Deciding between Camino de Madrid and Camino Vasco del Interior

[Phillypilgrim]

I would like any thoughts about these two routes which join the CF. I know they will both be challenging for me in two ways; language and how solitary they are. In the future I will try Le Puy and Portuguese, but for now I want something different joining with something familiar for fall 2014. Please respond if you have walked one or preferably both. Thanks very much.

 

[Thomas1962]

In September last year I did walk the Madrid, together with my wife. I have no experience on the vasco.
I really enjoyed it. We did not meet any other person except once cyclist. Before I thought it would be a route with quite the same scenario, but I was surprised by the changes. It was beautiful! There is hardly any tarmac. When there was tarmac, I even enjoyed the change Although there are not many people, the nice thing is that the infrastructure is still quite good, enough Albergues and restaurants on the way. Just be aware of castromonte, no restaurant available.... I was in panic!
I was with my wife, to be just by yourselves would be a challenge to me. The good thing is that it is a good stretch to try the solitude, knowing that after about 12 days you join the frances in Sahagun with loads of other people. For me Sahagun was a shock which I couldn't stand. We took a train to Leon and did the Salvador from there. Not crowded, but we met some people every day.

 

[Roger Hogstrom]

I have done Camino de Madrid two times, 2012 and 2013 and I loved it. In 2012when Iwalked alone I met 3 other pilgrims in Castromonte the same night. So I can tell you there is a bar on the right hand when you go to the center of C and they make you dinner at night if you ask them. We had a 3 course dinner with wine for 8 euros. This was the only day that I met other walking pilgrims. The best thing about the CdM is like Thomas said to that you hardly never walk on tarmac.
If you look at https://www.youtube.com/user/RogerHogstrom you can look at nice photos from both walks on CdM.

Roger

 

[Canuck]

I walked both last spring.

Madrid: Flat, no tarmac.

Vasco: Steep at times and quite a bit of tarmac.

Both have good infrastructures and few pilgrims, although some can be a PITA just the same.

Your choice,
Jean-Marc

 

[unadara]

Madrid is great walk, lovely scenery and alberques and bars, can be good distances to walk and need to carry food, look at csj guia online, I walked with a Spanish friend though and may have struggled with language and isolation on the long days. We joined at El Burgo and I got train to Leon/Astorga and continued on Frances from there.

 

[peregrina2000]

I have only walked the Camino de Madrid but can add a couple of thoughts. There is only one day with a big ascent on the Madrid, and that's the walk between Cercedilla and Segovia. So if you like a lot of ups and downs, go for the Vasco Interior.

One other difference is the length. The Vasco Interior puts you on the Frances in 8 days if the online stages are within your comfort range. My understanding is that you can either join the Frances in Santo Domingo de la Calzada or Burgos. The Madrid joins the Frances at a point further west -- gets you to Sahagun in 12-13-14 days. So your ideas about what to do when you finish the route might be affected by the differences. If you want to get to Santiago, the Madrid gives you lots of options. You can continue on the Frances from Sahagun, you can continue on the Frances to Leon and there take the Salvador/Primitivo, or you can stay even longer on the Frances and in Ponferrada turn onto the Camino de Invierno.

The Madrid also offers the possibility of spending a "detour day" in Valladolid, which is very easy to reach from two points on the Camino Madrid (Simancas and Puente Duero). It's a very nice city, IMO. Beautiful sculpture museum in an ornate renaissance building.

As others have said, the Madrid is solitary -- a few years ago I only met two others on foot. But that might not distinguish it from the Vasco Interior. Buen camino, Laurie

 

[Phillypilgrim]

Thanks to all who responded. I am 60 and averaged about 12-13 miles a day on the CF last year. I do plan to return to Santiago, and will consider the Invierno, unless I had my fill of "time to myself". Now I am leaning toward the Madrid, but perhaps I should post a similar thread in the Vasco section? Or maybe PM anniethenurse, as it looks like she walked Vasco?

 

[peregrina2000]

Thanks to all who responded. I am 60 and averaged about 12-13 miles a day on the CF last year. I do plan to return to Santiago, and will consider the Invierno, unless I had my fill of "time to myself". Now I am leaning toward the Madrid, but perhaps I should post a similar thread in the Vasco section? Or maybe PM anniethenurse, as it looks like she walked Vasco?

