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The world.So sad to see the Camino succumbing to this.
I agree Marylin. There must be some very exhausted Peregrinos.. I would think that at least one person would wake ? These thieves are surely snakesI am so sorry to hear that these elements are creeping in - mind the truth is they have been around for ever - but these days they seem so brazen. What never fails to amaze me is that none of the pilgrims wake up during these times and surely there must be noise incurred even a rustle of a plastic bag gets heavy signs during sleep time - just asking!!!!
Wow, this is sneaky! It's never crossed my mind to think that someone who seems to be a 'real' pilgrim could actually be a thief.In many cases these are experienced thieves often posing as pilgrims themselves. They know the routines and watch before lights out to know where people have left valuables or cash. They sometimes befriend folks during the day and then offer to "watch" your stuff while you shower.
Like nobody would buy a ticket for Glastonbury or Womad festivals and spend their time harvesting tents instead of watching the bands. Sadly the economics: cost of Albergue bed for the night offset by the gains to be gleaned from the careless, are easily calculated.Wow, this is sneaky! It's never crossed my mind to think that someone who seems to be a 'real' pilgrim could actually be a thief.
Like nobody would buy a ticket for Glastonbury or Womad festivals and spend their time harvesting tents instead of watching the bands. Sadly the economics: cost of Albergue bed for the night offset by the gains to be gleaned from the careless, are easily calculated.
My God, I AM naive. I would never in a million years have thought people do that.Like nobody would buy a ticket for Glastonbury or Womad festivals and spend their time harvesting tents instead of watching the bands.
My God, I AM naive. I would never in a million years have thought people do that.
As far as albergues are concerned, it would probably be pretty easy to use a fake passport and then vanish in the morning like smoke on a windy day. No hospis are going to be checking.
You are misinterpreting "passport" in the pilgrim sense. A Pilgrims' passport, the Credential, is readily available at minimal cost and easily reproduced, sellos and all.Going to the trouble of getting and paying for a fake passport to commit petty crime on the camino seems very unlikely. You could maybe at the outside use it three times before it became useless.
Edit- Details of all passports are sent to the police each day.
Amiga, that isn't naivety that is innocence. And it is better to be an innocent abroad than in any other human state.
I mean "Innocent” as a person who is uncorrupted by evil, malice, or wrongdoing while “naïve” is the tperson who is lacking in experience
Over Holy Week a number of pilgrims were robbed in Roncesvales and Zubiri. It was reported to us by other hospitaleros that over €2000 Euros and a number of passports were stolen. Subsequently a number of pilgrims confirmed the account. Also I read on the forum a pilgrim staying at the municipal albergue in Burgos was lucky to wake up and stop someone from robbing her. Yes the Norte albergue was Güemes and I should say that this was not third hand info. My friend’s son emailed me this morning about the robbery. My point is for pilgrims to practice securing their valuables and not be a victim.Sorry to hear, @crhutch! Maybe you can add a bit more details? I believe it would be important to divide the rumours from the real stories. 'Much thievery on both the Frances and the Norte' sounds massive, but also very vague. As far as I know there were no recent reports about robbery on the forum.
The theft in Guedes (do you mean Güemes?) sounds pretty serious: more than one robber, they sneaked in in the middle of the night and went throught the bags (and even sleeping bags!) of several pilgrims. So far I haven't been able to find anything about it in the local news, which surprises me a little bit.
Don't get me wrong, I do believe what you have been told. But so far this is a third hand story (the son of a friend of yours). And these stories can spread like wildfire, while in the end nobody seems to know what really happened.
Happened to my friends and I at Glastonbury in '93. Luckily I personally had nothing worth stealing.Like nobody would buy a ticket for Glastonbury or Womad festivals and spend their time harvesting tents instead of watching the bands. Sadly the economics: cost of Albergue bed for the night offset by the gains to be gleaned from the careless, are easily calculated.
In many cases these are experienced thieves often posing as pilgrims themselves. They know the routines and watch before lights out to know where people have left valuables or cash. They sometimes befriend folks during the day and then offer to "watch" your stuff while you shower.
