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Ooo thanks for the Wise Pilgrim tip - I'm going to buy that - seems to be exactly what I need - once you buy it do they keep updating it?
Buen Camino! Follow your guide book but stop in the village/town just after or much better just before the recommended stages. May take a shorter day to set it up but it is a better option since most will pass you by galloping on to the next stop. Semana Santa is busy busy, lots of people on vacation since walking the Camino as a cheap holiday, it will thin out after Easter. Spain in the springtime is wonderful (!) gardens blooming in the towns and a myriad of wildflowers all along the Camino. Cool weather in the morning to make starting off walking at a faster pace in order to warm up, not too warm come afternoons to enjoy the walk.
Another great app is the Buen Camino app.https://www.editorialbuencamino.com/app-del-camino-de-santiago/ The website is in Spanish, but the app will be in English.
Another great resource is Gronze.com
If you use the Google Chrome browser to view Gronze you can set it to automatically translate to English.Yes I've found Gonze - I have enough Spanish to follow the simple stuff - particularly reading - I'm sure my speaking is very rusty - might have to study up a bit before we go. Will check out that app too - thanks
The older way across the mountains from St Jean goes through Valcarlos and up a valley. The actual 'alternate route' (the newer Napoleon) has thanks to Hollywood become the one everyone thinks to be the 'real' one.You don't have to do the Napolean route, if you want to avoid the snow.
It's good to be aware of this but don't worry about it too much. The panicky online threads can be misleading. As far as I can tell, the real bottleneck around Easter and 1 May is the section Roncesvalles-Pamplona.What is doing my head in is working out what to do about Easter (WHY didn't we do this year - when it was conveniently early). I'm assuming public holidays will mean we'll need reservations - I don't want to reserve - I want to be able to stop when my legs say enough! We don't have to stay in albergues - we can afford pensions and hotels if necessary - I'd like to keep accommodation under EUR50/night (for 2) if possible. We prefer to mix up accommodation and get a variety. Starting at SJPP on about 8 April 2019 - would see us hit Maundy Thursday at around Najera?
Semana Santa is the week before Easter a time of celebrations, processions, and a good time is had by all.Well I was figuring it would be like camping in Australia in the winter -freezing cold in the morning - so you stay in bed until it warms up - laughing at the silly people getting up a dawn! Semana Santa is the week before Easter right?
Keep an eye on regional holidays. Maundy Thursday as a public holiday caught us by surprise. And Easter Monday wasn't one. But, honestly, many pilgrims don't even notice when it's a regional or national holiday.
You will not have a problem finding accommodations in April. Everything will be open, and there are lots of beds. Even the holidays will not present a problem.
If you are representing your physical condition accurately, do not try to hike 20 km per day the first couple of weeks. That is close to the journeyman distance!! The continuous walking will wear you down after the first three or four days, and you will need to let your muscles and joints catch up with you. Settle for 6-10 km if you need to.
If you fall behind schedule, there are plenty of buses and trains to move you ahead. If you decide on taxis, I suggest starting the day in one. Taxis may be hard to find mid-stage, particularly if you do not speak enough Spanish to tell a driver where you are. Taxis are available at hoteles, hostales, and albergues at the beginning of the day, and they will drop you anywhere on the way to your next destinations. Drivers know the Camino and all the points that it crosses roads and streets.
Many Spaniards eat their big meal midday. However, that mostly is in the cities. In the small villages you find the midday fare is sandwiches (bocadillos) or lighter food. In restaurants the midday meal may not begin until 1 p.m., though noon is also popular. The midday break ends by about 3 p.m. after which the kitchen may not open until 8 or 9 p.m. Openings are earlier in restaurants that cater to pilgrims because they know that they want to beat and be in bed by 10 p.m. In the big cities the Spanish begin showing up for dinner around 9 p.m., so the good restaurants may not open until then.
Buen camino.
Semana Santa is the week before Easter a time of celebrations, processions, and a good time is had by all.
Buen Camino! Follow your guide book but stop in the village/town just after or much better just before the recommended stages. May take a shorter day to set it up but it is a better option since most will pass you by galloping on to the next stop. Semana Santa is busy busy, lots of people on vacation since walking the Camino as a cheap holiday, it will thin out after Easter. Spain in the springtime is wonderful (!) gardens blooming in the towns and a myriad of wildflowers all along the Camino. Cool weather in the morning to make starting off walking at a faster pace in order to warm up, not too warm come afternoons to enjoy the walk.
