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Your questions are too hard, @caminka ☺. I was idly thinking about this and wondered whether there was an actual excavation or rather some kind of discovery made when they put in the paving stones for the plaza and surrounding streets. I found an older photo of the crucero, see below. I myself don't even recall seeing the cross (nor the massive peregrino sculpture next to it on the other side of the street) when leaving Molinaseca.I would love to see that article again, or some other reference to this excavation. if I remember correctly, the article was a skan/jpg? and part of a blog? it probably came from a local newspaper or magazine. the picture(s) were in colour. this time I have had no luck finding it or any other info. anyone came across something similar?
Your questions are too hard, @caminka ☺.
it could quite possibly be a replacement of the paving stones or the redoing of the street or maybe even refurbishing or repositioning (for a few meters) of the cross - this is based on the old picture you posted. it seems to me that the cross used to stand more in the middle of the street then.I was idly thinking about this and wondered whether there was an actual excavation or rather some kind of discovery made when they put in the paving stones for the plaza and surrounding streets. I found an older photo of the crucero, see below.
I don't think so. The street is on the left of cruceiro on the first photo and on the right side on the second one and that is misleading. If you look at the houses on the left first two are exactly the same as they were but the first house on the righthand side clearly got another floor. And together with change of perspective that change could very much interfere with perception of the place....
it could quite possibly be a replacement of the paving stones or the redoing of the street or maybe even refurbishing or repositioning (for a few meters) of the cross - this is based on the old picture you posted. it seems to me that the cross used to stand more in the middle of the street then.
The cross is positioned in a small open space between two roads, the Calle Real and the Calle Iglesia. And as you say, because of the different angles/viewpoints, it is hard to tell whether it ever changed position when looking at older photos. But there were definitely roadworks in Molinaseca. A b&w photo from 1939 shows this quite clearly. I had hoped info about these works would yield something about the cross but no luck so far. Note the typical slabs of stone on the right side that you also find on some of the countryside trails along the Camino Frances in Galicia in particular.For really adequate comparison one would have to take exactly the same standpoint as in first photo and find the same focal length
The roadworks (pavement) were already clearly seen in your first post. Nothing unusual in time span of 100, 50 or even 20 yearsThe cross is positioned right between two roads, the Calle Real and the Calle de Iglesia. And as you say, because of the different angles/viewpoints, it is hard to tell whether it ever changed position when looking at older photos. But there were definitely roadworks in Molinaseca, including around the cross. A b&w photo from 1939 shows this quite clearly. I had hoped info about these works would yield something about the cross but no luck so far. Note the typical slabs of stone on the right side that you also find on some of the countryside trails along the Camino Frances in Galicia in particular.
Main camino road through Molinaseca, year 1939 versus year 20xx:
View attachment 80224
I had to find a reason for posting the photo from 1939 which turned up while searching for info about the cross and which I find quite intriguing. ☺The roadworks (pavement) were already clearly seen in your first post. Nothing unusual in time span of 100, 50 or even 20 years
Let me guess ...I found something else that's very interesting that I am very sorry to have missed the second time I went through Molinaseca (the first time it was not there)...it's worth another thread.
I was thinking particularly of the cross in the relation to the first building on the left, nicely illuminated in the sun on the old photo. it looked that, if you moved a bit to the right with the google, the angle at which that house is captured could be a bit different then the angle in the old photo. but it was just a guess, of course.I don't think so. The street is on the left of cruceiro on the first photo and on the righ side on the second one and that is misleading. If you look at the houses on the left first two are exactly the same as they were but the first house on the righthand side clearly got another floor. And together with change of perspective that change could very much interfere with perception of the place.
assuming I remember correctly, it was more recent 'excavation', perhaps in the 1980s, 1990s, 2000s.But there were definitely roadworks in Molinaseca. A b&w photo from 1939 shows this quite clearly. I had hoped info about these works would yield something about the cross but no luck so far. Note the typical slabs of stone on the right side that you also find on some of the countryside trails along the Camino Frances in Galicia in particular.
I tried various approaches via Google searches but I came up with nothing, and as it is in Spanish, it's also not easy for me to think of promising search terms. I had a look at Molinaseca.es and Molinaseca.info, and two names came up of local men with an interest in local history so depending on how keen you are to pursue this, it might be worth a try to contact them. They are both on Facebook it seems: Rogelio Meléndez Tercero and Alberto Morán Luna. The cross is also known as the Veijo Crucero but you probably know this anyway.assuming I remember correctly, it was more recent 'excavation', perhaps in the 1980s, 1990s, 2000s.
We posted the same photo at exactly the same time. ☺another view of the cross on a photo from 1939.
indeed.We posted the same photo at exactly the same time. ☺
I have been thinking about this if the google search fails, yup.I tried various approaches via Google searches but I came up with nothing, and as it is in Spanish, it's also not easy for me to think of promising search terms. I had a look at Molinaseca.es and Molinaseca.info, and two names came up of local men with an interest in local history so depending on how keen you are to pursue this, it might be worth a try to contact them. They are both on Facebook it seems: Rogelio Meléndez Tercero and Alberto Morán Luna. The cross is also known as the Veijo Crucero but you probably know this anyway.
I do think that this crucero which apparently isn't medieval anyway as far as the current column and top is concerned did not have a stone cross on top at some point in time. I find it also a bit odd that the figure of the crucified Christ is in a sort of metal display box that seems to have been added to the column at one point in time (and replaced by a different box at a later time as the photos show) instead of being part of the stone sculpture.no cross portion either but now I'm wondering if the image has been chopped off
that is very interesting. apparently there really was no cross portion for a time and the box with the christ has been added before 1939 (which means that the time frame of the photo from #14 and #15 which was taken between 1924 and 1964 has been reduced to between 1924 and 1939).I do think that this crucero which apparently isn't medieval anyway as far as the current column and top is concerned did not have a stone cross on top at some point in time. I find it also a bit odd that the figure of the crucified Christ is in a sort of metal display box that seems to have been added to the column at one point in time (and replaced by a different box at a later time as the photos show) instead of being part of the stone sculpture.
Below is a slightly better version of the photo in #13. The crucero looks more like a rollo without the top cross and Christ figure. The photo is taken from the book Molinaseca Real y Peregrina. It was published in 2014. Someone posted many pages in a YouTube video but the video is not clear enough to make the text readable.
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