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Dog from Hell ?

Time of past OR future Camino
Frances10, Norte11, Frances16, Primitivo23
I begin Camino Primitivo with variant Oct 13.
I understand dogs, and most seem to warm up to me, even shy. Also I understand that some dogs through training, breed, or just evil, are aggressive.
1. some owners train dogs to guard and attack
2. some breeds of herding dogs bite first and ask later
3. some dogs are just the devil reincarnate ( photo for drama )
It is not my desire to have a dog bite break skin. ( knowing a bite is painful for 10 days and the mental anguish of possible rabies infection persists longer ). I am not comfortable standing still, yelling for help, or waving a stick, all are too late after the fact. I wish a more secure solution.

I propose to tape a high lumen pen light ( 1800lumen, 124gm ) to my walking cane that has a blinding strobe setting....
with hope time to activate will exist. ??
 

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The focus is on reducing the risk of failure through being well prepared. 2nd ed.
Spain is officially rabies free and has been so for years. Make sure you are vaccinated against Tetanus to prevent infection of any wound that bleeds.

I see that you are preparing for Hell in Spain. By all means continue to do so if this makes you happy. Most people take a broader view of their Camino but who are we to critcise someone's preferred brand of spirituality?

Ultreia!
 
I see that you are preparing for Hell in Spain. By all means continue to do so if this makes you happy. Most people take a broader view of their Camino but who are we to critcise someone's preferred brand of spirituality?

Ultreia!

I agree with the reply about rabies. Thank you. I am puzzled, though, about how the OPs post was critical of the spiritual beliefs of others? I re-read the post several times and I'm just not seeing that at all. Maybe I'm missing something?
 
...and ship it to Santiago for storage. You pick it up once in Santiago. Service offered by Casa Ivar (we use DHL for transportation).
I agree with the reply about rabies. Thank you. I am puzzled, though, about how the OPs post was critical of the spiritual beliefs of others? I re-read the post several times and I'm just not seeing that at all. Maybe I'm missing something?
The post is about "aggressive dogs" and defence against them. You are Not missing anything.
 
I just finished walking on several ways:
- Camino de San Salvador
- Camino Primitivo
- Camino Verde
- Camino Muxia-Fisterra

My conclusion is that on most of caminos, there are no impressive dogs outside closed garden along the caminos.
However, not-so-frequented caminos differ:
- on Camino San Salvador I meet two big dogs in a village. But we stay quiet and nothing happens.
- on Camino Verde, dogs are not very used to see pilgrims: they bark violently when I was passing.

My advice is to try to make the dog understand that you are neither a threat nor prey.
 
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
some dogs are just the devil reincarnate ( photo for drama )

I agree with the reply about rabies. Thank you. I am puzzled, though, about how the OPs post was critical of the spiritual beliefs of others? I re-read the post several times and I'm just not seeing that at all. Maybe I'm missing something?
I certainly didn't read the post as an attack on the OP, but a very clear - and clever - reference to the 'devil incarnate ' dog sentence . Or do I just have a wierd sense of humour?

On the Verde (July) I was attacked by a young German Shepherd, AFTER it had peacefully let me walk by ... . Fortunately it a/ growled as it ran after me, giving me a chance to turn around, b/ was half-hearted, and c/ I have significant experience dealing with German Shepherds in exactly that situation. I was able to deflect the initial lunge. A loud yell, combined with a sharp rap over the muzzle on the second attempt with the haft of my walking stick was sufficient to discourage it from trying again. I then backed away with sticks crossed in front of me.
I was exceptionally glad that the massive sheep dog that accompanied it wasn't interested in joining in. Rather, it was looking at the youngster with a 'what on earth are you doing?' expression....
@Teddie , The strobe light is an interesting concept, and if it makes you feel more comfortable, go for it. Confidence is king in dealing with aggressive animals.
As @Pafayac says, try to make the dog understand that you are neither threat nor prey.
Oh, and Buen Camino!
 