I recommend that you figure that out before being on the Camino! It is the wrong place to discover anything new (except scenery, food, and people). Know how far you can walk before you leave. Know how your backpack feels under load. Know how you footwear fits with pack and a repetitive step. Know which joints will be a problem. It is a lot more fun if you are not in agony.To be honest I don't know how many kms we can walk a day
I recommend that you figure that out before being on the Camino! It is the wrong place to discover anything new (except scenery, food, and people). Know how far you can walk before you leave. Know how your backpack feels under load. Know how you footwear fits with pack and a repetitive step. Know which joints will be a problem. It is a lot more fun if you are not in agony.Discomfort, yes. Misery, no.
Lissie45,
Take your time! Start slow. If you are not doing much hill training before going, maybe consider the Valcarlos route. you stlll have a big climb, but you will save your knees on the downhill as you will not have as dramatic a downhill. Ease into the Camino. If when you are ready to begin your camino, the hills seem to much, take a taxi, shuttle or bus to Roncevalles. Or walk to Valcarlos and pick up transport there.There are buses and taxis you can take if you need to, especially at the beginnng.- so do not overdue it. Find your pace. Do not worry about how many Kms you can do now. You are not going till next Spring. Keep walking. Try and find some hills to walk on or use a treadmill and try to get up to a sustained grade that will help you build up the muscles. You have time. When you start send your pack ahead to Roncevalles. Many folks do it...it eases the stress on the joints and heart.
I have seen a number of folks try to do to much in the beginning and ruin the whole Camino. Yes there are some folks who can go on the Camino and walk there way to a decent rhythm and pace without training. I am not one of them. I need to put in the training time or I will be miserable walking for numerous reasons. You sound like you need to put time in as well? Good luck!
You are quite right! The best training for a Camino is a camino...So what I mean is that all the training in the world is not the same as actually doing a long trip.
You are quite right! The best training for a Camino is a camino...
Well, that would be a deal breaker for sure!and even sometimes lack vino tinto
Just because the widely sold guidebooks start in the lovely town of SJPdP doesn't mean you need to. And if Pyrenees is a dream, you can always go back at the end and do SJPdP to Pamplona.
IMO Paris CDG is one of the most congested airports. After my RLStevenson plus a few days in Paris, it took 2 hours to get seat assignments and another 45 minutes to pass security and walk to gate; just made the last boarding call.
And Pamplona is hard to get to from CDG (as is SJPdP). French and Spanish use different rail gauges--methinks 4 legs/transfers: CDG-Bayonne alone is a 7 hour train.
Use MAD as entry port (Hipmunk shows RT of $959 from AUK-MAD on Qatar--the direct Pamplona bus leaves same terminal T4.
And check cost of open jaw if you must do Paris--ie NZ-MAD; CDG-NZ. Pamplona is a nice layover city and albergues at intervals of 4.8, 6.1, 5.9, 2.7, 1.8, 2.5 km to make a flexible and short start. (from Wise Pilgrim app).
The idea of starting in Pamplona and coming back for the mountains at the end is a good one.I have a fantasy about climbing the Pyrenees - but if the weather is closed in there's no point, and Varcarlos doesn't sound like a bad option at all - and I know its the historical route. There's also no way we'd do Roncevalles in one day - we'll break it into 2 staying at either Varcarlos or Ormisson. We are a right pair at the moment actually - my partner struggles with up hill and altitude (cardiac issues) I struggle with downhills (osteoarthritic knees) so I'm very aware that we need to take it easy or we won't be going anywhere. And because we're flying some 30-40 odd hours to get to Europe in the first place, its not like we can just come back later and continue
It is worse than even New Delhi...Heathrow is definitely the worst!
It is worse than even New Delhi...
There's a reason Qatar is cheap - its a 16 hour direct flight AKL-Doha
I'm hoping to average 20km over the whole trip - I'd prefer it was less but 20km day x 800 km is already 40 days - throw in a day off a week on average - I'm up to 47
I didn't realise buses left direct from Barajas
I'd rather have a main meal with the locals at lunch time and then arrive later in the day after that, and just do tapas in the evenings.
Varcarlos doesn't sound like a bad option at all
I'm sure my speaking is very rusty - might have to study up a bit before we go. Will check out that app too - thanks
simple google ;
Camino Madrid Terminal to Pamplona .
If you do this you will be completed by 35 days.
We stop at lunch [ noon -12.30 pm] find the restaurant where ALL the local farmers eat [ yes they come to their village and then return to the field ] and dine with them and eat what they eat.
You will see the old vans in front of a little house/shop in the village .
Suggest you look for the word "Comedor" which could be in their passage way or off the main eating room and go behind .......
No need , you will meet 30 plus different nationalities [yes keep a record] and the common language is ENGLISH.
