Traveller747
New Member
- Time of past OR future Camino
- Walken camino frances from st Jean in 2015(?) now think about walk from Porto or bike from Haarlem
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WHY??????! I think its so disrespectful towards the people that left it. Fair that it’s not there forever but at least leave it for the season
Can you imagine what the Cruz de Ferro would look like after a few years of no attention by the local authorities?
I am mostly in your camp, but when I see the ocassional photos of deceased loved ones attached with a poem, my heart goes out to them in their loss and its quite possibly their reason for walking. It's hard to think of these items being thrown out, although necessary at some point. That said, there is definately a lot of unnecessary ticky tacky to be dealt with.Leave your stone, but please keep your personal "momentos" close to your heart, that is where they belong. Well that puts me firmly into one camp. Light and Love
(That people come in on a daily basis and grab whatever of value is sad, but where would it go otherwise? )
I'm not so surprised at the difference. We have a culture that values money and what one possesses above all.Interesting how different cultures view such things.
I really don't understand the significance of Cruz de Ferro, and was quite underwhelmed the first time that I saw it.
The tradition of bringing a stone from home is only a few decades old.
Picking up a stone on the way approaching the cruz and leaving the stone in connection with the Santiago pilgrimage is not much older.
That's probably why many of us don't get any vibes there ....
But the myth has been born and is spread daily through blogs, articles and books and will not die out any time soon and I do realize that such modern rituals have meaning for many. I get a little bit cynical when I see the carefully staged photographs of one's own person or spouse kneeling in front of this long pole but whatever floats their boats ...
Please.While we're putting these myths to rest, can we also add that it is NOT a tradition, and indeed it is illegal, to burn clothing, or worse yet shoes, at Finisterre?!
I'm a total sucker for old ritualsIt may be an unpopular view, but I don´t see a problem with leaving a stone there.
I'm not.I'm a total sucker for old rituals.......
I find myself agreeing with you here David. At the cross, I left my wedding ring, finally allowing myself to let go of my long term marriage which had broken down sixteen years ago.... Finally freeing myself of 'the chains which I had allowed myself to be weighed down by'.…...but, once I left the cross, thise ring was no longer mine.....it was gone and no longer of any concern to me. Camino blessings to all.I can imagine and empathize with the pilgrim that Camino Crhis writes of, who leaves a photo of a deceased love on with an attached poem, the reason for their walking the Camino. I don't have it in my heart to think negatively of them. And I left my stone behind, too.
At the same time, I can empathize with those who worry about the impact of hundreds of thousands of people a year leaving detritus at the mound if some of it is not removed.
Perdsonally, for me, the act of leaving the item is about leaving it behind and not remaining attached to it. Once I've left it, if someone thinks it would be better placed somewhere else, that is no longer my concern.
Can you imagine what the Cruz de Ferro would look like after a few years of no attention by the local authorities?
I'm a total sucker for old rituals, and also for old stones btw, but tell me that it's not at least 600 years old and it loses all appeal for me ... so I mentioned this being fairly recent just in case there are more like me.
I don't want to sound critical towards you personally, @susanawee, I do get the whole thing of creating meaning and ritualistic symbolic acts. But here's what I'm often wondering: Why does it have to happen in Spain, why there, why at that moment? Of all the places in the world? Aren't there places closer to home, much more meaningful, for letting go of anything material and symbolic?At the cross, I left my wedding ring, finally allowing myself to let go of my long term marriage which had broken down sixteen years ago.
While we're putting these myths to rest, can we also add that it is NOT a tradition, and indeed it is illegal, to burn clothing, or worse yet shoes, at Finisterre?!
Many years ago I took my young daughters to Paris where we visited the Père Lachaise Cemetery to see Oscar Wilde's tomb (I know how to show a girl a good time.) We also came across Jim Morrison's grave, which was covered, bizarrely, in half-smoked cigarettes and other flotsam. A group of hollow-eyed teenagers stood round, silently gazing at the grave. The peace was broken by one of my daughters asking, in a clear voice, "Daddy, what are they waiting for?"Decades ago when I lived on the other end of the state I used to make a pilgrimage to the grave of Henry David Thoreau when in the area. It is a small stone inscribed simply with Henry. Though now a walk from where I live I no longer visit it as it now looks to me like a pile of litter with all the mementos left there.
