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And, anecdotal observation, it has worked! (Though I've never heard that this was a government decision; more likely the economics of studios dubbing into continental Portuguese just didn't add up in terms of potential viewership, so distributors went with subtitles.)I think the original language (with / without subtitles) rather than dubbing is key. When we were walking in Portugal we noticed on TVs and bars and Albergues that English / American programs were in their original language, with subtitles - not dubbed. More so than in Spain, at least some years go. We spoke of this with one albergue owner, as an episode of Friends played in English in the background, and he said original language with subtitles was a deliberate Government decision with the objective of improving spoken English.
I think the original language (with / without subtitles) rather than dubbing is key. When we were walking in Portugal we noticed on TVs and bars and Albergues that English / American programs were in their original language, with subtitles - not dubbed. More so than in Spain, at least some years go. We spoke of this with one albergue owner, as an episode of Friends played in English in the background, and he said original language with subtitles was a deliberate Government decision with the objective of improving spoken English.
And, anecdotal observation, it has worked! (Though I've never heard that this was a government decision; more likely the economics of studios dubbing into continental Portuguese just didn't add up in terms of potential viewership, so distributors went with subtitles.)
I started using Duolingo to learn spanish about 6 months before I went on the Camino Frances. I still do it daily now 6 years later and when I was in Guatemala and more recently Costa Rica, it helped a great deal. I'm no where fluent but, like you, I'm generally a bit lazy about language learning and well... learning in general. But I find Duolingo Spanish is a lot of fun. I guess kinda like how some folks like video games...I like Duolingo. I'm in the highest league and I enjoy the challenge. BTW I am going to hike Del Norte in October 2023 and I'm soooo happy I kept up with my Spanish. Buen Camino.... or as we say in German "Wie überwindet man seinen inneren Schweinehund?"
About a year ago I decided to learn Spanish so I could survive better on Camino routes that were less travelled than the Camino Francés. But so far I re-started two times and never really got further than ¡Hola!, ¡Adiós! and Soy el señor Blumenau. While on the grand scale I am highly motivated, I lack daily motivation and hence there is no consistency in my learning and progress is painfully slow.
I am using Babble, which I like, and I will borrow a textbook probably.
My native language is German and I started learning English at an early age – partly thanks to a considerable fraction of my relatives being British and partly thanks to several Regiments of the British Army being stationed in my German hometown.
At school, our first official foreign language to learn was ancient Latin and I also experimented a bit with ancient Greek at the time – it was a traditional almost Hogwarts-style school (without the magic, sadly) tracing its roots back to the year 799 AD and Charlemagne.
At that age learning languages was fun, natural and weekly progress was really fast.
But things appear to have changed a lot sinceI first realised this when 10 years ago I started learning Swedish: Progress was incredibly slow, picking up the right pronunciation was close to impossible and motivation was always an issue.
The same happens now with my Spanish learning efforts. And what makes it worse, while for Swedish I still had the advantage of moving to Sweden, for Spanish there is no pressure on me.
I guess this is more of a rant than asking for advice, but any tips are as welcome as is any co-ranting
One of the many semi-successful strategies in learning Portuguese, for me, was kind of like this.Hi, Pilgrims:
The posting on this thread have been very well inspiring and motivational.
I am bilingual (Spanish and English), studied both languages simultaneously in all grade levels, even when at higher education. In other thread, I mentioned that I was born in a Caribbean island, the language most used is Spanish; have visited Spain several times and although I do not the accent as a Spaniard, I am understood whenever I interact with them. There may be certain words that may be different meaning or usage.
One method of learning is to get the basics and then immerse in the language. Currently, I am learning Italian; began with Duolingo, but reached a level that needed more challenge and switched to Babbel, I think my understanding and confidence to have a conversation.
This happened to my wife and me while visiting Italy. We were with a group and the afternoon before returning home, we went to buy some souvenirs for our children; we entered a shop to look around and found something. Asked the shopkeeper about the item (he noticed) that my Italian was limited, so he spoke in English (which was also a bit broken) that he learned with his interaction with tourists. We reach an agreement, he would talk to me in English and I would talk him in Italian. To make this story short, we spend over and hour talking, when there was a mistake, we would stop for correction.
