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You doing the CF?I’ve been reading the threads and accounts of women who have had incidents/unwanted attention from men on the Camino and as a man I find it disgusting. It horrifies me that women have to feel on edge whilst walking the Camino and following what in no doubt has been a dream for them. It has also raised a couple of concerns.
I’ll be walking the Camino on my own in Sept 16 and am by no means afraid for my safety. I’m 6’ 2” tall, quite big built with a shaved head and some people would say that I can look quite intimidating. But those who really know me would agree that I am a “gentle giant” (for want of a better phase). I can be quite shy with people who I have just met and certainly am around big groups of people who I don’t know. I certainly try to be a gentleman and be courteous towards women and would be the first to intervene if I see a woman in trouble.
My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable? This is the last thing that I would want to do. Also, how can I put their mind at ease and deal with the situation if I do unintentionally upset them? After all they won’t know me at all.
I would hate to think that I would negatively affect anyone’s Camino, woman or man, in anyway at all and wouldn’t be happy with myself if I did.
Am I being a little over cautious or do I have a genuine concern? I’d be grateful for your thoughts and honest opinions.
Cheers
Steve
I’ve been reading the threads and accounts of women who have had incidents/unwanted attention from men on the Camino and as a man I find it disgusting. It horrifies me that women have to feel on edge whilst walking the Camino and following what in no doubt has been a dream for them. It has also raised a couple of concerns.
I’ll be walking the Camino on my own in Sept 16 and am by no means afraid for my safety. I’m 6’ 2” tall, quite big built with a shaved head and some people would say that I can look quite intimidating. But those who really know me would agree that I am a “gentle giant” (for want of a better phase). I can be quite shy with people who I have just met and certainly am around big groups of people who I don’t know. I certainly try to be a gentleman and be courteous towards women and would be the first to intervene if I see a woman in trouble.
My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable? This is the last thing that I would want to do. Also, how can I put their mind at ease and deal with the situation if I do unintentionally upset them? After all they won’t know me at all.
I would hate to think that I would negatively affect anyone’s Camino, woman or man, in anyway at all and wouldn’t be happy with myself if I did.
Am I being a little over cautious or do I have a genuine concern? I’d be grateful for your thoughts and honest opinions.
Cheers
Steve
You doing the CF?
Hey cecy.
Yes I am doing the CF. Arriving at St Jean on Sept 5th. I see your doing yours then too. Which route?
Steve
Thanks you all for your comments and great advise.
Maybe I am overthinking this a little but it does come from the heart. Without going into detail, my step daughter was raped a few years ago and even though her mother and I have split up since, I do still feel guilty that I wasn't there to protect her. I know that I couldn't do anything as I wasn't there but that sense of guilt still existence. I'm sure ever parent will understand this. So now the thought of women being attacked appals me more than ever.
I hadn't thought of the fact that I will be standing out as a pilgrim and not just some random guy. I try not to worry any further about this.
Cheers.
Steve.
Steve, thank you, from a soon to be solo woman pilgrim, for your gracious concern. I wish we were walking at the same time, because I do have my concerns. But, as others have said, if I see you with a backpack, looking like you have been walking too, I would look at you as another pilgrim, and be happy to see you, even if only for a moment to wish a buen camino and have you leave me in your dust. Embrace your sensitive humanity, it will be felt and noted by all pilgrims you encounter.I’ve been reading the threads and accounts of women who have had incidents/unwanted attention from men on the Camino and as a man I find it disgusting. It horrifies me that women have to feel on edge whilst walking the Camino and following what in no doubt has been a dream for them. It has also raised a couple of concerns.
I’ll be walking the Camino on my own in Sept 16 and am by no means afraid for my safety. I’m 6’ 2” tall, quite big built with a shaved head and some people would say that I can look quite intimidating. But those who really know me would agree that I am a “gentle giant” (for want of a better phase). I can be quite shy with people who I have just met and certainly am around big groups of people who I don’t know. I certainly try to be a gentleman and be courteous towards women and would be the first to intervene if I see a woman in trouble.