Thank you for mentioning the most likely reason why the contemporary pilgrim ritual arose: seasonal workers from Galicia, travelling in the opposite direction to today's pilgrims, who crossed the Montes de Leon on foot to work during harvest time in the corn (wheat etc) fields of Castilla y Leon and threw a stone for good luck and safe return on the heap at the Cruz de Ferro.The modern tradition of leaving a stone can be al least from 17th century. The Galician reapers walked to Castille to do their job and left a stone at Cruz de Ferro to return home in good condition. That tradition lasted till the 1940s when they started traveling by train. In this period of time probably there weren´t pilgrims at all but when the pilgrimage started again in the 1970s a big pile of stones still remained and the tradition was continued
I love your story. I'm thinking that your Dad didn't want the stone left at the Cruz in his memory - at least not under the conditions you describe - so he saw that it didn't happen. Methinks someone is having a good chuckle.I agree 100%.
.......At first, I was devastated. I had carried it over 2000km at that stage. It had been an important part of the journey, being taken out to "experience" different places. But, between the shouting and the screaming and the inappropriate photo-taking, I realised that the place it ended up was probably more appropriate. He wasn't a destination kinda guy, the journey was the more important part. And he would have appreciated me falling off my bike in the middle of nowhere for no good reason. When I started to laugh a little at that thought, my cracked ribs really started to hurt, so I moved on and left the Cruz to the party people.
Many years ago I took my young daughters to Paris where we visited the Père Lachaise Cemetery to see Oscar Wilde's tomb (I know how to show a girl a good time.) We also came across Jim MOrrison's grave, which was covered, bizarrely, in half-smoked cigarettes and other flotsam. A group of hollow-eyed teenagers stood round, silently gazing at the grave. The peace was broken by one of my daughters asking, in a clear voice, "Daddy, what are they waiting for?"
Well, he sure followed a "to be sure, to be sure" method! My fall resulted in a dislocated shoulder, several cracked ribs and large amounts of skin loss on my hands, arms and legs!I love your story. I'm thinking that your Dad didn't want the stone left at the Cruz in his memory - at least not under the conditions you describe - so he saw that it didn't happen. Methinks someone is having a good chuckle.
Dont people realise this happens every year. Look at the island in the bay of Kotor. Completely man made from people laying stones at their holy place for a few hundred years. Can you imagine how high the mound at the cruz would be after a few years with millions of pilgrims laying stones. The cross would be long since buried. It has to be cleared every year and no matter when it is done someone will notice. Besides, the tradition is to leave a stone, nothing else. Once you have passed by, you dont know what happens behind you and probably never give it a second thoughtJust made it to Santiago and now return partially with a rental car. Once at Cruz De Fierro I catch the cleaners from the local authority removing all the messages and all other items people so carefully were hanging on this cross or laying in front of it and ask myself: WHY??????! I think its so disrespectful towards the people that left it. Fair that it’s not there forever but at least leave it for the season
Completely agree! It makes the serene n beautiful place looks like a dumpster. I think it is very disrespectful to leave something that not wanted anymore for someone else to clean.While we're putting these myths to rest, can we also add that it is NOT a tradition, and indeed it is illegal, to burn clothing, or worse yet shoes, at Finisterre?!
Well done, yes that is what it should look like, long live the Cruz.... I am a bit concerned about one thing though, the cruz is made of wood?? it seems a bit decayed, indented at the bottom, how long will it still last, how long has it survived the elements?View attachment 44886
(Click to enlarge)
So this is what the Cruz de Ferro looks like after members of the two associations "Friends of the Camino de Santiago" from El Bierzo and from Astorga had cleaned it for the traditional pilgrimage that is celebrated tomorrow, as they do every year on the Sunday following the Apostle's Feast Day (25 July). Doesn't it look good ? This is what it's meant to be like.