Well I was figuring it would be like camping in Australia in the winter -freezing cold in the morning - so you stay in bed until it warms up - laughing at the silly people getting up a dawn!
I doubt that its the common language of the locals though? Rural Spain is very much not English speaking in my experience - is the Caminio different? I'm not saying Im fluent - but used to be able to - and need to revise so that I can do all the basic travel Spanish stuff
I went onto Muxia, which was an experience far different than the trek to Santiago.
I spent Easter in Santo Domingo de la Calzada, wonderful procession.
ISorry I know it sounds miles in advance - but its not when you need to buy airfares from New Zealand! We are old and fat with some health issues - I don't expect to walk more than 20km day maximum, we are also tourists and want to spend extra days in the bigger towns - we love Spain - but have never been to this part though.
What is doing my head in is working out what to do about Easter (WHY didn't we do this year - when it was conveniently early). I'm assuming public holidays will mean we'll need reservations - I don't want to reserve - I want to be able to stop when my legs say enough! We don't have to stay in albergues - we can afford pensions and hotels if necessary - I'd like to keep accommodation under EUR50/night (for 2) if possible. We prefer to mix up accommodation and get a variety.
Starting at SJPP on about 8 April 2019 - would see us hit Maundy Thursday at around Najera? Would that be OK - smaller towns? Stay between stages (I assume the Gonze stages are to be avoided as well as the briely ones) To complicate matters everything I read about the Pilgrim menus puts me off - I'd rather have a main meal with the locals at lunch time and then arrive later in the day after that, and just do tapas in the evenings.
I guess my main questions are - staying off-stage will we be to just walk into town? Even around 5pm? Will there still be bars/restaurants open over the holiday? What about public transport?
Are there any other obscure holidays I need to worry about I know about 1 May - I think Asuncion has caught me out in Tahiti previously but I don't see it on this list https://publicholidays.es/es/2019-dates/
My other half is less than impressed about the pics of snow in the Pyrenees - our other option would be fly out of New Zealand around Good Friday - which would have us starting
Sorry I know it sounds miles in advance - but its not when you need to buy airfares from New Zealand! We are old and fat with some health issues - I don't expect to walk more than 20km day maximum, we are also tourists and want to spend extra days in the bigger towns - we love Spain - but have never been to this part though.
What is doing my head in is working out what to do about Easter (WHY didn't we do this year - when it was conveniently early). I'm assuming public holidays will mean we'll need reservations - I don't want to reserve - I want to be able to stop when my legs say enough! We don't have to stay in albergues - we can afford pensions and hotels if necessary - I'd like to keep accommodation under EUR50/night (for 2) if possible. We prefer to mix up accommodation and get a variety.
Starting at SJPP on about 8 April 2019 - would see us hit Maundy Thursday at around Najera? Would that be OK - smaller towns? Stay between stages (I assume the Gonze stages are to be avoided as well as the briely ones) To complicate matters everything I read about the Pilgrim menus puts me off - I'd rather have a main meal with the locals at lunch time and then arrive later in the day after that, and just do tapas in the evenings.
I guess my main questions are - staying off-stage will we be to just walk into town? Even around 5pm? Will there still be bars/restaurants open over the holiday? What about public transport?
Are there any other obscure holidays I need to worry about I know about 1 May - I think Asuncion has caught me out in Tahiti previously but I don't see it on this list https://publicholidays.es/es/2019-dates/
My other half is less than impressed about the pics of snow in the Pyrenees - our other option would be fly out of New Zealand around Good Friday - which would have us starting around 22/23 April - would that put us out of sync with the group who are working over Easter? Or do locals not walk over Easter because they are doing the religious thing - and therefore it would be a good time to be walking? Would starting 2 weeks later make much difference in the weather?
Sorry I know I'm over-thinking it - but its pretty hard - economically we have to book return airfares which are not at all flexible - so once we have the dates we're stuck with them.
around 22/23 April - would that put us out of sync with the group who are working over Easter? Or do locals not walk over Easter because they are doing the religious thing - and therefore it would be a good time to be walking? Would starting 2 weeks later make much difference in the weather?
Sorry I know I'm over-thinking it - but its pretty hard - economically we have to book return airfares which are not at all flexible - so once we have the dates we're stuck with them.
I'm hoping to average 20km over the whole trip - I'd prefer it was less but 20km day x 800 km is already 40 days - throw in a day off a week on average - I'm up to 47! Given that a lot of people seem to complete it in 35 odd days as per "the book" - I thought doubling the time was being conservative? Not so? To be honest I don't know how many kms we can walk a day - well we can 10km now on the flat without packs - routinely do around 15km according to the pedometers when we travel - but not carrying any weight. I'm 56 my partner 66 - so it really is a bit of try it and see.
