- Time of past OR future Camino
- Frances 15,16,18
VdlP 23, Invierno 23, Fisterra 23
For 2024 Pilgrims: €50,- donation = 1 year with no ads on the forum + 90% off any 2024 Guide. More here. (Discount code sent to you by Private Message after your donation) |
---|
So long as you are replenishing the water in the bladder daily with fresh water there's really nothing else you need to do to keep it sanitary. I don't normally clean mine while I'm on the Camino, and I haven't had any problems. Perhaps @davebugg will be along to explain why cleaning isn't necessary until you are ready to store it.While i use bladders for day hikes at home, for a camino keeping it "sanitary" seems to much hassle for me.
My bladder and tube go in the freezer for a couple of days every few weeks. I only use them for day walks and long (very slow) runs. Never for Camino or multi-day walks.So long as you are replenishing the water in the bladder daily with fresh water there's really nothing else you need to do to keep it sanitary. I don't normally clean mine while I'm on the Camino, and I haven't had any problems. Perhaps @davebugg will be along to explain why cleaning isn't necessary until you are ready to store it.
So long as you are replenishing the water in the bladder daily with fresh water there's really nothing else you need to do to keep it sanitary. I don't normally clean mine while I'm on the Camino, and I haven't had any problems. Perhaps @davebugg will be along to explain why cleaning isn't necessary until you are ready to store it.
Have a look at a ‘boresnake’ - you can get them down to 0.177”. Maybe a 0.22” would be suitable for a water tube?I have found with a bladder I sometimes get a black mold inside the tube, but that would be the same for my bottle system too. I'm working on a way of being able to clean them every couple of weeks. For anyone who is into shooting, rather like a 'pull through'.
Will check it out.Have a look at a ‘boresnake’ - you can get them down to 0.177”. Maybe a 0.22” would be suitable for a water tube?
I’d get my micrometer out and check, but it’s in one of my outbuildings, I’m in bed and it’s cold and raining.
I use water bottles also. And like @henrythedog I too fully hydrate before leaving in the morning....at least a liter of water, plus tea or coffee and perhaps juice. I usually have to make a bathroom stop within an hour...and when we leave early that means I am mooningfor a minute in the dark! The amount of 1/2liter of bottles I carry depends upon the stage and water availability, but I always arrive anywhere with a half liter of water in reserve. I carry water in the side pockets of the backpack, sometimes, jacket or pantspockets. It depends as well on the time of year and what I am wearing. In the past, I would buy bottled water and change the bottles every few days.
I absolutely must have a my Platypus and tube when I walk. My history of dehydration has taught me if I cannot quickly grab that tube and slurp up the water, it just won't happen until too late....I'm sure this will create a lot of debate
What 'system' do you prefer? Do you have others to share?
There are specific brushes made for the drinking tubes by all the water reservoir manufacturers. There are also brushes that are used for aquarium tubing. This is the one I have on hand.I have found with a bladder I sometimes get a black mold inside the tube, but that would be the same for my bottle system too. I'm working on a way of being able to clean them every couple of weeks. For anyone who is into shooting, rather like a 'pull through'...
There are specific brushes made for the drinking tubes by all the water reservoir manufacturers. There are also brushes that are used for aquarium tubing. This is the one I have on hand.
View attachment 94362
That black stuff may be algae, rather than mold. I have found that keeping the reservoir and water tube out of sunlight as they are drying has prevented this from occurring. If you do find it, a flush of the tube with a solution of 1:5 bleach-water solution using a syringe will do well just prior to storage.
Rob, I know you understand that my post below is not a critique about what you or anyone else prefers as a water carrying system or what handles best or what feels more 'natural' in usage. I want folks to use what makes sense to them, and seems the best choice. Those factors for choosing are all subjective issues which no one can dispute.
I simply will not tell someone that bottles are bad, reservoirs are the best. I am limited to telling people WHY I might prefer one over the other, and they can legitimately do likewise.
This post is written to dispel myths which are commonly used to try and claim that reservoirs are either less sanitary to use, or are less easy to use than bottles. This is quite different than how someone 'perceives' usability as was mentioned above regarding the subjective value to the individual.
