Andrea Mayfield
it's about the journey.....
- Time of past OR future Camino
- Camino Frances (May 2015)
Camino Portugues - Porto to Santiago (June 2018)
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So that is exactly my question: hard or soft feet? I thought hard - calluses already formed. There are products to help harden feet (Tano) or lemon juice will also do the job. But then there are those who swear by baby-soft feet. I'm confused.Nothing prevents blisters like hardened foot.
What kind of preventative tape do you use?Start now. Prevention is much better than responding to problems. I use Vaseline in the morning and Vicks at night. I used Vaseline both morning and night while on the Camino. I wear injinji liners and either darn tough or icebreaker mid weight hikers. I wear boots because I need the ankle support: Merrill Moabs on the Camino and now Asolo. The last half of the Camino I preventative taped my toes as well. Every couple of hours I changed out the liners and hung the ones I took off on my pack. Whenever I stopped for coffee I removed my boots and let the feet rest. No blisters SJPP to Santiago.
Thanks I will go hunting for it@jostony, I'm not sure what it was as I bought it in Spain at a farmacia after describing what I was looking for. It came in both white and flesh toned. I have since replaced it in the US with a product called "hospital tape". Hopefully another tape user can give you a clearer answer.
Hi Barbara, its basically barrier cream, if you Google it you will get the full spec. In the UK and Ireland its available in Boots the Chemists. Its good stuff.wayfarer : what is "Gloves in a Bottle" ?
Many thanks
Off topic: how does one quote just a piece of a prior posting without quoting the whole thing and deleting the rest of it?
Calluses are our body's natural defence around those pressure points. Of course if you let the calluses get too thick it can cause additional pressure. and have to shave them off. Normally, I let my feet get hardened for three months without any pedicure. I would not want to artificially accelerate that 'hardening' process.So that is exactly my question: hard or soft feet? I thought hard - calluses already formed. There are products to help harden feet (Tano) or lemon juice will also do the job. But then there are those who swear by baby-soft feet. I'm confused.
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Definitely buy Nok and Hiker's Wool (http://www.hikerswool.co.nz/). I think Hikers Wool has a source in America, but if you buy enough they ship for free from NZ at less per package. I love this stuff and I buy enough to share with people who are having feet problems.I have been walking increased distances for a couple weeks and have plans to add hills and increasing weight in my pack to prepare for my May 27 Camino. I need guidance on socks and foot lubrication during training. I walk in thin coolmax socks ordinarily. I'm wondering how to incorporate "proven blister prevention" . I'm stuck between 'start now' and 'wait until my feet tell me they need help'. Thanks for your thoughts....
Calluses are our body's natural defence around those pressure points. Of course if you let the calluses get too thick it can cause additional pressure. and have to shave them off. Normally, I let my feet get hardened for three months without any pedicure. I would not want to artificially accelerate that 'hardening' process.
The KEY is to minimize friction. You want to prevent your skin from slipping, sliding, and rubbing back and forth inside your shoe.
In addition to hardening, small amount of vaseline, fast wicking socks to reduce moisture, good fitting shoes that are broken in and taping those potential hot spots all would help. I have seen many Europeans tape the entire heel area. They were not second skin, much thinner. Don't know what they are called.
Good to know -- I'll put dimethacone on my "try it" list while I train. Thanks for the book reference too.Many people use vaseline with great success. It s too messy for me. I like Blue Steel Sports Anti-chafe cream which is like a liquid powder. It contains dimethacone which purportedly incorporates into the epithelium and prevents friction against the dermis thus disrupting the pathophysiology of blister formation. I previously used BodyGlide but they changed the formula and eliminated the dimethacone. There is a great book, "Fixing Your Feet" by John Vonhof, which devotes Chapter 19 to 'Preventing Blisters' which has a good discussion of things you can do.
Thanks for the advice -- I have developed a training schedule based on 3 or 4 sources. They all focus on starting slow. Still working on the sweet spot. It changes from hour to hourMy feet tend to sweat so keeping my feet dry was my most effective blister preventative.
I used sock liners and socks. I didn't use vaseline. I used sanitary pads on the boot liners to help keep my feet dry.