There were a few dogs on the last stage of the Baztan, not far out from Pamplona, that looked ready to eat my ankles and weren't afraid to let me know it. Thankfully, the aforementioned hounds were chained up, but had they not been I would have probably ruined a perfectly good pair of boxers...and waved goodbye to my ankles.
 
Perfect memento/gift in a presentation box. Engraving available, 25 character max.
We had a couple of small yappers chase us on the Norte. I turn and face and yell NO and I do walk with sticks so that helps. I find the minute you turn around, they give chase. On the Portugese they were mostly behind fences and would give me a heart attack waiting until the last minute to start snarling. Lol.
 
I met wonderful dogs pretty much every day of the CF. Mostly big dogs, but the odd small one. The HUGE mastiffs in Galicia were particularly great. Maybe I was lucky, but I never met a bad dog along the way. One barked at me as I passed by, but that's about it. That said, I'm a dog lover, so that might have influenced my thinking.
 

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I met many friendly dogs on all of my Caminos. The barking ones protecting property were always chained or mostly behind fences, so no problem. Sometimes I thought their incessant barking as I walked by could possibly be out of boredom for them on the less traveled routes. I have yet to encounter a loose, growling, mean dog on the loose after 8 Caminos; possibly I've just been lucky.
 
You’ll be activating it with your eyes shut presumably?

I'd love to see an aggressive dogs reaction to a blinding light! :oops:
I have found the old advice works fine.
Ignore them, no eye contact, poles by your side, keep walking.

I met numeros dogs everyday on my Camino this year.
The VdlP is 'awash' with them!
Some quite aggressive.
But if they see you are no threat, they leave you alone.

The 'standard' advice worked fine every day, with dozens of dogs.
Except once, though it might have worked had we waited............a bit longer........but we were not willing to take the risk.

Dog Story 1. This was VERY rare and a one off! And it occured on a remote section of the VdlP.
Three Pilgrims strung out along the path over about 200 metres.
Rear Pilgrim sees three dogs approaching fast at 9 o'clock across a field.
Still about 300 metres from us he yells out a warning.
We all stop and look towards the dogs.
They are heading right for us at full speed.
Now 200 metres and closing fast.

Lead Pilgrim who speaks Spanish, points his poles at the dogs and let's rip with a stream of abuse in Spanish! Dogs stop dead in their tracks, now about 100 metres from us.

We ignore them and keep walking, as they watch us depart.........

Reflection on the incident.

It was quite scary for a moment, but even so I think the dogs might have stopped at the end of 'their' field which was sunken a couple of metres below the path.

We didn't see them initially, as they were so far off. Probably 400 metres away, protecting a small flock of sheep in the middle of a huge field. We only noticed the distant sheep as we were leaving the area.

It really was a one off, and the dogs were just doing what all dogs in that area do, protecting their sheep / property.

Dog Story 2. What normally happens.......though this was a bit of a scary example.

Again on the VdlP. Walking a remote track I passed an open gate to a Finca (farm)
As I passed I heard a large dog barking behind me. It had come out of the open gate onto the path to check me out........
A moment later another large dog appeared on the path to my front.
So now I have one 50 metres behind me and one 50 metres in front of me.
Both barking.

So.............

Ignore them, no eye contact, poles at my side, move to the side of the path furthest from them and keep going. They let me pass and watched me go on my way............

I knew a couple of other Pilgrims were about 30 minutes behind me so I sent a Whatsapp message to warn them. But the dogs were gone by the time they passed. The owner probably closed the gate after hearing the commotion.

Any other dogs I met, did not even leave their property. Just barked as I passed.

Yes dogs can be a bit scary in remote locations, particularly when you are alone.
But I never really felt that I needed protection from dog repelling devices.
I would be concerned that they might just escalate the situation.

