• Get your Camino Frances Guidebook here.
  • For 2024 Pilgrims: €50,- donation = 1 year with no ads on the forum + 90% off any 2024 Guide. More here.
    (Discount code sent to you by Private Message after your donation)
  • ⚠️ Emergency contact in Spain - Dial 112 and AlertCops app. More on this here.

Search 69,459 Camino Questions

LIVE from the Camino 20 year old Pilgrim FOUND safe and sound

Status
Not open for further replies.
Time of past OR future Camino
October 20-November 31st
I appreciate this community so much. Thank you all so much for working together to find my daughter who otherwise would not be found. She was in a small private albergue in the mountains with no internet. I would have never heard from her without you all. Thank you so so much. This is an extremely special and rare community. God bless you all.

Concerned mama.
 

Attachments

  • 44E3BB22-1392-44EA-B083-BE9AEAB10463.jpeg
    44E3BB22-1392-44EA-B083-BE9AEAB10463.jpeg
    283 KB · Views: 496
Last edited:
Ideal sleeping bag liner whether we want to add a thermal plus to our bag, or if we want to use it alone to sleep in shelters or hostels. Thanks to its mummy shape, it adapts perfectly to our body.

€46,-
The 2024 Camino guides will be coming out little by little. Here is a collection of the ones that are out so far.
Hi Concerned Mama
I hope to alleviate your (warranted) concern by telling you posts like this frequently appear on the forum - and turn out fine. I hope the same for yours. May your daughter make contact soon
 
The focus is on reducing the risk of failure through being well prepared. 2nd ed.
None of her friends have heard from her either. I need to research what the next steps would be.
 
None of her friends have heard from her either. I need to research what the next steps would be.

Hello, this is an unfortunate situation. Often pilgrims are not aware of the concerns that their silence causes at home. Let's hope this is the case here and that she is just too busy.

What you could do is make an overview. Start with the last known place and date,. Can you figure out where she would be now if everything had gone as planned? (we assume that this is indeed the case.)

Also, you might put her name in the header of this thread. "Missing Zoe from ...." will surely catch the eyes of forum members who may have met her.
 
€2,-/day will present your project to thousands of visitors each day. All interested in the Camino de Santiago.
If you have access to her bank account you could see if she has made any withdrawals- but if she had enough cash on her, she may not have needed to in a week so that is not necessarily a beneficial action.
 
Hello, this is an unfortunate situation. Often pilgrims are not aware of the concerns that their silence causes at home. Let's hope this is the case here and that she is just too busy.

What you could do is make an overview. Start with the last known place and date,. Can you figure out where she would be now if everything had gone as planned? (we assume that this is indeed the case.)

Also, you might put her name in the header of this thread. "Missing Zoe from ...." will surely catch the eyes of forum members who may have met her.
Done. Thank you for your input.
 
The 2024 Camino guides will be coming out little by little. Here is a collection of the ones that are out so far.
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
When did you last talk to her? Do you know where she was at that time? And do you know how many KMs she was walking per day? With this info you can narrow down some possible towns where she might be have been yesterday. The folks on this forum can help with narrowing it down if you have exact dates to start calculating from. Based on what you wrote, she's probably within just a few days of finishing. I bet she calls you in the next day or two.
 
Last edited:
The 9th edition the Lightfoot Guide will let you complete the journey your way.
When did you last talk to her? Do you know where she was at that time? And do you know how many KMs she was walking per day? With this info you can narrow down some possible towns where she might be have been yesterday. The folks on this forum can help with narrowing it down if you have exact dates to start calculating from.
On the 15th she was at the Iron Cross. On the 19th she said she was in a nice albergue and with a group of young italians. She was walking about 20 kms a day. A friend of her said the last location picture she posted was around the 17th and was this church.
 

Attachments

  • 81F55268-3D59-451E-8788-10BCB869728F.jpeg
    81F55268-3D59-451E-8788-10BCB869728F.jpeg
    31.3 KB · Views: 165
Also please notify police and authorities. If you can see her phone activity that is helpful. But they police can access if you can’t.
I emailed the US Consulate in Barcelona and sent a picture of her passport. I don’t share a phone plan with her, but I have asked her father who she does share a plan with.
 
That would be a long list of places to call, starting in el Acebo, Molinaseca, Ponferrada, Cacabelos to Villafranca.
I would be inclined to follow the money. Where was her last ATM withdrawal? If it was in Astorga then she probably has enough cash to get as far as O'Cebreiro or Triacastela before her next withdrawal. This region is mountainous and remote with small villages and few chance for Internet connections.
 
Join our full-service guided tour and let us convert you into a Pampered Pilgrim!
That would be a long list of places to call, starting in el Acebo, Molinaseca, Ponferrada, Cacabelos to Villafranca.
I would be inclined to follow the money. Where was her last ATM withdrawal? If it was in Astorga then she probably has enough cash to get as far as O'Cebreiro or Triacastela before her next withdrawal. This region is mountainous and remote with small villages and few chance for Internet connections.
That is comforting. Thank you. I don’t know about her last withdrawal, although I do know she got out cash in Astorga, that was 2 weeks ago.
 
