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Hi everyone,
I am not intending to rage or start arguments, but I am posting this so people can be aware.
It may be hard to share a space such as an albergue with other people. Where do we cross the line between what we want to do and other's personal space? As delicate as this can be, I believe that normal education and common sense are key. So, posing the scenario of several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
We are in the camino as we are in life is, for me, one of the most real sayings about the camino. I guess that if you are rude, selfish and not aware of your surroundings, this is the kind of situation that you will create. People will sing together, dinner together and share this life time experience. But I guess that at the end of the day, if you don't care about others, this is what you are gonna do.
I am just appealing to some common sense to be used. Some good manners would be appreciated. People have all afternoon to prepare their rucksacks and put things they need aside. This is also why flashlights were created. But no. Just turning the volume up and wake up everyone for no reason whatsoever. Excuse if I sound angry, but I am. Just so rude.
Hi everyone,
I am not intending to rage or start arguments, but I am posting this so people can be aware.
It may be hard to share a space such as an albergue with other people. Where do we cross the line between what we want to do and other's personal space? As delicate as this can be, I believe that normal education and common sense are key. So, posing the scenario of several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
We are in the camino as we are in life is, for me, one of the most real sayings about the camino. I guess that if you are rude, selfish and not aware of your surroundings, this is the kind of situation that you will create. People will sing together, dinner together and share this life time experience. But I guess that at the end of the day, if you don't care about others, this is what you are gonna do.
I am just appealing to some common sense to be used. Some good manners would be appreciated. People have all afternoon to prepare their rucksacks and put things they need aside. This is also why flashlights were created. But no. Just turning the volume up and wake up everyone for no reason whatsoever. Excuse if I sound angry, but I am. Just so rude.
Love that term. Obliviots!I tend to think of Alburgue life as having the qualities of summer camp, without a counselor to keep some semblance of order. Without a resident monitor to enforce things like noise limitations and lights out curfews, one is at the mercy of Obliviots. Sometimes the Obliviots are few and far between, at other times you feel like you are between a gaggle of Obliviots. Sometimes peer pressure from the group keeps the Obliviots at bay, at other times it seems the peer group is content to let the Obliviots bay.
It seems that any discussions wishing or hoping for even minimum standards of behavior and expectations, draws criticisms by those who include any such discussion as imposing on the vaporously undefined notion of "My Camino". To be sure, there is a definite and positive rationale for respecting the concept of "My Camino"; but should that not also include discouraging negative behaviors which Obliviots impose on others?
Thankfully, most here on this forum counsel novice pilgrims on those types of behaviors to avoid when in a group setting. But there are still those voices which will tell the pilgrim, who is frustrated by Obliviot behavior, to just suck it up because that annoyance is your problem. And to a certain extent I agree, in that how we handle that annoyance is the individual's issue.
So, thankfully, much of the Obliviot problem is not going to be consistent; but it must be <sigh> expected. To avoid this, there are other choices for accommodations to provide needed respite. Yes, that makes the Camino budget more expensive; and it does nothing to discourage Obliviot behaviors from expanding with the passing years. It seems that, like bedbugs, Obliviots are simply part of the Camino picture.
Does Permethrin work to ward off Obliviots?
I am quite often one of those mid afternoon nappers, but I do it not expecting everyone else to adjust their behavior around me. Besides, when I'm tired it pretty much takes a small explosion to wake me up. I always seemed to get a decent siesta in even in the busiest of albergues.I've only experienced rude, loud people coming in late at the curfew a few times on three Caminos, and it was mostly the vino tinto talking.
Lights in the morning were usually turned on at 6am, but most early risers did whisper and tried to be quiet. If I wasn't ready to get up, my ear plugs kept most of the noise out anyway and I just tucked my head under my sleeping bag and fell back asleep.
I do have a question though....Often when I would reach the albergue in mid afternoon, there would be one or two people napping. Am I supposed to whisper in conversation to my companions and tiptoe around in order to not disturb them? I'm couteous, but I personally don't think we should have to accomodate the afternoon nappers when we arrive tired ourselves, unloading our packs, getting our shower gear together, etc.
Is my attitude inconsiderate? Maybe I'm opening a pandora's box by asking this question.
FalconI find it useless and frustrating to worry about the actions of others.
Hi everyone,
I am not intending to rage or start arguments, but I am posting this so people can be aware.
It may be hard to share a space such as an albergue with other people. Where do we cross the line between what we want to do and other's personal space? As delicate as this can be, I believe that normal education and common sense are key. So, posing the scenario of several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
We are in the camino as we are in life is, for me, one of the most real sayings about the camino. I guess that if you are rude, selfish and not aware of your surroundings, this is the kind of situation that you will create. People will sing together, dinner together and share this life time experience. But I guess that at the end of the day, if you don't care about others, this is what you are gonna do.
