- Time of past OR future Camino
- .
For 2024 Pilgrims: €50,- donation = 1 year with no ads on the forum + 90% off any 2024 Guide. More here. (Discount code sent to you by Private Message after your donation) |
---|
Do you use the hiking poles? I also have bad knees (meniscus tears in both). I found that the poles are a huge help on the steep downhills, which are the hardest on my knees. I found from hiking on the AT that Altras and Hokas actually make my knees worse because they lack the necessary support and glucosamine chondrotin supplements are a waste of money. I am planning my second Camino with my same knees this fall. Poles, non-steroidals as needed and hyaluronic gel injections helped me last time…. Everyone is different and respond to different things. Good luck finding solutions that work for you!I recently returned from the camino. I’ve been getting increasingly sore and crackly knees over the last 5 years, but now it’s becoming an issue. I don’t tend to experience much discomfort while walking, except the usual, on long steep downhills – or worse, whole days on the flat. But at night I lie awake in my bunk trying to deal with the pain. It used to recede around midnight, which was OK, but on this last trip it was often still present until 3-4 in the morning. Sometimes I’d take a little Ibuprofen and other times not, as there didn’t seem to be much difference. X-rays on my return (for some camino-sustained fractures, unrelated) show arthritic wear to both knees, so I can no longer ignore that it’s really happening.
What I’m interested in hearing about and exploring with other forum members is how their knee journeys are working out. I can see that my knees are only going in one direction and that ultimately I will probably need to access that Developed World luxury of knee replacement surgery (if I can find the money…). But what happens between now and then? Do many people go down the Synvise/Orthovise injection route first, or is that enough for some to stabilise their birth knees’ usefulness and never need the replacement surgery?
I’m particularly interested in hearing from people who felt their knee pain was becoming a significant issue 5-20 years ago, and what has happened since.
I’m keen to find out whether there are any actions I can take now to prolong the usefulness of my birth knees in my day to day activities, like Glucosamine supplements. I’m already doing a range of exercises.
Or maybe there are some of you that just revised your walking expectations downwards and now do slower, shorter stages and appear to have stabilised at that level?
I’m hoping we can steer clear of repeating all the usual strategies people take while actually walking, as I think those have been covered extensively already, whether it’s using walking/pacer poles, having impact reducing shoes like Altras or Hokas, employing kinesiology tape or knee braces or compression sleeves etc etc. But if you feel these or others are an integral part of your successful stabilising strategy then do say so.
FYI, before posting I did a search on knee journeys on this forum. Here are a couple of related threads, mainly about surgery
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/walking-after-knee-replacements.65173/
Cheers, tom
I'm 77 and had to have both my knees replaced. TKR on both one in 2014 and the other in 2015. Find an orthopedic surgeon that has a great reputation for success and that does the minimally invasive surgery. Small incisions and less muscle displacement. The PT after the surgery is the most important part of the process. You MUST push yourself hard, it hurts, but that is when you get the range of motion back. After 6 weeks you have pretty much what you're going to get.I recently returned from the camino. I’ve been getting increasingly sore and crackly knees over the last 5 years, but now it’s becoming an issue. I don’t tend to experience much discomfort while walking, except the usual, on long steep downhills – or worse, whole days on the flat. But at night I lie awake in my bunk trying to deal with the pain. It used to recede around midnight, which was OK, but on this last trip it was often still present until 3-4 in the morning. Sometimes I’d take a little Ibuprofen and other times not, as there didn’t seem to be much difference. X-rays on my return (for some camino-sustained fractures, unrelated) show arthritic wear to both knees, so I can no longer ignore that it’s really happening.
What I’m interested in hearing about and exploring with other forum members is how their knee journeys are working out. I can see that my knees are only going in one direction and that ultimately I will probably need to access that Developed World luxury of knee replacement surgery (if I can find the money…). But what happens between now and then? Do many people go down the Synvise/Orthovise injection route first, or is that enough for some to stabilise their birth knees’ usefulness and never need the replacement surgery?
I’m particularly interested in hearing from people who felt their knee pain was becoming a significant issue 5-20 years ago, and what has happened since.
I’m keen to find out whether there are any actions I can take now to prolong the usefulness of my birth knees in my day to day activities, like Glucosamine supplements. I’m already doing a range of exercises.
Or maybe there are some of you that just revised your walking expectations downwards and now do slower, shorter stages and appear to have stabilised at that level?
I’m hoping we can steer clear of repeating all the usual strategies people take while actually walking, as I think those have been covered extensively already, whether it’s using walking/pacer poles, having impact reducing shoes like Altras or Hokas, employing kinesiology tape or knee braces or compression sleeves etc etc. But if you feel these or others are an integral part of your successful stabilising strategy then do say so.