Also please notify police and authorities. If you can see her phone activity that is helpful. But they police can access if you can’t.
I second this recommendation. Contact both the embassy and the local police as soon as possible.
 
Get a spanish phone number with Airalo. eSim, so no physical SIM card. Easy to use app to add more funds if needed.
My 20 year daughter Zoe started the Camino solo from St Jean Pied de Port on October 23rd. We tended to hear from her every couple days as she would hit Albergues with internet. We haven’t heard from her in a week. She was a couple days past the iron cross and traveling with Italians and a man and co worker from Dubai that she had met on the trail. This is unlike her to go silent. Is there a network of albergues where I can ask if anyone has seen her? She is 5’9 and 140 pounds and has a blue jacket and doc marten boots. She is walking on through to “the end of the world.”

Concerned mama.
If she was two days beyond the iron cross a week ago I reckon that puts her somewhere near Villafranca then and, continuing at the same pace, possibly near Arzua/Pedrouzo now. Santiago is a further day or two then it's around four days to Finisterre. Everyone takes the Camino at their own pace so that's an approximate timetable. Really hope she gets in touch with you soon.
 
I think that church is on the west end of Molinaseca. Someone else may have another opinion. If she stopped at the Cruz the Ferro on the 15th and walked down the hill to el Acebo that night, then leaving Molinaseco on the morning of the 17th would make sense, even though the shadows and lighting don't look like morning time to me. (I'd even be willing to say the that church could be in Melide or Arzua because of the 4 story building the background and the width of the street and trash can agglomeration, but that would be way beyond her 20km/day progress.)
Ten days after Astorga she should have made another ATM withdrawal by now and she is probably as far as Portomarin or Palas del Rei by now if she is walking 20km/day.
 
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
My 20 year daughter Zoe started the Camino solo from St Jean Pied de Port on October 23rd. We tended to hear from her every couple days as she would hit Albergues with internet. We haven’t heard from her in a week. She was a couple days past the iron cross and traveling with Italians and a man and co worker from Dubai that she had met on the trail. This is unlike her to go silent. Is there a network of albergues where I can ask if anyone has seen her? She is 5’9 and 140 pounds and has a blue jacket and doc marten boots. She is walking on through to “the end of the world.”

Concerned mama.

Could this young woman possibly be of Hungarian origin?

(spoke to someone looking a bit like her yesterday in Fisterra)
 
If she was at Cruz de Ferro (Iron Cross) around the 15th Nov then she should be within a day of Santiago. (based on her average daily distance) If you do not here from her by Wednesday (28th) then I would step up the process.
Maybe contact Police in Santiago with her passport details, when you register for accommodation you need to provide your National Passport details - most places take a photocopy for the info page. Keeping you and her in my thoughts! Cheers
 
New Original Camino Gear Designed Especially with The Modern Peregrino In Mind!
Y
My 20 year daughter Zoe started the Camino solo from St Jean Pied de Port on October 23rd. We tended to hear from her every couple days as she would hit Albergues with internet. We haven’t heard from her in a week. She was a couple days past the iron cross and traveling with Italians and a man and co worker from Dubai that she had met on the trail. This is unlike her to go silent. Is there a network of albergues where I can ask if anyone has seen her? She is 5’9 and 140 pounds and has a blue jacket and doc marten boots. She is walking on through to “the end of the world.”

Concerned mama.
From her father “Talked to local police. They say there is definitely a way for authorities to ping the phone but usually with overseas situations this happens through Interpol. She said starting with the consulate is correct. I would wait a couple more days to file a missing persons report though, it’s still more likely than not that she is in a bad connection area or something happened to her phone.”
 
The 2024 Camino guides will be coming out little by little. Here is a collection of the ones that are out so far.
Perhaps check on weather conditions. If there is much rain or snow, perhaps she has been held up because of that. (in a place with bad connections) Zoe is in my prayers.
There is a Facebook page called Camino Companions. They are a group that offers post-camino support at Santiago at the Pilgrims office.
 
Last edited:
She might still be about 50km out. And especially if she had snow over the mountains by LaFaba and O’Cebreiro. There is a list of all albergues and also a profile map with most towns listed at the bottom of the main forum page that may help you be somewhat familiar with distances and options. Does she have a pack? Any idea what brand and color or anything special about it?
 
@FiveReasonsWhy , I'm sorry to read this and can imagine the depth of your concern.
There are a lot of good suggestions here - I can only echo what others have said and offer heartfelt empathy and well-wishing. May she turn up safe and sound - and soon.

And if you need help on the ground in Santiago, @natefaith of Pilgrim House and @SYates of Egeria House are the people to ask.

t is a bit further, at the end of Camponaraya
Yes. That's the one - I have a photo of it confirming that.
 
Get a spanish phone number with Airalo. eSim, so no physical SIM card. Easy to use app to add more funds if needed.
If she plans to get her Compostela, and she has not yet arrived in SdC, you might leave a message at the pilgrims office.
@t2andreo can hopefully tell you all about how to do that.