You should also try jpflavin. He walked the Vasco a couple of years ago, actually, I think he may have a few posts on the forum about it. Buen camino, Laurie

 

[Phillypilgrim]

I'm committing to Camino de Madrid, but Ay Caramba! Where does it actually start? The Church of Santiago near The Royal Palace in Madrid? I'm trying to figure this out, so bear with me! Thanks for any help. Pam

 

[peregrina2000]

Hi, Pam,

The first arrow for the camino de Madrid is outside the Rodillas store at the Plaza de Castilla. You can start at the Santiago church in Old Madrid, but it's not a great walk. About 8 kms through very dense city space. But once you are at the arrows, in no time flat you are out of the city and on dirt paths. It's one of the easiest and most asphalt-free exits from a big city on any Camino.

 

[Phillypilgrim]

Thanks so much Laurie.

 

[KinkyOne]

I would like any thoughts about these two routes which join the CF. I know they will both be challenging for me in two ways; language and how solitary they are. In the future I will try Le Puy and Portuguese, but for now I want something different joining with something familiar for fall 2014. Please respond if you have walked one or preferably both. Thanks very much.

Although my original plan for this year was VdlP I'm (due to time&funds) now leaning more toward Camino de Madrid, CF (Sahagun - Ponferrada), Camino Invierno & Muxia/Fisterra combination. Current plan is to start between 15-20th June with time-frame around 50 days altogether with non-walking days. I'll try to post my observations on this forum either way VdlP or "Camino Combo South" as I call it now

I've gathered all the information I have about CdM & CdI's accommodation and route here on the forum and I think that will be sufficient although I wouldn't mind to have a paperback guide such as Brierley. Especially for some historical or otherwise interesting places I'm affraid I'll be missing.

Ultreia!

 

[Phillypilgrim]

Hi KinkyOne, Are you planning on walking the CdM alone? Are you female? I will be leaving September 1st. I agree, the planning and gathering of all the information is a job! Thanks to Johnnie Walker I will soon download the updated csj guide to the CdM. Where would you actually start walking the CdM?

 

[KinkyOne]

Hi KinkyOne, Are you planning on walking the CdM alone? Are you female? I will be leaving September 1st. I agree, the planning and gathering of all the information is a job! Thanks to Johnnie Walker I will soon download the updated csj guide to the CdM. Where would you actually start walking the CdM?

I'm planing to walk alone, at least I'll most probably leave my hometown alone. And I'm a male, 44yo. Will start in Madrid and go all the way to Fisterra via Muxia. But I'll be two months and a half ahead of you

 

[Phillypilgrim]

I'll be watching for your posts! Buen Camino!

 

[KinkyOne]

I'll be watching for your posts! Buen Camino!

Will have to buy one of those "smart phones" first to put regular posts on the forum But will try my best. So, hopefully see you here in a few months time.

 

[Roger Hogstrom]

I agree with Laurie that the walk out of Madrid is boring, but starting the Camino in the Santiago church in the center of town with a mass and a blessing as a pilgrim was a great start for me and I also had my first sello there.

Roger

 

[Phillypilgrim]

Thanks Roger, I will consider the starting place. BTW, I really enjoyed your photos of the CdM!

 

[peregrina2000]

I agree with Laurie that the walk out of Madrid is boring, but starting the Camino in the Santiago church in the center of town with a mass and a blessing as a pilgrim was a great start for me and I also had my first sello there.

Roger

Completely agree with that sentiment. I arrived in Madrid in the early morning after a transatlantic flight and was too tired to do a real stage. So I took the metro to Sol and walked to the Santiago church. The priest who gave me my first sello also gave me a lot of helpful tips. A walk through Madrid to the first arrows at plaza Castilla was a good jet-lag-fighter. The other nice thing was that it made the next day's walk to Colmenar quite do-able.