FYI, before posting I did a search on knee journeys on this forum. Here are a couple of related threads, mainly about surgery
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/walking-after-knee-replacements.65173/
Cheers, tom
@peregrino_tom, this is a great question, and I did a range of almost everything mentioned already in this thread over the years. Without trying to depress you about the effectiveness of any particular solution, as individuals we have no idea whether our personal approaches to this did much, if anything, to extend the life of our knees. That said, some posters have shared articles based on research that has some prospect of giving some indication of what works, although this subject still seems to have myriad treatments that might work well for only some people, and for others make no practical difference.I’m keen to find out whether there are any actions I can take now to prolong the usefulness of my birth knees in my day to day activities, like Glucosamine supplements. I’m already doing a range of exercises.
Or maybe there are some of you that just revised your walking expectations downwards and now do slower, shorter stages and appear to have stabilised at that level?
For what it is worth, I shot my knees completely on the Camino Frances. It was clear that they were going by the time we arrived in Puente la Reina. I needed knee braces, lots of ibuprofen, and hiking poles (which I picked up in Viana when everything else wasn't enough) for the rest of the Camino to see me through. I tried cutting back on the knee braces (because it was hot and they were sweaty!) but I needed all three right to the end. But over time, my knees recovered. I did lots of training, with hiking poles, for my 2018 Camino Portugues. And on that Camino, my knees were fine. I didn't need the ibuprofen or knee brancesI recently returned from the camino. I’ve been getting increasingly sore and crackly knees over the last 5 years, but now it’s becoming an issue. I don’t tend to experience much discomfort while walking, except the usual, on long steep downhills – or worse, whole days on the flat. But at night I lie awake in my bunk trying to deal with the pain. It used to recede around midnight, which was OK, but on this last trip it was often still present until 3-4 in the morning. Sometimes I’d take a little Ibuprofen and other times not, as there didn’t seem to be much difference. X-rays on my return (for some camino-sustained fractures, unrelated) show arthritic wear to both knees, so I can no longer ignore that it’s really happening.
What I’m interested in hearing about and exploring with other forum members is how their knee journeys are working out. I can see that my knees are only going in one direction and that ultimately I will probably need to access that Developed World luxury of knee replacement surgery (if I can find the money…). But what happens between now and then? Do many people go down the Synvise/Orthovise injection route first, or is that enough for some to stabilise their birth knees’ usefulness and never need the replacement surgery?
I’m particularly interested in hearing from people who felt their knee pain was becoming a significant issue 5-20 years ago, and what has happened since.
I’m keen to find out whether there are any actions I can take now to prolong the usefulness of my birth knees in my day to day activities, like Glucosamine supplements. I’m already doing a range of exercises.
Or maybe there are some of you that just revised your walking expectations downwards and now do slower, shorter stages and appear to have stabilised at that level?
I’m hoping we can steer clear of repeating all the usual strategies people take while actually walking, as I think those have been covered extensively already, whether it’s using walking/pacer poles, having impact reducing shoes like Altras or Hokas, employing kinesiology tape or knee braces or compression sleeves etc etc. But if you feel these or others are an integral part of your successful stabilising strategy then do say so.
FYI, before posting I did a search on knee journeys on this forum. Here are a couple of related threads, mainly about surgery
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/walking-after-knee-replacements.65173/
Cheers, tom
Many years of mountaineering and Morris Dancing wrecked my lead (left) knee and I had a half knee replacement eleven years ago which solved my problems. Now it seems the joint replacement was not correctly aligned and I'm back where I started and waiting for my knee replacement to be replaced...........hopefully this year. Fortunately my local hospital has a specialist knee physiotherapist whose exercises keep me going in the meantime.I recently returned from the camino. I’ve been getting increasingly sore and crackly knees over the last 5 years, but now it’s becoming an issue. I don’t tend to experience much discomfort while walking, except the usual, on long steep downhills – or worse, whole days on the flat. But at night I lie awake in my bunk trying to deal with the pain. It used to recede around midnight, which was OK, but on this last trip it was often still present until 3-4 in the morning. Sometimes I’d take a little Ibuprofen and other times not, as there didn’t seem to be much difference. X-rays on my return (for some camino-sustained fractures, unrelated) show arthritic wear to both knees, so I can no longer ignore that it’s really happening.
What I’m interested in hearing about and exploring with other forum members is how their knee journeys are working out. I can see that my knees are only going in one direction and that ultimately I will probably need to access that Developed World luxury of knee replacement surgery (if I can find the money…). But what happens between now and then? Do many people go down the Synvise/Orthovise injection route first, or is that enough for some to stabilise their birth knees’ usefulness and never need the replacement surgery?
I’m particularly interested in hearing from people who felt their knee pain was becoming a significant issue 5-20 years ago, and what has happened since.