I am just appealing to some common sense to be used. Some good manners would be appreciated. People have all afternoon to prepare their rucksacks and put things they need aside. This is also why flashlights were created. But no. Just turning the volume up and wake up everyone for no reason whatsoever. Excuse if I sound angry, but I am. Just so rude.
I think that's one of the things that I love the most about the Camino - every day brings brand new possibilities!My saving grace was a lesson I learned - tomorrow is a brand new day, and whatever irks me now will not be there tomorrow....
Though I often post thoughtful, "live and let live" messages here or say things like Falcon said, "I find it useless and frustrating to worry about the actions of others." I wish that were true for me! But ACTUALLY in real life, I often allow myself to get incredibly annoyed, indignant and judgmental about the actions of others. I do start every day on the camino fresh, but then the next day some group of asses will inevitably take up the whole laundry line with their towels splayed out horizontally so nobody else can use the line. They will whisper loudly (which for some reason drives me even much crazier than when people talk out loud). They will stink up the dorm with strong-smelling foot ointments. Etc. The only thing that relieves the tension for me is my sense of humor. It's the only thing I seem to have control over (*most* of the time); the choice between being angry or laughing.
In one albergue, I was happy to be put in a room with only three beds. And only one of the other beds was occupied! But it was occupied by a woman who talked to herself while unpacking little plastic bags from her pack, sorting out all kinds of little things on her bed, repacking them and then repeating this again and again. I tried to get a good look at what she was doing and how she was sorting her little gadgets, because I was writing it all up in my journal. I almost couldn't wait to meet up with somebody I knew the next evening so I could tell this story. And, amazingly enough, the friend I ran into the next day HAD SPENT A NIGHT NEXT TO THIS SAME PERSON IN AN ALBERGUE A COUPLE OF NIGHTS BEFORE. We laughed so hard.
I know this doesn't sound kind, but it works for me.
We met a guy and his wife in their mid-late 60's; they would normally have been quite pleasant I think.
However he bought shoes that were too small, decided to walk barefoot, but that made him slower, so he started early. I mean early like 3-4am. He had other shoes with him (but was saving them? for what?)
In the comedy of errors that this was, he was also quite deaf.
So in the very early hours, he would wake, rustle, talk to his wife (very loudly because he was deaf), she would shhh him (loudly so he could hear). It would take them ages to get ready.
I think her shhhing was worse than his talking.
In no time the entire room would be awake, just waiting for them to leave.
They never turned the light on, one blessing.
We decided to walk a longer day, and ditch them, so I think did half the room. We never saw them again.
Okay, your question got me thinking about past Caminos and that particular subject and one humourous experience I had regarding it.I do have a question though....Often when I would reach the albergue in mid afternoon, there would be one or two people napping. Am I supposed to whisper in conversation to my companions and tiptoe around in order to not disturb them? I'm couteous, but I personally don't think we should have to accomodate the afternoon nappers when we arrive tired ourselves, unloading our packs, getting our shower gear together, etc.
Is my attitude inconsiderate? Maybe I'm opening a pandora's box by asking this question.
I have seen pilgrims do that a few times in albergues and often wonder why? Their equipment will be literally strewn about the floor in the space between the bunks where others walk. It really is rude, and I suppose impractical as you could lose or damage something that got kicked out of the way or stepped on by another pilgrim trying to negotiate through it.spread their equipment all over the floor (making getting to the toilet at night a hazard) .
I can't tell you how many people put their pack right at the bottom of the ladder to my upper bunk...I have seen pilgrims do that a few times in albergues and often wonder why? Their equipment will be literally strewn about the floor in the space between the bunks where others walk. It really is rude, and I suppose impractical as you could lose or damage something that got kicked out of the way or stepped on by another pilgrim trying to negotiate through it.
Any forum members ever do that (strewn it about) with their equipment and why?
No, I've never done this either, but I could have written your post verbatim, for all the same reasons. It's as if they don't respect their own gear and it usually seems to be the younger crowd doing this...I guess when mama and papa paid for it, the "kids" just don't care enough. Lol.I have seen pilgrims do that a few times in albergues and often wonder why? Their equipment will be literally strewn about the floor in the space between the bunks where others walk. It really is rude, and I suppose impractical as you could lose or damage something that got kicked out of the way or stepped on by another pilgrim trying to negotiate through it.
Any forum members ever do that (strewn it about) with their equipment and why?
I tend to think of Alburgue life as having the qualities of summer camp, without a counselor to keep some semblance of order. Without a resident monitor to enforce things like noise limitations and lights out curfews, one is at the mercy of Obliviots. Sometimes the Obliviots are few and far between, at other times you feel like you are between a gaggle of Obliviots. Sometimes peer pressure from the group keeps the Obliviots at bay, at other times it seems the peer group is content to let the Obliviots bay.