My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable? This is the last thing that I would want to do. Also, how can I put their mind at ease and deal with the situation if I do unintentionally upset them? After all they won’t know me at all.
I would hate to think that I would negatively affect anyone’s Camino, woman or man, in anyway at all and wouldn’t be happy with myself if I did.
Am I being a little over cautious or do I have a genuine concern? I’d be grateful for your thoughts and honest opinions.
Cheers
Steve
Cecy, I am a former DV advocate, if you have not spoken to anyone, we can swap email addresses, I have worked with many families of DV survivors, and would be happy to chat with you. I leave on April Fools Day from StJPP solo.Sorry to hear that, I can honestly understand feeling helpless when trying to protect our children and the intense feeling of guilt associated with it. My daughter didnt get raped but is still in a toxic relationship and is being emotionally abused and been hit (once that I know of) its been very hard for me to see her so broken and not be able to do a thing about it.
I hope our Camino will allow us to shed those feelings of guilt and any other baggage we carry.
Buen Camino
I’ve been reading the threads and accounts of women who have had incidents/unwanted attention from men on the Camino and as a man I find it disgusting. It horrifies me that women have to feel on edge whilst walking the Camino and following what in no doubt has been a dream for them. It has also raised a couple of concerns.
I’ll be walking the Camino on my own in Sept 16 and am by no means afraid for my safety. I’m 6’ 2” tall, quite big built with a shaved head and some people would say that I can look quite intimidating. But those who really know me would agree that I am a “gentle giant” (for want of a better phase). I can be quite shy with people who I have just met and certainly am around big groups of people who I don’t know. I certainly try to be a gentleman and be courteous towards women and would be the first to intervene if I see a woman in trouble.
My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable? This is the last thing that I would want to do. Also, how can I put their mind at ease and deal with the situation if I do unintentionally upset them? After all they won’t know me at all.
I would hate to think that I would negatively affect anyone’s Camino, woman or man, in anyway at all and wouldn’t be happy with myself if I did.
Am I being a little over cautious or do I have a genuine concern? I’d be grateful for your thoughts and honest opinions.
Cheers
Steve
No, i tried to help myself but couldnt get her to leave.Cecy, I am a former DV advocate, if you have not spoken to anyone, we can swap email addresses, I have worked with many families of DV survivors, and would be happy to chat with you. I leave on April Fools Day from StJPP solo.
I think your are a little too concern, I think even as a men one knows when its time to change tables so to speak do you know what I mean?
@zzotte I know what you are saying, but think this goes well beyond what the OP was asking. He wondered if women walking alone would be frightened when they see him on the path, because he is a big man with a shaved head. We have reassured him that this generally won't be the case because of his polite manner and pilgrim outfit. Whether he will earn respect, be liked, and make friends is another question.
how can I put their mind at ease
Lots of good advice above.
Being aware that women, especially alone, can find a man overtaking from behind worrisome, I have rehearsed in my mind a way that might work for me to lighten the moment. The advantage: English is assumed.
As suggested above, at the approach make some gentle noise to announce my presence. On drawing alongside offer a greeting. Judging the situation I might say something like: I am going to so and so and would appreciate company to make the journey quicker. And, no, I don't want to know where you are going. Depending on the reply either fall into step and chat or say goodbye and stride ahead.
I haven't had any opportunity to use this but it is a comfort to me that I had thought about this situation.
As many parliamentarians have said: the impromptu off the cuff remark has to be carefully prepared beforehand.
... My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable? This is the last thing that I would want to do. Also, how can I put their mind at ease and deal with the situation if I do unintentionally upset them? After all they won’t know me at all...
Greet with "Buen Camino". Smile. Be polite. Be a gentleman. If the situation calls for it, open the door. Buen CaminoI’ve been reading the threads and accounts of women who have had incidents/unwanted attention from men on the Camino and as a man I find it disgusting. It horrifies me that women have to feel on edge whilst walking the Camino and following what in no doubt has been a dream for them. It has also raised a couple of concerns.