The place had been cleaned only a month ago but needed already another clean-up now !!! You can read "Un paso limpio" on the yellow bags. This is an initiative that the Japanese Camino Association and the Asociación de amigos del Camino de Santiago de Astorga put together some years ago.
The pole is made of wood, the cross is made of metal (iron perhaps?). Both are modern.I am a bit concerned about one thing though, the cruz is made of wood?? it seems a bit decayed, indented at the bottom, how long will it still last, how long has it survived the elements?
In my case, my actions were notplañned or premeditated beforehand, it was just the right place at the right time...I don't want to sound critical towards you personally, @susanawee, I do get the whole thing of creating meaning and ritualistic symbolic acts. But here's what I'm often wondering: Why does it have to happen in Spain, why there, why at that moment? Of all the places in the world? Aren't there places closer to home, much more meaningful, for letting go of anything material and symbolic?
It's just a rhetorical question, or food for thought, no need to reply for a specific case.
I don't mind how high the pile of stones gets if those of us who leave one are somehow comforted by the ritual and prayer associated with it. After all, our world is full of stones, rocks, and boulders deposited by glaciers and forces of nature, and we think nothing of it, in fact are often in awe. For those who find no value in the heap of rocks at Cruz, just walk around it. The bricabrac however, is another story!Cruz de Ferro for me is a Holy site. But I cannot imagine an additional 150k stones annually to the mount of stones it would be a much higher walk to the cross. I scattered some of my brother's (who was going to walk with me) ashes there and left a stone too.
I guess I lucked out then when I was there. Only one other couple praying with tears. No photos taken, just a very sobering moment for me to witness.I didn't enjoy seeing the crowds at the Cruz de Ferro, people on horseback, bikes and many walkers posing for photos amongst all the tourist tat. I walked around the other side to take my photo of the cross which just looked bare. To my mind that's how it should be..
But it's better if pilgrims consider how their actions affect others. Now you know what some of the things to consider are, at least at the Cruz. Then act in the way you think is appropriate.Whatever happened to "Let everyone hike their own Camino?" How quickly we forget. The Cruz de Ferro was very meaningful to me on each of my two trips, regardless of all of the "expert" opining (whining?) here. Let it be so.
The Spanish umbrella organisation of all the Camino associations in Spain published the appeal of the two local Camino associations who cleaned the Cruz de Ferro recently. They couldn't be clearer: the Cruz de Ferro deserves respect in all aspects and that includes respect of the environment. They ask to leave nothing but stones.I think its so disrespectful towards the people that left it.
This message, from the Associations of Friends of the Camino de Santiago de El Bierzo and de Astorga y Comarca is indeed very clear: They record that the area round the Cruz de Ferro was cleaned up yesterday, 29 July, but that a month ago another clean-up day was carried out, but due to the influx of pilgrims, the waste in the form of memories left by them has proliferated again.The Spanish umbrella organisation of all the Camino associations in Spain published the appeal of the two local Camino associations who cleaned the Cruz de Ferro recently. They couldn't be clearer: the Cruz de Ferro deserves respect in all aspects and that includes respect of the environment. They ask to leave nothing but stones.
The Spanish umbrella organisation of all the Camino associations in Spain published the appeal of the two local Camino associations who cleaned the Cruz de Ferro recently. They couldn't be clearer: the Cruz de Ferro deserves respect in all aspects and that includes respect of the environment. They ask to leave nothing but stones.
http://www.caminosantiago.org/cpperegrino//prensa/verprensa.asp?PrensaID=12059
Let's hope that the Camino associations in the other countries and the writers of guidebooks and the tour operators get the message and spread it.
Totally agree. Back in 2017 I could not believe the garbage that some people, I will not even consider them pilgrims, dumped. Items included underwear (both female and male) obviously used; half used wine bottles. Some of the above was tied around the pole. Totally disrespectful.I know that it may not be a popular view but I feel that the greater disrespect is in covering the Cruz de Ferro with all that detritus in the first place. Why the need to deface the way with such visible reminders of our passing by? Whose interests does it really serve?
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