I'm NOT writing this post to suggest that I and others who prefer reservoirs are making the best and most superior choice; I am posting this to preempt those who misstate facts - or who have insufficient facts -to claim that using hydration reservoirs is the WRONG way to go.
1. Sanitation. With water carry, bottles have no advantage. Reservoirs stay just as sanitary. They do not require cleaning every day, nor do they need to be dried.
As with plumbing, it is the change of water and water flow through frequent use which keeps bottles, reservoirs, and tubing fresh and sanitary. With normal use, both bladders and bottles are constantly refilled and emptied That keeps them sanitary UNLESS contaminated water is introduced, or other fluids with sugars (juices, energy drinks, soda pop, etc) are put into a bottle or a reservoir.
While working for the local public health district, I did a review of the literature, which I again did in 2016. Comparisons of bacterial contamination levels between bottles and hydration bladders were indistinguishable -- both had equally low rates of bacterial contamination. And both were at about equal risk for developing significant levels of bacteria and mold if not cleaned and dried properly prior to storage. In the last few years, the hydration reservoirs have become more modular in nature and have wider openings to access the water compartments, making it much easier to clean and prepare for storage than previous generations of the product.
One example study, from 2009:
https://www.wemjournal.org/article/S1080-6032(09)70419-3/fulltext
When it is time to store bottles or bladders away for the season, they can be sanitized if desired with a bit of bleach added to the final rinse water during cleaning. It is not necessary, but there is no harm in doing so. Then they can be rinsed out and be allowed to dry.
Molds and other nasty things occur if either container is stored with water over a period of time, or have contained other fluids which might have sugars and then are not properly washed out prior to long term storage. Mold may also form in the shorter term when fluids with sugars are exposed to warmth and sun.
Also, not all discolorations are harmful molds. Most times, it may be an algae growth from leaving stagnant water exposed to light.
2. Ease of Use. I find it personally easier to raise the mouth tube on my shoulder strap to drink from. I do not like to reach around to a side pocket, or even need to take off my pack to do so. I definitely do NOT like stuff hanging on my shoulder straps like bottles of water.
Again, this is personal preference, not an issue of something being 'better'. Access water bottles is not an issue of usability for bottle users.
3. Weight. Here is where two major claims are made, one is correct and the other is not.
A typical empty 2 liter reservoir weighs around 4 to 6 ounces. The equivalent in bottles around 1.5 to 3 ounces. Depending on bottle material used, though, bottles can weigh up to 8 ounces.
So while it is correct that bottles can weigh less, it is not a significant issue of consideration with overall backpack weight.
The other issue is reservoir water capacity and total weight.
You do not have to fill a reservoir to the tippy top. I will carry as much water as I need to carry from water source to water source. If the next water source is 32 kilometers distant under a hot sun, I will carry up to 4 liters. If the next water source is a few kilometers distant in cool weather, I might carry a half liter.
4. Refills. This is actually a subheading under 'ease of use', but it is frequently pointed to as why bottles are better than reservoirs.
I can refill my reservoir without even removing my backpack. One does not need to pull a reservoir out of the pack. It is a matter of using a quick disconnect system which is a simple and cheap add on accessory.
For those interested in adding a Quick Connect adapter to your hydration reservoir/bladder, I've added a link below. With the quick disconnect added, I don't even need to remove my backpack or daypack to do a quick and easy refill of the bladder.
NOTE: The video shows the quick disconnect being used with a water filter as used when wilderness backpacking. However, on camino I leave off the filter altogether. The refill cap is simply attached to my collapsible water bottle, after it is filled with water from a fountain or faucet.
For refill bottles.... I use an extremely lightweight collapsible bottle that can hold up to 1.5 liters. Empty, it rolls down to a small bundle that are easily stashed in an outside pocket.
Many times, I will carry 1/2 liter in the collapsible bottle as a quick backup as the weather or the distance between water refills dictates. So, if I decide to, say, carry 1 liters of water between water resupply points, I will fill the reservoir with 1/2 liter, and then carry 1/2 liter in the bottle, keeping the bottle partially collapsed and tucked into a side pocket.