 

[Phillypilgrim]

So Laurie, your first day you walked from the Santiago Church to Plaza Castilla and stayed overnight there? Is it way marked from the church to Plaza Castilla? And where exactly is the "Santiago Church"? Thanks, Pam

 

[peregrina2000]

So Laurie, your first day you walked from the Santiago Church to Plaza Castilla and stayed overnight there? Is it way marked from the church to Plaza Castilla? And where exactly is the "Santiago Church"? Thanks, Pam

Hi, Pam,
The route from the Church to the Plaza de Castilla is not marked, I just used a city street map. I walked to Plaza Castilla, then walked back to my hotel, which was near the Glorieta de Bilbao. Then the next day I just took the metro back to Plaza Castilla and started out. (There are hotels near Plaza Castilla, but they are mainly business 3*** or 4**** hotels.

These posts have information on the church and its location: http://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/credential-in-madrid.10880/#post-118482
http://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/is-there-a-pilgrim-office-in-madrid.15559/

I kept a blog on the Camino de Madrid/Invierno combination, which might or might not be of interest:
http://peregrina2000.blogspot.com

Buen camino, Laurie

 

[Pelegrin]

peregrina2000, posted:
"The first arrow for the camino de Madrid is outside the Rodilla store at the Plaza de Castilla. You can start at the Santiago church in Old Madrid, but it's not a great walk. About 8 kms through very dense city space. But once you are at the arrows, in no time flat you are out of the city and on dirt paths. It's one of the easiest and most asphalt-free exits from a big city on any Camino.[".

I have not followed the marks yet, but i think that from Plaza Castilla to Montecarmelo, where the asphalt-free begins, there must be no less than 10 Kms.

 

[Canuck]

peregrina2000, posted:
"The first arrow for the camino de Madrid is outside the Rodilla store at the Plaza de Castilla. You can start at the Santiago church in Old Madrid, but it's not a great walk. About 8 kms through very dense city space. But once you are at the arrows, in no time flat you are out of the city and on dirt paths. It's one of the easiest and most asphalt-free exits from a big city on any Camino.[".

I have not followed the marks yet, but i think that from Plaza Castilla to Montecarmelo, where the asphalt-free begins, there must be no less than 10 Kms.

I agree, there's a significant distance.
The best is to take the metro to Montecarmelo, walk straight out from the back of the station and Bob's your uncle, the arrow awaits you. No city walking!

 

[Phillypilgrim]

I actually had to look up"Bob's your uncle" ha!
Getting excited about this route no matter where I start it! Hope it won't be too, too hot September 1st!
Thanks to all of you for the information and support. Pam

 

[peregrina2000]

pe

I have not followed the marks yet, but i think that from Plaza Castilla to Montecarmelo, where the asphalt-free begins, there must be no less than 10 Kms.

My admittedly fading memory is virtually certain that very soon after the Hospital Ramon y Cajal (a few hundred meters off the Castellana), the asphalt ends and there is an off-road path into Fuencarral. Maybe someone who has walked it more recently could confirm.

 

[alansykes]

My admittedly fading memory is virtually certain that very soon after the Hospital Ramon y Cajal (a few hundred meters off the Castellana), the asphalt ends and there is an off-road path into Fuencarral. Maybe someone who has walked it more recently could confirm.

It does, although it's not exactly thrilling landscape. I somehow missed Fuencarral and ended up at Montecarmelo, taking the metro back into town after the first day. Montecarmelo is indeed a good place to start one's first day of "proper" camino, as you're on an agricultural path within 200 yards of the metro station.

I also liked getting my first sello after mass at Santiago y San Juan Bautista, and especially enjoyed the gory altarpiece of Santiago Matamoros in full 17th century cavalry costume.

 

[peregrina2000]

It does, although it's not exactly thrilling landscape. I somehow missed Fuencarral and ended up at Montecarmelo, taking the metro back into town after the first day. Montecarmelo is indeed a good place to start one's first day of "proper" camino, as you're on an agricultural path within 200 yards of the metro station.

I also liked getting my first sello after mass at Santiago y San Juan Bautista, and especially enjoyed the gory altarpiece of Santiago Matamoros in full 17th century cavalry costume.

