camino on horseback

[peter fischer]

what are the costs and qualifications to do the camino on horseback and can the whole camino be done
like that or only partially?Peter

 

[GAUVINS]

We are renting donkeys. Donkeys can only carry 40kg (our daughter will ride). The cost from SJPP should be under 1000 euros.

Traveling with a donkey is fairly common and (we are told) not that complicated. Although not that simple either (for instance it is advised to not try the el norte because it crosses Iarge cities and requires ferry crossings).

Traveling with a horse is a different story. Horses require food and care. I don't know if you can rent them. I can ask the donkey owner if you want.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

Horses require food and care. I don't know if you can rent them. I can ask the donkey owner if you want.

And donkeys don't? Have only seen one donkey on route, so I wouldn's say it's fairly common. Sounds like a fun adventure though, but surely you can't just park a donkey like you do a car.

 

[GAUVINS]

You may want to read about donkeys.

1. Donkeys eat grass from any field. That plus water will get them going (horses need feed, i. e. more energetic food such as oats)

2. Every gîte is familiar with donkeys and I would say that about a third will welcome them. Unlike a car it will not be exactly where it was left, but is unlikely to run away (donkeys are said to be very tame. They bond with their owners.)

3. Donkeys are very easy to "operate". My 10 year old was able to lead a donkey through a thunderstorm, the day we went to see a farmer to become acquainted with these beasts. It would have been impossible (or dangerous) with a horse, which is much more powerful and nervous.

4. Clouteau writes that there are 200 donkey renters in France, and just a handful in the rest of Europe.

Spaniards are not found of donkeys. It is said that they associate them with extreme poverty (as - you still see donkeys used as labor animals in poor countries).

Brits tend to ridicule donkeys and/or their owners. There is a popular English book where the author talks about his (mis) adventures with a donkey, where the beast is described as a stubborn and uncooperative animal, with the kind of humour you can imagine.

French literature tends to describe donkeys as affectionate and intelligent animals. There has been a strong revival with the Pyrenees donkeys becoming increasingly common.

You write "fun adventure". Like walking the Camino I suppose.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

As I said, I have seen one donkey to date and have heard of a couple of others, so doable it is. Just like there are those walking with their dogs, but I doubt it's a "walk in the park" when it comes to taking care of the donkey. Where will it eat its grass from? Certainly in Spain many albergues do not have a spot of grass to offer, to eat or spend the night. I will look forward to reading about your adventure.

 

[Deleted member 3000]

While this thread is about horses, it is getting lots of donkey posts. To Gauvins I would say, most of what you have posted is not correct. I have not done the Camino with a donkey, but I have done a two week trek in the Sierra Nevada mountains with two donkeys. What you have read does not match with my experience. I grew up with Shetland ponies, and love the various equine animals, but after two weeks with donkeys, I would not take one on the Camino! I find patience is in short supply when I am hot and tired, and donkeys require, even demand, patience. Donkeys are welcome on the Camino, except by pilgrims awakened by their braying at dawn!!

For a humorous and informative description of a donkey on the Camino, read

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0312320833/?tag=casaivar02-20

The horse riders I have met on the Camino were only doing short sections. Only one group even had their equipment tied to their saddles. The rest were going from hostal to hostal.

 

[GettingThere]

You may want to read about donkeys.

1. Donkeys eat grass from any field. That plus water will get them going (horses need feed, i. e. more energetic food such as oats)

2. Every gîte is familiar with donkeys and I would say that about a third will welcome them. Unlike a car it will not be exactly where it was left, but is unlikely to run away (donkeys are said to be very tame. They bond with their owners.)

3. Donkeys are very easy to "operate". My 10 year old was able to lead a donkey through a thunderstorm, the day we went to see a farmer to become acquainted with these beasts. It would have been impossible (or dangerous) with a horse, which is much more powerful and nervous.

4. Clouteau writes that there are 200 donkey renters in France, and just a handful in the rest of Europe.

Spaniards are not found of donkeys. It is said that they associate them with extreme poverty (as - you still see donkeys used as labor animals in poor countries).

Brits tend to ridicule donkeys and/or their owners. There is a popular English book where the author talks about his (mis) adventures with a donkey, where the beast is described as a stubborn and uncooperative animal, with the kind of humour you can imagine.

French literature tends to describe donkeys as affectionate and intelligent animals. There has been a strong revival with the Pyrenees donkeys becoming increasingly common.

You write "fun adventure". Like walking the Camino I suppose.