I’m keen to find out whether there are any actions I can take now to prolong the usefulness of my birth knees in my day to day activities, like Glucosamine supplements. I’m already doing a range of exercises.
Or maybe there are some of you that just revised your walking expectations downwards and now do slower, shorter stages and appear to have stabilised at that level?
I’m hoping we can steer clear of repeating all the usual strategies people take while actually walking, as I think those have been covered extensively already, whether it’s using walking/pacer poles, having impact reducing shoes like Altras or Hokas, employing kinesiology tape or knee braces or compression sleeves etc etc. But if you feel these or others are an integral part of your successful stabilising strategy then do say so.
FYI, before posting I did a search on knee journeys on this forum. Here are a couple of related threads, mainly about surgery
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/walking-after-knee-replacements.65173/
Cheers, tom
@peregrino_tom & others interested...
After many walks which, a few hours in turned into limping & tears, I thought my walking days were over...said she before her first foray into the world of long distance walking (CF in 2012).
My solution; not pills, poles, support braces/bandages or shorter distances...I changed the way I walk..the actual mechanics of it.
Good on you @Walton!That's exactly what I'm doing now Tazzie Kas!
Asking myself -
Am I walking correctly?
And
What is most likely the correct way to walk?
The only thing different from you at the moment is that I'm leaning forward slightly.
I think any knee examination needs to look at the whole leg structure from a medical point of view, at the footwear, and at how one walks.
I'm also looking at knee strengthening exercises.
I'm hoping the ever knowledgeable Dave Bugg might have something to say here.
This a great thread!
Cheers
Graham
TMcA - thank you. Still, despite the limited motion range you've managed three caminos on the TKR - sounds pretty amazing to me.Arthritis was the culprit. I tried glucosamine, though my doctor at the time was skeptical about its efficacy. It seemed not to help. I tried injections in the knee before 3 Caminos. Once I started hiking, relief lasted only a week at the most. Sometimes just days. I tried an elastic knee brace. Not much help. Ibu to reduce swelling and pain helped a little. Physical therapy - strengthening the supporting muscles; maybe helped a little. Acupuncture, a long shot, had no effect.
I eventually had a TKR (Total Knee Replacement), but the results were disappointing. My range of motion post-op was disappointing. And still is. However, I did 3 more Caminos easily even with my lousy range of motion. And my right knee is solid; I can carry somewhat heavy loads of wood from my woodshed to my garage as well as other activities that put a strain on my knees.
Elle, thanks, unfortunately I can't access that link at the moment: my internet provider says I have to register my details and confirm my age as 18+ before it will let me proceed! But reviews I've seen in my seach engine are pretty positive. PS Curious as to whether you are still an advocate for the Kinesiology tape you recommended a few years ago?I finally found Instaflex. (https://www.instaflex.com/)
Scott, thanks for the info. The cortisone injections seem to get a mixed reception but at least they've been working for you.If all is good, we'll do more cortisone injections before departure and hope for the best. If pain gets too bad during training or while walking...we'll, I guess I'm done, until I get new knees.
jtc: very useful - thanks for the info.The PT after the surgery is the most important part of the process. You MUST push yourself hard, it hurts, but that is when you get the range of motion back. After 6 weeks you have pretty much what you're going to get.
I did Sarria to Santiago in April of this year without any discomfort. I ride a bicycle both on the road and stationary and keep active. When your knees are worn out the only remedy is replacement. Don't wait too long as it takes longer to recover the older you get.
I agree. Didn't used to have to do any prep at all in the past, but now it's very importantI know, my experience would not be the same for everyone, but I think it's still important to train as much as possible for this wonderful experience. Almost 4 years later, there is not a day that I don't think about it.
Hi Laurie, actually I don't notice the pain much during the day at all. I'm a little envious that you continue to power through so many caminos without apparent joint wear! I'm going to the gym now and enjoying doing various exercises for quads and glutes that the instructor has put together.This may not be helpful for someone with your degree of pain, but in my case there’s no doubt that the pain was caused by weak muscles.
Lydia, that's great advice, thanksdid the physio faithfully for a few minutes every morning and night strengthening the muscles need for afterwards. The healing was amazing, nurses used to say "you cant do that, you are only day 2 or 3," but I had just done it, thanks to the pre-op physio.
True that!Docs’ jobs are To medicate and lacerate but PTs jobs are to strengthen and return to some
Range of motion.
Doug, thanks. This is the kind of gradual decline in performance that I think many of us are working out how to deal with. Liking your strategies and tenacity hereI reached the point where I had become so limited in the distances I could do that I had my second TKR, this time my left knee. The other knee was replaced a few years ago. Over that time I continued to do the things you already know about - walking poles, knee braces, OTC analgesics for pain management, supplements, and kept walking.