Rick of @RickandPeg sent me a Private Conversation request for how to handle direct contact with the Pilgrim Office. I provided phone numbers and names.

I also provided contact info for the Policia Local at Santiago de Compostela.

I believe he is working with @FiveReasonsWhy, offline.
 
She might still be about 50km out. And especially if she had snow over the mountains by LaFaba and O’Cebreiro. There is a list of all albergues and also a profile map with most towns listed at the bottom of the main forum page that may help you be somewhat familiar with distances and options. Does she have a pack? Any idea what brand and color or anything special about it?
 

Attachments

  • 6BD7CC5E-7CD1-4175-BC26-5B9BA9EBDFBB.jpeg
    6BD7CC5E-7CD1-4175-BC26-5B9BA9EBDFBB.jpeg
    880.1 KB · Views: 61
Rick of @RickandPeg sent me a Private Conversation request for how to handle direct contact with the Pilgrim Office. I provided phone numbers and names.

I also provided contact info for the Policia Local at Santiago de Compostela.

I believe he is working with @FiveReasonsWhy, offline.
I haven’t seen anything but the public email accounts
 
The 9th edition the Lightfoot Guide will let you complete the journey your way.
That is comforting. Thank you. I don’t know about her last withdrawal, although I do know she got out cash in Astorga, that was 2 weeks ago.
This is a very worrying situation and I feel for your anxiety. I think that If she withdrew money in Astorga, she should surely be in, or within a day of Santiago now. This should narrow down the research of where she might have stayed over these last couple of days, perhaps starting with Arzua. I have no idea which albergues are still open at this time of the year, but it shouldn't be too difficult to obtain the list and check them out. Obviously with someone to help you locally. The Pilgrim's Office is also a very important connection and they should be looking out for her fellow travelers too (the Italians and the go worker from Dubai). I do hope she contacts you soon.
 
I usually contacted friends/family every few days, but I'm pretty sure there would have been a week gap in there. I would have been embarrassed if anyone contacted the police. Especially when there is a lot going on around you, new friendships and a lot to process, you aren't sure how to communicate it all to folks back home. I could be way off track here, but I wouldn't worry so much if it's been just a week...
 
Down bag (90/10 duvet) of 700 fills with 180 g (6.34 ounces) of filling. Mummy-shaped structure, ideal when you are looking for lightness with great heating performance.

€149,-
I usually contacted friends/family every few days, but I'm pretty sure there would have been a week gap in there. I would have been embarrassed if anyone contacted the police. Especially when there is a lot going on around you, new friendships and a lot to process, you aren't sure how to communicate it all to folks back home. I could be way off track here, but I wouldn't worry so much if it's been just a week...
Yes, I agree. I really would just like to know she’s been seen.
 
I usually contacted friends/family every few days, but I'm pretty sure there would have been a week gap in there. I would have been embarrassed if anyone contacted the police. Especially when there is a lot going on around you, new friendships and a lot to process, you aren't sure how to communicate it all to folks back home. I could be way off track here, but I wouldn't worry so much if it's been just a week...

I'd be absolutely mortified if I was assumed missing because I hadn't been in contact for a week! I had a "situation" last year when travelling, and it was only after 10 days that someone contacted me and asked me what was up. I train my friends and family to Not Panic unless I'm gone for at least 30 days. I also explain to the less travelled that the whole world doesn't have easy to use and accessible Internet. What if she's lost her phone? I can't imagine smallSpanish towns are the easiest places to get a replacement.
 
This pack would be somewhat unique to see on the Camino. It’s a MOUNTAINTOP 40 Liter Hiking Backpack with Rain Cover. The outside back pocket is different, logo is easy to identify and quite different from the Osprey picks used by so many. Hoping this helps anyone that may have seen it/her.
 
Get a spanish phone number with Airalo. eSim, so no physical SIM card. Easy to use app to add more funds if needed.
If I were to lose my phone on this type of trip and had previously been contacting loved ones every few days, I would definately be stopping in at the next tourist office and have them call for me or let me borrow a computer to email so my family would not worry a moment longer than necessary. I'm sure many other hospis, or local police would be more than willing to help, too. I think having a lost phone would be a poor excuse to do nothing.
 
Transport luggage-passengers.
From airports to SJPP
Luggage from SJPP to Roncevalles
Of more concern is this young lady also had problems before/earlier in camino and transported ahead to leave distance according to a post.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Join our full-service guided tour and let us convert you into a Pampered Pilgrim!
Of more concern is this young lady also had problems before/earlier in camino and transported ahead to leave distance according to a post. This screenshot is from Nov. 6, her first time with a problem.

Can we confirm that message is genuine and her correct email address? Though she must be almost finished. Happy to contribute.
Hopefully she is amongst 'friends' now.
 