I have just finished 16 days as a hospitalero at the Albergue de Peregrinos Emaus in Burgos. I have not seen much on any forum about theft on the Camino so I’d like to give a warning to all. While my albergue was safe, we heard of much thievery on both the Frances and the Norte. A friend of mine son was staying at the Albergue in Guedes on the Norte last night and in the middle of the night robbers snuck in and robbed many pilgrims while they slept. So a word to the wise is to secure your valuables and be attentive all the time. So sad to see the Camino succumbing to this.
Just out of curiosity - did they come and check at the albergue or was it on the path? I'm really just curious, I think Spain is one of the countries that takes the protection of personal data seriously and has also strict rules that regulate linking and mining of databases of the different government entities.On my last Camino a German man had his passport checked by the police twice I think, so they clearly do use the data and not just collect it.
Just out of curiosity - did they come and check at the albergue or was it on the path? I'm really just curious, I think Spain is one of the countries that takes the protection of personal data seriously and has also strict rules that regulate linking and mining of databases of the different government entities.
Wow, this is sneaky! It's never crossed my mind to think that someone who seems to be a 'real' pilgrim could actually be a thief.
Scam artists yes...but theft? Maybe I'm more naive than I thought.
I guess the lesson is don't be paranoid, but don't to leave your intelligence at home, either.
Over Holy Week a number of pilgrims were robbed in Roncesvales and Zubiri. It was reported to us by other hospitaleros that over €2000 Euros and a number of passports were stolen. Subsequently a number of pilgrims confirmed the account. Also I read on the forum a pilgrim staying at the municipal albergue in Burgos was lucky to wake up and stop someone from robbing her. Yes the Norte albergue was Güemes and I should say that this was not third hand info. My friend’s son emailed me this morning about the robbery. My point is for pilgrims to practice securing their valuables and not be a victim.
There are ways and means of hiding things such as phones, but, I do concede that something like a Large SLR camera would be quite a bit harder to hide away whilst you are sleeping.The world.
Well, it's nothing new: old accounts of the camno from the middle ages are rife with warnings of bandits and thievery. We're backsliding, from the sound of it.
Was stuff stolen out of packs, @crhutch , or from the foot of sleeping bags, or...?
(Just wondering what "secure your valuables" should mean these days...besides the obvious of keeping them around your waist. The challenge is that there are a limited number of things that fit that way, and it offers an uncomfortable night's sleep.)
So is everything alright then! "it's nothing new: old accounts of the camno from the middle ages are rife with warnings of bandits and thievery."The world.
Well, it's nothing new: old accounts of the camno from the middle ages are rife with warnings of bandits and thievery. We're backsliding, from the sound of it.
Was stuff stolen out of packs, @crhutch , or from the foot of sleeping bags, or...?
(Just wondering what "secure your valuables" should mean these days...besides the obvious of keeping them around your waist. The challenge is that there are a limited number of things that fit that way, and it offers an uncomfortable night's sleep.)
Few weeks later that isI had my Fitbit knocked off at Puente la Reina and caught the tea leaf the next morning by chance, it’s safe to say the pilgrim probably struggled to use toilet paper for a few weeks. A week later my pommy mate another ex serviceman who was walking in support and raising money fir a kid dying of a brain tumour had his new boots knocked off in Casteroitz so we organised a few euros for him to get a new set of shoes
where would be a good place to carry cash and valuables..
Güemes
I find it unbelievable that people would keep large sums of money in their back pack.
My God, I AM naive. I would never in a million years have thought people do that.
As far as albergues are concerned, it would probably be pretty easy to use a fake passport and then vanish in the morning like smoke on a windy day. No hospis are going to be checking.
If thieves know this (which they likely do as they are sometimes more clever than we would like to admit), then there would be more risk in donativos, right?All private albergues has to follow and do this every single day. only the donativo albergues do not have the obligation to do it.
If your passport is fake , the police will call the albergue.