So, motivate yourself; don’t place excuses that would prevent you from learning whatever you want. Frustrations will surface many times, when this happens, maybe it is time to stop and let your memory bank register the new information.
Hope this helps with motivating your learning of the Spanish language.
Ivan_Prada
This story would make some sense, if it happened post-revolution (mid-70s). They had a lot of interesting policies.I have heard it yet another way, that the stopping of dubbing in Portugal in the 1970s was the government's way of trying to encourage the local film industry by way of making English-language films incomprehensible to locals. Instead, the Portuguese kept watching those films, learned English better, and didn't make their own films. That story does seem a bit of a stretch but I like it anyway.
This pretty much encapsulates the keys to success in learning a language, according to a number of those that have succeeded. You have to be motivated, you have to practice every day, you have to learn it doing something you enjoy, don't fear making mistakes (and a couple of other points that I can't immediately remember!)Let me respond from the point of view of someone who is currently (but not always) highly motivated in language learning, and who is married to a fanatical language learner (@Wendy Werneth).
A word @Arctic_Alex used three times in the OP is motivation, and this is of course the key to everything. People often say about Wendy something like, 'She is so motivated to learn languages'. And she is.
But let's say you have a friend who likes watching movies. Perhaps every week they go to the cinema 1-2 times and watch several more movies at home. Would anyone say that they are 'motivated' to watch movies? No. And why not? Because in our minds, we categorise watching movies (or sports, or other such activities) as something that is inherently fun, while language learning is categorised as study, something that is not fun and therefore that requires motivation (the generally poor level of instruction in foreign languages at school is a large contributing factor in this, but that's a conversation for another day).
So the short answer is this: make language learning fun.
I asked Wendy to reply to this thread and she declined because she essentially does not understand not being motivated in language learning. It's inherently fun for her so she doesn't need to motivate herself, just like the person who likes watching movies doesn't need to be motivated to watch a new movie.
Making language learning fun is easier said than done, of course, and even more so at a beginner level when you can't access a lot of great material. But the key to it is essentially this: do what you like doing in your native language in your target language, and then it will be fun for you.
We are understandably focused on speaking in language learning. And of course, speaking well tends to be the end goal, and for good reason. But in your own language, you do far more input than output. And that's the second key: input (that is, listening/watching and reading). Input is how you unlock output in a foreign language -- i.e. it's how your learned your native language as a child. And, if you consume the right content for you, it can be fun simply to consume it, so that the learning happens naturally as a byproduct.
For example, I listen to history podcasts (e.g. Hardcore History, The History of Rome etc) for fun in English; therefore, it makes sense if my level is high enough that I would do the same in Italian, which is my current focus language (e.g. Storia d'Italia).
As a second example, I have always enjoyed reading fantasy-type books in English as a child and as an adult (e.g. Narnia, Tolkien's books, Harry Potter etc). So I am doing the same in Italian. In the last three months I have read 8.5 books written by the Italian adolescent fantasy author Licia Troisi. I read them in LingQ which is (among other things) essentially a tool to help you to read in a foreign language. I have read about 30 books by the Spanish adolescent fantasy author Laura Gallego in the last 12 years. Reading her most famous trilogy (Memórias de Idhún) was literally the biggest factor in allowing me to take the next step in Spanish. Reading is magic, as Wendy says.
These are just examples of the kinds of things you can do, according to your own interests. If you like music, listen to music in your target language. If you like soap operas, watch soap operas in your target language. Use tools like LingQ (and I'm sure there are others) to import books or content from YouTube or Netflix or wherever to assist with things like transcriptions/subtitles to allow for greater understanding. This content would ideally but not necessarily be aimed at native speakers, including at children for beginner learners.
The two themes I hear again and again when polyglots speak about their language learning success are to listen/read extensively, and to do it every day. Consuming content that you're interested in motivates you and gives you the grounding in the language that you need in order to be able to speak well.
In today's connected world, there is an enormous amount of content available to consume for major languages (including Spanish, obviously, as that's likely to be our focus here -- Notes in Spanish is one good example at multiple levels). The excuse of not being in the country where the language is spoken is, these days, just that.