Thanks this is very helpful - I didn't know that about the difference between country and city Spain - I've mainly been in southern Spain and Madrid - and yeah nothing open until at least 9pm.
I'm thinking though at that early in the year there is no real need to be starting really early in the morning so eater later would be fine too. I assume its just he Municipals that have curfews? We'd be OK in private albergues and pensions?
@lissie45, do brush up on your rusty Spanish so that you can interact with locals and Spanish pilgrims in the language of the country you are in. You can easily walk for 30+ days in an expat bubble dominated by English but it's fun (and enriching in a different way) to break out of it from time to time.I doubt that its the common language of the locals though? Rural Spain is very much not English speaking in my experience - is the Caminio different? I'm not saying Im fluent - but used to be able to - and need to revise so that I can do all the basic travel Spanish stuff
The OP has already enough Spanish to follow simple stuff she says. To brush it up to have proper conversations with anyone would be just great.
My experience is much more limited than that of others but quite a number of shop/hostal/bar owners and employees who deal a lot with tourists/pilgrims in these towns can communicate efficiently in English.So I will be truly astounded if I can walk into a shop/hostal/bar in Leon or Burgos or Pamplona and speak English and expect to be understood! Has it changed that much in 18 years?
Me, too. I am grateful If a clerk in the Vodafone store speaks enough English to help me with a cell phone chip. I cannot think of a better way to ruin a camino than to expect anyone except fellow pilgrims to speak English. For other language-impaired pilgrims, louder is NOT clearer. By all means, repeat a request in the probably vain hope that you will be understood, but stay in your "indoor" voice!So I will be truly astounded if I can walk into a shop/hostal/bar in Leon or Burgos or Pamplona and speak English
Me, too. I am grateful If a clerk in the Vodafone store speaks enough English to help me with a cell phone chip. I cannot think of a better way to ruin a camino than to expect anyone except fellow pilgrims to speak English. For other language-impaired pilgrims, louder is NOT clearer. By all means, repeat a request in the probably vain hope that you will be understood, but stay in your "indoor" voice!
Along the first sections of the CF in Navarra, there were several owners of casas rurales etc who preferred to talk to me in French instead of English. That was also unexpected for me.
So I will be truly astounded if I can walk into a shop/hostal/bar in Leon or Burgos or Pamplona and speak English and expect to be understood! Has it changed that much in 18 years?
Hm, French isn't my preferred language of communication; it was the Spanish owners in Navarra who preferred French over English. I was disappointed to hear very little spoken Basque, both before and after the border. Just saw it mainly in written form.You might be in trouble here mate , no French spoken there .
I made the same mistake when walking from Le Puy when 3 days before StJPP .
i was reminded i had entered The Basque Country.
loud shouting idiots were obviously not worth his effort!
Sorry I know it sounds miles in advance - but its not when you need to buy airfares from New Zealand! We are old and fat with some health issues - I don't expect to walk more than 20km day maximum, we are also tourists and want to spend extra days in the bigger towns - we love Spain - but have never been to this part though.
What is doing my head in is working out what to do about Easter (WHY didn't we do this year - when it was conveniently early). I'm assuming public holidays will mean we'll need reservations - I don't want to reserve - I want to be able to stop when my legs say enough! We don't have to stay in albergues - we can afford pensions and hotels if necessary - I'd like to keep accommodation under EUR50/night (for 2) if possible. We prefer to mix up accommodation and get a variety.
Starting at SJPP on about 8 April 2019 - would see us hit Maundy Thursday at around Najera? Would that be OK - smaller towns? Stay between stages (I assume the Gonze stages are to be avoided as well as the briely ones) To complicate matters everything I read about the Pilgrim menus puts me off - I'd rather have a main meal with the locals at lunch time and then arrive later in the day after that, and just do tapas in the evenings.
I guess my main questions are - staying off-stage will we be to just walk into town? Even around 5pm? Will there still be bars/restaurants open over the holiday? What about public transport?
Are there any other obscure holidays I need to worry about I know about 1 May - I think Asuncion has caught me out in Tahiti previously but I don't see it on this list https://publicholidays.es/es/2019-dates/
My other half is less than impressed about the pics of snow in the Pyrenees - our other option would be fly out of New Zealand around Good Friday - which would have us starting around 22/23 April - would that put us out of sync with the group who are working over Easter? Or do locals not walk over Easter because they are doing the religious thing - and therefore it would be a good time to be walking? Would starting 2 weeks later make much difference in the weather?