I walked the CP this in May this year having planned substantially shorter stages, typically 20 km or less. There were a couple of longer days. Whereas I had never regularly taken ibuprofen, I needed to take it every day to supplement the modified release paracetamol I routinely take for pain management of my osteoarthritis. I also took more regular breaks, at bars, cafes or to check out a grocery store mostly, but also just at some convenient roadside seat where there was one.
I was still able to walk around 20 km/day until late Sep, but with increased discomfort. For the next couple of months, I was finding it difficult to contemplate anything more than 10 km, which I could manage but needed to take ibuprofen to deal with the pain.
David, this sounds like me a few years back. But hopefully you don't follow the same deterioration path as me!But over time, my knees recovered. I did lots of training, with hiking poles, for my 2018 Camino Portugues. And on that Camino, my knees were fine. I didn't need the ibuprofen or knee brances
Brian, thanks, I had heard about these before. Looking more like a worthwhile investment now.He said the Oofos made a world of difference.
Tassie thanks. Posture, gait, walking style, frequency and types of stretches and exercises are all things I'm reviewing!I changed the way I walk..the actual mechanics of it.
Tom, sorry about the link. Don't know what to tell you there. That's never happened to me.Elle, thanks, unfortunately I can't access that link at the moment: my internet provider says I have to register my details and confirm my age as 18+ before it will let me proceed! But reviews I've seen in my seach engine are pretty positive. PS Curious as to whether you are still an advocate for the Kinesiology tape you recommended a few years ago?
Oh, my how could I have forgotten the GLUTES?! After my hamstring injury in 2021, my physical therapist told me that the glutes are muscles that are missing in action for most people. (Maybe he was only talking about people in the US, but I suspect it’s more widely true). It took me months to even be able to identify when my glutes were “kicking in.” The day I could tell that I was “pedalling from my glutes” on my bicycle was one of those aha moments.I'm going to the gym now and enjoying doing various exercises for quads and glutes that the instructor has put together.
Hi Tom. To add my two cents to the question of the tape. Like @Elle Bieling I recommend trying kinesiology tape.PS Curious as to whether you are still an advocate for the Kinesiology tape you recommended a few years ago?
I can speak to your question from the perspective of someone who has had knee issues for more than 37 years.I recently returned from the camino. I’ve been getting increasingly sore and crackly knees over the last 5 years, but now it’s becoming an issue. I don’t tend to experience much discomfort while walking, except the usual, on long steep downhills – or worse, whole days on the flat. But at night I lie awake in my bunk trying to deal with the pain. It used to recede around midnight, which was OK, but on this last trip it was often still present until 3-4 in the morning. Sometimes I’d take a little Ibuprofen and other times not, as there didn’t seem to be much difference. X-rays on my return (for some camino-sustained fractures, unrelated) show arthritic wear to both knees, so I can no longer ignore that it’s really happening.
What I’m interested in hearing about and exploring with other forum members is how their knee journeys are working out. I can see that my knees are only going in one direction and that ultimately I will probably need to access that Developed World luxury of knee replacement surgery (if I can find the money…). But what happens between now and then? Do many people go down the Synvise/Orthovise injection route first, or is that enough for some to stabilise their birth knees’ usefulness and never need the replacement surgery?
I’m particularly interested in hearing from people who felt their knee pain was becoming a significant issue 5-20 years ago, and what has happened since.
I’m keen to find out whether there are any actions I can take now to prolong the usefulness of my birth knees in my day to day activities, like Glucosamine supplements. I’m already doing a range of exercises.
Or maybe there are some of you that just revised your walking expectations downwards and now do slower, shorter stages and appear to have stabilised at that level?
I’m hoping we can steer clear of repeating all the usual strategies people take while actually walking, as I think those have been covered extensively already, whether it’s using walking/pacer poles, having impact reducing shoes like Altras or Hokas, employing kinesiology tape or knee braces or compression sleeves etc etc. But if you feel these or others are an integral part of your successful stabilising strategy then do say so.
FYI, before posting I did a search on knee journeys on this forum. Here are a couple of related threads, mainly about surgery
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/walking-after-knee-replacements.65173/
Cheers, tom
Cheers Elle. See Pelerin comment belowAnd yes, absolutely I still recommend kinesiology tape!!
Laurie, yes - I guess it's the equivalent motivator to people who try and lose a few pounds before going on a beach holiday ;-) It seems it can certainly give some purpose around an exercise regimen and help us not to backslide when idleness beckons..Hope the exercise regimen helps with the knee problem, @peregrino_tom. Isn’t the camino a wonderful motivator?!
Interesting! Might look into this one a bit more.Leg crossing can also, apparently affect hips, pelvis and spine.