No doubt we shall get some dog 'expert' jumping in shortly with the right advice.
I just stuck with what seemed to work.
I've had dogs, and like dogs. Maybe that helps.

As an aside, I was initially, during planning, more concerned about cattle on the VdlP.
Having read that Pilgrims need to pass through whole fields of them.
Nothing to worry about.
They were wonderful and very curious.
Often the calves would come quite close to check me out.
Sometimes I'd walk slowly through quite a large herd of cows.

If there was a Bull in the field, and sometimes there was, I kept a close eye on him!
But it was never a problem.
 
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IMO, the crazy devil dog myth is overblown. Like you ever play the game "telephone" on a school bus? Still tho, I have been threatened before by them. How I react kind of depends on the context of the interaction. I don't think any technology will improve your chances, though I admire the approach. For me, as someone mentioned, avoiding the altercation works, but when it doesn't, I just look as big and mean as possible and they disappear. Just my opinion.
 
...and ship it to Santiago for storage. You pick it up once in Santiago. Service offered by Casa Ivar (we use DHL for transportation).
My experience on the VdlP was that there were lots of very large dogs protecting stock (Pyrenean Mountain Dogs?). They were almost always fenced off from the Camino. They barked a lot, but I guess that is part of their job.

On one occasion I opened a gate through a farmyard and there he was. HUGE. No fence between me and him. He sauntered up to me and sniffed my feet. I placed my two hands, side by side, on top of his head. His head was bigger. He was no threat at all.

On the Norte as I was passing a property a German Shepherd appeared out of nowhere and escorted me away from the property. No barking, no aggression. A very well trained dog.

On the Olvidado an aggressive dog chased after me for a short distance then gave up.

In France small dogs hid behind walls, fences and hedges and scared the shit out of me barking as I passed.

On the VF I was warned of aggressive dogs near Radicofani. I saw the dogs. They were pretty chilled. No problem.

I am not suggesting that there are no dangerous dogs, just that I haven't had much problem. By way of contrast ... bedbugs!! Lots of people think there are no bedbugs because they haven't experienced them. Well I have. Mostly in Spain, but also in France. Twice in SdC.

Buen Camino!!
 
I have had very few problems with dogs in Spain although they seemed very errr ‘lively’ in Portugal!

During Covid I lived in a houseshare with a girl from Romania and she was very scared of dogs (stray dogs are a big issue in Romania). We went walking a fair bit and ‘managing’ dogs was a key part of the walk!
 
I met this guy coming out of Espelette on the Baztan, he followed me over the hill to Ainhoa, sauntering ahead of me and stopping and waiting if I was out of sight! Planned to find a local when we arrived in the village to let them know and return him to Espelette but he disappeared as phantom like as he appeared!
 

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...and ship it to Santiago for storage. You pick it up once in Santiago. Service offered by Casa Ivar (we use DHL for transportation).
I am afraid of dogs if they bark or run towards me, because I'm not very good at reading their body language and never sure if they're simply putting on a show, want to play, or are aggressive and truly want to bite. But I do love animals in general and understand that many dogs have a job, which is to bark at strangers.

So my approach is non-confrontational.

Usually I try to slowly put more distance between me and seemingly aggressive / barking / working dogs when possible. Find a way around the area they guard if possible. Show them that I have no interest in getting closer to the house / farm / barn / flock they want to protect.

Most dogs seem to want to guard their owner's property only and once they realize that you're not interested in stealing the sheep or breaking into the house, they leave you alone.

Most dogs I met were friendly. I do love to pet them if they ask for it. Once I was approached by half a dozen puppies who all wanted to cuddle. I felt like in heaven!

A few times I had to wave my stick, pick up a stone and pretend to throw it to keep smaller dogs from biting my ankles. Once I had to throw my cheese sandwich to a farm dog so he would let me pass. Apparently that was enough for him to know that I'm not a threat!