Really.
I think the best blister preventative is finding the right pair of boots, finding a good combination of socks, and gently training, paying careful attention to boot lacing (you want to find the sweet spot between your feet sliding around too much and your feet not having a bit of flexibility) and to the hot spots that may develop.
Be gentle. Just like auto manufacturers recommend you take it easy the first XX miles on a new car, take it easy with your feet. You can't replace those tires.
Buen Camino.
Do you mind me asking why you use the Vicks on your feet?Start now. Prevention is much better than responding to problems. I use Vaseline in the morning and Vicks at night. I used Vaseline both morning and night while on the Camino. I wear injinji liners and either darn tough or icebreaker mid weight hikers. I wear boots because I need the ankle support: Merrill Moabs on the Camino and now Asolo. The last half of the Camino I preventative taped my toes as well. Every couple of hours I changed out the liners and hung the ones I took off on my pack. Whenever I stopped for coffee I removed my boots and let the feet rest. No blisters SJPP to Santiago.
I don't think anyone has provided a response to this. Here is a list of products that might be useful:@jostony, I'm not sure what it was as I bought it in Spain at a farmacia after describing what I was looking for. It came in both white and flesh toned. I have since replaced it in the US with a product called "hospital tape". Hopefully another tape user can give you a clearer answer.
Thanks for helpful information. Can you please advise me whether:I don't think anyone has provided a response to this. Here is a list of products that might be useful:
- zinc oxide strapping tape - comes in a variety of widths in tan or white. Several manufacturers. A strong, fabric backed tape either flexible or rigid. Normally waterproof but permeable to both air and water vapour. I normally carry a roll of 25mm or 37mm wide tape for strapping my heels. I have used it in the past for taping my toes, but have switched to Micropore or Fixomull Stretch most of the time.
- Micropore(tm) - a paper based surgical tape (there are similar products from other manufacturers). It comes in a variety of widths, is air permeable. I use the 25mm width for taping toes before big walks, including the Camino.
- Fixomull Stretch(tm) - a porous, non-woven tape that is really great at conforming to complex shapes, like the ball and sides of the feet. I also use it to cover Compeed patches to enhance their 'stickability' and reduce the chance of the Compeed adhesive getting into socks! That sometimes works, but Compeed adhesives seems to have a knack of getting into everything!
- Moleskin - the classic soft cotton flannel tape with a self adhesive backing. Used to prevent chafing. I buy this in small sheets and then cut the shape that I need, but it can be bought in rolls as well. I use this less often than the other products that I have listed.
Thanks for helpful information. Can you please advise me whether:
Any advice gratefully received, as always. Thanks
- Are all these tapes applied straight onto the skin?
- Do you apply this tape as preventative before walking or only once you detect a heat or tender spot developing?
- If you get a tender spot developing under the foot do you recommend compeed patch (with or without tape)?
- A lot of commentary I have read on Forum in last few months suggests that you should take your boots off mid walk to either cool down in stream, just air the feet and also massage them - which works best in your expereince? My concern is that once I stop walking and take boots off will I want to put them back on start walking?
Many thanks for responsesSome people might get a reaction to zinc oxide based adhesives (strapping tape and moleskin). In that case, some further preparation is required. I have never had a problem, and still have a roll of pre-taping underwrap I bought in case I did get a reaction. You can find advice on taping issues online, eg here. There are many similar sites.
- Are all these tapes applied straight onto the skin?
Both. For shorter walks (up to about 15km) I don't do much preparation. Beyond that I will tape my large and adjacent toes, and small toes. For long walks (30km plus) I will strap my heels as well. This worked well for me on my recent pilgrimages, but is not perfect, and I still sometime get blisters.
- Do you apply this tape as preventative before walking or only once you detect a heat or tender spot developing?
If I have Fixomull or moleskin, I prefer that to Compeed.
- If you get a tender spot developing under the foot do you recommend compeed patch (with or without tape)?
I don't regularly remove my boots, and I have never cooled them down in a stream! When I have taken my boots off, I haven't had too much problem getting them back on, but I really don't have a view that one of these various approaches is better than the others.