So stretching those ligaments and muscles unnecessarily. Maybe not a good idea for older folks.
I was using a knee compression sleeve after my recent fall on the camino. It strikes me that the way the cross-straps bind around the knee cap is very similar to the positioning of the KT.Like @Elle Bieling I recommend kinesiology tape.
I don't drink as much as you, but I like it, no big lifestyle change necessary here!have you tried Rooibos tea ? Has strong anti inflationary properties.
Betsy, there's so much here that I'm already aligned with. The whole walking thing is a bit of a conundrum: walking wears out our joints, but hills can both strengthen our legs to prevent wear, as well as induce discomfort on the downhills (as presumably what goes up must come down.. but perhaps ageing camino preppers could get a discount on ski lifts, by only coming down the mountain in them?But here I am 10 years later with still functioning knees. Losing weight helped, but walking more, including the hills of Seattle, has strengthened my knees. I am a newly retired family doctor and recommend trying to avoid regular ibuprofen or naproxen for the two reasons that chronic use can hurt the kidneys or cause gastric ulcers. I personally would avoid the steroid injections- some compelling data shows that they may increase destruction of the cartilage faster. Glucosamine works in dogs and animals so is worth trying. I think using your knees and strengthening the muscles around them is really helpful. My biggest recommendation for you is to sleep with a small pillow between your knees. I do and I am amazed how much less knee pain I have at night. No ibuprofen needed.
Lurch, this sounds grim. I really hope you manage to make the right decision next week on whatever the professional recommends. While missing your March camino is tough, the right therapeutic interventions may put you in a better longer term frame for future, further away caminos. Fingers crossed.At this time, I am lying in bed with severe pain in left knee. It is bone on bone for three years now, but for some reason I have been reluctant to replace it. Now paying the penalty as I can’t bend it without extreme pain and it feels as if there is tendon damage. I see the orthopedic next Thursday and am sure he will recommend replacement.
clarkandkaren - I'm hoping that not ever having torn anything myself, this is a route I won't need to go down! but it's interesting. Really seems to be working for you.I can speak to your question from the perspective of someone who has had knee issues for more than 37 years.
Before going any further, I will say the Euflexxa, SynVisc, and shark cartilage derivatives prior to those synthetic materials, have literally saved my knees and extended both my hiking and cycling abilities FAR BEYOND what I would have experience without them.
At this point in life, I’m 64, had my 4th and last knee surgery in 2007 (torn ACL at 49 yrs old.. playing Baseball), I have as close to bone-on-bone (no cartilage) in both knees.
For the last 14 years I have taken injections of SynVisc, or the various iterations, every 6 months.”As a consequence, I bicycle more than 10,000 miles a year and walk more than a few hundred every year!
Over the years I have recommended this treatment to more than a dozen people, mostly cyclists, all have had the same experiences I’ve come to expect.
Heidi - I very much like that since putting aside the Arthrotec you are making more natural adaptations and they seem to be working for you.I have had knee problems for many years, and after having a stroke, cannot use Arthrotec, which was a miracle cure for me. Currently, poles, taping, exercises taught by physiotherapist and avoiding hilly terrain is enough - along with learning a new style of walking, particularly walking up and down stairs and the odd unavoidable hill: toes land first, which means that there is no uncomfortable jolt inside the knee when the heel lands.
Thanks…one way or another, I WILL finish the Camino on foot…no guts, no glory. Been preparing by only buying Spanish wine at the liquor store…Buen Camino.Cheers Elle. See Pelerin comment below
Laurie, yes - I guess it's the equivalent motivator to people who try and lose a few pounds before going on a beach holiday ;-) It seems it can certainly give some purpose around an exercise regimen and help us not to backslide when idleness beckons..
Interesting! Might look into this one a bit more.
I was using a knee compression sleeve after my recent fall on the camino. It strikes me that the way the cross-straps bind around the knee cap is very similar to the positioning of the KT.
I don't drink as much as you, but I like it, no big lifestyle change necessary here!
Betsy, there's so much here that I'm already aligned with. The whole walking thing is a bit of a conundrum: walking wears out our joints, but hills can both strengthen our legs to prevent wear, as well as induce discomfort on the downhills (as presumably what goes up must come down.. but perhaps ageing camino preppers could get a discount on ski lifts, by only coming down the mountain in them?)
The pillow thing is fascinating - I'd already started doing that without anyone's advice, because I'm a side sleeper and the two knee bones against each other sometimes hurts, particularly after a big walk.
Lurch, this sounds grim. I really hope you manage to make the right decision next week on whatever the professional recommends. While missing your March camino is tough, the right therapeutic interventions may put you in a better longer term frame for future, further away caminos. Fingers crossed
clarkandkaren - I'm hoping that not ever having torn anything myself, this is a route I won't need to go down! but it's interesting. Really seems to be working for you.