Last edited:
If you can find a Spanish speaking person who is able to call some albuerges, that might get you some relieve and semi quick info. I would suggest to use Gronze.com for a list of albuergues and start from Santiago moving back. If you can’t find anybody I am definetly willing to do it for you. My Spanish is good enough to make myself clear. But maybe this forum has some native speakers?
 
€2,-/day will present your project to thousands of visitors each day. All interested in the Camino de Santiago.
Join our full-service guided tour and let us convert you into a Pampered Pilgrim!
The 9th edition the Lightfoot Guide will let you complete the journey your way.
Could you contact me directly? Thank you.

Just as an FYI, last night before going to sleep I asked a friend who lives in Santiago to help us out. She should be in Private Conversation with you tomorrow - already...

If it is not too intrusive, please share what happened and why she did not remain in contact here.

We always try to provide the best advice and information to all pilgrims, but especially to both men and women who opt to walk solo. Zoe's experiences might help add to that advice. The Camino, statistically, is safer than remaining at home. However, any solo traveler, anywhere, needs to hold themselves to a higher level of awareness and responsibility, at least IMHO.

Basically, ANYONE who walks solo and has family or friends at home who will be concerned for them should (IMHO) leave a walking plan and establish a contact plan. This is similar to a sailor who leaves a 'float plan' before casting off. This way, if the traveler fails to check in as prearranged, recovery steps can be taken from the distant, stay-at-home, end.

The solo pilgrim who opts for this added protection should agree and develop a set contact plan for periodic text, email, video conversation, voice calls, or similar, and stick to it. With all the research and planning that usually accompanies any Camino the plan should also include a list of people and places to call on the Camino if you fail to keep the pre-agree contact plan. There should be a mutual understanding that this pre-plan will click into action automatically after some period of time that is, again, pre-agreed.

For example, my plan includes a weekly call to my senior mom, and daily updates to my wife. If I miss a contact my wife will ping me. If I fail to call mom (it has happened) she will call my wife. If two days (>48 hours) pass, my wife activates the pre-agreed emergency locator plan I devised. Here is what is looks like...

1. Use the "Find My Phone" app on her phone or iPad to locate where my phone is on the Camino. By repeating this over a few hours, depending on time of day, she can determine if I (or at least the phone is moving). However, if I changed my SIM card for a local SIM card, this would not work, unless she also had the new number. I has never used an unknown SIM. Also, if the phone has completely no power this might be difficult. It is easy to borrow a charger at an albergue, people leave them behind all the time, you have only to ask...

2. As I stay in pre-booked lodging, I leave a detailed plan, including phone numbers for all lodging places. She will go to a neighbor or friend who speaks fluent Spanish and will ask that person to call the previous, and next listed places to ask for me. We live in South Florida. Finding a native Spanish speaker is not difficult.

3. If steps #1 and #2 do not find me, she will take it to the next level. That includes calls to the Policia Nacional and Guardia Civil if I am not likely in a town or city. When they answer in Spanish, you can simply say "ayuda en ingles, por favor - help in English please." If I am in a large city, then she knows to search the internet for "Policia Local (name of town or city)." With that information, our friendly Spanish speaker will call the police to put out the word.

4. Only after all that is done will she contact the US Department of State (www.state.gov) to file a missing citizen's report. The reason for the relatively late contact in the order of things is that the embassy cannot do any more than steps 1 - 3 envisage.

5. As I happen to have friends who live at Santiago, she would reach out to them after step #2. My walking plan has all the contact names, phone numbers and e-mail addresses. But, we do not shake that tree unless and until we have to. The ICE information I always carry with my passport and in my rucksack also has the name of a Santiago friend who knows what I am doing and can come to claim me in hospital or worse. This is also by pre-agreement.

Basically, this is all about responsibility. Yes, the Camino is about freedom and at times, anonymity. Yes, it is also about spontaneity. But, when you are far from home and there are family members, loved ones, or friends who might reasonably be concerned for your well-being, you have a responsibility to them to provide this level of confidence. With all the planning that usually goes into any Camino, this walking plan is just an added layer of insurance.

Finally, once the solo pilgrim gets to a certain mature age, or at any age, has chronic medical issues, it is even more important that this sort of pre-planning occur. Doing it for the first time is the most difficult thing. Once you have done it for the first-time, it only needs to be updated for each, successive Camino.

[I am editing this to add that being very OCD is in my nature as a trained process analyst and retired intelligence analyst.]

I am glad that this young lady has apparently surfaced, and I hope the above helps. If even one pilgrim is helped, my role is fulfilled.

Be safe out there...
 
Last edited:
Hello, i run a casa rural and look after the village albergue along the camino Frances. Legally we have to register everyones details into a special data base the police provide us. Once the police came because a name flagged up in their system. I would suggest mentioning this to the consulate who could ask the police to look in their data base to see if she has been registered in albergues along the way after your last point of contact. Sending you a big embrace and hoping you will soon find out she is well and happy and just in a camino bubble.
 
The one from Galicia (the round) and the one from Castilla & Leon. Individually numbered and made by the same people that make the ones you see on your walk.
I never saw this. Thank you so much!