Sorry I know I'm over-thinking it - but its pretty hard - economically we have to book return airfares which are not at all flexible - so once we have the dates we're stuck with them.
Hi LissieSorry I know it sounds miles in advance - but its not when you need to buy airfares from New Zealand! We are old and fat with some health issues - I don't expect to walk more than 20km day maximum, we are also tourists and want to spend extra days in the bigger towns - we love Spain - but have never been to this part though.
What is doing my head in is working out what to do about Easter (WHY didn't we do this year - when it was conveniently early). I'm assuming public holidays will mean we'll need reservations - I don't want to reserve - I want to be able to stop when my legs say enough! We don't have to stay in albergues - we can afford pensions and hotels if necessary - I'd like to keep accommodation under EUR50/night (for 2) if possible. We prefer to mix up accommodation and get a variety.
Starting at SJPP on about 8 April 2019 - would see us hit Maundy Thursday at around Najera? Would that be OK - smaller towns? Stay between stages (I assume the Gonze stages are to be avoided as well as the briely ones) To complicate matters everything I read about the Pilgrim menus puts me off - I'd rather have a main meal with the locals at lunch time and then arrive later in the day after that, and just do tapas in the evenings.
I guess my main questions are - staying off-stage will we be to just walk into town? Even around 5pm? Will there still be bars/restaurants open over the holiday? What about public transport?
Are there any other obscure holidays I need to worry about I know about 1 May - I think Asuncion has caught me out in Tahiti previously but I don't see it on this list https://publicholidays.es/es/2019-dates/
My other half is less than impressed about the pics of snow in the Pyrenees - our other option would be fly out of New Zealand around Good Friday - which would have us starting around 22/23 April - would that put us out of sync with the group who are working over Easter? Or do locals not walk over Easter because they are doing the religious thing - and therefore it would be a good time to be walking? Would starting 2 weeks later make much difference in the weather?
Sorry I know I'm over-thinking it - but its pretty hard - economically we have to book return airfares which are not at all flexible - so once we have the dates we're stuck with them.
Have you decided if you are spending the night in Varcarlos because after that there are no options but to continue to Roncevalles. If you have found any reasonable Auberges could you please let me know we would like to spend the night there May 10th/2019This is exactly why I don't want to book in advance! I want to stay flexible so when the bodies say stop we do so. And that's not just about kilometers its also about weather. I feared for my life once when caught in a snow storm on the Everest trek - because I was trying to catch up with a group when I should have turned back.
I have a fantasy about climbing the Pyrenees - but if the weather is closed in there's no point, and Varcarlos doesn't sound like a bad option at all - and I know its the historical route. There's also no way we'd do Roncevalles in one day - we'll break it into 2 staying at either Varcarlos or Ormisson. We are a right pair at the moment actually - my partner struggles with up hill and altitude (cardiac issues) I struggle with downhills (osteoarthritic knees) so I'm very aware that we need to take it easy or we won't be going anywhere. And because we're flying some 30-40 odd hours to get to Europe in the first place, its not like we can just come back later and continue
We'll be doing lots of training in advance - I walked to Everest Base Camp with no training at all - but I was 29 then - and it still hurt quite a lot (and gave me the osteoarthritic knees !)
Have you decided if you are spending the night in Varcarlos because after that there are no options but to continue to Roncevalles. If you have found any reasonable Auberges could you please let me know we would like to spend the night there May 10th/2019
We’re not walking this year, my partner is having cardiac surgery next month. Hopefully next year.Have you decided if you are spending the night in Varcarlos because after that there are no options but to continue to Roncevalles. If you have found any reasonable Auberges could you please let me know we would like to spend the night there May 10th/2019
Thornley said:Walk to Orisson [ 3 hours ] and get a taxi back [ very little cost ] to St JPP . The next day , taxi back to Orisson and continue.
The cost of the albergue in STJPP will be well under the Orisson expenditure which means no extra cost and you are over stress free and better choice in meals for dinner.
In restaurants the midday meal may not begin until 1 p.m., though noon is also popular. The midday break ends by about 3 p.m. after which the kitchen may not open until 8 or 9 p.m. Openings are earlier in restaurants that cater to pilgrims because they know that they want to beat and be in bed by 10 p.m. In the big cities the Spanish begin showing up for dinner around 9 p.m., so the good restaurants may not open until then.
We’re not walking this year, my partner is having cardiac surgery next month. Hopefully next year.
I wouldn’t bother booking Valcarlos in May, there will be somewhere to stay I’m sure
I generally stay in Albergues, but reading this, it just occurred to me that this is a good reason to find a pension or hotel in the bigger cities. No curfew and you can leisurely sample the good restaurants.
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