I’ll be walking the Camino on my own in Sept 16 and am by no means afraid for my safety. I’m 6’ 2” tall, quite big built with a shaved head and some people would say that I can look quite intimidating. But those who really know me would agree that I am a “gentle giant” (for want of a better phase). I can be quite shy with people who I have just met and certainly am around big groups of people who I don’t know. I certainly try to be a gentleman and be courteous towards women and would be the first to intervene if I see a woman in trouble.
My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable? This is the last thing that I would want to do. Also, how can I put their mind at ease and deal with the situation if I do unintentionally upset them? After all they won’t know me at all.
I would hate to think that I would negatively affect anyone’s Camino, woman or man, in anyway at all and wouldn’t be happy with myself if I did.
Am I being a little over cautious or do I have a genuine concern? I’d be grateful for your thoughts and honest opinions.
Cheers
Steve
Hi Steve. You are very kind. I understand your thoughts and will just write about my response. First, everyone greets each other with Buen Camino. Some people will respond Buen Camino and keep walking. They perhaps are meditating and need the silence. If you get a friendly comment back, you might ask a question .. How are you doing? Take your cues from her.I’ve been reading the threads and accounts of women who have had incidents/unwanted attention from men on the Camino and as a man I find it disgusting. It horrifies me that women have to feel on edge whilst walking the Camino and following what in no doubt has been a dream for them. It has also raised a couple of concerns.
I’ll be walking the Camino on my own in Sept 16 and am by no means afraid for my safety. I’m 6’ 2” tall, quite big built with a shaved head and some people would say that I can look quite intimidating. But those who really know me would agree that I am a “gentle giant” (for want of a better phase). I can be quite shy with people who I have just met and certainly am around big groups of people who I don’t know. I certainly try to be a gentleman and be courteous towards women and would be the first to intervene if I see a woman in trouble.
My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable? This is the last thing that I would want to do. Also, how can I put their mind at ease and deal with the situation if I do unintentionally upset them? After all they won’t know me at all.
I would hate to think that I would negatively affect anyone’s Camino, woman or man, in anyway at all and wouldn’t be happy with myself if I did.
Am I being a little over cautious or do I have a genuine concern? I’d be grateful for your thoughts and honest opinions.
Cheers
Steve
interesting thread...I will offer up my two cents and experience - I wouldn't say I am paranoid but I would say that I have an over exaggerated startle response, meaning I jump out of my skin when someone comes up behind me and I am not aware they are there. I have always been that way. When I first started doing my training hikes (in a large park area with trails, woods etc..) and someone would come up from behind me to pass me I usually jumped or gasped a bit (it was automatic and very embarrassing and they were apologetic)...but the more I became accustomed to it the better I felt and that automatic response started to settle down. I was so grateful. Then people actually would actually start a brief conversation or just say hello and I began to imagine that it is much that way on the camino. Not only has the training helped my physically but it has also helped me get over this annoying startle response!My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable?
Hi Steve, be yourself and there will be no problem what so ever.I’ve been reading the threads and accounts of women who have had incidents/unwanted attention from men on the Camino and as a man I find it disgusting. It horrifies me that women have to feel on edge whilst walking the Camino and following what in no doubt has been a dream for them. It has also raised a couple of concerns.
I’ll be walking the Camino on my own in Sept 16 and am by no means afraid for my safety. I’m 6’ 2” tall, quite big built with a shaved head and some people would say that I can look quite intimidating. But those who really know me would agree that I am a “gentle giant” (for want of a better phase). I can be quite shy with people who I have just met and certainly am around big groups of people who I don’t know. I certainly try to be a gentleman and be courteous towards women and would be the first to intervene if I see a woman in trouble.
My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable? This is the last thing that I would want to do. Also, how can I put their mind at ease and deal with the situation if I do unintentionally upset them? After all they won’t know me at all.
I would hate to think that I would negatively affect anyone’s Camino, woman or man, in anyway at all and wouldn’t be happy with myself if I did.
Am I being a little over cautious or do I have a genuine concern? I’d be grateful for your thoughts and honest opinions.
Cheers
Steve
Then people actually would actually start a brief conversation or just say hello
That would definitely be reassuring!I start a monologue in an even tone discussing the weather or wondering what the grass is like today or any other small talk that occurs. And I continue this idiocy until well past.
