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One way to know if the new Brierley contains both routes: In the stretch between Betanzos and Hospital de Bruma, the old camino will stay on or near the DP-0105 through Leiro and into Vilacoba, where the Casa Julia is. The new route, which we followed, turns right (west) shortly after Leiro and bypasses Vilacoba entirely. That was the biggest of the differences we noted.
Hi, If you go onto one of the mobile phone mapping applications like Viewranger ( other applications are available ! )you can find GPS routes that were uploaded when the English route was the original and so download the old route
If it would be of any help I can search for my 2016 "old route" GPS Wikiloc track...In looking thru the Brierley's Ingles guidebook, I am wondering if any of the 'optional' paths that he shows are part of the 'Old' Ingles route? Having reviewed several other resources, it seems that at least two of his 'stages' do that. Does anyone familiar with the Ingles and Brierley have any view on this?
I appreciate the input.
If it would be of any help I can search for my 2016 "old route" GPS Wikiloc track...
And you wouldn't need it on the Ingles, anyway, Dave. That's definitely overkill.I hadn't planned to make use of GPS. . . yet.
And you wouldn't need it on the Ingles, anyway, Dave. That's definitely overkill.
Of course, the new route is well marked. And if you want to follow the older path, why not just print out screenshots of Wikiloc tracks and take them with you?
Here you have it: https://www.wikiloc.com/hiking-trails/presedo-bruma-13889076Ok, I get it now, duh....
That's a good idea, thanks. Please, pass it on
Because there were none in 2016 on that stretch...
Interestingly, I noticed that unlike the 2019 edition, the 2016 Brierley, doesn't have much Optional routing on any stage. For example, on the 'stage' going between Betanzos and Hospital de Bruma, there are no Optional routes listed like in the 2019 edition.
Don't worry about the "highway" (which is not). In US terms this AC-542 so-called highway is just a minor road if it comes to poor weather even more. Real, multi lanes highways in Spain are marked either with A (free) or AP (private, toll), they are fenced and walking on them is highly forbidden. In this case AC means A Coruna and it's local road. Which of course can be busy too. I wouldn't know because in 2016 I walked the old route between Presedo and Bruma:...
I’m guessing then that they are still visible and since I doubt I’ll walk the Ingles again I might walk the old route so I can at least past by Bar Julia. I don’t know exactly how busy the AC-542 will be, but the idea of walking along a highway here in SoCal isn’t high on my list of things to do. And if the weather is bad making visibility poor for drivers, well..... no thanks.
As I said above, we walked the new route last June from Betanzos to Bruma. I have no specific recollection of whether the old marker was still visible where the new route diverges near Leiro. HOWEVER, in general the old markers had been removed at the divergence points. I know this because we were often walking with other pilgrims who had only old guidebooks, and they were thoroughly confused at all the points where the routes diverged, because their guidebook pointed one way and the new (and only) markers pointed in a different way. I seemed to be the only one with an updated guidebook, so I frequently had to explain that the routing had been changed, and that the markers were correct.I received the 2016 edition of Brierley's guide which is based on the OLD route. I then looked at the 2019 edition which is based on the NEW route.
The 2019 edition includes Optional routes on some of the listed 'stages'. Those Optional routes seem to be identical -- both in the directions given, and what is drawn on his maps -- to the OLD routing that appears in the 2016 edition.
It appears that the 2019 Brierley's has BOTH routes in this edition: the primary route which incorporates the new changes, along with those portions of the Old route that the New route replaced and are now listed as Optional routes. As stated above, the Optional routes, AKA Old route, incorporates the same basic (but abbreviated) descriptions and directions, and map drawings that appear in the 2016 edition. It seems that if one could follow the Camino from the 2016 guide, one should be able to do the same with the 2019 guide as well.
The missing piece is the question of how necessary the way-markings of yellow arrows and monuments were in order to supplement Brierley for navigation along the Old route.
Interestingly, I noticed that unlike the 2019 edition, the 2016 Brierley, doesn't have much Optional routing on any stage. For example, on the 'stage' going between Betanzos and Hospital de Bruma, there are no Optional routes listed like in the 2019 edition.