Ummm..... Yes, donkeys can survive on grass and water, if they're not being asked to do much and if there is a handy field of grass near your accommodation. This won't always be the case if you are walking the CF. There will be times when you need to find other food for your donkey, either to replace or supplement grass, and you will need to know what kind of feed and where to find it. And donkeys are work - they're fine if you're going where they want to be, but they are complex and highly intelligent animals and if they don't think it's the best thing to do, they will do their best not to do what you want! They can be hugely rewarding to work with, once you know how they tick.

Gauvins, I know you will have talked to many donkey owners, not just the person you'll be renting from. So I know you will have lots more information about caring for working donkeys. I owned donkeys for twenty years, and I thought Tim Moore's book was realistic in terms of what I know of them (whether you appreciate his humor or not). I saw only one donkey on the CF, and don't know how much of the route it walked.

To the OP, Peter, I saw horses, but I think they were part of an organized group each time, and only doing part of the route.

 

[Anemone del Camino]

what are the costs and qualifications to do the camino on horseback and can the whole camino be done
like that or only partially?Peter

I know of people who have done the lat 100km on horseback, but it was with a company that organised it, took their bags, took care of the horses etc. There are ways to find them on the internet. This year I saw a man with his horse and his two dogs. It was on the Primitivo and he was sleeping in a tent, not using albergues other than to shower.

 

[GAUVINS]

most of what you have posted is not correct.

Could you please be more specific about what is not correct so I can edit my posts or learn from your experience?

BTW - in France, until recently, gîte d'étapes were legally required to provide for donkeys.

An interestingly enough, the only long distance walker that I've come across so far was travelling with both a horse and a donkey (she was circumnavigating the Morvan)

Just to add some sauce - I talked with a gîte owner today about this. Among other things he said that he estimates that 2 out of 3 renters end up returning their donkeys because they are fed up and cannot progress as they would like.

And another thing maybe. We are not planning on walking with donkeys because we love long ears. We simply do not see how our 4 year old would appreciate this kind of a walk otherwise. We have no stakes in this but generally succeed in what we plan to do, and I'll gladly report if it is useful. (as I already indicated in a previous post, making it to Santiago is conditional on the girls and the donkeys going along. Our schedule is very flexible and we have several layers of backup plans)

I am also a bit puzzled by the chorus. Less than a century ago donkeys were very commonly used as working animals. Presumably, most medieval pilgrims did walk with a horse, a mule or a donkey.

---

Two more things.

1. There are 1,200 donkey breeders in France. The national association of breeders estimates that 3000+ donkeys were rented last year for trips totalling 900 000 kms, a business that has generated 5M euros.

2. Google "donkey rental". Results will depend on where you live. Still, try it.

 

[MTtoCamino]

Interestingly I found northern Spain has a lot of geography that reminds me of where I live. If I were to walk to the Pacific Ocean from my home the mountain ranges to cross would be the same, the distance very close to the same & the flat country like the Meseta the same.
So as far as say a quarter horse you could find feed. I think the biggest issue would be finding a source, unless you plan on bringing your own, then depending on how many riders would determine how many pack horses. As you would have to pack oats for the days the grass was limited. So the logistics would get tough. With horses you could find routes to bypass the cities but once again logistics.
Last thing horses, mules , Donkeys, can be unpredictable. I worked in the backcountry as a young man taking hunters in. Along with another man we went in early to set camp. He was thrown & broke his neck. Even with an animal you know very well things happen. I would hesitate to try this unless I did know the critters & their abilities/experience. Not to mention yours.
Walk it is fun!

 

[Anniesantiago]

You may want to read about donkeys.
.

I've walked the Camino Francis 7 times and have seen very few donkeys.
The animals I have seen are difficult to control, and you must carry food for them. There aren't just grassy fields waiting for your donkey to graze in.
Nor are the farmers along the way likely to appreciate your donkey in their fields, vinyards and orchards.
Your 10 year old was lucky, imo, or had a very old beast.
You say until recently, gîte d'étapes were legally required to provide for donkeys = but that is no longer the case, I'm afraid you will find.
I believe your idea of a third of the albergues (or Gites) accepting them is waaaaaay wrong.

And as far as your 4 year old, I've seen many young children on the Camino in trekking strollers, on foot, and on the backs of their parents.
I'd worry very much about putting my child on a donkey on a trail where bicycles come up VERY fast VERY often and without warning.
No way...

I wish you luck and would like to hear from you AFTER your Camino?

 

[Anniesantiago]

Peter, it is possible to do the Camino on horseback.
I met a man and woman in Villafranca del Bierzo on my first Camino that arranged those trips.
I'll see if I can find the information for you.
I do know there is someone renting horses for the trail up to O Cebreiro also.