Thanks for the information, Alan. Yes, I think that the path goes from the hospital along the perimeter of Franco's old hunting lodge at El Pardo, or am I messing things up? I don't even remember Montecarmelo, though, so I may be totally confused. In any event, the marking is great so people will easily find their way. Laurie

 

[Roger Hogstrom]

Montecarmelo is the place where you just before Montecarmelo walk over a big road on this blue bridge (look at photo) and pass this strange church on your way out.

Roger

 

[Roger Hogstrom]

By the way it´s 11 k from Puerta del Sol in Madrid citycenter to Montecarmelo where the open fields begin and 6k from Plaza Castilla to Montecarmelo.

Roger

 

[Pelegrin]

Peregrina 2000: I've read the route description from Plaza Castilla to Montecarmelo from here:

http://www.caminosantiago.org/cpperegrino/caminos/etapa.asp?EtapaId=93&CaminoId=11

Plaza Castilla -- Paseo Castellana --- Barrio de Begoña - Hospital Ramon y Cajal--- Fuencarral --- Montecarmelo---------- El Pardo perimeter.

Roger: Yes, probably the distance between Plaza Castilla and Montecarmelo in straight line is 6 Kms, but the "distance sensation" and the real distance must be higher because you have to walk on streets looking for the marks.

I definetely think that taking the metro to Montecarmelo (line 10 ) is worth it.

 

[Roger Hogstrom]

For me The Santiago Church to Montecarmelo is the first 11 k on CdeM and it was interesting for me to se Madrid suburbs and how fast you can be in a big field after walking just a couple of hours from the center of such a big city as Madrid.

 

[Pelegrin]

Roger, I agree that your option could be interesting for many pilgrims (not for me because I live in Madrid).
For those who decide to start in Montecarmelo would be interesting to know that this place is still Madrid (I mean not a different council).

 

[Phillypilgrim]

To clarify (oh, wise ones) to get a Madrid sellos my options are;
"Real Parish Church of Santiago and San Juan" Calle Santiago, 24 (open 10AM-1PM, 6PM-8PM).
"AACS Madrid", Calle Carretas,14,7-B (open Tues. & Thurs. 7-9PM, Wed. 11AM-1230PM) in September.
Also, an interesting website, www.lossellosdelcamino.com, when you have time to spare.

 

[KinkyOne]

To clarify (oh, wise ones) to get a Madrid sellos my options are;
"Real Parish Church of Santiago and San Juan" Calle Santiago, 24 (open 10AM-1PM, 6PM-8PM).
"AACS Madrid", Calle Carretas,14,7-B (open Tues. & Thurs. 7-9PM, Wed. 11AM-1230PM) in September.
Also, an interesting website, www.lossellosdelcamino.com, when you have time to spare.

I think that credencial can be obtained in the Madrid Catedral de la Almudena also, but not entirely sure about that. Anyway it's very close to Santiago y San Juan and I'll try to report about that around 19th June

 

[Phillypilgrim]

Thanks, I'll have my Pilgrim's Passport in hand (through APOC) but will make an effort to get a stamp in Madrid before I set off from Plaza Castilla.

 

[Roger Hogstrom]

If not in the Santiago church you can get a stamp in any church in Madrid. The stamp in the santiago Church looks like this (Photo) . Beautiful isn´t it ?

 

[Phillypilgrim]

That is a beautiful stamp Roger! It is a relief to know I can go into any Madrid church for a sellos. Thanks so much!
Pam

 

[grayland]

I am not sure that you can go into "any" church in Madrid for a stamp.
My experience would suggest that it would be uncommon to find a sello in a church not actually on the Camino route.
To add to the problem....most churches are closed most of the time.
Might be a good idea to try to identify which churches have stamps and are open at a time to match your schedule.

 

[Roger Hogstrom]

Perhaps you are right about the stamps. If you only want to prove that you are a pilgrim you can get stamps from hotels and bars too, not beautiful but works

Roger

 

[Anniesantiago]

I kept a blog on the Camino de Madrid/Invierno combination, which might or might not be of interest:
http://peregrina2000.blogspot.com

Buen camino, Laurie

Laurie, I just found this.
Ignore my PM.
I'm not able to delete or edit it.
Sorry.

Annie

 

[peregrina2000]

Too late. I responded to you.