Orrison to Roncesvalles bail out location?

[Mysticl]

Hi,

I am hoping to walk the Camino in May 2015 but I have a question regarding the section from Orrison to Roncesvalles. I am slow walking the Camino with my husband and we are planning on only covering 12 km/day give or take, at least initially. I am 57 and overweight and although I can walk 12 km relatively easily on a standard grade, crossing a mountain while walking that same 12 km, is a whole nother kettle of fish. I'd REALLY like to try it however so I am looking for a possible safety net if things go south. Is it possible to call a taxi on the path above Orisson or is finding a likely pick up location dicey about midway along ... I imagine if I get to the halfway point and I am still ok I'd prolly end up giving it a go ( I am stubborn like that) but if I am absolutely strung out at that point it sure would be nice to be able to bail and pick it up the next day. I just want to know if it is worth a try. I'd hate to not try and then find out later it was possible but then again the reverse is also true I am afraid about biting off more than I can handle too soon and blowing my entire Camino. I know the Valcarlos route is an option but I had my heart set on Napoleon and a SJPP start. if there was a viable escape hatch I'd feel much more secure in giving it a shot. Anyone have any experience with something like this or am I possibly biting off more than I can chew?

 

[SYates]

Ok, you might not want to hear this but until May you still have a few months to lose weight and gain fitness. Also the pilgrims office in SJPDP hands out maps which marks the last 'point of no return' back to the Valcarlos road. I haven't heard of any taxis doing that route regularly and you certainly would need to decide before going from the secondary road to the walking path near the Col. Your best chance might be actually to ask the people in the Orisson albergue if they know of a local service that would provide such a stand-by emergency option.
Buen Camino,SY

PS Yes, exhausted pilgrims have been rescued by kind people driving the mountain road, but I wouldn't bank on that one.
PPS In any case, start with the sunrise and walk really, really slowly and no, don't take the steep path down to Roncesvalles.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Arranging a taxi from the path will be nearly impossible. If you need a taxi, get it at Orisson and have it take you to the summit.

 

[Mysticl]

Thanks for the reply. Yes I am walking daily to improve my endurance. At the moment I walk 4 km every day rain or shine but I am upping that in the next week or two to 6 km daily ... still testing my limits. The only thing limiting how far I walk so far however, is time, not ability but I think anything above 10 km daily and I'll start to feel it in my mildly bum hip. I'll eventually need a hip replacement but the time is not yet, thankfully. I will also be doing some hill training prior to departure starting in March/April and I will be working on my weight as well as you suggest but the thing is ... I was hoping to do this a couple years ago after a rather significant weight loss (100 lbs) as a sort of reward but had to delay waiting for hubby to retire ... unfortunately age and circumstance has eroded some of that so now I am having some second thoughts about my ability ... departure jitters maybe ... and losing more post menopause is turning into quite a different challenge. Still I think I am more or less ready and able to do this ... I am just a little psyched out about the initial mountain crossing ... and even tho I really really want to at least give it a shot I recognize I might need a little extra support to do it safely.

 

[cher99840]

By the time you make it up that hill to Orisson you will know if you want to do the rest of the mountains.

 

[SYates]

Ok, here my step by step guide for less fit people to get over the Pyrenees:

• Check with the pilgrims office in SJPDP if the 'high road' is open and safe, if yes, proceed as follows.
  
• Stock up on food in SJPDP, forget about healthy living, bananas, chocolate, nuts, dried fruit and bread and cheese/dried sausage are your friends here.
• Send main backpack ahead to Orisson and reserve a bed there. Keep day pack with food, water and rain/cold weather gear.
• Eat bananas first, then take frequent breaks to snack and drink plenty of water.
• Do not rush, from SJPDP it is only 8km, take your time and enjoy the landscape.
• Enjoy pilgrims dinner at Orisson and stock up on more food (bananas!) as necessary.
  