By doing the above I do not need to see the water bladder itself in order to be assured of adequate water or to avoid accidentally running out of water.
The collapsible bottle I use is just one container option. The refill adapter with the Quick Connect kit can also fit on a variety of empty bottled water containers.
So those are the major issues that always seem to come up. There are other myths, but those are the major ones.
I absolutely must have a my Platypus and tube when I walk. My history of dehydration has taught me if I cannot quickly grab that tube and slurp up the water, it just won't happen until too late....
Thanks @davebugg . I have one of those brushes, though I was a bit reluctant to add extra weight to the pack for 'on camino' use. Hence trying to rig something using shoe laces or similar.
But it really hasn't been much of a problem. The denture tablets soaking method helps, every couple of weeks.
.
I'm NOT writing this post to suggest that I and others who prefer reservoirs are making the best and most superior choice; I am posting this to preempt those who misstate facts - or who have insufficient facts -to claim that using hydration reservoirs is the WRONG way to go.
No, no, no!!!! Do not delete a thing; your video is terrific, nor did you mistate anything.In fact, if I ever decide to go back to using water bottles, your video has given me some tips that I would use.
I had thought that rather than a separate thread, that my post might be a complimentary expansion on the topic as a whole. My thought was that my doing a separate thread could be wrongly interpreted as being a counter-argument against water bottles.
I wanted my post to be viewed as something specifically directed toward those who think "I love the idea of using a bladder, but they are_____________". The fill-in-the-blank being something that isn't necessarily true or can be easily dealt with. It wasn't intended to sway those who like using bottles, or to argue against using bottles. It was to help those who already like the idea of using a reservoir.
Rob, the video was a great depiction of the various choices. PLUS, it capably outlined how you evolved your system for water carrying to what you use today. There are a ton of folks who share your preference for bottles, and the video will add insights to how functional your system is for bottle users.
The need to monitor water levels is important. I agree with you that a reservoir in the backpack makes it difficult to do. In fact, being able to monitor water levels not only keeps you from accidentally running out of water, but it also made me carry more water than I needed to carry "Just In Case", which means carrying much more weight than needed.
That is why IF someone uses a reservoir, using the collapsible, reservoir refill bottle to carry a set amount of water, will eliminate suddenly running out of water. If I decide to carry 2 liters of water, I will put .5 to 1 liter of that amount into the refill bottle that sits in a side pocket.
Like you, someone who uses bottles gets a direct look at that amount of water left.
Rob, this is your thread. If it seems to you that my post contrarian and interferes with the instructional value of your video, I am more than happy to remove it, and save it for posting at some other time.
edit: rereading words, they seem a bit to harsh to me. That is not my intention. I'll write something up again when i have had another coffee or two.
Ease of access seems to be a big issue for lots of people. I have no problem with taking off my pack and pulling out a coolish bottle.
I have used a bladder once. Unfortunately the lid cracked.
I generally take four 500ml bottles stored in my pack. The water remains surprisingly cool for quite a while, even on the VdlP. I have only run out of water once, and that was walking from Canterbury to Dover!!
Rob, I know you understand that my post below is not a critique about what you or anyone else prefers as a water carrying system or what handles best or what feels more 'natural' in usage. I want folks to use what makes sense to them, and seems the best choice. Those factors for choosing are all subjective issues which no one can dispute.
I simply will not tell someone that bottles are bad, reservoirs are the best. I am limited to telling people WHY I might prefer one over the other, and they can legitimately do likewise.
This post is written to dispel myths which are commonly used to try and claim that reservoirs are either less sanitary to use, or are less easy to use than bottles. This is quite different than how someone 'perceives' usability as was mentioned above regarding the subjective value to the individual.
I'm NOT writing this post to suggest that I and others who prefer reservoirs are making the best and most superior choice; I am posting this to preempt those who misstate facts - or who have insufficient facts -to claim that using hydration reservoirs is the WRONG way to go.