It seems that any discussions wishing or hoping for even minimum standards of behavior and expectations, draws criticisms by those who include any such discussion as imposing on the vaporously undefined notion of "My Camino". To be sure, there is a definite and positive rationale for respecting the concept of "My Camino"; but should that not also include discouraging negative behaviors which Obliviots impose on others?
Thankfully, most here on this forum counsel novice pilgrims on those types of behaviors to avoid when in a group setting. But there are still those voices which will tell the pilgrim, who is frustrated by Obliviot behavior, to just suck it up because that annoyance is your problem. And to a certain extent I agree, in that how we handle that annoyance is the individual's issue.
So, thankfully, much of the Obliviot problem is not going to be consistent; but it must be <sigh> expected. To avoid this, there are other choices for accommodations to provide needed respite. Yes, that makes the Camino budget more expensive; and it does nothing to discourage Obliviot behaviors from expanding with the passing years. It seems that, like bedbugs, Obliviots are simply part of the Camino picture.
Does Permethrin work to ward off Obliviots?
Hi everyone,
I am not intending to rage or start arguments, but I am posting this so people can be aware.
It may be hard to share a space such as an albergue with other people. Where do we cross the line between what we want to do and other's personal space? As delicate as this can be, I believe that normal education and common sense are key. So, posing the scenario of several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
We are in the camino as we are in life is, for me, one of the most real sayings about the camino. I guess that if you are rude, selfish and not aware of your surroundings, this is the kind of situation that you will create. People will sing together, dinner together and share this life time experience. But I guess that at the end of the day, if you don't care about others, this is what you are gonna do.
I am just appealing to some common sense to be used. Some good manners would be appreciated. People have all afternoon to prepare their rucksacks and put things they need aside. This is also why flashlights were created. But no. Just turning the volume up and wake up everyone for no reason whatsoever. Excuse if I sound angry, but I am. Just so rude.
Or "usually in hostels people don't use loud audible alarms".I have been in hostels with people who seemed to have no sense of "hostel etiquette" and very kindly try to teach them some. For example, "Typically in hostels, people leaving in the very early morning hours pack up before going to bed." Or, "Typically in hostels, quiet hours are from _ to _." This could be their first experience in communal living, so I think it can be helpful to make them more conscious.
...Sounds like something out of a Lucille Ball episode...We met a guy and his wife in their mid-late 60's; they would normally have been quite pleasant I think.
However he bought shoes that were too small, decided to walk barefoot, but that made him slower, so he started early. I mean early like 3-4am. He had other shoes with him (but was saving them? for what?)
In the comedy of errors that this was, he was also quite deaf.
So in the very early hours, he would wake, rustle, talk to his wife (very loudly because he was deaf), she would shhh him (loudly so he could hear). It would take them ages to get ready.
I think her shhhing was worse than his talking.
In no time the entire room would be awake, just waiting for them to leave.
They never turned the light on, one blessing.
We decided to walk a longer day, and ditch them, so I think did half the room. We never saw them again.
...Sounds like something out of a Lucille Ball episode...
I think that's one of the things that I love the most about the Camino - every day brings brand new possibilities!
I think that the best way to deal with people that annoy you is to try to put some distance between you, so that you never end up in the same albergue again! Either walk farther ahead, or let them get ahead of you.
I agree with you. I went through the same experience last year when I walked the Camino Portuguese. It was enjoyable from Lisbon, but from Porto onwards it was a completely different experience. I couldn’t wait to finish.Hi everyone,
I am not intending to rage or start arguments, but I am posting this so people can be aware.
It may be hard to share a space such as an albergue with other people. Where do we cross the line between what we want to do and other's personal space? As delicate as this can be, I believe that normal education and common sense are key. So, posing the scenario of several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
We are in the camino as we are in life is, for me, one of the most real sayings about the camino. I guess that if you are rude, selfish and not aware of your surroundings, this is the kind of situation that you will create. People will sing together, dinner together and share this life time experience. But I guess that at the end of the day, if you don't care about others, this is what you are gonna do.
I am just appealing to some common sense to be used. Some good manners would be appreciated. People have all afternoon to prepare their rucksacks and put things they need aside. This is also why flashlights were created. But no. Just turning the volume up and wake up everyone for no reason whatsoever. Excuse if I sound angry, but I am. Just so rude.
I agree with you. I went through the same experience last year when I walked the Camino Portuguese. It was enjoyable from Lisbon, but from Porto onwards it was a completely different experience. I couldn’t wait to finish
Hi everyone,
I am not intending to rage or start arguments, but I am posting this so people can be aware.
It may be hard to share a space such as an albergue with other people. Where do we cross the line between what we want to do and other's personal space? As delicate as this can be, I believe that normal education and common sense are key. So, posing the scenario of several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
We are in the camino as we are in life is, for me, one of the most real sayings about the camino. I guess that if you are rude, selfish and not aware of your surroundings, this is the kind of situation that you will create. People will sing together, dinner together and share this life time experience. But I guess that at the end of the day, if you don't care about others, this is what you are gonna do.