• Start with the sunrise, or slightly before, the next day.
• Send main backpack ahead again, see above.
  
• Carry plenty of water, there aren't any reliable source of drinkable water until the Roland fountain.
  
• Rest frequently and drink water and snack abundantly. You have plenty of time to cover the ~18km to Roncesvalles. Do.not.rush!
• In May you will have ~14 hours of daylight, use them all, do.not.rush.
• Do not take the steep descend into Roncesvalles, but the alternative, you will be tired and it will be easier to slip and injure yourself.

Buen Camino, SY

 

[naplesdon]

Walk the Val Carlos!!!

 

[Mark Lee]

Walk the Val Carlos!!!

Agreed. You won't be disappointed.
I've walked both ways. Both were nice. Beautiful views. Can't say one is better than the other.
Why the attraction solely to the Napoleon route? Is it because that's the route the guy took in the movie?

 

[naplesdon]

Agreed. You won't be disappointed.
I've walked both ways. Both were nice. Beautiful views. Can't say one is better than the other.
Why the attraction solely to the Napoleon route? Is it because that's the route the guy took in the movie?

And remember he died there like many other pilgrims!!!

 

[SYates]

... Why the attraction solely to the Napoleon route? Is it because that's the route the guy took in the movie?

No, for me it is simply less cars/traffic! SY

 

[Mysticl]

The attraction for me is the view and also the challenge. I want to know IF I can do it. SYates thank you so much for that checklist I think I shall incorporate that into my planning it looks pretty solid and practical. I HAVE done very difficult mountain trails before, slightly more than 10km hikes and the terrain was likely similar what I expect on the Camino if not harder (I live in BC) but then again that was a couple years ago and it WAS hard just not impossible ... still .. I did THAT with no training so hopefully I can manage ok in May after 3 months of daily walking (hills included) ... I guess what has me spooked is the mileage ... at least for the second day ... not QUITE sure I can manage 18 km in one go ... the terrain/elevation doesn't quite bother me as much
.

 

[SYates]

18km in 14 hours is just a bit more than 1km/hour. KM not miles! SY

 

[Icacos]

The attraction for me is the view and also the challenge. I want to know IF I can do it. SYates thank you so much for that checklist I think I shall incorporate that into my planning it looks pretty solid and practical. I HAVE done very difficult mountain trails before, slightly more than 10km hikes and the terrain was likely similar what I expect on the Camino if not harder (I live in BC) but then again that was a couple years ago and it WAS hard just not impossible ... still .. I did THAT with no training so hopefully I can manage ok in May after 3 months of daily walking (hills included) ... I guess what has me spooked is the mileage ... at least for the second day ... not QUITE sure I can manage 18 km in one go ... the terrain/elevation doesn't quite bother me as much
.

Hi @Mysticl, like you, I had my heart set on the Route Napoleon for the view and the challenge, but alas, that route was closed due to snow when I started in early April 2013, so I had to go the Valcarlos route which, by the way, was not at all disappointing. I know how you feel. Keep up your training and plan to follow the advice others have given you in this thread, particularly going very slowly and stopping frequently to rest and replenish. I feel sure with that, and the right mental outlook (and who will not have the right mental outlook with so many of us supporting you) you will soon 'get into the groove' and have no trouble going over the top. I wish you good weather, good stamina and Buen Camino. Come back and let us know how you manage.

 

[Icacos]

I should have added .... Yes, there are on the Forum steadfast proponents of the Valcarlos route, and they are right ..... but you want to walk the Route Napoleon, and I support you.

 

[SYates]

... Yes, there are on the Forum steadfast proponents of the Valcarlos route, and they are right ..... but you want to walk the Route Napoleon, and I support you.

So do I, as long as it is officially open and safe to walk! Buen Camino! SY

 

[Walli Walker]

Mysticl, whether you think you can, or think you can't, you are usually right.