So, long story short, most dogs you'll meet have no interest in biting pilgrims, unless they see you as a threat. Shouting, screaming, throwing objects, spraying anti-dog spray, aggressive and confrontational body language on the human side tend to create more problems than to help.

While meeting a dog from hell might be possible, I'd say the risk is pretty low and special gear usually not needed. Unless you meet the one in the photo I added, of course. He lives on the GR65 in France, though, so you should be safe!

IMG20220620140934.jpg
 
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3rd Edition. More content, training & pack guides avoid common mistakes, bed bugs etc
Now THAT is a new one on me. What cheese do you recommend?

I don't remember which kind of cheese, but it was in an area where food was not easy to get, and I was hungry for the rest of the day until evening. So it certainly was the best cheese, ever.
 
Once I had to throw my cheese sandwich to a farm dog so he would let me pass
Never feed the wolves (dogs) at the side of the trail!
Great. Now that dog has learned that all he has to do is scare the stuff out of passerby's so he gets a tasty treat.
People have supposedly been shot for throwing food to the wolves to keep them at bay in the Arctic. Possibly an urban legend.
 
Never feed the wolves (dogs) at the side of the trail!

People have supposedly been shot for throwing food to the wolves to keep them at bay in the Arctic. Possibly an urban legend.

I wouldn't give food to wildlife, as it often ends in the animals being killed because they lose their fear and get too close to humans. Certainly wouldn't feed a patou / great pyrenees or similar also. They're working and better to keep distance.

I've only used this strategy once, because the trail passed directly through the farm's front yard, and there was no way to easily walk around. An act of desperation, and to be honest, I didn't expect it to work. But I guess I was lucky that the dog was a probably usually friendly pet and simply unsure of my intentions (and probably not used to see many pilgrims - it was a rarely walked route).

In general, I agree, don't feed wildlife, and same with other people's pets, lifestock, working animals ect., without asking for permission first. It can create lots of problems.

The one exception for me are starving strays, and at home I'll feed the birds and hedgehogs (as wildlife organisations suggest for urban gardens). But that's a different topic.
 
Get a spanish phone number with Airalo. eSim, so no physical SIM card. Easy to use app to add more funds if needed.
I just finished walking on several ways:
- Camino de San Salvador
- Camino Primitivo
- Camino Verde
- Camino Muxia-Fisterra

My conclusion is that on most of caminos, there are no impressive dogs outside closed garden along the caminos.
However, not-so-frequented caminos differ:
- on Camino San Salvador I meet two big dogs in a village. But we stay quiet and nothing happens.
- on Camino Verde, dogs are not very used to see pilgrims: they bark violently when I was passing.

My advice is to try to make the dog understand that you are neither a threat nor prey.
I was very fearful going on the Salvador, having been bitten badly at home while training just 3 weeks before I left. Psychologically I was a mess but once on actual camino I was far more relaxed. I do believe I met the two same big dogs while exiting a village and the magic of the Camino kicked in. I just raised my stick snd shouted Allez! at them and they ran off my path.
 
I agree with the reply about rabies. Thank you. I am puzzled, though, about how the OPs post was critical of the spiritual beliefs of others? I re-read the post several times and I'm just not seeing that at all. Maybe I'm missing something?
One thing - don’t look a dog in the eye as it will think you are challenging it. This is true of many animals btw.
 
I think you would be unlucky to have a serious incident with a dog. I walked the Camino del Norte and Primitivo last year and had no problems with dogs. I kept a respectful distance where they were guarding stock, and the odd one I met at closer quarters was charming. My only danger with one was of falling over because he was leaning against my legs enjoying having his ears scratched. I did have to say 'go home' firmly to one who looked as though he was following me. I understand having dogs following pilgrims can be a problem as they then get lost, not because they are aggressive.
 