I am just appealing to some common sense to be used. Some good manners would be appreciated. People have all afternoon to prepare their rucksacks and put things they need aside. This is also why flashlights were created. But no. Just turning the volume up and wake up everyone for no reason whatsoever. Excuse if I sound angry, but I am. Just so rude.
I totally agree. Especially in the Albergue in Marinhas. We like to go to bed early as we’re pretty exhausted every day. It was shocking the lack of respect from other walkers. I wouldn’t call them pilgrims as real pilgrims would not behave like this. I think the protocol should be, arrive, find your bed, prepare your bed then go out. Don’t come in at 9/10pm and start making your bed. If you want to have a conversation outside the room,speak quietly not shout at each other. And if you see people sleeping when entering the room, try your best to close the door quietly instead of throwing it shut. I don’t want to rain on anyone’s parade, and I’m perfectly fine with groups having a good time, but please be aware that there are other people than you. It’s shameful and I’m embarrassed for those people. They seem to miss the whole point of a pilgrimage. Rant over.
Maybe this is what's addictive about the Camino. You can't do this in your regular life.
The thing is, you're in SPAIN and in SPAIN, their 10 pm is like OUR 7 pm.
Even the children are out in the streets playing at 10 pm.
Earplugs or private lodging or walking in the off season are the only answers I can think of.
No expectations.
so you saying people shouldn’t be respectful towards others? Isn’t that missing the whole point of the camino? No one is saying anything about local children etc. And, not that it matters, but we’re in Portugal. And here, so far, there has not been any noise from the locals. Only other people in the albergue. I think what we are saying is, that there is a lack of respect from fellow travellers which is totally unessary.
so you saying people shouldn’t be respectful towards others? Isn’t that missing the whole point of the camino?
I kno lots of people are so rude and they lack so much etiquette.Hi everyone,
I am not intending to rage or start arguments, but I am posting this so people can be aware.
It may be hard to share a space such as an albergue with other people. Where do we cross the line between what we want to do and other's personal space? As delicate as this can be, I believe that normal education and common sense are key. So, posing the scenario of several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
We are in the camino as we are in life is, for me, one of the most real sayings about the camino. I guess that if you are rude, selfish and not aware of your surroundings, this is the kind of situation that you will create. People will sing together, dinner together and share this life time experience. But I guess that at the end of the day, if you don't care about others, this is what you are gonna do.
I am just appealing to some common sense to be used. Some good manners would be appreciated. People have all afternoon to prepare their rucksacks and put things they need aside. This is also why flashlights were created. But no. Just turning the volume up and wake up everyone for no reason whatsoever. Excuse if I sound angry, but I am. Just so rude.
I believe you’re missing the point here. I can only speak from my experience in the last 4 days here in Portugal. And no one turned any lights off at 7/7.30pm as there would be no point as it is still light outside. There have been no school children playing outside. In fact, there have been no children whatsoever. Or many adults for that matter. We’re walking the coastal route so I can only speak of that. So I’m wondering if you are saying it is inconsiderate of me to be tired at what you might consider an early hour? I’m very happy for anyone who can afford a private room. Thus far they’ve been around €40 a night. I’m pleased for anyone who can afford that. Unfortunately I can’t. I think the point here is that yes, I’m sleeping in an albergue and might pay as little as €5. So I’m not coming in with much expectations. All I’m saying is that itd be nice if people would be a bit more considered. I know i would be if I’d come into a room and find you asleep. But that’s just me.Is it not also inconsiderate of those 1 or 2 who go to bed at 7-7.30pm turn all the lights out and expect everyone else staying in the room to fumble around in the dark when returning from dinner before 8pm. Often there is a posted 'lights out' time. Then that that should be the expected lights out time. Others may need to use eye covers and ear plugs if retiring very early or getting up late. My 2c worth.
Amen. Exactly the point I tried to bring across! Well said!ah bless having read all the posts has made me chuckle.we need a thread to educate people about pilgrim behaviour,whether you class yourself as a pilgrim or not.
i have walked several different camino"s and it is usually the first night that is the worst.
when arriving at your chosen albergue,firstly sort out your bed.then sort out what you will be wearing the rest of the day and tomorrow .shower and do any washing that needs to be done.sort any medical problems,ie blisters,sore spots ect out.relax and unwind.
in the evening have your next day clothes ready and when you get into bed,make sure that the next day clothes are the only things out.
wake up at your chosen time and if need be use your head torch on its single setting,so as not to imitate a lighthouse.
if possible take your clothes/kit outside into another room and get dressed.leave the albergue quietly.
i have found most people settle into albergue routine very quickly,if not a quiet word to help them i have found to be very welcome.
you will always find that people have their own views and it seems to me that a healthy dose of common sense and an even bigger dollop of humour is essential.
if you find a really annoying group,try to avoid the first albergue you come too that evening and go for the next of my favourite is to walk to the furthest one on the edge of town.most people aim for the first one or one near a bar.
i sleep like the proverbial log and have slept through a minor earthquake whilst in a nunnery,whilst everyone else dashed outside.
we all learn things about ourselves and others on the camino,let us keep positive and thankful.