So — if the new Brierley doesn’t include specific directions at the divergence points, AND if it’s really important to you to walk the old route, I would take a gps back-up, or an older guidebook with specific directions.
In looking thru the Brierley's Ingles guidebook, I am wondering if any of the 'optional' paths that he shows are part of the 'Old' Ingles route? Having reviewed several other resources, it seems that at least two of his 'stages' do that. Does anyone familiar with the Ingles and Brierley have any view on this?
I appreciate the input.
Has anyone thought of contacting Brierley and asking him? I'm sure he would indeed tell us if the old route is indeed now listed as an optional route?
I'm willing to email him if it has not yet been done.
Hi! I walked it last August and none of the guide books had been changed as there was no time before publication. It wasn’t a problem as the ‘new’ path was well indicated with signs.
However, I did choose one day to walk the ‘old’ way.... which was shown on my guide book. Half way through a forest and a big climb, locals (who had been involved in redesigning the path, apparently) stopped by and told me I should turn back as I would not be able to get through a bit later. It looked like they were doing some big work in the forest!
I’m sorry, I don’t have my guide book here so can’t be more specific as to where it was (approx. the last day of walking or so).
Just to make you aware that maybe, the old path at times isn’t practicable any more....
Hi! I walked it last August and none of the guide books had been changed as there was no time before publication. It wasn’t a problem as the ‘new’ path was well indicated with signs.
However, I did choose one day to walk the ‘old’ way.... which was shown on my guide book. Half way through a forest and a big climb, locals (who had been involved in redesigning the path, apparently) stopped by and told me I should turn back as I would not be able to get through a bit later. It looked like they were doing some big work in the forest!
I’m sorry, I don’t have my guide book here so can’t be more specific as to where it was (approx. the last day of walking or so).
Just to make you aware that maybe, the old path at times isn’t practicable any more....
I did the old way. I was totally confused with Bar Julia deal and walked passed it in a freezing/driving rain storm. Just down the road I turned right and started walking up a hill and suddenly discovered my water bottle was empty. I stopped and asked a home owner if I could fill my bottle and btw, where is the hill?
Minutes later I realized I was there and the path was a raging river of water. I made it to the top and started walking on paved road towards Bruma. Some very kind sheep herder stopped and asked me if I needed a ride. Understand, I could not see more than 50 meters in front of me and I was freezing. I said yes, and there we went. He stopped at the first bar to buy me a drink and then another, to celebrate he had met a true ancient pilgrim. Meanwhile I was shivering and soaking wet. I said I need to find a hotel, albergue or anyplace I can dry out, get warm and sleep. He was a remote relative of the hotel owner in the Bruma. So I ended up in a very pricey ensuite which was large enough for me to unpack everything and lay it out to dry. The food was dreadful It was basically a truck stop, but there were altenative places to eat in the small town but it must have a Sunday night because everything was closed.
Sent it off on a whim... @davebugg , are you walking the Ingles this year? I leave from Ferrol on Sept 16th... (I'm longing to do a much much longer route again, as soon as health issues resolve )You can, but there is no doubt that the Optional routes are, or include, the 'Old' route.
Sent it off on a whim... @davebugg , are you walking the Ingles this year? I leave from Ferrol on Sept 16th... (I'm longing to do a much much longer route again, as soon as health issues resolve )
Very nice ! And a well thought out plan as expected. Our paths won’t cross, I’ll be home before you leave . Enjoy every minute ! Buen CaminoI am.My wife, Jill, and I will depart Ferrol on October 18.
I will be also walking the Camino Aragones with my son, Caleb.
I will fly to Paris about 11 days before Jill departs for Madrid. Once Caleb and I finish Aragones where it joins onto the Frances at Obanos or Puenta la Reina (still deciding since I've been at Puenta la Reina and Obanos twice and Caleb once) we will taxi into Pamplona.
The plan will be to fly from Pamplona to Madrid where we will meet Jill at Madrid airport on October 17. Then Caleb will catch a flight back to Denver.