- A lot of commentary I have read on Forum in last few months suggests that you should take your boots off mid walk to either cool down in stream, just air the feet and also massage them - which works best in your expereince? My concern is that once I stop walking and take boots off will I want to put them back on start walking?
If I have read correctly you wear 3 pairs of socks? Before I am swayed to follow your lead I can see how that would give plenty of cushioning and help with blisters but how hot do your feet get? One of my concerns as I countdown to my Camino is how hot my feet will feel in practice with just a liner and outer sock in May/June.Omnifex is non-woven elastic tape and Dermomedfix is non-woven dressing strip, both available in Spanish farmacias. Fungusol foot powder, also from farmacias, helps to care for your feet. (Be sure to ask for 'polvo' as it also comes as cream.) I powder mine at night, Terry in the morning and on the Camino we shower late afternoon or at night, never morning, so our feet are not soft/damp when we set off.
We wear liner socks, mid weight middle socks and cushion sole outer socks. The middle pair take the friction and we haven't had blisters yet. Practising some days now with our actual Camino socks and boots so as to accustom our feet to the pair we will be wearing, although we still wear our old kit for road walking at present.
I find the menthol or whatever it is in the Vicks soothing to tired feet.Do you mind me asking why you use the Vicks on your feet?
We have walked in May and have found this combination OK. I have carried a spare pair of older liner socks and worn them as the middle pair when it was hot. (IE 2 pairs of the 'inner and hot' liners and the cushion-soles leaving out the mohair middle pair.) I plan to do this for this year as we will be walking a little later than before. So yes 3 pairs have worked for us over several Caminos.If I have read correctly you wear 3 pairs of socks? Before I am swayed to follow your lead I can see how that would give plenty of cushioning and help with blisters but how hot do your feet get? One of my concerns as I countdown to my Camino is how hot my feet will feel in practice with just a liner and outer sock in May/June.
Thanks for that. Any reason you say "specifically" Rohan inner & hot socks? I have Bridgedale coolmax inner and outer socks. Will these do the same job?We have walked in May and have found this combination OK. I have carried a spare pair of older liner socks and worn them as the middle pair when it was hot. (IE 2 pairs of the 'inner and hot' liners and the cushion-soles leaving out the mohair middle pair.) I plan to do this for this year as we will be walking a little later than before. So yes 3 pairs have worked for us over several Caminos.
Specifically Rohan inner and hot socks -ladies or mens as they are unisex; Corrymoor Sportsman and Companion/Woodlander depending on whether you like long or shorter socks. The outer socks wick the moisture away from the liners which we wash daily. The outer 2 pairs are mohair and don't need washing very often.
Note we bought our boots wearing the 3 sock combination of liner and 2 mohair.
I don't know about other makes which is why I was specific about the socks we use. I don't see any reason why other types of sock should not work just as well. The mohair are different weights - one plain knit the other the cushion sole - but maybe Bridgedale are too.Thanks for that. Any reason you say "specifically" Rohan inner & hot socks? I have Bridgedale coolmax inner and outer socks. Will these do the same job?
Thanks. Yes I will try second pair of coolmax liners to see how that feels.I don't know about other makes which is why I was specific about the socks we use. I don't see any reason why other types of sock should not work just as well. The mohair are different weights - one plain knit the other the cushion sole - but maybe Bridgedale are too.
It is probably best to experiment and find what suits best for your own feet. You could always add a second pair of the Bridgedale coolmax liners for your middle layer, like me layering the 2 pairs of Rohan liners, with your Bridgedale outers.
Am trying it out nowI find the menthol or whatever it is in the Vicks soothing to tired feet.
You totally read my mind!! You may have noticed that on my packing list I noted "some type of tape" Right on time Doug. Thanks so much.I don't think anyone has provided a response to this. Here is a list of products that might be useful:
- zinc oxide strapping tape - comes in a variety of widths in tan or white. Several manufacturers. A strong, fabric backed tape either flexible or rigid. Normally waterproof but permeable to both air and water vapour. I normally carry a roll of 25mm or 37mm wide tape for strapping my heels. I have used it in the past for taping my toes, but have switched to Micropore or Fixomull Stretch most of the time.