So very well put, thank you.Rebekkah said it best...
Collecting sellos, pondering payment, wondering over the worthiness of the person asking for support, measuring your church offering according to the building's degree of decoration... it is all a very transactional approach to the pilgrimage. I give you this, I get that. I shop for months in advance, ask everyone which is the Best albergue, route, shoes, socks, prayers, airline, and guidebook. and if my expectations are not met, I complain on the Forum.
Beyond all this noise and preoccupation about Getting and Spending is the truly amazing truth about the Camino, maybe the thing that makes it so special. The Camino trail itself may have become a grab-that-cash theme park in places, but the pilgrim economy, practiced by the pilgrim community, is not based on transactions. It runs on Grace.
Something for nothing. Beauty, kindness, acceptance, brotherhood, in exchange for... just showing up, just walking. Just being what you are is enough. Just a place out of the rain, a bocadillo, a glass of tinto is enough. Yes, you are expected to pay your way. And you have so many opportunities to help others make their way, too -- and you find your heart is open, and your wallet is, too, and you can afford it just fine.
If you don't get a great bunk in the recommended albergue, your heart does not break.
If you have to walk another couple of km., you survive. Someone gives you his lower bunk, or lends you a sleeping mat, or tells you where there's a nice haystack. You give your last Compeed to the boy with shredded toes, and you don't fret about having enough for yourself. You walk freely. Free. It's grace. You find it on the Camino.
And when you get home, you realize it's there, too. It always has been. Even after your credential with all the fancy stamps is lost in a drawer, you still can give and receive without judging or fearing the other, because you are free. You've met grace, and she lives in you now.
I hike quite a lot in the Alps and stay at mountain huts. Almost universally it's lights out and quiet at 22:00 and it's enforced. Of course you could be bunking next to a climber who is up at 3:00 to make a summit ascent!Hi everyone,
I am not intending to rage or start arguments, but I am posting this so people can be aware.
It may be hard to share a space such as an albergue with other people. Where do we cross the line between what we want to do and other's personal space? As delicate as this can be, I believe that normal education and common sense are key. So, posing the scenario of several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
We are in the camino as we are in life is, for me, one of the most real sayings about the camino. I guess that if you are rude, selfish and not aware of your surroundings, this is the kind of situation that you will create. People will sing together, dinner together and share this life time experience. But I guess that at the end of the day, if you don't care about others, this is what you are gonna do.
I am just appealing to some common sense to be used. Some good manners would be appreciated. People have all afternoon to prepare their rucksacks and put things they need aside. This is also why flashlights were created. But no. Just turning the volume up and wake up everyone for no reason whatsoever. Excuse if I sound angry, but I am. Just so rude.
If only.........<3I tend to think of Alburgue life as having the qualities of summer camp, without a counselor to keep some semblance of order. Without a resident monitor to enforce things like noise limitations and lights out curfews, one is at the mercy of Obliviots. Sometimes the Obliviots are few and far between, at other times you feel like you are between a gaggle of Obliviots. Sometimes peer pressure from the group keeps the Obliviots at bay, at other times it seems the peer group is content to let the Obliviots bay.
It seems that any discussions wishing or hoping for even minimum standards of behavior and expectations, draws criticisms by those who include any such discussion as imposing on the vaporously undefined notion of "My Camino". To be sure, there is a definite and positive rationale for respecting the concept of "My Camino"; but should that not also include discouraging negative behaviors which Obliviots impose on others?
Thankfully, most here on this forum counsel novice pilgrims on those types of behaviors to avoid when in a group setting. But there are still those voices which will tell the pilgrim, who is frustrated by Obliviot behavior, to just suck it up because that annoyance is your problem. And to a certain extent I agree, in that how we handle that annoyance is the individual's issue.
So, thankfully, much of the Obliviot problem is not going to be consistent; but it must be <sigh> expected. To avoid this, there are other choices for accommodations to provide needed respite. Yes, that makes the Camino budget more expensive; and it does nothing to discourage Obliviot behaviors from expanding with the passing years. It seems that, like bedbugs, Obliviots are simply part of the Camino picture.
Does Permethrin work to ward off Obliviots?