I won´t say that, each albergue has its internal rules and its own guidelines about this and everyday is a different day and situation,, for example, we do not allow visits of other pilgrims or friends that are not staying and registered in our place. People can gather and talk at the Bar. In my case, my room is in the entrance of the albergue and I can hear when people try to go out in the middle of the night to "Smoke", so I can stop them.If thieves know this (which they likely do as they are sometimes more clever than we would like to admit), then there would be more risk in donativos, right?
I wonder if this people you heard this went to report at the police. Police in Spain is very clever and they will work very efficiently on that. there is no need to create a panic, Spain is one of the safest countries in the world.I have just finished 16 days as a hospitalero at the Albergue de Peregrinos Emaus in Burgos. I have not seen much on any forum about theft on the Camino so I’d like to give a warning to all. While my albergue was safe, we heard of much thievery on both the Frances and the Norte. A friend of mine son was staying at the Albergue in Guedes on the Norte last night and in the middle of the night robbers snuck in and robbed many pilgrims while they slept. So a word to the wise is to secure your valuables and be attentive all the time. So sad to see the Camino succumbing to this.
thank you for your clarification.. I had never heard of registering details on a daily basis with the police - because my experience as a hospitalera has only been in a donative albergue. Of course details of passports are recorded in donativos, in a register, to be available for inspection.According to the laws and regulations of private albergues, hostels and hotels in Spain, we have to ask for the passport and verify its validity in situ, then within 24 hours enter that data in an app on the computer. these data go directly to the police. I do this before going to sleep every night, only 2 times in 4 years have the police called me back to ask for extra information from a person. All private albergues has to follow and do this every single day. only the donativo albergues do not have the obligation to do it.
If your passport is fake , the police will call the albergue.
Once I posted in this forum about people who sometimes get out of the albergue in the middle of the night to smoke and when they come back they don´t close the door propertly, and that is a risk for the security. They do that because it obvious that we cannot lock the door for security and take advantage.
Four weeks ago she was one of18 people staying in a dorm in the Albergue in Arzua. In the early morning17 phones+cash, many that had been charging overnight, were taken. "Peregrino no 18" disappeared overnight and his passport details when checked by police were discovered to be fake.
Do you need to sleep with your backpack?Over Holy Week a number of pilgrims were robbed in Roncesvales and Zubiri. It was reported to us by other hospitaleros that over €2000 Euros and a number of passports were stolen. Subsequently a number of pilgrims confirmed the account. Also I read on the forum a pilgrim staying at the municipal albergue in Burgos was lucky to wake up and stop someone from robbing her. Yes the Norte albergue was Güemes and I should say that this was not third hand info. My friend’s son emailed me this morning about the robbery. My point is for pilgrims to practice securing their valuables and not be a victim.
If you feel a strong personal attraction, why notDo you need to sleep with your backpack?
Your backpack will be near your bed. Do not leave any valuables in it. The only valuables you "should" be carrying anyway are: passport, credit cards, cash - all of them should be attached to your body at all times except when you are showering (when they should be in sight) -and your phone, which should be tucked securely into some case/bag/holder inside your sleeping bag but close to your body.Do you need to sleep with your backpack?
I asked because they said thieves where going through the packs I would not leave my phone in a pack. Worrisome, since many charge the phones at nightIf you feel a strong personal attraction, why not
But following the theme of this thread I would ask why would you need to. Your valuables should be on you or in bed with you, not in your backpack.
And thieves rummage packs because people make it worth their while...I asked because they said thieves where going through the packs I would not leave my phone in a pack. Worrisome, since many charge the phones at night
The more I hear about the Albergues the more I wonder if I need to stay in private accommodationAnd thieves rummage packs because people make it worth their while...
@Nana6 your decision to stay in Albergues or Hotels is between you and your inclinations and budget. For context try spending a few hours searching "Hotel" robbery/thefts on Godgle (you know who I mean) instead of "Albergue". My Aunt had her heart stolen by a Swiss waiter but thats another story.The more I hear about the Albergues the more I wonder if I need to stay in private accommodation
Yes. I know how to keep most valuables. Just was concerned about thieves breaking in and taking backpacks or phones@Nana6, Have you read how many of us keep our valuables (Passport, Credential and money) on our persons? It's not difficult. Let me run out and grab some posts. BRB...