I did find this:
http://www.santiago-compostela.net/contrib-horseback.html

and this:

Camino by Horse

A very small number of pilgrims complete the Camino de Santiago by horseback each year. There is a guidebook available atwww.elcaminoacaballo.com specifically for horseback riders, including accommodations where horses can stay, horse rental, and tips of the best route by horse.

Riding the entire camino presents many challenges, especially in urban areas, and most horseback riders require a support vehicle. The best option for those who would like to do a portion by horseback would be to participate in a tour package with a tour company that specializes in horse trips. Camino a Caballo (http://www.caminoacaballo.com/en/) offers a variety of guided package tours by horse on the Camino Francés, Finisterre and Portugués.

 

[GAUVINS]

I believe your idea of a third of the albergues (or Gites) accepting them is waaaaaay wrong

As per MMDD. (But no I didn't do the exact math and don't have the source with me.)

Let me just say that I've had no problems planning our route in stages of 15k and alternate 25k with a night where donkeys are formally accepted.

I always find it puzzling when someone forms an opinion instead of asking a question, such as "how did you come up with such a figure?"

Wrt to safety / stubbornness of these animals : I stumbled across an interesting paper published a few years ago in the Figaro (a French newspaper that would be the equivalent of the Washington Post, let's say). They sent a reporter on Le Puy route (in France, Le Puy to Cahors is very popular and said to be the most scenic segment on the Santiago way).

He went along with his wife and 4 children. Early June. Mentions the cold weather (kids wearing their socks on their hands to keep warm).

They were traveling with two donkeys.

He DOES mention one instance where a donkey refused to walk for a couple of hours - at the entrance of a field where there was a large herd of cattle.

He then goes on to write that the next day a pilgrim had been trampled to death at that very location.

---

Your 10 year old was lucky, imo, or had a very old beast.

The animal was a 7 year old castrated male (I believe that the term is gelding). Males that are not castrated are said to be temperamental, and obviously a risk factor when there is a female in heat at close range. Females are more docile but when in heat become uncooperative and also become a significant risk factor because they attract attention and love has to run its course...

We will walk with two 5 year-old pregnant females who have walked the whole way, last year.

But you are right. My daughter said she felt lucky

 

[GAUVINS]

He was thrown & broke his neck

Yes, this is the one thing that may be a real risk factor...

Do you remember if the animal was a horse? (vs mule or donkey)

My understanding, as stated before, is that horses are powerful but nervous, whereas donkeys are relatively weak but much more stoic.

 

[MTtoCamino]

Yes, this is the one thing that may be a real risk factor...

Do you remember if the animal was a horse? (vs mule or donkey)

My understanding, as stated before, is that horses are powerful but nervous, whereas donkeys are relatively weak but much more stoic.

Yes & still make the quarter horse our ride. Mules come in a close second but I don't think you will find many to rent in Spain. So now I am assuming your plan is to walk with donkeys?
I totally understand your thinking as my grand kids wear me out if I pack them around. I was going to send you a picture of a young German couple who had 3 children 6 months, 5 years, 7 years. They pulled a light weight wagon with a harness that fit on the waist. But the forum gave a message saying I didn't have access...

 

[GAUVINS]

It's not always clear whether you are talking about the French caminos aka as French chemins or the French Camino.

As I said, we are starting from Le Puy. And yes I know (and stated) that Spain is less welcoming to donkeys. I also have the 2015 CF MMDD and you probably saw a very decent number of places marked with horseshoes (i.e. that accept donkeys.) Also use the Le Puy - SJPP MMDD.

I'll post a new thread titled : Donkeys, guns, sailboats and true pilgrims.

Thanks for chiming in and take care

 

[Anniesantiago]

Well, like I said, I will be interested to hear how you do on the route.
I hope you will keep a blog.
I'd love to follow you.

 

[GAUVINS]

I hope you will keep a blog.

I promise I'll update. I doubt there will be a blog but will talk to my older. She might bite.

I do think that there is a need for information.

I personally see this as a genuine adventure, not of the Disneyland type. The opportunity to talk with the girls about how it was.

We'll see how things turn out

 

[waveprof]

When we were on Camino we were told repeatedly about a french family who had done the camino with 3 kids and 2 donkeys on the camino, and were now returning to france via the frances.

Then, in Santiago, this was "parked" in front of our hotel. But the man couldn't find anywhere to stable the donkey in Santiago so he had to leave the city without spending the night

There is also a Camino book about a man that traveled with his donkey: Travels with My Donkey: One Man and his Ass on a Pilgrimage to Santiago, by Tim Moore