1. Sanitation. With water carry, bottles have no advantage. Reservoirs stay just as sanitary. They do not require cleaning every day, nor do they need to be dried.
As with plumbing, it is the change of water and water flow through frequent use which keeps bottles, reservoirs, and tubing fresh and sanitary. With normal use, both bladders and bottles are constantly refilled and emptied That keeps them sanitary UNLESS contaminated water is introduced, or other fluids with sugars (juices, energy drinks, soda pop, etc) are put into a bottle or a reservoir.
While working for the local public health district, I did a review of the literature, which I again did in 2016. Comparisons of bacterial contamination levels between bottles and hydration bladders were indistinguishable -- both had equally low rates of bacterial contamination. And both were at about equal risk for developing significant levels of bacteria and mold if not cleaned and dried properly prior to storage. In the last few years, the hydration reservoirs have become more modular in nature and have wider openings to access the water compartments, making it much easier to clean and prepare for storage than previous generations of the product.
One example study, from 2009:
https://www.wemjournal.org/article/S1080-6032(09)70419-3/fulltext
When it is time to store bottles or bladders away for the season, they can be sanitized if desired with a bit of bleach added to the final rinse water during cleaning. It is not necessary, but there is no harm in doing so. Then they can be rinsed out and be allowed to dry.
Molds and other nasty things occur if either container is stored with water over a period of time, or have contained other fluids which might have sugars and then are not properly washed out prior to long term storage. Mold may also form in the shorter term when fluids with sugars are exposed to warmth and sun.
Also, not all discolorations are harmful molds. Most times, it may be an algae growth from leaving stagnant water exposed to light.
2. Ease of Use. I find it personally easier to raise the mouth tube on my shoulder strap to drink from. I do not like to reach around to a side pocket, or even need to take off my pack to do so. I definitely do NOT like stuff hanging on my shoulder straps like bottles of water.
Again, this is personal preference, not an issue of something being 'better'. Access water bottles is not an issue of usability for bottle users.
3. Weight. Here is where two major claims are made, one is correct and the other is not.
A typical empty 2 liter reservoir weighs around 4 to 6 ounces. The equivalent in bottles around 1.5 to 3 ounces. Depending on bottle material used, though, bottles can weigh up to 8 ounces.
So while it is correct that bottles can weigh less, it is not a significant issue of consideration with overall backpack weight.
The other issue is reservoir water capacity and total weight.
You do not have to fill a reservoir to the tippy top. I will carry as much water as I need to carry from water source to water source. If the next water source is 32 kilometers distant under a hot sun, I will carry up to 4 liters. If the next water source is a few kilometers distant in cool weather, I might carry a half liter.
4. Refills. This is actually a subheading under 'ease of use', but it is frequently pointed to as why bottles are better than reservoirs.
I can refill my reservoir without even removing my backpack. One does not need to pull a reservoir out of the pack. It is a matter of using a quick disconnect system which is a simple and cheap add on accessory.
For those interested in adding a Quick Connect adapter to your hydration reservoir/bladder, I've added a link below. With the quick disconnect added, I don't even need to remove my backpack or daypack to do a quick and easy refill of the bladder.
NOTE: The video shows the quick disconnect being used with a water filter as used when wilderness backpacking. However, on camino I leave off the filter altogether. The refill cap is simply attached to my collapsible water bottle, after it is filled with water from a fountain or faucet.
For refill bottles.... I use an extremely lightweight collapsible bottle that can hold up to 1.5 liters. Empty, it rolls down to a small bundle that are easily stashed in an outside pocket.
Many times, I will carry 1/2 liter in the collapsible bottle as a quick backup as the weather or the distance between water refills dictates. So, if I decide to, say, carry 1 liters of water between water resupply points, I will fill the reservoir with 1/2 liter, and then carry 1/2 liter in the bottle, keeping the bottle partially collapsed and tucked into a side pocket.
By doing the above I do not need to see the water bladder itself in order to be assured of adequate water or to avoid accidentally running out of water.
The collapsible bottle I use is just one container option. The refill adapter with the Quick Connect kit can also fit on a variety of empty bottled water containers.