This whole thread has lots of good ideas (mostly):
Here's what I do: https://www.caminodesantiago.me/com...on-lock-bags-portable-safes.61529/post-732517
Evidently, my post may have offended. It was meant as concern. I am not as travelled as you I apologise.Yes. I know how to keep most valuables. Just was concerned about thieves breaking in and taking backpacks or phones
@Nana6 - I'm not sure if it was clear that phones should not be left out in the open, charging, at night. Your phone should be charged at a time when you can keep an eye on it, and then stashed away hidden and close during the night.Just was concerned about thieves breaking in and taking backpacks or phones
Thanks.@Nana6 - I'm not sure if it was clear that phones should not be left out in the open, charging, at night. Your phone should be charged at a time when you can keep an eye on it, and then stashed away hidden and close during the night.
@Nana6 - I'm not sure if it was clear that phones should not be left out in the open, charging, at night. Your phone should be charged at a time when you can keep an eye on it, and then stashed away hidden and close during the night.
One morning prior to heading out, I sat catching up on some reading while my phone was charging next to me. A pilgrim came by and indicated that he also wanted to use the outlet. That was an instance when I wished I had had with me a charger with extra plugs.Thanks.
I did not know that. All I had read were to bring a charger with extra plugs to share
This story just doesn't ring true for me. All 17 non thief pilgrims in this dorm left their phones and cash out in the open while they slept?? Not a single one slept with their phone and valuables next to them in their sleeping bag or liner?A friend told me of her recent first hand experience on the Camino. Four weeks ago she was one of18 people staying in a dorm in the Albergue in Arzua. In the early morning17 phones+cash, many that had been charging overnight, were taken. "Peregrino no 18" disappeared overnight and his passport details when checked by police were discovered to be fake.
tarasis, what a shocking list. I m so sorry for those who had items taken. I just hope the elderly man is insured. You have learned something crucial very early. Mind how you go.There was at least 4 thefts last night in Roncleaves.
2 phones, unknown quantity of money, and one elderly man had 1200€ taken.
Someone I met had money taken in SJPdP the night before that.
Really sad
Unfortunately, most travel insurance policies (AFAIK) don't compensate more than a few hundred Euros for lost or stolen cash. I hope that that the elderly man isn't facing difficulties because of this. For most people who have credit cards and ATM cards, it makes no sense to carry so much cash.tarasis, what a shocking list. I m so sorry for those who had items taken. I just hope the elderly man is insured. You have learned something crucial very early. Mind how you go.
Do you know where it happened? In the Albergue?There was at least 4 thefts last night in Roncleaves.
2 phones, unknown quantity of money, and one elderly man had 1200€ taken.
Someone I met had money taken in SJPdP the night before that.
Really sad
Do you know where it happened? In the Albergue?
tarasis, what a shocking list. I m so sorry for those who had items taken. I just hope the elderly man is insured. You have learned something crucial very early. Mind how you go.
Well, one day I thought I would be nice and helpful and brought my pilgrim friend’s rucksack closer to where we were seating..... (He was ordering the drinks and we were outside on a terrace)Just was concerned about thieves (...) taking backpacks (...)
That is funny! However, you were trying to helpWell, one day I thought I would be nice and helpful and brought my pilgrim friend’s rucksack closer to where we were seating..... (He was ordering the drinks and we were outside on a terrace)
Only to have one very indignant peregrina yelling at me ‘What do you think you’re doing???’I had picked the wrong rucksack Oops.
This was just to bring a smile in an otherwise serious thread(True story though).
Yeah... Won’t do that again in a hurryThat is funny! However, you were trying to help
I don't understand why any adult would not be aware, without even reading this thread, that they should not leave portable valuables out exposed to people they don't know who could so easily walk off with them. Sure we all decide to take risks, and make guesses about whether the items are safe in a particular situation, but no one should be surprised that there are thieves all around the world. And always have been!