Not to be a wet blanket, but this is still well short of a direct email, text or phone call that says: "Hi, I'm fine, I am at (place). Sorry for scaring you..."

Were it me, I would not rest until I had personally been in contact with my missing loved one.

I am cautiously optimistic...
 
My 20 year daughter Zoe started the Camino solo from St Jean Pied de Port on October 23rd. We tended to hear from her every couple days as she would hit Albergues with internet. We haven’t heard from her in a week. She was a couple days past the iron cross and traveling with Italians and a man and co worker from Dubai that she had met on the trail. This is unlike her to go silent. Is there a network of albergues where I can ask if anyone has seen her? She is 5’9 and 140 pounds and has a blue jacket and doc marten boots. She is walking on through to “the end of the world.”

Concerned mama.
I believe she has made contact. So all good??
 
She obviously knows her mom is worried because the man at the albegue wrote, so yes, one would think that a personal message to mom would be forthcoming immediately. The message from the albergue was posted hours ago. Lot of concerned people in all of the other albegues, the many FB pages, all waiting to hear that truly all is ok.
 
Technical backpack for day trips with backpack cover and internal compartment for the hydration bladder. Ideal daypack for excursions where we need a medium capacity backpack. The back with Air Flow System creates large air channels that will keep our back as cool as possible.

€83,-
3rd Edition. More content, training & pack guides avoid common mistakes, bed bugs etc
I was surprised at American Pilgrims on the Camino's response to the message that she was missing being forwarded to their website from CAMIGAS, the buddy system for women on the Camino. They responded with: "Please contact the local authorities rather than posting here. Although we would all like to help, from here the best thing we can do is inform those in the position to investigate. " and disabled further comments. It was heartening and reassuring to see the marked contrast here! So glad that she's found.
 
Yes if it was my kid missing I wouldn’t take a FB message from a third party as good enough evidence that she’s safe and well. But as I wrote on another thread I’m *very* safety/security oriented. 😁
Her mother posted on the thread that she started on the Camigas page:

Yes she was at the Alchemist is the mountains without internet 🙂
 
Down bag (90/10 duvet) of 700 fills with 180 g (6.34 ounces) of filling. Mummy-shaped structure, ideal when you are looking for lightness with great heating performance.

€149,-
I was surprised at American Pilgrims on the Camino's response to the message that she was missing [...] They responded with: "Please contact the local authorities rather than posting here. Although we would all like to help, from here the best thing we can do is inform those in the position to investigate" and disabled further comments.
I was also surprised when I saw their reaction on their FB group but I can also understand that they adopted this policy. I suppose it is difficult to determine in the first few days whether it's an actual missing person case or a case where contact to a person has been temporarily lost for so long that it becomes worrying.

We are becoming more and more aware of the powers of social networks like FB. Whatever one feels about this, Facebook certainly delivered in this case.

(There are several large and active camino groups on Facebook, in various languages, some of them are members-only. There is also a FB group for this forum).
 
Last edited:
Her mother posted on the thread that she started on the Camigas page:

Yes she was at the Alchemist is the mountains without internet 🙂
Hopefully this is fact coming from her actually speaking to her daughter for verification and not just taken from the fb photo and comment, although it does sound like very encouraging news.
 
I appreciate this community so much. Thank you all so much for working together to find my daughter who otherwise would not be found. She was in a small private albergue in the mountains with no internet. I would have never heard from her without you all. Thank you so so much. This is an extremely special and rare community. God bless you all.

Concerned mama.
Thanks for letting us all know.
 
Technical backpack for day trips with backpack cover and internal compartment for the hydration bladder. Ideal daypack for excursions where we need a medium capacity backpack. The back with Air Flow System creates large air channels that will keep our back as cool as possible.

€83,-
I was surprised at American Pilgrims on the Camino's response to the message that she was missing being forwarded to their website from CAMIGAS, the buddy system for women on the Camino. They responded with: "Please contact the local authorities rather than posting here. Although we would all like to help, from here the best thing we can do is inform those in the position to investigate. " and disabled further comments. It was heartening and reassuring to see the marked contrast here! So glad that she's found.
I'm on that group and they were, imo, absolutely wrong to shut down that thread. These forums are the way that people gain information about what to do. Especially for the non Spanish speaker or non Camino walker who has no clue what to do. The fact that it was the albergue who raised the flag that the girl was with them is proof of the power of social media.
I'm grateful for this forum and the willingness of everyone to give advice and support to concerned mama. As opposed to shutting down the conversation and telling her to go figure it out on her own.
 
I'm on that group and they were, imo, absolutely wrong to shut down that thread. These forums are the way that people gain information about what to do. Especially for the non Spanish speaker or non Camino walker who has no clue what to do. The fact that it was the albergue who raised the flag that the girl was with them is proof of the power of social media.
I'm grateful for this forum and the willingness of everyone to give advice and support to concerned mama. As opposed to shutting down the conversation and telling her to go figure it out on her own.
I’m so grateful. We would have had days ahead of us of not knowing and would have caused an international incident, when this beautiful community was able to network and pinpoint her. Extremely touching and grateful.
 