Heidi - I very much like that since putting aside the Arthrotec you are making more natural adaptations and they seem to be working for you.
Wow - thanks everyone! A wide range of experiences and views once again. I definitely don't have the level of pain and severity that some of you are experiencing. But I appreciate that some of that may lie ahead - or not, because at this point it feels like there's quite a lot of self-determination in play, quite a few forks in the road where I can still decide to take the high road or the low road (in camino-speak).
I'm more focused right now on the little walking/lifestyle-changing measures that have worked for some of you. These might alleviate immediate discomfort while in the act of walking (which I actually experience very little of at the moment) and/or prevent slow down further joint wear.
Actually I'm amazed at what some of you are prepared to put up with in order to walk the camino - be careful out there!
Cheers, tom
I wish you well with your ongoing treatment of your knees.I recently returned from the camino. I’ve been getting increasingly sore and crackly knees over the last 5 years, but now it’s becoming an issue. I don’t tend to experience much discomfort while walking, except the usual, on long steep downhills – or worse, whole days on the flat. But at night I lie awake in my bunk trying to deal with the pain. It used to recede around midnight, which was OK, but on this last trip it was often still present until 3-4 in the morning. Sometimes I’d take a little Ibuprofen and other times not, as there didn’t seem to be much difference. X-rays on my return (for some camino-sustained fractures, unrelated) show arthritic wear to both knees, so I can no longer ignore that it’s really happening.
What I’m interested in hearing about and exploring with other forum members is how their knee journeys are working out. I can see that my knees are only going in one direction and that ultimately I will probably need to access that Developed World luxury of knee replacement surgery (if I can find the money…). But what happens between now and then? Do many people go down the Synvise/Orthovise injection route first, or is that enough for some to stabilise their birth knees’ usefulness and never need the replacement surgery?
I’m particularly interested in hearing from people who felt their knee pain was becoming a significant issue 5-20 years ago, and what has happened since.
I’m keen to find out whether there are any actions I can take now to prolong the usefulness of my birth knees in my day to day activities, like Glucosamine supplements. I’m already doing a range of exercises.
Or maybe there are some of you that just revised your walking expectations downwards and now do slower, shorter stages and appear to have stabilised at that level?
I’m hoping we can steer clear of repeating all the usual strategies people take while actually walking, as I think those have been covered extensively already, whether it’s using walking/pacer poles, having impact reducing shoes like Altras or Hokas, employing kinesiology tape or knee braces or compression sleeves etc etc. But if you feel these or others are an integral part of your successful stabilising strategy then do say so.
FYI, before posting I did a search on knee journeys on this forum. Here are a couple of related threads, mainly about surgery
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/walking-after-knee-replacements.65173/
Cheers, tom
Hi Tom, anything you can do to reduce the load on your knees will help increase Camino comfort and postpone those operations.I recently returned from the camino. I’ve been getting increasingly sore and crackly knees over the last 5 years, but now it’s becoming an issue. I don’t tend to experience much discomfort while walking, except the usual, on long steep downhills – or worse, whole days on the flat. But at night I lie awake in my bunk trying to deal with the pain. It used to recede around midnight, which was OK, but on this last trip it was often still present until 3-4 in the morning. Sometimes I’d take a little Ibuprofen and other times not, as there didn’t seem to be much difference. X-rays on my return (for some camino-sustained fractures, unrelated) show arthritic wear to both knees, so I can no longer ignore that it’s really happening.
What I’m interested in hearing about and exploring with other forum members is how their knee journeys are working out. I can see that my knees are only going in one direction and that ultimately I will probably need to access that Developed World luxury of knee replacement surgery (if I can find the money…). But what happens between now and then? Do many people go down the Synvise/Orthovise injection route first, or is that enough for some to stabilise their birth knees’ usefulness and never need the replacement surgery?
I’m particularly interested in hearing from people who felt their knee pain was becoming a significant issue 5-20 years ago, and what has happened since.
I’m keen to find out whether there are any actions I can take now to prolong the usefulness of my birth knees in my day to day activities, like Glucosamine supplements. I’m already doing a range of exercises.
Or maybe there are some of you that just revised your walking expectations downwards and now do slower, shorter stages and appear to have stabilised at that level?
I’m hoping we can steer clear of repeating all the usual strategies people take while actually walking, as I think those have been covered extensively already, whether it’s using walking/pacer poles, having impact reducing shoes like Altras or Hokas, employing kinesiology tape or knee braces or compression sleeves etc etc. But if you feel these or others are an integral part of your successful stabilising strategy then do say so.