I keep being grateful for all the blessings of « my » camino in 2013: I never encountered such rudeness except at the very end in Fisterra. Would a gentle grandmotherly nudge work, or would it generate anger in addition to rudeness?I hike quite a lot in the Alps and stay at mountain huts. Almost universally it's lights out and quiet at 22:00 and it's enforced. Of course you could be bunking next to a climber who is up at 3:00 to make a summit ascent!
I sometimes wonder why some people walk the Camino. Perhaps they gain an awareness of how disrespectful they can be!Hi everyone,
I am not intending to rage or start arguments, but I am posting this so people can be aware.
It may be hard to share a space such as an albergue with other people. Where do we cross the line between what we want to do and other's personal space? As delicate as this can be, I believe that normal education and common sense are key. So, posing the scenario of several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
We are in the camino as we are in life is, for me, one of the most real sayings about the camino. I guess that if you are rude, selfish and not aware of your surroundings, this is the kind of situation that you will create. People will sing together, dinner together and share this life time experience. But I guess that at the end of the day, if you don't care about others, this is what you are gonna do.
I am just appealing to some common sense to be used. Some good manners would be appreciated. People have all afternoon to prepare their rucksacks and put things they need aside. This is also why flashlights were created. But no. Just turning the volume up and wake up everyone for no reason whatsoever. Excuse if I sound angry, but I am. Just so rude.
Well said, pilgrim.I find it useless and frustrating to worry about the actions of others.
ah bless having read all the posts has made me chuckle.we need a thread to educate people about pilgrim behaviour,whether you class yourself as a pilgrim or not.
i have walked several different camino"s and it is usually the first night that is the worst.
when arriving at your chosen albergue,firstly sort out your bed.then sort out what you will be wearing the rest of the day and tomorrow .shower and do any washing that needs to be done.sort any medical problems,ie blisters,sore spots ect out.relax and unwind.
in the evening have your next day clothes ready and when you get into bed,make sure that the next day clothes are the only things out.
wake up at your chosen time and if need be use your head torch on its single setting,so as not to imitate a lighthouse.
if possible take your clothes/kit outside into another room and get dressed.leave the albergue quietly.
i have found most people settle into albergue routine very quickly,if not a quiet word to help them i have found to be very welcome.
you will always find that people have their own views and it seems to me that a healthy dose of common sense and an even bigger dollop of humour is essential.
if you find a really annoying group,try to avoid the first albergue you come too that evening and go for the next of my favourite is to walk to the furthest one on the edge of town.most people aim for the first one or one near a bar.
i sleep like the proverbial log and have slept through a minor earthquake whilst in a nunnery,whilst everyone else dashed outside.
we all learn things about ourselves and others on the camino,let us keep positive and thankful.
Hi everyone,
I am not intending to rage or start arguments, but I am posting this so people can be aware.
It may be hard to share a space such as an albergue with other people. Where do we cross the line between what we want to do and other's personal space? As delicate as this can be, I believe that normal education and common sense are key. So, posing the scenario of several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
We are in the camino as we are in life is, for me, one of the most real sayings about the camino. I guess that if you are rude, selfish and not aware of your surroundings, this is the kind of situation that you will create. People will sing together, dinner together and share this life time experience. But I guess that at the end of the day, if you don't care about others, this is what you are gonna do.
I am just appealing to some common sense to be used. Some good manners would be appreciated. People have all afternoon to prepare their rucksacks and put things they need aside. This is also why flashlights were created. But no. Just turning the volume up and wake up everyone for no reason whatsoever. Excuse if I sound angry, but I am. Just so rude.
I've only experienced rude, loud people coming in late at the curfew a few times on three Caminos, and it was mostly the vino tinto talking.
Lights in the morning were usually turned on at 6am, but most early risers did whisper and tried to be quiet. If I wasn't ready to get up, my ear plugs kept most of the noise out anyway and I just tucked my head under my sleeping bag and fell back asleep.
I do have a question though....Often when I would reach the albergue in mid afternoon, there would be one or two people napping. Am I supposed to whisper in conversation to my companions and tiptoe around in order to not disturb them? I'm couteous, but I personally don't think we should have to accomodate the afternoon nappers when we arrive tired ourselves, unloading our packs, getting our shower gear together, etc.
Is my attitude inconsiderate? Maybe I'm opening a pandora's box by asking this question.
Wow you were staying with saints?Maybe I was just lucky but I've never experienced bad inconsiderate behaviour in the albergues on my journeys, I've only stayed in the Municipal and found them ok, some better than others, but the other guests have all been really nice and considerate.
I'm sorry you haven't experienced this.
so you are saying because they are walking for different reasons they are allowed to do what ever they please? I am about to do my 10th. Camino and it seems the 5 AM risers are always there no matter the rules . The only place where there is total consideration is the former Le' sprit du chemin. They have no wifi in the Albergue and no one leaves before 6 it's a rule. This Albergue is still one of the best places to stay and get a good nite sleep. The former owners were ber concerned with how the first nite was spent there. I was a hospitalero there in 2010 for 2 weeks.Portugal is even worse. (I'm Portuguese!)