 

[CdnDreamer]

In 2012 my friend and I at 60 and 54 years of age walked that route. We are from a town near Toronto so we did mostly flat walking to prepare for the camino. The 8 km to Orrison took us 6 hours. I was so worried about the next day that we had our packs picked up in Orrison and delivered to Roncesvalles. The 18 km the next day took us from 8 am to 4 pm. It was not as steep and we took the easier route down the mountain. It was an enjoyable day. We carried a small piece of tyvek housewrap as our ground sheet, and we would lay down to rest. We both had small bags with us that could be carried like a back pack and we only carried rain gear, food, water and our electronics. There is a new service at http://www.expressbourricot.com/en/persons-transport/ that shows they can split the walk in half rather than 8 km/18 km. I don't know anything about their service.

 

[Sue M]

I walked from St. Jean to Roncesvalles in one go at 67 and not very fit, without any training. I was very tired when I got there but not at collapsing point! By the time I got to Burgos (and went home, to return later for the last 100k) I had dreadful blisters and had to abandon my walking boots for crocs. I did the last 100k in sandals with no blisters at all. Enjoy!

 

[Jellycat]

Try not to put yourself under pressure if you can. You'll know what to do when you get there, have checked the weather out, listened to advice and chatted with other pilgrims. The main thing is to enjoy the experience and immerse yourself in whichever path you take. The Valcarlos route (starts from SJPP too) is by no means a walk in the park. I had to take it in 2011 due to strong winds over the top in early March. I thoroughly enjoyed it, it was a long day, tough in parts with some beautiful scenery and I was pretty shattered by the time I got to Roncesvalles. I was happy to have arrived without injuries and be in a decent state to continue on with my journey the next day. Take it slow and steady and I'm sure you'll enjoy the gradual improved fitness, energy levels and weight loss that the Camino brings as I did. Buen Camino!

 

[jeffnd]

First day: Walk to Valcarlos.
Second day: Taxi back to St. Jean in the morning, walk to Orrison.
Third Day: Walk to Roncesvalles

 

[LesBrass]

Hi,

I am hoping to walk the Camino in May 2015 but I have a question regarding the section from Orrison to Roncesvalles. I am slow walking the Camino with my husband and we are planning on only covering 12 km/day give or take, at least initially. I am 57 and overweight and although I can walk 12 km relatively easily on a standard grade, crossing a mountain while walking that same 12 km, is a whole nother kettle of fish. I'd REALLY like to try it however so I am looking for a possible safety net if things go south. Is it possible to call a taxi on the path above Orisson or is finding a likely pick up location dicey about midway along ... I imagine if I get to the halfway point and I am still ok I'd prolly end up giving it a go ( I am stubborn like that) but if I am absolutely strung out at that point it sure would be nice to be able to bail and pick it up the next day. I just want to know if it is worth a try. I'd hate to not try and then find out later it was possible but then again the reverse is also true I am afraid about biting off more than I can handle too soon and blowing my entire Camino. I know the Valcarlos route is an option but I had my heart set on Napoleon and a SJPP start. if there was a viable escape hatch I'd feel much more secure in giving it a shot. Anyone have any experience with something like this or am I possibly biting off more than I can chew?

Mysticl- I was exactly the same as you last year. About 2 weeks before I walked I got myself into such a state that I changed my plans and started in Roncesvalles. I regretted that decision throughout my camino and I still regret the choice. Having walked the rest of the camino Francis I do beleive I would have been fine... I talked myself out of the climb.

I'm going to do it again in April... I dont think it will be easy but mentally I'm happy that I will get there... I really think a lot of the first couple of days is in your head and if you can walk the rest of the route you can walk this part. Lise T has some great tips... start slow and let the climb tell you where your pace is... have a wonderful wonderful walk!

 

[GettingThere]

Hey.

Im a big girl. And I did Orrisson to Roncesvalles in about 7.5hours.