FYI, before posting I did a search on knee journeys on this forum. Here are a couple of related threads, mainly about surgery
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/walking-after-knee-replacements.65173/
Cheers, tom
There is good advice in this post about using poles, but when I see claims like this, I wonder. The most downwards force I can generate standing on a normal set of bathroom scales using two poles results in a 20 kg reduction in my measured weight. That might be close to 25% of my body weight, but that is not how one uses poles, and I don't think 25% reductions in weight loads are realistic.They can easily take 25% of your weight load.
Happy New Year Dougfitz,There is good advice in this post about using poles, but when I see claims like this, I wonder. The most downwards force I can generate standing on a normal set of bathroom scales using two poles results in a 20 kg reduction in my measured weight. That might be close to 25% of my body weight, but that is not how one uses poles, and I don't think 25% reductions in weight loads are realistic.
That said, even a more modest reduction in loads on ankles, knees and hips is going to be a significant benefit on any camino.
I started doing this to avoid rain getting into the arm of my rainjacket and pooling at the elbow. It gives one a nasty surprise if you forget to empty the arm before raising it for some reason!One thing I probably do differently than most trekkers is that I have the length a bit shorter to put my forearms less than parallel to the ground.
Have you considered prolozone injections. It works for my shoulder and my girlfriend's knees. It's a common procedure not to be confused with steroids which are not recommended because they break down your joint even more. Here's a link to the science.I recently returned from the camino. I’ve been getting increasingly sore and crackly knees over the last 5 years, but now it’s becoming an issue. I don’t tend to experience much discomfort while walking, except the usual, on long steep downhills – or worse, whole days on the flat. But at night I lie awake in my bunk trying to deal with the pain. It used to recede around midnight, which was OK, but on this last trip it was often still present until 3-4 in the morning. Sometimes I’d take a little Ibuprofen and other times not, as there didn’t seem to be much difference. X-rays on my return (for some camino-sustained fractures, unrelated) show arthritic wear to both knees, so I can no longer ignore that it’s really happening.
What I’m interested in hearing about and exploring with other forum members is how their knee journeys are working out. I can see that my knees are only going in one direction and that ultimately I will probably need to access that Developed World luxury of knee replacement surgery (if I can find the money…). But what happens between now and then? Do many people go down the Synvise/Orthovise injection route first, or is that enough for some to stabilise their birth knees’ usefulness and never need the replacement surgery?
I’m particularly interested in hearing from people who felt their knee pain was becoming a significant issue 5-20 years ago, and what has happened since.
I’m keen to find out whether there are any actions I can take now to prolong the usefulness of my birth knees in my day to day activities, like Glucosamine supplements. I’m already doing a range of exercises.
Or maybe there are some of you that just revised your walking expectations downwards and now do slower, shorter stages and appear to have stabilised at that level?
I’m hoping we can steer clear of repeating all the usual strategies people take while actually walking, as I think those have been covered extensively already, whether it’s using walking/pacer poles, having impact reducing shoes like Altras or Hokas, employing kinesiology tape or knee braces or compression sleeves etc etc. But if you feel these or others are an integral part of your successful stabilising strategy then do say so.
FYI, before posting I did a search on knee journeys on this forum. Here are a couple of related threads, mainly about surgery
https://www.caminodesantiago.me/community/threads/walking-after-knee-replacements.65173/
Cheers, tom
Amen on the water down the sleeves! My first walking CF I also did Muxia/Finisterre and then Camino Ingles++ for about 1200 km with extensive experimentation on my adjustable poles to find one length worked well in all cases for me. Dumb luck. Now if I just put load cells in each pole along with 6-way accelerometers linked to a data logger........I started doing this to avoid rain getting into the arm of my rainjacket and pooling at the elbow. It gives one a nasty surprise if you forget to empty the arm before raising it for some reason!
I'm not an advocate of fixed length poles. They might work reasonably well when there aren't too many variations in the slope. But I use poles regularly bush walking here in Australia, and prefer to be able to adjust the length of the pole to suit the circumstances, particularly going downhill.
Hi Judy, I hadn't heard of this. Just been reading about it on a UK practioner's site - all looks very convincing and the cost seems quite manageable as well.Have you considered prolozone injections. It works for my shoulder and my girlfriend's knees. It's a common procedure not to be confused with steroids which are not recommended because they break down your joint even more. Here's a link to the science.