3rd Edition. More content, training & pack guides avoid common mistakes, bed bugs etc
I begin Camino Primitivo with variant Oct 13.
I understand dogs, and most seem to warm up to me, even shy. Also I understand that some dogs through training, breed, or just evil, are aggressive.
1. some owners train dogs to guard and attack
2. some breeds of herding dogs bite first and ask later
3. some dogs are just the devil reincarnate ( photo for drama )
It is not my desire to have a dog bite break skin. ( knowing a bite is painful for 10 days and the mental anguish of possible rabies infection persists longer ). I am not comfortable standing still, yelling for help, or waving a stick, all are too late after the fact. I wish a more secure solution.

I propose to tape a high lumen pen light ( 1800lumen, 124gm ) to my walking cane that has a blinding strobe setting....
with hope time to activate will exist. ??
One thing - don’t look a dog in the eye as it will think you are challenging it. This is true of many animals btw.
???? Just don't get the connection to what I had written. :)
Sorry!! I put my reply to an earlier post here by accident and couldn’t figure out how to delete it!! Ha! Ha! I knew it would be a puzzle and hoped you’d not see it .🙏🏻🙏🏻
 
I did have to say 'go home' firmly
Oh yah, that happens too. I've spent a good 2 or 3 km trying to outpace a follower. It always just chilled a bit, whenever I turned around. It seemed to know what it was doing, however. I hated the thought of the dog getting lost, and I was relieved when it turned back.
 
The 2024 Camino guides will be coming out little by little. Here is a collection of the ones that are out so far.
I begin Camino Primitivo with variant Oct 13.
I understand dogs, and most seem to warm up to me, even shy. Also I understand that some dogs through training, breed, or just evil, are aggressive.
1. some owners train dogs to guard and attack
2. some breeds of herding dogs bite first and ask later
3. some dogs are just the devil reincarnate ( photo for drama )
It is not my desire to have a dog bite break skin. ( knowing a bite is painful for 10 days and the mental anguish of possible rabies infection persists longer ). I am not comfortable standing still, yelling for help, or waving a stick, all are too late after the fact. I wish a more secure solution.

I propose to tape a high lumen pen light ( 1800lumen, 124gm ) to my walking cane that has a blinding strobe setting....
with hope time to activate will exist. ??
Guard dogs are fenced in or chained on the premises they are guarding. That is the whole point of having a guard dog. Sheep dogs protect the flock: move away from the flock, they will bark but leave you alone. Hunting dogs are extremely well trained and won’t do anything unless they are told to. The chances of being attacked by a dog in Spain are very, very small. Please don’t go walking around with a device designed to cause unnecessary harm to animals.
 
One thing - don’t look a dog in the eye as it will think you are challenging it. This is true of many animals btw.

Sorry!! I put my reply to an earlier post here by accident and couldn’t figure out how to delete it!! Ha! Ha! I knew it would be a puzzle and hoped you’d not see it .🙏🏻🙏🏻
It happens to most. . .don't ask me how I know 🤪
 
The focus is on reducing the risk of failure through being well prepared. 2nd ed.
I begin Camino Primitivo with variant Oct 13.
I understand dogs, and most seem to warm up to me, even shy. Also I understand that some dogs through training, breed, or just evil, are aggressive.
1. some owners train dogs to guard and attack
2. some breeds of herding dogs bite first and ask later
3. some dogs are just the devil reincarnate ( photo for drama )
It is not my desire to have a dog bite break skin. ( knowing a bite is painful for 10 days and the mental anguish of possible rabies infection persists longer ). I am not comfortable standing still, yelling for help, or waving a stick, all are too late after the fact. I wish a more secure solution.

I propose to tape a high lumen pen light ( 1800lumen, 124gm ) to my walking cane that has a blinding strobe setting....
with hope time to activate will exist. ??
Only thing that works for me, & I haven’t had to do this on the Camino, but on my road, is to squirt a big dose of water from my water bottle in the dog’s face. It shocks them enough to lose their focus. Never had one come back after me. But don’t know about Spain dogs. Vicious is vicious.
 

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