I just cruised.
I think SY suggestion of getting your pack transferred is a good one.
However, I carried mine and it fitted so well that I didn't notice it. ( until tge next day into Zubiri )

My tips from a big girls perpective are:
(This work for me and may not suit everyone)

1. Start early and start in cruise mode.
2. Walking Poles help immensely in keeping you upright and getting more oxygen in. Pacer poles are amazing.
3. Small steps. If it gets hard...take smaller steps. Its amazing how far little steps take you. No one cares and infact I got people complimenting me on my uphill walking style.
4. Keep hydrarated. Take little sips often.
5. Have some good protein with you. Jerky or grab an egg from the man in the van ( if he's there) about 4/5km from Orrisson (i think)
6. Grab some boiled lollies for a sugar hit. Worthers orginals were my choice.
7. Dont try and keep up with any one. Arrange to meet your husband every 30-60 min. He needs to go at his pace too.
8. When you start the decent. There is a road to your right. ( approx 2km longer) but a lot easier to go down than the forest track with tree roots and slippery surfaces
9. Dont under estimate how strong big people are. Often we a built for endurance not speed.
10. The first/second day buzz will get you there. But it is the next third or fourth day that will get you. That is when your 12km a day ( or less) will serve you well.

There is no one body type that suits the Camino. I got passed by people ( women and men) alot bigger than me.
And I saw slight men and women struggle. The Camino equals things out in its own way.

And...if it should happen....its ok to stop too. Or try a different tact. Its your journey....your path....your walk.

☺

This is really great advice, Lise. Thanks so much for sharing these tips - these will be very useful for me too.

 

[SYates]

First day: Walk to Valcarlos.
Second day: Taxi back to St. Jean in the morning, walk to Orrison.
Third Day: Walk to Roncesvalles

Can you explain the reasoning behind your post a bit more? I mean why should anybody walk to Valcarlos and then drive back to SJPDP and then walk to Orrison. Why do you suggest this 'Valcarlos Detour'? SY

 

[Icacos]

Can you explain the reasoning behind your post a bit more? I mean why should anybody walk to Valcarlos and then drive back to SJPDP and then walk to Orrison. Why do you suggest this 'Valcarlos Detour'? SY

I was wondering too. Maybe ............. tongue in cheek?

 

[Deleted member 3000]

Having walked the rest of the camino Francis

You did walk all of the Camino Frances. It is the Camino Navarro until Roncesvalles...

 

[Anniesantiago]

Mysticl, I sent you a PM.

 

[CaminoKris2016]

Ok, here my step by step guide for less fit people to get over the Pyrenees:

• Check with the pilgrims office in SJPDP if the 'high road' is open and safe, if yes, proceed as follows.
  
• Stock up on food in SJPDP, forget about healthy living, bananas, chocolate, nuts, dried fruit and bread and cheese/dried sausage are your friends here.
• Send main backpack ahead to Orisson and reserve a bed there. Keep day pack with food, water and rain/cold weather gear.
• Eat bananas first, then take frequent breaks to snack and drink plenty of water.
• Do not rush, from SJPDP it is only 8km, take your time and enjoy the landscape.
• Enjoy pilgrims dinner at Orisson and stock up on more food (bananas!) as necessary.
  
• Start with the sunrise, or slightly before, the next day.
• Send main backpack ahead again, see above.
  
• Carry plenty of water, there aren't any reliable source of drinkable water until the Roland fountain.
  
• Rest frequently and drink water and snack abundantly. You have plenty of time to cover the ~18km to Roncesvalles. Do.not.rush!
• In May you will have ~14 hours of daylight, use them all, do.not.rush.
• Do not take the steep descend into Roncesvalles, but the alternative, you will be tired and it will be easier to slip and injure yourself.

Buen Camino, SY

Great Advice SYates! I wish I had followed it! I had made it up to Orrisson which was a lot steeper than I expected. I wasn't in good physical conditioning...I had a wonderful time in Orrisson, but I let my anxiety push me to take a taxi from Orrisson to Roncesvalle where I walked on to Corazon Puro. I'm definitely going to keep this advice and save it! I'm making another attempt in October 2016, and I plan on planning a lot better. Thank you!

