started sawing logs the size of Spain. Man! That guy was loud! He was walking with a big gang of folks; they soon all arrived and I was able to move to another room that had one other occupant. She had said she would switch beds with me; she was immune to snoring when it came to sleeping. But the next day she told me she was really glad she stayed put; she would not have been able to sleep with the volume he snored at! One of his walking buddies high-tailed it to our room, to the last available bunk there.
Poor Stuart! But he was completely good natured about it all, as were many other folks, especially those in his Camino family who all--for the most part--were able to sleep through his snoring!

 

[Mark Lee]

Unfortunately the door slammers, plastic bag rustlers and other things people do when they don't seem to realize how much they are disturbing the other folks aren't confined to the hostels. These things happen also in albergues. Just got back from walking the Frances again; stayed at all sorts of accommodations including albergues, hostels, single rooms in albergues and hostels and a couple of times in small hotels.

Yes, you definitely see some of the politest and caring behavior, and unfortunately some of the rudest and egocentric behavior.
Bag rustlers. Light shiners. People who think their loud annoying whispers at 4:00 am are covert. Snorers. Pack inventories at 5:00 am in the dark (why? can someone explain that one to me?). The before mentioned fearful of night air circulating people. Pilgrims putting their filthy packs on beds. Pilgrims taking long showers while there's others waiting. etc etc etc
and one of my pet peeves, pilgrims who dump out their pack contents on the floor between the bunks. Why? People gotta walk there. I guess they like their stuff with footprints on them.
Nonetheless I would remind myself I ain't buying the place, and only staying for a few hours, ha ha.

 

[ShellsG]

One year on from my Camino my answer is probably quite different than it had been. Why would I sleep in an Albergue when in Ponferrada an older German fellow told me I snored, I ruined his night, I was fat and I should be getting a hotel room?? Why would I sleep in an Albergue when in Puente la Reina the 5 am rustlers rustled until midnight and then again at 5 am with headlamps and no regard for the upper bunks, ate breakfast at their bunks while there was a lovely empty kitchen 10 feet away, with a door. Why would I sleep in an Albergue when the fellow in the lower bunk 2 inches away was having gastric issues after his meal of lentils??? Why would I sleep in an alberque, because at the alberque in Ages a pilgrim came running across the dormitory and threw herself around me and greeted me as a long lost friend who she had lost track of and because we then spent the rest of the day in the bar with new friends. That one incident made up for all the other events before or after.

 

[Kanga]

I leap to the defence of the snorers. My mother-in-law, many years deceased, had a snore that would do justice to a boom box and caused the walls to vibrate. She was skinny, slept on her side, and was a teetotaller. Unfortunately her children have inherited this particular trait. Two of those children have had operations to try to cure the problem but to no avail. It is a disability, not a lifestyle choice, and it often gets worse with age.

I was told by one of the Padres Reparadores that if someone cannot cope with snoring, then they should make arrangements to sleep other than in an albergue.

It does not worry me - maybe because I am married to a snorer. When on camino I use earplugs or relax into sleep by listening to music through earphones.

Snoring is the norm in a dorm.