I live in Portugal but with my current language focus, I am exposed to far, far more Italian than Portuguese on a daily basis, because I am choosing to surround myself with Italian through listening, reading and iTalki conversations. For example, I just watched a 25-minute video on Dante before writing this post, and when I finish this post I'm going to read the transcript of the video to enhance my understanding of what I watched and to pick up some new language along the way (listening and having access to the transcript is gold). I once took a course in English on Dante for fun, so watching this video in Italian was also fun.
In a nutshell: figure out how to consume lots of content in your target language in a way that is fun for you. That's when you reach the secret Wendy level where language learning is fun, motivation is inbuilt and when you wake up each morning you can't wait to get started on it.
I hope this helps.
P.S. Apps like duolingo have realised they can making language learning fun through gamification, but they are not actually very effective by themselves.
Love this! I am fluent, as well.My second language is Chirades. I am now quite fluent.
I have just checked the English guidebook section "How to communicate with locals when abroad". SPEAK. LOUDER. AND. SLOWER. IN. ENGLISH. This apparently works in all countries. Allegedly
This is something I've always disparaged but I'm beginning to have second thoughts as I learn Spanish. I know that if I am having difficulty in understanding Spanish, it will help if the Spanish speaker does something similar in Spanish.I have just checked the English guidebook section "How to communicate with locals when abroad". SPEAK. LOUDER. AND. SLOWER. IN. ENGLISH. This apparently works in all countries. Allegedly
Maybe we should just give up. Also maybe this should be about Americans but who would believe that they would be waiting at a bus stop?
A Swiss man, looking for directions, pulls up at a bus stop where two Englishmen are waiting.
"Entschuldigung, koennen Sie Deutsch sprechen?" he says.
The two Englishmen just stare at him.
"Excusez-moi, parlez vous Francais?" The two continue to stare.
"Parlare Italiano?" No response.
"Hablan ustedes Espanol?" Still nothing.
The Swiss guy drives off, extremely disgusted.
The first Englishman turns to the second and says, "Maybe we should learn a foreign language...."
"Why?" says the other, "That bloke knew four and it didn't do him any good."
Can I recommend my own blog?I’ve been looking for a resource on the forum that contained the most common phrases and questions you would need to know in Spain as a pilgrim and despite numerous attempts at the « resource » section I cannot find it
(I'm Swiss)
I am sooo fluent in Spanglish. Now just need to work on more “Span” than “glish”. For my part, I am working on listening comprehension through podcasts and I have trained the Netflix algorithm to feed me Spanish language programs (with English subs).I had a pastor once, who had a growing congregation of hispanohablantes. He came to me one Sunday and asked what was the easiest way for him to learn Spanish.
I quickly responded, "Get a girlfriend who only speaks Spanish." I could see he was not ready to take that course of action. I imagined his brain physically cramping, like the calf of my leg was cramping two weeks into our Camino in September.
After a few moments he said, "I can't do that, I have a wife and children!"
Oh, well, I guess you are going to have to do it the hard way.
What do you mean?
Immersion therapy. Spaced repetition. Reading. Netflix in Spanish. And etc.,
Personally, I like walking with audio books. In fact my neighbors call me, "Walks-With-Audio-Books."
Here's my suggestion: https://www.audible.com/pd/Learn-Sp...on_code=ASSGB149080119000H&share_location=pdp
Just my opinion, but I think Spanglish is the best language to learn for the Camino. It allows you to dialogue with the locals and many of the extranjeros speak some English. Yup, my Spanglish, me ayudar, mucho, in the scorchio days caminando and eating my WAY por the Norte of Spain. ¡Viva la Meseta!
There's a very useful lesson here that can be applied to any target language: the more you actively surround yourself with a language, the easier it will be to learn.
And when I say "actively surround yourself" with the language, I don't just mean study more—I mean weave the language into the very fabric of your life!
The best way to get started with this is to think of all the things you currently do (or would like to do) in your native language, and instead work towards doing those things in your target language.
For example:
Anything goes, really, so long as you're connecting your target language with your favorite hobbies and habits, and the things that make you, you!
- If you listen to podcasts, find a show in your target language about topics you love.
- If you enjoy watching a TV series, watch it dubbed or subtitled in your target language.
- If you have a favorite book or book series, pick up a translated version.
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