When we visit there, people in cars come honking to pick us up for dinner at 11 pm!
I'm not saying people should not be respectful.
I'm saying you cannot control other people's behavior and if you think you will do that by complaining in a forum, you're in for a sad life. The only person you can change is YOU.
Noise is a part of Camino life in albergues.
Which is why I book private rooms these days.
And frankly, there IS no one point of the Camino.
People walk for many different reasons.
so you are saying because they are walking for different reasons they are allowed to do what ever they please? I am about to do my 10th. Camino and it seems the 5 AM risers are always there no matter the rules . The only place where there is total consideration is the former Le' sprit du chemin. They have no wifi in the Albergue and no one leaves before 6 it's a rule. This Albergue is still one of the best places to stay and get a good nite sleep. The former owners were ber concerned with how the first nite was spent there. I was a hospitalero there in 2010 for 2 weeks.
I totally agree. Especially in the Albergue in Marinhas. We like to go to bed early as we’re pretty exhausted every day. It was shocking the lack of respect from other walkers. I wouldn’t call them pilgrims as real pilgrims would not behave like this. I think the protocol should be, arrive, find your bed, prepare your bed then go out. Don’t come in at 9/10pm and start making your bed. If you want to have a conversation outside the room,speak quietly not shout at each other. And if you see people sleeping when entering the room, try your best to close the door quietly instead of throwing it shut. I don’t want to rain on anyone’s parade, and I’m perfectly fine with groups having a good time, but please be aware that there are other people than you. It’s shameful and I’m embarrassed for those people. They seem to miss the whole point of a pilgrimage. Rant over.
Portugal is even worse. (I'm Portuguese!)
When we visit there, people in cars come honking to pick us up for dinner at 11 pm!
I'm not saying people should not be respectful.
I'm saying you cannot control other people's behavior and if you think you will do that by complaining in a forum, you're in for a sad life. The only person you can change is YOU.
Noise is a part of Camino life in albergues.
Which is why I book private rooms these days.
And frankly, there IS no one point of the Camino.
People walk for many different reasons.
Nobody said that you should be able to control other's behaviour. And saying that complaining in a forum is a sad thing is so only because you do not agree, which you are entitled to.
But the forum does not exist, and no forum exists only for discussing the good.
Yes, I learned a long time ago, you cannot change other people, you can change how you respond or feel.No. As I said before, I'm not saying people should not be respectful.
I'm saying you cannot control other people's behavior. The only person you can change is YOU.
I'm one of those who rise early in the morning and have a bit of a rest in the afternoon as most people arrive. I 100% would NOT expect people to stay quiet during the day time to accommodate my schedule. If the sun is still shining, make as much noise as you want.I've only experienced rude, loud people coming in late at the curfew a few times on three Caminos, and it was mostly the vino tinto talking.
Lights in the morning were usually turned on at 6am, but most early risers did whisper and tried to be quiet. If I wasn't ready to get up, my ear plugs kept most of the noise out anyway and I just tucked my head under my sleeping bag and fell back asleep.
I do have a question though....Often when I would reach the albergue in mid afternoon, there would be one or two people napping. Am I supposed to whisper in conversation to my companions and tiptoe around in order to not disturb them? I'm couteous, but I personally don't think we should have to accomodate the afternoon nappers when we arrive tired ourselves, unloading our packs, getting our shower gear together, etc.
Is my attitude inconsiderate? Maybe I'm opening a pandora's box by asking this question.
Somewhat related source of aggravation - litter.
Just finished Burgos-León stretch. Seemed cleaner than my earlier Camino Francés walks. So maybe people who have previously tossed tissues, tp, etc., are becoming more considerate. Hope so.
Tom
I often wondered the same. To me it seems pretty normal that a dorm in an albergue is dark and quiet somewhere between 9.30pm and 6.30am (depending a little bit on the season and the heat). But if people also close curtains and ask for silence in the middle of the afternoon, what moment is left then to make your bed and organize your pack?I do have a question though....Often when I would reach the albergue in mid afternoon, there would be one or two people napping. Am I supposed to whisper in conversation to my companions and tiptoe around in order to not disturb them? I'm couteous, but I personally don't think we should have to accomodate the afternoon nappers when we arrive tired ourselves, unloading our packs, getting our shower gear together, etc.
Is my attitude inconsiderate? Maybe I'm opening a pandora's box by asking this question.