That would definitely be reassuring!
HAH! good one ~ love it...Something I find often works with curious dogs, deer and llama/alpaca is to hold a hand or fingers out to be smelt or licked. It seems to form a bond and an indication of non-aggression. I find, once the dogs have licked off any salts from the skin, they lose interest. I've not tried this particular technique with people, so far.
I'm starting the CF around the same time as you Steve and will be travelling solo, so it's reassuring to know help will be at hand if anything untoward happens and also just to chat to if I get sick of my inner dialogue!
Buen Camino
Hi Steve ,its great to hear that you are concerned and aware of upsetting people but please don't be put off being yourself and if you pass a fellow pilgrim male of female a cheery "buen camino "and a smile will be greeted with the same response ,if you feel like having a conversation you will know if the other person is willing to engage with you by their body language .I have met many new friends this way so i encourage you to be happy and enjoy the whole experience and buen camino .I’ve been reading the threads and accounts of women who have had incidents/unwanted attention from men on the Camino and as a man I find it disgusting. It horrifies me that women have to feel on edge whilst walking the Camino and following what in no doubt has been a dream for them. It has also raised a couple of concerns.
I’ll be walking the Camino on my own in Sept 16 and am by no means afraid for my safety. I’m 6’ 2” tall, quite big built with a shaved head and some people would say that I can look quite intimidating. But those who really know me would agree that I am a “gentle giant” (for want of a better phase). I can be quite shy with people who I have just met and certainly am around big groups of people who I don’t know. I certainly try to be a gentleman and be courteous towards women and would be the first to intervene if I see a woman in trouble.
My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable? This is the last thing that I would want to do. Also, how can I put their mind at ease and deal with the situation if I do unintentionally upset them? After all they won’t know me at all.
I would hate to think that I would negatively affect anyone’s Camino, woman or man, in anyway at all and wouldn’t be happy with myself if I did.
Am I being a little over cautious or do I have a genuine concern? I’d be grateful for your thoughts and honest opinions.
Cheers
Steve
I’ve been reading the threads and accounts of women who have had incidents/unwanted attention from men on the Camino and as a man I find it disgusting. It horrifies me that women have to feel on edge whilst walking the Camino and following what in no doubt has been a dream for them. It has also raised a couple of concerns.
I’ll be walking the Camino on my own in Sept 16 and am by no means afraid for my safety. I’m 6’ 2” tall, quite big built with a shaved head and some people would say that I can look quite intimidating. But those who really know me would agree that I am a “gentle giant” (for want of a better phase). I can be quite shy with people who I have just met and certainly am around big groups of people who I don’t know. I certainly try to be a gentleman and be courteous towards women and would be the first to intervene if I see a woman in trouble.
My concern comes when I think that I may (and probably will) come across a women walking alone on the Camino with no one else around. If I am aware that some women have been having some problems, how do I know that I can greet them without fear of upsetting them, causing alarm or making them feel uncomfortable? This is the last thing that I would want to do. Also, how can I put their mind at ease and deal with the situation if I do unintentionally upset them? After all they won’t know me at all.
I would hate to think that I would negatively affect anyone’s Camino, woman or man, in anyway at all and wouldn’t be happy with myself if I did.
Am I being a little over cautious or do I have a genuine concern? I’d be grateful for your thoughts and honest opinions.
Cheers
Steve
The obvious and often stated phase: "There is only one chance to make a first impression," is true. Soften the image. Maybe grow your hair, wear cheerful colours and not dark somber colours. Sounds maybe a bit shallow, but people do react to these things. Everyone has fixed images (often wrong) of what certain appearances mean. I am sure that a friendly smile will get you through.