Very interesting and thanks for the info. I am hoping to walk part of the Camino with my husband later this year and am worried about my left knee which has arthritis and is close to bone-on-bone. Indeed, my doctor wasn't sure about doing another cortisone injection because of this. I have my name down for a knee replacement but this will be some years off - I live in the UK where the waiting list is very long and I'm likely to be lucky if it happens before 2025. So I have been reading what measures others have taken in order to walk without too much difficulty and pain. So far, I'm thinking a unloader brace, will definitely use sticks, and carry a lot of pain meds. We cycled the Camino de Santiago back in 2013 but I'm now off my bike because, at 75 (and a close-up bout with Covid) means I can no longer get on the bike easily and tend to keep falling off when I least expect it (!) We already go to the gym and are now trying *so far unsuccessfully) to lose weight. It will happen. I thought immediately of my husband when I read Clint Eastwood's quote. He still, at 81, thinks he's 50I won't bore you with the all the details but my knees have been up and down over 4 Caminos. Camino 1: Full Frances, age 71, swelling and some minor pain on days 4-10, probably caused by a very heavy pack and an overweight pilgrim. Issues resolved with ice, Ibuprofen and Jacotrans. After Burgos all was good. Camino 2: Full Frances, age 72, no issues. Camino 3: Puy to Pamplona, age 73, right knee clicking a week before SJPdP. Resolved with frequent quad stretching. After six weeks off I returned to Pamplona to finish the Frances. All good until 10km from Logroño when right knee went out. Intense pain. Flew home immediately. After four week wait to see ortho-doc knee recovered. Agreed with the MD that for the next Camino he'd inject steroids before departure. Camino 4: Salamanca to SdC, age 76 and 20 pounds lighter. I switched from boots to Altra Olympus 4 high cushion trail runners. That and cortisone shots did the trick. No issues other than minor morning stiffness for the entire route. Now planning Camino 5 at age 76, June start León to SdC. Saw Ortho-doc in November. X-rays reveal I'm at or very near bone-on-bone in both knees -- severe osteoarthritis. Plan is PT (so far so good) to strengthen muscles, then gym - weights and bike/treadmill , then lots of long walks. If all is good, we'll do more cortisone injections before departure and hope for the best. If pain gets too bad during training or while walking...we'll, I guess I'm done, until I get new knees.
I am inspired by the words of Clint Eastwood. When asked how he kept going, he said, "When he knocks, don't let the old man in."
my replacement taking place in 2 days, I understand where you are coming from. I will be 79 next year when I will try again, hopefully with a better grounding and knee. Hate to tell you, but from my initial meeting with the orthopod till my surgery, it has taken less than a month. Hopefully, yours will be sooner than later!Very interesting and thanks for the info. I am hoping to walk part of the Camino with my husband later this year and am worried about my left knee which has arthritis and is close to bone-on-bone. Indeed, my doctor wasn't sure about doing another cortisone injection because of this. I have my name down for a knee replacement but this will be some years off - I live in the UK where the waiting list is very long and I'm likely to be lucky if it happens before 2025. So I have been reading what measures others have taken in order to walk without too much difficulty and pain. So far, I'm thinking a unloader brace, will definitely use sticks, and carry a lot of pain meds. We cycled the Camino de Santiago back in 2013 but I'm now off my bike because, at 75 (and a close-up bout with Covid) means I can no longer get on the bike easily and tend to keep falling off when I least expect it (!) We already go to the gym and are now trying *so far unsuccessfully) to lose weight. It will happen. I thought immediately of my husband when I read Clint Eastwood's quote. He still, at 81, thinks he's 50
It is just over three months since replacement of my left knee, and while I am frustrated, the objective evidence is that rehab physio, etc following surgery has been successful, or at least I am doing as well as at the same time after my right knee was replaced three years ago. Sticking at the rehab has been key. Keeping the exercises going has been more difficult since the end of the formal rehab program, and my walking speed has not improved quite so quickly, but it is getting there.my replacement taking place in 2 days, I understand where you are coming from. I will be 79 next year when I will try again, hopefully with a better grounding and knee. Hate to tell you, but from my initial meeting with the orthopod till my surgery, it has taken less than a month. Hopefully, yours will be sooner than later!
As they say in Oz, Goodonya! Just keep walking.Very interesting and thanks for the info. I am hoping to walk part of the Camino with my husband later this year and am worried about my left knee which has arthritis and is close to bone-on-bone. Indeed, my doctor wasn't sure about doing another cortisone injection because of this. I have my name down for a knee replacement but this will be some years off - I live in the UK where the waiting list is very long and I'm likely to be lucky if it happens before 2025. So I have been reading what measures others have taken in order to walk without too much difficulty and pain. So far, I'm thinking an unloader brace, will definitely use sticks, and carry a lot of pain meds. We cycled the Camino de Santiago back in 2013 but I'm now off my bike because, at 75 (and a close-up bout with Covid) means I can no longer get on the bike easily and tend to keep falling off when I least expect it (!) We already go to the gym and are now trying *so far unsuccessfully) to lose weight. It will happen. I thought immediately of my husband when I read Clint Eastwood's quote. He still, at 81, thinks he's 50If you can do the training without pain, you may well be able to do the Camino as well.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?