I was also surprised when I saw their reaction on their FB group but I can also understand that they adopted this policy. I suppose it is difficult to determine in the first few days whether it's an actual missing person case or a case where contact to a person has been temporarily lost for so long that it becomes worrying.

We are becoming more and more aware of the powers of social networks like FB. Whatever one feels about this, Facebook certainly delivered in this case.

(There are several large and active camino groups on Facebook, in various languages, some of them are members-only. There is also a FB group for this forum).
This was something so efficiently and lovingly handled by community instead of authority and that’s a lovely thing this season. The authorities are necessary and I am grateful they exist, and people and community are necessary and can accomplish so much on the human level and in this case with more care, and gentleness.
 
3rd Edition. More content, training & pack guides avoid common mistakes, bed bugs etc
I’m so grateful. We would have had days ahead of us of not knowing and would have caused an international incident, when this beautiful community was able to network and pinpoint her. Extremely touching and grateful.

But have you spoken, texted, or exchanged direct email with your daughter? We all want this to be resolved in the best possible manner. But some of us veterans, including me, are wary of third-party reports on social media.

Please let us know once you have communicated directly with Zoe. Only then will we relax and stand down.

Thanks
 
Last edited:
Relieved she was located and all is well. Love this forum...so many great people pulling together. I must admit I'm disappointed in APOC's reaction, one of the reasons I hang out here, and not there. The Camigas Facebook group is a wonderful and supportive resource for camino women, but this forum is effective because of its world-wide reach and networking.

cheers and rest easy.
 
But have you spoken, texted, or exchanged direct email with your daughter? We all want this to be resolved in the best possible manner. But some of us veterans, including me, are wary of third-party reports on social media.

Please let us know once you have communicated directly with Zoe. Only then will we relax and stand down.

Thanks
When she said "would never have heard from her" the message I read is that she heard directly from Zoe and not just from third parties.
 
The 9th edition the Lightfoot Guide will let you complete the journey your way.
€2,-/day will present your project to thousands of visitors each day. All interested in the Camino de Santiago.
These threads always make me a little bit uncomfortable, like a stranger asking to be a Friend on Facebook. I always try to keep in mind that some people are incommunicado because they want to be. Nervous parents are justifiably wary of a full scale search through the Spanish authorities, so it is nice that social media can help. Everyone who helped is now in the great database in the cloud, linked to Camino de Santiago! Expect to get popup ads for tours in Spain.

In this case it was a youth who did not properly communicate with a concerned parent. It occurs thousands of time each year and is a crisis for those individuals. Only in the case of Denise Thiem has there ever been a bad outcome, at least to my knowledge. So while it may be a huge problem for the concerned parties, it may be less important than litter, which affects us all.

Everyone is free to help, but they are equally free to not help. I have to disagree that APOC is in any manner negligent in its reaction. If they don't want to hand-hold, I can fully support that policy and will continue sending in my dues. A decade ago, instant communication was available only from intermittently operating computers in just a few albergues (and libraries). I understand that we have moved from pony express to postage stamps, through FedEx, and on to wifi, but good old fashioned patience is still a virtue.:)

Social media is causing the death of democracy and privacy. When someone is "found" who does not want to be found, each of us may need to examine our personal contribution. That may be useful to contemplate on future pilgrim searches.
 
Hola Tom, your contact plan is a very useful one. Whilst I did not make too many phone calls directly to family, I did phone in to a radio station that on Sundays broadcast to virtually all of Australia. I also posted somewhat regularly on my Facebook page. But I agree with those in the 18-28 age range something a little more detailed is the "mum reassurance" necessary.

As for the somewhat errant woman in this case - glad to know that as the saying goes "all's well that ends well". Oh and a special like/virtual hug to @FiveReasonsWhy (think you sound like a great mum!!)!;)
 
Join our full-service guided tour and let us convert you into a Pampered Pilgrim!
Food for thought, @falcon269 . Thank you.
For me, it is actually quite simple: when I read a search request, I would make a decision about whether I trust what the requester says or not and whether I would want to err on the side of the requester or on the side of the missing person.

I was wondering earlier how long it would take until the argument would turn up that some people are incommunicado because they want to be. If memory does not fail me, this argument turned up in 2015 much earlier - right at the beginning I believe - than in this thread when it appears that all ended well.

BTW, it's not only Facebook that makes up social media. This forum is part of it.
 
Last edited:
Food for thought, @falcon269 . Thank you.
I've suggested to my wife, that she ever considers me to have gone missing on a Camino trip, that she posts here and asks if anyone has seen me. I hope the day never comes, but if it does, I dearly hope that anybody who thinks they might have encountered me will give her news rather than sit around philosophising over whether I want to be found. Equally, I think it falls within a mother's remit to try and find her child, whom after all, she knows best. Neither would I say, "Only in the case of Denise Thiem..." Rather, I would say, "Because of..."
 
