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tyrrek said:I get a bit bolshy when it comes to charging to get into churches. I appreciate that for some it's a tourist experience more than a religious one, but a church should never be closed to anyone (and I accept that it sounds like you can still get into these cathedrals without paying if you're attending services). Jesus was a pretty mild mannered man and the only time he got violent was for turning the temple into a market. They can be more imaginative in their fundraising than just asking for cash to walk through the door. Sorry if I offend anyone, but it's a strongly held opinion. :evil:
Buen Camino!
jeff001 said:I also get a little upset, not with magnificent churches charging a fee but with pilgrims who seem to think that they are somehow entitled to free or discounted charges. If you can't afford or don't want to pay for admission to something just keep walking. If you are so poor that you can't afford a few euro for admissions maybe you should delay your trip until you are better able to afford it.
Spain’s recession worsened in the second quarter as the government’s austerity push to reduce the euro area’s third-biggest budget deficit and a slump in consumer spending offset growth in exports.
Gross domestic product fell 0.4 percent from the previous quarter, when it declined 0.3 percent, the Madrid-based National Statistics Institute said today. That’s in line with an estimate published July 30. Separately, Spain’s borrowing costs fell to the lowest in three months at an auction today after the nation’s bonds rallied this month on optimism the European Central Bank will agree on a plan to help peripheral nations.
Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy last month gave up on his forecast for a return to growth in 2013 as he unveiled budget cuts that will expand austerity measures to a total of 15 percent of annual GDP by 2014. He is due to host European Union President Herman Van Rompuy today for the first in a series of meetings aimed at solving the nation’s funding issues.
“We fear that things are likely to get worse before they get better,” said Martin van Vliet, an economist at ING Bank in Amsterdam, who expects Spain will seek additional financial aid as early as next month. “With much more fiscal austerity in the pipeline and unemployment at astronomic highs, the risks are clearly tilted toward a more protracted recession.”
Separate data today from the ECB showed that private-sector deposits at Spanish banks fell by a record in July, dropping 74.2 billion euros ($93 billion), or 4.7 percent, to 1.51 trillion euros. That’s the biggest decline since at least 1997, when the ECB’s data series started.
Domestic Demand
The Spanish GDP report showed that consumer spending dropped 1 percent in the second quarter, investment dropped 3 percent and government spending declined 0.7 percent. Exports of goods and services rose 1.6 percent. The economy grew 0.4 percent last year, less than the 0.7 percent initially stated, the statistics agency said. The 2010 contraction was 0.3 percent, revised from 0.1 percent.
Deputy Economy Minister Fernando Jimenez Latorre said it is too early to tell whether the revision will impact the nation’s deficit goals. He also said the economy is in its worst phase.
“We are in the moment of steepest fall and it will surely continue in the second half of this year,” he said. “We will see a correction starting in the first quarters of next year.”
Debt Auction
The yield on Spain’s 10-year benchmark bond rose 2 basis points to 6.41 percent as of 11:55 a.m. in Madrid. The yield has fallen since reaching a record of 7.75 percent on July 25 after ECB President Mario Draghi said the central bank may intervene to curb governments’ borrowing costs and win them time to implement fiscal changes.
The ECB said today that Draghi has canceled his trip to the annual Jackson Hole economic symposium later this week due to his busy workload.
Spain’s Treasury sold 3.6 billion euros ($4.5 billion) of bills, more than the 3.5 billion euros sought. The yield for three-month bills fell to 0.946 percent from 2.434 percent at the last sale on July 24. That’s the least paid for three month bills at auction since May 22. The rate on the six-month bills fell to 2.026 percent from 3.691 percent last month.
Italy also saw its borrowing costs drop at an auction today when it sold zero-coupon and inflation-linked bonds.
Public finance figures due Aug. 31 may show Spain is struggling to cut its deficit to 6.3 percent of GDP this year and reach the EU limit of 3 percent of GDP in 2014. Economists forecast that the economy will shrink 1.6 percent this year and 0.9 percent in 2013 according to the median forecast of 30 economists surveyed by Bloomberg News.
falcon269 said:C'mon. They really need the money..
I can see where you and others are coming from. Yes, these great cathedrals and many churches are short of cash and it's important that they are maintained.jeff001 said:I also get a little upset, not with magnificent churches charging a fee but with pilgrims who seem to think that they are somehow entitled to free or discounted charges. If you can't afford or don't want to pay for admission to something just keep walking. If you are so poor that you can't afford a few euro for admissions maybe you should delay your trip until you are better able to afford it.
Yep, it was me! Ha ha! As I said before it's really difficult to get the balance right. Maybe it's a case of communication. I don't know the solution, but I know that I was offended by being charged to enter a cathedral along the Camino as a pilgrim with a credencial full of stamps. Just to walk through the door. What exactly is the cathedral there for? Buen Camino!oursonpolaire said:Sorry for the double post, but I meant Tyrrek's perspective in my opening line.
Totally agree. I was thinking in terms of an area being sectioned off depending on the number of pilgrims who arrived the day before. The rest open to everyone, though. Buen Camino!Tia Valeria said:No one should be excluded from any service, pilgrim or not. For many it SdeC it is their church.
Also maybe that 'tourist' will be next year's pilgrim. We were tourists once and attended the Pilgrims' Mass, which inspired us to walk the Camino ourselves.
Thanks for your thoughts PadreQ. I think mine have been misinterpreted as 'pilgrims should get special rights' or similar, which is not what I said. I'm obviously not very good at argument! I am happy to pay some money during a visit because I understand the pressures but as a principle I don't like to spend it just to get in. The church is a place of refuge and sanctuary for people in the worst of circumstances. Buen Camino!PadreQ said:Tyrrek,
The cathedral, any cathedral, belongs to the diocese of which it is the center. Pilgrims, by definition, are just people passing through...
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