I totally agree with your post. In fact I had to edit my post above to say we should NOT have to tiptoe around the albergue in the afternoon while people take naps, and yes, they often are out late and/or up early because of that.@Camino Chris First of all, I am joking. Second, I mean, my fellow pilgrims should be tired enough to want to go to bed before 10pm and to sleep at least until 6am ;-) If they nap for 2 hours in the middle of the day chances are that they can do with less sleep during the night.
several, and I mean several, people already fast asleep in a room, would it be ok for most of you fellow pilgrims, just to enter said room blasting, talking really loud, turning on the lights ans basically waking up everyone? Would it be ok if I wake up like at 5am and do the same, just turn on the lights and wake everybody up?
though i noticed first wondering Mr. Jones senior chopper avatar...budget more expensive;
suddenly...suddenly i missed a church in dubai where once ur inside automatically shuts your internet and even phone signals.turned off at 10 pm and on again 6 am next morning.
Expressing our outrage here, be it over poop ... right into the face of the generator might get more results. Just saying.
It might be like monkeys in a zoo...I'm not going to volunteer to be the one to try it ...
I've done it a few times, with mixed results. But I felt better. You do what you can and then let go of the outcome.though I'm not going to volunteer to be the one to try it ...
Depends. Calm, kind, but very clear boundary setting has better results than venting one's (understandable) irritation or outrage. There is such a thing as violent communication and then there's non-violent communication. The latter works a whole lot better than the former.It might be like monkeys in a zoo...
I totally disagree with you.I agree, I often find that the people who go to sleep the earliest, snore the loudest, wake up the earliest and make the most noise sorting their bag which they could’ve done the afternoon before!!
I’m completely with you here. Consideration should go both ways and expecting those who start walking later or finish later to be stumbling around in a darkened room at 8 or even 9pm is equally selfish. By all means go to bed but don’t turn off the lights in a passive aggressive manner. Too often I’ve gone to dinner and got back around 8:30 to find the place in darkness and then been sssssh’d because I can’t find anything in the dark - usually by the ones who then leave at 5am after waking everyone else with their carrier bag rustling !!Is it not also inconsiderate of those 1 or 2 who go to bed at 7-7.30pm turn all the lights out and expect everyone else staying in the room to fumble around in the dark when returning from dinner before 8pm. Often there is a posted 'lights out' time. Then that that should be the expected lights out time. Others may need to use eye covers and ear plugs if retiring very early or getting up late. My 2c worth.
Take a sleep mask, also very handy on the airplane flights to and from, and the room lights become a non-issue. If you do what you can, you do not have to rely on other people doing what they can. Ditto earplugs.don’t turn off the lights in a passive aggressive manner
I encountered couples and individuals on this years Camino that do not stay in Albergues but simply stay in private places. I myself have also on this Camino have stayed in a lot of private spots my own small room and privacy. I will stay in albergues as long as they are small and few people. I enjoy people but not in my sleeping area although have met many great people in albergues...some of us just like to have privacy and the Camino allows for that.so you are saying because they are walking for different reasons they are allowed to do what ever they please? I am about to do my 10th. Camino and it seems the 5 AM risers are always there no matter the rules . The only place where there is total consideration is the former Le' sprit du chemin. They have no wifi in the Albergue and no one leaves before 6 it's a rule. This Albergue is still one of the best places to stay and get a good nite sleep. The former owners were ber concerned with how the first nite was spent there. I was a hospitalero there in 2010 for 2 weeks.
Lights, camera, action, scene 4 take 1.Sorry but that scenario would have had me in stitches laughing.
A few do, but don't expect the practice to catch on. Enforcement is scanty. Many hospitaleros are gone by bedtime.I would hope that Spanish Albergues would post quiet hours.
I think I met her too !!!Though I often post thoughtful, "live and let live" messages here or say things like Falcon said, "I find it useless and frustrating to worry about the actions of others." I wish that were true for me! But ACTUALLY in real life, I often allow myself to get incredibly annoyed, indignant and judgmental about the actions of others. I do start every day on the camino fresh, but then the next day some group of asses will inevitably take up the whole laundry line with their towels splayed out horizontally so nobody else can use the line. They will whisper loudly (which for some reason drives me even much crazier than when people talk out loud). They will stink up the dorm with strong-smelling foot ointments. Etc. The only thing that relieves the tension for me is my sense of humor. It's the only thing I seem to have control over (*most* of the time); the choice between being angry or laughing.
In one albergue, I was happy to be put in a room with only three beds. And only one of the other beds was occupied! But it was occupied by a woman who talked to herself while unpacking little plastic bags from her pack, sorting out all kinds of little things on her bed, repacking them and then repeating this again and again. I tried to get a good look at what she was doing and how she was sorting her little gadgets, because I was writing it all up in my journal. I almost couldn't wait to meet up with somebody I knew the next evening so I could tell this story. And, amazingly enough, the friend I ran into the next day HAD SPENT A NIGHT NEXT TO THIS SAME PERSON IN AN ALBERGUE A COUPLE OF NIGHTS BEFORE. We laughed so hard.
I know this doesn't sound kind, but it works for me.
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