Last edited:
Neither would I say, "Only in the case of Denise Thiem..." Rather, I would say, "Because of..."
Well said. All sorts of arguments have been given as to why this community should not help to find someone who is missing or has not checked in but the easy answer is to ask the person to contact home if you are with them or know where they are rather than give a location online, this protects both parties IMO.
It will be a sad day if we are not willing to help because of "what ifs"
 
St James' Way - Self-guided 4-7 day Walking Packages, Reading to Southampton, 110 kms
Hola Tom, your contact plan is a very useful one. Whilst I did not make too many phone calls directly to family, I did phone in to a radio station that on Sundays broadcast to virtually all of Australia. I also posted somewhat regularly on my Facebook page. But I agree with those in the 18-28 age range something a little more detailed is the "mum reassurance" necessary.

As for the somewhat errant woman in this case - glad to know that as the saying goes "all's well that ends well". Oh and a special like/virtual hug to @FiveReasonsWhy (think you sound like a great mum!!)!;)

Your radio show call in is perhaps the most unique way to communicate with everyone who knows you back home. What a communication plan is all about is providing a "sign of life" to those who care about you and who are not with you. When crafting the communication plan that I highly recommend, anything that accomplishes this is fine.

It reminds me of my 2016 Camino from Madrid. I was testing a new SPOT GPS location transmitter. By prearrangement, several friends and my wife asked for a GP location daily, So we agreed that I would hit the single button at noon, my time every day.

This small device sent a GPS location, using email via the SPOT server. In the end, I decided it was not worth the extra expense, weight and hassle, as anyone with my iPhone number could use "Find My Phone" to locate the phone, and ostensibly me.

Hope this helps.
 
I was so disheartened with the APOC FB group, that I wrote a post about it this morning. I was chastised by the admins, that I should have written them a personal message if I wasn't happy with how they handled it instead of an open post and then they closed off all comments. Other people wrote asking about "the missing girl", why the post was gone. All of the admin answers were lame, in my opinion. So, have left their FB group. Where is their empathy and kindness?
 
St James' Way - Self-guided 4-7 day Walking Packages, Reading to Southampton, 110 kms
I was chastised by the admins, that I should have written them a personal message if I wasn't happy with how they handled it i
This forum has a similar policy, and it is quite firmly applied. If you don't like the moderation, you must comment by PM, to Ivar, and not post your criticism in a public thread. While that might seem odd at first, it is necessary so that the team of Moderators can do their volunteer work without harassment and potentially insulting threads. None of them would hang around if they were subject to open criticism by strangers. They are doing their best, and may make "wrong" calls, but I understand that they try to work together to develop the best approach to discussions that can be difficult.

Perhaps the team at APOC are reconsidering their response after hearing your concerns, and next time will be different. But every case is different.
 
She wasn’t missing. She knew where she was.
I think you confuse "missing" with "lost". To her mum, she was missing until accounted for but I suspect that you understand that really. As a father, I can entirely identify with her plight.
 
Get a spanish phone number with Airalo. eSim, so no physical SIM card. Easy to use app to add more funds if needed.
I was so disheartened with the APOC FB group, that I wrote a post about it this morning. I was chastised by the admins, that I should have written them a personal message if I wasn't happy with how they handled it instead of an open post and then they closed off all comments. Other people wrote asking about "the missing girl", why the post was gone. All of the admin answers were lame, in my opinion. So, have left their FB group. Where is their empathy and kindness?

I will not speak for APOC but I held responsibilities at the national level in another country at the time of Denise Thiem's murder, and was astonished at the volume and nature of social media traffic which transpired. It divided into two good zones, a medium one, and then a dark one, that of practical and often on-the-ground advice, much well-intended expression of concern, then feverish speculation and, most disturbingly, a zone --at times very dark-- of intense and sometimes disturbed commentary and imagination.

I was astonished. I too well recall, and shudder while doing so, some of the emails I received. APOC, I think, was overwhelmed by the volume and intensity, which took up much of their energy while they were trying to manage the issue for the Thiem family at a terrible time.

Again, I will not speak for APOC, but I wonder if their focus was on the missing/unreachable girl, and that they did not want to exercise too much of it on managing the social media debate. Perhaps this explains their seeming brusqueness.

Other posters have made useful comments about mechanisms for keeping in touch, and I'll keep them in mind as I do training sessions in the future.
 
Last edited:
This forum has a similar policy, and it is quite firmly applied. If you don't like the moderation, you must comment by PM, to Ivar, and not post your criticism in a public thread. While that might seem odd at first, it is necessary so that the team of Moderators can do their volunteer work without harassment and potentially insulting threads. None of them would hang around if they were subject to open criticism by strangers. They are doing their best, and may make "wrong" calls, but I understand that they try to work together to develop the best approach to discussions that can be difficult.

Perhaps the team at APOC are reconsidering their response after hearing your concerns, and next time will be different. But every case is different.
The APOC moderators messaged me with great kindness and said they were simply of the belief that all info should be posted here so that I would see it and they were concerned that information was becoming scattered and apologized for any stress their decision made.
 