If the flight schedules don't change radically, Jill and I will likely fly to A Coruna. We'll catch a taxi into Ferrol. Based on current airline schedules, it will be late morning by then. Once we get checked into our hotel, we can rest a bit, and then spend most of the afternoon wandering around Ferrol for Jill's first taste of Spain.
The nice thing is that we will be flying Jill business class, so hopefully that will make the 12 hour flight more relaxing and restful, giving her a bit of a head start against jet lag. Neither of us are affected much by 'jet lag' as Jill works four, 12-hour overnight shifts as a Pediatric Charge nurse on Pediatrics at our hospital. And I also have varied sleep shifts in my schedule due to my consulting practice, a lot of which is with clients overseas.
It is only a nine hour time difference. We will sleep really well that night. We'll start Camino the next morning.
Very nice ! And a well thought out plan as expected. Our paths won’t cross, I’ll be home before you leave . Enjoy every minute ! Buen Camino
From what I have gathered it wasn't a major re-routing overall. Some of the changes sounded like they involved shifts from busier roads to farm roads.I walked the Inglés in 2004, I believe, so I guess that was the “old route.” Can anyone tell me why they changed the route and what the major differences are? Less road perhaps? Is it a major re-routing? Are all the major stopping points still the same?
John Brierley's reply:
Dear Sophie
Thank you for your enquiry. The 2019 edition of the guide shows the new waymarked route in the familiar yellow colour. The former route is marked in grey and is shown in case a pilgrim should stray off the new path and inadvertently find themselves following arrows on the old route. Old waymarks have been removed from the first few hundred meters but confusion may still arise and old waymarks will disappear in time.
The camino routes are constantly changing (not, in my opinion, always for the best). These changes occur for a variety or reasons (not necessarily all logical but mostly around safety and improved facilities). To minimise the chances of getting lost I suggest pilgrims stay on the newly waymarked route. The 2019 guide includes one suggestion to follow a short alternative (green) route through woodland (rather than the new route parallel to the motorway into Sigueiro) and this is shown on the stage 5 map (p.43) with details in the text.
I hope this helps in your planning and wish you an uplifting journey along the beautiful pathways that make up the camino Inglés.
Many blessings and 'Bo camino'…
John (Brierley)
Sophie: Thanks for doing this. This is good knowledge that a lot of people will want to know (beyond the few of us who have been following this thread).John Brierley's reply:
Dear Sophie
Thank you for your enquiry. The 2019 edition of the guide shows the new waymarked route in the familiar yellow colour. The former route is marked in grey and is shown in case a pilgrim should stray off the new path and inadvertently find themselves following arrows on the old route. Old waymarks have been removed from the first few hundred meters but confusion may still arise and old waymarks will disappear in time.
The camino routes are constantly changing (not, in my opinion, always for the best). These changes occur for a variety or reasons (not necessarily all logical but mostly around safety and improved facilities). To minimise the chances of getting lost I suggest pilgrims stay on the newly waymarked route. The 2019 guide includes one suggestion to follow a short alternative (green) route through woodland (rather than the new route parallel to the motorway into Sigueiro) and this is shown on the stage 5 map (p.43) with details in the text.
I hope this helps in your planning and wish you an uplifting journey along the beautiful pathways that make up the camino Inglés.
Many blessings and 'Bo camino'…
John (Brierley)
Sophie: Thanks for doing this. This is good knowledge that a lot of people will want to know (beyond the few of us who have been following this thread).
Would you consider posting his response, and your question to him, as a separate thread? That way more people will see it, and it will come up more easily when someone is searching the forum.
John Brierley's reply:
Dear Sophie
Thank you for your enquiry. The 2019 edition of the guide shows the new waymarked route in the familiar yellow colour. The former route is marked in grey and is shown in case a pilgrim should stray off the new path and inadvertently find themselves following arrows on the old route. Old waymarks have been removed from the first few hundred meters but confusion may still arise and old waymarks will disappear in time.