So those are the major issues that always seem to come up. There are other myths, but those are the major ones.
Thank you,RoboI'm sure this will create a lot of debate
What 'system' do you prefer? Do you have others to share?
Great video - could you kindly post your link to the hipster clips? ThanksI'm sure this will create a lot of debate
What 'system' do you prefer? Do you have others to share?
I purchased bottle of water at the beginning. Refilled at every opportunity. Drank the water when I was thirsty. Heard about how desolate the Meseta was so purchased a second bottle. Easy.I'm sure this will create a lot of debate
What 'system' do you prefer? Do you have others to share?
Had a problem with the tube attached to bottles. The adapter that was supposed to fit a Zig aluminium bottle was not even close to the correct thread and the manufacturer was less than helpful when I contacted them, in fact, quite rude and dislikeable. Prefer my hiking bottle from Lidl. Built in carabiner and pop up drinking spout at the press of a button. Carry spare plastic bottle in pack side pockets. I will refill that maybe 4 times and then look for a recycling bin to get rid and buy new bottle. I did have a holster for carrying any old shape of bottle that I could sling round my neck but unfortunately the left it on a table in a café in Portomarin.I'm sure this will create a lot of debate
What 'system' do you prefer? Do you have others to share?
Great video - could you kindly post your link to the hipster clips? Thanks
Awesome advice here and really enjoyed your video Robo - subscribed to your channel for further tips for when I can finally set out on my journey
Wondering where your links are for the hipster clips and the clip on accessory tube? Love that idea as I can never reach my bottles on the side pouches of my back pack either without dislocating my shoulder lol.
Love the idea of a shoulder strap pouch keeping the bottle within easy reach. Could you tell me the brand name or did it come as an added extra for your particular brand of backpack?For me a combination of a pouch on my shoulder straps for a bottle and some water in the side pockets of the pack (depending on how much i have to carry) works well. If my bottle in the front empties, i can switch or refill it. I tried a similar thing to your clips, but found the pouch more comfortable (and weight is more or less the same).
While i use bladders for day hikes at home, for a camino keeping it "sanitary" seems to much hassle for me. And the weight to volume ratio on those 0.75l "single use" bottles is just superb (i use them for a couple of days).
Have to say, i am blessed that i don't have to carry that much water. Drink a lot before leaving albergue, like 0.5 to 0.75l. Than for the first 10k its another 0.5 or even less. For the next 10k another 0.5 to 1.0. So even if for some reason there is no water to be had for 20k, i can start with just about 1.5l and likely have to spare.
Only section i carried 3l was the Via Trajana in the Meseta, and i have to say, i was glad i had it.
(i do quite long day hikes at home. 35-50k. Usually there is no way to easily get water. So i try to adapt to having to use less, cause carrying 5l with me would not be that nice)
And i have to say, very nice video again Rob!
edit: picture
View attachment 94356
Love the idea of a shoulder strap pouch keeping the bottle within easy reach. Could you tell me the brand name or did it come as an added extra for your particular brand of backpack?
I met a man at the beginning of my 2014 Camino who had a single-use 1 litre bottle wrapped in silver duct tape for insulation. He said it also gave extra strength to the bottle walls. Would like to have met him at the end of the journey to see whether this met his expectations.
I recently bought a water bag but I haven’t tried it yet so I don’t know if it will turn out better or worse than the bottle.
2 things to add from someone that uses something similar:This shoulder strap holder and bottle also looks like a great idea.
RoboI added some links below the video in the description box, but here they are.
Here are some handy links. (no commercial interest)
Hipsta Clips. https://www.hipsta.com.au/
Drinking Tube: https://amzn.to/2ZIkNgP
Though I prefer this style of bite valve. Bite Valve: https://amzn.to/3smlgBy
Robo
Inspired by your description, a couple of ‘hipsta clips’ arrivedtoday from Oz.
The clever part is the metal spring-clip, but the plastic attachment clip seems fragile. How robust do you find them to be?
I’m considering extracting the metal clip and zip-tie’ing it to my rucksack shoulder strap
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?