Ideal sleeping bag liner whether we want to add a thermal plus to our bag, or if we want to use it alone to sleep in shelters or hostels. Thanks to its mummy shape, it adapts perfectly to our body.

€46,-
These threads always make me a little bit uncomfortable, like a stranger asking to be a Friend on Facebook. I always try to keep in mind that some people are incommunicado because they want to be. Nervous parents are justifiably wary of a full scale search through the Spanish authorities, so it is nice that social media can help. Everyone who helped is now in the great database in the cloud, linked to Camino de Santiago! Expect to get popup ads for tours in Spain.

In this case it was a youth who did not properly communicate with a concerned parent. It occurs thousands of time each year and is a crisis for those individuals. Only in the case of Denise Thiem has there ever been a bad outcome, at least to my knowledge. So while it may be a huge problem for the concerned parties, it may be less important than litter, which affects us all.

Everyone is free to help, but they are equally free to not help. I have to disagree that APOC is in any manner negligent in its reaction. If they don't want to hand-hold, I can fully support that policy and will continue sending in my dues. A decade ago, instant communication was available only from intermittently operating computers in just a few albergues (and libraries). I understand that we have moved from pony express to postage stamps, through FedEx, and on to wifi, but good old fashioned patience is still a virtue.:)

Social media is causing the death of democracy and privacy. When someone is "found" who does not want to be found, each of us may need to examine our personal contribution. That may be useful to contemplate on future pilgrim searches.
I agree with much of what you say. For me it was that she had been pursued by a pilgrim twice her age who was not taking No for an answer and so had been more diligent than otherwise to make her whereabouts known for her own safety and well being and then had gone silent. It was out of character and out of pattern for her and thus a red flag. She had checked in every 3-5 days at most with location and who she was traveling with and was in contact with friends nearly daily. There was no trace of her for a week. Her friends became concerned as did we her parents.

I didn’t need to know her location, just was hoping people had seen her and that she was safe. When something is out of pattern it warrants investigation and I felt here was a much more gentle and human way then involving authorities. I am eternally grateful that community is still a thing. It was beautiful how people networked and she was grateful to be able to communicate her wellbeing to us. We were completely ignorant to the fact that there would be spans of time making communication impossible. Our ignorance of this (previous travelers has spoken of wifi and internet being available at most albergue’s along the way) and her first trip and not realizing she was moving into an area of no communication created a perfect storm.

It’s actually the people who make this experience possible, the care, looking out for each other. For this mama every person who helped created the Hand of God and were gently able to place a light on her whereabouts. This family is extremely grateful that people like you all still exist.
 
For the record, I am not opposed to helping!

https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/looking-for-russell-kenny.43377/

Walking with my son and 4 1/2 year-old grandson, I spotted the "missing" pilgrim over the best homemade yogurt on the Camino at Formiga. I told him his mother was concerned. He was a bit astonished, since he was a permanent wanderer. He gave me permission to tell her he was fine and that he would call. He did, and joined the Forum as well (never to return).

The presence of a stalker is very disturbing. While November is a very quiet time to choose to walk alone, even during busy times, these predators will appear. The half-dozen times I have seen it, fellow pilgrims were very helpful and supportive. I have always said that the middle aged lotharios are a bigger danger than the flashers.:mad:

General advice for the future: A cell phone with international service can be very useful to nervous parents! I recommend Vodafone Spain. I don't think I was ever out of voice and data communication in the last few years, though I don't walk along the Camino watching if "Can you hear me now?" ;)
 
The 9th edition the Lightfoot Guide will let you complete the journey your way.
Status
Not open for further replies.

Most read last week in this forum

The Burguete bomberos had another busy day yesterday. Picking up two pilgrims with symptoms of hypothermia and exhaustion near the Lepoeder pass and another near the Croix de Thibault who was...
Between Villafranca Montes de Oca and San Juan de Ortega there was a great resting place with benches, totem poles andvarious wooden art. A place of good vibes. It is now completely demolished...
Just an FYI that all available beds are taken in SJPDP tonight - fully, truly COMPLETO! There’s an indication of how busy this year may be since it’s just a Wednesday in late April, not usually...
Left Saint Jean this morning at 7am. Got to Roncesvalles just before 1:30. Weather was clear and beautiful! I didn't pre book, and was able to get a bed. I did hear they were all full by 4pm...
Hi there - we are two 'older' women from Australia who will be walking the Camino in September and October 2025 - we are tempted by the companies that pre book accomodation and bag transfers but...
We have been travelling from Australia via Dubai and have been caught in the kaos in Dubai airport for over 3 days. Sleeping on the floor of the airport and finally Emerites put us up in...

❓How to ask a question

How to post a new question on the Camino Forum.

Forum Rules

Forum Rules

Camino Updates on YouTube

Camino Conversations

Most downloaded Resources

This site is run by Ivar at

in Santiago de Compostela.
This site participates in the Amazon Affiliate program, designed to provide a means for Ivar to earn fees by linking to Amazon
Official Camino Passport (Credential) | 2024 Camino Guides
Back
Top