- Micropore(tm) - a paper based surgical tape (there are similar products from other manufacturers). It comes in a variety of widths, is air permeable. I use the 25mm width for taping toes before big walks, including the Camino.
- Fixomull Stretch(tm) - a porous, non-woven tape that is really great at conforming to complex shapes, like the ball and sides of the feet. I also use it to cover Compeed patches to enhance their 'stickability' and reduce the chance of the Compeed adhesive getting into socks! That sometimes works, but Compeed adhesives seems to have a knack of getting into everything!
- Moleskin - the classic soft cotton flannel tape with a self adhesive backing. Used to prevent chafing. I buy this in small sheets and then cut the shape that I need, but it can be bought in rolls as well. I use this less often than the other products that I have listed.
SY,Liner socks help to keep the blister causing friction between the two pairs of socks and not between the skin and the one pair of socks. Buen Camino! SY
I don't think this is the best explanation for why people wore liner socks in the past. In my lifetime, their use has been promoted as reducing the friction between foot and sock by allowing movement between the liner and outer sock. This hasn't changed.Back in the day, people had to wear liners because wool socks were so itchy and needed something to make your feet comfy.
It is common to combine a thin sock liner on the inside and synthetic quick drying socks on the outside and achieve a desired sock thickness effect, depending on the season.
Moisture management is just one of the issues, but needs to be accompanied by good friction management. Using liner socks, powder or another lubricant are part of the latter.Modern socks make this layering redundant, imho. Take a look at e.g point6 socks (former smartwool inventors). They knit the socks in such a way the hydrophobic inner layer wicks moisture away the skin (like a liner) and the outer hydrophilic layer absorbs some of the moisture and transport it outward for fast drying.
I have tried modern wool socks, and have effectively abandoned them for serious hiking. They retain far too much moisture for my liking, and stay damp for longer than any of my other trekking socks.I would recommend using modern merino wool socks during training with or without a liner and see which one is preferable.
SY, i am not disagreeing with the role of the liner socks. It is not the most prevalent method for reducing/eliminating blisters. I know lot of people annoyed by liners. It is not for everyone. If all other blister prevention strategy fails, i am all for trying liners and see if it helps.@Rajy62 We will have to agree to disagree here. IMO the two sock system helps greatly to redirect blister causing friction between the two sock layers and away from the skin. Less blisters, more joy! SY
Historically, i believe that is how liners started into footwear. I agree, liners are good for friction reduction. But, so are other strategies such as taping, vaseline or similar. Moisture increases friction and tend to cause more blisters. So, if you have a warm/sweaty feet to begin with liners can make it worse. Shoe type (low/mid cut), breathability (mesh/leather) will all influence the friction/moisture levels of the feet. I recommend people try and decide whether liners are needed/suitable for them?I don't think this is the best explanation for why people wore liner socks in the past. In my lifetime, their use has been promoted as reducing the friction between foot and sock by allowing movement between the liner and outer sock. This hasn't changed.
I totally agree.Moisture management is just one of the issues, but needs to be accompanied by good friction management. Using liner socks, powder or another lubricant are part of the latter.
I switched to merino wool socks and never looked back. Breathability of the boots, how warm/sweaty your feet is all contributes to getting your socks damp. If other type works for you that is great. But, there is substantial evidence from hikers touting the benefits of merino.I have tried modern wool socks, and have effectively abandoned them for serious hiking. They retain far too much moisture for my liking, and stay damp for longer than any of my other trekking socks.
Have been spending a lot of time at the hospital at my father's bedside lately and noticed a product they use to prevent bedsores - and wouldn't you know it, it contains dimethacone: it's called Proshield Plus and is available in retail: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000TLUSX4/?tag=casaivar02-20It contains dimethacone which purportedly incorporates into the epithelium and prevents friction against the dermis thus disrupting the pathophysiology of blister formation. I previously used BodyGlide but they changed the formula and eliminated the dimethacone.
Here is my new foot predicament: I have been out of 4 Camino stretches, never had an issue with blisters but rather with falling toe nails.
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