Jo
As you pointed out at the beginning, this was while Denise Thiem's fate was unknown, so I expect women would have been more nervous, especially about a quickly approaching lone cyclist. I'm not sure that their reactions were so unwarranted, but am still surprised if they were so hostile that you would "never" travel that area again.I will never travel the Camino Frances through the Meseta again because of the unwarranted reactions of the solo female Pilgrims
When I was traveling solo on a mountain bike through the Meseta a week before Denise Thein's body was found near Astorga...so my experience was that most solo women Pilgrims were afraid of any solo man even if it was obvious that they are a Pilgrim...most of the women I passed never said responded "Buen Camino", never smiled, and some even looked extremely afraid...when I started I would ask any Pilgrim that looked distressed if they needed help but after a while I stopped even looking at solo women Pilgrims as I passed...and most of the time I passed solo women Pilgrims I was pushing my mountain bike uphill and was in clear view of other Pilgrims on the hiking trail...although to the contrary I had many solo women Pilgrims initiated conversations with me in towns, cafes, stores, rest areas, etc...also from SJPDP to Logrono I had multiple older women Pilgrims hit on me but this was not in my plans as a married man on a religious Camino...and during my Camino I saw many romantic relationships blossom mostly in the under 30-years old and over 60-years old solo Pilgrims...Buen Camino...while on the hiking trail in the Meseta I only had one woman Pilgrim talk to me and she started the conversation and later while we were talking I realized that her husband was hiking at a faster pace about 100 meters ahead...we talked about our shared cancer experiences in Seattle and we talked for about an hour and I never saw her before or again...I beleive on the Camino most Pilgrims are lonely and away from family and friends so it is easy to get into very personal conversations about things that you would never talk to anyone in the real world (religion and spirituality, traumatic life experiences, difficult personal relationships, sex and sexuality, medical issues, drug and alcohol use, and many more) but this is about trust and intimacy which is different than wanting to initiate any type of sexual relationship...also during my Camino I had many solo women Pilgrims hug me but it was because I took the time to help or listen to them which added another personal dimension to my Camino experience...the Camino teaches you that the two most important things in life are relationships and how to forgive yourself for making mistakes...but based on my experience I will never travel the Camino Frances through the Meseta again because of the unwarranted reactions of the solo female Pilgrims which I felt was contrary to my intended purpose of a religious Pilgrimage.
As you pointed out at the beginning, this was while Denise Thiem's fate was unknown, so I expect women would have been more nervous, especially about a quickly approaching lone cyclist. I'm not sure that their reactions were so unwarranted, but am still surprised if they were so hostile that you would "never" travel that area again.
There is no excuse for anyone to treat you badly when you have done nothing wrong. However, the women are not under any obligation to interact with you. Surely personal fear is a forgiveable reason. And the "being aware of your surrounding," that you suggest, always involves profiling. You and the OP, Steve, have both made a good point that men are almost always well intentioned and they deserve courtesy. It is easy to say that if women are so afraid that they can't summon up simple courtesy, then they shouldn't walk alone. But fears don't work quite so logically, and the camino is meant to be a learning experience - for all of us.I did not appreciate the prejudicial treatment I received as a solo male pilgrim
Thin on top... I know the feeling. However, let me add that I walked the Camino last May. I encountered ladies of all ages walking alone. None of them showed fear or anxiety. I would hate some reports to inflame feelings an wories about one of the sfetst places I know. Where else do nearly a quarter of a milluon people congregate with so little crime? A city of half that population in the western world has far far more crimes against women. The women I talked to also stated that at home, after stating their intentions to friends and family receive, almost without exception, the comment "What, you're walk as a woman alone!?!?" Their answer was "Yes", and they did. So well done girls! Remember there are far more risks in walking through parks and some neighbourhoods in your own countries. I suppose this is a message to women, but guys should not get disheartened about being needlessly suspect.Hey Jo.
I appreciate your thoughts but it is a bit difficult to grow my hair where none exists (going bald). So rather than a comb over, I prefer to just get rid of it. Cuts down on the cost of shampoo too .
. The women I talked to also stated that at home, after stating their intentions to friends and family receive, almost without exception, the comment "What, you're walk as a woman alone!?!?" Their answer was "Yes", and they did. So well done girls! Remember there are far more risks in walking through parks and some neighbourhoods in your own countries. I suppose this is a message to women, but guys should not get disheartened about being needlessly suspect.
I have realised that it isn't other pilgrims I should fear...
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