Especially in an albergue like Roncesvalles where lockers are provided.I don't understand why any adult would not be aware, without even reading this thread, that they should not leave portable valuables out exposed to people they don't know who could so easily walk off with them
We used to have in the municipal alberge light out at ten, now day up until one in the morning people com back in the dormitory zipping and an zipping, opening plastic bag without any care of other that are trying to catch up with the fatigue of the day, the same people that complain because the pilgrims (rightly so) start they journey at the first light.
How can one be careful, I wonder? You have to get on the bus while the hold is still open, or you are on the bus during an intermediate stop while loading and unloading goes on and you are sitting on your assigned seat and can’t see much, especially not if you are sitting on the other side. So what do you advise in practical terms? And is it really a concern? I’ve been now on a few bus trips in Spain, getting to a starting point or leaving after finishing, and I’ve never worried about my backpack in the hold.be careful when going on a bus and putting your bag in the hold. It is not unknown for thieves to take them whilst the driver is waiting for everyone to come on board (and the door stays open). Can happen in any country and recently to a friend of mine’s husband, on a trainIn Switzerland.
I stay outside until the hold is shut.How can one be careful, I wonder? You have to get on the bus while the hold is still open, or you are on the bus during an intermediate stop while loading and unloading goes on and you are sitting on your assigned seat and can’t see much, especially not if you are sitting on the other side. So what do you advise in practical terms? And is it really a concern? I’ve been now on a few bus trips in Spain, getting to a starting point or leaving after finishing, and I’ve never worried about my backpack in the hold.
That is precisely what happened, except it was a bag put on the rack above the seat. It contained photographic equipment, the thieves must have spotted it before he boarded the train. It was very quick.As to trains, there is a new trick in town, or rather on trains, and we’ve been made aware of it some years ago already (for trains in Germany), especially when your train stops in a major station: pay attention to your handbag and don’t put it on the seat next to you while you are settling in. Thieves may enter the train, walk quickly through your carriage, snatch your handbag, leave the train again, and while the train sets in motion, you notice that your handbag is gone!
Are you not allowed to hold your backpack? Or place under a seat?How can one be careful, I wonder? You have to get on the bus while the hold is still open, or you are on the bus during an intermediate stop while loading and unloading goes on and you are sitting on your assigned seat and can’t see much, especially not if you are sitting on the other side. So what do you advise in practical terms? And is it really a concern? I’ve been now on a few bus trips in Spain, getting to a starting point or leaving after finishing, and I’ve never worried about my backpack in the hold.
As to trains, there is a new trick in town, or rather on trains, and we’ve been made aware of it some years ago already (for trains in Germany), especially when your train stops in a major station: pay attention to your handbag and don’t put it on the seat next to you while you are settling in. Thieves may enter the train, walk quickly through your carriage, snatch your handbag, leave the train again, and while the train sets in motion, you notice that your handbag is gone!
I'm pretty sure that a backpack wouldn't fit under the seat, and depending on the length of the journey, holding it would be impractical, and possibly annoying to your seat mates.Are you not allowed to hold your backpack? Or place under a seat?
No, at least yesterday on ALSA and Estella.es everybody had to put their backpack into the hold. The drivers were quite adamant about that issue. They even wanted me to put my smaller bag there which I refused, because I had all my valuables in there plus my medication.Are you not allowed to hold your backpack? Or place under a seat?
I'm pretty sure that a backpack wouldn't fit under the seat,
OK. I’ve taken my clues from the Spanish passengers and just filed into the bus with them. There still remains the problem of the stops. One would have to get off the bus at each stop, no?I stay outside until the hold is shut.
As someone said, the bus drivers seem adamant that the backpacks go into the hold, both on regional and national lines, and I’ve never questioned it. But I checked the rules now (to which you agree when you buy a ticket). Anything that doesn’t fit into the overhead luggage rack has to go into the hold. These racks are quite small and don’t have enough space for pilgrim backpacks in the usual sizes.Are you not allowed to hold your backpack? Or place under a seat?
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