The camino routes are constantly changing (not, in my opinion, always for the best). These changes occur for a variety or reasons (not necessarily all logical but mostly around safety and improved facilities). To minimise the chances of getting lost I suggest pilgrims stay on the newly waymarked route. The 2019 guide includes one suggestion to follow a short alternative (green) route through woodland (rather than the new route parallel to the motorway into Sigueiro) and this is shown on the stage 5 map (p.43) with details in the text.
I hope this helps in your planning and wish you an uplifting journey along the beautiful pathways that make up the camino Inglés.
Many blessings and 'Bo camino'…
John (Brierley)
The biggest changes on the Ingles route are as follows:
Ferrol / Neda to Pontedeume section - at Vilar do Colo, the new route goes off right after passing under the motorway, and goes through the countryside till it comes to Cabanas and then comes down a very steep hill to the river estuary where you walk over the bridge to Pontedeume. The old route went off right before the motorway junction and came down onto the beach at Cabanas which you walked the full length of before you come to the Pontedeume bridge. I walked the old route, due to an absence of markers and a friendly local directing where the old route was. I think the old route was better.
Betanzos to Hospital de Bruma - two main changes. The first at Cos, you turn left and walk along a pavement on a road and follow this for about 2km down to Presedo. The old route somehow walked through fields to the north of the road. the new route was not signposted well with waymarks and you needed to trust that walking along the road was the correct way. For the last 1km, the pavement stops and you do need to walk along the actual side of the road, down a hill and round some bends where there path then branches off left to Presedo. Walking on the road was not too pleasant, but there was not too much traffic to both
Later, at Leiro, the new route branches off and misses out the fearsome hill up to Hospital de Bruma and Bar Julia. Most of the walk is unpaved forest road with a long gradual incline. You keep wondering where the fearsome hill is, but it never comes. At the top, you join a fairly large raod where the Ingles from La Coruna joins and you need to walk on the side of the road (pavement half and half) for about 2km, including passing a quite large electricity substation. This is where Bar Avelina is, which was not too welcoming.
Hospital de Bruma to Sigueiro - when you pass over the motorway, the new Ingles route takes you right and down onto the motorway embankment. What you do not realise at that point is that you walk alongside the motorway for a good 4km, albeit separated from the motorway by a metal fence. But walking alongside a motorway for over 45 minutes is so depressing, seeing cars do what you are doing in an hour, in a matter of minutes. The road is also noisy. If you can, do not turn right, but carry on the road and then take the second road on the right. You then walk along a country road (no pavement, but you can see and hear the occasional car that comes) all the way to Sigueiro. This is the one time when walking on tarmac beats walking on a grass path.
Sigueiro to Santiago - the new route, for the better, takes the Ingles off the main Sigueiro to Santiago road and onto country roads which run parallel about half a kilometre away. You need to be on the right hand side of the main road in Sigueiro as you walk over the river.
On guides, if you look a the CSJ guide, it is so detailed, in terms of exactly where to turn right, left or go straight on. Invaluable if you are lost, but if you have it open when you walk, you will be worrying when the next turn comes and literally walking with your nose in the book, instead of watching and enjoying the camino. Also, your judgement of what is 100, 200 or 400 metres (for when you need next to turn left, reading the guidebook), invariably turns out to be half of what it is in reality, especially when you are tired, meaning that if you are actively walking with the guidebook, you are stressed half the time that you have missed where to go.
You needn't be. The Ingles, generally, is well marked by the triangular waymarks, which appear, as and when there is a junction, fork or a place you should change direction (or carry on straight when other roads / tracks appear left and right. I think having a guide is good, but I would carry it in your pocket, for reference when things are confusing, not to get you along the way. The waymarks do that. Unfortunately, unlike more popular caminos, there is not the pilgrim traffic to look ahead and follow. I saw no more than 10 other pilgrims per day, and therefore, a guidebook is handy to have, when you are confused.
I look forward to your report...buen caminoThanks for all the info!
Leaving tomorrow to Santiago d C airport and then bus to Ferrol. Starting 6d walk on friday.
Buen Camino
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