 

[Suzanne S.]

I walked from St. Jean to Roncesvalles in one go at 67 and not very fit, without any training. I was very tired when I got there but not at collapsing point! By the time I got to Burgos (and went home, to return later for the last 100k) I had dreadful blisters and had to abandon my walking boots for crocs. I did the last 100k in sandals with no blisters at all. Enjoy!

Sue M! Very inspiring! I am 60, walking the first time on May 1 from SJPP. I want to get to Roncesvalles that day. I have been hiking with my pack, although only up to about 12-13 km each time. I have three more months to prepare. Your post makes me feel like I CAN do it! I would like to know though...What Crocs did so well for you? I am looking for the perfect pair of sandals...
Thanks so much! Suzanne

 

[Mysticl]

In 2012 my friend and I at 60 and 54 years of age walked that route. We are from a town near Toronto so we did mostly flat walking to prepare for the camino. The 8 km to Orrison took us 6 hours. I was so worried about the next day that we had our packs picked up in Orrison and delivered to Roncesvalles. The 18 km the next day took us from 8 am to 4 pm. It was not as steep and we took the easier route down the mountain. It was an enjoyable day. We carried a small piece of tyvek housewrap as our ground sheet, and we would lay down to rest. We both had small bags with us that could be carried like a back pack and we only carried rain gear, food, water and our electronics. There is a new service at http://www.expressbourricot.com/en/persons-transport/ that shows they can split the walk in half rather than 8 km/18 km. I don't know anything about their service.

Thank you SO much for that link. It is exactly the kind of thing I was looking for. Splitting the two days into more or less equal distances will be much more doable for me. Not exactly sure how it works but I am definitely going to investigate them

 

[Mysticl]

Hey.

Im a big girl. And I did Orrisson to Roncesvalles in about 7.5hours.

I just cruised.
I think SY suggestion of getting your pack transferred is a good one.
However, I carried mine and it fitted so well that I didn't notice it. ( until tge next day into Zubiri )

My tips from a big girls perpective are:
(This work for me and may not suit everyone)

1. Start early and start in cruise mode.
2. Walking Poles help immensely in keeping you upright and getting more oxygen in. Pacer poles are amazing.
3. Small steps. If it gets hard...take smaller steps. Its amazing how far little steps take you. No one cares and infact I got people complimenting me on my uphill walking style.
4. Keep hydrarated. Take little sips often.
5. Have some good protein with you. Jerky or grab an egg from the man in the van ( if he's there) about 4/5km from Orrisson (i think)
6. Grab some boiled lollies for a sugar hit. Worthers orginals were my choice.
7. Dont try and keep up with any one. Arrange to meet your husband every 30-60 min. He needs to go at his pace too.
8. When you start the decent. There is a road to your right. ( approx 2km longer) but a lot easier to go down than the forest track with tree roots and slippery surfaces
9. Dont under estimate how strong big people are. Often we a built for endurance not speed.
10. The first/second day buzz will get you there. But it is the next third or fourth day that will get you. That is when your 12km a day ( or less) will serve you well.

There is no one body type that suits the Camino. I got passed by people ( women and men) alot bigger than me.
And I saw slight men and women struggle. The Camino equals things out in its own way.

And...if it should happen....its ok to stop too. Or try a different tact. Its your journey....your path....your walk.

☺

Thank you Lise. That sounds like good solid advice. Very reassuring too. I am probably second guessing myself too much as my time approaches. Pre Camino jitters heh ... I have my pacer poles at the ready and I am planning to get my husband a set too before we leave. He borrowed my daughter's pair last time we went out and was quite pleasantly surprised at how much better he felt ... he is fairly fit and didn't figure he needed them ... but he has now changed his mind after trying them